Regular Session - March 29, 1996

                                                                 
2930

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         9                       ALBANY, NEW YORK

        10                         March 29, 1996

        11                           11:02 a.m.

        12

        13

        14                       REGULAR SESSION

        15

        16

        17

        18       SENATOR JOHN R. KUHL, JR., Acting President

        19       STEPHEN F. SLOAN, Secretary

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        21

        22

        23











                                                             
2931

         1                      P R O C E E D I N G S

         2                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  The

         3       Senate will come to order.  Ask the members to

         4       find their places, staff their seats.  Ask

         5       everybody in the chamber to rise and say the

         6       Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag with me.

         7                      (The assemblage repeated the

         8       Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag. )

         9                      In the absence of clergy, may we

        10       bow our heads in a moment of silence.

        11                      (A moment of silence was

        12       observed. )

        13                      Reading of the Journal.

        14                      THE SECRETARY:  In Senate,

        15       Thursday, March 28th.  The Senate met pursuant

        16       to adjournment, Senator Hoblock in the Chair.

        17       The Journal of Wednesday, March 27th, was read

        18       and approved.  On motion, Senate adjourned.

        19                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Hearing

        20       no objection, the Journal stands approved as

        21       read.

        22                      Presentation of petitions.

        23                      Messages from the Assembly.











                                                             
2932

         1                      Messages from the Governor.

         2                      Reports of standing committees.

         3                      Reports of select committees.

         4                      Communications and reports from

         5       state officers.

         6                      Motions and resolutions.

         7                      Senator Bruno, that brings us to

         8       the calendar.

         9                      SENATOR BRUNO:  Mr. President,

        10       can we ask for a Finance Committee meeting

        11       immediately in Room 332.

        12                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  There

        13       will be an immediate meeting of Senate Finance

        14       Committee in the Majority Conference Room, Room

        15       332.  An immediate meeting of the Senate Finance

        16       Committee in the Majority Conference Room, Room

        17       332.

        18                      Senator Bruno.

        19                      SENATOR BRUNO:  Mr. Bruno, can we

        20       at this time take up the non-controversial

        21       calendar.

        22                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Secretary

        23       will read the non-controversial calendar.











                                                             
2933

         1                      THE SECRETARY:  On page 14,

         2       Calendar Number 389, by Senator Saland, Senate

         3       Print 2115.

         4                      SENATOR PATERSON:  Lay aside,

         5       please.

         6                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Lay the

         7       bill aside.

         8                      THE SECRETARY:  Calendar Number

         9       481, by Senator Goodman, Senate Print Number

        10       911, an act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic

        11       Law, in relation to allowing parking violation

        12       bureaus to increase the fine for illegal

        13       parking.

        14                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Secretary

        15       will read the last section.

        16                      THE SECRETARY:  Section 2.  This

        17       act shall take effect on the 90th day.

        18                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Call the

        19       roll.

        20                      (The Secretary called the roll. )

        21                      THE SECRETARY:  Ayes 37.

        22                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  The bill

        23       is passed.











                                                             
2934

         1                      The Secretary will continue to

         2       call the non-controversial calendar.

         3                      THE SECRETARY:  Calendar Number

         4       483, by Senator Maltese, Senate Print 4344-A, an

         5       act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, the

         6       Criminal Procedure Law and the Tax Law, in

         7       relation to penalties for failing to answer a

         8       traffic summons.

         9                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Secretary

        10       will read the last section.

        11                      THE SECRETARY:  Section 11.  This

        12       act shall take effect on the first day of

        13       November.

        14                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Call the

        15       roll.

        16                      (The Secretary called the roll. )

        17                      THE SECRETARY:  Ayes 41.

        18                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  The bill

        19       is passed.

        20                      THE SECRETARY:  Calendar Number

        21       499, by Senator Johnson, Senate Print 4469, an

        22       act to amend the Election Law, in relation to

        23       the transmitting of certain information in











                                                             
2935

         1       computer readable form by the Department of

         2       Motor Vehicles.

         3                      SENATOR STACHOWSKI:  Lay aside,

         4       please.

         5                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Lay the

         6       bill aside.

         7                      THE SECRETARY:  Calendar Number

         8       501, by Senator Levy, Senate Print Number 372,

         9       an act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in

        10       relation to increasing the penalties for

        11       aggravated unlicensed operation of a motor

        12       vehicle.

        13                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Secretary

        14       will read the last section.

        15                      THE SECRETARY:  Section 3.  This

        16       act shall take effect on the first day of

        17       November.

        18                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Call the

        19       roll.

        20                      (The Secretary called the roll. )

        21                      THE SECRETARY:  Ayes 44.

        22                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  The bill

        23       is passed.











                                                             
2936

         1                      THE SECRETARY:  Calendar Number

         2       506, by Senator Trunzo, Senate Print 6181, an

         3       act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in

         4       relation to allowing persons to indicate an

         5       emergency contact person.

         6                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Secretary

         7       will read the last section.

         8                      THE SECRETARY:  Section 3.  This

         9       act shall take effect one year after it shall

        10       have become a law.

        11                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Call the

        12       roll.

        13                      (The Secretary called the roll. )

        14                      THE SECRETARY:  Ayes 45.

        15                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  The bill

        16       is passed.

        17                      THE SECRETARY:  Calendar Number

        18       514, by Senator Johnson, Senate Print 1987, an

        19       act to amend the Domestic Relations Law, in

        20       relation to visitation rights to infant grand

        21       children.

        22                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Secretary

        23       will read the last section.











                                                             
2937

         1                      THE SECRETARY:  Section 2.  This

         2       act shall take effect immediately.

         3                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Call the

         4       roll.

         5                      (The Secretary called the roll. )

         6                      THE SECRETARY:  Ayes 45.

         7                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  The bill

         8       is passed.

         9                      Senator Bruno, that completes the

        10        -- oh, excuse me.  Secretary will continue to

        11       call the non-controversial calendar.

        12                      Senator Bruno, that completes the

        13       non-controversial calendar.

        14                      SENATOR BRUNO:  Mr. President,

        15       can we at this time take up the controversial

        16       calendar.

        17                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Secretary

        18       will read the controversial calendar beginning

        19       with Calendar Number 389.

        20                      THE SECRETARY:  On page 14,

        21       Calendar Number 389, by Senator Saland, Senate

        22       Print 2115, an act to amend the Family Court

        23       Act, in relation to the placement of children











                                                             
2938

         1       upon disposition of child protective

         2       proceedings.

         3                      SENATOR PATERSON:  Explanation.

         4                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

         5       Saland, an explanation of Calendar Number 389

         6       has been asked for by the Acting Minority

         7       Leader, Senator Paterson.

         8                      SENATOR SALAND:  Mr. President,

         9       is this the only bill on the controversial

        10       calendar, because if not, I'd like to have it

        11       laid aside temporarily.

        12                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  No,

        13       there's one other.

        14                      SENATOR SALAND: May I request it

        15       be laid aside and return to it.

        16                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill

        17       will be laid aside temporarily.

        18                      Senator Paterson, why do you

        19       rise?

        20                      SENATOR PATERSON:  That's all

        21       right.  It was really just a brief question.  If

        22       Senator Saland would -- why don't we lay it

        23       aside and I'll go and see Senator Saland.











                                                             
2939

         1                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  That

         2       sounds like a good idea, Senator Paterson.  The

         3       bill will be laid aside.

         4                      Secretary will continue to call

         5       the controversial calendar.

         6                      THE SECRETARY:  Calendar Number

         7       499, by Senator Johnson, Senate Print 4469, an

         8       act to amend the Election Law, in relation to

         9       the transmitting of certain information in

        10       computer readable form by the Department of

        11       Motor Vehicles.

        12                      SENATOR PATERSON:  Explanation.

        13                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

        14       Bruno.

        15                      SENATOR BRUNO:  Mr. President,

        16       Senator Johnson I believe is out of the chamber

        17       and if we can lay that bill aside temporarily

        18       and I believe Senator Saland is here now and may

        19       be prepared to take up his bill.

        20                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Calendar

        21       Number 499 will be laid aside temporarily.

        22       We'll return to Calendar Number 389.  I'll ask

        23       the Secretary to read.











                                                             
2940

         1                      THE SECRETARY:  On page 14,

         2       Calendar Number 389, by Senator Saland, Senate

         3       Print Number 2115, an act to amend the Family

         4       Court Act, in relation to placement of

         5       children.

         6                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

         7       Saland, previously an explanation of this bill

         8       had been asked for by Senator Paterson.  If you

         9       would so explain.

        10                      SENATOR SALAND:  Thank you, Mr.

        11       President.

        12                      What this bill endeavors to do

        13       is, in the case of child protective proceedings

        14       where there has been a -- a placement, the

        15       placement is by law defined as being limited to

        16       one year.  Those placements may be subsequently

        17       renewed by the court.

        18                      What this bill does is, it carves

        19       out an exception to those one-year placements

        20       and says that where the child who has been the

        21       subject of the proceeding is placed in the

        22       custody of a relative or other suitable person,

        23       the court may continue that order pending the











                                                             
2941

         1       further order of the court which would enable

         2       the placement to be extended for more than one

         3       year in those limited number of cases.

         4                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

         5       Paterson.

         6                      SENATOR PATERSON:  Senator

         7       Saland, the Legal Aid Society has a memo in

         8       opposition, and I was wondering if you might

         9       respond to it for me, so I can understand.

        10       Their concern has to do with an annual review of

        11       these types of placements so that maybe we might

        12       not want to restrict the placement to one year

        13       but perhaps the Legal Aid Society is saying they

        14       want to continue the review.

        15                      SENATOR SALAND:  Well, I'm not

        16       familiar with the -- the opposition memo.  I

        17       believe this to be a narrow exception in the

        18       sense that we're carefully attempting to

        19       proscribe the placements to people who are

        20       relatives of the child or some other person

        21       determined to be a suitable surrogate for

        22       purposes of the child's placement.

        23                      I'm -- I would think that the











                                                             
2942

         1       type of -- of follow-up that the Legal Aid memo

         2       is seeking might turn out to be superfluous in

         3       this type of an environment.  There certainly

         4       would be nothing -- there would be nothing that

         5       would prohibit the court from directing that

         6       particular type of review, but I would not want

         7       to bind the court to that in this narrow class

         8       of cases.

         9                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

        10       Paterson.

        11                      SENATOR PATERSON:  Thank you,

        12       Senator.  If the Senator would yield for just

        13       one further question.

        14                      SENATOR SALAND:  Certainly, Mr.

        15       President.

        16                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

        17       yields.

        18                      SENATOR PATERSON:  Senator, would

        19       you, describe this bill as a part of a desire to

        20       provoke... to promote non-foster care placement

        21       of children in situations where the parent is

        22       unable to be the active guardian? The reason

        23       that I ask the question is because, as we are











                                                             
2943

         1       limiting foster care resources in the budget, I

         2       would suggest that it might be somewhat

         3       restrictive in the sense that not all families,

         4       not all children have the resources that those

         5       who have relatives that can take them have, and

         6       I'm just hoping, because I think this is

         7       otherwise a good bill, so I'm just hoping that

         8       this is not just a philosophy that this should

         9       happen, but what would be more of something that

        10       can be permissible when it actually exists, but

        11       what I'm cautioning is that this should not be a

        12       general philosophy of what should be the

        13       placement of children when the parents are

        14       unable to serve.

        15                      SENATOR SALAND:  You ascribe to

        16       me a far grander design or agenda than I could

        17       possibly have contemplated.  This is merely an

        18       effort to recognize in those situations where a

        19       placement is made with someone who is relatively

        20       close to the child that the court would have the

        21       ability to provide for a lengthier placement.

        22       There is no underlying agenda that's intended

        23       somehow or other to create the type of scenario











                                                             
2944

         1       to which you allude.

         2                      SENATOR PATERSON:  Well, thank

         3       you, Senator.  In that case, I recommend

         4       unanimous adoption.

         5                      SENATOR SALAND:  Thank you.

         6                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Secretary

         7       will read the last section.

         8                      THE SECRETARY:  Section 2.  This

         9       act shall take effect on the 120th day.

        10                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Call the

        11       roll.

        12                      (The Secretary called the roll. )

        13                      THE SECRETARY:  Ayes 50.

        14                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  The bill

        15       is passed.

        16                      Secretary will continue to call

        17       the controversial calendar.

        18                      THE SECRETARY:  Calendar Number

        19       499, by Senator Johnson, Senate Print 4469, an

        20       act to amend the Election Law, in relation to

        21       the transmitting of certain information in

        22       computer readable form by the Department of

        23       Motor Vehicles.











                                                             
2945

         1                      SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Explanation.

         2                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

         3       Johnson, an explanation of the bill has been

         4       asked for by Senator Stachowski.

         5                      SENATOR JOHNSON:  Mr. President,

         6       the motor-voter registrations that come through

         7       the Motor Vehicle Department are made in paper

         8       duplicates, and these paper duplicates are

         9       normally sent to the local board of elections.

        10                      Now, our board is anticipating a

        11       lot of applications.  They received a lot of

        12       applications.  They don't have the staff to take

        13       all this paper and compute it, put it into

        14       computer form so it can be printed out and

        15       available expeditiously.  So this bill simply

        16       asks if, since the Motor Vehicle Bureau does put

        17       the stuff in their computer, they should

        18       communicate it to the county Board of Elections

        19       of Suffolk County by computer right into our

        20       records without all the attendant paperwork and

        21       paper shuffling that would be required without

        22       the passage of this bill.

        23                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator











                                                             
2946

         1       Paterson.

         2                      SENATOR PATERSON:  Senator, Mr.

         3       President.  I was waiting for Senator

         4       Dollinger.  He's not in the chamber but I think

         5       we can go ahead without him, if Senator Johnson

         6       is willing to yield to a question.

         7                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

         8       Johnson, do you yield to Senator Johnson

         9       Paterson?

        10                      SENATOR JOHNSON:  Yes, yes.

        11                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

        12       yields.

        13                      SENATOR PATERSON:  Senator

        14       Johnson, if Senator Dollinger were here I

        15       imagine he would say to you that this is a great

        16       idea, it's a terrific idea, and it's great that

        17       we're having it in Suffolk County, but what

        18       about extending this kind of thing to places

        19       like Rochester or Orange County, or maybe Ulster

        20       County or Onondaga County?  In other words, this

        21       is a good idea, but why aren't we doing this for

        22       all counties around the state?

        23                      SENATOR JOHNSON:  Well, of











                                                             
2947

         1       course, Senator, it would be presumptuous of me

         2       residing in Suffolk County, and being familiar

         3       with the advanced state of computerization in my

         4       county, to assume these other counties might be

         5       on a level to take advantage of this

         6       opportunity.

         7                      But, on the other hand, Senator,

         8       this bill has been on the calendar or in this

         9       house for a year, and others have suggested that

        10       when this was passed a year ago, and -- and

        11       certainly I had no objection to them introducing

        12       a bill and I would be supportive of their bill

        13       but it would be, as I say, presumptuous of me to

        14       put another county with which I'm not familiar

        15       into this bill.

        16                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

        17       Paterson.

        18                      SENATOR PATERSON:  If Senator

        19       would yield for just one final question.

        20                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

        21       Johnson, do you yield to another question?

        22                      SENATOR JOHNSON:  Yes, Mr.

        23       President.











                                                             
2948

         1                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

         2       yields.

         3                      SENATOR PATERSON:  Well, Senator,

         4       one of the rather consistent approaches that's

         5       used in this chamber is to pass this legislation

         6       and leave it to the discretion of the county as

         7       to whether or not they would like to implement

         8       it, and I would imagine that since your bill

         9       passed last year with only one exception, that

        10       that would at least be an indication that there

        11       would be a favorable determination on this type

        12       of issue, so I would just want to suggest that

        13       you consider leaving it open -- leaving it

        14       optional for the counties but providing it so

        15       that we don't have to come back and pass 61

        16       other separate bills just to accomplish this

        17       purpose.

        18                      SENATOR JOHNSON:  Senator, I -- I

        19       think I answered your question, and I certainly

        20       think that the representatives of the balance of

        21       the counties in our state are very capable,

        22       intelligent legislators and, if they felt their

        23       counties wanted this, or it would be beneficial











                                                             
2949

         1       they would be the first to introduce such a bill

         2       and make such a request, but, Senator, since

         3       last year I haven't heard a word from anyone.

         4       So I can only assume that since our county

         5       asked for it and registrations are coming in hot

         6       and heavy, that they ought to have the

         7       opportunity to implement this type of a program

         8       in the county, the only county which has

         9       requested it.

        10                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Secretary

        11       will read the last section.

        12                      THE SECRETARY:  Section 2.  This

        13       act shall take effect immediately.

        14                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Call the

        15       roll.

        16                      (The Secretary called the roll. )

        17                      THE SECRETARY:  Ayes 53.

        18                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  The bill

        19       is passed.

        20                      Senator Skelos, we have a couple

        21       of motions we could do at this time if you'd

        22       like to return to motions and resolutions.

        23                      SENATOR SKELOS:  O.K. Yes, Mr.











                                                             
2950

         1       President.

         2                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  We'll

         3       return to motions and resolutions.  The Chair

         4       recognizes Senator DiCarlo.

         5                      SENATOR DiCARLO:  Yes, Mr.

         6       President.  I wish to call up my bill, Print

         7       Number 6149, recalled from the Assembly which is

         8       now at the desk.

         9                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Secretary

        10       will read.

        11                      THE SECRETARY:  By Senator

        12       DiCarlo, Senate Print 6149-A, an act to amend

        13       the Real Property Tax Law, in relation to the

        14       exemption from real property taxation.

        15                      SENATOR DiCARLO:  Mr. President,

        16       I now move to reconsider the vote by which this

        17       bill was passed.

        18                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Secretary

        19       will call the roll on reconsideration.

        20                      (The Secretary called the roll on

        21       reconsideration. )

        22                      THE SECRETARY:  Ayes 53.

        23                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator











                                                             
2951

         1       DiCarlo.

         2                      SENATOR DiCARLO:  I now offer the

         3       following amendments.

         4                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:

         5       Amendments are received and donated.

         6                      Senator DiCarlo.

         7                      SENATOR DiCARLO:  Mr. President,

         8       I wish to call up, on behalf of Senator Velella,

         9       print bill, Print Number 5742, recalled from the

        10       Assembly which is now at the desk.

        11                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Secretary

        12       will read.

        13                      THE SECRETARY:  By Senator

        14       Velella, Senate Print 5742, an act to amend the

        15       Insurance Law, in relation to establishing a

        16       mandatory minimum coverage.

        17                      SENATOR DiCARLO:  Mr. President,

        18       I now move to reconsider the vote by which this

        19       bill was passed.

        20                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Secretary

        21       will call the roll on reconsideration.

        22                      (The Secretary called the roll on

        23       reconsideration.)











                                                             
2952

         1                      THE SECRETARY:  Ayes 53.

         2                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

         3       DiCarlo.

         4                      SENATOR DiCARLO:  Mr. President,

         5       I now offer the following amendments.

         6                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:

         7       Amendments are received and adopted.

         8                      Senator Skelos.

         9                      SENATOR SKELOS:  Mr. President,

        10       if we could return to reports of standing

        11       committees, I believe there's a report of the

        12       Finance Committee at the desk.

        13                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  You're

        14       absolutely correct, Senator Skelos.  We'll

        15       return to reports of standing committees.  I'll

        16       ask the Secretary to read.

        17                      THE SECRETARY:  Senator Stafford,

        18       from the Committee on Finance, offers up the

        19       following bill:

        20                      By Senator Hoblock, Senate Bill

        21       6773, an act to provide a retirement incentive

        22       for certain public employees.

        23                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Without











                                                             
2953

         1       objection, bill is ordered directly to third

         2       reading.

         3                      Senator Skelos.  Or, Senator

         4       Montgomery, why do you rise?

         5                      SENATOR MONTGOMERY:  Mr.

         6       President, I would like the record to show that

         7       had I been in the chamber when Calendar 390 was

         8       voted on by the house, I would have voted in the

         9       negative.

        10                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  The

        11       record will reflect, Senator Montgomery, that

        12       had you been in the chamber when Calendar Number

        13       390 was brought to the floor for a vote, that

        14       you would have voted in the negative.

        15                      Senator Skelos.

        16                      SENATOR SKELOS:  Mr. President,

        17       at this time if we could take up Calendar Number

        18       606, Senate 6773, which was reported from the

        19       Finance Committee.

        20                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Secretary

        21       will read.

        22                      THE SECRETARY:  Calendar Number

        23       606, by Senator Hoblock, Senate Print 6773, an











                                                             
2954

         1       act to provide a retirement incentive for

         2       certain public employees.

         3                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

         4       Skelos.

         5                      SENATOR SKELOS:  Mr. President,

         6       is there a message of necessity at the desk.

         7                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  There is.

         8                      SENATOR SKELOS:  Move we accept.

         9                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Motion is

        10       to accept the message of necessity at the desk.

        11       All those in favor signify by saying aye.

        12                      (Response of "Aye.")

        13                      Opposed nay.

        14                      (There was no response.)

        15                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The

        16       message is accepted.

        17                      Senator Skelos.

        18                      SENATOR SKELOS:  Can we now take

        19       up Number 607, Senate Number 5594-A, and I

        20       believe Senator Hoblock would like to give an

        21       explanation.

        22                      I correct my previous statement,

        23       Calendar Number 606.











                                                             
2955

         1                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Secretary

         2       will read.

         3                      THE SECRETARY:  It's already

         4       read.

         5                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  It has

         6       been read, to the floor, accepted the message.

         7       The Chair recognizes Senator Hoblock.

         8                      SENATOR HOBLOCK:  Thank you, Mr.

         9       President.

        10                      A couple of days ago, we passed a

        11       bill that was referred to as an early retirement

        12       incentive piece of legislation, and we now have

        13       this piece back before us, and what the differ

        14       ence is basically is we have an agreed upon bill

        15       between the Assembly, the Governor's office and

        16       this house, on an early retirement incentive.

        17                      Last year, the Legislature, with

        18       the approval of the Governor, likewise had an

        19       early retirement incentive which was quite

        20       successful given the adoption of the Legislative

        21       Budget, having some 5,000 employees take

        22       advantage of that legislation.

        23                      This year we again have an early











                                                             
2956

         1       retirement incentive with a little different

         2       spin on it in that it gives a great deal more

         3       management flexibility, so those that want to

         4       take advantages of the incentive will be able to

         5       do and, at the same time, to continue to

         6       maintain those positions that are important to

         7       the operation of state government.

         8                      We don't know yet obviously

         9       because we have not adopted a budget, as to the

        10       impact in numbers of the affected employees at

        11       the state level, but this bill also includes

        12       non-stated employers at their option and that's

        13       particularly local governments, counties, towns,

        14       villages and school districts.

        15                      It's a considerable advantage,

        16       because what it does is it allows government at

        17       all levels to continue its right-sizing, if you

        18       will, and at the same time to protect those

        19       employees by minimizing, if not totally elimin

        20       ating the need for layoffs and taking people out

        21       of their jobs.

        22                      The bill also contains an

        23       appropriation of $25 million which will be -











                                                             
2957

         1       which is included in the Executive's proposed

         2       budget to cover the first year cost of this

         3       program at the state level, but again it's an

         4       option at local government.  It's a significant

         5       management tool for local government at all

         6       levels to continue to operate with the

         7       maintenance of the essential positions and allow

         8       those that want to retire to do so giving them

         9       that flexibility.

        10                      So with that, I want to thank the

        11       staffs of both the Assembly and Senate and the

        12       Governor's office for working very diligently in

        13       the last couple of days to come up with a

        14       compromise that we have before us, and I request

        15       that the bill be moved.

        16                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

        17       Montgomery, why do you rise?

        18                      SENATOR MONTGOMERY:  Mr.

        19       President, I would ask if the sponsor would

        20       yield for a question, clarification.

        21                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

        22       Hoblock, do you yield to a question from Senator

        23       Montgomery?











                                                             
2958

         1                      SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Sure.

         2                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  The

         3       Senator yields.

         4                      SENATOR MONTGOMERY:  Senator

         5       Hoblock, on page 3 of the support memo, there is

         6       an example of what would happen in the case of

         7       an eligible Tier I employee under this bill.

         8       Could you give me an example of what would

         9       happen with a Tier II employee.  I understand

        10       that there are a number of state employees who

        11       are in Tier II and might also be -- would like

        12       to take advantage of this early retirement.

        13       Would they lose any of their benefits under

        14       this, or would they also be as per your example

        15       here, would they receive the full benefit of

        16       retirement under this bill?

        17                      SENATOR HOBLOCK:  Well, the

        18       question is, because the Tier II have a

        19       retirement age of 62 as opposed to 55?

        20                      SENATOR MONTGOMERY:  That's

        21       right.  That is correct.

        22                      SENATOR HOBLOCK:  I'm told,

        23       Senator Montgomery, that the 62 to 55 would











                                                             
2959

         1       apply.  The reduction would occur if they're

         2       under the age of 55.

         3                      SENATOR MONTGOMERY:  So, in other

         4       words, the bill allows them to retire at age 55?

         5                      SENATOR HOBLOCK:  Yes.

         6                      SENATOR MONTGOMERY:  O.K. Thank

         7       you.

         8                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

         9       Leichter, did I see that you wanted the

        10       attention of the chair.

        11                      Senator Leichter.

        12                      SENATOR LEICHTER:  Yes, Senator

        13       Hoblock, if you would yield, please.

        14                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

        15       yields.

        16                      SENATOR LEICHTER:  Senator, as I

        17       understand it, the bill covers both the

        18       executive branch, covers local government, and

        19       it also covers the Legislature; is that correct?

        20                      SENATOR HOBLOCK:  That's

        21       correct.

        22                      SENATOR LEICHTER:  And am I also

        23       correct that it establishes various standards as











                                                             
2960

         1       to the monetary savings that will be achieved

         2       upon early retirement and that's actually one of

         3       the conditions for proceeding with the early

         4       retirement?

         5                      SENATOR HOBLOCK:  That would be

         6       in those titles that are defined as not

         7       eligible.  That's correct.

         8                      SENATOR LEICHTER:  Right, and

         9       there's a specific standard set forth for the

        10       executive, is that correct?

        11                      SENATOR HOBLOCK:  The Executive

        12       Department?

        13                      SENATOR LEICHTER:  Yes.

        14                      SENATOR HOBLOCK:  Yes, as far as

        15       eligible titles.

        16                      SENATOR LEICHTER:  Right, and

        17       there is also a standard in regard to the

        18       savings that is set up for local government; is

        19       that correct?

        20                      SENATOR HOBLOCK:  If they -- if

        21       they choose to opt in.

        22                      SENATOR LEICHTER:  Right.  And is

        23       there a standard set up for the Legislature in











                                                             
2961

         1       case the Legislature -- either of the branches

         2       of the Legislature chooses to opt in?

         3                      SENATOR HOBLOCK:  I'm told that

         4       the Legislature and the judiciary will have the

         5       choice of adopting the standards of the state

         6       Executive Department criteria, local government

         7       criteria or establishing other.

         8                      SENATOR LEICHTER:  Thank you,

         9       Senator Hoblock.  That's what I'm really trying

        10       to get to.  I'm trying to understand why there

        11       is a more flexible or if you will, a laxer

        12       standard for the Legislature than there is for

        13       the executive.

        14                      SENATOR HOBLOCK:  That basically

        15       was an agreement between the Assembly, the

        16       Senate and the Governor's office in order to

        17       come to conclusion covering those two branches.

        18                      SENATOR LEICHTER:  Senator, while

        19       I'm sure you couldn't find three wiser men than

        20       the ones that you've just mentioned,

        21       nevertheless it remains for mortals like you and

        22       me to have to vote on the bill to try to

        23       understand and to justify it, and I just











                                                             
2962

         1       wouldn't want to think that the Legislature has

         2       a more generous or favorable position than local

         3       government or the Executive Department.

         4                      SENATOR HOBLOCK:  Well, it's -

         5       it's probably a couple of better steps, Senator

         6       Leichter, in that last year there was no

         7       standard in terms of them having to come up with

         8       anything and, secondly, if in fact they are

         9       exercised, I would think that -- that is the

        10       Legislature and the judiciary -- they're going

        11       to have to handle it within the appropriated

        12       budgets that we -- we give them, so that is

        13       going to be some curtailment to a certain degree

        14       as to what they're going to be able to do.

        15                      SENATOR LEICHTER:  Mr. President,

        16       if Senator Hoblock would be good enough to

        17       yield.

        18                      SENATOR HOBLOCK:  Sure.

        19                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

        20       Hoblock, continue to yield? Senator yields.

        21                      SENATOR LEICHTER:  Senator, I

        22       appreciate your explanations.  I'm just

        23       concerned as I'm sure you are.  I would not want











                                                             
2963

         1       to go to the public and say, Well, you know,

         2       we're the Legislature and, therefore, we're

         3       entitled to a special status and a very

         4       favorable position and we're not really bound by

         5       the same standards as other parts of government

         6       are bound by, and somehow I have difficulty not

         7       explaining this or justifying why we have a much

         8       more lenient standard than the executive.

         9                      SENATOR HOBLOCK:  Well, we are

        10       going to have to adopt a resolution to authorize

        11       this incentive for the Senate, as the Assembly

        12       will have to do and at that particular point,

        13       your suggestions and others can be incorporated

        14       into that resolution because there will have to

        15       be standards, whether they will be as for the

        16       Executive Department or for local government,

        17       something in between, or something different.

        18       Will have to be decided by resolution.

        19                      SENATOR LEICHTER:  Yes, Senator

        20       Hoblock, if you would continue to yield,

        21       please?

        22                      SENATOR HOBLOCK:  Sure.

        23                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator











                                                             
2964

         1       continues to yield.

         2                      SENATOR LEICHTER:  In regard to

         3       the judiciary, is the judiciary covered by this

         4       also?

         5                      SENATOR HOBLOCK:  Yes, it is.

         6                      SENATOR LEICHTER:  And does the

         7       judiciary have to opt in, or is the judiciary

         8       automatically made part of this early retirement

         9       system?

        10                      SENATOR HOBLOCK:  They have to

        11       opt in.

        12                      SENATOR LEICHTER:  And when they

        13       opt in, do they have the same leeway as to the

        14       savings that are to be achieved as the

        15       Legislature has?

        16                      SENATOR HOBLOCK:  Yes.  I am

        17       told.

        18                      SENATOR LEICHTER:  It's the same,

        19       they can do it either the way the executive,

        20       they can do it the way local government does or

        21       they can do it in some -- in some other

        22       fashion.

        23                      SENATOR HOBLOCK:  That's











                                                             
2965

         1       correct.

         2                      SENATOR LEICHTER:  And that is -

         3       and, Senator, is that their choice, they can do

         4       that by however decisions are made for the

         5       judicial branch, whether by the Judicial

         6       Conference or some -

         7                      SENATOR HOBLOCK:  Yes, that's -

         8       that's true, but again they're going to have to

         9       live within their budget, and that's the

        10       agreement between the judiciary and both houses,

        11       that's correct.

        12                      SENATOR LEICHTER:  O.K. Thank you

        13       very much, Senator Hoblock.

        14                      Mr. President, I have no problem

        15       with early retirement, though I think that it

        16       often means that we lose some of our best people

        17       from government.  We lose some of our best

        18       people at SUNY and CUNY, so there's a cost to

        19       it.  There's a cost that can't always be

        20       calculated just in terms of, Oh, I've saved so

        21       many dollars.  You may lose something in the

        22       nature of the performance by government.  You

        23       may have a teacher in class who's not anywheres











                                                             
2966

         1       qualified as the person that they replace, but

         2       my particular concern was that we not put the

         3       Legislature on a pedestal, that we not say,

         4       Well, the Legislature isn't subject to the laws

         5       as anyone else.

         6                      I accept Senator Hoblock's

         7       explanation, and I think he did as well with it

         8       as could be done, but I have a sneaking

         9       suspicion that by this bill the Legislature is

        10       doing what it has done in other instances, says,

        11       Hey, we're the Legislature.  We have a special

        12       status.

        13                      I do hope that's not the case,

        14       but -

        15                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  The Chair

        16       recognizes Senator Stavisky.

        17                      SENATOR STAVISKY:  Will Senator

        18       Hoblock yield?

        19                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

        20       Hoblock, do you yield to Senator Stavisky?

        21       Senator yields.

        22                      SENATOR STAVISKY:  Will the

        23       sponsor please indicate how this legislation











                                                             
2967

         1       affects SUNY and CUNY faculty and other

         2       personnel?

         3                      SENATOR HOBLOCK:  Well, my

         4       understanding is that, first, SUNY would have to

         5       opt in.  The position need not be eliminated,

         6       but there needs to be a demonstration of the 50

         7       percent savings.

         8                      SENATOR STAVISKY:  Senator

         9       Hoblock, isn't it true that in the SUNY

        10       trustees' report "Rethinking SUNY" on issues of

        11       governance, it was the announced purpose of that

        12       report that they would strengthen and improve

        13       SUNY standards vis-a-vis excellence and that

        14       that was the purpose of the "Rethinking SUNY"

        15       report on governance? Wasn't that the stated

        16       purpose?

        17                      SENATOR HOBLOCK:  That's -- that

        18       was their stated purpose.

        19                      SENATOR STAVISKY:  Well, that was

        20       what the report purported to offer, and it seems

        21       to me that, when there is a -- an assumption in

        22       this bill that the most experienced, most

        23       qualified faculty at SUNY and CUNY may disappear











                                                             
2968

         1       under this early retirement, that the only

         2       standard -- and this is not a standard of

         3       excellence, this is a standard of dollars -- the

         4       only standard that is provided is that the new

         5       hirees will not be paid more than 50 percent of

         6       what the former faculty members received in

         7       serving SUNY and CUNY.  Am I correct?

         8                      SENATOR HOBLOCK:  Well, Senator

         9       Stavisky, I think that the whole issue of early

        10       retirement for the SUNY system, like local

        11       governments, is at their choice.  They don't

        12       have to do it.  It's not like we're eliminating

        13       positions or forcing them into it.  If they feel

        14       that they need to maintain that excellence with

        15       the people they have, they can keep going.  It's

        16       not like we're telling them they have to do

        17       that.  We're not eliminating those positions.

        18                      SENATOR STAVISKY:  It seems to me

        19       that this is a plan for early retirement which

        20       is at variance with the avowed purpose of the

        21       SUNY "Rethinking SUNY" report issued by the

        22       trustees, that in fact we're saying it doesn't

        23       matter if the new people are not as qualified,











                                                             
2969

         1       only if they are willing to work for no more

         2       than half of what the previous employees' salary

         3       was, and that doesn't necessarily guarantee

         4       improvement to quality.  It means an improvement

         5       in the cash flow.

         6                      At the very same time that that

         7       report suggests the reduction in state support

         8       for higher education and that report also

         9       suggests increasing the tuition charged to the

        10       students, isn't the end result of all of this

        11       that the students may be paying more money for

        12       tuition for faculty services which would be of

        13       lesser quality than they had before?  I ask you

        14       to reconcile these two avowed purposes.

        15                      SENATOR HOBLOCK:  Well, Senator

        16       Stavisky, I'm having a little difficulty coming

        17       to that reconciliation because I'm not sure that

        18       the area and the issues that you're raising

        19       really have anything to do with this

        20       legislation.

        21                      Again, we are not forcing

        22       anything on SUNY.  We are giving them that

        23       option and if, in fact, they choose to do











                                                             
2970

         1       something internally, that is their choice.

         2       Whether -- I don't see how this legislation is

         3       in any way affecting through an involuntary way

         4       the quality of services provided by SUNY.  It's

         5       just providing them a mechanism should they

         6       choose to do so.

         7                      Now, if it's your opinion that we

         8       should not even do that, that's your opinion.

         9                      SENATOR STAVISKY:  I -- on the

        10       bill.

        11                      What I am suggesting, Mr.

        12       President and Senator Hoblock, is that on the

        13       one hand we are promising more flexibility to

        14       SUNY in order that the SUNY trustees' plan which

        15       guarantees higher quality and higher standards

        16       will be implemented, and yet at an expense of

        17       higher tuition rates for the students attending

        18       SUNY and CUNY, without any assurance that the

        19       quality and experience of the new faculty

        20       members that are hired will even begin to match

        21       what they presently have.

        22                      So what they're getting is less

        23       quality for higher tuition, and that's the sad











                                                             
2971

         1       conclusion that we have to arrive at in looking

         2       at this piece of legislation against the back

         3       drop of what the SUNY trustees have promised.

         4       They promise that, if they are able to raise

         5       tuition, that there will be higher standards.

         6       There will be greater quality in the State

         7       University system, but the higher quality may,

         8       in fact, result in a faculty with lesser

         9       qualifications while the students are forced to

        10       pay more money, the third round of increases in

        11       tuitions in recent years, and I think that that

        12       is hardly in keeping with the lofty promises of

        13       the SUNY trustees with regard to what their

        14       "Rethinking SUNY" plan called for.

        15                      I think the students are going to

        16       be socked and their parents obviously too.

        17       They'll be socked with a higher tuition rate and

        18       will necessarily not have the experienced

        19       faculty members that are there now, let alone

        20       any improvement in the faculty members.

        21                      This is not to say that new

        22       faculty members may not have skills, may not

        23       have ingenuity, may not have a desire to excel,











                                                             
2972

         1       but there is nothing with regard to faculty

         2       standards in this legislation, only with regard

         3       to saving money, and the saving money comes at

         4       the same time that the students and their

         5       families all over the state, by the way, will be

         6       forced to pay more money on tuition for

         7       enrolling in SUNY courses.

         8                      Now, that's a conflict that the

         9       members of this Legislature will have to face if

        10       the SUNY plan for governance is put into effect,

        11       because your constituents, the students, their

        12       parents, and others who are paying locally for

        13       the costs of higher education may, in fact, find

        14       that they're getting less while spending more

        15       for tuition, and I would ask you to review the

        16       impact that it has on your constituents, my

        17       constituents, all of our constituents, in the

        18       name of higher standards of quality.

        19                      Yes, they are saving money.  No,

        20       they are spending more money when it comes to

        21       the students and their parents, and there is no

        22       guarantee in this legislation, nothing I can see

        23       which guarantees comparable experience or











                                                             
2973

         1       qualifications for the new people who are

         2       hired.

         3                      Are they going to be the

         4       equivalent of graduate assistants who will be

         5       replacing senior tenured faculty members? I fear

         6       that in many cases that will be the consequence

         7       of this legislation.  We know what we have.  We

         8       are not sure about what we will get, and you

         9       have to consult your own constituents to see how

        10       that washes with them, now that they're going to

        11       have to be paying a bigger bill for tuition.

        12                      I may yet vote for this

        13       legislation because of the fiscal crisis facing

        14       the state, but it seems to be at variance with

        15       the avowed premise and promises of the SUNY

        16       trustees.

        17                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

        18       Bruno?  Senator Bruno, on the bill.

        19                      SENATOR BRUNO:  On the bill.

        20                      Mr. President, my colleagues, I

        21       just wanted to make a comment on how important

        22       this piece of legislation is to so many of the

        23       employees that will be affected in a very











                                                             
2974

         1       positive way, and I want to commend the Governor

         2       in his wisdom in preparing a budget and helping

         3       with this piece of legislation in taking the

         4       lead and the intent, of course, is that there

         5       not be layoffs, that people are able to make

         6       their own judgments, their own decisions in

         7       leaving the work place, wherever that might be,

         8       and the legislation allows local option in terms

         9       of who will participate in that respect.

        10                      So while there may not be any

        11       perfect vehicle, we should note for the record

        12       that an alternative could have been layoffs that

        13       would affect people very negatively, and that is

        14       more widespread than the individuals that are

        15       affected.

        16                      So again, I want to commend the

        17       Governor.  I want to commend Senator Hoblock,

        18       who took the lead with the chair of the

        19       committee, Senator Trunzo, to help orchestrate

        20       and put together this piece of legislation that

        21       will have such a positive effect on so many

        22       people throughout this state, allowing them to

        23       make judgments for their own health, for their











                                                             
2975

         1       own welfare, and going on with their lives.

         2                      So, Mr. President, I am pleased

         3       and proud that this piece of legislation is

         4       before us, and I certainly intend to vote in a

         5       positive way, and I would encourage my

         6       colleagues to do the same.

         7                      Thank you, Mr. President.

         8                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Secretary

         9       will read the last section.

        10                      THE SECRETARY:  Section 15.  This

        11       act shall take effect immediately.

        12                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Call the

        13       roll.

        14                      (The Secretary called the roll. )

        15                      THE SECRETARY:  Ayes 56.

        16                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  The bill

        17       is passed.

        18                      The Chair recognizes Senator

        19       Bruno.

        20                      SENATOR BRUNO:  Mr. President, we

        21       are waiting for one more piece of legislation

        22       that relates to the debt service for the state,

        23       and it's important that we pass it today if we











                                                             
2976

         1       can.  I understand that there was a delay in

         2       printing, but we are expecting it momentarily.

         3       So I would ask that the Senate stand in recess

         4        -- at ease -- I am sorry, we are not recessing

         5        -- at ease for just a few minutes, and I

         6       believe the legislation will be here and we can

         7       take it up and then do whatever else is

         8       important in our lives.

         9                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  The

        10       Senate will stand at ease.

        11                      (Whereupon at 12:48 p.m., the

        12       Senate stood at ease.)

        13                      ...At 12:55 p.m...

        14                      ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO:

        15       Senator Skelos, why do you rise?

        16                      SENATOR SKELOS:  There will be an

        17       immediate meeting of the Finance Committee in

        18       the Majority Conference Room.

        19                      ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO:  There

        20       will be an immediate meeting of the Finance

        21       Committee in the Majority Conference Room.

        22                      SENATOR SKELOS:  And the Senate

        23       will continue to stand at ease.











                                                             
2977

         1                      ACTING PRESIDENT DiCARLO:  And

         2       the Senate will continue to stand at ease.

         3                      (Whereupon, at 12:36 p.m., the

         4       Senate reconvened.)

         5                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senate

         6       will come to order.

         7                      The Chair recognizes Senator

         8       Skelos.

         9                      SENATOR SKELOS:  Mr. President,

        10       if we could return to reports of standing

        11       committees, I believe there is a report of the

        12       Finance Committee at the desk.

        13                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  There is,

        14       Senator Skelos.

        15                      We will return to reports of

        16       standing committees.

        17                      I will ask the Secretary to read.

        18                      THE SECRETARY:  Senator Stafford,

        19       from the Committee on Finance, offers up the

        20       following bill:

        21                      Senate Print 5594A, Budget Bill,

        22       an act making appropriations for legal

        23       requirements to the state debt services.











                                                             
2978

         1                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

         2       Skelos, without objection, the bill is ordered

         3       directly to third reading.

         4                      SENATOR SKELOS:  Will you please

         5       take up Calendar 607, Senate 5594A, which was

         6       just reported from the Finance Committee.

         7                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Secretary

         8       will read.

         9                      THE SECRETARY:  Calendar 607,

        10       Budget Bill, Senate Print 5594A, an act making

        11       appropriations for the legal requirements of the

        12       state debt service.

        13                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

        14       Skelos.

        15                      SENATOR SKELOS:  Mr. President,

        16       is there a message of necessity at the desk?

        17                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  There is.

        18                      SENATOR SKELOS:  Move to accept

        19       the message.

        20                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  The

        21       motion is to accept the message of necessity

        22       which is at the desk.

        23                      All those in favor, signify by











                                                             
2979

         1       saying aye.

         2                      (Response of "Aye.")

         3                      Opposed, nay.

         4                      (There was no response.)

         5                      The message is accepted.

         6                      The Secretary will read the last

         7       section.

         8                      THE SECRETARY:  Section 2.  This

         9       act shall take effect immediately.

        10                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Call the

        11       roll.

        12                      (The Secretary called the roll.)

        13                      Senator Dollinger to explain his

        14       vote?

        15                      SENATOR DOLLINGER:  Explain my

        16       vote.

        17                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

        18       Dollinger, to explain his vote.

        19                      SENATOR DOLLINGER:  Mr.

        20       President, I asked in the Finance Committee

        21       whether this included any new authorizations for

        22       debt by the state of New York and was told that

        23       it did not.  This was simply fulfilling our debt











                                                             
2980

         1       obligations.  I support it on that basis.  I

         2       just wanted to suggest to my colleagues that if

         3       there is new back-door borrowing in the state in

         4       any portion of it, it would be my intention to

         5       vote against that new back-door borrowing.

         6                      So I'm voting in favor of this

         7       item but simply reserving my options to a later

         8       date.

         9                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

        10       Dollinger will be recorded in the affirmative.

        11                      Announce the results.

        12                      Senator Gold to explain his vote

        13       after he picks up his Pepsi can.

        14                      SENATOR GOLD:  You putt better

        15       than I do.  I can see that.

        16                      Mr. President, I am really very

        17       delighted that we are passing this piece of

        18       legislation.  I know that there have been delays

        19       in past years in the budgets and that this year

        20       again we are not on time, and I don't want to

        21       have a whole political discussion as to that.  I

        22       know Senator Bruno is quoted in the papers

        23       today, giving his explanation, which I think is











                                                             
2981

         1       naive to say the least.

         2                      The point is that this is an

         3       important bill, and I think the reason why our

         4       conference was very adamant about passing it is

         5       the following:

         6                      The state of New York always pays

         7       its debts, yet there are people who sit in back

         8       rooms with charts and computers and whatever and

         9       they find 16 reasons to Sunday why we should

        10       either not have the state's bond rating

        11       increased, why we should not have the interest

        12       levels dropped, or why they should be increased,

        13       none of which makes any sense when you take a

        14       look at the history of the state in paying its

        15       debts.

        16                      So I think that what we're doing

        17       today, even though the budget itself is delayed,

        18       is eliminating any excuse that Wall Street may

        19       have for suggesting that New York State is not

        20       anything other than an excellent credit risk.

        21                      So it's with that in mind that I

        22       vote for this bill.

        23                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator











                                                             
2982

         1       Gold will be recorded in the affirmative.

         2                      Announce the results.

         3                      THE SECRETARY:  Ayes 55.

         4                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  The bill

         5       is passed.

         6                      Senator Skelos.

         7                      SENATOR SKELOS:  I believe there

         8       are some substitutions at the desk.

         9                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  There

        10       are, Senator Skelos.  I'll ask the Secretary to

        11       read.

        12                      THE SECRETARY:  On page 20,

        13       Senator Kuhl moves to discharge from the

        14       Committee on Agriculture, Assembly Bill Number

        15       5430 -- or 9430, excuse me -- and substitute it

        16       for the identical Senate Bill 6188.

        17                      On page 22, Senator Cook moves to

        18       discharge from the Committee on Education

        19       Assembly Bill 9041 and substitute it for the

        20       identical Senate Bill 6272.

        21                      On page 5, Senator Farley moves

        22       to discharge from the Committee on Banks

        23       Assembly Bill 8466 and substitute it for the











                                                             
2983

         1       identical Senate Bill 4933.

         2                      SENATOR SKELOS:  Move the

         3       substitutions.

         4                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:

         5       Substitutions are ordered.

         6                      Chair recognizes Senator

         7       Hoblock.

         8                      SENATOR HOBLOCK:  Mr. President,

         9       request the removal of the sponsor's star on

        10       Calendar Number 207, Bill 5137A.

        11                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  At the

        12       request of Senator Hoblock, the star will be

        13       removed on Calendar Number 207.

        14                      Senator Skelos.

        15                      SENATOR SKELOS:  Mr. President,

        16       if we could return to motions and resolutions,

        17       please recognize Senator DeFrancisco.

        18                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Return to

        19       motions and resolutions.

        20                      Senator DeFrancisco.

        21                      SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:  Mr.

        22       President, a very important event is going to

        23       start unfolding tomorrow at the Meadowlands, and











                                                             
2984

         1       I understand that we have -- I have started

         2       preparing a resolution which basically is going

         3       to be an upbeat resolution indicating their

         4       success in the final four, and we're waiting

         5       until after the final four to unveil that

         6       resolution, and I will offer it after the

         7       event.

         8                      However, I think it's also proper

         9       to urge that the team do well, and it's my

        10       understanding that there is a motion -- a

        11       privileged resolution, I should say, at the desk

        12       sponsored by Senator Hoffmann, and I would

        13       request that that be -- that you would recognize

        14       Senator Hoffmann with respect to that

        15       resolution.

        16                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

        17       DeFrancisco, I was listening very intently being

        18       an alumnus of Syracuse, and I didn't hear you

        19       mention the name of the most prominent team in

        20       the final four as being the Syracuse University

        21       Orangemen.

        22                      The Chair would recognize, based

        23       on that, Senator Hoffmann.











                                                             
2985

         1                      SENATOR HOFFMANN:  Mr. President,

         2       perhaps it would be appropriate for the resolu

         3       tion to be read into the record and offered for

         4       cosponsorship to all members of the Senate, by

         5       yours truly and Senator DeFrancisco, as a proud

         6       alumnus of Syracuse University.

         7                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  There is

         8       a privileged resolution at the desk.  I'll ask

         9       the Secretary to read the title.

        10                      THE SECRETARY:  By Senator

        11       Hoffmann, Legislative Resolution, commending

        12       Syracuse University's men's basketball team upon

        13       the occasion of finishing in the NCAA's final

        14       four.

        15                      SENATOR GOLD:  In honor of my

        16       sister, I would like to be on the resolution.

        17                      SENATOR SKELOS:  Mr. President.

        18       I was wondering if Senator Hoffmann would allow

        19       all the members of the Senate to cosponsor this

        20       wonderful resolution.

        21                      SENATOR HOFFMANN:  Right.

        22       Senator Skelos, I had indicated earlier that I

        23       would like very much to see it cosponsored by











                                                             
2986

         1       all members and, since it is Syracuse University

         2       and the city of Syracuse is jointly represented

         3       by two Senators, I think Senator DeFrancisco and

         4       I would be the appropriate cosponsors on this

         5       resolution, and I hope that in the -

         6                      SENATOR SKELOS:  I appreciate

         7       that, and I know that Senator DeFrancisco on

         8       Monday or Tuesday with his resolution will be

         9       offering it up to sponsorship by all the members

        10       of the Senate, and we appreciate that also, in

        11       anticipation, Senator DeFrancisco.

        12                      SENATOR HOFFMANN:  As we adjourn

        13       today, I can think of no better way for us to

        14       send our good wishes to the Orangemen, and I

        15       look forward to a victorious Saturday and Monday

        16       as do all other members of Syracuse University,

        17       its alumni and this Legislature.

        18                      Thank you.

        19                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

        20       Skelos, should we put all the members of the

        21       Legislature on the resolution?

        22                      SENATOR SKELOS:  Absolutely.  If

        23       there's no objection, they should be.











                                                             
2987

         1                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  I don't

         2       know if there are any other alumnus of those

         3       other three schools here, but we'll put all

         4       members on the resolution except for those who

         5       don't want to be on the resolution.  If those

         6       people who don't want to be on the resolution

         7       could indicate that to the Secretary, then we'll

         8       remove their names from the resolution.

         9                      Senator DeFrancisco.

        10                      SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:  I'd like to

        11       speak on the resolution.

        12                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

        13       DeFrancisco on the resolution.

        14                      SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:  As not only

        15       an alumnus but a former ball player, although a

        16       smaller team, baseball team, and also a season's

        17       ticketholder who has gone to just about every

        18       game in the last ten years, including the last

        19       final four when we were disappointed with the

        20       last-second shot by somebody from Indiana whose

        21       name we will never put on this record, I am very

        22       hopeful that this trip down to the final four at

        23       the Meadowlands is going to be a successful











                                                             
2988

         1       one.  Coach Boeheim has done a wonderful job

         2       with a lot of people who have overachieved and

         3       they've played with team spirit, just like this

         4       body shows from time to time, overachievers and

         5       also team spirit.

         6                      So I'm looking forward to being

         7       there, and I'm looking forward to rooting the

         8       Orangemen on, and I'm looking forward to

         9       presenting a resolution after the tournament

        10       which will congratulate the new national

        11       champion, Syracuse Orangemen.

        12                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  The

        13       question is on the resolution.

        14                      Senator Dollinger, do you wish to

        15       speak on the resolution?

        16                      SENATOR DOLLINGER:  Mr.

        17       President, I'd just like to join Senator

        18       Hoffmann and Senator DeFrancisco.  When the

        19       Orangemen go to New Jersey, they will be riding

        20       in part on the shoulders of Greece-Athena's

        21       finest graduate, John Wallace, and I certainly

        22       wish him well.

        23                      Senator DeFrancisco, when you











                                                             
2989

         1       bring the resolution forward congratulating the

         2       Orangemen on their national championship, I hope

         3       it will be because John Wallace will have been

         4       the Most Valuable Player in the final four.

         5                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Question

         6       is on the resolution.

         7                      All those in favor, signify by

         8       saying aye.

         9                      (Response of "Aye.")

        10                      Opposed, nay.

        11                      (There was no response.)

        12                      The resolution is unanimously

        13       adopted.

        14                      Senator Skelos.

        15                      SENATOR SKELOS:  Mr. President.

        16       Is there any other housekeeping at the desk?

        17                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  There is

        18       none, Senator Skelos.

        19                      SENATOR SKELOS:  There being no

        20       further business, I -

        21                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Oh,

        22       excuse me.  Senator Paterson, why do you rise?

        23                      SENATOR PATERSON:  Mr. President,











                                                             
2990

         1       this is actually the deadline date by which

         2       motions for discharge would be filed in the

         3       chamber; however, with the gracious consent of

         4       the Majority, we postponed them, and we will

         5       have them on April, 16th day -- April 16th.

         6                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Senator

         7       Skelos.

         8                      SENATOR SKELOS:  It's my

         9       understanding that unanimous consent will be

        10       given to all the motions to be -- to discharge

        11       be presented on April 16th, and we look forward

        12       to that day.

        13                      Mr. President, there being no

        14       further business, I move we adjourn until

        15       Monday, April 1, 1996, at 3:00 p.m. sharp,

        16       intervening days to be legislative days.

        17                      ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:  Without

        18       objection, the Senate stands adjourned until

        19       Monday, April 1, at 3:00 p.m., all days -

        20       intervening days to be intervening days.

        21                      (Whereupon, at 12:47 p.m., the

        22       Senate adjourned.)

        23