Regular Session - April 10, 1995
4396
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9 ALBANY, NEW YORK
10 April 10, 1995
11 3:00 p.m.
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14 REGULAR SESSION
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18 LT. GOVERNOR BETSY McCAUGHEY, President
19 STEPHEN F. SLOAN, Secretary
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4397
1 P R O C E E D I N G S
2 THE PRESIDENT: The Senate will
3 come to order. Would you please rise and repeat
4 with me the Pledge of Allegiance.
5 (Whereupon, the Senate and those
6 present joined in the Pledge of Allegiance to
7 the Flag.)
8 May we bow our heads in a moment
9 of silence.
10 (Whereupon, there was a moment of
11 silence.)
12 The reading of the Journal,
13 please.
14 THE SECRETARY: In Senate,
15 Sunday, April 9. The Senate met pursuant to
16 adjournment. Senator Farley in the chair upon
17 the designation of the Temporary President. The
18 Journal of Saturday, April 8, was read and
19 approved. On motion, Senate adjourned.
20 THE PRESIDENT: Without
21 objection, the Journal stands approved as read.
22 Presentation of petitions.
23 Messages from the Assembly.
4398
1 Messages from the Governor.
2 Reports of standing committees.
3 Reports of select committees.
4 Communications and reports from
5 state officers.
6 Motions and resolutions.
7 SENATOR RATH: Madam President.
8 On page 14, I offer the following amendments to
9 Calendar Number 222, Senate Print Number 2764,
10 and ask that said bill retain its place on Third
11 Reading Calendar.
12 THE PRESIDENT: Amendments
13 received.
14 SENATOR RATH: Madam President.
15 THE PRESIDENT: Senator.
16 SENATOR RATH: On page 25, I
17 offer the following amendments to Calendar
18 Number 337, Senate Print Number 539, and ask
19 that said bill retain its place on Third Reading
20 Calendar.
21 THE PRESIDENT: Amendments
22 received.
23 Senator Wright.
4399
1 SENATOR WRIGHT: Madam
2 President. On behalf of Senator Farley, on page
3 number 25, I offer the following amendments to
4 Calendar Number 338, Senate Print Number 1275,
5 and ask that said bill retain its place on Third
6 Calendar Reading.
7 On behalf of Senator Leibell, on
8 page number 18, I offer the following amendments
9 to Calendar Number 275, Senate Print Number
10 3479, and ask that said bill retain its place on
11 Third Calendar Reading.
12 On behalf of Senator Goodman,
13 please place a sponsor star on Calendar Number
14 379.
15 Thank you, Madam President.
16 THE PRESIDENT: Amendments
17 received. The bill is starred.
18 Senator Bruno.
19 SENATOR BRUNO: Madam President,
20 can we ask for an immediate meeting of the
21 Finance Committee in Room 332 and that followed
22 immediately by a meeting of the Rules Committee
23 in the same place, Room 332.
4400
1 THE PRESIDENT: Yes. There is an
2 immediate meeting of the Finance Committee in
3 Room 332 to be followed by a meeting of the
4 Rules Committee in the same room.
5 Senator Bruno, are you ready for
6 the calendar?
7 SENATOR BRUNO: Yes, Madam
8 President. Can we now at this time take up the
9 noncontroversial calendar?
10 THE PRESIDENT: Senator Bruno, we
11 have a couple of substitutions first. Sorry.
12 THE SECRETARY: Senator Saland
13 moves to discharge the Committee on Children and
14 Families from Assembly Bill Number 3749 and move
15 to substitute for the identical Senate Bill
16 Number, Calendar 203.
17 On page 21, Senator Spano moves
18 to discharge, from the Committee on
19 Investigations, Taxation and Government
20 Operations, Assembly Bill Number 4105, and move
21 to substitute for the identical Senate Bill,
22 Calendar Number 310.
23 THE PRESIDENT: Substitutions
4401
1 ordered.
2 The Secretary will now read the
3 noncontroversial calendar.
4 THE SECRETARY: On page 8,
5 Calendar 51, by Senator Nozzolio, Senate Print
6 16A, an act to amend the Penal Law and the
7 Correction Law, in relation to establishing the
8 crime of aggravated harassment of an employee.
9 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
10 THE PRESIDENT: Lay it aside,
11 please.
12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
13 121, by Senator Levy, Senate Print 372, an act
14 to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in
15 relation to increasing the penalties for
16 aggravated unlicensed operation of a motor
17 vehicle.
18 THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
19 section, please.
20 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
21 act shall take effect on the first day of
22 November.
23 THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
4402
1 (The Secretary called the roll.)
2 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 47.
3 THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
4 passed.
5 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
6 126, by Senator Levy, Senate Print 2270, an act
7 to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in
8 relation to the proof required for eligibility
9 for distinctive plates for volunteer fire
10 fighters.
11 THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
12 section, please.
13 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
14 act shall take effect immediately.
15 THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
16 (The Secretary called the roll.)
17 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 48.
18 THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
19 passed.
20 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
21 214, by Senator LaValle, Senate Print 1368, an
22 act to amend the Town Law, in relation to
23 expending from fire district revenues amounts
4403
1 appropriated for equipment.
2 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Lay it aside.
3 THE PRESIDENT: Lay it aside,
4 please.
5 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
6 238, by Senator DeFrancisco, Senate Print 1966A,
7 an act to amend the Criminal Procedure Law, in
8 relation to applications for recognizance or
9 bail.
10 THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
11 section, please.
12 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
13 act shall take effect on the 30th day.
14 THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
15 (The Secretary called the roll.)
16 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 48.
17 THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
18 passed.
19 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
20 259, by Senator Nozzolio, Senate Print 2244, an
21 act to amend the Correction Law, in relation to
22 limiting time allowances for good behavior for
23 sexual offender.
4404
1 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
2 THE PRESIDENT: Lay it aside,
3 please.
4 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
5 287, by Senator Cook, Senate Print 3441, an act
6 to allow police officers in the Town of
7 Saugerties to be covered under the provisions of
8 Section 384D of the Retirement and Social
9 Security Law.
10 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Lay it aside.
11 THE PRESIDENT: There is a home
12 rule message at the desk.
13 Lay it aside, please.
14 That completes the
15 noncontroversial calendar.
16 SENATOR BRUNO: Madam President,
17 can we now take up the controversial calendar.
18 THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary
19 will read.
20 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
21 51, Senate Bill 16A, by Senator Nozzolio, an act
22 to amend the Penal Law and the Correction Law,
23 in relation to establishing the crime of
4405
1 aggravated harassment.
2 THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
3 section.
4 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation.
5 THE PRESIDENT: Oh, an
6 explanation. Senator Nozzolio.
7 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Questions,
8 Madam President.
9 THE PRESIDENT: Yes. An
10 explanation is requested.
11 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Yes, I will be
12 glad to give Senator Paterson an explanation of
13 the bill.
14 Madam President, my colleagues.
15 The measure before us amends the Penal Law to
16 establish the crime of aggravated assault when a
17 prisoner with intent to harass, annoy, threaten,
18 harm or alarm a person commits one of what I
19 believe are the most heinous indignities that we
20 are seeing today in our correctional system.
21 The men and women who work in our state's
22 prisons do so under the most stressful
23 conditions. They do that as a condition of
4406
1 their employment. They understand, by and
2 large, exactly that is the nature of their job
3 and that they must do their job in those types
4 of very hazardous work environments.
5 But what we see today in our
6 prisons is an assault weapon being used, and
7 that assault weapon is the inmate's bodily
8 fluids. Particularly those who know that they
9 may be infected with the HIV virus would assault
10 a nurse, a correctional employee, a correction
11 officer, with their bodily fluids not just to
12 create an indignity but to create a very
13 significant danger.
14 Put yourself in the situation of
15 being doused with another individual's bodily
16 fluids and ask the question, how would you
17 feel? What indignity would you feel; and with
18 the threat of HIV, how safe would you feel?
19 THE PRESIDENT: Senator
20 Nozzolio. Senator Paterson, why do you rise?
21 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you,
22 Madam President. Would Senator Nozzolio yield
23 for a couple of questions?
4407
1 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: I will be glad
2 to yield.
3 THE PRESIDENT: Would you like to
4 continue, first?
5 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: I will be glad
6 to yield.
7 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you,
8 Senator Nozzolio. It was a well-explained bill
9 and I think a very well-intentioned bill, and
10 probably a very necessary bill. A question that
11 I have is, according to the National Center for
12 Disease Control, which of these transferences of
13 bodily fluids are such that it would qualify for
14 a proper transmission of the HIV virus?
15 THE PRESIDENT: Senator
16 Nozzolio.
17 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Madam
18 President, I am not a doctor, but it seems with
19 this type of situation today's dogma is
20 tomorrow's heresy; that we today are seeing the
21 medical community make certain estimates that
22 things are not being done or are being done
23 relative to HIV; and the issue really is what
4408
1 are we doing to protect our correctional
2 personnel?
3 I have certainly no scientific
4 evidence before me relative to the HIV virus,
5 but I believe we must do all we can to protect
6 those state employees who work behind the walls.
7 THE PRESIDENT: Senator Paterson.
8 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you very
9 much, Senator Nozzolio.
10 And, Madam President, if Senator
11 Nozzolio would continue to yield.
12 Senator Nozzolio, when -- do you
13 see this bill as a possible administrative
14 nightmare for the people who run the
15 facilities? In other words, what we're talking
16 about is perhaps a fight, and a correctional
17 guard breaks up the fight and now the prisoner
18 is subject to an E felony and can spend
19 additional time in prison, basically because
20 they had a fight. In other words, what I'm
21 saying is, have we clearly defined in this bill
22 what qualifies someone to be penalized under
23 it?
4409
1 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Senator, I
2 believe that there are clear definitions, and
3 whatever administrative efforts must be taken to
4 comply with this statute pale in comparison to
5 the actual nightmare that the correctional
6 employees who are the recipients of this type of
7 heinous behavior have to face; that it is
8 certainly a life or death situation for our
9 correctional employees.
10 I don't believe certain
11 administrative effort on behalf of the
12 Corrections Department is too much to ask when
13 you are taking into account someone's very
14 significant jeopardy of safety in the
15 circumstances we're talking about. What we are
16 saying is that when there is a person who knows
17 or reasonably should know to be an employee -
18 an individual is an employee of a correctional
19 facility and that they are engaged in the
20 performance of their official duties while an
21 employee of the correctional facility, that that
22 inmate causes or attempts to cause such employee
23 to be coming into contact with blood, seminal
4410
1 fluid, saliva, urine, feces, by throwing,
2 tossing, or expelling such fluid or material. I
3 think it's extremely specific. It's almost too
4 specific for discussion for this chamber, but
5 it's such an uncomfortable and distasteful
6 subject, Senator, that I believe the bill is
7 absolutely necessary.
8 THE PRESIDENT: Senator Paterson.
9 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you,
10 Madam President, and thank you, Senator
11 Nozzolio.
12 On the bill, Madam President. I
13 am going to support the bill, and I thank
14 Senator Nozzolio for his explanation, and I
15 understand it was difficult to discuss a subject
16 like this without nauseating the entire chamber,
17 which Senator Nozzolio was able to do.
18 My reservation, while voting for
19 the bill, is simply that we are actually going
20 to cause people to take tests for the HIV virus
21 when, in fact, some of the transmissions listed
22 in this bill don't qualify under the National
23 Center for Disease Control's threshold test of
4411
1 what is the transmission of the virus, and we've
2 had a lot of extensive study on what causes the
3 virus to be transmitted.
4 So, for instance, if a prisoner
5 bit a guard, I think you would have them tested
6 immediately. If some of the other acts that
7 Senator Nozzolio was describing occurred, I
8 don't know that that would be necessary, as
9 revolting an act as that might be, and perhaps
10 that act is punishable. But the additional
11 mandated HIV tests and the felony involved, I
12 think, is a little bit excessive; but because of
13 the fact that this has been a problem in the
14 facilities, I can support the bill.
15 I would like to point out,
16 however, that the Department of Corrections has
17 not issued a memorandum one way or the other,
18 and it just leads me to believe -- and I have no
19 evidence, but it is just kind of a feeling -
20 that there is a lot of administrative grief that
21 is going to come over this particular bill.
22 Senator Abate, who is out of the chamber right
23 now on another matter, has indicated, as a
4412
1 person who has worked in supervision in that
2 particular area, that it would cause a great
3 deal of problem; but, otherwise, we support the
4 bill.
5 THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
6 section, please.
7 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
8 act shall take effect on the first day of
9 November.
10 THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
11 (The Secretary called the roll.)
12 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 49.
13 THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
14 passed.
15 THE SECRETARY: On Calendar
16 Number 51, Senator Markowitz in the negative.
17 Ayes 48. Nays 1.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
19 is passed.
20 THE SECRETARY: Calendar 214, by
21 Senator LaValle, Senate Print 1368, an act to
22 amend the Town Law, in relation to expending
23 from fire district revenues.
4413
1 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Explanation.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
3 LaValle, an explanation has been asked for by
4 Senator Dollinger.
5 SENATOR LAVALLE: This is really
6 a very simple bill in what it attempts to do,
7 Senator Dollinger. Fire districts, as you
8 probably know, have a spending limitation. At
9 the same time, there have been over the last -
10 since 1980, on almost an annual basis,
11 additional OSHA requirements our local fire
12 departments have had to meet. It goes from
13 basic equipment of helmets and coats, various
14 other protective gear that they have to wear,
15 the kinds of equipment that they use. These
16 pressures have placed a lot of pressure on the
17 fire district budget not allowing them to do
18 other things that they would normally do if it
19 was not for these additional mandates on them,
20 and so this bill allows them to exceed the
21 spending cap for those OSHA mandates, and it's
22 consistent with other exemptions that we have
23 allowed to our local fire districts to exceed
4414
1 this spending cap, particularly when it's come
2 to things like indebtedness and other kinds of
3 things. It's very consistent with bills that we
4 have passed on the floor of this house.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
6 Dollinger.
7 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Will Senator
8 LaValle just yield to a question?
9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
10 LaValle, do you yield to a question?
11 SENATOR LAVALLE: Yes.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
13 yields, Senator Dollinger.
14 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Senator, just
15 so I understand, are these federal OSHA
16 requirements that are imposed?
17 SENATOR LAVALLE: Yes. Yes, they
18 are.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Then just
20 on the bill briefly, Mr. President.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
22 Dollinger on the bill.
23 SENATOR DOLLINGER: I'm going to
4415
1 support this bill. I think Senator LaValle's
2 bill just highlights another point that I just
3 wanted to mention. A lot of our local
4 communities, particularly fire departments, have
5 these OSHA regulations imposed on them by the
6 federal government, and it might be an issue
7 that in the new environment we would look to
8 Washington to say, "Maybe it's time to change
9 some of these very onerous regulations." I know
10 they've been very expensive in my town and have
11 been a source of great concern.
12 I think they try to achieve the
13 right goal, perhaps a goal that we should all
14 share, but the question is whether the federal
15 government should mandate them and local fire
16 communities to pay for them. So I think Senator
17 LaValle is right on the nose with respect to
18 allowing them an exemption from the cap in order
19 to be able to do this, but it's the kind of
20 thing that we ought look to the federal
21 government and ask for some relief.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
23 Secretary will read the last section.
4416
1 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
2 act shall take effect immediately.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
4 roll.
5 (The Secretary called the roll.)
6 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
8 is passed.
9 Secretary will continue to call
10 the controversial calendar.
11 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
12 259, by Senator Nozzolio, Senate Print 2244, an
13 act to amend the Correction Law, in relation to
14 limiting time allowances for good behavior.
15 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
17 Nozzolio, an explanation has been asked for by
18 Senator Paterson.
19 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Thank you, Mr.
20 President. I would be glad to give the Acting
21 Minority Leader an explanation of this measure.
22 Certainly, we need to do all we
23 can to keep criminals who are extremely
4417
1 dangerous behind bars, and that sex offenders in
2 this state have the highest incidence of
3 recidivism of any type of criminal.
4 That, we are asking by
5 establishing this legislation that individuals
6 convicted of sex offenses should also not
7 receive time off for good behavior. Sex
8 offenders that commit grievous crimes,
9 historically, have a high recidivism rate. It
10 doesn't make sense to free sex offenders early,
11 particularly when there is such a high
12 propensity of them tending to commit a similar
13 crime.
14 What we are suggesting by this
15 statute change is that Section 803 of the
16 Correction Law which provides time off for good
17 behavior for all criminals that -- we are
18 stating that that should be changed and that any
19 person serving a maximum term of life
20 imprisonment -- pardon me. That Sections 803
21 and 804 of the Correction Law excepts sex
22 offenders from being eligible for time
23 allowances for good behavior.
4418
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
2 Paterson.
3 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, Mr.
4 President. Senator Nozzolio, we appreciate that
5 you are addressing this particular issue. Would
6 you yield for a question?
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
8 Nozzolio, do you yield?
9 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Certainly, Mr.
10 President.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
12 yields.
13 SENATOR PATERSON: Senator
14 Nozzolio, on this particular bill, the Governor
15 has certainly some ideas about reforming this
16 area that relates to sexual offenders, and he is
17 thinking of rolling back the good behavior time
18 from one-third to one-seventh. This would still
19 qualify us under the federal regulations to
20 receive funding from the government; and, of
21 course, we wouldn't worry as much about the
22 funding if we were feeling we were keeping
23 hardened criminals off the streets, but what I
4419
1 think would be consistent is the fact that,
2 under your bill, what you are suggesting, we
3 will have criminals going back out on the
4 streets (A) with no supervision and (B) without
5 any kind of transition from the end of their
6 terms to the time that they are now out on the
7 streets.
8 Don't you think it would be
9 better, should we continue this sort of
10 transition and just roll it back as the Governor
11 is suggesting, as opposed to just creating a
12 long-term sentence and then allowing the
13 individual who has served that time to go right
14 back out on the streets?
15 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Mr.
16 President. I would wish to respond to Senator
17 Paterson's question in this way. Senator, I
18 understand the tenor of your question, and I
19 think that your point does not seem unreasonable
20 to me but for the fact that the type of
21 criminality that we're trying to deal with here
22 is so vicious, so vile in its nature that we can
23 not, I believe, allow the tide to continue to
4420
1 flow.
2 I hold in my hand a February 8
3 clipping from the New York Times; headline, "Man
4 on Parole is Charged in Sex Attacks in the
5 Bronx." Underheadline said he had been released
6 for good behavior. "A string of sexual attacks
7 in the Bronx was carried out by a man who was
8 paroled from prison a year ago after serving 13
9 years for rape," police said. Under the law, he
10 was held as long as he could be under the
11 current law, and that prisoners in New York
12 State earn a day of good behavior time for every
13 two days spent in prison if they generally stay
14 out of trouble. That's a very euphemistic way
15 of saying not causing a riot or not attacking
16 correction officers; but, otherwise, they are
17 generally given this as an entitlement in law
18 today. The accumulated time, then, is deducted
19 from the prisoner's maximum sentence.
20 What we have is prisoners who are
21 being released who have committed sex crimes in
22 the past who are going out and perpetrating
23 additional crimes upon society and, in many
4421
1 cases, with the same modus operandi that put
2 them in prison in the first place.
3 What we're saying in this statute
4 is, let's forget this time off for good
5 behavior. It doesn't make sense. We have the
6 highest recidivism rate of any crime becoming in
7 the sex offender, and that releasing sex
8 offenders based on good behavior in prison is
9 wrong. What we should not do is put them in
10 prison if they exhibit good behavior in the
11 first place. What we're saying is, just because
12 you exhibit good behavior after you are in
13 prison doesn't do anything for the victim who is
14 carrying a scar in general in her and, in cases
15 of sex abuse of children, in his character for
16 the rest of his life.
17 Taking that into account,
18 Senator, I just have to reject your suggestion.
19 Even though it is not unreasonable, I think it
20 is certainly not warranted at this time because
21 of the very serious aspects of this crime.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
23 Paterson.
4422
1 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr.
2 President. Even though Senator Nozzolio rejects
3 my suggestion, I'm pleased to see what I
4 consider to be a metamorphosis of opinion that
5 has evolved throughout the last couple of
6 decades. The focus that this bill and others
7 like it are placing on the issue of sexual
8 offenses, the high rate of recidivism, the
9 unnecessary difficulty that the victims have had
10 trying to get these cases prosecuted, the fact
11 that often the victim felt like it was the
12 victim who was on trial. This going on for the
13 period of time that it has, I think we in this
14 chamber welcome this piece of legislation.
15 What I would add to it, on the
16 bill, Mr. President, if we are going to be
17 locking people up and not giving them some kind
18 of treatment, then we really are inviting this
19 problem to visit us again.
20 There are facilities that have
21 demonstrated, such as the one in New Jersey at
22 Avedale, that there has been a rate of success
23 when counseling and treating sexual crime
4423
1 predators. There is, I think, a sense right now
2 that there cannot be any treatment, and I don't
3 think the statistics actually sustain that. I
4 think the statistics belie that, and so I think
5 that this legislation goes a long way to focus
6 our efforts on not necessarily drawing a
7 conclusion between the ease of managing
8 prisoners which is a correctional duty and the
9 likelihood of an individual getting out quicker
10 and creating the same crime again, which I think
11 is a very good point that Senator Nozzolio is
12 making.
13 However, what we are saying is
14 that with the treatment, if it begins at the
15 time of incarceration so that you can have real
16 rehabilitation, that there should be some
17 transitional period in which the individual
18 moves back into society, and we are suggesting
19 -- although this bill certainly is with great
20 merit, we are suggesting that that time period
21 be equal to that that the Governor of the State
22 of New York has suggested, one-seventh the time
23 of the term.
4424
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Chair
2 recognizes Senator Jones.
3 SENATOR JONES: Yes, will the
4 Senator yield to a question?
5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
6 Nozzolio, do you yield to a question from
7 Senator Jones?
8 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Yes, Mr.
9 President.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
11 yields, Senator Jones.
12 SENATOR JONES: Yes. I just need
13 a clarification. In the Crime Committee,
14 Senator Abate kind of raised my level of
15 concern. First let me say, if they all served
16 the rest of their life would be just fine with
17 me, but she brought up the issue if you
18 eliminate the good time, as you are suggesting
19 in this bill, what happens then when they are
20 released? Can the Parole still determine where
21 they live, notify the right people and keep
22 track of them, or are they out of the system and
23 running loose, basically?
4425
1 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Mr.
2 President. This bill does certainly no change
3 to those who have been paroled, to those who
4 have been part of the criminal justice system.
5 There still needs to be follow-up. Taken in
6 conjunction, though, with Senator DiCarlo's Sex
7 Offender Reform Act -- the Senator is the lead
8 sponsor. Many of us in this chamber have
9 endorsed and sponsored this bill, and it has
10 passed this chamber. The Sex Offender Reform
11 Act mandates that there be a continued course of
12 treatment for those sex offenders who have
13 entered in and served their time and exited from
14 the criminal justice system.
15 We believe -- and, Senator, you
16 may be a supporter of that bill. I am not
17 sure. But, certainly, it has not passed the
18 Assembly, and we not only lose federal dollars
19 as the result of that measure not passing the
20 Assembly, your very concern, which I believe is
21 extremely well-taken, that your concern as you
22 raise it here, would four square be taken care
23 of by Senator DiCarlo's Sex Offender Reform Act,
4426
1 and we need to do all we can in this house to
2 get it passed. The Assembly, as you well know,
3 has been reluctant to pass that needed
4 legislation. I think the two of these measures
5 should be taken together in conjunction and I
6 believe it would resolve the concern completely
7 that you have.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
9 Jones.
10 SENATOR JONES: Thank you. Maybe
11 the Senator would yield for one more question.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Will you
13 yield, Senator Nozzolio, for one more question?
14 SENATOR JONES: Just so I can
15 clarify. Senator, this bill taken alone, then,
16 we would not have the hook on them when they're
17 released if they served the whole time; however,
18 if we combine it with something Senator DiCarlo
19 has, then we would be able to handle them
20 forever, which is what I think is necessary. Is
21 that basically what you are saying?
22 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Senator, I
23 don't want to leave you with the impression that
4427
1 this measure detracts from or destroys any
2 parole requirements that an inmate may have once
3 they are paroled after committing this crime.
4 The only thing this measure does is take away
5 the sweetener that they now have of being good
6 boys in prison and then being let out early as a
7 quid pro quo for that good prison behavior.
8 We are saying that is a slap in
9 the face to those crime victims who have been
10 the recipient of a heinous sexual offense.
11 SENATOR JONES: Thank you.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
13 will read the last section.
14 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
15 act shall take effect on the first day of
16 November.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
18 roll.
19 (The Secretary called the roll.)
20 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
22 is passed.
23 THE SECRETARY: On Calendar
4428
1 Number 259, Senator Galiber recorded in the
2 negative. Ayes 49. Nays 1.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
4 is passed.
5 The Secretary will continue to
6 call the calendar.
7 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
8 287, by Senator Cook, Senate Print 3441, an act
9 to allow police officers of the Town of
10 Saugerties to be covered under the provisions of
11 Section 384D.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is
13 a home rule message at the desk.
14 Senator Dollinger.
15 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Explanation.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
17 Cook, an explanation of the bill has been asked
18 for by Senator Dollinger.
19 SENATOR COOK: Mr. President.
20 Members of the Saugerties police force completed
21 the application to be covered under this section
22 of law. For some reason, those applications
23 were never forwarded by the town. Interestingly
4429
1 enough, I think there were seven people that
2 filled out applications. One of them was -
3 didn't have time to fill it out at work and
4 said, "Well, I'll mail it in when I get home."
5 Then he went home and filled it out and mailed
6 it in, and he is the only person covered.
7 Somebody else basically put the applications in
8 the bottom drawer, and they never got submitted
9 to the state. The town has recognized the error
10 now. They have agreed to pay the necessary cost
11 to have these people covered, so there won't be
12 any cost to the state.
13 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Through you,
14 Mr. President, just one question for Senator
15 Cook.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
17 Cook, do you yield to Senator Dollinger?
18 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Is that the
19 respect in which this bill differs from last
20 year?
21 SENATOR COOK: Yes.
22 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Last year, we
23 were going to pick up -
4430
1 SENATOR COOK: That's right.
2 SENATOR DOLLINGER: -- and now
3 the town is going to do it.
4 Thank you, Mr. President. My
5 opposition from last year will be withdrawn.
6 I'll be voting in the affirmative on this.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
8 will read the last section.
9 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
10 act shall take effect immediately.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
12 roll.
13 (The Secretary called the roll.)
14 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
16 is passed.
17 Senator Skelos, that completes
18 the controversial calendar.
19 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President.
20 May we return to reports of standing committees,
21 and I believe there is a report of the Rules
22 Committee.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is
4431
1 a report of the Rules Committee at the desk.
2 We will return to reports of
3 standing committees. I will ask the Secretary
4 to read.
5 THE SECRETARY: Senator Bruno,
6 from the Committee on Rules, hands up the
7 following bills directly for third reading:
8 Senate Print 4079, Budget Bill,
9 an act making appropriation for the support of
10 government.
11 Senate Print 4080, Budget Bill,
12 an act to provide for payments and providers of
13 medical services.
14 4081, Budget Bill, an act making
15 an appropriation for the support of government.
16 All bills directly for third
17 reading.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
19 Skelos.
20 SENATOR BRUNO: I move we accept
21 the rules report.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
23 motion is to accept the rules report. All those
4432
1 in favor, signify by saying aye.
2 (Response of "Aye.")
3 Opposed, nay.
4 (There was no response.)
5 The report is accepted.
6 Senator Skelos.
7 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President.
8 At this time, may we please take up Calendar
9 390, Senate 4079.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
11 will read Calendar Number 390.
12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
13 390, Budget Bill, Senate Print 4079, an act
14 making an appropriation for the support of
15 government.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
17 will read the last section.
18 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This
19 act shall take effect immediately.
20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
21 roll.
22 (The Secretary called the roll.)
23 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 51.
4433
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
2 is passed.
3 Secretary will continue to call.
4 Senator Skelos.
5 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President.
6 At this time, could we take up Calendar Number
7 391, S.4080.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
9 will read Calendar Number 391.
10 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
11 391, Senate Print 4080, Budget Bill, an act to
12 provide for payments to municipalities and to
13 providers of medical services under the Medical
14 Assistance Program.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Chair
16 recognizes Senator Galiber.
17 SENATOR GALIBER: Would Senator
18 Stafford yield to a question as opposed to
19 asking for an explanation of the entire bill?
20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
21 Stafford, do you yield to a question from
22 Senator Galiber?
23 The Senator yields.
4434
1 SENATOR GALIBER: Senator, I
2 asked the question in our committee, and those
3 who are not privileged enough or honored enough
4 to serve on your committee might be interested
5 in the response that you give. I noted that the
6 notion of income maintenance was left out of the
7 bill and there was a question whether it was by
8 design. I know last year we didn't pay the
9 income maintenance, back in May of some
10 occasion.
11 SENATOR STAFFORD: Right, that
12 was -
13 SENATOR GALIBER: So perhaps you
14 can give us that explanation without going into
15 the entire bill.
16 SENATOR STAFFORD: Exactly. That
17 was an excellent question, as all of yours are,
18 Senator Galiber, but it shows you have read the
19 bill.
20 SENATOR GALIBER: (Indicating.)
21 SENATOR STAFFORD: Your staff;
22 right?
23 SENATOR GALIBER: Right.
4435
1 SENATOR STAFFORD: There is an
2 existing appropriation for that function.
3 SENATOR GALIBER: As I ask the
4 question, though, perhaps for those who are
5 privileged to live Upstate under certain
6 circumstances, does it apply in Upstate also?
7 SENATOR STAFFORD: Yes, it does.
8 SENATOR GALIBER: They have an
9 escrow account; is that correct?
10 SENATOR STAFFORD: Exactly.
11 SENATOR GALIBER: Or something
12 similar to that.
13 SENATOR STAFFORD: Exactly.
14 SENATOR GALIBER: Thank you, Mr.
15 President.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
17 will read the last section.
18 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
19 act shall take effect immediately.
20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
21 roll.
22 (The Secretary called the roll.)
23 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 51.
4436
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
2 is passed.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
4 Skelos.
5 SENATOR SKELOS: Yes, at this
6 time, may we please take up Calendar Number 392,
7 Senate 4081.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
9 will read Calendar Number 392.
10 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
11 392, Budget Bill, Senate 4081, an act making an
12 appropriation for the support of government.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
14 last section.
15 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This
16 act shall take effect immediately.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
18 roll.
19 (The Secretary called the roll.)
20 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 51.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
22 is passed.
23 Senator Galiber.
4437
1 SENATOR GALIBER: Thank you for
2 the recognition, Mr. President. I would like to
3 have unanimous consent to be recorded in the
4 negative on Calendar Number 238.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
6 objection, Senator Galiber will be recorded in
7 the negative on Calendar Number 238.
8 Senator Skelos.
9 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President.
10 I believe at this time the Minority has some
11 motions to discharge.
12 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: Yes, Mr.
13 President.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
15 Paterson, is that correct, you have several
16 motions to discharge at the desk?
17 SENATOR PATERSON: Yes, Mr.
18 President. In fact, we have one million motions
19 for discharge, but we have cut them down to
20 really just reflect the most important bills, so
21 we know there should be no problem bringing
22 those bills to the floor, and we would like at
23 this time if you would recognize Senator
4438
1 Oppenheimer.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
3 Oppenheimer to present a motion to discharge.
4 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: I have
5 filed this motion to discharge at the desk. I
6 would like the opportunity to explain it.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
8 Oppenheimer. The desk informs me that you have
9 two at the desk. Can you tell me which one you
10 would like to take up first? It's 705 or 759?
11 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: 705.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 705.
13 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: I didn't
14 know I had two. I think this is the one we're
15 talking about. This would limit the lawful
16 possession of semi assault weapons to persons
17 who have acquired a license to possess and use
18 them for either organized marksmanship
19 competition and target firing; or if they are
20 federally licensed collectors, they can obtain a
21 license to possess these weapons, and any other
22 possession of this weapon would be a crime.
23 So this is a ban on the
4439
1 possession and sale of semi assault weapons
2 without a license, and the bill names a large
3 number of weapons, some of which you are very
4 familiar with the names. Many of these weapons
5 are modified versions of military ordinance,
6 originally, and specifically designed to kill
7 human beings in battlefields, not intended for
8 civilian use. Many of them are equipped with or
9 designed to accept magazines having an
10 unreasonably large ammunition capacity, and,
11 obviously, such capacity is not necessary for
12 hunting purposes or recreational purposes.
13 Indeed, they are specifically banned for
14 hunting. Their purpose truly is only to kill
15 the maximum number of people in the minimum
16 amount of time.
17 Law enforcement officers and
18 innocent bystanders are increasingly in peril.
19 There is a great deal of cross fire that goes on
20 and innocent people -- a lot of the youngsters
21 are caught in this cross fire, and, indeed, our
22 police are asking for us to do something because
23 they are out-gunned at the present time. The
4440
1 criminals have much better firepower than our
2 police have.
3 These are just weapons of
4 terrible destructive power, and I don't think
5 our society should permit them to continue to
6 proliferate, and this legislation would go just
7 about as far as the state can go in controlling
8 them. I see that they serve absolutely no valid
9 purpose; and, indeed, when our governor was on
10 the campaign trail, he also said that he thought
11 it was time for a ban or considerable restraints
12 on semi assault weapons, and I hope he believes
13 that now and will act upon it in the near
14 future.
15 In the meantime, I would like to
16 have this motion to discharge from committee
17 come to the floor, and I would move that.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
19 motion is to discharge Senate Bill Number 705
20 from committee. A vote in the affirmative will
21 discharge that bill. A vote in the negative
22 will vote to keep it in committee.
23 All those in favor of the motion,
4441
1 signify by saying aye.
2 (Response of "Aye.")
3 Those opposed, nay.
4 (Response of "Nay.")
5 The motion fails.
6 Senator Oppenheimer, would you
7 now like to take up the second -- no.
8 Senator Paterson.
9 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr.
10 President. Now, if you would recognize Senator
11 Jones.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The chair
13 recognizes Senator Jones for a motion.
14 Senator Jones.
15 SENATOR JONES: Yes, I filed -
16 there's two motions to discharge from committee,
17 Senate 37 and Senate 39, and I would like to
18 call them up and ask if I can discuss them
19 together. 37 and 39.
20 SENATOR MARCHI: Point of order,
21 Mr. President.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
23 Marchi.
4442
1 SENATOR MARCHI: I received a
2 memorandum from Senator Goodman, who underwent a
3 medical procedure, giving me the Senate bills
4 that were going to be moved on this agenda; and
5 you say 739?
6 SENATOR JONES: 37 and 39.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senate
8 39.
9 SENATOR MARCHI: It's not on this
10 list, not that it's immoral or fattening or
11 illegal. The same goes for Senator
12 Oppenheimer's -- are we working from different
13 lists?
14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
15 Marchi, if you will bear with us.
16 Senator Marchi, if you will bear
17 with us just for a moment, I'm attempting to be
18 able to resolve your question here at the desk.
19 Senator Marchi.
20 SENATOR MARCHI: Mr. President I
21 understand that there were amplified lists and
22 they didn't happen to be on this one, but I -
23 quite all right.
4443
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
2 Jones, on both motions to discharge.
3 SENATOR JONES: These two bills
4 are bills that I filed last year, and I know
5 Senator Maltese was interested in taking them up
6 last year, but nothing has happened to them this
7 year.
8 So I would really like to call
9 your attention -- they are both dealing with
10 crime victims issues and both from situations
11 that have happened in Monroe County. The first
12 one deals with the ability of someone to speak
13 at sentencing, and while we have lots of things
14 in statute -- we just did one recently -
15 dealing with who can speak for a victim of a
16 crime, in Monroe County we had a rather unusual
17 situation where a judge held to the letter of
18 the law. The problem was the person was not
19 charged with a homicide. It was a hit-and-run
20 driver. Although the person was killed, the
21 defendant did not show up until the following
22 day; and, therefore, it was not a homicide.
23 When it came time for sentencing,
4444
1 the judge held to the letter of the law and
2 indicated that this did not fit any of our
3 present criteria, which is, "A victim is a child
4 unwilling or unable to speak or if the victim is
5 mentally or physically disabled or, of course,
6 in the case of a homicide."
7 So this person basically fell
8 through the cracks, and the judge held to the
9 letter of the law and would not allow them to
10 speak. I have been told that there are other
11 situations where judges are more lenient and
12 would have allowed this to happen; however, in
13 Monroe County, they did not.
14 I know we all feel very strongly,
15 particularly when there has been -- a death
16 occurred, that someone should always be there to
17 speak for the victim. So this bill was actually
18 introduced to try and correct this situation
19 that did occur in Monroe County and to prevent
20 it from happening in any other place throughout
21 the state.
22 The second bill, Senate 37, also
23 dealt with the crime victim issue, and anybody
4445
1 who's been in the Monroe County area -- again,
2 let me say Senator Maltese picked this up after
3 I filed it last year, but no one has done so
4 this year. So, you know, I would recommend that
5 someone do that because it is certainly
6 something that bears looking at.
7 Again, it's a case in Monroe
8 County where a woman was a victim of serious
9 domestic violence; in fact, was stabbed 11 times
10 to the point where the woman has lost her
11 ability to speak. The man is now serving 25
12 years in prison. Unfortunately, from prison, he
13 has continued to harass her, filing various
14 lawsuits including the validity of their
15 divorce, custody issues, visitation issues,
16 whether or not the children could write to him.
17 All of these, the judges have been forced to
18 hear in court in Monroe County.
19 I have spoken many times to the
20 judges about this. They are looking for
21 something in law to help them and they can
22 immediately discount these as being frivolous.
23 This woman who not only suffered such a serious
4446
1 physical injury at the hands of this person is
2 now forced to pay to defend herself in court;
3 and, of course, we all know who is paying for
4 his court filings in the court cases that he is
5 bringing against her.
6 So, again, this is another thing
7 that I believe could help victims; and,
8 certainly, any of you who knew this woman and
9 what she's been through certainly would be
10 interested in helping in any way possible to
11 prevent her from further victimization at the
12 hands of her ex-husband.
13 So I would move that both of
14 these be discharged from committee and be
15 brought to the floor.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
17 question is on the motion to discharge Senate
18 Bill Number 39 dealing with victims. All those
19 in favor of the motion to discharge, signify by
20 saying aye.
21 (Response of "Aye.")
22 Opposed, nay.
23 (Response of "Nay.")
4447
1 The motion is lost.
2 The second motion before the
3 house is the motion to discharge Senate Bill
4 Number 37, dealing with frivolous lawsuits. All
5 those in favor of the motion, signify by saying
6 aye.
7 (Response of "Aye.")
8 Opposed, nay.
9 (Response of "Nay.")
10 The motion is lost.
11 Senator Paterson.
12 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr.
13 President. I thought we won that last one.
14 If you would recognize Senator
15 Jones, Mr. President, we have one further
16 motion.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
18 Jones.
19 SENATOR JONES: There is one more
20 bill that I would like to call up, please,
21 Senate 1025.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
23 Jones, hang on just a minute while we find it.
4448
1 Senator Jones, we have it now.
2 Senator Jones on the motion to discharge.
3 SENATOR JONES: Yes. This bill
4 deals with reverse sale of a controlled
5 substance. Again, it's a bill that I had in
6 last year, but it's become a very important
7 issue this year in Monroe County; and so, since
8 it's on the Health Committee currently, I would
9 like to turn the floor over to our ranking
10 member on the Health Committee, which is Senator
11 Dollinger, to speak on this bill.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Chair
13 recognizes Senator Dollinger on the motion.
14 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr.
15 President. This concept of a reverse drug sale
16 is not a new concept before this house. I point
17 out that Senator Wright, and I believe 13 other
18 members of the Republican Majority in this house
19 have recognized the problem and introduced a
20 very similar bill. The reason why we want to
21 move to discharge this bill is because the issue
22 of reverse sales have become even more pertinent
23 in our hometown community in Monroe County.
4449
1 There, a City Court judge threw out 123
2 accusatory instruments filed against people who
3 had come into the city of Rochester or had been
4 in the city and attempted to buy drugs. They
5 were all done on the reverse sale model; and
6 because of the lack of any statutory function to
7 support an accusation under a reverse sale, all
8 123 of those cases were dismissed.
9 It seems to me that this bill's
10 time has come and that this would give the
11 communities, places like the city of Rochester,
12 an additional weapon in their arsenal to try to
13 curb the problem of neighborhood drug buys.
14 They start out of in small amounts. They start
15 off in marijuana. They build up to bigger
16 things. If we're going to put a stop to it, I
17 think we have to give the police not only in
18 Monroe County and in the city of Rochester this
19 tool, but we should give it across the board.
20 I would strongly recommend that
21 this be brought out of committee and be put
22 before the Senate so that we can have a full
23 debate on the issue, and we can give the people
4450
1 of this state the opportunity to begin to reduce
2 the drug traffic which infests our
3 neighborhoods, our urban areas and, I should
4 add, also our rural areas. Many of the people
5 who are, often times, arrested -- in fact, who
6 were arrested in the city of Rochester were from
7 rural areas. Drug use, as we all know, is as
8 prevalent in the suburbs as it is in the city,
9 and anyone who thinks that this is just an urban
10 problem is kidding themselves. This bill will
11 give us a tool we can use throughout New York
12 State.
13 I urge that this motion be
14 adopted and that we bring this measure, this
15 very important measure, sponsored by Senator
16 Jones, to the floor for debate.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
18 motion is to discharge Senate Bill 1025. All
19 those in favor of discharging the bill from
20 committee, signify by saying aye.
21 (Response of "Aye.")
22 Opposed, nay.
23 (Response of "Nay.")
4451
1 The motion is defeated.
2 Senator Skelos.
3 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr.
4 President.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
6 Dollinger.
7 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr.
8 President. I believe there is another motion
9 filed with respect to Senate 2974.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senate
11 2974? Let me check, Senator Dollinger, to see
12 that it's here.
13 Senator Dollinger, it is at the
14 desk.
15 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr.
16 President.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
18 Dollinger on the motion.
19 SENATOR DOLLINGER: This is a
20 motion to discharge Senate Bill 2974, of which I
21 am the sponsor. Senator Babbush, Senator Jones,
22 Senator Markowitz and Senator Paterson are the
23 co-sponsors.
4452
1 This bill would expand the
2 forfeiture power of the police in enforcing the
3 forfeiture laws against those who buy
4 misdemeanor amounts of illegal substances. As I
5 mentioned a moment ago with respect to Senator
6 Jones's bill, in which we talked about the
7 concept of reverse buys, expanding the scope of
8 the forfeiture laws would give the police an
9 additional option in trying to deter drug sales
10 wherever they occur in this state.
11 Current law provides it has to be
12 a felony in order for you to begin the
13 forfeiture process. This bill, if it were
14 considered by this body, would give us an
15 opportunity to debate the issue of whether that
16 forfeiture power should be extended down to
17 misdemeanors. In many cases, people are buying
18 drugs only in misdemeanor quantities or they're
19 buying marijuana in misdemeanor quantities.
20 There is no forfeiture law that applies to them
21 because we haven't extended it that far.
22 I point out that our information
23 from the Monroe County drug enforcement
4453
1 officials, both the police in the city of
2 Rochester, the Monroe County Sheriff's
3 Department and local police departments,
4 indicates that people who are buying drugs are
5 buying them in small amounts and, in many cases,
6 we are unable to apply the forfeiture law to
7 them.
8 The other advantage of the
9 forfeiture law is that it might open the eyes of
10 the entire community about the prevalence of
11 drug use because it would be one thing to simply
12 be arrested for a misdemeanor possession of
13 drugs, it would be another thing to have to go
14 back to explain to your wife or your boyfriend
15 or your family why your car has been seized as a
16 consequence of buying those drugs.
17 The Rochester Police Department
18 and the Rochester City neighborhood leaders
19 estimate that one-half of the drug sales in the
20 city of Rochester involve suburban drivers.
21 This would be a good deterrent to them if we
22 extended the forfeiture law to include
23 misdemeanor amounts of illegal substances.
4454
1 I think this is another important
2 tool to put in the hands of our police
3 officers. I would strongly recommend that we
4 support this motion so that we can bring this
5 issue to the table today.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
7 motion is to discharge Senate Bill Number 2974
8 from committee. All those in favor of
9 discharging the bill from committee, signify by
10 saying aye.
11 (Response of "Aye.")
12 Opposed, nay.
13 (Response of "Nay.")
14 The motion is lost.
15 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr.
16 President.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
18 Dollinger.
19 SENATOR DOLLINGER: I believe
20 there are four other motions that I would like
21 to consider as a package, and these are motions
22 with respect to Senate 3096, 3098, 3099 and
23 3101, Mr. President.
4455
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Do you
2 wish to discuss those all at one time, Senator
3 Dollinger?
4 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Yes, if I
5 could, Mr. President. These are known as the
6 bawdy house bills, and I would like to see if I
7 can bring them before the floor.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Okay.
9 I -- the chair will recognize Senator Dollinger
10 for the purpose of explaining four discharge
11 motions, and then we will take up each motion
12 separately.
13 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Thank you,
14 Mr. President.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
16 Dollinger.
17 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Thank you for
18 the courtesy of allowing me to consolidate them,
19 as well.
20 Mr. President. What this package
21 of bills does is it takes a century old concept
22 in the State of New York and applies it to a new
23 and threatening problem. In the early part of
4456
1 this century, Mr. President, this Legislature
2 recognized that community groups, civic groups,
3 police and landlords, should have the power to
4 enforce the laws of eviction and the laws of
5 criminal nuisance to prevent use of real
6 property for illicit purposes.
7 The illicit purpose in the
8 beginning of this century were as houses of
9 ill-repute. These were the brothels and other
10 similar places in which this Legislature decided
11 that we would do a number of things. One is, if
12 illegal activity was going on in the house, we
13 would allow the landlord to evict them on that
14 basis. We would extend the standing so that if
15 a community group or the attorney general -- if
16 the person lived within 200 feet of a bawdy
17 house, they could bring an action to evict the
18 illegal or illicit operation. In addition, it
19 would make -- we made criminal nuisance a felony
20 and allowed neighborhood groups to go in and
21 describe this criminal nuisance, which was a
22 form of ill-repute, and they would have the
23 standing under the law to bring an action for
4457
1 eviction.
2 What this package of bills does
3 is it takes the concept of a bawdy house and
4 applies it to what is a common problem in the
5 city of Rochester and in many other parts of the
6 state, the "crack" house, the drug house. It
7 gives people that live in the vicinity of those
8 drug houses civil remedies and the police civil
9 remedies and the Attorney General of this state
10 civil remedies so that they can evict the
11 tenants, so that they can toss people out of
12 these "crack" houses and drug houses inside the
13 city of Rochester.
14 They expand the scope of
15 standing. They allow community groups to have
16 standing to bring these actions. They expand
17 the geographic reach. Now it is 200 feet. If
18 these bills became law, it would be 1,000 feet.
19 Anyone living within 1,000 feet of a drug house
20 could bring an action to evict the tenant, and
21 it would also give the landlord express power to
22 remove a tenant when they are involved in
23 illegal drug operations, and it would expand the
4458
1 definition of criminal nuisance to make it a
2 felony, to put real teeth in these laws.
3 Mr. President. In the city of
4 Rochester, most of which I represent and Senator
5 Jones represents the other part, there is a
6 crying demand for those types of powers so that
7 the neighbor groups which are trying to save
8 parts of the city of Rochester have the
9 opportunity to use their power, the collective
10 power of the people, to evict people who are
11 engaged in drug activities. Everyone in this
12 chamber knows how deleterious the impact of a
13 drug house is, what it does to decay, what it
14 does to driving people out of the neighborhood,
15 how it disrupts families and how it disrupts the
16 functioning of a neighborhood.
17 Let's give the people of this
18 state the tools so that they can come forward
19 just as a century ago we allowed them to throw
20 out houses of ill-repute. Let's give them the
21 same power now and let's expand the powers to
22 throw out these terrible drug traps which catch
23 our children and the rest of our citizens.
4459
1 Mr. President. I would strongly
2 request that my colleagues support discharging
3 this package of bills so that we can take bawdy
4 houses and as we did away with them a century
5 ago, some day maybe drug houses will sound just
6 as archaic as bawdy houses do if we pass this
7 legislation.
8 I'd urge its support.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The first
10 motion is to discharge Senate Bill 3096 from
11 committee.
12 All those in favor of discharging
13 the bill from committee, signify by saying aye.
14 (Response of "Aye.")
15 Opposed, nay.
16 (Response of "Nay.")
17 The motion, close vote, is lost.
18 The second motion is to discharge
19 Senate Bill 3098 from committee. All those in
20 favor of discharging the bill from committee,
21 signify by saying aye.
22 (Response of "Aye.")
23 All those opposed, nay.
4460
1 (Response of "Nay.")
2 In a not-so-close-vote, the
3 motion is lost.
4 The next motion is to discharge
5 Senate Bill 3099 from committee. All those in
6 favor of discharging the bill from committee,
7 signify by saying aye.
8 (Response of "Aye.")
9 Those opposed, nay.
10 (Response of "Nay.")
11 The motion is lost.
12 Next motion is to discharge
13 Senate Print 3101 from committee. All those in
14 favor of discharging the bill from committee,
15 signify by saying aye.
16 (Response of "Aye.")
17 Opposed, nay.
18 (Response of "Nay.")
19 The motion is lost.
20 Senator Paterson.
21 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr.
22 President. I have two other motions, Mr.
23 President, and then I will sit down.
4461
1 I believe there is a motion at
2 the desk for 3102.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
4 Dollinger. 3102?
5 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Yes, Mr.
6 President, the child stalking bill.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Yes,
8 there is. The chair recognizes Senator
9 Dollinger to present a motion to discharge.
10 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr.
11 President. Again, I ask just for a brief moment
12 to explain this bill. It's relatively simple.
13 This bill would attack what is becoming a more
14 common problem in this state, which is the
15 stalking of children, and this bill makes
16 conduct which currently constitutes harassment
17 in the second degree into aggravated harassment
18 in the second degree when that conduct is
19 committed against a child or is committed on
20 school grounds.
21 We had an incident in the Monroe
22 County area about a year ago in which a child
23 was followed by someone in a white car. They
4462
1 were importuned to come to the car. There were
2 things said to the child that would constitute
3 harassment; and after consultation with the
4 district attorney and representatives of law
5 enforcement in Monroe County, we determined that
6 the only thing to do was to increase the
7 penalties for aggravated harassment of a child
8 inside a school zone. That's what this bill
9 seeks to do.
10 We have talked a lot in this
11 chamber about the dangers of luring children
12 into cars. We have tools, some tools, at our
13 disposal. By enacting this, we would
14 substantially increase the penalty, and we would
15 make it very specific that the harassment of a
16 child inside a school zone constitutes a felony,
17 and we would send a clear message to anyone
18 whether it be a "childnapper", a child molester
19 or just one of those high school kids. He
20 decides he's going to have a little fun by
21 scaring the daylights out of a little girl on
22 her way home from school. The message would be
23 plain and simple, "We do not tolerate it and we
4463
1 are going do punish it as a crime."
2 I would, again, urge that this
3 bill be considered by this house. I believe it
4 will extend further protections to our children
5 and send a clear message to those who would
6 harass them for any reason, that they can not do
7 it.
8 Mr. President. I make the
9 motion.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
11 motion is to discharge Senate Bill 3102 from
12 committee. All those favor of discharging the
13 bill from committee, signify by saying aye.
14 (Response of "Aye.")
15 Opposed, nay.
16 (Response of "Nay.")
17 The motion is lost.
18 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr.
19 President. I have one more that I would just
20 call before the house.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: What is
22 the number, Senator Dollinger?
23 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Let me find
4464
1 it here, Mr. President. This would be Senate
2 Bill 3056, Mr. President. It deals with the
3 application of the Freedom of Information Law to
4 the Legislature.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Yes,
6 Senator Dollinger, the motion to discharge is at
7 the desk. Senator dis -- Senator Dollinger to
8 explain his motion to discharge.
9 SENATOR DOLLINGER: "Senator
10 Discharge" is that what I'm to be called,
11 Senator?
12 Mr. President. I thank you
13 again. This is a bill which would apply the
14 substance of the Freedom of Information Law to
15 the New York State Legislature.
16 As you all know, our Court of
17 Appeals recently held in the Weston against
18 Sloan case that certain documents held in the
19 possession of this Legislature would be
20 accessible to the public. Those documents
21 included documents that were specifically
22 related to the spending of taxpayer money.
23 However -- however, the Court
4465
1 held that items such as newsletters and
2 information on mass -- targeted mass mailings,
3 for example, are not subject to mandatory
4 disclosure. In my view in a tortuous route
5 through the intricacies of a statutory
6 interpretation of Public Officers Law, the Court
7 did hold that certain information was available
8 but that other types of information were not.
9 It seems to me that the concept that somehow we
10 can spends a portion of the taxpayers' money
11 without telling them what we're spending it on
12 and that there are other portions that we have
13 to disclose is a legal fiction that deserves no
14 credence in this house.
15 And, therefore, I would propose
16 that we debate this bill and apply all the terms
17 and conditions of the Freedom of Information Law
18 to ourselves. I would just point out that
19 anyone in this chamber, either under the prior
20 administration or under this administration
21 could go downstairs to the second floor and
22 demand to see the newsletters and the mailing
23 lists of any newsletter sent out by any agency
4466
1 in this state because it's the taxpayers'
2 money. We're spending their money, and under
3 those circumstances, the taxpayers should know
4 what we're doing. Instead -- instead, in this
5 chamber, if you were asked for your mass
6 mailings, a copy of your mass mailings or the
7 targeted list, for some reason at least under
8 what the Court of Appeals has had to say in
9 dicta in its earlier opinion, you might not have
10 the obligation to disclose that.
11 Why don't we just say enough is
12 enough. We are spending the taxpayers' money.
13 Let's tell them what we're spending. Let's not
14 keep any secrets from the public about how we
15 spend their money. Let's just put it right on
16 top of the table. Let's empty our pockets, show
17 them where the money goes and make the Freedom
18 of Information Law apply to the New York State
19 Legislature.
20 That's what this legislation
21 does. I know that Senator Bruno -- I suspect
22 that he would support this kind of move, because
23 he's opened up this house. He's begun the
4467
1 process of opening up this house. My hope is
2 that everyone on both sides of the aisle can
3 join in opening the rest of the books, not just
4 this chamber, perhaps, but the books, as well,
5 so that the people will know where and how we
6 are spending their money.
7 Mr. President. I make the motion
8 to discharge.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
10 motion is to discharge Senate Bill Number 3057.
11 All those in favor of discharging 3056 from
12 committee, signify by saying aye.
13 (Response of "Aye.")
14 Opposed, nay.
15 (Response of "Nay.")
16 The motion is lost.
17 Chair would recognize Senator
18 Montgomery for purposes of a motion to
19 discharge.
20 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Thank you,
21 Mr. President. I have a bill at the desk.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: What is
23 the Senate bill number, Senator Montgomery?
4468
1 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: It's bill
2 number 1928 -- number 1998. I'm sorry.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 1998.
4 Senator Montgomery, the motion to
5 discharge is at the desk. Senator Montgomery to
6 explain the motion to discharge.
7 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Thank you,
8 Mr. President.
9 This motion regards a bill that
10 is extremely important to residents in the State
11 of New York, and it is to let out of committee
12 my bill which would make it possible, at least
13 more possible to increase the number of needle
14 exchange programs in our state.
15 The purpose of this bill is to -
16 an attempt to reduce the spread of AIDS virus by
17 virtue of those persons who are intravenous drug
18 users sharing needles and, thereby, spreading
19 the disease of AIDS.
20 I want to point out, Mr.
21 President, that this legislation does a number
22 of things in addition to making nonprescription
23 needles legal, the possession of nonprescription
4469
1 needles legal in the State of New York. It
2 also, in fact, promotes safe needle disposal,
3 because in the needle exchange programs, in
4 order for a person participating in such a
5 program to receive a clean needle, they are
6 required to bring in a dirty needle; so that
7 they are not only to encouraged to bring in
8 their own needles, but, in many instances, they
9 would be encouraged to pick up dirty needles
10 that they may find and bring them in, in order
11 to receive clean needles.
12 Now, one of the results of
13 various programs up to date under the auspices
14 of the Department of Health and the New York
15 City Department of Health have proven that
16 people who are involved in intravenous drug use
17 are concerned about the fact that they can
18 contract AIDS and, thereby, do participate in
19 the program.
20 Now, it has been alleged that if
21 we have a needle exchange program or if we
22 legalize needles in the State of New York, we're
23 going to encourage drug use. Well, that has
4470
1 been proven not to be true. In fact, what
2 happens with needle exchange programs is because
3 these programs really target a very particular
4 population and they are conducted with that
5 population in mind, meaning that they are more
6 than likely to be conducted at the site where
7 the drug users are likely to have more access to
8 the program, they become a bridge or a
9 connection between the drug using people and the
10 drug treatment programs, and so they have acted
11 as a source of referral and as a connection
12 between getting treatment and getting off of
13 drugs, so that is one positive outcome that has
14 been the case in every single needle exchange
15 program to date.
16 In addition, my legislation
17 requires that each needle contain information in
18 terms of safe disposal of the equipment so that
19 people who are able to even purchase a clean
20 needle over the counter without a prescription
21 will still have the information that is required
22 in terms of safe disposal of the equipment.
23 My legislation stipulates that
4471
1 there will be no -- in cases where an insurance
2 company currently covers free needles for any
3 person so insured for whom a prescription needle
4 is required, such as a person with diabetes and
5 so forth, that insurance must continue to cover
6 the purchase of needles in those cases.
7 So, Mr. President, this really is
8 a measure that would save hundreds of thousands
9 of lives. It is estimated that of some over
10 200,000 people in the City of New York alone who
11 are currently IV drug users, some -- some -
12 over 50 percent of them are active HIV cases.
13 Now, in my district in Brooklyn,
14 I have the highest number of active HIV cases in
15 the whole borough of Brooklyn; and so as you can
16 see, Mr. President, this bill is extremely
17 important to constituents in my own district,
18 but I can tell you in no uncertain terms that it
19 is important to people throughout the state; and
20 if passed -- if passed, we in the state would
21 see an increase in the number of programs
22 targeting intravenous drug users as a group to
23 try and reduce the spread of this horrible
4472
1 disease.
2 So I ask, Mr. President, that
3 this body vote to allow this legislation to be
4 passed, vote yes on this motion, because we're
5 not voting on -- we're not voting on increasing
6 money in the budget. We're not changing
7 significantly our state laws. We are simply
8 removing an arcane and outdated provision which
9 says that if you possess a hypodermic syringe
10 and needle without a prescription, you are
11 likely to be arrested, and the purpose of that
12 law was to try and reduce drug use in the State
13 of New York. It has not been the case, and we
14 now are faced with the problem of having this
15 disease being spread to a very large degree by
16 people who either use drugs or their partners,
17 contracting the disease from them, passing it on
18 to their partners.
19 So, Mr. President, I ask for a
20 yes vote on this motion to discharge.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
22 motion is to discharge Senate Bill 1998 from
23 committee. All those in favor of discharging
4473
1 the bill from committee, signify by saying aye.
2 (Response of "Aye.")
3 Opposed, nay.
4 (Response of "Nay.")
5 The motion is lost.
6 Senator Paterson, that completes
7 your list of motions to discharge, I believe,
8 does it not?
9 SENATOR PATERSON: Yes, Mr.
10 President. You know, I attended Columbia
11 University whose football team lost 40 straight
12 NCAA games, so this doesn't hurt me. I'm not
13 hurt at all.
14 Thank you, Mr. President.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: You still
16 have about 28 motions to go.
17 (Laughter.)
18 Senator Larkin, we have a little
19 housekeeping. May we return to motions and
20 resolutions?
21 SENATOR LARKIN: Return to
22 motions.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: We will
4474
1 return to motions.
2 The chair recognizes Senator
3 DiCarlo.
4 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President.
5 On behalf of Senator Hannon, please place a
6 sponsor star on Calendar Numbers 316 and 378.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Sponsor
8 star will be placed on Calendars Number 316 and
9 378.
10 For the benefit of the members,
11 the chair would announce to the membership that
12 we have had a cross on three of the
13 appropriation bills, Calendar Numbers 390, 391
14 and 392.
15 The Senate has requested to
16 recall those bills which is currently in
17 process. We will bring them back and substitute
18 them for the Assembly bills which had been
19 passed for the Senate bills, and then we will
20 take them up. However, they are not at the desk
21 at this time, so we'll have to -- unless the
22 acting Majority Leader has some other business,
23 we would have to stand at ease.
4475
1 Senator Larkin.
2 SENATOR LARKIN: Mr. President.
3 Let's stand at ease until we get them back here.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senate
5 will stand at ease for a few moments.
6 (Whereupon, the Senate was at
7 ease.)
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senate
9 will come to order. Chair recognizes Senator
10 Larkin.
11 SENATOR LARKIN: Mr. President.
12 I'd like to have you call up Senate Print Number
13 4079, which was recalled from the Assembly and
14 is now at the desk.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
16 will call the roll on reconsideration.
17 THE SECRETARY: Senate Bill
18 Number 4079, Budget Bill, an act making
19 appropriation for the support of government.
20 SENATOR LARKIN: Mr. President.
21 I now move to reconsider the vote by which this
22 bill was passed and ask that the bill be
23 restored to the order of third reading.
4476
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
2 secretary will call the roll on reconsideration.
3 (The Secretary called the roll on
4 reconsideration.)
5 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 51.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
7 is before the house and restored to third
8 reading.
9 Senator Larkin.
10 SENATOR LARKIN: Mr. President.
11 I now move to discharge, from the Committee on
12 Rules, Assembly Print 7353, and substitute it
13 for the identical bill before.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
15 will read the substitution.
16 THE SECRETARY: Senate Budget
17 Bill, making appropriation for the support of
18 government, Assembly Bill 7353, and sub' it for
19 identical bill Calendar Number 390.
20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:
21 Substitution is ordered.
22 Secretary will read the last
23 section.
4477
1 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This
2 act shall take effect immediately.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
4 roll.
5 (The Secretary called the roll.)
6 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 52.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
8 is passed.
9 Senator Larkin.
10 SENATOR LARKIN: Mr. President.
11 I now wish to call Senate Print Number 4080
12 recalled from the Assembly, which is now at the
13 desk.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
15 will read.
16 THE SECRETARY: Senate Bill 4080,
17 an act to provide for payments to municipalities
18 and providers of medical services.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
20 Larkin.
21 SENATOR LARKIN: I now move to
22 reconsider the vote by which this bill was
23 passed and ask the bill be restored to the order
4478
1 of third reading.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
3 secretary will call the roll on reconsideration.
4 (The Secretary called the roll on
5 reconsideration.)
6 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 52.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
8 is before the house.
9 Senator Larkin.
10 SENATOR LARKIN: I now move to
11 discharge, from the Committee on Rules, Assembly
12 Print 7354 and substitute it for our original
13 bill 4080.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:
15 Substitution is ordered.
16 Secretary will read.
17 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
18 391, Budget Bill, Assembly Bill 7354, an act to
19 provide for payments to municipalities and to
20 providers of medical services.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
22 last section.
23 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
4479
1 act shall take effect immediately.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
3 roll.
4 (The Secretary called the roll.)
5 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 52.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
7 is passed.
8 Senator Larkin.
9 SENATOR LARKIN: Mr. President.
10 I wish to call up Senate Bill 4081, recalled
11 from the Assembly, which is now at the desk.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
13 will read.
14 THE SECRETARY: Senate Bill 4081,
15 Budget Bill, an act making appropriation for the
16 support of government.
17 SENATOR LARKIN: I now move to
18 reconsider the vote by which this bill was
19 passed and ask that the bill be restored to the
20 order of third reading.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
22 secretary will call the roll on reconsideration.
23 (The Secretary called the roll on
4480
1 reconsideration.)
2 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 52.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
4 is restored to third reading.
5 SENATOR LARKIN: Mr. President.
6 I now move to discharge, from the Committee on
7 Rules, Assembly Bill Print Number 7353 and
8 substitute it for 4081, Senate Bill.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:
10 Substitution is ordered.
11 Secretary will read.
12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
13 352, Budget Bill, Assembly 7355, an act making
14 appropriation for the support of government.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
16 will read the last section.
17 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This
18 act shall take effect immediately.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
20 roll.
21 (The Secretary called the roll.)
22 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 52.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
4481
1 is passed.
2 Senator Larkin.
3 SENATOR LARKIN: Is there any
4 other housekeeping to be done?
5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Nothing
6 at the desk, Senator Larkin.
7 SENATOR LARKIN: Mr. President.
8 There being no further business, I move we
9 adjourn until Tuesday, April 11, at 3:00 p.m.
10 sharp.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
12 objection, the Senate will stand adjourned until
13 tomorrow, Tuesday, April 11, at 3:00 p.m.
14 (Whereupon, at 4:29 p.m., Senate
15 adjourned.)
16
17
18
19
20