Regular Session - April 14, 1997
2803
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9 ALBANY, NEW YORK
10 April 14, 1997
11 3:08 p.m.
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14 REGULAR SESSION
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18 LT. GOVERNOR BETSY McCAUGHEY ROSS, President
19 STEPHEN F. SLOAN, Secretary
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2804
1 P R O C E E D I N G S
2 THE PRESIDENT: The Senate will
3 come to order.
4 Would everyone please rise and
5 join with me in the Pledge of Allegiance.
6 (Whereupon, the assemblage joined
7 in the Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag.)
8 The invocation today will be
9 given by Reverend Peter G. Young from Blessed
10 Sacrament Church in Bolton Landing.
11 Reverend Young.
12 REVEREND PETER G. YOUNG: Let us
13 pray.
14 We pray today for all New York
15 State people and that their wealth and their
16 power might become a force for peace rather than
17 conflict, a source of hope rather than
18 discontent, an agent of friendship rather than
19 enmity.
20 May the actions of this Senate,
21 then, set the example for the citizens of our
22 state.
23 THE PRESIDENT: Amen.
24 Thank you.
25 The reading of the Journal.
2805
1 THE SECRETARY: In Senate,
2 Sunday, April 13. The Senate met pursuant to
3 adjournment. The Journal of Saturday, April 12,
4 was read and approved. On motion, Senate
5 adjourned.
6 THE PRESIDENT: Without
7 objection, the Journal stands approved as read.
8 Presentation of petitions.
9 Messages from the Assembly.
10 Messages from the Governor.
11 Reports of standing committees.
12 Reports of select committees.
13 Communications and reports from
14 state officers.
15 Motions and resolutions.
16 Senator Farley.
17 SENATOR FARLEY: Thank you, Madam
18 President.
19 On behalf of Senator Volker,
20 would you please place a sponsor's star on
21 Calendar Number 349.
22 THE PRESIDENT: So ordered.
23 SENATOR FARLEY: On behalf of
24 Senator Kuhl, Madam President, on page 20, I
25 offer the following amendments to Calendar 494,
2806
1 Senate Print 2705, and I ask the bill retain its
2 place on the Third Reading Calendar.
3 THE PRESIDENT: So ordered.
4 SENATOR FARLEY: On behalf of
5 Senator Levy, Madam President, I wish to call up
6 his bill, Senate Print -- no, Assembly Print
7 Number -- no. It's Print Number 928A, which was
8 recalled from the Assembly, which is now at the
9 desk.
10 THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary
11 will read.
12 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
13 326, by Senator Levy, Senate Print 928A, an act
14 to amend the Railroad Law and the Penal Law.
15 SENATOR FARLEY: I now move to
16 reconsider the vote by which this bill was
17 passed.
18 THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary
19 will call the roll on reconsideration.
20 (The Secretary called the roll on
21 reconsideration.)
22 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 40.
23 THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
24 before the house.
25 Senator Farley.
2807
1 SENATOR FARLEY: I now offer the
2 following amendments.
3 On behalf of Senator Maltese, I
4 wish to call up his bill, Print Number 1219,
5 which was recalled from the Assembly, which is
6 now at the desk.
7 THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary
8 will read.
9 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
10 174, by Senator Maltese, Senate Print 1219, an
11 act to amend the Election Law.
12 SENATOR FARLEY: I now wish to
13 reconsider the vote by which this bill passed.
14 THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary
15 will call the roll on reconsideration.
16 (The Secretary called the roll on
17 reconsideration.)
18 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 40.
19 THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
20 before the house.
21 Senator Farley.
22 SENATOR FARLEY: Madam
23 President. I now offer the following
24 amendments.
25 THE PRESIDENT: Amendments on
2808
1 both bills received.
2 Secretary will read.
3 THE SECRETARY: On page 28,
4 Senator Johnson moves to discharge from the
5 Committee on Higher Education Assembly Bill
6 Number 937 and substitute it for the identical
7 Third Reading Calendar 576.
8 THE PRESIDENT: Substitution
9 ordered.
10 Senator Skelos.
11 SENATOR SKELOS: Madam President,
12 there will be an immediate meeting of the
13 Transportation Committee in Room 328 of the
14 Capitol.
15 THE PRESIDENT: There will be an
16 immediate meeting of the Transportation
17 Committee in Room 328.
18 SENATOR SKELOS: Madam President,
19 may we please take up Privileged Resolution
20 1019, sponsored by Senator Montgomery, and ask
21 that it be read in its entirety, and move for
22 its immediate adoption.
23 THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary
24 will read.
25 THE SECRETARY: By Senators
2809
1 Waldon and Montgomery, Legislative Resolution
2 congratulating the Long Island University
3 Basketball Team and Coach Ray Haskins on their
4 outstanding season and on winning the 1997
5 Northeast Conference Championship.
6 Whereas, excellence and success
7 in competitive sports can be achieved only
8 through strenuous practice, team play and team
9 spirit, nurtured by dedicated coaching and
10 strategic planning; and
11 Whereas, athletic competition
12 enhances the moral and physical development of
13 these young people of this state preparing them
14 for the future by instilling in them the value
15 of teamwork, encouraging a standard of healthy
16 living, imparting a desire for success, and
17 developing a sense of fair play and competition;
18 and
19 Whereas, the Long Island
20 University Basketball Team is the 1997 Northeast
21 Conference Champion; and
22 Whereas, the athletic talent
23 displayed by this team is due in great part to
24 the efforts of Coach Ray Haskins, a skilled and
25 inspirational tutor, respected for his ability
2810
1 to develop potential into excellence.
2 The team's overall record is
3 outstanding and the team members were loyally
4 and enthusiastically supported by family, fans,
5 friends and the community at large.
6 The hallmarks of the Long Island
7 University Basketball Team from the opening game
8 of the season to participation in the
9 championship were a brotherhood of athletic
10 ability, of good sportsmanship, of honor and of
11 scholarship, demonstrating that these team
12 players are second to none.
13 Athletically and academically,
14 the team members have proven themselves to be an
15 unbeatable combination of talents, reflecting
16 favorably on their school.
17 Coach Ray Haskins has done a
18 suburb job in guiding, molding and inspiring the
19 team members toward their goals; and
20 Whereas, sports competition
21 instills the values of teamwork, pride and
22 accomplishment, and Coach Ray Haskins and 11
23 outstanding athletes have clearly made a
24 contribution to the spirit of excellence which
25 is a tradition of their school; now, therefore,
2811
1 be it
2 Resolved, that this Legislative
3 Body pause in its deliberations to congratulate
4 the Long Island University Basketball Team; its
5 members: Corey Goodall, Dave Masciale, Shawn
6 Browne, Charles Jones, Richie Parker, Mike
7 Campbell, Jason Cragan, Matt Picinic, Omar
8 Noureddine, Karim Smith, Johnnie Drew, Coach Ray
9 Haskins, Assistant Coaches Julius Allen, Wendell
10 Saunders, Joe Palermo and Khalid Green; Athletic
11 Directors Alan Chaves and Margaret Alaimo;
12 Trainers Said Hamdan and Jayne Kitsos; Sports
13 Information Director Greg Fox; and Managers
14 Nicole Johnson, Jerri Hedrington and Ekwah
15 Haskins, on their outstanding season of overall
16 team record; and be it further
17 Resolved, that a copy of this
18 resolution, suitably engrossed, be transmitted
19 to the Long Island University Basketball Team
20 and to Coach Ray Haskins.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
22 Montgomery, did you wish to speak on the
23 resolution?
24 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: I'll yield
25 to Senator Waldon.
2812
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
2 Montgomery yields to Senator Waldon.
3 Senator Waldon, on the
4 resolution.
5 SENATOR WALDON: Thank you very
6 much, Mr. President.
7 I really appreciate your
8 kindness, Senator Montgomery.
9 There was a time in my life when
10 nothing counted as much as basketball. As a
11 teenager growing up in Brooklyn and playing for
12 Boys High School, there was nothing that I would
13 not sacrifice for to play that game.
14 My mother was concerned because
15 she thought I didn't eat too much. That is now
16 a thing of the past. My father was concerned
17 because he didn't think I concentrated
18 sufficiently on my books.
19 And being as poor as we were -
20 being as poor as we were, they saw the key to my
21 escaping Patchen Avenue in Brooklyn as
22 education. But I had the dream that every young
23 African-American has and had at that time to
24 play ball at a higher level; and though I did
25 not realize my dream as well as Lenny Wilkins,
2813
1 who was my partner and is now my son's God
2 father and I am his daughter's Godfather, or
3 Tommy Davis, who went on to play great baseball,
4 or Frank Thomas, who is the head of the Ford
5 Foundation, but because of the discipline and
6 friendships developed during that experience, my
7 life has been helped tremendously.
8 New York, for all too long, has
9 been devoid of a team which could capture the
10 imagination as did the Knicks in '69 and '70 and
11 '72 and '73 or as City College did with the
12 Grand Slam in '50 and '51 or St. John's during
13 its heyday or even St. Francis College at one
14 time so many years ago, or LIU under Clair Bee
15 in the '40s, when he was considered along with
16 Hank Iba and others to be one of the great
17 basketball minds of this country.
18 But this year -- this year
19 basketball was resurrected in New York City.
20 This year, a group of young men under the
21 leadership of Ray Haskins created history. They
22 resurrected basketball for LIU, and they
23 resurrected the spirit of those who live the
24 game.
25 I saw seven games in person and
2814
1 one on TV. Each game left me sitting on the
2 edge of my seat. Each game required that I take
3 Gelucel or whatever it is that you take to calm
4 your stomach, because even though the team won
5 almost all of those games, the way they won
6 sometimes made Al Waldon a nervous wreck, but I
7 want to tell you that the excitement of watching
8 Dave Masciale and Mike Campbell, Richie Parker,
9 Charlie Jones, Shawn Browne and even Omar
10 Noureddine and Karim Smith, who are here -- did
11 I get all of the names, fellas? Did I miss
12 anybody? I don't think I missed anyone who is
13 here. The excitement -
14 Seabrook says I missed him but
15 I've always missed him. The excitement of those
16 games did good for my heart, because it allowed
17 me to vicariously return to the streets of
18 Brooklyn in the early '50s, late '50s. These
19 young men and their coach under the tutelage of
20 the Provost of the school, Mrs. Haynes, have
21 given us a spirit in Brooklyn that is so nice to
22 be a part of.
23 And so, it was with this spirit
24 that Senator Montgomery and Assemblyman Green
25 and I decided that we had to do something to
2815
1 recognize them. We brought the West Pointers in
2 here. We brought other people here who have
3 achieved significantly, from the state of New
4 York. These young men made all of us happy,
5 brought all of us pride and showed us that
6 someone can meld together a group of young men,
7 in a sense, in terms of focus and achievement
8 that is magnificent to behold.
9 So I am privileged and honored to
10 be the person along with others who sponsored
11 this resolution and to be a part of this
12 experience. It made me a happier person this
13 past year, and I am sure that this is just the
14 beginning. So I'm considering buying a portable
15 television to put in my office so that whenever
16 LIU plays anywhere in the country I will be able
17 to follow those games.
18 Ray, my brother, you did it. To
19 each of the players, you did it.
20 Now, let me tell you just about
21 three of the players who are here. Richie
22 Parker, tremendous jumper. You wouldn't think a
23 kid 6'-4" could jump the way he does. But he
24 has hops similar to anybody in the NBA, and he
25 showed us that tenacity and courage and
2816
1 commitment to the game proves that you can be a
2 winner.
3 Dave Masciale has the biggest
4 heart I've every seen for a man less than 6'-5"
5 tall. This kid from Hoboken ran through brick
6 walls in order to ensure that the team had
7 success while on the floor. Tremendous leader.
8 And Charles Jones. You've heard
9 of Dr. "J". You've heard of "Clyde, the
10 Glide". You've heard of Michael Jordan. Get
11 ready for the future, ladies and gentlemen,
12 because we have a kid who, athletically and his
13 understanding of the game, is art and poetry in
14 motion. I saw him do some things that in a 360
15 sense -- those of you who understand the game,
16 "helicopter moves 360" -- that I've not seen
17 any other human being do. He is a pleasure to
18 watch. He is a super, super player. And we
19 have in our chamber today, the highest scorer in
20 the nation this past year in NCAA ball, Division
21 I, a kid from Brooklyn.
22 So let's put our hands together,
23 please, for the Long Island University
24 Basketball Team, led by Charles Jones, Richie
25 Parker, Dave Masciale, Mike Campbell, Shawn
2817
1 Browne, et al, et al, et al, Coach Haskins and
2 our dear Provost Haynes.
3 Please.
4 (Applause)
5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
6 Montgomery, did you wish to speak on the
7 resolution?
8 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
10 Montgomery, on the resolution.
11 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Thank you,
12 Mr. President. I rise to join my colleague who
13 has the advantage that I don't have of having a
14 very personalized relationship with the coach as
15 well as the game, but I certainly do have a very
16 good and what I believe to be very positive
17 relationship with Long Island University which
18 is about a block and a half from my district
19 office. There are many great things about LIU,
20 including the fact that we have an African
21 American woman who is the provost there, Provost
22 Gail Haynes, who is here with us today, along
23 with one of the Deans from the school who is
24 also an African-American woman. So that is
25 something to be especially proud of for a major
2818
1 university in our state.
2 We also know that the state has
3 invested in LIU because last year -- we have a
4 particular investment. Last year we were able
5 to provide some assistance to the university for
6 a new building that has already gone up. I have
7 visited that building several times. It's the
8 new health professions building, I believe.
9 And, in fact, I serve on an advisory committee
10 for the nursing program which is supposed to be
11 giving some support and direction for the
12 development of new nursing careers which will be
13 offered at that university.
14 And, in fact, Long Island
15 University is one of the major adult education
16 centers in the borough of Brooklyn and I dare
17 say in the city of New York which has a large
18 number of people who are returning to school or
19 they are going to school for the first time to
20 receive any number of opportunities, including
21 certificates in various fields and as well as
22 degrees in other fields. There are large
23 numbers of women there, Caribbean-Americans,
24 African-Americans, Latinos and others.
25 And so I'm very, very proud of
2819
1 the legacy and the contribution of Long Island
2 University; and today, of course, is another
3 reason to be exceptionally proud and that is
4 that LIU has brought to us once again a group of
5 young people, bright, young, very, very
6 mannerable, very wonderful young men who are,
7 I'm told, the Blackbirds, who are being
8 recognized by us today, especially because of
9 their outstanding performance this past season.
10 But it is a very, very prideful
11 moment to be able to recognize young African
12 American men, in particular, who are making a
13 contribution to society in a very significant
14 way that goes far beyond their being a member of
15 this team. They do not just represent their
16 team. They represent that university, and they
17 represent what for us in New York State is most
18 important and that is what our future portends
19 as they grow up and go out into the world and
20 hopefully come to take our places.
21 And I want to say, just lastly,
22 to Coach Haskins, you are certainly to be
23 commended because it is not easy to be a person
24 who takes on building character and building
25 "teamship" and building the lives of young
2820
1 people, especially young African-American men in
2 this society.
3 So we thank you not only for your
4 victory as it relates to your team this year but
5 we thank you for the tremendous investment in
6 what New York State needs the most and that is
7 success in bringing young men into the world so
8 that they will be able to provide the leadership
9 that we all wish and hope to look forward to
10 ourselves.
11 Thank you very much, Mr.
12 President.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Is there
14 any other Senator wishing to speak on the
15 resolution?
16 Senator Paterson.
17 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, Mr.
18 President.
19 On behalf of Senator Connor and
20 the entire conference, we would like to thank
21 Senator Waldon and Senator Montgomery for this
22 idea of bringing this resolution forward today.
23 Senator Waldon -- I could not
24 help, Mr. President, hearing him say that there
25 was a thought at one point that basketball was
2821
1 the only thing on his mind as he went on to
2 become a policeman and had a distinguished
3 career beyond that in law enforcement, went to
4 law school and became an attorney, was an
5 outstanding singer, has served in the New York
6 State Assembly, in the New York State Senate,
7 the New York House of Representatives in
8 Congress in Washington, D.C., and also has been
9 a distinguished agency head in this state. I
10 suggest that there must have been a couple of
11 things on his mind while he was thinking about
12 basketball. He is also an accomplished singer,
13 contracted by a major recording industry, and
14 actually gave us the benefit of that earlier
15 this year.
16 So, Senator Waldon is a man with
17 a rare combination of skills, not the least of
18 which were his comments about what Long Island
19 University has done for New York City
20 basketball. He so aptly described the loss of
21 interest that seems to exist and just the thirst
22 in the New York fan to have some of the
23 excitement that was reminiscent of the old City
24 College days or even the old LIU days or the
25 championships of the New York Knicks in 1970 and
2822
1 '73, and I think that really was the catalyst
2 for this resolution because Senator Waldon, as
3 he so aptly put it, also felt that need to have
4 some excitement in the basketball community, and
5 I agree with him.
6 Personally, I lost interest in
7 basketball since the day I was cut from the
8 Nets; and since then, I tried to really find
9 something that inspired me, and Coach Ray
10 Haskins and all the players at LIU, who were
11 under tremendous scrutiny from the press and
12 tremendous public pressure, flourished under
13 that and had a tremendous basketball season.
14 I thought it was interesting that
15 the conference championship that was won when
16 Charles Jones drove to the basket that,
17 commenting later, Coach Haskins said that was
18 the only time that year that LIU had run that
19 play. So it's interesting that sometimes at
20 some of the most important moments some of the
21 most creative situations are developed, and I
22 think this was an important time in the history
23 of LIU as they have shown the rest of the
24 basketball college community that some of the
25 most difficult situations are actually an
2823
1 immense opportunity to flourish and to
2 demonstrate how athletics can become something
3 that is more than just playing games on a field
4 or on a court but becomes an opportunity to
5 build the human character and enhance the human
6 condition.
7 And so, I would like to thank LIU
8 for all they've done and all the players and
9 coaches for all they've done, and Senator Waldon
10 for bringing it before us so that we could give
11 you really the prompt and deserving congratula
12 tions that you have so richly earned.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
14 Seabrook, on the resolution.
15 SENATOR SEABROOK: Mr. President,
16 it's certainly a good day today. Being an
17 alumnus of LIU makes me very proud to be here
18 for this occasion, but I think it's also good to
19 have the opportunity to compliment the Provost
20 for having the courage and the will to give
21 people a second chance, because that's what LIU
22 is all about, opportunities and second chance;
23 and certainly the Coach, Ray Haskins, should be
24 commended for following in the footsteps of
25 Benjamin Mays, making men over at LIU; and
2824
1 certainly to the team that has risen to the
2 occasion to have a sense of camaraderie and
3 esprit de corps to allow you to excel.
4 And I was so proud to have the
5 only team in New York State participating in the
6 NCAA finals -- or in the NCAA. They're Finals
7 next time; right? But in the tournament, the
8 only New York team. Syracuse and all the other
9 ones didn't make it. LIU was the only New York
10 team.
11 So certainly, today, we're
12 honored to have you here and with a tremendous
13 amount of success, and the future is certainly
14 beyond, and we're looking forward, Al, so in the
15 Final Four we will be there with LIU.
16 Congratulations.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Is there
18 any other Senator wishing to speak on the
19 resolution?
20 Hearing none, the question is on
21 the resolution.
22 All those in favor, signify by
23 saying aye.
24 (Response of "Aye.")
25 Opposed, nay.
2825
1 (There was no response.)
2 The resolution is adopted.
3 Senator Waldon. Senator Waldon,
4 I'll control the applause. Thank you.
5 Coach Ray Haskins and members of
6 the team, we're very, very honored you chose to
7 come and spend some of your lifetime with us, a
8 few minutes with us. We're very pleased at your
9 successes.
10 We wish you the very best in your
11 stay here in Albany, and may you have a
12 wonderful life in the years ahead. Thank you
13 for coming and joining us.
14 Please stand and be recognized by
15 the members.
16 (Applause)
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
18 Skelos.
19 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President.
20 If we could take up Privileged Resolution 1020,
21 sponsored by Senator Libous, I would like to
22 have the title read and move for its immediate
23 adoption.
24 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
25 Secretary will read the title to Resolution
2826
1 Number 1020, by Senator Libous.
2 THE SECRETARY: By Senator
3 Libous, Legislative Resolution 1020, honoring
4 Wendy C. Loomis upon the occasion of her
5 designation by Broome County Chamber of Commerce
6 as the first Small Business Advocate of the
7 Year.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
9 question is on the resolution.
10 All those in favor, signify by
11 saying aye.
12 (Response of "Aye.")
13 Opposed, nay.
14 (There was no response.)
15 The resolution is adopted.
16 Senator Skelos.
17 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President.
18 I believe Resolution 780 is at the desk,
19 sponsored by Senator Cook. May we please have
20 it read in its entirety.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
22 will read the Resolution 780, previously adopted
23 by this body, by Senator Cook, in its entirety.
24 THE SECRETARY: By Senator Cook,
25 Legislative Resolution 780, commending five
2827
1 students upon the occasion of their designation
2 as recipients of the first "American Dream
3 Awards, School-to-Work Scholarships" and
4 honoring three teachers for their commitment to
5 our youth.
6 Whereas, it is the sense of this
7 Legislative Body that work force development and
8 lifelong learning are synonymous with economic
9 prosperity in this state; and
10 Whereas, parents, educators and
11 representatives of the business community must
12 be engaged as partners at both the state and
13 local level in discussions to establish the
14 academic standards necessary to best prepare
15 students for the careers of tomorrow; and
16 Whereas, resources must be
17 aligned to assure that all students have access
18 to educational opportunities which prepare them
19 for the workplace of the 21st century.
20 Students must be prepared for the
21 broadest range of career options to enable them
22 to enter and reenter the world of work at
23 several points during their lifetime.
24 Students must see the relevance
25 of their academic learning to the workplace of
2828
1 today and tomorrow.
2 School-to-work is the bridge to
3 success between high academic learning and
4 productive citizenship; and
5 Whereas, students recognized by
6 the "American Dream Award" have participated in
7 school-to-work and are themselves better
8 prepared to be among tomorrow's productive
9 workers and citizens; now, therefore, be it
10 Resolved, that this Legislative
11 Body pause in its deliberations to commend
12 students Michele Barber of Falconer Central
13 School, Robert Brinskelle of Half Hollow Hills
14 Central School District, Octavio Campos of
15 Wilson Technological Center-Northport Campus,
16 Nyasia Harvey of Rochester City School District,
17 and Sheldon Rankin of Niagara Falls High School,
18 as recipients of the first "American Dream
19 Awards, School-to-Work Scholarship"; and
20 Whereas, teachers and business
21 mentors are significant partners in the
22 School-to-Work experience; now, therefore, be it
23 further
24 Resolved, that Cohoes High School
25 teacher Maria Russo, Greece Central School
2829
1 District teacher Larry Lacy, and business mentor
2 Jack Lyda from Rochester General Hospital, be
3 recognized for their commitment to school
4 to-work principles and practices; and be it
5 further
6 Resolved, that copies of this
7 resolution, suitably engrossed, be transmitted
8 to Cynthia T. Laks and Margarita S. Mayo,
9 co-chairs of the New York State School-to-Work
10 Advisory Council and Michelle Barber, Robert
11 Brinskelle, Octavio Campos, Nyasia Harvey,
12 Sheldon Rankin, Maria Russo, Larry Lacy and Jack
13 Lyda.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Chair
15 recognizes Senator Cook to speak to the
16 resolution.
17 SENATOR COOK: Mr. President,
18 thank you very much.
19 It is a great day here of
20 saluting people for their accomplishments, and
21 we certainly join with all those who are
22 celebrating the success of Long Island
23 University.
24 This resolution celebrates
25 success of a different type. It probably did
2830
1 not make very many headlines. In fact, it may
2 be something that was kind of hidden in the
3 middle of the inside pages even of the hometown
4 newspapers, but it is something that is
5 extremely significant; and that is, that five
6 students of New York State have been chosen for
7 the "American Dream Scholarships" under the
8 National School-to-Work Program.
9 This is a brain child, if you
10 will, of the 1996 Miss America, Shawntel Smith,
11 who, unfortunately, I think, had to leave
12 because she had a plane to catch and, therefore,
13 wasn't able to stay for this part of the
14 tribute.
15 But it is significant that out of
16 40 of these awards made across the country, New
17 York State recipients numbered five and, in
18 addition, we are honoring three teachers or
19 mentors of students who are participating in the
20 School-to-Work Program.
21 This indeed is a wave of the
22 future. It is an effort that we are making to
23 move the education system so that it is in touch
24 with the world of reality, so that students when
25 they graduate from school will, in fact, be
2831
1 ready to go into the workplace and that,
2 furthermore, they will have the skills that will
3 enable them throughout their lifetime to
4 readjust to the career changes that are going to
5 be a part of the life of everyone over the next
6 several decades as our economy, as our society
7 continues to change and to move forward.
8 So I'm very honored to be able to
9 stand today and to, once again, congratulate
10 these winners of the "American Dream
11 Scholarships," people who have shown in their
12 own way a great degree of personal leadership,
13 shown that you have the stuff to make it in this
14 world and, in fact, that you will also be
15 leaders who will help lead your generation, your
16 cohort of our population, as we reach this new
17 millennium that we're entering and as we move
18 into the workplace of tomorrow.
19 I congratulate you personally,
20 and I say this, that you are also the pioneers,
21 the people who are breaking the new ground that
22 other people will follow as our education
23 system, hopefully, begins to catch up with the
24 demands and the needs of this new century.
25 Thank you, Mr. President. I
2832
1 think most of the recipients are with us today
2 in the gallery, and I would be pleased if you
3 would be willing to recognize them.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Is there
5 any other Senator wishing to speak to the
6 resolution?
7 As the Chair previously
8 indicated, the resolution was previously
9 adopted. We'd ask the recipients of the
10 "American Dream Awards" scholarships to rise
11 and be recognized by the body.
12 We welcome you here today,
13 congratulate you on your effort. Good luck in
14 the future.
15 (Applause)
16 Senator Skelos.
17 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
18 if we could return to reports of standing
19 committees, I believe there is a report of the
20 Transportation Committee at the desk. I ask
21 that it be read.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: We will
23 return to the order of reports of standing
24 committees. Secretary will read the report of
25 the Transportation Committee.
2833
1 THE SECRETARY: Senator Levy,
2 from the Committee on Transportation, reports
3 the following bill direct to third reading:
4 Senate Print 4329, by Senator
5 Maltese, an act to amend the Highway Law, in
6 relation to designating a portion of the state
7 highway system as the Jackie Robinson Parkway.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
9 objection, the bill is ordered directly to third
10 reading.
11 Senator Skelos.
12 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
13 at this time, may we please take up Senate 4329,
14 which was just reported from the Transportation
15 Committee.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
17 will read the title.
18 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
19 579, by Senator Maltese, Senate Print 4329, an
20 act to amend the Highway Law, in relation to
21 designating a portion of the state highway
22 system as the Jackie Robinson Parkway.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
24 Maltese, an explanation of Calendar Number 579,
25 which is Senate Print 4329, which has just been
2834
1 reported out of the Transportation Committee,
2 has been requested.
3 SENATOR MALTESE: Mr. President,
4 first of all, I wish to acknowledge that this is
5 an event that is an historic event; and because
6 it is an historic event, I would like to precede
7 my remarks with an indication that all members
8 will be asked if they wish to go on the bill as
9 co-sponsors.
10 SENATOR CONNOR: Explanation
11 satisfactory, Mr. President.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Is there
13 any other Senator wishing to speak on the bill?
14 Senator Waldon, on the bill.
15 SENATOR WALDON: Mr. President,
16 my colleagues.
17 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Excuse
19 me, Senator Waldon.
20 Senator Skelos, why do you rise?
21 SENATOR SKELOS: If I could -
22 and, certainly, any colleague that wishes to
23 speak on this bill, I'm not looking to cut them
24 off. There will be a resolution taken up
25 concerning Jackie Robinson right after this bill
2835
1 is passed and, if members want to speak about
2 Mr. Robinson at that time, fine.
3 But, Senator Waldon, if you wish
4 to speak on the bill, that's fine also.
5 SENATOR WALDON: Thank you very
6 much, Mr. President. Thank you, Senator
7 Skelos.
8 I think what I want to say should
9 be said now. It is not negative or whatever
10 but, you know, I was moved to do it now, so let
11 me do it now.
12 When I was in the fifth grade, I
13 lived at 146 Patchen Avenue in Brooklyn. We had
14 just moved from Halsey Street, between Reid and
15 Patchen, and I had a newspaper route. Mrs.
16 Gardner was my teacher at P.S. 70, where John D.
17 King was the principal. My newspaper route took
18 me along McDonough Street between Patchen and
19 Ralph.
20 Jackie Robinson lived with Rachel
21 and their firstborn three houses in from Mr.
22 Reavis' candy store. I was his newspaper
23 delivery boy, and I was in awe of this man who
24 had so changed the world in terms of the
25 divisive elements which were known in pro sports
2836
1 until the arrival of Jackie Roosevelt Robinson,
2 and he was a nice man. He was very warm with
3 the children in our block. He came over to our
4 assembly, and he spoke to all of us on assembly
5 days telling us the kinds of things that we
6 should do with our lives.
7 But the thing that caught my
8 imagination then even though I couldn't well
9 understand it and has maintained my fascination
10 with Jack Roosevelt Robinson all of my adult
11 life since then is that he was a person who
12 brought people together. Despite the hate that
13 Chapman and other managers around the league
14 foisted upon him, despite the fact that Dixie
15 Walker and other guys on his team would not even
16 speak to him or shake his hand, he took it and
17 he moved forward, trying to get people to work
18 with each other and to be accepting of each
19 other.
20 One of the great moments that I
21 remember from that period of time is that one
22 day we were in Mr. Reavis' candy store, and you
23 have to understand, and you cannot without this
24 information know that Henry Reavis, Mr. Reavis'
25 son was in my fifth grade class, so we used to
2837
1 hang out in Henry's father's store. In came
2 Jackie Robinson, and he bought ice cream cones
3 for all of the kids at that moment. I don't
4 know if you know what a mellow-roll is, but
5 those of you who grew up in Brooklyn remember
6 mellow-roll was different than a scoop of ice
7 cream. All of the kids that Jackie bought the
8 ice cream and the cone for ate theirs in its
9 entirety, except Alton. I was so fascinated
10 with what Jackie had done for me that I ate the
11 ice cream without any way messing up the cone.
12 I took it home. My mother got me a cigar box.
13 I scotchtaped the cone into the cigar box, and I
14 took it to school the next day for Show and
15 Tell, and the class was fascinated with this
16 cone that Jackie Robinson had bought me.
17 I was at the Urban League Dinner
18 in New York City some time ago, and Mrs.
19 Robinson was there with their daughter and their
20 son. Jackie Junior, as you may know, is dead,
21 but David is still alive, and I told her of the
22 story, and she thought it so fascinating she
23 went and got her children and brought them over
24 and had me tell the story again of this kid who
25 was her newspaper boy and what had happened on
2838
1 this day.
2 Mrs. Robinson is very much like
3 her husband. She wants everybody included in
4 everything that she does. If you look at the
5 board that she has for all of her construction
6 projects, if you look at her foundation and what
7 she does in helping children, it is inclusive,
8 not exclusive.
9 I share these thoughts with you
10 because I have a personal knowledge of Jackie
11 Roosevelt Robinson. I have a personal knowledge
12 of Mrs. Robinson, and I would encourage us to
13 follow the life of Jackie in the sense that he
14 was a person who wanted everybody to work
15 together for the betterment of our entire
16 society.
17 I think a lesson can be learned
18 even in this house regarding the life of Jack
19 Roosevelt Robinson, what he stood for and what
20 his wife stands for now. He is a great man. He
21 changed the social fabric of America forever,
22 and I'm pleased to join with Senator Maltese and
23 others in honoring him in regard to naming of
24 the parkway in his name and whatever other
25 praise that we may be able to lend to the name
2839
1 of Jackie Roosevelt Robinson. Truly, not just
2 an African-American, born in Georgia, raised in
3 California, who made his mark through sports but
4 an American who was a giant in terms of causing
5 people to come together. If there is a legacy
6 from Jackie Roosevelt Robinson, it is that he
7 brought people together.
8 Thank you very much, Mr.
9 President. Thank you, my colleagues.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
11 Gold.
12 SENATOR GOLD: Thank you so
13 much.
14 Will Senator Maltese yield to one
15 question?
16 SENATOR MALTESE: Yes.
17 SENATOR GOLD: Senator, I was
18 listening to Senator Waldon's remarks and,
19 unquestionably, if there was one thing that
20 Jackie Robinson stood for, it was inclusion. It
21 has, as he said, changed the fabric of American
22 society.
23 I was wondering -- and this is my
24 question -- when you stood up today, you
25 graciously asked if everybody or anybody was
2840
1 interested in co-sponsoring the bill, and my
2 question is whether or not it's going to be
3 reprinted?
4 Because I say to myself the
5 Robinson family upon what I know will be a lot
6 of pomp and circumstance of the signing of this
7 bill will probably get a pen certificate, and I
8 wonder how they're going to explain to their
9 grandchildren that that pen certificate will
10 have the names of I think it's seven very
11 distinguished white gentlemen, when this Senate
12 has some very distinguished Afro-American
13 gentlemen, some ladies, some people from all
14 different kinds of origins, and Jackie Robinson
15 was a treasure for all of us, and I don't even
16 see anyone from Brooklyn, and I don't think you
17 can mention Jackie Robinson without thinking of
18 Brooklyn.
19 So I was just curious whether or
20 not after the buck slips are in whether there
21 was any intention to reprint the bill?
22 SENATOR MALTESE: Mr. President,
23 in response to the inquiry, I will be speaking
24 to the leadership as to the procedure. But the
25 distinguished Senator from Queens must realize
2841
1 that this was initiated by our distinguished
2 mayor from the city of New York. It was done
3 very quickly and expeditiously. It was done in
4 an atmosphere of good faith and good will.
5 It was only this afternoon that I
6 was made aware that, as is sometimes the custom,
7 it had been circulated only to a few and that we
8 then acted to open it to all, although that is
9 at the time of discussion of the bill somewhat
10 dramatic, if you will, or unusual procedure.
11 In response to the question, I
12 will use my best efforts to see that the bill
13 that is given to those persons who receive
14 copies of the bill includes all the cosponsors.
15 SENATOR GOLD: Mr. President.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
17 Gold.
18 SENATOR GOLD: Yes, I want to
19 thank Senator Maltese for that statement of
20 gracious intent. I do appreciate it.
21 Senator, I would like, though -
22 and I know it's not your fault -- to inform the
23 house that there have been situations such as
24 "Son of Sam" where we were concerned in a
25 matter of time in passing a piece of
2842
1 legislation. We did it 48 hours with bipartisan
2 sponsorship in both houses, and these things
3 seem to be able to work out when they can be
4 worked out.
5 At any rate, I appreciate your
6 remarks, and I think that if we are that
7 concerned for the Robinson family and we are
8 trying to send a message, which we are and I
9 think it is very appropriate -- I don't think
10 there was one human in America yesterday who
11 didn't feel that "Tiger" Woods was the hero of
12 America, and I know that's the feeling that
13 people get when they talk about Jackie
14 Robinson. He belongs to all of us.
15 And I think that if what he stood
16 for is to have true meaning, then the minimum
17 cost of reprinting a one-page bill is worth it
18 so that posterity will see that it was an entire
19 Senate filled with many different kinds of
20 people that supported this legislation.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
22 Montgomery.
23 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Thank you,
24 Mr. President.
25 I just want to say two things.
2843
1 One is to thank Senator Maltese for at least
2 offering to have all members on this legislation
3 and, hopefully, as in following up with Senator
4 Gold's inquiry that in fact will happen.
5 I would certainly hate to see
6 this go down in history without -- not one
7 single African-American on it nor one single
8 person from Brooklyn at least on this
9 legislation, and let me just say that it would
10 be very shameful, I think, to have a person of
11 the stature of Jackie Robinson give his entire
12 life, suffer all kinds of indignities and
13 insults and acts of bigotry and racism quietly
14 just so that he could make a statement on behalf
15 of his people, and for him not to have his -
16 this act that we're doing reflective of his
17 contribution to this society, to all of us in
18 this room and outside and all Americans, I think
19 it would be the grandest insult to him and his
20 life and his legacy.
21 So, Senator Maltese, I appreciate
22 your offering, and I certainly hope that you can
23 correct this today. Thank you very much.
24 Thank you, Mr. President.
25 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Any other
2844
1 Senator wishing to speak on the bill?
2 Senator Paterson.
3 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, Mr.
4 President. Anyone who examines the history of
5 the civil rights movement in this country would
6 probably come to the conclusion that before
7 Martin Luther King there was Jackie Robinson.
8 Before some of the collective struggles that
9 were waged in places like Mississippi and
10 Alabama, there was an individual struggle waged
11 in cities like Brooklyn and St. Louis and
12 Boston, where an individual tried to win
13 acceptance in this country in spite of great
14 ability not having the requisite color that it
15 took to play in major league baseball at that
16 particular time.
17 Jackie Robinson was selected not
18 because he was the best baseball player in the
19 Negro leagues. In fact, it was known he was not
20 one of the best. He was selected because of his
21 personal acumen, his education and his ability
22 to withstand the kind of pressure and the kind
23 of degradation that coming to major league
24 baseball would bring upon him.
25 Jackie Robinson served this
2845
1 country in the military, and there's one piece
2 of his military service that isn't discussed
3 very often. He was court-martialed. He was
4 court-martialed for refusing to sit in the back
5 of a military bus. Does that sound familiar?
6 Does that sound like another American who did
7 that on December 1 of 1954?
8 What we're saying is that Jackie
9 Robinson embodies the efforts of many
10 African-Americans, both the living and the dead,
11 who struggled unremittingly and courageously
12 throughout the centuries to bring together a
13 viable national movement that was directed
14 toward achieving economic, political and social
15 justice, and it wasn't just African-Americans.
16 It was many Asians and whites and Hispanics who
17 fought collectively so that we could sit in this
18 chamber today, looking at each other and
19 noticing that all parts of this state and all
20 people who live within it are represented and
21 that they have the opportunity to even run for
22 office and be a part of this great government
23 here in New York State.
24 And so, while I am thankful for
25 Senator Maltese' graciousness and that he would
2846
1 open this piece of legislation for cosponsor
2 ship, I just happen to notice what Senator
3 Gold's referred to earlier as a list of
4 individuals that were not indicative of the
5 cross-section of this body when I got here this
6 morning. But I did notice that when the
7 Assembly bill that -- seeing that Republican or
8 Democrat, black or white, whichever delineation
9 there was, Brooklyn or Queens or otherwise, that
10 they had members of their body that were
11 represented.
12 How much more foresighted would
13 it have been if the drafters of this legislation
14 had immediately understood the full historical
15 meaning of Jackie Robinson's presence in major
16 league baseball.
17 In 1947, he came to the Brooklyn
18 Dodgers. Interestingly enough, he preceded
19 another baseball player who played in the
20 American League by the name of Larry Doby by
21 only six weeks. Now, Larry Doby is not well
22 known to people around the country but endured
23 the same suffering.
24 So Jackie Robinson, when we honor
25 him, we're really honoring all the people whose
2847
1 names we don't know, whose struggles we could
2 never endure, whose pain we would never
3 experience, but somehow fought through it all
4 because they believed in America. Many of us
5 wave the flag, many of us salute the flag and
6 many of us pay homage to it; but how often do we
7 actually practice what is inscribed in those
8 words that we say before session every day?
9 It is interesting to love
10 America, but, too often, we don't love
11 Americans, and it's interesting that this
12 American came forward at a time when this
13 country so needed it, and from his struggle, he
14 won the Rookie of the Year in the National
15 League in 1947, became the first
16 African-American to play in the World Series
17 that year, and was then asked to speak before
18 Congress afterward. He was not the first
19 African-American to win a World Series ring.
20 That was Larry Doby in 1948 playing for the
21 Cleveland Indians.
22 And so, after his service in
23 major league baseball, Jackie Robinson went on
24 to serve in the government, served in the
25 government of this state under the Republican
2848
1 Governor Rockefeller, who saw the opportunity
2 through this unique individual, a chance to give
3 him an opportunity to give to this state all
4 that he had learned and all that he had taught
5 in his time as a baseball player. He was
6 certainly one of the great minds of his time and
7 died prematurely at the age of 54, probably from
8 some of the stress produced by a contract he
9 signed not to make any public comment on some of
10 the circumstances that he went through during
11 his first three years in the major leagues.
12 I would certainly hope that we
13 would listen to the last public words that were
14 known to have been spoken by Jackie Robinson at
15 the 1972 World Series, when, in throwing out the
16 first ball, he made the comment, "I don't think
17 I will rest peacefully until I look down the
18 lines of the baseball field and see an
19 African-American manager managing a team." He
20 never saw that.
21 And so that is the reason, I
22 think, that Senator Gold and Senator Montgomery
23 and others raise this issue today not for any
24 partisanship or politicizing of an historical
25 moment but to try to bring clarity and to try to
2849
1 bring meaning to something that perhaps, even in
2 the '90s, we still somewhat misunderstand.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
4 Maltese has offered the opportunity to members
5 of the chamber to join as cosponsors. Would
6 those people who would like to be cosponsors of
7 the bill, please raise their hands.
8 It looks as though most of the
9 members, not all of them -- we'll leave it that
10 we'll put on all the members on the bill,
11 Senator Skelos, except for those people who
12 indicate -
13 SENATOR SKELOS: There is a
14 process where a form has to be filled and given
15 to the sponsors.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: It just
17 was going to make it easier.
18 SENATOR SKELOS: We ask each
19 member to do that.
20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Okay.
21 Secretary will read the last
22 section.
23 Senator Gold.
24 SENATOR GOLD: I'm not trying to
25 slow this down. I sent a young man from my
2850
1 office to the desk, and we were told we couldn't
2 get a slip because everyone was being put on it,
3 so at least -
4 SENATOR SKELOS: We will make
5 sure that everybody has a slip.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Yes,
7 that's what we're doing, Senator Gold, just
8 trying to facilitate the process.
9 Secretary will read the last
10 section. Senator Markowitz, why do you rise?
11 SENATOR MARKOWITZ: On the bill.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
13 Markowitz, on the bill.
14 SENATOR MARKOWITZ: Senator
15 Maltese, I have little recollection of Jackie
16 Robinson. My older twin brother does; and
17 having admitted that, nonetheless, growing up
18 two blocks away from Ebbets Field, going on the
19 roof of my apartment building because even in
20 those days at times it was rough to pay to get
21 in, although those of us that knew Ebbets Field
22 knew how to sneak in, and that's the truth -
23 for those of the older generation.
24 The excitement of witnessing a
25 game of Jackie Robinson, it was among the most
2851
1 exciting experiences that a young man could have
2 and a young woman, and it's days that all of us
3 that live in Brooklyn can never forget, that
4 were blessed -- that were lucky to have lived
5 during that time.
6 The excitement of walking down
7 Empire Boulevard and Bedford Avenue, waiting
8 outside -- Senators, some of you may remember -
9 waiting outside for those batting practices to
10 occur, catching balls if we were lucky enough,
11 and the excitement of seeing one of America's
12 greatest sports people performing beyond belief
13 and being the first of color.
14 It's only natural that that
15 should have occurred in Brooklyn. It's only
16 natural because Brooklyn always leads the way of
17 good things in the state of New York and
18 throughout the nation.
19 I think today of some of those
20 baseball players that earn more in one game than
21 Jackie Robinson ever earned in his life, to
22 think that many of them have little time for
23 their fans. They run. After the game is over,
24 they run as fast as they can. Few of them live
25 in the area that they play in. Those days that
2852
1 we knew of Jackie Robinson residing in our
2 borough, being a part of the fabric of Brooklyn,
3 all the good things and being a true role model
4 to young people, those days are gone but the
5 memories are not gone.
6 So I'm delighted, Senator
7 Maltese, that a part of Brooklyn -- and I have a
8 hunch that Interborough -- does it go into the
9 other borough? If I'm not mistaken, it goes
10 into the borough that we call Queens. Am I
11 right?
12 So from Kings, it meanders into
13 the borough of Queens, but I'm real pleased that
14 the name of this tremendous sportsman will be
15 there for all to see of my generation.
16 And for younger generations that
17 weren't lucky enough, I hope we'll raise the
18 question, Senator Montgomery, "Who is Jackie
19 Robinson and why is this major highway in our
20 city named after this great baseball player?"
21 And if that is accomplished, then
22 our action this afternoon is one that will be
23 positive for the years to come.
24 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
25 Secretary will read the last section.
2853
1 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
2 act shall take effect immediately.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
4 roll.
5 (The Secretary called the roll.)
6 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 54.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
8 is passed.
9 Senator Skelos.
10 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
11 could we at this time take up a privileged
12 resolution 982, sponsored by Senator Johnson,
13 ask that it be read in its entirety and move for
14 its immediate adoption.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Return to
16 the order of motions and resolutions. Secretary
17 will read a resolution introduced by Senator
18 Johnson, in its entirety.
19 THE SECRETARY: By Senator
20 Johnson, Legislative Resolution 982, paying
21 tribute to Jackie Robinson, major league base
22 ball's first African-American baseball player,
23 upon the 50th Anniversary of his first game.
24 WHEREAS, it is the sense of this
25 legislative body to commemorate individuals of
2854
1 historical significance who have contributed to
2 the richness and ethnic diversity of New York
3 State and our nation; and
4 WHEREAS, Jack Roosevelt Robinson,
5 or "Jackie", as he was known, was born on
6 January 31, 1919 in Cairo, Georgia; and
7 WHEREAS, Jackie Robinson was
8 major league baseball's first player of color in
9 modern times. He was an athlete of outstanding
10 physical skills and a burning single-minded
11 desire for victory. He played his first major
12 league game for the Brooklyn Dodgers on April
13 15, 1947. The Dodgers played the Boston Braves
14 and defeated them by a score of 5 to 3, and
15 WHEREAS, Jackie Robinson, a
16 versatile athlete, also excelled in football and
17 track while in college at the University of
18 California in Los Angeles. While playing with
19 the Kansas City Monarchs of the Negro National
20 League, he was signed to a major league baseball
21 contract by Branch Rickey and assigned to the
22 Dodgers' Montreal farm team of the International
23 League in 1946; and
24 WHEREAS, in 1947, Jackie Robinson
25 joined the Brooklyn Dodgers of the National
2855
1 League at the age of 28, he hit .297, scored 125
2 runs and led the league in stolen bases (29) as
3 the Dodgers won their first pennant since 1941.
4 He was named "Rookie of the Year". He was
5 instrumental in leading the team to six World
6 Series appearances in ten years; and
7 WHEREAS, although he was
8 primarily a second baseman, he was an
9 outstanding fielder. In 1949, he was named Most
10 Valuable Player. He led the league in batting
11 (.342) and stolen bases (37), scoring 122 runs,
12 batting in 124 runs and amassing 203 hits, and
13 WHEREAS, in 1962, Jackie Robinson
14 was elected to the Baseball Hall of Fame, a
15 fitting climax to an illustrious career that
16 triumphed over adversity and led the way for
17 other African-American baseball players to
18 emulate;
19 NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED
20 that on April 15, 1997, this legislative body
21 pause in its deliberations to pay tribute to
22 Jackie Robinson, major league baseball's first
23 African-American player, upon the occasion of
24 the 50th Anniversary of his first game; and
25 BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED, that
2856
1 copies of this resolution, suitably engrossed,
2 be transmitted to his wife Mrs. Rachel Robinson,
3 the Jackie Robinson Foundation and the National
4 League Baseball Hall of Fame, Cooperstown, New
5 York.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
7 Johnson, on the resolution.
8 SENATOR JOHNSON: Mr. President,
9 as the resolution indicated, it's 50 years
10 tomorrow since Jackie Robinson integrated the
11 major leagues and became the first Afro-American
12 to play for the Brooklyn Dodgers. Contrary to
13 what you've heard here today, it wasn't only
14 people from Brooklyn who had pride in "Dem Bums"
15 as they called them. Even farm boys in Suffolk
16 County were Dodger fans in those days, and I
17 certainly was one. Though I wasn't here -- I
18 was away in the Marine Corps -- I became very
19 aware of that and was very excited by his
20 initial performances and the fact that they won
21 the -- he was Rookie of the Year in '47, Most
22 Valuable Player in '49 again when I was home,
23 and he was a great star and a great person, I
24 thought, a great personality, and he helped the
25 Dodgers win their first pennant since 1941.
2857
1 I think it was -- it was, shall I
2 say, strange after being in the service with men
3 of various races to find that there was no black
4 baseball player in the major leagues at that
5 time. It didn't occur to me, but when he came
6 there he was like a breath of fresh light and a
7 breath of fresh inspiration to a lot of other
8 people.
9 I think it's been alluded to here
10 already by some members about his struggle off
11 the field as well as on the field, and it's
12 certainly true, he was very active, as I noticed
13 when I was in the service that some people had
14 to go to the back of the bus, and it seemed so
15 unfair, and he was one of the men that helped to
16 change those rules, and I think it's very
17 admirable.
18 He certainly did a lot for his
19 race by not only enduring that, combatting it,
20 but holding his head high through the process of
21 being the best possible baseball player he could
22 be and certainly a role model to a lot of other
23 Americans of other ages, races and religions,
24 and he's really been admired for his courage and
25 his wisdom as much as for his baseball skill
2858
1 since the true story of Jackie Robinson has come
2 out over the years.
3 We saw yesterday, I think,
4 another young man, Afro-Asian-American, if
5 that's the right way to say it, "Tiger" Woods,
6 who is another role model for this generation of
7 young people and, of course, I'm talking about
8 the man who broke the barrier yesterday by being
9 the first non-white to win the Masters in
10 Atlanta. It was really an inspiring thing, and
11 it really shows that we are becoming one
12 nation. We are becoming open to all. It is
13 all-inclusive despite what some people might
14 say, that everyone has an opportunity in
15 America.
16 It's a wonderful thing; it's a
17 timely thing and something that's long overdue,
18 and I think that persons like Jackie and "Tiger"
19 Woods have really shown the way, so I'm really
20 very proud to sponsor this resolution and have
21 it sponsored by everyone in this house. As you
22 know, you're all on it.
23 I think it's a great inspiration
24 to our young people that we do have an open
25 society, that opportunity is there and that
2859
1 Jackie Robinson, we're honored today has helped
2 to lead the way, and I will be down at
3 Cooperstown to present the citation, the
4 resolution passed, to Mrs. Robinson in a few
5 months when the ceremony takes place, and I
6 invite others to be there if they'd like to. It
7 certainly will be a wonderful day and, after
8 all, baseball is a New York State game. We have
9 the Hall of Fame in our state and we should be
10 very proud of Jackie and all the things we're
11 doing together today to honor his memory, both
12 the naming of the road, the resolution, and so
13 forth. As you know, it's being taken up right
14 now by Clarence Norman in the other house, and
15 he will be there with me, I hope, at the
16 presentation.
17 Thank you all very much.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
19 Leichter.
20 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. President,
21 thank you.
22 I think we've had some really
23 very moving and wonderful words here today about
24 what Jackie Robinson has meant to the nation and
25 to our society, and I was particularly touched
2860
1 by the very eloquent words of Senator Paterson.
2 I just want to point out that
3 actually Jackie Robinson played a major league
4 game in New York before April 15th. How do I
5 know that? Because I was there. The practice
6 in those years was that the Yankees and the
7 Dodgers, as they ended their spring training,
8 would play a series in New York. I think
9 actually it was just two games, maybe one at
10 Yankee Stadium and one at Ebbets Field, and that
11 year 1947 the first game of the -- it was a
12 practice game but between major league teams in
13 New York, and it was the first appearance of
14 Jackie Robinson playing in a major league game
15 in New York City at Ebbets Field, and I went
16 there and I was a dyed-in-the-wool Yankee fan,
17 but I went there to root for Jackie Robinson. I
18 still remember he went 0-for-4 but he did drive
19 in a run with a long fly to left field. It was
20 really a memorable day obviously, and I just
21 wish I'd kept the score card.
22 But what I also think we need to
23 point to is that we've seen enormous changes in
24 our society since 1950, all to the good, and
25 people like Jackie Robinson who are really
2861
1 catalysts for these much needed changes, and I
2 think it's wonderful that this chamber
3 recognizes these changes, that the whole nation
4 does, that the President, as I understand, is
5 going to come to New York for this occasion.
6 But I think it also needs to be
7 an affirmation by us that the job is certainly
8 not finished of achieving equality for all our
9 citizens. It's certainly for African-Americans
10 and Hispanics and others who, as all the
11 statistics show, tend to have a much more
12 difficult life than the rest of us. That's
13 really what Jackie Robinson was about. You can
14 talk about his wonderful baseball skills and
15 they certainly are to be honored, but what we
16 honor really is a person that has changed the
17 society for the better and that fight, that
18 struggle, that work continues.
19 Thank you.
20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
21 Lachman, on the resolution.
22 SENATOR LACHMAN: First of all, I
23 very much appreciate the honor to be a
24 co-sponsor of this resolution, and I would just
25 like to say a few words that I hope will be on
2862
1 target and give it a different dimension.
2 I happen to be of the age of
3 Senator Markowitz' older twin brother and I had
4 the pleasure as a youngster of eight or nine of
5 leaving school early and latching onto a
6 Catholic Youth Organization group that went to
7 Ebbets Field to see a Dodger game and witnessed
8 Jackie Robinson play, and it's an experience
9 that I will never forget.
10 The strength and the grace of
11 this individual, knowing afterwards even as a
12 child the insults that he endured on and off the
13 field, and the greatness of the man not only in
14 his baseball record but that he established a
15 major precedent as being the first black to play
16 in major league baseball.
17 But we should not forget the fact
18 that there were two who accomplished this, and
19 the other person who accomplished this was
20 Branch Rickey, the owner of the Brooklyn
21 Dodgers. Branch Rickey had to divest himself of
22 the prejudices of his youth and the insults of
23 many of his colleagues who were owners of major
24 league teams. As a rockribbed Methodist, he
25 relied upon his faith and he knew he did the
2863
1 right thing. Without Jackie Robinson, Branch
2 Rickey could not have appointed a black that
3 year, and without Branch Rickey, Jackie Robinson
4 would not have been appointed.
5 This tells us something about our
6 society today. For America to advance into the
7 future, we have to be one nation and one people,
8 black and white together, both on and off the
9 baseball field. So in honor of Jackie Robinson
10 and the man who had the guts to appoint him and
11 make him and help him show his strength as a
12 great baseball player, I'm honored and privi
13 leged to co-sponsor this resolution.
14 Thank you.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
16 Maltese, on the resolution.
17 SENATOR MALTESE: Mr. President,
18 in the, spirit of cooperation and not only with
19 the members across the aisle but with Senator
20 Johnson, we sought to have the debate on both
21 these related pieces of legislation together,
22 but we don't mean to in any way limit the
23 discussion and the tributes to Jackie Robinson.
24 I think that -- of course, I
25 never knew the man, but I think based on his
2864
1 actions, his heroic actions, heroic in many
2 ways, he would be pleased that in a relatively
3 few days the mayor of the city of New York acted
4 to rename a portion of a parkway, a parkway in
5 the city of New York linking Brooklyn and
6 Queens, that we in this house and the Assembly
7 put together legislation in an expeditious
8 manner, that the President of the United States
9 is visiting Shea Stadium for the first time a
10 sitting President has ever visited Shea Stadium,
11 that there will be ceremonies marking his
12 achievement of 50 years ago.
13 But it isn't only marking that
14 achievement of stepping onto a playing field, it
15 is marking his lifetime from -- from that action
16 in 1947 and his actions prior to stepping onto
17 that field.
18 I think it's been mentioned by
19 the prior Senators who spoke, and I know that
20 it's being mentioned in the Assembly now as my
21 good colleague, Jeff Aubry, has led the way in
22 his house to discuss and debate and pass this
23 historic in many ways legislation, but I think
24 it's the life that -- the life that Jackie
25 Robinson led that adds to his luster.
2865
1 Passing away at a relatively
2 young age, he still made many milestones for
3 youngsters to emulate and follow, youngsters of
4 every race, creed and color.
5 This is what we are celebrating
6 today. This is what we are commemorating today,
7 so just as Interborough, previously Interborough
8 and now Jackie Robinson Parkway, links Brooklyn
9 and Queens, that we link the historic site of
10 Ebbets Field and Shea Stadium and we link the
11 players, the ball players of 1947 with the ball
12 players of today, and the actions of this state
13 Legislature and our President and our nation and
14 our state with Governor Pataki, who has
15 indicated that he will sign this bill today, we
16 link all that as a tribute to Jackie Robinson
17 and what he stood for, and what he stood for is
18 the American way, America, our great country,
19 where the grandson of a slave could aspire to be
20 a landmark for Americans of all races, religions
21 and colors, an example for all of us to emulate
22 and a person who we know will be remembered as
23 long as baseball and Ebbets Field is remembered.
24 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
25 Montgomery, on the resolution.
2866
1 SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes. Thank
2 you, Mr. President. Just briefly, on the
3 resolution.
4 I would like to join my
5 colleagues in thanking Senator Owen Johnson for
6 being the lead sponsor of this resolution and
7 including all of us and, once again, I would
8 just like to reiterate the significance of
9 Jackie Robinson in this society of ours and
10 taking it in a little bit different area.
11 I think he epitomizes the extreme
12 importance of the idea of having people,
13 especially youngsters, involved in sports and
14 because we know that sports teaches sportsman
15 ship and cooperation and builds character and
16 discipline for young people, in addition to them
17 building skills, and it also gives them
18 motivation to do other things and to do
19 everything that they do very well. It happens
20 in basketball and it happens in football, and it
21 happens in hockey and soccer and baseball and
22 every single sport, organized sport, and it -
23 what Jackie Robinson has done is to break open
24 the -- the area of sports in the society to
25 include every single young person, and now we
2867
1 have even have young women who are very much
2 involved in organized sports, in organized
3 athletic teams, based on the federal law Title
4 IX, and witnessed yesterday, I believe it was,
5 that the most recent outstanding contribution
6 that has been made to athletics in our society
7 was done by "Tiger" Woods who is a young
8 African-American who has broken into, so to
9 speak, the world of golf and has shown and
10 proven that it does not matter the color or it
11 does not matter even the age, it just matters
12 that if you have all of those qualifications
13 that I mentioned before as a sportsman, you can
14 compete successfully and compete very well.
15 So for that, we owe a great debt
16 to Jackie Robinson's contribution and I might
17 add that I believe the legacy that Robinson has
18 left for us is that we should invest in
19 athletics, in sports for our schools, for after
20 school and for communities, so that young people
21 can indeed at least compete and have an
22 opportunity to develop all of those skills that
23 are so important as it relates to organized
24 sports.
25 So thank you, Senator Johnson.
2868
1 Recognizing Jackie Robinson means so much more
2 even than the wonderful history of Jackie
3 Robinson. I think it means for us additionally
4 it gives us a path to -- for, as a Legislature,
5 for us to pursue in our attempt to address the
6 needs of young people in this state and nation.
7 Thank you.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Is there
9 any other Senator wishing to speak on the
10 resolution? Hearing none, the question is on
11 the resolution. All those in favor signify by
12 saying aye.
13 (Response of "Aye.")
14 Opposed nay.
15 (There was no response. )
16 The resolution is unanimously
17 adopted.
18 Senator Skelos.
19 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
20 if we could take up the non-controversial
21 calendar at this time.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
23 will read the non-controversial calendar.
24 THE SECRETARY: Calendar 357, by
25 Senator Cook, Senate Print 2729, an act to amend
2869
1 the General Municipal Law and others, in
2 relation to enhancing the use of mediation.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
4 will read the last section.
5 THE SECRETARY: Section 11. This
6 act shall take effect on the 180th day.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
8 roll.
9 (The Secretary called the roll. )
10 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 56.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
12 is passed.
13 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
14 391, by Senator LaValle, Senate Print 2586, an
15 act to amend the Education Law, in relation to
16 registration of a pharmacy.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
18 will read the last section.
19 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
20 act shall take effect on the 1st day of
21 November.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
23 roll.
24 (The Secretary called the roll. )
25 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Record
2870
1 the negatives; announce the results.
2 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 55, nays 1,
3 Senator Kuhl recorded in the negative.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
5 is passed.
6 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
7 431, by Senator Lack, Senate Print 3133-A, an
8 act to amend the Real Property Tax Law, in
9 relation to duties of the Director of Real
10 Property Tax Services.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
12 will read the last section.
13 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
14 act shall take effect immediately.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
16 roll.
17 (The Secretary called the roll. )
18 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 56.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
20 is passed.
21 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
22 445, by Senator Kuhl, Senate Print 1977, an act
23 to amend the Penal Law, in relation to criminal
24 possession of a weapon in the third degree.
25 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
2871
1 Paterson.
2 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
3 Mr. President. May we have a day on that bill?
4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
5 will lay the bill aside for the day.
6 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
7 448, by Senator Volker, Senate Print -
8 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay aside.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
10 bill aside.
11 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
12 490, by member of the Assembly Hoyt, Assembly
13 Print 205-A, an act to amend the Public Health
14 Law, in relation to requiring statements of
15 patients.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
17 will read the last section.
18 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
19 act shall take effect on the 1st day of January.
20 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
21 roll.
22 (The Secretary called the roll. )
23 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 56.
24 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
25 is passed.
2872
1 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
2 495, by Senator Hannon, Senate Print -
3 SENATOR SKELOS: Lay aside for
4 the day.
5 THE SECRETARY: -- Print 3000-A.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
7 bill aside for the day.
8 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
9 512, by Senator DeFrancisco, Senate Print 1541
10 A, an act to amend the Surrogate's Court
11 Procedure Act, in relation to retention of
12 commissions.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
14 will read the last section.
15 THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This
16 act shall take effect immediately.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
18 roll.
19 (The Secretary called the roll.
20 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 56.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
22 is passed.
23 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
24 521, by Senator Larkin, Senate Print 2368, an
25 act to authorize the town of Newburgh, Orange
2873
1 County, to abandon Mill Road -- Mill House
2 Road.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is
4 a home rule message at the desk. Secretary will
5 read the last section.
6 THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This
7 act shall take effect immediately.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
9 roll.
10 (The Secretary called the roll. )
11 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 56.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
13 is passed.
14 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
15 526, by Senator Rath, Senate Print 3611, an act
16 to amend the Real Property Tax Law, in relation
17 to service of a petition.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
19 will read the last section.
20 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
21 act shall take effect on the 1st day of January.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
23 roll.
24 (The Secretary called the roll. )
25 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 56.
2874
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
2 is passed.
3 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
4 531, by Senator Levy, Senate Print 41, an act to
5 amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in relation
6 to requiring suspension and revocation of a
7 driver's license.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
9 will read the last section.
10 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
11 act shall take effect on the 1st day of
12 November.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
14 roll.
15 (The Secretary called the roll. )
16 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 56.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
18 is passed.
19 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
20 554, by Senator Present, Senate Print 764, an
21 act to amend the State Administrative Procedure
22 Act, in relation to adjudicatory proceedings.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
24 will read the last section.
25 THE SECRETARY: Section 6. This
2875
1 act shall take effect on the 180th day.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
3 roll.
4 (The Secretary called the roll. )
5 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 56.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
7 is passed.
8 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
9 570, by Senator Marcellino, Senate Print 2246,
10 an act to amend the Environmental Conservation
11 Law, in relation to issuing integrated facility
12 permits.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
14 will read the last section.
15 THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This
16 act shall take effect immediately.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
18 roll.
19 (The Secretary called the roll. )
20 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 56.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
22 is passed.
23 Senator Skelos, that completes
24 the reading of the non-controversial calendar.
25 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
2876
1 if we could take up the controversial calendar.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
3 will read the controversial calendar, beginning
4 on page 17, Calendar Number 448, by Senator
5 Volker.
6 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
7 448, by Senator Volker, Senate Print 3407, an
8 act to amend the Criminal Procedure Law, in
9 relation to the authority of police officers.
10 SENATOR LEICHTER: Explanation.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
12 Volker, an explanation has been requested by
13 Senator Leichter.
14 SENATOR VOLKER: Mr. President,
15 my colleagues, I hope you'll bear with me a
16 little bit today if I'm a little emotional.
17 This has been a very long and difficult day for
18 us in Buffalo. I came directly from the funeral
19 of a police officer who some of you may have
20 read about, was killed earlier this week in a
21 senseless killing. As I said, very emotional,
22 young man 36 years old, four children. I
23 realized, as I read some of the stories in the
24 paper, that of the last half dozen police
25 officers killed in Erie County, four of them
2877
1 were friends of mine. One of them was a client
2 and a good friend.
3 It is very difficult sometimes,
4 and I'd be the first to admit to you, to discuss
5 some of these issues and as much as I realize
6 that they should be discussed completely
7 objectively, it is not necessarily easy to do.
8 In fact, you might be fascinated to know -- and,
9 Senator Gold, you and I have talked about this
10 before, and there's a reason I mention this and
11 you'll know why when I tell you -- the
12 individual involved who has been arrested and
13 who turned himself in was arrested approximately
14 30 times, and I say "approximately" because I'm
15 not sure of his juvenile record. I know that he
16 was arrested more than 20 times as an adult, 19
17 years old, suspected in three murders. He not
18 only shot an individual, he was out on bail
19 pending three felony convictions.
20 As far as I can determine, he was
21 a non-violent felon and the reason he was a
22 non-violent felon is that he had never been
23 convicted of a violent felony that I could
24 determine -- drugs, guns. Had been charged, as
25 I say, on a number of occasions but never
2878
1 convicted, and admittedly you could say, Well,
2 this has nothing to do with the Police and
3 Public Protection Act of 1997. In a way, it
4 does.
5 These are the kinds of people,
6 like it or not, that our law enforcement people
7 are facing today out on the streets. We're
8 facing a situation, I think, where I don't think
9 we completely realize -- yes, David, I get the
10 point -- that it is still a very scary situation
11 even though the numbers of violent crimes have
12 been declining; but all that aside, still our
13 police officers face a situation, in fact, in
14 some ways much more serious because of the
15 declining feeling for law enforcement people and
16 for our institutions.
17 One thing I think our media
18 should understand is, the media in Buffalo just
19 finished tearing apart the police department in
20 Buffalo with the involvement in several cases,
21 so I don't think they quite realize that they
22 never really, in my opinion, revealed the
23 situation that was involved in the police
24 killing. They only talked about one side of the
25 case and did not really get into some of the
2879
1 other sides and made the case look even worse in
2 many ways than it was.
3 The Police and Public Protection
4 Act of 1997, which is essentially the same bill
5 as passed last year, passed this house 38 to 12,
6 it tries to deal with the mish-mash of Court of
7 Appeals decisions, Appellate Division decisions,
8 in this state and every time I go through these
9 and reread them, I shake my head.
10 I think the problem is that if
11 you objectively look at some of the things that
12 are said in this bill without reading these
13 Court of Appeals and Appellate Division cases,
14 you really can't begin to understand what has
15 been occurring in this state, and some of the
16 almost loony decisions -- it's the only way I
17 can characterize them -- that have been
18 occurring where wanton criminals were allowed to
19 walk out the door essentially because a judge
20 had some idea that he was driving the thought of
21 constitutional privilege to its ultimate,
22 penultimate, whatever you want to call it,
23 depth.
24 Basically what this bill tries to
25 do is to put New York's statute on police stops
2880
1 -- these are stops and questionings -- back the
2 way the rest of the nation is, because it's -
3 the Court of Appeals of this state has set up a
4 standard not by law -- that is, not by statute,
5 but they have interpreted our statute.
6 Our statute which has been on the
7 books for years talks about a reasonable ground
8 of suspicion that the person is committing, has
9 committed or is about to commit a crime. Now,
10 that standard's been around for a number of
11 years, but what has happened is that the court
12 has interpreted that so stringently so that a
13 number of cases, real substantial stopping and
14 questioning has become very, very difficult, if
15 not impossible, and in fact I read one case that
16 to me is unbelievable where the judge said,
17 Well, the person has the right to flee.
18 Now, you have to think about it.
19 There is no question about the right not to
20 respond unless there's some criminal act or
21 something like that. No one's arguing that, but
22 the right to flee is something that is a little
23 bit beyond me. I guess, as somebody who was in
24 the street, it's beyond me how a judge could do
25 that unless except for one thing, if you do not
2881
1 understand what is truly involved in police
2 procedures and in what's happening in the
3 streets and you have to put that in
4 perspective.
5 What this bill would do is set up
6 a standard that talks about an objective -
7 where is the provision here because I want to
8 get it exactly right. The -- oh, "objective,
9 credible, reason not necessarily indicative of
10 criminality." The reason for that reminds me of
11 the time when a fellow, police officer of mine,
12 stopped a person who was shot, didn't know he
13 had been shot, thought that there was something
14 wrong with him. He thought he was sick,
15 whatever, stopped him to see if he was all
16 right. He didn't obviously know that there was
17 any crime involved. Technically speaking, he
18 didn't have a right to stop and question him,
19 did question him. After some questioning, the
20 fellow said, "I've been shot," and he said,
21 "I've got to get some help," and then he
22 realized this fellow had a gun and then he
23 realized a little bit later that the fellow had
24 killed somebody.
25 The point I'm trying to make is
2882
1 technically, under the rules of the Court of
2 Appeals of New York today, that entire matter
3 would have been thrown out because there would
4 have been no -- no knowledge of criminality, no
5 standard of criminality. Under this standard,
6 something of that nature that is pretty obvious,
7 it seems to me, would objectively be allowed.
8 The other main provision of this
9 bill dates and involves the question of
10 evidence. What the Supreme Court has done is
11 use an old standard, Supreme Court of the United
12 States, that basically goes back to a case
13 called Mapp vs. Ohio. The federal standard says
14 that we still have rules that deal with the
15 proper -- the proper evidentiary rules for
16 lawful searches, but it also says that if the
17 officer did not act in bad faith and was
18 attempting to protect the safety of the
19 individual or the police officer himself or
20 herself and the individual, then that -- that
21 search could be found to be valid.
22 What this bill basically does is
23 go back to that standard and try to use that
24 standard which is the standard which practically
25 every jurisdiction in this country uses.
2883
1 There's a kind of a strange provision in the
2 bill that talks about violations of state
3 statutes and the reason for that is, if you read
4 the bill through, you'd realize it's not that
5 the bill would invalidate any state statutes,
6 but what it says that you can't use state
7 statutes to go beyond the federal constitutional
8 limits, and that's what it really means.
9 It doesn't intend to say that we
10 don't have our own constitutional restrictions,
11 but the bill attempts to clearly define statutes
12 that our Court of Appeals has reinterpreted
13 which they've been interpreting for years in one
14 way, and the Constitution of the United States
15 has interpreted, and not be in violation and
16 what the Court of Appeals has said, no matter
17 what we've said through all these years, no
18 matter what the federal Constitution says, no
19 matter what the state Legislature says, this is
20 what we say they said.
21 What this legislation attempts to
22 do is to say that we need to go back to the
23 reasonable standards for stopping and frisking
24 and to the reasonable standard for search and
25 seizure and for withholding in searches, and
2884
1 that basically is what this bill does.
2 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr.
3 President.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
5 Leichter.
6 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. President,
7 if Senator Volker would yield.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
9 Volker, do you yield to some questions from
10 Senator Leichter?
11 SENATOR VOLKER: Yes.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
13 yields.
14 SENATOR LEICHTER: Senator, the
15 first part of your bill which deals with the
16 right or purports to give the right to police
17 officers to approach people and ask them
18 questions when they have a credible reason, not
19 necessarily indicative of criminality.
20 SENATOR VOLKER: Right.
21 SENATOR LEICHTER: You gave an
22 example where a police officer thought that
23 somebody was ill or sick. Did I understand you
24 correctly?
25 SENATOR VOLKER: Right. Right.
2885
1 SENATOR LEICHTER: Now, there's
2 nothing under the law presently that prohibits a
3 police officer coming to somebody that they
4 believe is in distress and saying, Are you in
5 trouble, can I help you?
6 SENATOR VOLKER: Except if you
7 follow -- if the following -- if you follow the
8 language of what the courts have done, anything
9 that you find after that stop, any questions
10 that you make could well be thrown out and, in
11 fact, have been thrown out and any evidence that
12 you obtain after that because you didn't
13 anticipate that there was any criminality
14 involved, also has been thrown out and that's
15 the key.
16 It's not the stopping as such;
17 it's what happens afterwards that the courts
18 have interpreted.
19 SENATOR LEICHTER: All right.
20 But Senator Volker, if you continue to yield.
21 SENATOR VOLKER: Yeah.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
23 continues to yield.
24 SENATOR LEICHTER: You keep
25 saying that, but the question is that had the
2886
1 person who was stopped and asked, Are you in
2 need of help, and the person says, No, I'm fine.
3 SENATOR VOLKER: Right.
4 SENATOR LEICHTER: Your bill
5 would seem to allow the police officer to
6 continue to ask questions, once having stopped
7 the person to conceivably take some other police
8 action.
9 SENATOR VOLKER: No, I don't
10 think it would. I think all it would do is,
11 yes, it would continue to, if there was some
12 suspicion, if there could be some suspicion. If
13 the person continued to say, No, and continued
14 to answer the questions objectively there's
15 nothing the police officer could do from there.
16 Let's make that clear. In fact, that's one of
17 the things that's been a bit annoying about the
18 court cases, is the question about saying that
19 you know, well, if you find something that the
20 fact that you asked the questions is a restraint
21 of rights.
22 You -- Senator, you and I
23 discussed the fact that you do have the right
24 not to respond. If you want to say, No, I have
25 no problem, so forth. Of course, on the other
2887
1 hand if you drop a gun or if the -- if something
2 is objectively found, that's a different -
3 that's a different story, but I agree with you.
4 I don't think there is anything in this bill
5 that, if nothing else is determined, that would
6 stop that person from saying, No. That's it,
7 and if there's no objective evidence, they can
8 walk away and that's it.
9 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. President,
10 if Senator Volker will yield.
11 SENATOR VOLKER: Yeah.
12 SENATOR LEICHTER: Senator
13 Volker, I think the plain language of the
14 statute belies what you say. Maybe one of the
15 reasons why the court sometimes does some of the
16 things that we object to is, very frankly, that
17 we also author statutes that are not clearly
18 expressed, because the key to this section is
19 stopping somebody.
20 Now, you've given a grounds for
21 stopping which is, are you in distress, the way
22 you do now, but then you go on and if you look
23 at line 17, "may ask such questions and take
24 such other actions".
25 SENATOR VOLKER: Right.
2888
1 SENATOR LEICHTER: "Ask such
2 questions and take such other actions", so what
3 your bill does, once you give the police officer
4 the right to stop -- and that's what your bill
5 purports to do -- you then say the police
6 officer may take such -
7 SENATOR VOLKER: Right.
8 SENATOR LEICHTER: -- take such
9 other actions.
10 SENATOR VOLKER: Right.
11 SENATOR LEICHTER: So in the case
12 that I've given to you where the police officer
13 stops somebody and says, Are you sick, are you
14 in distress, do you need help?
15 SENATOR VOLKER: M-m h-m-m,
16 right.
17 SENATOR LEICHTER: I think the
18 person clearly -
19 SENATOR VOLKER: What would that
20 police officer do, arrest him?
21 SENATOR LEICHTER: Let me just
22 finish the question.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: If you
24 would permit me, Senator Leichter, if I might
25 just interrupt you a minute. We do have a
2889
1 reporter who has to take this down and when you
2 turn your back to the microphone and talk
3 directly to Senator Volker, it's very difficult
4 for us up here or other people here or in the
5 rest of the complex to hear you, and when you
6 jump right in, Senator Volker, it makes it
7 extremely difficult to record the content and
8 because it's so important today on this
9 historical day in Albany to have it recorded
10 exactly as it's debated, I would plead with you
11 to each respect the rights of the other and use
12 the mechanisms that are here so that we can get
13 it all down to the last exclamation point.
14 And now if you want to proceed
15 with your explanation.
16 SENATOR LEICHTER: I don't think
17 Senator Volker needs to be chastised. I think as
18 usual you have given us very good instructions,
19 Mr. President, and I thank you for that. I just
20 want to finish my question of Senator Volker and
21 just say that it seems to me that what your bill
22 does is establish vast parameters for stopping
23 people, and then once you've stopped, you may
24 ask such questions and, in your example, I think
25 that after the person says, "No, Officer, I'm
2890
1 not in distress, I'm fine," that the officer has
2 the right to ask other questions, and take such
3 other actions as he deems appropriate even
4 though the person says, "No, I'm not in
5 distress." The officer says, "Well, let me
6 see," and maybe pats him down or asks him some
7 other questions. I think that's clearly what you
8 seek to do.
9 SENATOR VOLKER: No, Senator, I
10 don't agree with that. In fact, I was trying to
11 think of what could happen. Let's say the guy,
12 you ask him a couple more questions, he says,
13 "No," and he falls down, he falls down and a
14 gun falls out of his pocket. You find out he's
15 been shot. Then you, of course, get an
16 ambulance for him. Then the question becomes
17 was what you did proper? I think that's the
18 further actions that would be taken.
19 But let's assume that doesn't
20 happen. Let's assume he just says, "No, I'm
21 sorry, I have no problem and I have nothing to
22 say to you." There's nothing under this bill
23 that would allow a police officer, to my -- to
24 my way of thinking, and I think it's pretty
25 clear, to do anything else, unless he has other
2891
1 objective evidence to allow him to do something
2 further.
3 SENATOR LEICHTER: Mr. President,
4 on the bill, please.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
6 Leichter, on the bill.
7 SENATOR LEICHTER: Senator
8 Volker, let me say -- and I appreciate how
9 difficult it must have been today for you to be
10 at the funeral of an officer. I've been at
11 funerals of officers who have been killed, and I
12 know there's nothing more painful, and I think
13 all of us certainly extend the deepest sympathy
14 not only to his family but the people of
15 Buffalo, and we've had police officers shot in
16 my city, in New York City. It's a terrible
17 thing, and we're ever grateful for police
18 officers who protect us, who risk their lives.
19 We know it's a dangerous job, and I think we
20 want to give them all appropriate protection.
21 But having said that, Senator
22 Volker, I don't think, and I urge my colleagues
23 to read this bill carefully because, as heart
24 felt as the situation is that Senator Volker has
25 brought to our attention, it should not be the
2892
1 reason or the means, the vehicle by which we
2 pass a bill that I believe violates the
3 Constitution of the state of New York and quite
4 likely the Constitution of the United States.
5 I think this bill shreds basic
6 constitutional rights. One of the most
7 cherished rights that we have in this country,
8 and maybe I appreciate it more than some other
9 people because I came from a country that was
10 under a police state, and one of the most
11 terrible and terrifying things is that a police
12 officer can stop you at any time for any reason
13 and ask you any questions.
14 Now, I'm not suggesting that
15 that's what Senator Volker is trying to do. I
16 know it isn't, but I must say, Senator, that the
17 effect of this bill is to greatly broaden the
18 instances that a police officer can stop
19 somebody and to stop somebody because you feel
20 there's a reason of criminality obviously, that
21 should be permitted. It is permitted, it's the
22 law today. But to say you can stop them for
23 reasons that are not related to criminality and
24 then take such other action -- what your bill
25 says is, take such other actions as the officer
2893
1 deems appropriate. That, Senator, opens up a
2 whole area of police oppression where people in
3 this country, I think, don't want to be stopped
4 by police officers.
5 One thing, and it's a wonderful
6 thing, a police officer comes up, somebody says,
7 Do you need help? Do you need help crossing the
8 street? Do you need help carrying a bag or are
9 you sick? Can I in some other way be of
10 assistance to you? He can do that now, but then
11 to use that as an excuse to stop somebody and
12 ask him some other questions, as I think your
13 bill does, I think is extremely dangerous and I
14 plead with everyone, much as we're committed to
15 giving the police all of the tools that they
16 need, and much as we want to provide ways in
17 which we can reduce crime, bring it down even
18 lower than the reductions that we've achieved so
19 far, let's not do it at the expense of basic
20 rights.
21 We're talking of the most basic
22 right of all which is to be left alone, not to
23 be questioned by the police. Commit a crime,
24 police officer thinks you may have committed a
25 crime, has reasonable objective grounds to
2894
1 consider that a crime has been committed, of
2 course, the police officer can stop you. That's
3 the law, but now we're saying a police officer
4 can stop you even when there's no indication or
5 belief that a crime has been committed.
6 I find that very offensive. I
7 find that not just questionable. I find that
8 that really is violative of some of the basic
9 principles that make the freedom and liberty of
10 this country the envy of other countries
11 throughout the world.
12 The bill does two other things.
13 The second thing is in terms of requiring courts
14 to set forth the reasons when evidence is sup
15 pressed. I don't find anything objectionable.
16 But then it also deals with the suppression of
17 evidence, and there, Senator Volker, this is not
18 an effort, contrary to what you say, this is not
19 an effort to bring New York State in with what
20 exists in the rest of the nation.
21 I can't speak for every state of
22 the Union, but I don't believe that we now -- we
23 shouldn't say "we", that other states provide
24 that evidence that is gotten in a -- in -- where
25 the grounds for acquiring this evidence are not
2895
1 ones that presently, under the U.S. Constitution
2 would be permitted, where evidence is suppressed
3 because it was acquired illegally, even if it
4 was done in good faith that other states say
5 that evidence can be used.
6 I know that the federal rule
7 tends to be less restrictive than the New York
8 rule. But the point is that we have a
9 Constitution here in the state of New York, and
10 I heard you say something which I frankly found
11 difficult to believe, that the effort of this
12 bill is to see that the Court of Appeals does
13 what is required -- what is -- may be
14 permissible under the U. S. Constitution, even
15 though it's not permissible under the New York
16 State Constitution. We can't do this as a
17 legislative body. We have a court. This is
18 gross interference with the judicial process.
19 I guess one of the reasons I may
20 not have explained it as clearly as I would like
21 and as I think it needs to be explained is
22 because as the law presently is, unless you have
23 a valid and good grounds to search somebody, to
24 take property, so on, that you find evidence as
25 a result of that search even if the police
2896
1 officer acted in good faith, thought that he had
2 the right to do so, that that evidence will be
3 suppressed, and it's all based on the search and
4 seizure which is again one of the rock
5 principles in our Constitution, in our society,
6 and it's not only in the U. S. Constitution but
7 it's stated and somewhat differently in the New
8 York Constitution, and it's been interpreted by
9 the Court of Appeals over many years, and it has
10 required that the police officer, irrespective
11 of his good faith or bad faith, that he follows
12 the law.
13 What we're saying is that the
14 constable has to follow the law. So I think
15 that this is clearly, to my mind, unconstitu
16 tional. Certainly unconstitutional under the
17 New York Constitution, but I think it's also
18 unconstitutional under the federal Constitution
19 because the Supreme Court, although it's
20 somewhat given greater latitude on search and
21 seizure, has never gone to the point of saying
22 that -- that unless it was committed in bad
23 faith, and then you go on and you say not in
24 whole or in part for the purpose of protecting
25 the safety of the actor or another person.
2897
1 I mean that's a wide open
2 loophole because almost anything can be
3 considered as pursuing the safety of either the
4 one who is patting down the individual or taking
5 the evidence or he's doing it to protect society
6 at large. So it's really no standard at all as
7 far as I can see this.
8 Then you go on, and you have a
9 provision in there which I have difficulty
10 understanding, limiting in effect the current
11 statute that we have and even statutes in the
12 future are limited insofar as the exclusionary
13 rule is concerned.
14 So I think you have gone way
15 beyond what's permissible constitutionally, but
16 I think you have also violated the separation of
17 powers. This is a clear interference in our
18 part in the judicial process, in the province of
19 the judiciary to interpret the Constitution and
20 to interpret law, but we're saying that, no,
21 you've got to interpret this in a particular
22 way.
23 Let me finally say, Senator
24 Volker, there are all sorts of studies that have
25 been made that the suppression of evidence is
2898
1 not a hindrance. The suppression of evidence as
2 it's now applied by the court is not a hindrance
3 to getting convictions, to putting criminals
4 away, to pursuing a criminal case with proper
5 evidence, and prosecutors will tell you that.
6 Now, it's perfectly true some -
7 there have been some cases that have been
8 debated where people have different opinions but
9 to take those cases and based on two or three of
10 them, where you may disagree with the outcome
11 and to completely change the exclusionary rule,
12 I think is a bad mistake and I think as you do
13 it, as I've said, I think you've done it in
14 violation of the Constitution of this state and
15 probably of the federal Constitution.
16 So much as there may be a lot of
17 emotional reasons for passing this sort of
18 legislation, we can't do it. We shouldn't do it
19 and we should keep in mind basic principles of
20 liberty in this country.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
22 Waldon.
23 SENATOR WALDON: Thank you very
24 much, Mr. President.
25 My colleagues, I heard what
2899
1 Senator Volker said in regards to his experience
2 at the funeral today, and I respect that, and so
3 instead of asking questions of him, I will
4 attempt to do what I want to do by just speaking
5 to the bill, Mr. President.
6 I wonder why this is being
7 presented to us again. Last year the vote was
8 36 to 18, but it was only in our house that a
9 vote was taken. So if last year it did not
10 emerge in the Assembly, one could guess that the
11 same thing will happen this year, so this is an
12 exercise in futility to deal with this issue on
13 our floor.
14 So if my presumption is accurate,
15 then why are we going through the exercise,
16 seems to be a question that can be asked. For
17 one, it shows, from the Governor's perspective,
18 I would assume, that he's very tough on crime,
19 and that's commendable. It is good to be tough
20 on crime.
21 But yesterday's paper, driving up
22 here today on the news broadcast, and over the
23 last week or two, I've heard that crime is
24 plummeting, 12 percent by some estimates, 14
25 percent by others. The three major assault
2900
1 categories have dropped about 14 percent as
2 described in the media in the last day or so.
3 So there doesn't seem to be -- and I'm not
4 speaking from the perspective of the victim, but
5 there doesn't seem to be sufficient reason to
6 change the fundamental guarantees of our nation
7 in regard to its Constitution and the state's
8 Constitution regarding crime because crime seems
9 to be curtailing itself by itself.
10 What does this bill do? It
11 attempts to expand the authority of the police.
12 Doesn't attempt. If we pass it and if it became
13 law, it would. But aren't our police considered
14 the best trained in the world? That's what we
15 say. So why should we have to clear short-cuts
16 for them to accomplish their end under the
17 Constitution, if they are, in fact, so good?
18 But there's a more troublesome
19 and meddlesome area of this proposal. That is
20 prohibiting the court from suppressing evidence
21 and then requiring that a court cannot grant
22 motions to suppress tangible property. I'm
23 sorry. If a court should suppress tangible
24 property in regard to the case, they must then
25 put it in writing. The Governor then becomes
2901
1 the watchdog of the courts.
2 Our founding fathers, in their
3 wisdom, said we need three separate and apart
4 entities to govern ourselves. Final review is
5 by the court. The Legislature passes the bills
6 and the Executive administers the government.
7 What we would do if this were to become law in
8 this state is to allow the Governor to expand
9 beyond his parameters and control the courts. I
10 don't think the founding fathers intended that,
11 and I think that is a huge, huge mistake.
12 But let's just presume that this
13 were to pass. If this were to pass, a police
14 officer is walking along the street and he sees
15 someone who has not done anything which is
16 reasonable cause, that gives him reasonable
17 cause to believe a crime has been committed, et
18 cetera, et cetera. Who does he stop? Who will
19 the police officers in the state of New York
20 stop? Will they look to stop illegal aliens,
21 people who do not look like them? Will they
22 look to stop even those who are not illegal
23 aliens or aliens, but who do not look like them?
24 Will this become a reason to hassle and harass
25 to a greater extent than they are already being
2902
1 hassled and harassed young black men who wear
2 "dreads", who wear their caps on the backs of
3 their heads, who wear loud and funky colors, who
4 I find often obnoxious and I can't handle it,
5 and I am African-American? Who will the police
6 hassle and harass if this becomes law?
7 I think it becomes a situation
8 for those who will be most hassled and harassed
9 will look somewhat like me. I don't think we
10 need this. I think we're better than this. I
11 think our police are sufficiently trained not to
12 need to resort to such devices in order to
13 express criminality, but isn't that what police
14 are there for, To deal with crime and
15 criminals, not whim as described by this
16 particular bill?
17 And so because of these reasons
18 and because I think it contravenes our
19 Constitution both at the state and the federal
20 level, and because it would interfere with
21 judicial discretion and because it creates a
22 situation where the Governor is "uber alles", I
23 think it is not wise for us to deal with this
24 and to pass it. But I'm sure we will pass it,
25 but I'm sure in the Assembly it will not come up
2903
1 for consideration, and so we have again an
2 exercise in futility.
3 Unfortunately, these things
4 happen here. Stuff happens even in the Senate,
5 but I encourage us to improve the vote over last
6 year. Last year it was 36 to 18, 50 percent.
7 Let's make it better this year, let's have some
8 more wisdom from amongst those of us who sit in
9 this chamber.
10 I thank you very much, Mr.
11 President, for your indulgence and the
12 indulgence of my colleagues. I recommend that we
13 vote no on this proposal.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
15 Volker.
16 SENATOR VOLKER: Mr. President,
17 let me just say, in all sincerity, and I mean
18 this very sincerely, I know you feel very
19 strongly. The passage of this bill will have
20 very little impact on the street except -- let
21 me finish -- except for one thing.
22 The question was asked by
23 someone, then why do it? The answer is, it will
24 have very little impact on the day-to-day
25 operations of the street except for one thing,
2904
1 that a lot of people who are now taking
2 advantage of police officers out there on the
3 streets now and escaping justice and assaulting
4 police officers and doing a lot of the things
5 that we all abhor will have more difficulty
6 doing it.
7 Let me explain something to you
8 about some things that happened many years ago
9 and, by the way, what's been happening in our
10 society has been coming a long, long time, and I
11 thought about today when I was going to expound
12 and I was really in a kind of a foul mood, I
13 suppose for obvious reasons, and I won't get
14 into that.
15 But, as a young police officer,
16 one of my jobs was -- before I left was to train
17 young police officers, and I'm proud to say one
18 of them is the chief of police today, one of
19 them is an F.B.I. agent. Another one is a
20 retired DEA agent, so forth, not that I had
21 anything to do with it, but at least I was with
22 them. And I used to say to them, Look -- they'd
23 say, "Dale, you're a lawyer" -- by this time I
24 was a lawyer and a police officer -- "How do we
25 deal with this stuff in the streets? How do we
2905
1 deal with it? We're not lawyers and we don't
2 know how to deal with it," and I said, "Look,
3 use the guide that I've always used and you'll
4 be all right. Do what's reasonable under the
5 circumstances. If you do what's reasonable
6 under the circumstances you'll be all right."
7 Unfortunately, in this state that
8 has -- what has occurred is that a number of
9 people who do not understand our streets, who do
10 not understand what crime is all about, have
11 been interpreting statutes way beyond what this
12 Legislature intended and are saying, "We don't
13 care what you believe is reasonable, we're not
14 going to follow that."
15 For instance, Senator Leichter,
16 and you and I weren't there, I know that for
17 sure, but in 1938 there was a Constitutional
18 Convention. You and I were -- in fact, I don't
19 think we were even born, but there was a
20 Constitutional Convention and they specifically
21 rejected the exclusionary rule that now our
22 Court of Appeals is saying New York has. Well,
23 we don't have it, but they're saying we do and
24 the article of the state's Constitution that
25 they're interpreting as more stringent than the
2906
1 federal constitutional provision is exactly the
2 same language.
3 Not only are they doing that but
4 they're taking statutes that this Legislature
5 passed and saying, basically we don't care what
6 that Legislature said, we're reinterpreting it
7 because that's not -- it wasn't clear enough for
8 us, even though we've had case after case over
9 the years that have said, Yes, Legislature, you
10 did say that, and we're going to follow that.
11 Well, they're not following it.
12 So when you talk about the
13 exclusionary rule, you'd better understand no
14 one is saying, this bill does not say that New
15 York is going to change our whole Constitution.
16 What we're saying is that, in modern times, in
17 other words, within the last few years, we've
18 had interpretations that go way beyond anything
19 that New York has ever interpreted before this.
20 That's what we're saying.
21 The second thing about the
22 streets, and as far as stopping is concerned, I
23 don't agree -- if I agreed that police would be
24 stopping and harassing people because of this
25 statute, I would be the last one to do this bill
2907
1 and I can assure you of something, that there
2 are bills that come to my committee, tough
3 hard-nosed criminal justice bills that favor
4 police that don't get out of my committee
5 because I don't think they're a good idea,
6 because I think I know a little bit about -- I
7 don't profess to know a great deal, but I know
8 about some of the things that occur.
9 So I happen to believe that what
10 we're trying to do here is to put more
11 credibility into the streets and not give police
12 officers enormous powers, but more than anything
13 to allow where they acted reasonably that
14 evidence that's uncovered and criminality that's
15 uncovered can be reasonably treated after that.
16 That's what we're really trying to do here.
17 And, Senator Waldon, I want to
18 tell you something about bills that pass this
19 Senate and don't pass the Assembly. I had about
20 seven of them last year that have been passing
21 this house year after year after year after year
22 and people said, They'll never pass the
23 Assembly.
24 Well, we changed them a little
25 bit and they passed the Assembly. In fact, one
2908
1 bill, I'd been sponsoring I think for eight or
2 ten years and it passed the Assembly because
3 finally we were in a situation where we were
4 able to deal with the Assembly and get an
5 agreement.
6 I'll make a prediction to you
7 about this bill. This bill may not pass the
8 Assembly exactly the way it is, but I will make
9 a prediction to you that this house's version of
10 this bill will pass the Assembly before the next
11 election.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
13 Abate.
14 SENATOR ABATE: Yes. Would
15 Senator Volker yield to a question?
16 SENATOR VOLKER: Yes.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
18 yields.
19 SENATOR ABATE: Senator, I have
20 about 12 pages of my questions and statement
21 from last year. I will spare you.
22 SENATOR VOLKER: Thank you for
23 that. I remember very vividly.
24 SENATOR ABATE: Yes, I'm even
25 shocked by the length of the discourse from last
2909
1 year, but I just have one question that still
2 remains in my mind to be answered.
3 Is it your intention by this bill
4 to have our state standards consistent with
5 federal standards in terms of stop, in terms of
6 search and seizure?
7 SENATOR VOLKER: Generally
8 speaking, yes, reasonably so. I think that, you
9 know, what I think the argument that we make
10 here is that the general standards throughout
11 the country is a lesser standard than New York
12 has adopted, not adopted, but that the Court of
13 Appeals has determined not by statute, but by
14 court decision.
15 Senator Leichter talked about the
16 separation of powers. I agree with him on the
17 separation of powers, and I have a tremendous -
18 I take tremendous umbrage to what I believe has
19 been reinterpretation of statutes that have been
20 done over the last decade way beyond anything
21 that anyone has ever seen in this state, at
22 least in our time, certainly not in my time and
23 I think he's absolutely correct, and I think
24 that there should be a separation of powers but
25 I think it's the courts that have taken the
2910
1 initiative to reinterpret our statutes; and so
2 my answer to you is, generally speaking, yes, we
3 -- in this bill we attempt to go back to the
4 federal standard.
5 SENATOR ABATE: So, Senator
6 Volker, it's not your intent to make the state's
7 exclusionary rule more stringent than the
8 federal standards?
9 SENATOR VOLKER: In all honesty,
10 over the years our exclusionary rule has
11 somewhat -- well, we don't have an exclusionary
12 rule as such, but our search and seizure rule
13 before the most recent Court of Appeals
14 decision, if I'm not mistaken, were somewhat
15 more stringent anyway, but what we're doing
16 basically is not necessarily to just go to the
17 federal standard but in no case would we be less
18 than the federal standard which I think is under
19 Mapp vs. Ohio if I'm not mistaken. Mapp vs.
20 Ohio.
21 SENATOR ABATE: So, Senator, it's
22 your intention to have our state exclusionary
23 rule no more than the federal government, no
24 more and no less?
25 SENATOR VOLKER: Yeah, correct.
2911
1 Let me point out to you once before what I said
2 once again. The exclusionary rule, New York
3 exclusionary rule, was rejected specifically by
4 the convention in 1938 and, technically
5 speaking, we have some case law and statutory
6 law but technically we don't have a statutory
7 rule.
8 SENATOR ABATE: I mean the
9 exclusionary rule that's been, not by statute
10 but rather by case law, the stop, frisk and
11 search capacity?
12 SENATOR VOLKER: Right.
13 SENATOR ABATE: So if, in fact,
14 what you're attempting to do is to mirror that
15 of the federal standard, why did you use
16 different language? The federal law talks about
17 "good faith" and this statute talks about "bad
18 faith".
19 SENATOR VOLKER: I think we used
20 a version of the federal -- I think there's
21 several ways in which the federal -- the federal
22 standards are used, and we used basically the
23 same standard but in a little bit different way
24 if that's what you mean. It's true, I suppose,
25 you could go exactly with the federal standard
2912
1 but if you look at the way in which this statute
2 is set up, it is virtually the same except that
3 the -- the language is changed a bit and, in
4 some ways, I suppose it could be determined to
5 be maybe even maybe more stringent, but I guess
6 it depends on how you look at it, but it is
7 basically the same standard.
8 SENATOR ABATE: Would the Senator
9 continue to yield?
10 SENATOR VOLKER: Sure.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
12 yields.
13 SENATOR ABATE: Mr. President.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: I was
15 just counting the questions, Senator. I think
16 we got to seven now, but in any case, continue.
17 SENATOR ABATE: Yes, it's part
18 seven of the first question.
19 So. In your mind, there's no
20 difference between a good faith exception and a
21 bad faith exception.
22 SENATOR VOLKER: Well, of course,
23 there is a difference between a good faith
24 exception and a bad faith exception, but it
25 depends on -- what it means the same as either
2913
1 you do have good faith or you have bad faith, or
2 you don't. In other words, you're using
3 basically the same standard you're using for
4 harassment purposes, and so forth.
5 By the way, I think that one of
6 the things is that we're not saying, remember
7 what's happened here, we've had a series of
8 cases that has been looked at in a vacuum. What
9 they've done they've looked at search and
10 seizure in a vacuum and have taken the criminal,
11 the person who is allegedly a criminal and have
12 said, Well, we're not looking over the issue
13 here of bad faith or good faith or anything. We
14 just see a technical rule was violated here and;
15 therefore under New York's Constitution we say
16 that that -- that material, that drug, that gun
17 whatever it is has got to be thrown out.
18 What we're saying here is that
19 you should look when technical rules are dealt
20 with, where there's no other indication of any
21 constitutional violation to the issue of bad
22 faith obviously by the police officer or good
23 faith, which is the reverse of that to determine
24 whether that evidence should be put in or not.
25 SENATOR ABATE: Senator Volker,
2914
1 could you explain to me why you decided to use
2 bad faith instead of good faith?
3 SENATOR VOLKER: Senator, I
4 didn't decide that. This is the Governor's
5 program bill. The decision was his, in all
6 honesty.
7 SENATOR ABATE: So it's the
8 wisdom of the Governor we must applaud for that,
9 applaud or criticize.
10 SENATOR VOLKER: I must be very
11 honest with you, it is not my language. It is a
12 Governor's program bill, but I think what the
13 Governor decided to do in this bill is to use
14 the same principle that the federal decisions
15 have made, but from the reverse perspective and
16 I think that you get to the same point, at least
17 that's how it seems to me.
18 SENATOR ABATE: Thank you,
19 Senator.
20 Just very briefly, on the bill.
21 My concerns are manifold, but let me just
22 highlight a couple of my concerns about this
23 bill.
24 I believe that this bill goes
25 beyond the standard set by federal law. What is
2915
1 bad faith? I'm not sure. What is good faith?
2 It is not defined in the bill. Certainly we
3 want to give guidance to police on when they are
4 stopping and searching and because of the
5 vagueness of the standards in this bill, we will
6 not be giving guidance. In fact, under the bill
7 it says the police can stop people for any
8 reason, good or bad, and how is the court or how
9 is any individual going to challenge this
10 statute? How can they go into the head of a
11 police officer? It's hard enough to show the
12 actions of good faith. How are they going to
13 determine bad faith?
14 Why are we doing this? I think we
15 have to ask ourselves. If you practice criminal
16 law and if you're in the courts and if you've
17 had an occasion to argue a motion to suppress,
18 it's an extraordinary event where any evidence
19 is suppressed. In fact, in 99 percent of the
20 cases, the motion to suppress is denied. Now,
21 every now and then, we see these headlines and
22 we may not agree with the Court of Appeals
23 decision but they are few and far between and we
24 have to ask ourselves, when we are reducing
25 crime, when we are paying attention and training
2916
1 our officers, when it is important that they be
2 trained, and why are we changing the standards
3 to such an extent that we are tipping the
4 balance in the wrong direction?
5 And the reason for exclusionary
6 rules is to have a balance on the street, so the
7 officer has all the capacity and power they need
8 to function on the street, but also that there
9 will be enough rules and laws in place so that
10 an innocent person is not stopped for any
11 reason. So an exclusionary rule is about
12 protecting all the innocent people in New York
13 State and also about giving sufficient power to
14 the police.
15 I have not heard any argument
16 today that we need to change the balance.
17 Because there is some Court of Appeals cases we
18 disagree with should not be enough basis to make
19 such a fundamental change in our system. What
20 we don't have before us and which is never
21 documented is how many innocent people are
22 subject to unwarranted intrusion, are subject to
23 unreasonable searches and seizures? Those
24 individuals may be searched, may be stopped.
25 There's no contraband found, no crime
2917
1 committed. They go on their way. That kind of
2 evidence is not documented. We as a state need
3 to be concerned if we tip the balance in the
4 wrong direction, and we open up the flood gates
5 to have more and more innocent people stopped
6 for no reason or for not a legitimate reason,
7 particularly if it's not indicative of
8 criminality.
9 So we shouldn't tamper, we should
10 not allow people and innocent people to be
11 stopped just because of a hunch or suspicion. I
12 believe that there are rules in place that
13 protect all of us. Let's not use the excuse
14 today because one criminal got off where we know
15 full well in our community that there are many
16 innocent people who are stopped unnecessarily,
17 who are put in pain and burden and they should
18 not be placed in the situation. So there are
19 many reasons and my colleagues have articulated
20 very well why this bill goes too far. It's not
21 necessary. The officers have all the capacity in
22 law and ability to stop people now and to arrest
23 people, to prevent crime, and this tips the
24 scales in a very dangerous direction, a
25 direction we should not venture into.
2918
1 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
2 will read the last section.
3 THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This
4 act shall take effect immediately. Call the
5 roll.
6 (The Secretary called the roll. )
7 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Record
8 the negatives.
9 Senator Waldon to explain his
10 vote.
11 SENATOR WALDON: Thank you very
12 much, Mr. President.
13 On the street is where this bill
14 really counts. In the city of New York 25 to 30
15 people are fatally shot each year by the New
16 York City Police Department. Most recently, a
17 young man was shot in the back of his head. It
18 was said that he was menacing the police officer
19 and coming towards the police officer. There
20 are two other such shootings similar to the
21 Cedeno shooting, Kevin Cedeno.
22 The point I am trying to
23 make is that now in some instances with all of
24 the constitutional guarantees and all of the
25 restraints of the media and all of the good
2919
1 supervision that the New York City Police
2 Department has, people are being shot in the
3 back and alleged to have been coming towards the
4 police officer when they were killed.
5 I remember attending a few press
6 conferences when I was a Lieutenant in New York
7 City, and regrettably at those press conferences
8 we were there to protest the fact that black
9 police officers had been shot by white officers,
10 while performing their duty and having
11 identifiable markings, either the pins or the
12 head bands that we wore at that time.
13 The point I'm trying to make is
14 that the police can do their job now very
15 capably with the laws which are on the books. To
16 allow them to go in a wanton sense after
17 criminals, I think creates a bad atmosphere and
18 will result in even more shooting by the police
19 which are unnecessary.
20 I agree when an officer is shot.
21 I've attended funerals of officers. I have a
22 cop even now who has been shot. Some of these
23 guys were my buddies who died, but I don't think
24 that giving them unparalleled power just to stop
25 and frisk and perhaps even kill people is the
2920
1 way to go. I would hope that we would show more
2 restraint. I hope the vote is better this year
3 than it was last year.
4 I vote in the no.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
6 Waldon will be recorded in the negative.
7 Senator DeFrancisco, did you wish
8 to explain your vote?
9 SENATOR DeFRANCISCO: Yes, I do.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
11 DeFrancisco, to explain his vote.
12 SENATOR DeFRANCISCO: I vote no
13 for some of the reasons that were discussed
14 earlier, but it has nothing to do with my
15 concern of police officers overstepping their
16 bounds. I believe most, if not all police
17 officers do, in fact, do what they think is
18 reasonable under the circumstances as Senator
19 Volker had mentioned.
20 My concern -- well, one of the
21 good parts of the bill I think before I mention
22 the bad, the good parts about the bill, I think
23 is every court, if they're going to suppress
24 evidence, should be required to in writing
25 articulate their reasons why. That gives the
2921
1 record for the appellate court to make a
2 determination as to whether those reasons were
3 legitimate or not legitimate, rather than just
4 by having a vote or a ruling without any
5 explanation. I think that every court should be
6 subject to review in that sense.
7 The difficulty I have with it is
8 I don't know how a police officer could possibly
9 understand the standard under which this bill
10 would govern their actions. An officer can stop
11 someone when he has an objective credible
12 reason, not indicative of criminality, an
13 objective, objective -- objective, credible
14 reason of what? And I don't know how you follow
15 that standard as a police officer in trying to
16 enforce the law under these circumstances.
17 So for those reasons, I will vote
18 no, and I would certainly hope that this bill
19 could be corrected to not only give police
20 officers a broader flexibility in how they do
21 their actions but also to give the police
22 officers a standard which they can legitimately
23 interpret so that they know the bounds of their
24 responsibility.
25 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
2922
1 DeFrancisco will be recorded in the negative.
2 Announce the negatives.
3 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
4 the negative on Calendar Number 448 are Senators
5 Abate, Connor, DeFrancisco, Gold, Kruger,
6 Lachman, Leichter, Markowitz, Mendez,
7 Montgomery, Nanula, Paterson, Rosado, Sampson,
8 Santiago, Seabrook, Smith, Stavisky and Waldon.
9 Ayes 39, nays 19.
10 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
11 is passed.
12 Senator Marcellino, that
13 completes the reading of the controversial
14 calendar.
15 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr.
16 President, any housekeeping at the desk?
17 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: No.
18 SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr.
19 President, there being no further business, I
20 move we adjourn until Tuesday, April 15, at 3:00
21 p.m.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
23 objection, the Senate stands adjourned until
24 tomorrow, tomorrow, Tuesday, April 15, at 3:00
25 p.m.
2923
1 (Whereupon at 5:29 p.m., the
2 Senate adjourned.)
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