Regular Session - May 16, 1995
5805
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8 ALBANY, NEW YORK
9 May 16, 1995
10 11:02 a.m.
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13 REGULAR SESSION
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17 SENATOR JOHN R. KUHL, JR., Acting President
18 STEPHEN F. SLOAN, Secretary
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5806
1 P R O C E E D I N G S
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
3 Senate will come to order. Members please find
4 their chairs, the staff their places. Ask
5 everybody in the chamber to rise with me and
6 repeat the Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag.
7 (The assemblage repeated the
8 Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag.)
9 We're very pleased once again to
10 be joined by a constituent of Senator Markowitz,
11 Bishop Muriel Grant of the Mt. Olivet Disciple
12 ship of Brooklyn, New York.
13 Bishop Grant.
14 BISHOP MURIEL GRANT: Let us
15 pray. O God, I thank You for Your presence
16 here. Eternal God, through Whose mighty power
17 our fathers of this nation won their liberties
18 of old, I beseech Thee humbly to hear my prayer
19 this day. May the Almighty God Whose kingdom is
20 everlasting and power infinite, have mercy on
21 our land and so rule the hearts of the servants
22 -- Thy servants, the President of these United
23 States and all others in authority, for the
5807
1 advancement of this great nation.
2 We can surely come to You on the
3 strength of the words of another Abraham in our
4 time in the foundation of the proclamation when
5 he said, "The way is plain, peaceful, generous,
6 just, the way which if followed, the world will
7 forever applaud and God must forever bless."
8 Bless us, Lord, our Governor,
9 whose glory is in all the world. We commend
10 this nation to Thy merciful care, that being
11 guided by Thy providence, we may dwell secure in
12 peace. I beseech these souls, especially for
13 the Senate, Republicans and Democrats alike.
14 Heal all their infirmities, Lord. Bless this,
15 their counseling session. I pray that Thou
16 wouldst be pleased to direct and prosper all
17 their consultations for the advancement of Thy
18 glory, for the good of Thy church, the safety,
19 honor and welfare of Thy people, that all things
20 may be ordered and settled by the endeavor of
21 these upon the best and surest foundation, that
22 peace and happiness, truth and justice, religion
23 and faith may be established amongst us for all
5808
1 generations. This and all other necessaries for
2 them, for us, the whole church, I humbly beg in
3 the name and meditation of Jesus Christ, my
4 Savior, my Lord. Amen.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Reading
6 of the Journal.
7 THE SECRETARY: In Senate,
8 Monday, May 15th. The Senate met pursuant to
9 adjournment, Senator Kuhl in the Chair. The
10 prayer by the Reverend Peter Young of Bolton
11 Landing. The Journal of Sunday, May 14th, was
12 read and approved. On motion, Senate adjourned.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Hearing
14 no objection, the Journal stands approved as
15 read.
16 Presentation of petitions.
17 Messages from the Assembly.
18 Messages from the Governor.
19 Reports of standing committees.
20 Reports of select committees.
21 Communications and reports from
22 state officers.
23 Motions and resolutions.
5809
1 SENATOR COOK: Mr. President.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The Chair
3 recognizes Senator Cook.
4 SENATOR COOK: Mr. President, on
5 behalf of Senator Hannon, please place sponsor's
6 stars on Calendar Numbers 378 and 503. I hope
7 those aren't bills he's already passed.
8 Mr. President -
9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Calendar
10 Number 378 and 503 will be starred at the
11 request of the sponsor.
12 Senator Cook.
13 SENATOR COOK: Mr. President, I
14 wish to call up Senator Lack's bill, Number
15 2833, recalled from the Assembly, which is now
16 at the desk.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
18 Secretary will read the title.
19 THE SECRETARY: By Senator Lack,
20 Senate Print 2833, an act to amend Chapter 689
21 of the Laws of 1993, amending the Criminal
22 Procedure Law.
23 SENATOR COOK: Mr. President.
5810
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
2 Cook.
3 SENATOR COOK: I now move to
4 reconsider the vote by which the bill was
5 passed.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
7 motion is to reconsider the vote by which the
8 bill passed the house. The Secretary will call
9 the roll on reconsideration.
10 (The Secretary called the roll on
11 reconsideration.)
12 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 45.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
14 Cook.
15 SENATOR COOK: Mr. President, I
16 offer the following amendments.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
18 amendments are received and adopted.
19 Senator Cook.
20 SENATOR COOK: Also, Mr.
21 President, on page 58, I offer the following
22 amendments to Senator Skelos' bill, Calendar
23 Number 880, Senate Print 2361, and ask that said
5811
1 bill retain its place on the Third Reading
2 Calendar.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
4 amendments to Calendar Number 880 are received
5 and adopted. The bill will retain its place on
6 the Third Reading Calendar.
7 Senator Bruno, we have a
8 substitution at the desk. Would you like to
9 take that up at this time?
10 SENATOR BRUNO: Please take that
11 up at this time, Mr. President.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
13 Secretary will read the substitution.
14 THE SECRETARY: Senator Levy
15 moves to discharge from the Committee on Rules,
16 Assembly Bill Number 5182-A and substitute it
17 for the identical Calendar Number 806.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
19 substitution is ordered.
20 The Chair recognizes Senator
21 Bruno.
22 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President, I
23 would like to call an immediate meeting of Rules
5812
1 in Room 332.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There
3 will be an immediate meeting of the Rules
4 Committee in the Majority Conference Room.
5 That's Room 332. Immediate meeting of the Rules
6 Committee in Room 332.
7 The Chair recognizes Senator
8 Trunzo.
9 SENATOR TRUNZO: Mr. President,
10 please put a sponsor's star on Calendar Number
11 600.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Calendar
13 Number 600 will be starred at the request of the
14 sponsor.
15 Senator Saland.
16 SENATOR SALAND: Thank you, Mr.
17 President.
18 Mr. President, I would like to
19 place sponsor's stars on the following bills:
20 Calendars 90... I'm sorry, 944, 945, 954, 955,
21 956, 958 and 959.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Calendar
23 Number 944, 945, 954, 955, 956, 958 and 959 will
5813
1 be starred at the request of the sponsor.
2 The Chair recognizes Senator
3 Bruno -- or Senator Hannon.
4 SENATOR HANNON: Mr. President,
5 would you please place a sponsor's star on
6 Calendar Number 378?
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
8 Hannon, a sponsor's star was already placed on
9 Calendar Number 378 by Senator Cook on your
10 behalf.
11 SENATOR HANNON: Thank you.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The Chair
13 recognizes Senator Bruno. That brings us to the
14 calendar, I believe, Senator Bruno.
15 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President,
16 can we at this time adopt the Resolution
17 Calendar?
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Certainly
19 can. The motion is to adopt the Resolution
20 Calendar. All those in favor signify by saying
21 aye.
22 (Response of "Aye".)
23 Opposed, nay.
5814
1 (There was no response.)
2 The Resolution Calendar is
3 adopted.
4 Senator Bruno.
5 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President,
6 can we now take up the non-controversial
7 calendar.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
9 Secretary will read the non-controversial
10 calendar.
11 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
12 234, by Senator Johnson, Senate Print 1638, an
13 act to amend the Penal Law, in relation to
14 possessing an obscene sexual performance by a
15 child.
16 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
18 bill aside.
19 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
20 310, Assembly Rules Committee, Assembly Print
21 4105, an act to amend the Tax Law, in relation
22 to extending the sales and use taxes by the city
23 of White Plains.
5815
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
2 Sec... the Secretary will read the last section.
3 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
4 act shall take effect immediately.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
6 roll.
7 (The Secretary called the roll.)
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce
9 the results when tabulated.
10 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 43, nays 2,
11 Senator Dollinger and Jones recorded in the
12 negative.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
14 is passed.
15 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
16 453, by Senator Levy, Senate Print 359, an act
17 to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in
18 relation to criminal history checks on school
19 bus attendants.
20 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
22 bill aside.
23 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
5816
1 461, by Senator Levy, Senate Print 4118, an act
2 to amend the Public Authorities Law, in relation
3 to requiring the Metropolitan Transportation
4 Authority to make public an annual summary of
5 the attendance records of its members.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
7 Secretary will read the last section.
8 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
9 act shall take effect immediately.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
11 roll.
12 (The Secretary called the roll.)
13 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 45.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
15 is passed.
16 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
17 562, by Senator Larkin, Senate Print 3652, an
18 act to amend the General Municipal Law, in
19 relation to the operation of games of chance by
20 authorized games of chance lessors.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
22 Secretary will read the last section.
23 THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This
5817
1 act shall take effect immediately.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
3 roll.
4 (The Secretary called the roll.)
5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce
6 the results when tabulated.
7 SENATOR GOLD: Lay it aside.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
9 bill aside.
10 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
11 601, by Senator Larkin, Senate Print 2963, an
12 act to amend the Election Law, in relation to
13 the hours for voting at primary elections within
14 the county of Orange or Ulster.
15 SENATOR LARKIN: Lay it aside for
16 the day.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
18 bill aside for the day at the request of the
19 sponsor.
20 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
21 602, by Member of the Assembly Tokasz, Assembly
22 Print 4959, an act to amend the Election Law, in
23 relation to merging election districts at school
5818
1 board and general elections.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
3 Secretary will read the last section.
4 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
5 act shall take effect on the 1st day of August.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
7 roll.
8 (The Secretary called the roll.)
9 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 45.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
11 is passed.
12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
13 603, by Senator Leibell, Senate Print 3343, an
14 act to amend the Real Property Tax Law, in
15 relation to the exemption of certain private
16 dwellings and improvements within cities having
17 a population of one million or more.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
19 Secretary will -- lay the bill aside.
20 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
21 617, Member of the Assembly Vitaliano, an act to
22 amend the Retirement and Social Security Law, in
23 relation to the extension of the temporary
5819
1 benefits and supplementation of programs.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
3 Secretary will read the last section.
4 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
5 act shall take effect immediately.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
7 roll.
8 (The Secretary called the roll.)
9 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 45.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
11 is passed.
12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
13 618, by Senator Trunzo, Senate Print 2868, an
14 act to amend the Retirement and Social Security
15 Law, in relation to the membership of policemen
16 and firemen.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
18 Secretary will read the last section.
19 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
20 this act shall take effect immediately.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
22 roll.
23 (The Secretary called the roll.)
5820
1 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 45.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
3 is passed.
4 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
5 625, by Senator Marchi, Senate Print 3367, an
6 act to repeal Section 630 of the Business
7 Corporation Law, relating to the liability of
8 shareholders.
9 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
11 bill aside.
12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
13 627, by Senator Marchi, Senate Print 3802, an
14 act to amend the Public Authorities Law, in
15 relation to powers and duties of the Battery
16 Park City Authority.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
18 Secretary will read the last section.
19 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
20 act shall take effect immediately.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
22 roll.
23 (The Secretary called the roll.)
5821
1 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 45.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
3 is passed.
4 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
5 635, by Senator Cook, Senate Print 562, an act
6 to amend the Highway Law, in relation to the
7 definition of the Southern Tier Expressway.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
9 Secretary will read the last section.
10 THE SECRETARY: Section 6. This
11 act shall take effect on the 1st day of July.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
13 roll.
14 (The Secretary called the roll.)
15 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 45.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
17 is passed.
18 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
19 636, by Senator Levy, Senate Print 1476, an act
20 to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law and the
21 Education Law, in relation to making technical
22 corrections relating to phasing out the use of
23 school buses.
5822
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
2 Secretary will read the last section.
3 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
4 act shall take effect immediately.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
6 roll.
7 (The Secretary called the roll.)
8 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 44, nays 1,
9 Senator Seward recorded in the negative.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
11 is passed.
12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
13 637, by Senator Goodman, Senate Print 1695-A, an
14 act to amend the Transportation Law, in relation
15 to increasing penalties for violating a motor
16 carrier certificate.
17 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. President.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
19 Leichter, why do you rise?
20 SENATOR LEICHTER: May I inquire,
21 Calendar Number 625, was that laid aside?
22 Okay. Thank you.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 625?
5823
1 Yes, Senator Marchi's bill, Calendar Number 625
2 was laid aside, Senator Leichter.
3 The Secretary will read the last
4 section on Calendar Number 637.
5 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
6 act shall take effect on the 1st day of
7 November.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
9 roll.
10 (The Secretary called the roll.)
11 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 45.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
13 is passed.
14 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
15 645, by Senator Seward, Senate Print 3432-A, an
16 act to amend the Public Service Law, in relation
17 to increasing the statutory ceiling for non
18 major changes.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
20 Secretary will read the last section.
21 THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This
22 act shall take effect immediately.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
5824
1 roll.
2 (The Secretary called the roll.)
3 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 45.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
5 is passed.
6 Senator DiCarlo, for those
7 members, we accidentally read Calendar Number
8 645. That's what the vote was. Are there any
9 negatives on Calendar Number 645?
10 (There was no response.)
11 If not, the bill is passed.
12 The Secretary will return to
13 Calendar Number 639 and call that.
14 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
15 639, by Senator Goodman, Senate Print 2429, an
16 act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in
17 relation to regulation of delivery bicycles.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
19 Secretary will read the last section.
20 THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This
21 act shall take effect on the 90th day.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
23 roll.
5825
1 (The Secretary called the roll.)
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce
3 the results when tabulated.
4 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 44, nays 1,
5 Senator DiCarlo recorded in the negative.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
7 is passed.
8 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
9 648, by Senator Johnson, Senate Print 36, an act
10 to amend the Tax Law, in relation to exempting
11 from sales and use tax certain transactions.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There's a
13 local fiscal impact note at the desk. The
14 Secretary will read the last section.
15 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
16 act shall take effect on the 1st day of the
17 quarterly sales tax period.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
19 roll.
20 (The Secretary called the roll.)
21 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 47.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
23 is passed.
5826
1 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
2 649, by Member of the Assembly Butler, Assembly
3 Print 1248, an act to amend the Executive Law,
4 in relation to requiring certain notices to be
5 printed on reports and publications.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
7 Secretary will read the last section.
8 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
9 act shall take effect on the 90th day.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
11 roll.
12 (The Secretary called the roll.)
13 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 48.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
15 is passed.
16 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
17 650, by Senator Farley, Senate Print 1446, an
18 act to amend the Executive Law, in relation to
19 the designation of August 7th as Family Day, a
20 day of commemoration.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
22 Secretary will read the last section.
23 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
5827
1 act shall take effect immediately.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
3 roll.
4 (The Secretary called the roll.)
5 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 49.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
7 is passed.
8 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
9 652, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 2336, an
10 act to amend the Executive Law and the Education
11 Law, in relation to providing security
12 information to prospective students.
13 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
15 bill aside.
16 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
17 655, by Senator Tully, Senate Print 2870, an act
18 to amend the Executive Law, in relation to the
19 creation of the Long Island Sound Coastal
20 Advisory Commission.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
22 Secretary will read the last section.
23 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
5828
1 act shall take effect immediately.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
3 roll.
4 (The Secretary called the roll.)
5 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
7 is passed.
8 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
9 671, by Senator Skelos, Senate Print 408, an act
10 to amend the Correction Law and the County Law,
11 in relation to maintenance of prisoners in
12 county jail facilities.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
14 Secretary will read the last section.
15 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
17 bill aside.
18 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
19 672, by Senator LaValle, Senate Print 579, an
20 act to amend the Correction Law, in relation to
21 eligible inmates for temporary release programs.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
23 Secretary will read the last section.
5829
1 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
2 act shall take effect immediately.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
4 roll.
5 (The Secretary called the roll.)
6 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
8 is passed.
9 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
10 674, by Senator Skelos, Senate Print 1740, an
11 act to amend the Executive Law and the Penal
12 Law, in relation to payment of a fee by persons
13 sentenced to probation.
14 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
16 bill aside.
17 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
18 678, by Senator Johnson, Senate Print 2355, an
19 act to amend the Education Law, in relation to
20 requiring that State University graduation
21 ceremonies include the Pledge of Allegiance and
22 National Anthem.
23 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
5830
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
2 bill aside.
3 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
4 688, by Senator Hoblock, Senate Print 3554, an
5 act to amend the Retirement and Social Security
6 Law, in relation to transfer of precious service
7 credit.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
9 Secretary will read the last section.
10 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
11 act shall take effect immediately.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
13 roll.
14 (The Secretary called the roll.)
15 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
17 is passed.
18 THE SECRETARY: In relation to
19 Calendar Number 688, ayes 49, nays 1, Senator
20 Leichter recorded in the negative.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
22 is passed.
23 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
5831
1 694, by Senator Cook, Senate Print 4165, an act
2 authorizing the town of New Paltz in Ulster
3 County to make provisions of Section 384-d of
4 the Retirement and Social Security Law.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There's a
6 home rule message at the desk. The Secretary
7 will read the last section.
8 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
9 act shall take effect immediately.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
11 roll.
12 (The Secretary called the roll.)
13 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
15 is passed.
16 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
17 703, by Senator Velella, Senate Print 4112-A, an
18 act to amend the Insurance Law, in relation to
19 investments.
20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
21 Secretary will read the last section.
22 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
23 act shall take effect immediately.
5832
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
2 roll.
3 (The Secretary called the roll.)
4 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 52.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
6 is passed.
7 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
8 704, by Member of the Assembly Bragman, Assembly
9 Print 6245, an act to amend Chapter 625 of the
10 Laws of 1992, amending the Insurance Law.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
12 Secretary will read the last section.
13 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
14 act shall take effect immediately.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
16 roll.
17 (The Secretary called the roll.)
18 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 52.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
20 is passed.
21 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
22 708, by Senator Wright, Senate Print 3073, the
23 act to amend the State Administrative Procedure
5833
1 Act, in relation to requiring that agencies
2 conduct and include a formal cost/benefit
3 analysis in each regulatory impact statement.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
5 Secretary will read the last section.
6 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
7 act shall take effect on the 1st day of October.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
9 roll.
10 (The Secretary called the roll.)
11 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 52.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
13 is passed.
14 Senator Libous, that completes
15 the non-controversial calendar. What's your
16 pleasure?
17 SENATOR STAFFORD: Mr. President,
18 there will be an immediate meeting of Finance in
19 Room 332, please, Mr. President.
20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: For the
21 benefit of the members, there will be an immed
22 iate meeting of the Senate Finance Committee in
23 the Majority Conference Room, that's Room 332.
5834
1 Immediate meeting of the Finance Committee.
2 Senator Montgomery, why do you
3 rise?
4 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Mr.
5 President, I would like unanimous consent to be
6 recorded in the negative on Calendar 672.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
8 objection. Hearing no objection, Senator
9 Montgomery will be recorded in the negative on
10 Calendar Number 672.
11 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Thank you.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The Chair
13 recognizes Senator Libous.
14 SENATOR LIBOUS: Mr. President,
15 we're ready to do the controversial calendar,
16 please.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
18 Secretary will call the controversial calendar.
19 THE SECRETARY: On page 12,
20 Calendar Number 234, by Senator Johnson, Senate
21 Print 1638, an act to amend the Penal Law, in
22 relation to possessing an obscene sexual
23 performance by a child.
5835
1 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
3 Johnson, an explanation of Calendar Number 234
4 has been asked for by the Acting Minority
5 Leader, Senator Paterson.
6 SENATOR JOHNSON: Mr. President,
7 this bill makes it illegal to possess an obscene
8 sexual performance by a child, and a sexual
9 performance by a child makes the penalty a -
10 it's a -
11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
12 Johnson, Senator Johnson, excuse me just a
13 minute. Can we have some order in the house,
14 please? There's an awful lot of conversation
15 going on. It's extremely difficult for members
16 to hear what another member is saying. Staff,
17 please take your chairs. Members, please take
18 their seats.
19 Thank you, Senator Johnson, for
20 the interruption. I apologize.
21 SENATOR JOHNSON: Mr. President,
22 this bill makes possession of child pornography
23 a violation, makes it a Class E felony. We're
5836
1 joining 30 other states that have similar laws,
2 the crackdown on child pornography.
3 We were presented with some sort
4 of an amendment from the other side. I guess
5 they want to talk about it further, but
6 essentially we passed this bill several years
7 running, and it's passed overwhelmingly.
8 That's about all I can say, Mr.
9 President.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The Chair
11 recognizes Senator Paterson.
12 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
13 I have an amendment that is at the desk. It is
14 served and, if you have received it, I would be
15 willing to waive its reading and just speak on
16 it for a couple of moments.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
18 Secretary does indicate, Senator Paterson, that
19 there is your amendment at the desk. The
20 reading of it is waived and you are afforded at
21 this time the opportunity to explain the
22 amendment.
23 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
5837
1 all the amendment would do is to require the
2 knowledge or the reason to have knowledge of the
3 individual who would possess the sexual
4 performance that the subject of the performance
5 is 18 years of age or older.
6 What we're trying to avoid is
7 individuals who would have some kind of a sexual
8 performance that they would be reasonably
9 assured would be performed by adults, and then
10 to later find out that actually a person who was
11 under age was involved.
12 Recently, there was a situation
13 where a pornographic film star, whose name is
14 Tracy Lords -- all this information, Mr.
15 President, was upon information and belief, and
16 this individual announced that she had
17 celebrated her 18th birthday, but apparently she
18 had been appearing in these movies for years but
19 no one knew that she was not 18, and so I would
20 not like for a citizen of our state to be put in
21 the position where it would seem that the
22 individual who is the subject of the sexual
23 performance is of age and, therefore, it is a
5838
1 legal transaction and it is a legal participa
2 tion, and then to find later on that the person
3 is under age. That is the sum and the substance
4 of the amendment.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
6 Saland on the amendment.
7 SENATOR SALAND: On the
8 amendment, Mr. President.
9 Mr. President, the existing law
10 in Article 263 already provides for an affirma
11 tive defense, an affirmative defense which, I
12 believe, is set forth in Section 263.20, and
13 that affirmative defense states that it shall be
14 such an affirmative defense that defendant in
15 good faith reasonably believed the person
16 appearing in the performance was 16 years of age
17 or over.
18 Affirmative defense, under our
19 Penal Code or civil procedure -- Criminal
20 Procedure requires that to be established by a
21 mere preponderance of the evidence. To burden
22 the district attorney in these types of prosecu
23 tions to prove beyond a reasonable doubt is not
5839
1 merely a shift in the burden of proof as would
2 be proposed by the Acting Minority Leader, but
3 certainly would be an onerous burden and make
4 prosecution pretty darn near impossible.
5 I would certainly oppose the
6 amendment and urge that my colleagues similarly
7 oppose it.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
9 Paterson.
10 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
11 truth is an affirmative defense, and the reason
12 that truth becomes affirmative is because we
13 don't know what the truth is when we indict
14 people, and so I think we are confusing the
15 nature of the description of what is an
16 affirmative defense.
17 There are times when there are
18 certain actions that the defense may take that,
19 as Senator Saland said, require a preponderance
20 of the evidence and have to be overlaid by a
21 proof beyond reasonable doubt, but what I'm
22 saying is by the time the truth comes up in this
23 particular case, you have an individual who's
5840
1 already been indicted; they have already been
2 arraigned; they have already been put on trial;
3 they have already in many respects been
4 humiliated in our criminal justice system.
5 What we have a chance to do today
6 -- and we are lawmakers and we would want to
7 make the best possible laws. We don't want to
8 leave a burden on an innocent party where we can
9 correct it in law. What we would like to do
10 today in this amendment is to establish that the
11 individual knew; in other words, there are some
12 very clear cases of child pornography. It is
13 really a loathesome and despicable kind of
14 action that is pervading our society in many
15 ways, and I would not like to diminish it in any
16 respect by creating any kind of confusion with
17 the regular situation that adults engage in
18 watching these sexual performances and which we
19 have not made illegal.
20 Now, if we want to make them
21 illegal or we don't like them, that's our
22 choice, but while we have a law as it stands
23 today, I don't think that the law should be
5841
1 ambiguous. This would make the law clear. We
2 don't need to establish an affirmative defense
3 where we have a better way, and I'm suggesting
4 that if we incorporate this amendment into
5 Senator Johnson's bill -- it's a good bill. I'm
6 going to vote for it anyway, but I would like
7 for it to have served our society in the best
8 way that it can.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
10 Johnson.
11 SENATOR JOHNSON: Mr. President,
12 I certainly don't want to debate this proposed
13 amendment, but suffice it to say that this
14 amendment would make the bill unenforceable and
15 no one would be convicted. In fact, this bill
16 makes it a misdemeanor, which means it will have
17 no practical impact on possession of child
18 pornography. This can be not be permitted.
19 I would like to say that 75
20 percent of the Senators here voted for this bill
21 the last time, 83 sponsors in the other house,
22 more than enough to pass the bill in the other
23 house if it got on the floor. The people want
5842
1 and need this bill and this amendment should be
2 rejected, and I move that be done.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
4 question is on the amendment. All those who are
5 in favor of the amendment signify by saying
6 aye.
7 (Response of "Aye".)
8 Those opposed, nay.
9 (Response of "Nay".)
10 The amendment fails.
11 The Secretary will read the last
12 section on the bill.
13 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
14 act shall take effect on the 1st day of
15 November.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
17 roll.
18 (The Secretary called the roll.)
19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce
20 the results when tabulated.
21 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
22 the negative are Senators Smith and Waldon.
23 Ayes 56, nays 2.
5843
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
2 is passed.
3 The Secretary will continue to
4 call the controversial calendar.
5 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
6 453, by Senator Levy, Senate Print 359, an act
7 to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in
8 relation to criminal history checks on school
9 bus attendants.
10 SENATOR LARKIN: Lay it aside
11 temporarily.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
13 bill aside temporarily.
14 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
15 562, by Senator Larkin, Senate Print 3652, an
16 act to amend the General Municipal Law, in
17 relation to the operation of games of chance by
18 authorized games of chance lessors.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
20 Paterson.
21 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
22 Senator Gold laid this bill aside, and I think
23 he's in the Rules Committee meeting. Can we
5844
1 hold it for just a few minutes?
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
3 Acting Majority Leader indicates yes. The bill
4 will be laid aside temporarily.
5 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
6 603, by Senator Leibell, Senate Print 3343, an
7 act to amend the Real Property Tax Law, in
8 relation to the exemption of certain private
9 dwellings and improvements within cities having
10 a population of less than one million from local
11 taxation.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
13 Paterson.
14 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
15 Senator Leichter laid this bill aside. I
16 believe he's also at the Rules Committee, so I
17 figure under equal protection, we would give him
18 a few moments as well.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Never
20 assume anything, Senator Paterson, but the
21 Acting Majority Leader submits to your request.
22 The bill will be laid aside temporarily.
23 SENATOR LARKIN: Lay it aside
5845
1 temporarily.
2 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
3 625, by Senator Marchi, Senate Print 3367, an
4 act to amend the real -- an act to repeal
5 Section 630 of the Business Corporation Law,
6 relating to the liability of shareholders for
7 wages due to laborers.
8 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
10 Paterson.
11 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
12 even prior to the explanation on the substance
13 of the bill, I just have a question about the
14 nature of the bill, because if this is S.4...
15 S.3367, we, earlier in the session in March,
16 passed Calendar 384 which I thought was the same
17 bill -- I'm sorry -- Calendar Number 174, which
18 I believe was the same bill, and I just wanted
19 to try to understand why that's the case.
20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
21 Marchi, an explanation of the bill was asked for
22 when the non-controversial calendar was read, by
23 Senator Dollinger. Senator Paterson certainly
5846
1 has raised a question which you would perhaps
2 like to address at this time. Maybe you would
3 like to address both of those at one time.
4 So, Senator Marchi, I'll
5 recognize you at this point for an explanation
6 and in response to the question posed by Senator
7 Paterson.
8 SENATOR MARCHI: Well, in this
9 bill, Mr. President, there are about 680 -- the
10 number of corporations that are put together
11 over the year, we have about 47 or 48 in the
12 state of New York. The provision that we have,
13 of course, takes the first ten shareholders and
14 the highest ten shareholders and makes them -
15 can make them personally liable under -- for
16 wages due to laborers, so it's not a bad -- it's
17 not a bad provision.
18 The only problem is that the vast
19 majority, I think out of 8,000 incorporations,
20 they all go out of state and over half of them
21 are in the state of Delaware; they're in other
22 jurisdictions. The result is there are no
23 corporations being incorporated in the state of
5847
1 New York, and this bill -- and the law that -
2 the law that prevails in the incorporated -
3 incorporations in other states does not present
4 -- does not -- does not coincide with the
5 thrust of this law.
6 On the other hand, there is no
7 relief. It just -- the net effect of it is that
8 all but a few incorporations in the state of New
9 York take place in other jurisdictions where
10 this exculpation does not take place. I believe
11 that in the long run that being -- having a more
12 intimate role in the formulation of corporations
13 would probably inure to the benefit even to
14 those who are sought to be served by a point of
15 view that I'm sure you reflect and I have to say
16 I share myself, but under the present arrange
17 ment, we are -- we are excluded completely from
18 -- from this process, and all the incorpora
19 tions are not taking place in the state of New
20 York, they're going elsewhere, and they should
21 be taking place here.
22 I feel that it would augur well
23 and perhaps lead to some developments that would
5848
1 meet both of our objectives. I sense what
2 you're saying, and I can't really disagree with
3 it on the merits, but on the other hand, I don't
4 think that it's a good arrangement at the
5 present time.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The Chair
7 recognizes Senator Paterson.
8 SENATOR PATERSON: Actually,
9 Senator -- Mr. President, to Senator Marchi, I
10 just wanted to understand. I guess what I
11 conclude from that is that Calendar 174 was more
12 of an omnibus bill that repeals several sections
13 of the law, and the bill that is before us right
14 now, Calendar 625, is -- deals with this one
15 section of the law, and so I would assume that
16 whichever one would prevail first, should we
17 pass it into law, would then be the enacted
18 law. That's all I was trying to clear up.
19 By the way, Senator Marchi, there
20 are four shopping days 'til my birthday, I'd
21 like you to know that.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
23 Dollinger.
5849
1 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr.
2 President, I rise just to speak against this
3 bill.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
5 Dollinger, on the bill.
6 SENATOR DOLLINGER: This bill, as
7 I understand it, Senator Marchi, says that if
8 you're a small corporation, it doesn't apply to
9 -- that section of the law does not apply
10 currently to major corporations that have their
11 -- I'm not sure what the numbers are, but in
12 excess of 50,000 or something of that nature,
13 but what this bill says, if you work for a small
14 corporation and you're an employee and you work
15 for that corporation -- and in many cases you're
16 dealing with just the boss. You've got a
17 corporate entity, but you deal with the boss
18 who's the major shareholder, and the boss says,
19 "We got to go to work this week" and "We got to
20 go to work next week and, don't worry, I'll pay
21 you. I'll pay you with your paycheck. Your
22 paycheck will come at the end of the two-week
23 period." What happens is they don't get the
5850
1 paycheck. The employee goes in to the employer
2 and says, "You owe me weeks' worth of pay." The
3 employer then says, "Well, I've decided to go
4 bankrupt. We're not going to pay you and, oh,
5 by the way, there's no personal liability
6 against me. You can sue the corporation as an
7 unsecured creditor and you can stand in line
8 behind all the people who filed liens, all the
9 people who have filed claims against the
10 corporation, have judgments against the
11 corporation, you, Mr. Employee, you can stand
12 behind all those other creditors." It seems to
13 me that that's not fair.
14 What we have done in this state
15 much to our credit over the course of the last
16 50 years is we have said that if you're working
17 and you deserve to be paid wages, we're going to
18 give you every possible tool to collect those
19 wages, including we are going to make the
20 shareholders of a small corporation personally
21 liable when those wages are not paid.
22 It's a tremendous incentive for
23 the corporation to put the employee, the person
5851
1 who puts their labor into the fields or into the
2 benefit of a corporation, that the employee
3 makes sure that they're going to get paid.
4 I don't like the trend of this
5 legislation. I don't like being -- telling our
6 employees that if you work for a small corpora
7 tion and they go bankrupt, guess what, you get
8 nothing. We can tell that to creditors. We can
9 tell that to other judgment creditors against
10 small corporations, but I'm opposed to telling
11 it to people that work for small businesses in
12 this state. I think this is the wrong idea.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
14 Secretary will read the last section.
15 THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This
16 act shall take effect immediately.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
18 roll.
19 (The Secretary called the roll.)
20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce
21 the results when tabulated.
22 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
23 the negative on Calendar Number 625 are Senators
5852
1 Dollinger, Onorato and Stavisky. Ayes 55, nays
2 3.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
4 is passed.
5 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
6 652, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 2336, an
7 act to amend the Executive Law and the Education
8 Law, in relation to providing security informa
9 tion to prospective students.
10 SENATOR LARKIN: Lay it aside
11 temporarily.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
13 bill aside temporarily.
14 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
15 671, by Senator Skelos, Senate Print 408, an act
16 to amend the Correction Law and the County Law,
17 in relation to maintenance of prisoners.
18 SENATOR LARKIN: Lay it aside
19 temporarily.
20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
21 bill aside temporarily.
22 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
23 674, by Senator Skelos, Senate Print 1740, an
5853
1 act to amend the Executive Law and the Penal
2 Law.
3 SENATOR LARKIN: Lay it aside
4 temporarily. He's at the Finance meeting.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
6 bill aside temporarily.
7 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
8 678, by Senator Johnson, Senate Print 2355, an
9 act amend the Education Law, in relation to
10 requiring that the State University graduation
11 ceremonies including the Pledge of Allegiance
12 and the National Anthem.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
14 Paterson.
15 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
16 I don't know if some of those who are employed
17 here know, but we only instituted the reciting
18 of the National Anthem in 1988 in the winter,
19 and I think it actually puts us in a good frame
20 of mind every day when we come in here -- I'm
21 sorry, the Pledge of Allegiance. We recite the
22 Pledge of Allegiance, and that brings me to this
23 bill.
5854
1 I'd proudly support this bill
2 but, Mr. President, I don't know why we don't
3 sing the National Anthem here. I think we could
4 bring in entertainers from all over the country
5 to lead us in singing the National Anthem, and
6 in the absence of entertainers, as in the
7 absence of clergy, you, Mr. President, could
8 sing the National Anthem.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: I don't
10 think you would want that, Senator.
11 The Secretary will read the last
12 section.
13 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
14 act shall take effect on the 120th day.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
16 roll.
17 (The Secretary called the roll.)
18 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 57, nays 1,
19 Senator Connor recorded in the negative.
20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
21 is passed.
22 SENATOR HOLLAND: Mr. President.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The Chair
5855
1 recognizes Senator Holland. Senator Holland, do
2 you have a motion in front of you?
3 SENATOR HOLLAND: I have two.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Ask the
5 Majority Leader to do housekeeping.
6 SENATOR LARKIN: Let's do a
7 little housekeeping, Mr. President.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Sounds
9 like a good idea. Senator Holland, you have
10 been given the room.
11 SENATOR HOLLAND: On page 24, I
12 offer the following amendments to Calendar
13 Number 581 for Senator Trunzo, Senate Print
14 Number 3755, and ask that the said bill retain
15 its place on the Third Reading Calendar.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
17 amendments to Calendar Number 581 are received
18 and adopted. The bill will retain its place on
19 the Third Reading Calendar.
20 Senator Holland.
21 SENATOR HOLLAND: Also on page
22 59, I offer the following amendments to Calendar
23 Number 888, Senate Print Number 1470, and ask
5856
1 that said bill retain its place on the Third
2 Reading Calendar.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
4 amendments to Calendar Number 888 are received
5 and adopted. The bill will retain its place on
6 the Third Reading Calendar.
7 Senator Holland.
8 SENATOR HOLLAND: On behalf of
9 Senator Libous, please place a sponsor's star on
10 Calendar Number 801 and 938.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Calendars
12 Number 801 and 938 will be starred at the
13 request of the sponsor.
14 Senator Waldon, why do you rise?
15 SENATOR WALDON: If I may, Mr.
16 President, I respectfully request unanimous
17 consent in regard to Calendar Number 678 to be
18 recorded in the negative and to make one
19 statement in that regard regarding my vote.
20 I think that -
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
22 Waldon, that is not really permissible at this
23 point.
5857
1 SENATOR WALDON: Okay, Mr.
2 President. I stand corrected. Please record me
3 in the negative.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Okay.
5 Without objection, and hearing no objection,
6 Senator Waldon will be recorded in the negative
7 on Calendar Number 678.
8 The Chair recognizes Senator
9 Johnson.
10 SENATOR JOHNSON: Mr. President,
11 I would like to call up my Calendar Number 602
12 which already passed and reconsider the vote.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
14 Johnson, you're talking about Calendar Number
15 602, Senator Maltese's bill?
16 SENATOR JOHNSON: That's correct.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
18 Johnson, I'm informed that that bill has left
19 the house, so we can no longer reconsider it at
20 this time.
21 SENATOR JOHNSON: Well, I'll just
22 have to let it go, Mr. President.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
5858
1 Maziarz, why do you rise?
2 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Mr. President,
3 my apologies. I would like to, with your
4 permission and the permission of the Senate, be
5 recorded in the negative on Calendar Number 703.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
7 objection, and hearing no objection, Senator
8 Maziarz will be recorded in the negative on
9 Calendar 703.
10 SENATOR MAZIARZ: Thank you.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The Chair
12 recognizes Senator Larkin.
13 SENATOR LARKIN: Mr. President,
14 may we return to reports of standing committees?
15 I believe there's a report from the Rules
16 Committee at the desk.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
18 Larkin, I'm informed by the Secretary that there
19 is a report of the Rules Committee at the desk,
20 so we will return to the reports of standing
21 committees at your request.
22 I'll ask the Secretary to read.
23 THE SECRETARY: Senator Bruno,
5859
1 from the Committee on Rules, reports the
2 following bill directly to third reading:
3 By the Committee on Rules,
4 Assembly Print 7373-A, an act to amend Chapter
5 729 of the Laws of 1994, relating to effecting
6 the health insurance benefits and contributions
7 of retired employees.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
9 Larkin.
10 SENATOR LARKIN: I move we adopt
11 the report of the Rules Committee, Mr.
12 President.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
14 motion is to adopt the report of the Rules
15 Committee. All those in favor signify by saying
16 aye.
17 (Response of "Aye".)
18 Opposed, nay.
19 (There was no response.)
20 The Rules report is adopted.
21 Senator Larkin.
22 SENATOR LARKIN: Mr. President,
23 may we take up Calendar 1000, Assembly Bill
5860
1 7373-A, health insurance benefit extenders for
2 retirees.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
4 Larkin, so that you know, the bill is being
5 distributed to the members at this moment. May
6 we wait just a minute before I have the
7 Secretary read the title until it is distributed
8 to all of the members?
9 SENATOR LARKIN: Thank you, Mr.
10 President.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: I believe
12 all bills have been distributed to all the
13 members at this time, so the Secretary will read
14 the title.
15 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
16 1000, by the Assembly Committee on Rules,
17 Assembly Print 7373-A, an act to amend Chapter
18 729 of the Laws of 1994, relating to effecting
19 the health insurance benefits and contributions
20 of retired employees.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
22 Secretary will read the last section.
23 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
5861
1 act shall take effect immediately.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
3 roll.
4 (The Secretary called the roll.)
5 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 58.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
7 is passed.
8 Senator Larkin.
9 SENATOR LARKIN: Mr. President, I
10 suggest we stand at ease for a few minutes. The
11 Finance Committee has not finished its business,
12 so let's just stand at ease.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
14 Senate will stand at ease for a short period of
15 time.
16 (Whereupon, the Senate stood at
17 ease from 11:51 a.m. until 12:06 p.m.)
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
19 Senate will come to order.
20 SENATOR SKELOS: Would you please
21 call up Calendar 674?
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
23 Secretary will read the title on Calendar Number
5862
1 674.
2 THE SECRETARY: On page 33,
3 Calendar Number 674, by Senator Skelos, Senate
4 Print 1740, an act to amend the Executive Law
5 and the Penal Law, in relation to payment of a
6 fee by persons sentenced to probation.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
8 Abate.
9 SENATOR ABATE: Yes. Is there an
10 an amendment at the desk?
11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is,
12 Senator Abate.
13 SENATOR ABATE: I'd like to waive
14 the reading of that amendment, and I'd ask for
15 an opportunity to explain the amendment.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
17 reading of the amendment proposed by Senator
18 Abate is waived and the opportunity to explain
19 it is provided to you at this moment.
20 SENATOR ABATE: Thank you very
21 much, Mr. President.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
23 Abate.
5863
1 SENATOR ABATE: My amendment
2 allows for a county or the New York City to have
3 the option through local law to put this
4 legislation in operation.
5 Right now, as the legislation is
6 drafted, it's mandatory for all counties, and
7 the reason that I'm seeking this change -- and
8 I go back to the days when I was the Commission
9 er of Probation in New York City and I met with
10 all the probation departments throughout the
11 state -- we had lengthy discussions over the
12 last four years around this piece of legisla
13 tion, and there is an organization called COPA
14 which is made up of all the probation
15 administrators throughout the state, made up of
16 the administrators from rural counties, from
17 large cities, from all the counties throughout
18 the state, and there was a consensus that this
19 bill in spirit was very good, that many
20 counties, particularly counties like Nassau
21 County, could utilize this legislation to
22 produce additional revenue, but there were other
23 counties that felt that this legislation would
5864
1 put an undue burden on them, and that the cost
2 of collecting these revenues would exceed any
3 revenues that they might be able to produce
4 through the probationers.
5 So my amendment would not
6 eviscerate this legislation. It would just
7 allow the localities, through local option, to
8 legislate, if they felt that this would be
9 something that was beneficial to this county,
10 and the reason the -- a number of the probation
11 departments find this troublesome -- and I can
12 speak to New York City because I know that
13 department the best -- there are now 75,000
14 people on probation. 77 percent of them are
15 felons, so we're not talking about individuals
16 who have been arrested for drunk driving and
17 property crimes, individuals that are currently
18 employed or have an employment record. Many of
19 these individuals are indigent and do not have
20 money but, if this bill were passed, every
21 probation department would have to expend
22 limited resources doing a financial analysis for
23 77,000 probationers. Money would have to be put
5865
1 in place to allow a reporting system for the
2 court. The court would then have to put in
3 place more judges to hear probation violators,
4 and probation departments are saying they're
5 having a hard time now getting money from
6 probationers for restitution, for mandatory
7 surcharges and other fees that need to be
8 collected.
9 So, on balance, I think we should
10 let it be done by local rule. Those probation
11 departments that are barely surviving that need
12 every resource possible to supervise violent
13 offenders, those resources should not be
14 depleted. We want those resources on the street
15 to protect the general public to make sure the
16 violent offenders that are on probation are
17 supervised adequately, and many probation
18 departments do not have sufficient resources to
19 prepare their investigation reports to the
20 court, and again, they would have to take those
21 needed resources to try to collect these fees.
22 So I say let it be local option.
23 I think it's a wonderful idea, Senator Skelos,
5866
1 for those counties that want it. It's an
2 opportunity for them to produce additional
3 revenue. For the counties that don't have the
4 resource do it, let them figure out other
5 innovative ways.
6 A number of the counties want to
7 come back and meet with you, Senator Skelos -
8 I've talked with them -- to look at how next
9 year, if this was changed to local option, how
10 they could opt in, in a more creative and less
11 burdensome way.
12 So I'd ask this body to seriously
13 consider this amendment. There's a way then to
14 move forward on your initiative, Senator, but -
15 and in some ways it could serve as an experiment
16 statewide; we could look at the results of this
17 and then take the next step, if necessary, the
18 following year.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
20 Jones on the amendment.
21 SENATOR JONES: Yes, on the
22 amendment.
23 I would just like to add that I
5867
1 commend Senator Skelos because this year -- I
2 know we put on probation fees last year but we
3 didn't give them any mechanism to do anything
4 about it, and I know from talking to my own
5 probation people, what was happening was many of
6 them, because it didn't come from the court,
7 their sentence would be up and there was no way
8 to collect. So I see you've fixed that now so
9 that it is a condition of the sentencing, but I
10 will have to say that from my own director of
11 probation in my county, he did indicate the same
12 thing that Senator Abate just said, that they
13 thought they had an agreement where it would be
14 subject to local option and would not be
15 mandatory on every county, that it would be left
16 to the local government.
17 So I am supportive of the
18 amendment. I am certainly supportive of the
19 concept of making them pay and do whatever we
20 can to not only lessen the cost for our
21 community but, you know, to do something that I
22 believe is right for people who have broken the
23 law but, you know, I would also agree that I
5868
1 wish we could have made it local option as
2 opposed to mandatory for everybody.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
4 question is on the amendment. All those in
5 favor of the amendment signify by saying aye.
6 (Response of "Aye".)
7 Opposed, nay.
8 (Response of "Nay".)
9 The amendment, in a close vote,
10 failed.
11 SENATOR ONORATO: Mr. President,
12 did you hear me say "aye"?
13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: I heard
14 you say it twice, I thought, Senator Onorato,
15 but again, I'm in need of signing up for that
16 hearing exam at the nurse's office.
17 The Secretary will read the last
18 section on the bill.
19 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
20 act shall take effect on the 1st day of
21 November.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
23 Waldon.
5869
1 SENATOR WALDON: Mr. President -
2 if I may, Mr. President, I would just like to
3 ask a question or two of the sponsor.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
5 Skelos, do you yield to a question from Senator
6 Waldon?
7 SENATOR SKELOS: Yes, Senator.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
9 Senator yields, Senator Waldon.
10 SENATOR WALDON: Thank you, Mr.
11 President. Thank you, Senator Skelos.
12 Senator, would you please refresh
13 my recollection about the mechanism for collect
14 ing these monies and who is the decision-maker
15 as to whether or not someone can afford to pay?
16 SENATOR SKELOS: At the time of
17 sentencing, as you know, the Probation Depart
18 ment will make a recommendation to the sentenc
19 ing judge as to what they feel would be approp
20 riate probation for the criminal. At that time,
21 they would make a recommendation to the
22 sentencing judge. The defendant would have his
23 attorney -- his or her attorney present and -
5870
1 to discuss with the judge at the time of
2 probation whether, in fact, they can or are able
3 to reimburse the county for the cost of
4 probation. So this would be a condition of
5 probation.
6 SENATOR WALDON: Mr. President.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
8 Skelos, do you continue to yield? The Senator
9 continues to yield.
10 SENATOR WALDON: Thank you, Mr.
11 President.
12 Senator, I'm not clear, though,
13 as to the decision on the amount that the person
14 on probation would be required to pay. Is that
15 going to be the purview of the probation officer
16 or will there be a separate mechanism created,
17 because becoming a probation officer requires
18 certain skills and certain education, none of
19 which is necessarily indicative that the person
20 will be a good financial planner in regard to
21 this situation.
22 SENATOR SKELOS: It would be
23 determined by the sentencing judge. The judge
5871
1 at that time would take into account the
2 financial resources, assets of the individual,
3 the health, the age and any other relevant
4 factor in making a determination as to whether
5 this person is indigent or non-indigent and
6 could afford to reimburse the county or the city
7 for the cost of probation supervision.
8 SENATOR WALDON: Thank you very
9 much, Senator.
10 Thank you, Mr. President.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
12 Secretary will read the last section. Call the
13 roll.
14 (The Secretary called the roll.)
15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce
16 the results when tabulated.
17 Senator Volker to explain his
18 vote.
19 SENATOR VOLKER: Just to explain
20 my vote quickly.
21 The real reason for this
22 legislation and the problem is the city of New
23 York.
5872
1 The city of New York absolutely
2 refuses to -- the judges in the City, to even
3 consider attempting to collect fees such as
4 this, even though there is a considerable per
5 centage, and I admit it's not a high percentage,
6 but a considerable percentage of defendants who
7 would be able to cover the cost, but the City
8 has taken the attitude over the years and, very
9 honestly, there has been some consideration, and
10 I think one of the reasons why some of the
11 probation directors are worried that we might do
12 it, and that is to put some sort of restrictions
13 on it, that is if they don't collect it, to put
14 some sort of a penalty added.
15 One of the suggestions a couple
16 of years ago was to set some sort of minimum
17 where you could -- to say that whatever you
18 collected would come out of -- would come out of
19 the appropriation that you get. I think the
20 truth is that that's the real fear of some of
21 the probation directors. Frankly, with the new
22 governor, that's not likely to happen, and
23 certainly this Senate, I think, wouldn't support
5873
1 that.
2 I think the problem is that the
3 City in particular is going to have to join the
4 rest of the state in attempting to deal with the
5 problems of criminal justice and with the
6 extreme costs.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
8 Volker, how do you vote?
9 SENATOR VOLKER: I vote in the
10 affirmative.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
12 Volker will be recorded in the affirmative.
13 Announce the results.
14 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
15 the negative on Calendar 674 are Senators Abate,
16 Connor, Markowitz, Paterson and Waldon. Ayes
17 53, nays 5. Also, Senator Smith.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
19 is passed.
20 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
21 could you call up Calendar Number 671, please?
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
23 Secretary will read Calendar Number 671.
5874
1 THE SECRETARY: On page 32,
2 Calendar Number 671, by Senator Skelos, Senate
3 Print 408, an act to amend the Correction Law
4 and the County law, in relation to maintenance
5 of prisoners in county jail facilities.
6 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
8 Skelos, an explanation has been asked for by
9 Senator Paterson.
10 SENATOR SKELOS: Senator
11 Paterson, this bill amends the Correction Law
12 and the County Law to provide that a prisoner
13 who had been found non-indigent shall be
14 required to reimburse a county or city jail
15 certain expenses incurred during his or her term
16 of imprisonment.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
18 Paterson.
19 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
20 I know sometimes you'll read cases about the
21 detention of Klaus Von Bulow or some music
22 artist that has great personal attributes and
23 probably could pay for their care during the
5875
1 time that they're incarcerated, but I think that
2 what would happen with this bill is it would
3 create such a dilemma for all the different
4 counties.
5 We haven't really issued a -- an
6 overriding resolution for how each county should
7 deal with this. I think, as Senator Abate
8 pointed out before, it would create more of a
9 problem for facilities than it would actually
10 cure, but if Senator Skelos would yield for a
11 question.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
13 Skelos, do you yield to a question?
14 SENATOR SKELOS: Yes.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
16 Senator yields, Senator Paterson.
17 SENATOR PATERSON: Senator, I'm
18 just a little concerned about the individuals
19 who are not convicted. I know that we're
20 talking about city and county jails and it would
21 cover those who are convicted maybe up to one
22 year or something like that, but let's just take
23 those individuals who are not convicted. Don't
5876
1 you think that this legislation, by passing it,
2 would kind of open the door for the fact that,
3 since we're going to charge them for their
4 health care while we have detained them, those
5 who are awaiting trial, for those who are found
6 not guilty, do you think they would then have a
7 right to come back and, in a sense, ask us for
8 whatever it was that they were denied while they
9 were being incarcerated?
10 SENATOR SKELOS: Well, it's the
11 intent of this legislation that it would apply
12 to a prisoner who's been convicted and released
13 from jail. Then the county or the city would
14 have the option of petitioning the court to get
15 reimbursement from a non-indigent prisoner for
16 the cost of incarceration.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
18 Paterson.
19 SENATOR PATERSON: So, then,
20 Senator, it does not cover those who are not
21 convicted.
22 SENATOR SKELOS: The person would
23 have had to have been sentenced to jail.
5877
1 Let me assure you, Senator
2 Paterson and Senator Abate, that with the two
3 pieces of legislation, if the -- if the Assembly
4 will get serious about the concepts that these
5 two bills represent, then we will certainly
6 enter into a discussion with suggestions that
7 Senator Abate had with her amendment and
8 certainly any concerns that you have.
9 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
10 I heard what Senator Skelos said, and I don't
11 need to see the nurse. I heard it very clearly.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
13 Secretary will read the last section.
14 THE SECRETARY: Section 7. This
15 act shall take effect immediately.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
17 roll.
18 (The Secretary called the roll.)
19 THE SECRETARY: Ayes -
20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce
21 the results when tabulated.
22 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 57, nays 1,
23 Senator Leichter recorded in the negative.
5878
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
2 is passed.
3 SENATOR GOLD: Mr. President.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
5 Gold, why do you rise?
6 SENATOR GOLD: Yeah. While I was
7 at Finance, there were some bills called, and I
8 would like unanimous consent to be recorded in
9 the negative on Calendar 234, 674 and 678.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 670...
11 what was the last one, Senator Gold?
12 SENATOR GOLD: 678.
13 Thank you very much.
14 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. President.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
16 objection, and hearing no objection, Senator
17 Gold will be recorded in the negative on
18 Calendar Number 234, 674 and 678.
19 Senator Leichter, why do you
20 rise?
21 SENATOR LEICHTER: Yes, Mr.
22 President. I was also in Finance, and I would
23 like to ask unanimous consent to be recorded in
5879
1 the negative on Calendar 234 and Calendar 678.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
3 objection. Hearing no objection, Senator
4 Leichter will be recorded in the negative on
5 Calendar Number 234 and Calendar Number 678.
6 SENATOR MARKOWITZ: Mr.
7 President.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
9 Markowitz.
10 SENATOR MARKOWITZ: Calendar
11 Number 671, please record me in the negative.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
13 objection.
14 SENATOR MARKOWITZ: Thank you.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Hearing
16 no objection, Senator Markowitz will be recorded
17 in the negative on Calendar Number 671.
18 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
20 Skelos.
21 SENATOR SKELOS: Would you please
22 call up Calendar Number 603, Senate 3343, by
23 Senator Leibell.
5880
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
2 Secretary will read the title of Calendar Number
3 603.
4 THE SECRETARY: On page 26,
5 Calendar Number 603, by Senator Leibell, Senate
6 Print 3343, an act to amend the Real Property
7 Tax Law, in relation to the exemption of certain
8 private dwellings and improvements within cities
9 having a population of less than one million
10 from local taxation.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
12 Secretary will read the last section.
13 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
14 act shall take effect immediately.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
16 roll.
17 (The Secretary called the roll.)
18 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 58.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
20 is passed.
21 Senator Leichter, why do you
22 rise?
23 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. President,
5881
1 with your indulgence, I apparently, coming back
2 into session from Finance, voted against a bill
3 because I thought it was another bill. So could
4 the record please reflect that I am in favor or
5 I should be voted in the affirmative on 671 and
6 ask unanimous consent to be in the negative on
7 Calendar 674?
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
9 objection, Senator Leichter, you will be
10 recorded in the affirmative on Calendar Number
11 671 and in the negative on Calendar Number 674.
12 The Chair recognizes Senator
13 Mendez.
14 SENATOR MENDEZ: Mr. President, I
15 was in the Finance Committee, and I would like
16 to be reported in the negative on bill Calendar
17 Number 671.
18 Thank you.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
20 objection, and hearing no objection, Senator
21 Mendez is recorded in the negative on Calendar
22 Number 671.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The Chair
5882
1 recognizes Senator Skelos.
2 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
3 if we could return to reports of standing
4 committees, I believe there's a report from the
5 Finance Committee at the desk.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: You're
7 correct, Senator Skelos, there is a report of
8 the Finance Committee at the desk. We'll return
9 to the reports of standing committees, and I'll
10 ask the Secretary to read the report of the
11 Finance Committee.
12 THE SECRETARY: Senator Stafford,
13 from the Committee on Finance, reports the
14 following nomination: E. Virgil Conway of
15 Bronxville, Chairman of the Metropolitan
16 Transportation Authority.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
18 Skelos.
19 SENATOR STAFFORD: Thank you, Mr.
20 President, Senator Skelos.
21 I'm sure some will say here,
22 after I speak very briefly today, that it seems
23 as though I'm always saying this; but when it's
5883
1 true, I think it should be said. The Governor
2 has sent up here tremendous individuals. He has
3 nominated people who really will get the job
4 done, and I will say here again today, we again
5 have as good a nominee presented to us since I
6 have been here in the Legislature, and that
7 includes 30 years.
8 If you are a cum laude graduate,
9 Phi Beta Kappa, valedictorian of your class, CEO
10 of a major corporation, involved in all the
11 community interests that Virgil Conway has been
12 involved in, it shows the type of individual you
13 are. We're all going to be better in this state
14 with him being chairman of the MTA because he is
15 going to get the job done, the job that affects
16 all the people in this state, and I certainly am
17 proud to stand here today and support his
18 confirmation for a most important position.
19 SENATOR GOODMAN: Mr. President.
20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Chair
21 recognizes Senator Levy.
22 SENATOR LEVY: Thank you very
23 much, Mr. President. It's a genuine honor and
5884
1 privilege to rise to join with Senator Stafford
2 in moving the confirmation of the nomination of
3 E. Virgil Conway to be the chair of the
4 Metropolitan Transportation Authority. Virg'
5 Conway's career is the personification of the
6 realization of the American dream.
7 As Senator LaValle pointed out at
8 the Finance Committee meeting, Virg' Conway was
9 born in Southampton. He grew up in the hamlet
10 of Montauk. He attended elementary school in
11 the community of Montauk, graduated from East
12 Hampton High School, and he went to Colgate
13 University on a scholarship; and as Senator
14 Stafford pointed out, he was Phi Beta Kappa and
15 he graduated magna cum laude. His education was
16 interrupted by the Korean War, and he served as
17 a pilot in the Air Force during the Korean War.
18 He went back to law school after
19 the war, to Yale Law School. He went there on a
20 scholarship, on the G.I. Korean bill of rights,
21 and he worked his way through Yale Law School
22 and he was the editor of the Yale law journal,
23 the Law Review.
5885
1 He began his career in public
2 service working with Governor Nelson
3 Rockefeller. He worked his way up through the
4 chairs to be Deputy Superintendent of Banks and
5 that led him into a career in the banking
6 profession and ultimately to become the chair
7 and the CEO of Seamen's Bank. During Virg'
8 Conway's long career in the private sector, he
9 has always made the time for the longest and
10 widest spectrum of public service and community
11 service, including serving during the past three
12 years as a member of the board of the MTA.
13 Virgil Conway's nomination to be
14 chair of the MTA comes at the most critical
15 time, the critical point in the history of the
16 Authority. After quantum progress forward under
17 another private sector leader, Dick Ravitch, the
18 MTA today faces a shrinking financial base,
19 cutbacks by New York City, proposed cutbacks by
20 the federal government and limitations on state
21 government funding driven by our own deficit.
22 As someone who has known Virgil Conway, I have
23 complete, implicit faith in his ability in these
5886
1 troubled times to bring order and control, to
2 bring financial stability, financial restraint,
3 and at the same time to improve the service and
4 to continue the improvement of the Authority's
5 infrastructure.
6 Virgil Conway is an extraordin
7 arily experienced and successful leader. He is
8 the right person at the right time for this
9 Authority, and the Governor is to be commended
10 for this outstanding appointment.
11 Thank you very much, Mr.
12 President.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Thank
14 you, Senator Levy.
15 Chair recognizes Senator Spano on
16 the confirmation.
17 SENATOR SPANO: Thank you very
18 much, Mr. President.
19 You might think after listening
20 to Senator Stafford and Senator Levy that there
21 might not be much to add about the Governor's
22 nominee, but that is very far from the truth.
23 When you look at the resume, the
5887
1 qualifications, the background of Virgil Conway,
2 he is someone who is very uniquely qualified to
3 be the head of one of the largest transportation
4 systems in the world; and it is my pleasure to
5 stand up and to say that I recognize that Virgil
6 and his wife, Elaine, have been very strong,
7 committed residents of Westchester County. He
8 has served at the recommendation of the County
9 Executive of Westchester as a member of the
10 MTA. He knows the workings of that agency. He
11 knows the concerns of the people who use the
12 transportation system. He knows the background
13 in terms of his own background in the financial
14 services industry. That is a long and extensive
15 background. He has been involved in many, many
16 different charitable and philanthropic
17 organizations in our region and in this state.
18 It is my pleasure, Mr. President,
19 to stand and to join with my colleagues in very
20 strongly supporting the nomination of someone I
21 have known for a long time and who will do us
22 all real proud, the nomination of Virgil
23 Conway.
5888
1 Also, I'm glad to note that his
2 wife, Elaine, is here today, as well, who in her
3 own right is a professional and is serving this
4 state well, and I'm glad to see you both here
5 today.
6 Mr. President. I second the
7 nomination.
8 SENATOR GOODMAN: Mr. President.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Chair
10 recognizes Senator Goodman.
11 SENATOR GOODMAN: Mr. President.
12 I have had the pleasure and privilege of knowing
13 Virgil Conway for perhaps 30 to 40 years, and
14 I'm just delighted to see that he has made a
15 very important personal decision which continues
16 his public service. It's very unusual to find
17 someone of this background who is willing to
18 devote his time on a pro bono basis to a
19 sensitive and highly controversial position.
20 Make no bones about it, the MTA
21 is one of the -- chairmanship is one of the
22 toughest jobs in the State of New York,
23 involving, as it must, the clashing of interests
5889
1 of people, many of whom have legitimate claims
2 on both sides of an argument. We have long seen
3 the battle, for example -- a well-intended one,
4 no doubt, but a bitter one -- that occurs when
5 those who are outside the city of New York seek
6 to obtain funds which the city of New York may
7 think should more properly be directed to it;
8 and to intermediate in such conflicts requires
9 an individual made of stern stuff.
10 I'm happy to say that the
11 inference which we can readily draw from the
12 extraordinary experience of Mr. Conway is that
13 he will have the capacity to handle these types
14 of conflicts with skilled diplomacy and
15 fairness.
16 I think it's very unusual to find
17 a resume of this richness and diversity. Virgil
18 Conway was not only a major bank president but
19 he has been involved on the boards of a number
20 of major corporations, including a large
21 railroad. He has also had an extraordinary
22 record of community service as reflected in the
23 fact that he was Deputy Bank Superintendent in
5890
1 an earlier administration in New York State.
2 To sum it up succinctly, this is
3 a man of character, of dedication to the public
4 interest, and of real ability of a type that is
5 rarely found and available to government, and I
6 think we should congratulate Governor Pataki and
7 express deep gratitude to Virgil Conway for his
8 willingness to take on this thorny and very
9 complex assignment.
10 To the extent that he will be
11 suffering the pangs and arrows, he will be
12 mollified and consoled by his extraordinarily
13 capable wife, who is in the chamber today, as
14 was noted. She herself will be playing a
15 significant role in this current administration,
16 and I dare say that at night their pillow talk
17 will involve all of the problems that beset the
18 citizens of New York. They will have ample
19 opportunity to exchange views on these matters,
20 and the result will be benefits to the state
21 that have been hitherto unimaginable except when
22 unique couples are together and are both in high
23 public service.
5891
1 In all seriousness, Mr.
2 President, let me say we are very, very lucky to
3 have Virgil Conway available for this task, and
4 we're very deeply grateful to him for being
5 willing to take it on at no pay whatsoever. I
6 would point out that the previous salary
7 attaching to this job was $150,000 a year. Mr.
8 Conway has waived that salary and, instead, has
9 very advisedly, I think, taken the view that a
10 chairman should be in place but, as well, there
11 should be an operating officer attending to the
12 daily details; and that combination is one which
13 I'm convinced will serve the public in the best
14 possible way under these services.
15 Mr. Conway, I salute you and I
16 commend most highly you to the house for prompt
17 confirmation.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Chair
19 would recognize Senator Bruno on the
20 confirmation.
21 SENATOR BRUNO: If Senator Gold
22 is standing to speak, I would defer to Senator
23 Gold at this time.
5892
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
2 Gold, the Majority Leader defers to you relative
3 to the confirmation.
4 SENATOR GOLD: I would be
5 surprised except I have always said he is a
6 gracious gentleman, so it's no surprise. Thank
7 you. You're very kind, sir.
8 I would like to make a few
9 comments. First of all, I think the resume is
10 important because, in a vacuum, if you didn't
11 know anything about the gentleman, never met him
12 and read the resume, you would have to be
13 impressed and you would say Governor Pataki is
14 looking for people who ought to be in government
15 and he has made a major catch.
16 So I do congratulate Governor
17 Pataki. I think this is a wonderful appoint
18 ment, and he makes the entire state look good
19 with this appointment.
20 There were a couple of rumors
21 around that we have to dispel. One of them,
22 which we did dispel, is that he has not been
23 able to overcome his early involvement with
5893
1 Martin Oppenheimer on the Yale Law Review. He
2 has certainly done that and is doing great.
3 The other rumor which is of a
4 more serious nature, and I'm glad that we
5 discussed it at the Finance Committee, dealt
6 with an issue of a cut in services in the city
7 of New York and the subway system closing
8 stations early, and the nominee, I guess, went
9 out of his way to make sure that was corrected
10 in the press, which was very important to the
11 people in the city of New York, that he didn't
12 let that lay out there as a rumor; and this
13 morning at the Finance Committee meeting, he
14 confirmed the fact that he believes New York
15 City is a 24-hour city. He understands that our
16 subway and transit system is like the bloodline
17 of a human being and is very, very necessary for
18 the survival of the city.
19 I also appreciated his remarks
20 concerning a sensitivity to the funding inequit
21 ies, the state funding inequities as it applies
22 to the transit system. I understand with my
23 eyes wide open that we are confirming today a
5894
1 nominee of a Republican governor and that the
2 budget in this state will have the imprimatur of
3 a Republican governor, but still I think it's
4 important for the people of the city of New York
5 to know that the person who will chair the MTA
6 has at least some sensitivity to that inequity;
7 and maybe with the good help of people in the
8 other house, we can do something about it.
9 The last issue -- and I know that
10 to some extent it's a problem that transcends
11 the nominee -- is, it is disappointing that we
12 do confirm people with resumes not quite of the
13 quality of Mr. Conway but of good people and
14 then when the MTA holds its hearings we find out
15 that the attendance record is under 25 percent.
16 I would urge everybody who is a member of that
17 board -- we are confirming today someone of fine
18 credentials, someone who has a willingness to
19 work, and someone who wants to make a
20 difference. I hope the other members of the
21 board will use his energies as an example and
22 participate. Why? So that the intellect that
23 helped to build their resumes becomes useful to
5895
1 the people of this state. The resume does no
2 good if we are withheld from the talents of
3 those people. So I hope that, under the
4 leadership of a chairman who I think is going to
5 be terrific, I hope that his energy in some way
6 passes its way through so we get the full
7 advantages of the board.
8 Mr. President, it's a delight to
9 support this nomination. I know it's one that
10 we're all going to be very, very proud of.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
12 Bruno.
13 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President, I
14 also want to add my congratulations to our
15 Governor for this very, very outstanding choice.
16 My congratulations to Virg' and to his wife,
17 Elaine, who has been a partner of his for an
18 awful lot of years.
19 I first met Virg' when I was on
20 staff, as you may recall, to Speaker Perry
21 Duryea, and my recollection -- and that was some
22 20-odd years ago -- was that whenever anything
23 was needed on behalf of the people of this
5896
1 state, the Speaker could reach out, we could
2 reach out, and Virg' Conway was there; and it
3 didn't make any difference whether it was New
4 York City, upstate, the Island, if there was a
5 need, he was trying to be helpful, most of the
6 time -- in fact, all the time that I'm aware of,
7 in a nonpaid voluntary way. Why? Because he is
8 committed to improving the quality of life for
9 people in New York.
10 I appreciate that, and I know the
11 people in this chamber appreciate that by your
12 comments. So I commend him for accepting this
13 great challenge that will be before him, and
14 again I commend the Governor on this outstanding
15 choice. We have a true public servant who is
16 willing to take on the task that is beyond the
17 comprehension of most people, but I'm totally
18 confident, Mr. President, my colleagues, that he
19 is up to the task, so I'm very pleased to stand
20 in his support in this chamber.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
22 Farley on the confirmation.
23 SENATOR FARLEY: Thank you, Mr.
5897
1 President.
2 I guess if the Pataki
3 administration has accomplished anything, it is
4 the superb appointments that it has made, and
5 none is more outstanding than Virgil Conway.
6 For the 20 years that I have been
7 on the Banking Committee and as chairman, I am
8 very familiar with his work. Incidentally, he
9 chaired the transition team on banks and has
10 always been of service to this state. He's led
11 the thrift industry through some very, very
12 difficult times several years ago.
13 Virgil Conway is an outstanding
14 citizen. I guess all I can say, Virgil, is
15 thank you. Thank you for being willing to serve
16 your state. As a citizen and as a Senator, I'm
17 very, very grateful for your contribution. You
18 are an outstanding person who has given of
19 yourself, and I know that everybody in this
20 chamber appreciates what you are trying to do in
21 one of the more difficult jobs that exists in
22 this state.
23 We wish you well, and I thank you
5898
1 for serving.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
3 Marchi on the confirmation.
4 SENATOR MARCHI: Mr. President, I
5 can only echo the sentiments that have been
6 expressed here and the highlights that have been
7 identified so well and unerringly with respect
8 to Virgil Conway.
9 In the late '60s, I remember our
10 committees, our committee structures here in the
11 Legislature. We had Roads, we had Railroads, we
12 had various components of transportation; and in
13 that period, we began to evolve a general
14 picture of the movement of people, the movement
15 of people creatively, and to compensate and to
16 complement the various elements that make up
17 transportation, the lifeline of any regional
18 area. Certainly this regional area, the premier
19 area in the world culturally, economically,
20 financially, it embraces so many different
21 disciplines; and to have a man of this
22 excellence at its service, a man who has held
23 responsible positions and has addressed them
5899
1 honestly and with integrity and with a clear
2 vision of what his mission was and now embracing
3 an even larger gamut of concerns because,
4 without it, basic economic reason, basic
5 economic and transportational needs, cultural
6 needs, all of these factors cannot be harmonized
7 in a way that lifts the spirits and give us a
8 hint of the better life that is available to
9 us.
10 Virgil Conway's assumption of
11 this responsibility attests to his ability and
12 is prologue, certainly, to a promise that holds
13 great expectation. Sensitive, unprepossessioned
14 -- there is no prepossession about him -- he is
15 an honest individual, knowing his own
16 limitations, but his capacity is so far expanded
17 that all of us look to the future with great
18 expectations.
19 God bless, Virgil. Thirty years,
20 and all of them you have been a most edifying
21 and wonderful example.
22 And, incidentally, you are
23 serving pro bono. You are being confirmed by a
5900
1 Senate that is also for the nonce serving pro
2 bono.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
4 Oppenheimer, on the confirmation.
5 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: Thank you,
6 Mr. President. That would have been very funny,
7 Senator Marchi, if it were not so painful.
8 Much has been said about Virgil
9 Conway, and it's wonderful to have a candidate
10 of this caliber before us. What wasn't
11 mentioned was the near perfect attendance that
12 Virgil Conway has had at all board and hearing
13 meetings of the MTA, and the value of his
14 financial background, having been the president
15 of Seamen's and having been involved in finance
16 and banking for so many years, is really going
17 to be a great strength and addition to the MTA,
18 and something that is desperately needed.
19 We have made great, great
20 progress in the commuter railroads and the
21 subway system with the enormous infusion of
22 capital funds that has been put into both
23 entities, and we know that they will now be
5901
1 maintained and continued to be upgraded because
2 of Virgil Conway's commitment.
3 I think I will end now because
4 most everything has been said. I want to
5 congratulate Virg'; and my husband, who
6 graduated with him from Yale Law School, also
7 congratulates him.
8 We wish you the very best, and we
9 will be there to support you at every turn.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Chair
11 recognizes Senator Stavisky, our last speaker,
12 on the confirmation.
13 SENATOR STAVISKY: Mr.
14 President. Virgil Conway has been accessible
15 and candid in his response to questions. I
16 spent, for me, a very productive period
17 exchanging views with the designee on the
18 enormous responsibilities of chairing a
19 transportation system that covers the entire
20 metropolitan region and doing it fairly so that
21 it will not be a chairman whose sole mission is
22 the commuter railroads or the New York City
23 subway system or the buses or the roads but
5902
1 rather someone who has the ability to understand
2 the importance of each of these modes of
3 transportation to the economy and stability and
4 growth of New York State.
5 There were controversies with the
6 last MTA chairman, and I rose in this chamber to
7 express my concern about some very unwise
8 actions taken by Mr. Conway's predecessor.
9 Nevertheless, the previous chairman turned out
10 to be a constructive head of the MTA, and I'm
11 delighted that Mr. Conway does not have that
12 baggage, but I'm absolutely convinced that he
13 will be equally constructive and maybe even more
14 so because he understands that he holds in his
15 hands the level of support for all the systems.
16 Within the large city or within the suburb area
17 surrounding a large city, he has to be fair.
18 He has to be fair in
19 understanding that there are portions of the
20 state aid system and there are portions of the
21 apportionment of funds, especially the surplus
22 of the Triborough Bridge and Tunnel Authority,
23 that does not always reflect where the money
5903
1 comes from; and sometimes the MTA, even more so
2 than those of us here in the chamber, may be
3 able to make adjustments if we would not lock in
4 an inflexible and perhaps unfair formula into
5 state statute.
6 I'm concerned about what will
7 happen with transportation for school children
8 if the city of New York and the Mayor's office
9 do not provide the funds that are needed. I'm
10 concerned about the possibility and the
11 opportunity for passes between subway and bus
12 transportation for those riders who are subject
13 to two-fare zones.
14 I'm concerned, finally, with the
15 future of the MTA's capital improvement program.
16 The long-range capital plan must move ahead, and
17 it must be resubmitted for action over the next
18 five-year period.
19 All of these are enormous
20 responsibilities that you will bear.
21 I'm convinced that he will carry
22 these responsibilities with fairness and equity
23 and with good sense, and I support his
5904
1 nomination.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
3 question is on the nomination of E. Virgil
4 Conway of Bronxville to become the chairman of
5 the Metropolitan Transportation Authority. All
6 those in favor of the confirmation signify by
7 saying aye.
8 (Response of "Aye.")
9 Opposed, nay.
10 (There was no response.)
11 The nominee is confirmed
12 unanimously.
13 Virgil, and your wife, Elaine, we
14 really appreciate your joining us today. We
15 wish you Godspeed, good luck, and we know that
16 you will do a very successful job at what you
17 are elected or what you are nominated here
18 today, confirmed to do.
19 Thank you for joining us. Good
20 luck.
21 (Applause.)
22 Senator Spano.
23 SENATOR SPANO: Can you please
5905
1 have the Secretary call Calendar 562.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
3 will read the title of Calendar 562.
4 THE SECRETARY: On page 23,
5 Calendar Number 562, by Senator Larkin, Senate
6 Print 3652, an act to amend the General
7 Municipal Law, in relation to the operation of
8 games of chance by authorized games of chance
9 lessors.
10 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
12 Larkin, an explanation on Calendar Number 562
13 has been asked for by Senator Paterson.
14 SENATOR LARKIN: Mr. President,
15 This bill would provide for nonprofit corpor
16 ations to host games of chance or Las Vegas
17 Nights at locations not owned by the
18 not-for-profit organization. This authorizes
19 games of chance to be conducted which are not
20 owned. For example, a fire company convention,
21 games of chance could be held at the hosting.
22 All profits are to go to the not-for-profit
23 organization.
5906
1 SENATOR GOLD: Mr. President.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
3 Gold, Senator Padavan had risen.
4 Senator Padavan.
5 SENATOR PADAVAN: Thank you, Mr.
6 President. First, Senator Larkin and I did have
7 the opportunity of discussing this bill before,
8 and I related to him some of my concerns which I
9 would like to share with the members. I can
10 understand the motivation that the sponsor has
11 with respect to fire rescue companies seeking to
12 raise money for their services that they provide
13 in localities, particularly in rural areas
14 around the state, and if this bill were
15 restricted to such entities, my concerns would
16 not be what they are. However, the bill goes
17 far beyond that in terms of its impact.
18 The notion that churches,
19 temples, fraternal organizations, who now have
20 authorization to operate Las Vegas nights on
21 their premises a certain number of times a year
22 and under certain restrictions can now export
23 that activity to any commercial establishment,
5907
1 the main ballroom of a large hotel in New York
2 City or any other place that is able to
3 accommodate it, that enlarges the potential
4 which is not hypothetical or academic of the
5 kinds of problems such activities have already
6 experienced in urban centers such as the city of
7 New York; and so what we do is expand the venue
8 of the problems related to criminal elements,
9 problems of teenage gambling, problems of
10 illegal gambling that have already been
11 something we live with on a regular basis.
12 You may have read an article in
13 the New York Times a week ago about a house of
14 worship that ran Las Vegas nights which is now
15 taken over, infiltrated by others, operating
16 totally outside the law, illegally,
17 clandestinely, and that's just one article about
18 one circumstance which is a problem. But with
19 this legislation, that kind of problem has a
20 potential to go just beyond the point we want to
21 see it go to.
22 So I would urge the sponsor to
23 attempt to focus his legislation in response to
5908
1 his constituency groups that have problems that
2 could be addressed without causing the kinds of
3 things that we're faced with and will be faced
4 with in an enormous way should this bill become
5 law.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Chair
7 recognizes Senator Gold.
8 SENATOR GOLD: Thank you.
9 Will the sponsor yield to a
10 question?
11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
12 Larkin, do you yield to Senator Gold?
13 SENATOR LARKIN: Yes, Mr.
14 President.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
16 yields.
17 SENATOR GOLD: Senator, I'm -
18 I'm trying to figure out. I see the amendments
19 -- the amendments basically take out some words
20 here and there. I'm trying to find the exact
21 portion which deals with having it done off the
22 premises.
23 SENATOR PADAVAN: Paragraph 13.
5909
1 SENATOR GOLD: 13?
2 SENATOR LARKIN: It just allows
3 them to hold it, Senator Gold, off the premises;
4 but the conduct of the game is by the person who
5 holds the license and they must operate the
6 game.
7 SENATOR GOLD: Senator, I
8 understand exactly. In other words, your memo
9 is very, very clear. I don't have a problem
10 with the memo. I'm trying to relate the memo
11 into the language of the bill; and while Senator
12 Padavan is very knowledgeable in this area, and
13 I appreciate it, I'm just trying to check it
14 myself.
15 Where is the specific language
16 that talks about holding this at a different
17 premises?
18 SENATOR LARKIN: I think if you
19 read on Section 13, Senator, I think that
20 encompasses it all right there.
21 SENATOR GOLD: All right. All
22 that you do in paragraph 13 is take out a
23 sentence. Am I correct?
5910
1 SENATOR LARKIN: Right. So we
2 left all of the other in there.
3 SENATOR GOLD: All right.
4 Senator, will you yield to a question?
5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
6 continues to yield.
7 SENATOR GOLD: As Senator Padavan
8 pointed out, under the existing law, there are
9 problems; and there are places which in order to
10 make money for the charity have opened their
11 doors and there are people doing illegal things,
12 and your bill certainly does not condone illegal
13 conduct, and I'm sure you don't condone illegal
14 conduct; but, Senator, isn't it easier for the
15 illegal conduct to happen if we now not only
16 have the games at the particular premises -- in
17 other words, if you are dealing with a church or
18 synagogue or whatever, you know, you've got to
19 talk about having organized crime, or whatever
20 it is, coming into these places, and somebody
21 can get a little itchy.
22 Now, if you're talking about them
23 running the game and it's not even in the church
5911
1 or synagogue, it might be uncomfortable but not
2 quite as uncomfortable. Don't you think we're
3 making it a little easier for those groups that
4 might want to get into that to -- you know, make
5 it a little less inconvenient for them?
6 SENATOR LARKIN: Talking to
7 people who've asked me to consider this,
8 Senator, it was a clear indication that some of
9 our upstaters small volunteer ambulance, fire
10 companies, and that, that are nonprofits feel
11 that they needed some place because the
12 equipment that they are buying today and trying
13 to remove the burden on the taxpayers, because
14 all of the money that's raised at this event
15 goes to the person that holds the license, and
16 these licenses still have to be issued by the
17 Racing and Wagering Board.
18 We don't see that as a problem.
19 I mean I visit a lot of them in my district, and
20 the main complaint is adequate space. We need a
21 bigger place to hold it and, as I said before,
22 the cost of all of the equipment and everything
23 else and trying to hold it down.
5912
1 They don't seem to -- I did pose
2 the question that you have because when we
3 talked about this last year I refused to put it
4 in last year because I thought we needed to look
5 at it. I looked in my own district and
6 surrounding districts and talking to these
7 various not-for-profits, and they feel it's
8 their responsibility as the holder of the
9 license and there are inspectors that go around
10 to these facilities and would continue to go on
11 even if its held in a different location.
12 SENATOR GOLD: Will the Senator
13 yield to a question?
14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
15 Larkin, do you yield to Senator Gold?
16 SENATOR LARKIN: Yes, sir. Yes,
17 Mr. President.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
19 yields.
20 SENATOR GOLD: Senator, just so I
21 understand it. Let's say that the volunteer
22 fire department and this group and that group
23 got permission to do it and there was one place
5913
1 in town, a movie theater, an abandoned movie
2 theater, and somebody takes over the theater or
3 the area, catering hall, under the existing law
4 or the law as you amend it, could an individual
5 take it over and actually set it up as a Las
6 Vegas Night type of operation and then be
7 available if the volunteer fire department wants
8 to come in and use that and then maybe the next
9 week have it available for a church and the next
10 week have it available for a synagogue?
11 SENATOR LARKIN: There is a
12 restriction now on how often they can hold one
13 of these events.
14 SENATOR GOLD: No, I understand
15 that, but the restriction is on the church,
16 synagogue or volunteer fire department; is that
17 correct?
18 SENATOR LARKIN: Yes.
19 SENATOR GOLD: What I'm trying to
20 find out is, under your bill, can somebody set
21 up a place and then the church might come in
22 there on a Monday, and then the following Monday
23 it might be a volunteer fire department and the
5914
1 following Monday it might be a synagogue, and
2 the following Monday it might be a different
3 group, each group living within the law of their
4 own license and not doing it more times a year
5 than they are allowed but, in essence, having a
6 gambling hall that's open almost continuously?
7 Why under your bill would that not be a
8 possibility?
9 SENATOR LARKIN: Because of the
10 way the license is issued. The license would be
11 issued for using it at that specific location
12 for that specific group.
13 SENATOR GOLD: No-no, no-no.
14 But, Senator -- no, no, no, Senator. Senator,
15 let's go back a step. The way the law is now,
16 as I understand it -- and I'm certainly willing
17 to be educated if I'm saying something wrong.
18 Senator, if I'm saying something wrong, you tell
19 me. But as I understand the law today, if they
20 want to hold a Las Vegas Night at a church,
21 synagogue, or whatever, they can do it at their
22 premises. They can set it up, do it at their
23 premises and the license limits them the number
5915
1 of times a year they can do it. Is that
2 correct?
3 SENATOR LARKIN: Yes.
4 SENATOR GOLD: All right. If
5 your bill becomes a law, my understanding is
6 that they don't have to do it at their church or
7 synagogue but they can do it at XYZ Hall which
8 is a different location. Is that correct?
9 SENATOR LARKIN: Yes.
10 SENATOR GOLD: Now, they contact
11 XYZ Hall -
12 SENATOR LARKIN: Mr. President.
13 Senator Gold. But one part here is that they
14 still have to have the approval of the local
15 governing body to hold that.
16 SENATOR GOLD: Well, Senator, let
17 me ask you a question. When you say the
18 approval of the local governing body, is the
19 approval of the local governing body required
20 for each time they run the event?
21 SENATOR LARKIN: Yes, and also
22 for the establishment of the hall.
23 SENATOR GOLD: Where is that in
5916
1 your bill?
2 SENATOR LARKIN: That's in the
3 existing law, Senator, that the local governing
4 body has to give approval.
5 SENATOR GOLD: So, Senator, let
6 me ask you this question. In one of your little
7 towns, villages or whatever, the local volunteer
8 fire department goes to the local board and says
9 we want to hold this and we can't do it at the
10 fire station and there is Bailey's Hall, or
11 whatever it's called, and we want permission -
12 Bailey's Hall asks the local board for
13 permission to run games for the volunteer fire
14 department.
15 SENATOR LARKIN: But you've
16 reversed it.
17 SENATOR GOLD: What?
18 SENATOR LARKIN: The fire
19 department asks the local government, "We want
20 to have games of chance, and we want to have it
21 at XYZ facility." Local government can say no.
22 SENATOR GOLD: I understand what
23 you are saying, but what I'm getting at is there
5917
1 are different issues here. There are zoning
2 issues. There are different issues, and you are
3 the one who pointed it out a moment ago, and
4 what I am asking you is, there is this hall.
5 We'll call it the XYZ Hall, and the volunteer
6 fire department wants to hold them and it says,
7 "We want to hold it at that hall." One
8 question, I assume, Senator, is the zoning
9 question, isn't that so?
10 SENATOR LARKIN: Yes.
11 SENATOR GOLD: All right. So
12 they go to the zoning board, and the zoning
13 board says, "All right. We will allow games of
14 chance at that hall." Now, they have approved
15 that and the zoning issue is finished, isn't
16 it?
17 SENATOR LARKIN: It's still up to
18 the Board to give approval. Right now -- I
19 don't know how it works in your area, but when
20 our fire companies go to it, you will notice
21 it's on a town board meeting that they are going
22 to give approval for a Las Vegas Night at a
23 volunteer company on such and such a day.
5918
1 SENATOR GOLD: In other words,
2 the question I'm asking you is under existing
3 law, do they have to get the local approval
4 under existing law each time they run the
5 function?
6 SENATOR LARKIN: No.
7 SENATOR GOLD: Then, Senator,
8 what you said two seconds ago is not accurate.
9 SENATOR LARKIN: Utilization of
10 the facility, Senator.
11 SENATOR GOLD: Well, Senator -
12 Senator Larkin, I appreciate your courtesy.
13 On the bill.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
15 Gold on the bill.
16 SENATOR GOLD: First of all, I
17 know that everything we say in this chamber is
18 weighed very, very carefully, but I'm personally
19 delighted that if I make a remark that I know
20 it's going to be scrutinized extra special today
21 because Senator Libous is back and listening
22 very carefully, so -- I can only speak for
23 myself, but I'm delighted to see it.
5919
1 Mr. President, on the bill. I
2 hear Senator Larkin, and I think that if it were
3 up to Senator Larkin everybody would be honest
4 and everybody would be patriotic, and I happen
5 to admire Senator Larkin. But, unfortunately,
6 it's just not the way things work, and with all
7 due respect, I'm not so confident about every
8 answer I got from Senator Larkin on this bill.
9 If you have a local small place
10 and the local fire department, which everybody
11 belongs to -- I think Senator Connor is famous
12 for that remark: You don't know what you're
13 talking about. You're one of those guys that
14 thinks volunteer fire departments are for
15 putting out fires, and everybody knows that
16 these are great social clubs; and they do a
17 wonderful job. I'm not trying to put any one of
18 them down. But everyone in town supports and
19 wants to do everything for the local volunteer
20 fire department, and I can't believe in my
21 wildest imagination that if the local volunteer
22 fire department wanted to hold Las Vegas Nights
23 they wouldn't get approval to do it in XYZ
5920
1 Hall.
2 I know people in upstate New York
3 and around the place. These are good,
4 religious, God-fearing people; and if the church
5 decides it might be easier because, "Look, they
6 are going to XYZ Hall and if the hall gets set
7 up, you know, we'll have our night" and the next
8 thing I know, as far as I know, people get to
9 know that you are at XYZ Hall every Monday or
10 Thursday night, whatever it is, because it's
11 either the church, the synagogue, the volunteer
12 fire department, whatever, and that's where the
13 charities are going to make their money, and
14 when you give the approval to the volunteer fire
15 department, I don't know how you tell the church
16 they can't do it, and I don't know how you tell
17 the Girl Scouts, "You can't do it," and, in my
18 opinion, I think it causes an awful lot of
19 problems.
20 Why? Not because of the
21 organizations; because when you start to talk
22 gambling, no matter what happens, you're talking
23 big money, and there are people who you and I
5921
1 would not like to go to dinner with who somehow
2 or other wind up getting involved in these
3 functions, and I have seen it.
4 I think that Senator Padavan and
5 I may or may not but I think we do have some
6 common feelings about the directions that we may
7 be going when it comes to trying to run this
8 state and run religious organizations, or what
9 ever on the backs of gambling, and everybody
10 shrugs their shoulders and says, "What can we
11 do. It's the only way we raise money." I'm
12 really at my limit for that.
13 I think it's dangerous. I think
14 Senator Larkin's motives are honorable, totally
15 honorable, but I think it's a mistake.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
17 will read the last section.
18 SENATOR PADAVAN: Mr. President.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
20 Padavan.
21 SENATOR PADAVAN: Mr. President.
22 My comments are directed to Senator Larkin.
23 Senator, as you look around this
5922
1 chamber, you see that for a variety of reasons a
2 good number of our members are not here, and I
3 really think this is an important piece of
4 legislation, and I don't think anyone wants to
5 call a quorum call or slow roll call because I
6 don't want to, and I don't intend to, but I
7 would ask you, as a matter of courtesy, that you
8 might want to lay this bill aside so that more
9 members can be here and have an opportunity to
10 be heard and cast an intelligent vote on this
11 issue.
12 SENATOR LIBOUS: May we have the
13 last section read, please.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
15 last section.
16 THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This
17 bill shall take effect immediately.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce
19 the results when tabulated.
20 Chair recognizes Senator Leichter
21 to explain his vote.
22 SENATOR LEICHTER: Thank you, Mr.
23 President. I think Senators Padavan and Gold
5923
1 made some very valid points. What we're doing
2 here is more and more eroding the prohibition
3 against gambling. Now, if we want to have
4 gambling in this state, maybe we ought to put it
5 to the voters. But this really opens the door
6 so wide to conducting gambling in so many
7 facilities throughout the state, I think as
8 Senator Gold pointed out, there is really no
9 limitation or restrictions on a particular place
10 having more than one, having in fact a number of
11 these licensees use that facility. It's just
12 like having a full-time casino in a community.
13 It just seems to me it's wrong. I don't want to
14 see us go towards legalized gambling; but maybe
15 if that's what the people of the state want, we
16 ought to do it, but we certainly shouldn't do it
17 in this fashion, chipping away, eroding away the
18 prohibition against gambling.
19 I vote in the negative.
20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
21 Leichter will be recorded in the negative.
22 Senator Gold to explain his vote.
23 SENATOR GOLD: Mr. President.
5924
1 Senator Larkin, I really was not
2 going to ask for a slow roll call; but when I
3 see the hands go up around the chamber on both
4 sides, I really think it's unfair, as Senator
5 Padavan pointed out very well. I wouldn't want
6 people tomorrow to find out that they cast a
7 vote which they're uncomfortable with, and I
8 really think Senator Larkin that, if people want
9 to support this, I respect it, and there are
10 some people on my side who are supporting it and
11 some on yours, and some on both sides opposed to
12 it.
13 So I really think, Mr. President,
14 that we ought to have a slow roll call, or at
15 least put it over as Senator Padavan suggested,
16 but if that can't be, I would ask for a slow
17 roll call on this.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
19 Gold is asking for a slow roll call. Are there
20 five members in the chamber, who -- would they
21 rise? There are five standing.
22 The Secretary will call the roll
23 slowly.
5925
1 SENATOR LIBOUS: Mr. President.
2 Do you want to lay that bill aside, please.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
4 Larkin, your desire to lay the bill aside?
5 SENATOR LARKIN: Lay the bill
6 aside until tomorrow.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Okay.
8 The bill is laid aside at the request of the
9 sponsor.
10 Senator Libous.
11 SENATOR LIBOUS: Mr. President.
12 Would you please recognize Senator Larkin again
13 for a committee announcement.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
15 Larkin.
16 SENATOR LARKIN: Mr. President.
17 There will be an immediate meeting of the Local
18 Government Committee in Room 332.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There
20 will be an immediate meeting of the Local
21 Government Committee in the Majority Conference
22 Room, Room 332, immediate meeting of the Local
23 Government Committee.
5926
1 Senator Libous.
2 SENATOR LIBOUS: Mr. President.
3 Would you recognize Senator Montgomery, please.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
5 Montgomery.
6 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes. Mr.
7 President, I would like unanimous consent to be
8 recorded in the negative on Calendars 671 and
9 674.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
11 objection and hearing no objection, Senator
12 Montgomery will be recorded in the negative on
13 Calendar Number 671 and 674.
14 Senator DiCarlo.
15 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President.
16 I would like to put a sponsor's star on my bill,
17 Calendar 732, Senate 3362, please.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: At the
19 request of the sponsor, a sponsor's star will be
20 placed on Calendar Number 732.
21 Senator Libous.
22 SENATOR LIBOUS: We can go back
23 to regular order, Mr. President.
5927
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
2 will continue to call the controversial
3 calendar.
4 THE SECRETARY: On page 19,
5 Calendar 453, by Senator Levy, Senate Print 359,
6 an act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in
7 relation to criminal history checks on school
8 bus attendants.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
10 Levy, an explanation had been asked for by the
11 Acting Minority Leader, Senator Paterson.
12 SENATOR LEVY: Yes. Senator
13 Paterson, unfortunately we have discussed this
14 bill annually almost since 1985 when we enacted
15 a law to require -- what we did was to pass a
16 bill which became law to require the finger
17 printing of school bus drivers. Omitted from
18 that law were school bus attendants; and,
19 unfortunately, due to that omission, children in
20 this state have paid the price, because using
21 Long Island as an example, we've had a number of
22 incidents on Long Island when felons who were on
23 parole wound up being school bus attendants, and
5928
1 we've had children sexually molested on school
2 buses, including children with disabilities and
3 handicaps.
4 If the fingerprinting of school
5 bus attendants was not omitted in 1985 from that
6 important law that had the end result of
7 disqualifying people from operating school
8 buses, I dare say that those incidents would not
9 have taken place because those people would not
10 have been working as school bus attendants.
11 This bill cures the omission from the law in
12 1985.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
14 Paterson.
15 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
16 Senator Levy raises an issue that has evidenced
17 itself in conduct by employees of the school
18 system that have manifested great harm to young
19 people who attend our school systems, and many
20 of the cases on Long Island I read about,
21 Senator Levy.
22 My question for you is why are
23 you asking the school attendants to pay for
5929
1 their own fingerprinting prior to their
2 employment? Don't you think that attaches a
3 stigma to the acts perhaps of others and makes
4 the entire class feel the burden of what a few
5 may have done?
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The Chair
7 recognizes Senator Levy to respond to a question
8 from Senator Paterson.
9 SENATOR LEVY: Senator, we would
10 be doing with school bus attendants exactly what
11 we are doing with school bus drivers.
12 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
13 what I'm interested in is that there have been a
14 number of crimes committed by a number of
15 personnel employed by the school system. Would
16 Senator Levy believe -- if he would yield for a
17 question -
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
19 Levy, do you yield to Senator Paterson?
20 SENATOR PATERSON: -- that it
21 might just be a better idea to establish a
22 standard for all employees of the school
23 system?
5930
1 SENATOR LEVY: Senator, with this
2 bill, we only have the power to deal with those
3 people who come within the purview of the
4 Vehicle and Traffic Law, and I'm trying to deal
5 with the specific omission from the 1985 law.
6 If somebody else obviously chooses to have a
7 wider application of the concept that is in the
8 law today with school bus drivers, fine. It's
9 up to them to initiate that legislation. This
10 bill is under the V&T, and it only deals
11 traditionally with school bus attendants.
12 SENATOR PATERSON: Under the 1985
13 law, then, Senator Levy, you are restricting
14 this to comply with the transportation of the
15 children back and forth from school?
16 SENATOR LEVY: Yes, it is,
17 Senator Paterson.
18 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you,
19 Senator Levy.
20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
21 will read the last section.
22 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
23 act shall take effect on the 90th day.
5931
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
2 roll.
3 (The Secretary called the roll.)
4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce
5 the results when tabulated.
6 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
7 the negative on Calendar 453 are Senators
8 Connor, Gold, Leichter, Markowitz, Montgomery,
9 Nanula and Santiago. Ayes 52. Nays 7.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
11 is passed.
12 THE SECRETARY: On page 30,
13 Calendar Number 652, by Senator Saland, Senate
14 Print 2336, an act to amend the Executive law
15 and the Education Law, in relation to providing
16 security information to prospective students.
17 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER:
18 Explanation.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
20 Saland, an explanation has been asked for by
21 Senator Oppenheimer.
22 SENATOR SALAND: Thank you, Mr.
23 President.
5932
1 Mr. President, this bill is the
2 Security Information Act for institutions of
3 higher education. It's a bill which has been
4 passed, I believe, on at least two prior
5 occasions in this house. It deals with
6 providing information to college students, their
7 parents, those who have an interest in security
8 on college campuses, such as employees of
9 college campuses. It endeavors to fill some of
10 the gaps that were left open when the federal
11 government got into this particular venue a
12 couple of years ago.
13 This bill is modeled in part on
14 legislation that was introduced originally in
15 Pennsylvania in response to an awful tragedy on
16 a campus down there, which sort of became the
17 model by which other states throughout the union
18 have endeavored to provide more information.
19 Unfortunately, when someone
20 visits a college campus perhaps in a summer or
21 spring trip or receives the materials that are
22 sent out by a college campus, they see this
23 rather idyllic setting, looks sort of like an
5933
1 oasis of tranquility; and far too often,
2 unfortunately, our campuses are the scenes of
3 crimes that reflect the communities, perhaps, in
4 which they are located or the reduction in
5 awareness of the potential for crime on college
6 campuses.
7 This bill would basically require
8 reporting, reporting of some crimes that are not
9 provided for in the federal legislation and
10 would also provide some specific reporting with
11 respect to certain security practices to, again,
12 provide a level of comfort for those who might
13 be interested in attending and working at this
14 campus that this, in fact, is a safe place.
15 The reality is, as I mentioned
16 earlier, that the last thing in the world that
17 campuses are about to do is to advise people of
18 whatever mis... criminal misfortunes may have
19 occurred on their campus. This is an attempt to
20 provide, in effect, disclosure or notification
21 to anybody having an interest.
22 It basically says, when you are
23 considering whatever campus you may be going to,
5934
1 if campus X and campus Y perhaps are similar
2 academically and if one of the two seems to have
3 a disproportionately high rate of crime, that's
4 something that you should know and should be
5 factored into your decision-making processes.
6 Thank you, Mr. President.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
8 Oppenheimer.
9 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: Would
10 Senator Saland yield for a question?
11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
12 Saland, do you yield?
13 SENATOR SALAND: Yes, Mr.
14 President.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
16 yields.
17 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: This looks
18 similar to a bill I had in which would require
19 providing the information on security
20 personnel. I think that this does not have a
21 piece that -- let me question.
22 Is this information to be
23 provided to anyone that makes application to the
5935
1 college for admission or to anybody who is
2 employed by the college? Will they be sent this
3 information or must they request this
4 information?
5 SENATOR SALAND: They will be
6 advised that the information is available upon
7 request, which, again, is the same tack that's
8 taken, I believe, in the federal legislation.
9 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: Uh-huh.
10 Thank you, Senator. It would be my strong
11 preference to see that this information -- since
12 it's already been complied with, that it be
13 generated to everybody who is making
14 application. Since we have already done the
15 work, they should know the statistical
16 information; but I certainly will support this.
17 I just wish it did not have to be requested,
18 that it would simply be available.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
20 will read the last section.
21 Senator LaValle to explain his
22 vote?
23 SENATOR LAVALLE: Yes. Yes, Mr.
5936
1 President.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: To
3 explain your vote or -
4 SENATOR LAVALLE: I rise really
5 to comp...
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
7 LaValle, to explain your vote -
8 SENATOR LAVALLE: Yes.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: -- or on
10 the bill?
11 SENATOR LAVALLE: I was going to
12 go on the bill, but I could just as well -
13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Your
14 choice. We're on the bill.
15 SENATOR LAVALLE: I'll explain my
16 vote.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
18 will read the last section.
19 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This
20 act shall take effect on the first day of
21 September.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
23 roll.
5937
1 (The Secretary called the roll.)
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
3 LaValle to explain his vote.
4 SENATOR LAVALLE: Thank you, Mr.
5 President. I rise really to compliment Senator
6 Saland, who has put in a lot of work, has held a
7 number of information meetings, has reached out
8 to all parties, with the Assembly, to really
9 bring this bill to a conclusion and a completion
10 which it should be.
11 The members of the committee have
12 worked on this bill in the Higher Education
13 Committee, and I think it's a bill that parents
14 and students really support. The higher
15 education community, I think, has warmed up to
16 the idea that this kind of information and
17 disclosure is not only in the best interest of
18 the students who are on their campus but also
19 for the institutions that they run; and I hope
20 that this year the Assembly will embrace the
21 Saland legislation and that we'll see this
22 become a chapter. I know that Senator Saland
23 has been at it for a couple of years, and we
5938
1 hope this is the year it will become the law.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
3 LaValle in the affirmative.
4 Senator Montgomery to explain her
5 vote.
6 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes, Mr.
7 President. I would like to explain my vote.
8 I also want to compliment Senator
9 Saland on this bill, and I know how much you
10 worked on it, but I also know that since this is
11 really not a Republican idea or a Democratic
12 idea -- this is a good idea -- and I know that
13 Senator Oppenheimer worked very hard in this
14 area, held some hearings throughout the state a
15 few years back; and, therefore, I would say that
16 this is really an Oppenheimer-Saland bill.
17 So I vote yes.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
19 Montgomery in the affirmative.
20 Announce the results.
21 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 59.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
23 is passed.
5939
1 Senator Libous.
2 SENATOR LIBOUS: Mr. President.
3 Is there any housekeeping at the desk?
4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is
5 no housekeeping at the desk, Senator Libous.
6 SENATOR LIBOUS: Mr. President.
7 There will be no, and I repeat, no Republican
8 conference today, but there will be a Republican
9 conference immediately following session
10 tomorrow.
11 And, Mr. President, being that
12 there be no further business, I move that we
13 adjourn until Wednesday, May 17th, at 10:00 a.m.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:
15 Republican conference is adjourned until
16 tomorrow. Repeat: Adjourned until tomorrow
17 after session.
18 Without objection, the Senate
19 stands adjourned until tomorrow, May 17th, at
20 10:00 a.m.
21 (Whereupon, at 1:32 p.m., Senate
22 adjourned.)
23