Regular Session - May 21, 1996
5452
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8 ALBANY, NEW YORK
9 May 21, 1996
10 3:05 p.m.
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13 REGULAR SESSION
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16
17 SENATOR JOHN R. KUHL, JR., Acting President
18 STEPHEN F. SLOAN, Secretary
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5453
1 P R O C E E D I N G S
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
3 Senate will come to order. Ask the members to
4 find their places, the staff to find their
5 places. Ask everybody in the chamber to rise
6 and join with me in saying the Pledge of
7 Allegiance to the Flag.
8 (The assemblage repeated the
9 Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag.)
10 In the absence of clergy, may we
11 bow our heads in a moment of silence.
12 (A moment of silence was
13 observed.)
14 Reading of the Journal.
15 THE SECRETARY: In Senate,
16 Monday, May 20th. The Senate met pursuant to
17 adjournment, Senator Kuhl in the Chair upon
18 designation of the Temporary President. The
19 Prayer by the Reverend Peter Young, Blessed
20 Sacrament Church, Bolton Landing. The Journal
21 of Sunday, May 19, was read and approved. On
22 motion, the Senate adjourned.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Hearing
5454
1 no objection, the Journal stands approved as
2 read.
3 Presentation of petitions.
4 Messages from the Assembly.
5 Messages from the Governor.
6 Reports of standing committees.
7 Reports of select committees.
8 Communications and reports from
9 state officers.
10 Motions and resolutions.
11 The Chair recognizes Senator
12 Tully.
13 SENATOR TULLY: Thank you, Mr.
14 President.
15 On behalf of Senator Levy, I wish
16 to call up his bill, Senate Print Number 7569,
17 which is now at the desk.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
19 Secretary will read the title.
20 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
21 1221, by Senator Levy, Senate Print 7569, an act
22 to authorize the Roosevelt Union Free School
23 District.
5455
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
2 Tully.
3 SENATOR TULLY: Mr. President, I
4 now move to reconsider the vote by which this
5 bill was passed and ask that the bill be
6 restored to the order of third reading.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
8 Secretary will call the roll on reconsideration.
9 (The Secretary called the roll on
10 reconsideration.)
11 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 32.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
13 is restored.
14 Senator Tully.
15 SENATOR TULLY: Mr. President, I
16 now move to discharge from the Committee on
17 Rules Assembly Print Number 10688 and substitute
18 it for Senator Levy's identical bill.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
20 substitution is ordered.
21 SENATOR TULLY: I now move that
22 the substituted Assembly bill have its third
23 reading at this time.
5456
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
2 Secretary will read.
3 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
4 1221, by the Assembly Committee on Rules,
5 Assembly Print Number 10688, an act to authorize
6 the Roosevelt Union Free School District.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
8 roll -- the Secretary will read the last
9 section.
10 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
11 act shall take effect immediately.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
13 roll.
14 (The Secretary called the roll.)
15 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 32.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
17 is passed.
18 Senator Tully.
19 SENATOR TULLY: Mr. President, on
20 behalf of Senator Rath, on page 43, I offer the
21 following amendments to Calendar Number 943,
22 Assembly Print Number 7366-A, and ask that said
23 bill retain its place on the Third Reading
5457
1 Calendar.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
3 amendments to Calendar Number 943 are received
4 and adopted. The bill will retain its place on
5 the Third Reading Calendar.
6 Senator Tully.
7 SENATOR TULLY: Mr. President, on
8 behalf of Senator Maziarz, on page 20, I offer
9 the following amendments to Calendar Number 670,
10 Senate Print Number 6355-A, and ask that said
11 bill retain its place on the Third Reading
12 Calendar.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
14 amendments to Calendar Number 670 are received
15 and adopted. The bill will retain its place on
16 the Third Reading Calendar.
17 Senator Tully.
18 SENATOR TULLY: Mr. President, on
19 behalf of Senator Hannon, on page 50, I offer
20 the following amendments to Calendar Number
21 1010, Assembly Print Number 7428, and ask that
22 said bill retain its place on the Third Reading
23 Calendar.
5458
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
2 amendments to Calendar Number 1010 are received
3 and adopted. The bill will retain its place on
4 the Third Reading Calendar.
5 Senator Tully.
6 SENATOR TULLY: Mr. President, on
7 behalf of Senator Lack, on page 55, I offer the
8 following amendments to Calendar Number 1056,
9 Assembly Print Number 4757, and ask that said
10 bill retain its place on the Third Reading
11 calendar.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
13 amendments to Calendar Number 1056 are received
14 and adopted. The bill will retain its place on
15 the Third Reading Calendar.
16 Senator Tully.
17 SENATOR TULLY: Mr. President, on
18 behalf of Senator Cook, on page 23, I offer the
19 following amendments to Calendar Number 719,
20 Senate Print Number 3220-A, and ask that said
21 bill retain its place on the Third Reading
22 Calendar.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
5459
1 amendments to Calendar 719 are received and
2 adopted. The bill will retain its place on the
3 Third Reading Calendar.
4 Senator Tully.
5 SENATOR TULLY: Mr. President, on
6 behalf of Senator Maltese, on page 73, I offer
7 the following amendments to Calendar Number
8 1198, Senate Print Number 3086-A, and ask that
9 said bill retain its place on the Third Reading
10 Calendar.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
12 amendments to Calendar Number 1198 are received
13 and adopted. The bill will retain its place on
14 the Third Reading Calendar.
15 We have substitutions at the
16 desk, Senator Skelos.
17 SENATOR SKELOS: Make the
18 substitutions.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
20 Secretary will read the substitutions.
21 THE SECRETARY: On page 54,
22 Senator Holland moves to discharge from the
23 Committee on Rules, Assembly Bill Number 8158-B
5460
1 and substitute it for the identical Third
2 Reading Calendar 1040.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
4 substitution is ordered.
5 Senator Skelos.
6 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
7 at this time may we please adopt the Resolution
8 Calendar.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
10 motion is to adopt the Resolution Calendar. All
11 those in favor signify by saying aye.
12 (Response of "Aye".)
13 Opposed, nay.
14 (There was no response.)
15 The Resolution Calendar is
16 adopted.
17 Senator Skelos.
18 SENATOR SKELOS: Would you please
19 recognize Senator Stachowski.
20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
21 Stachowski.
22 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Mr.
23 President, there's a privileged res... I believe
5461
1 there's a privileged resolution at the desk -
2 that's what I was thinking -- by Senator Smith.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There are
4 two privileged resolutions at the desk.
5 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Would you
6 waive the readings and read the titles.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
8 Secretary will read the title to the first
9 privileged resolution.
10 THE SECRETARY: By Senator Smith,
11 Legislative Resolution honoring Assistant Chief
12 Robert F. Burke for his outstanding leadership
13 and ceaseless dedicated service to the Patrol
14 Borough Queens South community on Wednesday, May
15 22nd, 1996.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
17 question is on the resolution. All those in
18 favor signify by saying aye.
19 (Response of "Aye".)
20 Opposed, nay.
21 (There was no response.)
22 The resolution is adopted.
23 The Secretary will read the title
5462
1 to the second privileged resolution.
2 THE SECRETARY: By Senator Smith,
3 Legislative Resolution honoring Deputy Chief
4 Jules Martin for his outstanding leadership and
5 ceaseless dedicated service to the Patrol
6 Borough Queens South community on Wednesday, May
7 22nd, 1996.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
9 question is on the resolution. All those in
10 favor signify by saying aye.
11 (Response of "Aye".)
12 Opposed, nay.
13 (There was no response.)
14 The resolution is adopted.
15 Senator Skelos, that brings us to
16 the calendar.
17 SENATOR STAFFORD: Finance
18 meeting, please, in Room 332.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There
20 will be an immediate meeting of the Senate
21 Committee on Finance in the Majority Conference
22 Room, Room 332. Immediate meeting of the Senate
23 Committee on Finance in the Majority Conference
5463
1 Room, Room 332.
2 Senator Skelos.
3 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
4 at this time if we could have a reading of the
5 non-controversial calendar.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
7 Secretary will read the non-controversial
8 calendar.
9 THE SECRETARY: On page number 7,
10 Calendar Number 314, by Senator Holland, Senate
11 Print 213 -
12 SENATOR SMITH: Lay it aside,
13 please.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
15 bill aside.
16 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
17 391, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 2595-A, an
18 act to amend the Social Services Law, in
19 relation to criminal screening.
20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
21 Secretary will read the last section.
22 THE SECRETARY: Section 6. This
23 act shall take effect on the 120th day.
5464
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
2 roll.
3 (The Secretary called the roll.)
4 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 39.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
6 is passed.
7 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
8 691, by Senator Padavan, Senate Print 4216-A, an
9 act to amend the Penal Law, in relation to auto
10 stripping.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
12 Secretary will read the last section.
13 THE SECRETARY: Section 10. This
14 act shall take effect on the first day of
15 November.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
17 roll.
18 (The Secretary called the roll.)
19 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 39.
20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
21 is passed.
22 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
23 701, by Senator DiCarlo, Senate Print 1984-A -
5465
1 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
3 bill aside.
4 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
5 702, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 2104, an
6 act to amend the Family Court Act, in relation
7 to evidence of child neglect.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
9 Secretary will read the last section.
10 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This
11 act shall take effect 120 days.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
13 roll.
14 (The Secretary called the roll.)
15 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 39.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
17 is passed.
18 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
19 703, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 2106, an
20 act to amend the Family Court Act, in relation
21 to dispositional alternatives.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
23 Secretary will read the last section.
5466
1 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
2 act shall take effect on the 120th day.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
4 roll.
5 (The Secretary called the roll.)
6 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 40.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
8 is passed.
9 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
10 715, by Senator Libous, Senate Print 6654-A, an
11 act to amend the Mental Hygiene Law, in relation
12 to providing for involuntary admissions.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
14 Secretary will read the last section.
15 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
16 act shall take effect immediately.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
18 roll.
19 (The Secretary called the roll.)
20 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 40.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
22 is passed.
23 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
5467
1 729, by Senator Larkin, Senate Print 6518, an
2 act to amend the Executive Law and the General
3 Municipal Law, in relation to the classification
4 of offenses.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
6 Secretary will read the last section.
7 THE SECRETARY: Section 9. This
8 act shall take effect on the first day of
9 November.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
11 roll.
12 (The Secretary called the roll.)
13 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 40.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
15 is passed.
16 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
17 735, by Senator Velella, Senate Print 6906-A, an
18 act to amend the Insurance Law, in relation to
19 marketing health maintenance organization
20 coverage.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
22 Secretary will read the last section.
23 THE SECRETARY: Section 9. This
5468
1 act shall take effect immediately.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
3 roll.
4 (The Secretary called the roll.)
5 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 40.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
7 is passed.
8 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
9 787, by Senator Goodman, Senate Print 7102, an
10 act to amend the Executive Law, in relation to
11 providing a fraud tipster incentive.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
13 Secretary will read the last section.
14 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
15 act shall take effect immediately.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
17 roll.
18 (The Secretary called the roll.)
19 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 40.
20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
21 is passed.
22 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
23 863, by Senator Volker, Senate Print 6951, an
5469
1 act to amend the Penal Law and the Family Court
2 Act, in relation to conditions of probation.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
4 Secretary will read the last section.
5 THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This
6 act shall take effect on the first day of
7 November.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
9 roll.
10 (The Secretary called the roll.)
11 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
13 is passed.
14 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
15 866, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 2597, an
16 act to amend the Family Court Act, in relation
17 to restitution and community service.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
19 Secretary will read the last section.
20 THE SECRETARY: Section 9. This
21 act shall take effect on the first day of
22 November.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
5470
1 roll.
2 (The Secretary called the roll.)
3 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
5 is passed.
6 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
7 873, by Senator Maziarz, Senate Print 6865, an
8 act to amend the State Administrative Procedure
9 Act, in relation to guidance documents.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
11 Secretary will read the last section.
12 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
13 act shall take effect on the 90th day.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
15 roll.
16 (The Secretary called the roll.)
17 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
19 is passed.
20 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
21 884, by Senator Levy, Senate Print 2884, an act
22 to amend the Executive Law and the Estates,
23 Powers and Trusts Law.
5471
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
2 Secretary will read the last section.
3 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
4 act shall take effect immediately.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
6 roll.
7 (The Secretary called the roll.)
8 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
10 is passed.
11 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
12 885, by Senator Padavan, Senate Print 3091 -
13 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
15 bill aside.
16 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
17 890, by Senator Marchi, Senate Print 6131, an
18 act to amend Chapter 759 of the Laws of 1973,
19 relating to the transfer of lands.
20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
21 Secretary will read the last section.
22 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
23 act shall take effect immediately.
5472
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
2 roll.
3 (The Secretary called the roll.)
4 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
6 is passed.
7 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
8 892, by Senator Stafford, Senate Print 6585, an
9 act to amend the Executive Law, in relation to
10 towns and villages.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
12 Secretary will read the last section.
13 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
14 act shall take effect immediately.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
16 roll.
17 (The Secretary called the roll.)
18 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
20 is passed.
21 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
22 893, by Senator Kuhl, Senate Print 6738, an act
23 in relation to authorizing the conveyance of a
5473
1 permanent easement.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
3 Secretary will read the last section.
4 THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This
5 act shall take effect immediately.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
7 roll.
8 (The Secretary called the roll.)
9 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
11 is passed.
12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
13 899, by Senator Marcellino, Senate Print 6904,
14 an act to amend the Environmental Conservation
15 Law, in relation to importation.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
17 Secretary will read the last section.
18 THE SECRETARY: Section 13. This
19 act shall take effect January 1.
20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
21 roll.
22 (The Secretary called the roll.)
23 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41.
5474
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
2 is passed.
3 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
4 933, by Senator Present, Senate Print 6854 -
5 SENATOR SMITH: Lay it aside.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
7 bill aside.
8 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
9 934, by Senator Leibell, Senate Print 6859, an
10 act to amend the General Municipal Law, in
11 relation to the approval of urban renewal plans.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
13 Secretary will read the last section.
14 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
15 act shall take effect immediately.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
17 roll.
18 (The Secretary called the roll.)
19 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41.
20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
21 is passed.
22 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
23 935, by Senator Hoblock, Senate Print 6936, an
5475
1 act to amend the General Municipal Law, in
2 relation to allowing for the use of fire
3 training centers.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
5 Secretary will read the last section.
6 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
7 act shall take effect immediately.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
9 roll.
10 (The Secretary called the roll.)
11 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
13 is passed.
14 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
15 937, by Senator Rath, Senate Print 6966, an act
16 to amend the Real Property Tax Law, in relation
17 to administrative review of assessments.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
19 Secretary will read the last section.
20 THE SECRETARY: Section 6. This
21 act shall take effect on the second day of
22 January.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
5476
1 roll.
2 (The Secretary called the roll.)
3 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
5 is passed.
6 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
7 963, by Senator Velella, Senate Print 7097, an
8 act to amend -
9 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
11 bill aside.
12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
13 972, by Senator Trunzo, Senate Print 7043, an
14 act to amend the Education Law and the
15 Retirement and Social Security Law, in relation
16 to loans to members.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
18 Secretary will read the last section.
19 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This
20 act shall take effect immediately.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
22 roll.
23 (The Secretary called the roll.)
5477
1 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
3 is passed.
4 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
5 973, by Senator Trunzo, Senate Print 7108, an
6 act to amend the Retirement and Social Security
7 Law, in relation to retirement benefits.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
9 Secretary will read the last section.
10 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
11 act shall take effect immediately.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
13 roll.
14 (The Secretary called the roll.)
15 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
17 is passed.
18 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
19 977, by Senator Maziarz, Senate Print 6191, an
20 act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in
21 relation to increasing penalties.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
23 Secretary will read the last section.
5478
1 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
2 act shall take effect on the first day of
3 November.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
5 roll.
6 (The Secretary called the roll.)
7 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
9 is passed.
10 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
11 978, by Senator Maziarz, Senate Print 6192, an
12 act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in
13 relation to the offense of operation.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
15 Secretary will read the last section.
16 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This
17 act shall take effect on the first day of
18 November.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
20 roll.
21 (The Secretary called the roll.)
22 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
5479
1 is passed.
2 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
3 979, by Senator DeFrancisco, Senate Print 6247,
4 an act to amend the Navigation Law, in relation
5 to the operation of a vessel.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
7 Secretary will read the last section.
8 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
9 act shall take effect immediately.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
11 roll.
12 (The Secretary called the roll.)
13 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
15 is passed.
16 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
17 980, by Senator Levy, Senate Print 6609, an act
18 to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in
19 relation to the commission of a predicate
20 felony.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
22 Secretary will read the last section.
23 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
5480
1 act shall take effect on the first day of
2 September.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
4 roll.
5 (The Secretary called the roll.)
6 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
8 is passed.
9 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
10 981, by Senator Spano, Senate Print 7251, an act
11 to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in
12 relation to the effect of a prior out of state
13 conviction.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
15 Secretary will read the last section.
16 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
17 act shall take effect immediately.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
19 roll.
20 (The Secretary called the roll.)
21 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
23 is passed.
5481
1 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
2 983, by Senator Wright, Senate Print 7338, an
3 act to amend -
4 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
6 bill aside.
7 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
8 1031, by Senator Larkin, Senate Print 5572-A, an
9 act to amend the Local Finance Law, in relation
10 to the period of probable usefulness.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
12 Secretary will read the last section.
13 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
14 act shall take effect immediately.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
16 roll.
17 (The Secretary called the roll.)
18 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
20 is passed.
21 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
22 1096, by Senator Libous, Senate Print 4420-C, an
23 act to amend the Penal Law, in relation to
5482
1 parole for certain sex offenders.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
3 Secretary will read the last section.
4 THE SECRETARY: Section 2.
5 This -
6 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
8 bill aside.
9 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
10 1098, by Senator Velella, Senate Print 4715, an
11 act to amend the Penal Law, in relation to arson
12 in the first degree.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
14 Secretary will read the last section.
15 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
16 act shall take effect on the 30th day.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
18 roll.
19 (The Secretary called the roll.)
20 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 41.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
22 is passed.
23 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
5483
1 1100, by the Senate Committee on Rules, Senate
2 Print 5494-A, an act to amend the Criminal
3 Procedure Law and the Public Authorities Law, in
4 relation to peace officer status.
5 SENATOR LEICHTER: Lay it aside.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
7 bill aside.
8 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
9 1115, by Senator Present, Senate Print 7032, an
10 act to amend the Public Housing Law, in relation
11 to creating the town of Allegany Housing
12 Authority.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
14 Secretary will read the last section.
15 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
16 act shall take effect immediately.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
18 roll.
19 (The Secretary called the roll.)
20 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
22 is passed.
23 Senator Skelos, that completes
5484
1 the calling of the controversial calendar. We
2 do have a report of the Finance Committee at the
3 desk. What's your pleasure?
4 SENATOR SKELOS: Please, if we
5 would return to reports of standing committees,
6 please read the report of the Finance Committee.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: We'll
8 return to the order of reports of standing
9 committees.
10 I'll ask the Secretary to read
11 the report of the Senate Finance Committee.
12 THE SECRETARY: Senator Stafford,
13 from the Committee on Finance, reports the
14 following bills directly to third reading:
15 Senate Print 7578, by the Senate Committee on
16 Rules, an act making appropriations for the
17 support of government;
18 Senate Print 7579, by the Senate
19 Committee on Rules, an act making appropriations
20 for the support of government.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
22 objection, all bills are directed directly to
23 third reading.
5485
1 Senator Skelos.
2 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
3 if we could take up the controversial calendar.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
5 Secretary will read the controversial calendar
6 beginning with Calendar Number 314, by Senator
7 Holland.
8 THE SECRETARY: On page 7,
9 Calendar Number 314, by Senator Holland, Senate
10 Print 213, an act to amend the Penal Law, in
11 relation to the validity of a license to carry
12 or possess a pistol.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
14 Skelos.
15 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
16 at this time on Calendar Number 314, would you
17 please recognize Senator Maziarz for the purpose
18 of voting.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
20 Secretary will read the last section.
21 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
22 act shall take effect on the first day of
23 November.
5486
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
2 roll.
3 (The Secretary called the roll.)
4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
5 Maziarz, how do you vote?
6 SENATOR MAZIARZ: I vote in the
7 affirmative, Mr. President.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
9 Maziarz will be recorded in the affirmative.
10 The roll call is withdrawn. We're on debate on
11 Calendar Number 314.
12 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
14 Holland, an explanation of Calendar Number 314
15 has been asked for by the Acting Minority
16 Leader, Senator Paterson.
17 SENATOR HOLLAND: Senator, you,
18 of course, know this bill. It is introduced in
19 this house every year and passes this house
20 every year since either before or mid-Gene
21 Levy's term. What it does is try to make the
22 state one state, an equal and fair situation
23 with the carrying of licensed firearms.
5487
1 You know today that if you are
2 issued a licensed -- license to carry a firearm
3 in the city of New York, you can carry that in
4 any county in the state, but if you, on the
5 other hand, are issued a license to carry a
6 pistol, et cetera, in any of the 57 counties
7 outside of the state of New York, you cannot
8 carry that in the city of New York unless it is
9 in a locked box in your trunk and you do not
10 stop. I consider this unfair and many, many
11 other people do as well.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
13 Paterson.
14 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, Mr.
15 President.
16 When I first came to the Senate,
17 this was actually one of my favorite debates
18 that Senator Gold and Senator Levy used to have,
19 and they would always talk about the times that
20 Senator Levy's wife was unable to bring her gun
21 to New York City. So in that spirit, if Senator
22 Holland would yield for a question.
23 SENATOR HOLLAND: Yes, sir. This
5488
1 is not one of your favorite debates anymore; is
2 that the idea?
3 SENATOR PATERSON: Well, I'm just
4 hoping, Senator Holland, that you and I can live
5 up to the standard that our predecessors have
6 set.
7 SENATOR HOLLAND: Certainly, sir.
8 SENATOR PATERSON: I wanted to
9 ask you as I'm sure a person who is an advocate
10 for a certain amount of control that local
11 governments would have why there would not be a
12 greater understanding of New York City's desire
13 to control the firearms that come into the
14 city? We love for people all around the state
15 to come to New York City, to come to shows, to
16 come to see the historic and cultural value that
17 New York City offers. We just kind of, in the
18 way that Wyatt Earp did, want everybody to check
19 their guns at the door, so to speak, and make
20 sure that only those individuals who had permits
21 within the City, or licensed law enforcement
22 would have that prerogative, and since it is
23 something that the local government has asked
5489
1 for among the states, since it is something that
2 Mayor Koch, Mayor Dinkins and Mayor Giuliani
3 have continued to advocate for, I just don't
4 understand why we continue to debate this bill
5 when it's clear that the residents of the City
6 have spoken and the residents of the City would
7 rather not have firearms being carried on the
8 premises.
9 SENATOR HOLLAND: Senator, I do
10 agree with you on the local control issue.
11 However, I -- people who have licensed -
12 licenses to carry pistols are not the people
13 that cause any problems, whether it's in the
14 city of New York or in the upstate 57 counties,
15 you know, and we've gone over this many times,
16 that anybody who applies for a pistol license
17 cannot get it for at least three months,
18 probably six months and their fingerprints must
19 go to the FBI. They must be checked out with
20 BCI, mental health. They must take a safety
21 course. Even in Rockland County they must have
22 a letter from their spouse of whether they
23 object to having the weapon carried, the license
5490
1 issued or not.
2 These people do not cause the
3 problems regardless of where they are, Senator,
4 and if they do, we have every bit of information
5 on them and we will take their weapon away from
6 them and never let them carry a weapon again,
7 and these are not the weapons that are causing
8 any problem in the city of New York or Buffalo
9 or Syracuse or wherever. Those weapons are
10 unlicensed and come from out of the state of New
11 York for the most part.
12 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, Mr.
13 President.
14 If Senator Holland would continue
15 to yield.
16 SENATOR HOLLAND: Yes, sir.
17 SENATOR PATERSON: Senator, your
18 point is -- is correct, and in an overwhelming
19 amount of cases involving crimes that are
20 committed with firearms, you are absolutely
21 right, and I wouldn't want to mislead you or
22 anyone else into thinking that we believe that
23 the individuals who have licenses around the
5491
1 state are causing the problems in New York City
2 or contributing to any criminality or violent
3 crime in the City.
4 What we are simply saying is that
5 New York City as a local government has a set of
6 standards, a set of standards that varies from
7 other parts of this state. In fact, the issue
8 about the spouse writing a letter is something
9 that I don't believe exists in New York City,
10 and there are probably some standards that New
11 York City has set that may not be consistent
12 with policy all around the other 57 or so
13 counties around the state.
14 What we are saying is that the
15 point that you made, the stringent standard, the
16 three- to six-month waiting list for the other
17 requirements are something that are taken very
18 seriously, and the City has delineated what the
19 City believes to be the standard, again
20 supported by all three of our last mayors, going
21 back to 1977, that we would have this standard,
22 and we would just hope that other counties
23 around the state would understand that that's
5492
1 something in a city as large as New York City
2 that we would like to maintain.
3 The final question I just would
4 have for you is, you know, just relating to the
5 similarity of this desire that the City has with
6 the desires of other local governments around
7 the state that we vote for all the time. Do you
8 see the similarity?
9 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
10 Paterson and Senator Holland, if you would
11 excuse for a moment an interruption, I would
12 just like to recognize Senator Johnson.
13 SENATOR JOHNSON: Thank you, Mr.
14 President.
15 I would just like to say that
16 this is a good bill. This bill has my support
17 as in the past. We should have one standard for
18 the state. We are a state, the united state of
19 the United States, and that provincialism is
20 sometimes overdone in the name of local
21 government.
22 Mr. President, at this time I
23 would also like you to recognize a group of high
5493
1 school students from the 4th Senate District in
2 my "Senate For a Day" program. They're here to
3 observe the proceedings, and I'm sure it will be
4 a very enlightened afternoon to them.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Thank
6 you, Senator Johnson, and it's our pleasure also
7 to welcome the students here to witness the
8 deliberations on this bill today.
9 Welcome to the state Capitol.
10 Excuse the interruption, Senator
11 Paterson and Senator Holland.
12 Senator Paterson, you have the
13 floor.
14 SENATOR HOLLAND: Senator, I do
15 agree with local control and I buy your
16 argument. On the other hand, would you think it
17 fair if the county of Westchester or the county
18 of Rockland or the county of Orange where many
19 of the major highways go, such as the Palisades
20 and the New York State Thruway go north out of
21 the city of New York, if they implemented the
22 same law that wouldn't allow licensed pistol
23 holders from the city of New York to carry their
5494
1 weapons in our counties; do you think that would
2 be fair?
3 I think this is a situation where
4 it should be a statewide law, and I learned
5 recently, Senator, that the reason this came
6 about in the first place is not the money
7 because the City charges $150 for the license
8 and the upstate charges are much less, but many
9 years ago, the people of the city of New York
10 used to go to the upstate counties and get their
11 licenses very quickly, very cheaply and then
12 carry them back into the city of New York.
13 That's why this was originated originally.
14 Today's it's much, much
15 different. Our judges won't give a license to
16 carry almost ever, and this is -- should be a
17 statewide bill. I certainly -- it's certain
18 that you agree that you wouldn't like
19 Westchester, Rockland or Orange to limit your
20 people in carrying weapons through our
21 counties.
22 SENATOR PATERSON: You're asking
23 me to yield for the question, Senator?
5495
1 SENATOR HOLLAND: No. I just
2 made a statement, Senator.
3 Thank you.
4 SENATOR PATERSON: No. I would
5 be happy it answer that. I think that -- I
6 understand the problem that individuals who are
7 licensed to carry firearms would come -- or
8 carry pistols would come into New York City on a
9 regular basis and it would be difficult.
10 Perhaps they're traveling. They can carry the
11 pistol in other counties of the state and maybe
12 they are forced due to business, investigators
13 from the Attorney General's Office or something
14 and they're now coming to New York City, that
15 there's a problem because once they cross the
16 line that they're in violation.
17 What I thought, Senator, is that
18 we had a remedy for those types of situations
19 where if they can show that there's a high
20 standard of a need or a use, that they could
21 still apply to have a permit when they come into
22 New York City.
23 In answer to your question about
5496
1 what the other localities are fairly or unfairly
2 determining, I think that it would be something
3 that is within the scope of the locality's
4 purview because the whole existence of weapons
5 and firearms in this society is one that is very
6 controversial.
7 There are good points to be made
8 on both sides as you have done in this debate,
9 Senator, and therefore, if that's what the
10 counties of Westchester, Rockland and Orange
11 County are -- are suggesting, then that's what
12 I'll do, and I'll promise you right here,
13 Senator, I will never carry a firearm in
14 Rockland County.
15 SENATOR HOLLAND: Thank you.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Any
17 other Senator wish to be heard on this bill?
18 (There was no response.)
19 Read the last section.
20 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
22 Paterson.
23 SENATOR PATERSON: May we have a
5497
1 slow roll call on this?
2 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Slow
3 roll call has been asked for. The Secretary
4 will call the roll.
5 THE SECRETARY: Senator Abate.
6 SENATOR ABATE: No.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Read the
8 last section.
9 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
10 act shall take effect on the first day of
11 November.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The
13 Secretary will call the roll and will the
14 Sergeant-at-Arms please get the members into the
15 chamber. Slow roll call.
16 THE SECRETARY: Senator Alesi.
17 (Affirmative indication)
18 Senator Babbush. Senator Babbush
19 excused.
20 Senator Bruno.
21 (Affirmative indication)
22 Senator Connor.
23 (There was no response.)
5498
1 Senator Cook.
2 SENATOR COOK: Yes.
3 THE SECRETARY: Senator
4 DeFrancisco.
5 (There was no response.)
6 Senator DiCarlo.
7 SENATOR DiCARLO: Aye.
8 THE SECRETARY: Senator
9 Dollinger.
10 (There was no response.)
11 Senator Espada.
12 SENATOR ESPADA: No.
13 Senator Farley.
14 SENATOR FARLEY: Aye.
15 THE SECRETARY: Senator Gold.
16 (There was no response.)
17 Senator Gonzalez excused.
18 Senator Goodman.
19 SENATOR GOODMAN: No.
20 THE SECRETARY: Senator Hannon.
21 (There was no response.)
22 Senator Hoblock.
23 SENATOR HOBLOCK: Yes.
5499
1 THE SECRETARY: Senator Hoffmann.
2 SENATOR HOFFMANN: Explain my
3 vote.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
5 Hoffmann to explain her vote.
6 SENATOR HOFFMANN: Thank you, Mr.
7 President.
8 I share the sentiment expressed
9 earlier by Senator Johnson on this issue. I too
10 believe that occasionally provincialism takes
11 over and -- in the name of local autonomy, and I
12 believe that there are many people in New York
13 State, certainly in the upstate region who
14 believe that they are, in fact, discriminated
15 against and that their local rules are being
16 discriminated against or ignored by the city of
17 New York. I think that it's long overdue that
18 we pass a statewide pistol permit and on behalf
19 of the people of Onondaga, Oneida and Madison
20 Counties, I will vote aye.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
22 Hoffmann in the affirmative. Continue the roll
23 call.
5500
1 THE SECRETARY: Senator Holland.
2 SENATOR HOLLAND: Yes.
3 THE SECRETARY: Senator Johnson.
4 SENATOR JOHNSON: Aye.
5 THE SECRETARY: Senator Kruger.
6 SENATOR KRUGER: No.
7 THE SECRETARY: Senator Kuhl.
8 (There was no response.)
9 Senator Lachman.
10 SENATOR LACHMAN: No.
11 THE SECRETARY: Senator Lack
12 excused.
13 Senator Larkin.
14 (Affirmative indication)
15 Senator LaValle.
16 (There was no response.)
17 Senator Leibell.
18 (There was no response.)
19 Senator Leichter.
20 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. President,
21 just briefly.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
23 Leichter to explain his vote.
5501
1 SENATOR LEICHTER: On the bill.
2 This bill certainly has been aired over the
3 years, but I'm sort of amused when people get up
4 and say, Well, this is one state, and I keep on
5 seeing bill after bill after bill coming out of
6 the Majority which makes different rules for
7 Suffolk and different rules for Rockland and
8 Ulster. Senator Larkin just had a bill about,
9 Well, voting in Ulster is different now. Well,
10 you've got to realize, you know, there's
11 regional differences. There's variations, and
12 so on.
13 We have a very good reason for
14 saying we don't want people who are not licensed
15 by the city of New York to carry guns in the
16 City both for their protection. It always
17 scared me when Gene Levy got up and would say
18 about his wife going to the airport, and so on,
19 and I said God forbid that she ever runs into
20 some of the people in New York City where there
21 would be a confrontation, and so on, because she
22 would really be at risk and, in fact, the
23 statistics show that in many instances, maybe
5502
1 more than 50 percent where somebody who is
2 licensed to carry a gun, a bodega store owner,
3 and so on, tries to protect himself or herself
4 against some thugs, it's the bodega store owner
5 that gets shot.
6 So we have had mayors, Democratic
7 and Republican; we have had police commissioners
8 of every which stripe, Commissioner Bratton
9 being the most recent that says, For God's sakes
10 for the protection of the people of the city of
11 New York and for the protection of people who
12 come from upstate and who are licensed to use a
13 gun upstate may use it perfectly safely and well
14 and properly. It's a different situation in the
15 city of New York. Therefore, for the protection
16 of everyone, we need that special licensing
17 provision. There are, in this instance, as you
18 people argue for your pet little bills,
19 variations, regional differences that you need
20 to recognize.
21 Mr. President, I vote in the
22 negative.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
5503
1 Leichter in the negative. Continue the roll
2 call.
3 THE SECRETARY: Senator Levy.
4 SENATOR LEVY: Aye.
5 THE SECRETARY: Senator Libous.
6 SENATOR LIBOUS: Aye.
7 THE SECRETARY: Senator Maltese.
8 SENATOR MALTESE: Aye.
9 THE SECRETARY: Senator
10 Marcellino.
11 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Aye.
12 THE SECRETARY: Senator Marchi.
13 SENATOR MARCHI: Aye.
14 THE SECRETARY: Senator
15 Markowitz.
16 SENATOR MARKOWITZ: No.
17 THE SECRETARY: Senator Maziarz
18 voting in the affirmative earlier.
19 Senator Mendez.
20 (There was no response.)
21 THE SECRETARY: Senator
22 Montgomery.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
5504
1 Montgomery to explain her vote.
2 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes, Mr.
3 President. I just would like to be on record
4 once again absolutely opposing this notion that
5 we should for reasons that I can never reconcile
6 -- because if you are so fearful of coming into
7 the City that you need a gun, it means that you
8 obviously have the feeling that you're going to
9 have to shoot someone, if you come across the
10 bridge, the -- and the mayor has indicated his
11 opposition.
12 We do know that we already have
13 too many guns on the streets and not only do we
14 have too many guns on the streets, Mr.
15 President, but we have guns in the hands of
16 children, and that is a very big problem, and so
17 if Senator Holland happens to come into New York
18 and he has his pistol, even though he has a
19 license to do it and someone mugs him on the
20 street, takes his gun, he can't -- he's not fast
21 enough to shoot them. They take the gun and now
22 the gun is in the hands of the wrong person, and
23 what do we need with that? He hasn't gained
5505
1 anything and we haven't gained anything in New
2 York City.
3 So I'm opposed to this. It
4 serves no purpose. It does not protect anyone.
5 It is not in anyone's interest and especially it
6 is not in the interest of citizens in New York
7 City.
8 So, Mr. President, I vote no.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
10 Montgomery in the negative. Continue the roll
11 call.
12 THE SECRETARY: Senator Nanula.
13 SENATOR NANULA: No.
14 THE SECRETARY: Senator Nozzolio.
15 SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Aye.
16 THE SECRETARY: Senator Onorato.
17 SENATOR ONORATO: No.
18 THE SECRETARY: Senator
19 Oppenheimer.
20 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: No.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
22 Oppenheimer, how did you vote?
23 SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: Oh, I said
5506
1 no. Sorry. I thought it was loud.
2 THE SECRETARY: Senator Padavan.
3 SENATOR PADAVAN: Yes.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
5 Paterson.
6 SENATOR PATERSON: No.
7 THE SECRETARY: Senator Present.
8 SENATOR PRESENT: Aye.
9 THE SECRETARY: Senator Rath.
10 SENATOR RATH: Aye.
11 THE SECRETARY: Senator Saland.
12 SENATOR SALAND: Aye.
13 THE SECRETARY: Senator Santiago.
14 SENATOR SANTIAGO: No.
15 THE SECRETARY: Senator Seabrook.
16 (There was no response.)
17 Senator Sears.
18 SENATOR SEARS: Aye.
19 THE SECRETARY: Senator Seward.
20 SENATOR SEWARD: Aye.
21 THE SECRETARY: Senator Skelos.
22 SENATOR SKELOS: Yes.
23 THE SECRETARY: Senator Smith.
5507
1 SENATOR SMITH: No.
2 THE SECRETARY: Senator Spano.
3 SENATOR SPANO: Aye.
4 THE SECRETARY: Senator
5 Stachowski.
6 SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Yes.
7 THE SECRETARY: Senator Stafford.
8 SENATOR STAFFORD: Aye.
9 THE SECRETARY: Senator Stavisky
10 excused.
11 Senator Trunzo.
12 SENATOR TRUNZO: Yes.
13 THE SECRETARY: Senator Tully.
14 SENATOR TULLY: Aye.
15 THE SECRETARY: Senator Velella.
16 (There was no response.)
17 Senator Volker.
18 SENATOR VOLKER: Yes.
19 THE SECRETARY: Senator Waldon.
20 (Negative indication)
21 Senator Wright.
22 SENATOR WRIGHT: Aye.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The
5508
1 Secretary will call the absentees.
2 THE SECRETARY: Senator
3 DeFrancisco.
4 SENATOR DeFRANCISCO: Yes.
5 THE SECRETARY: Senator
6 Dollinger.
7 SENATOR DOLLINGER: No.
8 THE SECRETARY: Senator Gold.
9 (There was no response.)
10 Senator Hannon.
11 SENATOR HANNON: Yes.
12 THE SECRETARY: Senator Kuhl.
13 SENATOR KUHL: Yes.
14 THE SECRETARY: Senator LaValle.
15 (There was no response.)
16 Senator Leibell.
17 SENATOR LEIBELL: Aye.
18 THE SECRETARY: Senator Mendez.
19 (There was no response.)
20 Senator Seabrook.
21 (There was no response.)
22 Senator Velella.
23 SENATOR VELELLA: Yes.
5509
1 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO:
2 Results.
3 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 36, nays
4 17.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The bill
6 is passed.
7 Senator Cook.
8 SENATOR COOK: Mr. President, I
9 know that we're breaking with tradition,
10 probably breaking rules, but we do have some
11 visitors from the state of Baden-Wurttemberg,
12 Germany, Rotary -- on a Rotary tour who are in
13 the gallery observing the proceedings today, and
14 I thought it might be appropriate if we could
15 recognize their presence and extend to them a
16 greeting.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: We'll
18 recognize the presence of the constituents of
19 Senator Cook. Hope you'll enjoy your visit to
20 the Capitol today.
21 Senator Padavan.
22 SENATOR PADAVAN: Mr. President,
23 could we reconsider the vote by which Senate -
5510
1 Calendar 691, Senate Bill 4216-A passed
2 earlier? Don't you need the motion? Recall
3 it. All right. Lay it aside for an amendment.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
5 Padavan, that bill is out of the house, but
6 we'll try to get it back for you to be
7 recalled.
8 SENATOR PADAVAN: Thank you.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The
10 Secretary will read Calendar Number 701.
11 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
12 701, by Senator DiCarlo, Senate Print 1984-A -
13 SENATOR COOK: Mr. President.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
15 Cook.
16 SENATOR COOK: Lest our guests
17 wonder why we are being -- having so much
18 levity, I would simply point out that the
19 presiding officer just included half of Germany
20 in my Senatorial District by virtue of the way
21 he introduced you, and that's what -- everybody
22 is quite amused by that.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
5511
1 Cook has a very diverse district, and he will
2 welcome votes from Germany or any place else he
3 can get them. So thank you for being here.
4 The Secretary will continue the
5 calendar.
6 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
7 701, by Senator DiCarlo, Senate Print 1984-A, an
8 act to amend the Executive Law, in relation to
9 qualifications of employment.
10 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: An
12 explanation has been asked for on Calendar
13 Number 701.
14 Senator DiCarlo -- could we
15 please have a little order in the chamber. Ask
16 the members to please take their seats.
17 Senator DiCarlo.
18 SENATOR DiCARLO: Mr. President,
19 this bill prohibits the Division for Youth from
20 employing any direct care staff who's been
21 convicted of felonies and authorizes the
22 director to refuse to employ any direct care
23 staff who has been convicted of a misdemeanor.
5512
1 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Read the
2 last section.
3 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
4 act shall take effect immediately.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Call -
6 Senator Montgomery, do you wish to be
7 recognized?
8 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes, I do.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
10 Montgomery.
11 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Thank you.
12 Mr. President, I am going to vote
13 no on this bill. I think that I may be the only
14 person in the chamber to do so, but I want to
15 explain my vote briefly.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
17 Montgomery, can we interrupt you for a second
18 and read the last section and then we'll
19 recognize you to explain your vote?
20 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Okay.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Read the
22 last section.
23 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
5513
1 act shall take effect immediately.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
3 Montgomery.
4 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Call the
6 roll. I'm sorry.
7 (The Secretary called the roll.)
8 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
9 Montgomery.
10 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes. One, I
11 have voted for this bill in prior legislative
12 sessions because I have knowledge of a program,
13 a particular program. It is in my district and
14 it is also -- it started at the location of some
15 prisons in the state, one of them in Staten
16 Island.
17 It is a program that seeks to
18 rehabilitate prisoners in particular. The
19 primary people involved in the rehabilitative
20 process are former inmates themselves. I have
21 met some of those people, and I have been
22 extremely impressed with the fact of their
23 degree of intelligence and understanding and
5514
1 insight and motivation and commitment to helping
2 people reform themselves, and one of the
3 advantages of having them be a part of the
4 program is that they know more about the
5 personality that they deal with than someone who
6 has never had experience in the ways that they
7 have.
8 So I think it is really -- we are
9 losing a valuable resource when we summarily
10 legislate that they shall never be eligible or
11 this -- a person in that category is not
12 eligible any longer to work with people in this
13 -- in situations as this bill seeks to deal
14 with.
15 So I'm opposed to it. I think
16 that we need to have much more latitude and
17 flexibility, and certainly I think that we
18 should definitely allow for people who have this
19 kind of experience to give -- to share that
20 experience, especially since it's so successful
21 in the programs that I'm aware of.
22 So I vote no.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
5515
1 Montgomery in the negative.
2 Senator Abate to explain her
3 vote.
4 SENATOR ABATE: Yes. Last year I
5 voted against this bill because I felt that it
6 was written so broadly it did not define "direct
7 care". I feel strongly that individuals in DFY
8 that are there for security and supervision
9 purposes should not have prior felony records.
10 However, there are other employees that do not
11 have necessarily direct supervision over the
12 youth and it may not be as relevant to eliminate
13 these employees.
14 I'm also concerned about how
15 broadly it's written if someone was convicted of
16 a felony, possession of drugs 10, 15, 20 years
17 ago and they have been outstanding citizens.
18 They, in fact, provide drug counseling and drug
19 treatment, have redeemed themselves and maybe
20 even received a Certificate of Relief from the
21 courts. This would also eliminate that
22 individual.
23 So while I agree with the intent
5516
1 of the bill that it's important for those
2 positions that are similar to corrections staff
3 in DOCS be free of felony conviction, I believe
4 as the proposed legislation is crafted now, it
5 is much too broad and for those reasons, I
6 cannot support this legislation again this year.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
8 Abate in the negative.
9 Announce the results.
10 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
11 the negative on Calendar Number 701 are Senators
12 Abate, Kruger, Leichter, Montgomery, Paterson
13 and Smith. Ayes 51, nays 6.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The bill
15 is passed.
16 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
17 885, by Senator Padavan, Senate Print 3091, an
18 act to amend the Executive Law, in relation to
19 cooperation between police agencies and the
20 United States Immigration and Naturalization
21 Service.
22 SENATOR PADAVAN: Read the
23 transcript from last year. You think that might
5517
1 suffice? No. I didn't think so.
2 Mr. President, this is a very
3 simple bill. What it says directly is if
4 someone is arrested for committing a crime and
5 the local police or district attorneys suspect
6 that that individual is an illegal alien, that
7 they notify INS for obvious reasons, and that's
8 what the bill does. Nothing more, nothing
9 less.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
11 Paterson.
12 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, Mr.
13 President.
14 If Senator Padavan would yield
15 for a question.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
17 Padavan, will you yield?
18 SENATOR PADAVAN: Yes.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The
20 Senator yields.
21 SENATOR PATERSON: Senator, I did
22 make use of looking at last year's transcript,
23 and we were talking about the Executive Order
5518
1 124, which I'm sure you're familiar with, New
2 York City executive order which has existed back
3 since the days of Mayor Koch, continued by Mayor
4 Dinkins and further continued by Mayor Giuliani,
5 and you cited to me a case in the Bronx in which
6 an individual was not questioned by police after
7 he was found to be selling drugs, and it was a
8 pretty horrible incident that you described, and
9 in this particular case, it was pretty apparent
10 that there was not a check to see whether or not
11 this person was a citizen. In fact, they were
12 an illegal alien, and this is kind of the
13 landmark type of situation that your bill
14 addresses, but in our discussion, you seemed to
15 indicate that the executive order was being
16 amended, and my question is if the executive
17 order was amended, can you show me where it was
18 because as late as May 8th, I have been in
19 contact with the mayor's office and I just can't
20 find where they amended Executive Order 124.
21 SENATOR PADAVAN: All right,
22 Senator. First, the basis of my making that
23 statement to you was a media report which I
5519
1 realize from time to time can be inaccurate, but
2 I will quote the report that I'm reading from.
3 "Mayor Giuliani and Police Commissioner William
4 Bratton met Tuesday to discuss the news report
5 on the Rodriguez case and decided to change
6 current policy in which the police department
7 selectively notifies the Immigration and
8 Naturalization Service about illegal aliens who
9 are picked up on arrests. The aim of the
10 current policy based on a 1989 executive order"
11 -- it goes on to talk about that, which I'm
12 sure you realize. He said, "Giuliani had
13 directed Bratton to meet with INS Regional
14 Commissioner William Slattery to discuss better
15 coordination."
16 So, in effect, what he had done
17 is directed the police commissioner to meet with
18 INS to set up a system of coordination, that
19 when they arrested someone for obviously
20 committing a crime and they suspected that he
21 was an illegal alien, that they would
22 "coordinate" -- quote, "coordinate" with INS.
23 That was my reason for saying that to you,
5520
1 Senator.
2 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, Mr.
3 President.
4 If Senator Padavan would continue
5 to yield.
6 SENATOR PADAVAN: Yes.
7 SENATOR PATERSON: Well, let me
8 put it this way, Senator Padavan. Do you have
9 any information as to whether or not this
10 actually occurred, because I have a question
11 relating to the need for this bill if they
12 actually did that, but I guess I don't have to
13 answer it because you haven't given me any
14 indication that they have actually implemented
15 the amendment for this executive order and not
16 only that, aren't you glad we debated again this
17 year because, if not, you would have gone on
18 believing that news report that's been over a
19 year and now -
20 SENATOR PADAVAN: Senator,
21 whether or not -- may I answer your question?
22 You wish me to answer it? I don't want to
23 interrupt you.
5521
1 Senator, whether or not Executive
2 Order 124 was amended formally or the mayor by
3 direction to his commissioner told him to do
4 something is irrelevant because what we want to
5 do is put in law that irrespective of an
6 executive order that varies with a mayor and is
7 applicable outside the city of New York as well,
8 that we want local law enforcement agencies -
9 many do this as a matter of routine, but we want
10 it in law that they will. That's what
11 distinguishes this from any administrative
12 order.
13 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
15 Paterson.
16 SENATOR PATERSON: If Senator
17 Padavan would continue to yield.
18 SENATOR PADAVAN: Yes.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
20 Padavan yields.
21 SENATOR PATERSON: All right,
22 Senator. What we'll do is we'll talk about the
23 bill. I just thought it was good that we
5522
1 debated it again this year because perhaps Mayor
2 Giuliani would like to amend the executive order
3 now which would comply with what is really the
4 thrust of your legislation whether or not it
5 becomes law this particular year. That's why I
6 thought I might point it out.
7 Now, on the bill itself, if the
8 Senator would yield.
9 SENATOR PADAVAN: Yes.
10 SENATOR PATERSON: We are talking
11 here, Senator, about individuals who have been
12 arrested for committing crimes. We do have a
13 law now that convicted criminals are
14 investigated as a matter of course to determine
15 whether or not they were citizens at the time of
16 their conviction; is that not correct?
17 SENATOR PADAVAN: Yes. We have
18 about 4,000 of them in state prisons at the
19 current time, although this governor has begun a
20 process of deportation which is reducing that
21 number, but that is so just as you stated it.
22 SENATOR PATERSON: If the Senator
23 would continue to yield.
5523
1 SENATOR PADAVAN: Yes.
2 SENATOR PATERSON: Then, Senator,
3 the probable cause that might be established
4 that the individual committed a crime relating
5 to their citizenship or the fact that they may
6 be illegal aliens, would you be willing to
7 explain for me what the relationship is? In
8 other words, if a person is arrested for
9 committing a crime, even if we determine that
10 there's a likelihood that they did, even if we
11 come to a subjective determination that they did
12 even though they haven't been convicted, how
13 does it help us during the time we're pursuing
14 the criminal case against them for us to know at
15 that point whether or not they are illegal
16 aliens?
17 SENATOR PADAVAN: Let's go back
18 to the -- how does it -- we know? I'm not
19 sure -
20 SENATOR PATERSON: No. You've
21 outlined in your explanation how we know. I'm
22 saying what is the need for us to know up to the
23 point of -
5524
1 SENATOR PADAVAN: Of conviction.
2 SENATOR PATERSON: -- of
3 conviction?
4 SENATOR PADAVAN: All right,
5 fine. Going back to the Rodriguez case, which
6 was a rather dramatic one, the young man, 20
7 year-old Dominican -- native of the Dominican
8 Republic was arrested for selling drugs. Now
9 he's brought into a court of law for an
10 indictment. The judge, not having been informed
11 of his -- or at least the information that the
12 police had relevant to his immigration status,
13 let him out on low bail or I think it may have
14 been his own recognizance. During the two-week
15 period following that, he killed a police
16 officer by the name of Sean McDonald.
17 Now, if the court had been aware
18 -- there are two things here: Number one, if
19 the court had been aware that he was an illegal
20 alien, I doubt if he would have let him out on
21 bail because obviously that individual was a
22 prime candidate to skip, but more importantly,
23 if this law had been in effect, the police would
5525
1 have been required to contact INS and retention
2 -- detention would have been initiated by INS,
3 and that individual would not have been out on
4 the street and today that police officer would
5 be alive.
6 So that's why it's important that
7 this operative procedure -- that this operative
8 procedure take place upon arrest.
9 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
10 if Senator Padavan would continue to yield.
11 Senator -
12 SENATOR PADAVAN: Yes.
13 SENATOR PATERSON: -- on the
14 issue of the tragic and horrible murder of
15 Officer McDonald, you couldn't be more correct.
16 Had the judge known that this individual was an
17 illegal alien, obviously there would be another
18 procedure and, therefore, what probably would
19 have occurred is that the individual would have
20 been detained. So I accept totally what you're
21 saying and in that particular case, had that
22 been the case, perhaps the police officer's life
23 would have been spared, but what I'm asking you
5526
1 in the process of lawmaking and in drafting this
2 piece of legislation is that the actual way in
3 which we investigate illegal aliens, is that
4 something that you feel should accompany the
5 fact that somebody has been arrested -- which is
6 really a suspicion that the state has taken -
7 that they might have committed a crime?
8 SENATOR PADAVAN: Senator, you
9 are attempting to ask a question that has many,
10 many hooks in it, and I'm not about to bite any
11 of them. The fact of the matter is if someone's
12 arrested for committing a crime, that stands on
13 its own.
14 The second fact of this
15 legislation is that if, as the bill clearly
16 states, there is an indication that this person
17 is in this country illegally, that INS be
18 notified. To me, that's logical. There's
19 nothing in it offensive. It should be done and
20 is done in many instances already. We're simply
21 -- Senator, I don't know if you're listening to
22 me. I don't want to interrupt your counsel.
23 Did you hear what I said? I know it's hard to
5527
1 listen out of two ears. This is happening now
2 in many jurisdictions. We are attempting to
3 preclude anything falling into the cracks. The
4 individual in the case of Sean McDonald who was
5 killed was subject to detention by INS but they
6 weren't notified, so he wasn't detained.
7 Now, that's the genesis of this
8 bill. It's not very complicated. Someone's
9 arrested, they've committed a crime to the
10 extent of an arrest having been implemented.
11 That's when this kicks in, not before.
12 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you,
13 Senator.
14 On the point of the specifics of
15 this particular bill, I think you are -- you've
16 made a very good point because your bill is
17 restricting itself to the actions of the police
18 and your bill is restricting itself to the
19 arrest, but you do know, Senator, that there are
20 other pieces of legislation, many of which that
21 you have sponsored that go beyond that and go
22 beyond -- go and analyze the duties of other
23 agencies as individuals attempt to receive
5528
1 assistance from those agencies, particularly in
2 the area of education. So all I'm saying to you
3 is -
4 SENATOR PADAVAN: Senator, I
5 don't know what bill you're particularly talking
6 about. We do not restrict in any bill that I'm
7 sponsoring elementary or secondary education for
8 anyone, illegal or legal. So if you're trying
9 to draw some analogies here, they escape me. I
10 would rather that we deal with this bill within
11 the framework and for the reasons that I have
12 presented it.
13 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you,
14 Senator.
15 The area of education I was
16 thinking of was post-secondary education which
17 is one of the areas of education, if I'm not
18 correct, but the -- but what relates to this
19 bill, if we just stay on this particular point
20 is in trying to make sure that where there would
21 actually be a conclusion that might be reached,
22 that there's a probable cause that the use of
23 the immigration process to detain an individual
5529
1 might be a very salient idea in this particular
2 case that we aren't legislating the exception
3 which would have existed in that terrible
4 tragedy that you documented for us earlier and
5 that we are not in the situation where everyone
6 that gets arrested that is presumed by nature of
7 appearance or some language difficulty to be an
8 illegal alien is immediately investigated.
9 SENATOR PADAVAN: What is your
10 question, Senator?
11 SENATOR PATERSON: My question is
12 do you understand that we run the risk by
13 passing that -- this piece of legislation of
14 having that happen in a great number of
15 situations where we do have -
16 SENATOR PADAVAN: I'm not quite
17 sure when you're saying "that happen", what are
18 you referring to?
19 SENATOR PATERSON: What that is
20 is the assumption that an individual, due to
21 their appearance or some language difficulty or
22 something that might be common to individuals
23 who are not born or reared in the United States
5530
1 of America, that they may not be American
2 citizens because it's very possible that they
3 are.
4 SENATOR PADAVAN: That would be
5 unreasonable, Senator, and the bill specifically
6 uses the word "reasonably". Your -- the picture
7 you paint in my view is unreasonable,
8 particularly in the city of New York.
9 SENATOR PATERSON: All right.
10 That's very good, Senator. If that's
11 unreasonable, then would you give me the
12 criteria by which the individual who is being
13 arrested would be examined; and that would be my
14 last question. I would just like to know what
15 it is that would set the standard since we're
16 not taking anything that's not reasonable. What
17 is it that defines whether or not there should
18 be some intervention on the part of the
19 Immigration and Naturalization Service to
20 determine whether or not this person is a
21 citizen?
22 SENATOR PADAVAN: Senator, we
23 could probably debate or discuss by the hour the
5531
1 phrase "reasonable", but even a non-lawyer like
2 myself is aware of the fact that that phrase,
3 "reasonable" is found in many, many of our
4 criminal statutes and "reasonable" is reasonable
5 by definition.
6 Now, is "reasonable" abused? I'm
7 sure on occasion it is. Is "reasonable"
8 generally followed? I would say most of the
9 time it is, but if you read the bill, there are
10 specific requirements or procedures for a
11 verification process that could be done very
12 quickly by the police if they reasonably suspect
13 the individual is an illegal alien. So -- and
14 that's in lines 19 and beneath it.
15 So what I'm saying to you,
16 Senator, I cannot define in every conceivable
17 configuration or instance of every kind of
18 arrest that could exist in this state and apply
19 the word "reasonable" for you by definition, but
20 I know what reasonable is. You know what
21 reasonable is, and I think our law enforcement
22 agencies -- I don't think. I know -- they know
23 what reasonable is and, therefore, I think we
5532
1 have to be guided accordingly.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
3 Paterson.
4 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you,
5 Senator Padavan.
6 Mr. President, on the bill.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
8 Paterson on the bill.
9 SENATOR PATERSON: We do have
10 federal law that guides us in this particular
11 area. We have a court case in 1928, Pyler v.
12 Doe. We have another which seems to very much
13 upset Senator Padavan, but we have a standard
14 that does exist in terms of these situations.
15 It's been raised and brought to
16 my attention a concern that has been brought
17 forth by a number of individuals who work in
18 western New York. They're farm workers. They
19 travel back and forth within that particular
20 area, and there's a feeling that they have been
21 arrested a number of times for charges that were
22 never sustained. Immediately upon their arrest,
23 there was some inquiry as to determine whether
5533
1 or not they were citizens, and all I'm trying to
2 describe is that what Senator Padavan seems to
3 feel is unreasonable and what may actually be
4 unreasonable does actually happen at times where
5 people who are American citizens are harassed
6 for reasons -- for reasons of their resemblance
7 to a different national origin, their
8 familiarity with a language that is foreign to
9 that of English which is spoken by Americans but
10 is also spoken by individuals who are citizens
11 of the United States and that there is a concern
12 on the part of these individuals that as
13 American citizens, they be treated with the full
14 respect and with the full dignity of other
15 Americans, and that in spite of the fact that
16 Senator Padavan illustrated to us a horrible
17 situation in which had there been INS
18 intervention, there might be a police officer
19 still serving us and still among his family to
20 this day.
21 What we're saying is that in
22 legislating to that end, we just want to make
23 sure that there is not undue harassment of
5534
1 individuals who are citizens and -
2 SENATOR PADAVAN: Mr. President,
3 would Senator Paterson yield to a question?
4 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
5 Paterson, will you yield to a question?
6 SENATOR PATERSON: Most
7 certainly, Senator.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
9 Padavan.
10 SENATOR PADAVAN: I'm not
11 familiar with the specifics of the case you
12 referred to of immigrant laborers, but I will
13 ask you this question: If any local law
14 enforcement agency had arrested these workers
15 for reasons other than were valid, would not
16 that local law enforcement agency be subjected
17 to action either by the U.S. Attorney or the
18 state Attorney General? Let me put it another
19 way. Would they, in fact, have been violating
20 the law themselves?
21 SENATOR PATERSON: Senator, in
22 that particular case -- and I'm very happy that
23 you would take an interest in it because other
5535
1 than that, you know, your bill, particularly -
2 the type of situation you're addressing in your
3 bill is quite valid. In that particular case,
4 there would certainly be an unwillingness or a
5 refusal or certainly an apprehension on the part
6 of those who had been injured to perhaps come
7 forward and report these types of situations.
8 I'm not going to represent to you that this is
9 the policy of a law enforcement agency anywhere
10 in the state.
11 SENATOR PADAVAN: Let me ask you
12 hypothetically. Would not their civil rights
13 have been violated if such a scenario had taken
14 place?
15 SENATOR PATERSON: Yes.
16 SENATOR PADAVAN: So, in other
17 words, you are using an illegality to justify
18 our not acting on something that is reasonable,
19 and I think that logic fails us, Senator. We
20 cannot be guided by the illegal actions of
21 anyone.
22 SENATOR PATERSON: Senator, what
23 I am trying to demonstrate to you is that there
5536
1 is a danger, and the fact that a situation is
2 illegal does not mean that we should be
3 precluded in this chamber from recognizing that
4 it might exist. That's why I was just saying a
5 moment ago that I am not going to tell you that
6 this is the policy of any law enforcement
7 organization in the state.
8 What I'm saying is that it may
9 very well be the actions of a few, and it always
10 is a very few, but under the protections of our
11 democracy and in writing legislation, I would
12 think that we would be sensitive to the fact
13 that there are abuses that do take place and
14 there are sometimes excessive use of power by
15 those who are authorized to administer it, and
16 that this kind of thing perhaps has happened.
17 It would be a lot easier if, as
18 you suggested, the individuals who feel they
19 have been victimized by it come forward, but as
20 long as I'm representing to you that it has
21 happened in some instances, I think that we
22 would be sensitive to it in our legislation and
23 wouldn't ignore the fact that it could be
5537
1 happening based on the fact that the individuals
2 who were afflicted didn't report it. It may be
3 an illegality, but the logic in it is that more
4 than an illegality, it's a danger that we're
5 opening the door to individuals who don't
6 deserve to be harassed.
7 And since Senator Padavan, by his
8 silence, implies consent, I guess I'll rest.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
10 Waldon -- Senator Waldon.
11 SENATOR PADAVAN: Are you asking
12 me to yield?
13 SENATOR WALDON: Thank you very
14 much, Mr. President. On the bill.
15 When I was a young man -- a young
16 boy, actually, we moved to Brooklyn around 1943,
17 and not too long after that, I had a job working
18 in Mr. Levy's delicatessen, and one the
19 beautiful experiences of running errands for his
20 grocery store was that I got to know someone who
21 was a recent immigrant to this country and who
22 was a very positive and caring human being and
23 who took a liking to me, and he marveled at what
5538
1 America meant to someone who had escaped from
2 the boot or the heel of Nazi Germany.
3 My second job was with a
4 gentleman named Percival Jones, and these were
5 all errand running jobs. I delivered the tailor
6 work, cleaning at his cleaning store and
7 basically made a couple of dollars in tips and
8 things like that so that my brothers and I could
9 go to a place called The Comet, which was a
10 movie theatre on Gates and Reid where you could
11 see 21 cartoons and a cowboy picture for a
12 dime. That's a long time ago, but Mr. Jones had
13 recently come to this country from Jamaica West
14 Indies, and he also marveled at what a nice
15 place this was that someone who had recently
16 arrived could own his own business, could be an
17 employer of people, not me, because I wasn't
18 truly an employee at that time, but could have
19 an opportunity to become somebody in a land that
20 was not the place of his origin.
21 Some years later in the garment
22 industry, I worked for a man named George
23 Nockdigal at an embroidery factory, and I can
5539
1 remember in front of those hot stoves -- I don't
2 know if anyone knows about embroidery work, but
3 there's a pattern and the ladies and gentlemen
4 would sew the pattern through the paper, and
5 you'd put it into an oven and it would heat up
6 and the paper would become easily removable by
7 just rubbing -- rubbing the garments, and I did
8 that for a whole summer, and the son of George
9 Nockdigal would tell me about how his father
10 explained to him what it was on the other side
11 when things were very, very tough, and to come
12 to America and then to own a business in the
13 garment district was a quantum leap from his
14 past.
15 What I'm trying to say with all
16 of this is that there was a time when this
17 nation opened its arms to everybody despite
18 color, despite place of origin, despite language
19 and said, Come here. We have a place for you,
20 and not that this bill specifically addresses
21 the concern that I raised with my remarks, but I
22 believe it is part and parcel of a philosophy
23 that I find troublesome, worrisome and
5540
1 meddlesome, and so I encourage you to do what
2 you have to do on this bill, but to recognize
3 that a restrictive exclusionary philosophy, in
4 my opinion, is un-American.
5 Thank you very much, Mr.
6 President, my colleagues.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Read the
8 last section.
9 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
10 act shall take effect on the 30th day.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Call the
12 roll.
13 (The Secretary called the roll.)
14 THE SECRETARY: Ayes -- those
15 recorded in the negative on Calendar Number 885
16 are Senators Connor, Espada, Markowitz,
17 Montgomery, Paterson, Santiago, Smith and
18 Waldon. Ayes 49, nays 8.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The bill
20 is passed.
21 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
22 933, by Senator Present, Senate Print 6854, an
23 act to amend the General Municipal Law, in
5541
1 relation to economic development zones.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
3 Smith.
4 SENATOR SMITH: Would the sponsor
5 be kind enough to give us an explanation of this
6 bill?
7 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
8 Present, will you yield for an explanation?
9 SENATOR PRESENT: Sure. Senator
10 Smith, under -- under existing law, if a
11 business wants to move into an economic
12 development zone, the municipality that houses
13 that business must hold a public hearing, post
14 it, take the testimony and go through the
15 procedures of a public hearing which is
16 expensive for the village and troublesome to the
17 business. All this bill does is delete the
18 public hearing portion.
19 SENATOR SMITH: Thank you.
20 I've spoken to some people who
21 sit on town boards and come from small towns and
22 villages, and it's my understanding that the
23 cost of placing an ad in the newspaper would be
5542
1 approximately 10 to $15 in most of these local
2 areas. Would that be accurate?
3 SENATOR PRESENT: I don't know.
4 I haven't placed a public notice in a long time.
5 SENATOR SMITH: Well, this is
6 according to some of the people that sit on the
7 boards in these areas, and the only concern that
8 I have -- on the bill, Mr. President.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
10 Smith, on the bill.
11 SENATOR SMITH: -- is that we're
12 willing to give up a public benefit and the
13 rights of people to have a say in what takes
14 place for 10 to $15, and I think that's too much
15 to pay. I believe that people should have a
16 right to have public comment, especially on
17 something as important as moving companies from
18 one place to another, especially when it has
19 been proven that most of these companies are not
20 hiring new people but just moving jobs from one
21 place to another into an EDZ.
22 Thank you.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Read the
5543
1 last section.
2 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
3 act shall take effect immediately.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Call the
5 roll.
6 (The Secretary called the roll.)
7 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 56, nays 1,
8 Senator Smith recorded in the negative.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The bill
10 is passed.
11 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
12 963, by Senator Velella, Senate Print Number
13 7097, an act to amend the Insurance Law, in
14 relation to the holding of meetings.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Read the
16 last section.
17 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
18 act shall take effect immediately.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Call the
20 roll.
21 (The Secretary called the roll. )
22 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 57.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The bill
5544
1 is passed.
2 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
3 983, by Senator Wright, Senate Print 7338, an
4 act to amend Chapter 3 of the Laws of 1993.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Read the
6 last section.
7 Senator Wright, explanation is
8 being asked for.
9 SENATOR WRIGHT: Thank you, Mr.
10 President.
11 The bill before the Senate this
12 afternoon extends the provisions that we enacted
13 in 1993 to comply with what's referred to as the
14 Solomon amendment in conformance of state
15 statute with federal statute extending mandatory
16 suspension of drivers' licenses upon conviction
17 of certain drug-related offenses.
18 Annually for the past several
19 years we have extended this provision and
20 enacted it in state statute to ensure compliance
21 with the federal statutes and to secure receipt
22 of federal assistance, this year to the tune of
23 42 million -- excuse me, $43 million in federal
5545
1 highway aid linked to the state's conformance
2 with the federal requirements.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
4 Paterson.
5 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, Mr.
6 President.
7 If Senator Wright would yield for
8 a question.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
10 Wright, would you yield?
11 SENATOR WRIGHT: Yes I would, Mr.
12 President.
13 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you.
14 Senator Wright, do you know how much it would
15 cost to implement this procedure that we have
16 before us?
17 SENATOR WRIGHT: No, Senator, I
18 do not know the cost of implementation because
19 it is, in fact, implemented now. We have had
20 this statute on the books since 1993, so the
21 cost of implementation at the time I'm not aware
22 of, but it is in effect, in place now.
23 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, Mr.
5546
1 President.
2 The reason I'm asking the
3 question is that I wondered if it would not be
4 prudent for us to find out how much it costs if
5 we're going to be extending this legislation in
6 light of the fact that 31 states have opted out
7 of it, and we have the option of passing
8 resolutions in the Senate and the Assembly and
9 having it signed by the Governor.
10 Now, this is a remedy that we
11 would have if we don't want to lose the money in
12 federal highway assistance from the government.
13 The reason that I would think that we might do
14 this is because, as I see it, there is no nexus
15 between the actual crime and the punishment in
16 this case which is withdrawing someone's
17 license.
18 Certainly, the crime is serious
19 and the punishment has been serious as it's
20 prescribed under the criminal law. What I'm
21 saying is that it's very hard to vote against
22 this piece of legislation because inevitably
23 there can be made the relationship between an
5547
1 individual under the use of some substance
2 driving an automobile and injuring an innocent
3 party, and certainly the thought of that is very
4 frightening and any way that we would want to
5 thwart that, we should undertake.
6 The question is whether or not
7 this legislation is somewhat speculative and
8 remote to the actual process. Where is the
9 offense related to the operation of a motor
10 vehicle where a person who perhaps as a younger
11 person makes a mistake early in their life,
12 they've paid their debt to society, they've
13 sought counseling for their substance abuse
14 problem, they now would be unable to operate a
15 motor vehicle because of this conviction in the
16 past.
17 At the same time, they might
18 become one of many who abuses alcohol and can
19 drive a car, as people do all the time; and so
20 the point is not that the spirit of the
21 legislation is in any way flawed, but that the
22 actual law that we would be passing bears no
23 relationship, as I see it, to the crime that the
5548
1 individual has committed.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Read the
3 last section.
4 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
5 act shall take effect immediately.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Call the
7 roll.
8 (The Secretary called the roll. )
9 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
10 the negative on Calendar Number 983 are Senators
11 Connor, Mendez, Paterson and Smith. Excuse me.
12 Those recorded in the negative on Calendar 983
13 are Senators Connor, Paterson and Smith. Ayes
14 54, nays 3.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The bill
16 is passed.
17 Senator Mendez.
18 SENATOR MENDEZ: Mr. President, I
19 was out of the chambers when two roll calls were
20 taken, and I want the record to reflect that if
21 I would have been here, I would have voted "no"
22 on 314 and "no" on Calendar Number 885.
23 Thank you.
5549
1 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Without
2 objection.
3 Senator Mendez, without
4 objection, the record will indicate if you had
5 been in the chamber you would have been recorded
6 in the negative on Calendar Number 314, and also
7 the record will indicate, without objection,
8 your opposition to 885.
9 SENATOR MENDEZ: Thank you.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The
11 Secretary will continue the calendar.
12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
13 1096, by Senator Libous, Senate Print 4420-C, an
14 act to amend the Penal Law, in relation to
15 parole for certain sex offenders.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Read the
17 last section.
18 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
19 act shall take effect on the 1st day of
20 November.
21 THE SECRETARY: Call the roll.
22 (The Secretary called the roll. )
23 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 57.
5550
1 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The bill
2 is passed.
3 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
4 1100, by the Senate Committee on Rules, Senate
5 Print 5494-A, an act to amend the Criminal
6 Procedure Law and the Public Authorities Law.
7 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. President.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
9 Leichter.
10 SENATOR LEICHTER: Yes, Mr.
11 President, on the bill.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
13 Leichter, on the bill.
14 SENATOR LEICHTER: Yes. This
15 relates to the Javits Convention Center which is
16 in my district.
17 I think, as we all know from
18 newspaper reports, and the Senate actually had a
19 hearing on the Center, there have been some
20 serious problems at the Center in its
21 management. There have been allegations that
22 there was mob influence. There certainly seems
23 to be no question that the costs for an
5551
1 exhibition at the Convention Center seem to be
2 unreasonably high.
3 The Governor seems to have taken
4 some steps that maybe has made that Convention
5 Center more competitive. Actually, I had a lot
6 of questions and doubts, both as to the person
7 that he appointed and as to this way of
8 proceeding. I felt that the best way would have
9 been really to try to hire a private firm to
10 operate the Convention Center.
11 Well, I really haven't had any
12 special knowledge on it, but based on first
13 reports, other reports, there seem to be some
14 improvements in the Convention Center. The
15 Governor has now asked for a licensing or asked
16 us to approve a licensing system whereby the
17 Convention Center could license contractors,
18 employees, and so on, obviously with a viewpoint
19 of keeping out anybody with mob connections or
20 an unsavory background.
21 I've no problem with that in
22 principle, and I'm going to vote for this bill,
23 but I just want to point out there's some
5552
1 awfully broad powers that are given here to the
2 Convention Center which I think could be worri
3 some or could be used in a manner to break labor
4 unions, to really give the management or the
5 employer, if you will, such extreme powers, and
6 I just want to point out to you some of the
7 language that I think could be somewhat
8 troublesome.
9 In Section 5, "the corporation
10 board may refuse to issue or renew or may
11 suspend or revoke a license," and it goes on to
12 say if it finds out that the applicant or the
13 licensee that is participating in activities at
14 the Convention Center would be "inconsistent
15 with the public interest or the best interests
16 of the corporation".
17 That's awfully broad. It means
18 really that they can deny a license to anybody
19 for any reason that they want to or they could
20 revoke a license for anybody. Maybe somebody's
21 organized and maybe somebody has a fight with a
22 shop steward. His license can be revoked and,
23 while there's a provision for due process
5553
1 hearings, since this is a standard it's an
2 awfully broad standard.
3 And it goes on -- then in another
4 instance, it says the -- in the due process
5 hearing, "the corporation board shall not be
6 bound by the rules of evidence." Here again, I
7 think that's an unwise grant. I think all of us
8 certainly want to root out organized crime
9 wherever it is or any criminal activity, and we
10 certainly don't want it to impede economic
11 development activities such as the Convention
12 Center, and I think as I stated before that some
13 additional powers given to the corporation that
14 runs the Javits Center, a public benefit
15 corporation, is appropriate, but I think this
16 goes really beyond, I think, the powers that are
17 legitimate and reasonably given.
18 I'm going to vote for it because
19 I don't want anybody to say that I did anything
20 that impeded the fight against organized crime
21 and I think all of us certainly want to see that
22 any criminal activity is rooted out, but I just
23 say that this is really part of the trend that
5554
1 we've seen, particularly in this session where
2 bills that deal with issues that may be really
3 quite legitimate are written so broadly and give
4 such vast powers to law enforcement agencies or
5 to the government, that they really impinge on
6 individual liberties, and it always surprises me
7 that it comes from people in a party that says,
8 We want to assert and we want to protect the
9 rights of the individual. We don't want
10 government to take over. Then you write these
11 bills that give all of these super-powers to
12 governmental agencies, in this instance the
13 Javits Convention Center.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Read the
15 last section.
16 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This
17 act shall take effect immediately.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Call the
19 roll.
20 (The Secretary called the roll. )
21 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 57.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The bill
23 is passed.
5555
1 Senator Marcellino.
2 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Yeah, Mr.
3 President. May we please take up Calendar
4 Number 1222, Senate 7578, which has just been
5 reported from the Finance Committee.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO:
7 Secretary will read Calendar 1222.
8 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
9 1222, by the Senate Committee on Rules, Senate
10 Print 7578, an act making appropriations for the
11 support of government.
12 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Is there a
13 message of necessity and appropriation at the
14 desk?
15 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Yes,
16 there is.
17 SENATOR MARCELLINO: I move to
18 accept the messages of necessity and
19 appropriation.
20 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: All
21 those in favor signify by saying aye.
22 (Response of "Aye.")
23 Opposed nay.
5556
1 The messages are accepted.
2 Senator Marcellino.
3 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Please read
4 the last section.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Read the
6 last section.
7 THE SECRETARY: Section 6. This
8 act shall take effect immediately.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Call the
10 roll.
11 (The Secretary called the roll. )
12 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 56, nays
13 one, Senator -
14 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr.
15 President.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The
17 negatives please raise their hands, Calendar
18 Number 1222, Senate 7578.
19 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
20 the negative on Calendar Number 1222 are Senat
21 ors Alesi, DiCarlo, Dollinger, Hoffmann, Libous,
22 Nozzolio and Oppenheimer. Ayes 50, nays 7.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The bill
5557
1 is passed.
2 Senator Marcellino.
3 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Yes, Mr.
4 President. May we please take up Calendar
5 Number 1223, Senate Number 7579.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO:
7 Secretary will read Calendar Number 1223.
8 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
9 1223, by the Senate Committee on Rules, Senate
10 Print 7579, an act making appropriations for the
11 support of government and to amend Chapter 63 of
12 the Laws of 1996.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
14 Marcellino.
15 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr.
16 President, are there any messages of necessity
17 and appropriation at the desk?
18 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: There's
19 a message at the desk.
20 SENATOR MARCELLINO: I move to
21 accept the messages of necessity and
22 appropriation.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: All
5558
1 those in favor signify by saying aye.
2 (Response of "Aye.")
3 Opposed nay.
4 (There was no response.)
5 The messages are accepted. Read
6 the last section.
7 THE SECRETARY: Section 12. This
8 act shall take effect immediately.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Call the
10 roll.
11 (The Secretary called the roll. )
12 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 57.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: The bill
14 is passed.
15 Mr. President -
16 SENATOR HOFFMANN: Could we -
17 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
18 Hoffmann.
19 SENATOR HOFFMANN: Yes, since we
20 just had bills reported directly to the floor
21 for votes, I'd like to just clarify for several
22 of my colleagues, if I could please, the two
23 bills that were just passed, the "no" votes that
5559
1 you recorded, the vote on the pay bill for the
2 Governor and the Legislature, what is the number
3 on that bill, and do you have "no" votes
4 recorded for that one?
5 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
6 Marcellino.
7 SENATOR MARCELLINO: If the desk
8 could provide that answer to Senator Hoffmann,
9 we'd appreciate it.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
11 Hoffmann, Senate 7578, Calendar 1222.
12 SENATOR HOFFMANN: 7578, you have
13 "no" votes recorded on that bill which provides
14 $646,000 for salaries and Social Security
15 payments for the Governor, Lieutenant Governor,
16 Comptroller, Attorney General and members of the
17 Legislature for the May 29 payroll?
18 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: That's
19 correct.
20 SENATOR HOFFMANN: That is
21 correct, and I along with several of my
22 colleagues are reported -- in the upstate
23 conservative caucus are recorded in the negative
5560
1 on that calendar.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: You are
3 recorded in the negative.
4 SENATOR HOFFMANN: Thank you, Mr.
5 President, for that clarification.
6 Senator Marcellino. Senator
7 Wright?
8 SENATOR WRIGHT: I request to be
9 recorded in the negative on Calendar 1222 and
10 Senate 7578.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Without
12 objection, you will be recorded in the
13 negative.
14 Senator Marcellino.
15 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr.
16 President, there will be -- I am so pleased to
17 find out that we have an upstate conservative
18 caucus in this chamber, and Senator DiCarlo has
19 joined it.
20 Are there any -- is there any
21 housekeeping at the desk, sir?
22 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Yes,
23 there is.
5561
1 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Can we take
2 that up now, please.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Senator
4 Farley.
5 SENATOR FARLEY: Thank you, Mr.
6 President.
7 On page 29 I offer the following
8 amendments to Calendar Number 817, Senate Print
9 5792, and I ask that that bill retain its place
10 on the Third Reading Calendar. That's on behalf
11 of Senator Norman Levy.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO:
13 Amendments are received.
14 SENATOR FARLEY: On behalf of
15 Senator Maltese, on page 32, I offer the
16 following amendments to Calendar 854, Senate
17 Print 4723, and I ask that that bill retain its
18 place.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO:
20 Amendments received.
21 SENATOR FARLEY: On behalf of
22 myself, wait a second -- on behalf of himself, I
23 wish to star these three bills: Sponsor star,
5562
1 Calendar 1190, Senate Print 6265; Calendar
2 Number 1192, Senate Print 7271; Calendar 991,
3 Senate Print 7374.
4 On behalf of Senator Levy, Mr.
5 President, I wish to call up his bill, Print
6 Number 331, which was recalled from the Assembly
7 which is now at the desk.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO:
9 Secretary will read.
10 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
11 41, by Senator Levy, Senate Print 331, an act to
12 amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law.
13 SENATOR FARLEY: I now move to
14 reconsider the vote by which this bill was
15 passed.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Call the
17 roll on reconsideration.
18 (The Secretary called the roll on
19 reconsideration. )
20 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 57.
21 SENATOR FARLEY: Mr. President, I
22 now offer the following amendments.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO:
5563
1 Amendments received.
2 SENATOR FARLEY: On behalf of
3 Senator Padavan, Mr. President, I wish to call
4 up his bill, Senate Print 4216-A.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO:
6 Secretary will read.
7 SENATOR FARLEY: Which is
8 recalled from the Assembly.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO:
10 Secretary will read.
11 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
12 691, by Senator Padavan, Senate Print Number
13 4216-A, an act to amend the Penal Law, in
14 relation to auto stripping.
15 SENATOR FARLEY: Mr. President, I
16 now move to reconsider the vote by which this
17 bill passed.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Call the
19 roll on reconsideration.
20 (The Secretary called the roll on
21 reconsideration. )
22 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 57.
23 SENATOR FARLEY: I now offer the
5564
1 following amendments.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO:
3 Amendments are received.
4 Any other housekeeping?
5 (There was no response. )
6 Senator Marcellino.
7 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr.
8 President, there being no further business, I
9 move we adjourn until Wednesday, May 22nd, at
10 11:00 a.m. sharp.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT SPANO: Motion
12 of Senator Marcellino, the Senate will stand
13 adjourned until Wednesday, May 22nd.
14 (Whereupon at 4:45 p.m., the
15 Senate adjourned. )
16
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