Regular Session - April 16, 1997
3027
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9 ALBANY, NEW YORK
10 April 16, 1997
11 11:02 a.m.
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14 REGULAR SESSION
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18 SENATOR CARL L. MARCELLINO, Acting President
19 STEPHEN F. SLOAN, Secretary
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3028
1 P R O C E E D I N G S
2 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: The
3 Senate will come to order. Ask everyone present
4 if you will please rise and repeat with me the
5 Pledge of Allegiance.
6 (The assemblage repeated the
7 Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag. )
8 In the absence of clergy, may we
9 have a moment of silence, please.
10 (A moment of silence was
11 observed. )
12 Have the reading of the Journal.
13 THE SECRETARY: In Senate,
14 Tuesday, April 15th. The Senate met pursuant to
15 adjournment. The Journal of Monday, April 14th,
16 was read and approved. On motion, Senate
17 adjourned.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
19 Without objection, the Journal stands approved
20 as read.
21 Presentation of petitions.
22 Messages from the Assembly.
23 Messages from the Governor.
24 Reports of standing committees.
25 Reports of select committees.
3029
1 Communications and reports from
2 state officers.
3 Motions and resolutions. The
4 Chair recognizes Senator Tully.
5 SENATOR TULLY: Thank you, Mr.
6 President. On behalf of Senator Lack, please
7 place a sponsor's star on Calendar Number 516.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: A
9 sponsor's star will be placed on Calendar Number
10 516.
11 Senator Bruno.
12 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President, I
13 believe there is a privileged resolution by
14 Senator DeFrancisco. I would ask that the title
15 be read and that we move for its immediate
16 adoption.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
18 Secretary will read.
19 THE SECRETARY: By Senator
20 DeFrancisco, Legislative Resolution Number 1051,
21 honoring the students of the International
22 Relations Club and 2-D Art Classes at Corcoran
23 High School, Syracuse, for their participation
24 in the 49th Senate District Good News! Good
25 Kids! Youth Responsibility Program.
3030
1 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
2 Senator DeFrancisco.
3 SENATOR DeFRANCISCO: I'm pleased
4 to have the students from the Corcoran High
5 School present here today to honor them by the
6 Senate passing this resolution.
7 As many of you know, we have a
8 program in Onondaga County called the Good News!
9 Good Kids! program. Unfortunately, nowadays we
10 oftentimes only hear about the negative things
11 that students do. Well, this program recognizes
12 good works of students in our community and, in
13 this case, the Corcoran High School has
14 participated for several years in a program that
15 recognizes and tries to help people in an
16 international setting. They raise money and in
17 the course of raising money, they provide good
18 works throughout the world actually, and in this
19 case, this year they raised $10,000 to fund a
20 medicinal herbal garden for the people of Mali,
21 which is a task that is sort of interesting to
22 think that high school students would be in that
23 situation to think about foreign students -
24 foreigners in this type of fashion, raising
25 money and also participating in activities such
3031
1 as this.
2 They have done other projects in
3 the past as well, and I just want to be here to
4 recognize each and every one of them and to let
5 people in our community know that we do have
6 good students and good people doing the right
7 things, and they should be recognized, and I
8 salute all of you for your fine work.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
10 Thank you, Senator.
11 We have a vote on the
12 resolution. All in favor of the resolution
13 signify by saying aye.
14 (Response of "Aye.")
15 Those opposed nay.
16 (There was no response. )
17 The ayes have it and the
18 resolution is passed.
19 Senator Bruno, with your
20 permission, we have the chaplain from the United
21 States Military Academy who will share the
22 invocation with us.
23 SENATOR BRUNO: Thank you, Mr.
24 President.
25 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
3032
1 Thank you.
2 CHAPLAIN FRITTS: Would you
3 please join me in prayer.
4 Our Heavenly Father, as we gather
5 today to recognize the United States Military
6 Academy, we first of all recognize You as the
7 source of all good things. Praise God from Whom
8 all blessings flow. Our Father, thank You for
9 our great nation, for our freedom and
10 prosperity. Thank You, Lord, for all who lead
11 our nation and for all who serve as leaders of
12 this great state. Thank You for our Military
13 Academy. May we all continue to prove ourselves
14 true to our mission and faithful in our
15 calling. By Your grace enable us to show
16 ourselves worthy of whatever honors we receive
17 and, in Your great goodness, bless us and make
18 us a blessing. We pray all this in Your holy
19 name. Amen.
20 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
21 Thank you very much.
22 Senator Bruno.
23 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President, I
24 believe we have a privileged resolution at the
25 desk. I would like to ask that it be read in
3033
1 its entirety, and call on Senator Larkin.
2 Thank you, Mr. President.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
4 Secretary will read Privileged Resolution 1049,
5 by Senator Larkin.
6 THE SECRETARY: By Senator
7 Larkin, Legislative Resolution Number 1049,
8 memorializing Governor George E. Pataki to
9 proclaim April 16, 1997 as West Point Day in New
10 York State.
11 WHEREAS, this legislative body is
12 justly proud to celebrate the establishment of
13 the United States Military Academy at West Point
14 and to call upon Governor George E. Pataki to
15 proclaim April 16, 1997 as West Point Day in New
16 York State, and
17 WHEREAS, by an act of Congress on
18 March 16, 1802, the United States Military
19 Academy was established within the borders of
20 New York State on the banks of the Hudson River;
21 and
22 WHEREAS, the Academy and its
23 graduates are an integral part of the proud
24 history of this state and nation; and
25 WHEREAS, the leadership and
3034
1 sacrifices of the members of the Long Grey Line
2 have helped this country withstand countless
3 threats to our cherished democratic way of life;
4 Alumni have excelled not only on
5 the battlefield but in many fields of endeavor;
6 The Academy continues to provide
7 our country with able and dedicated future
8 leaders;
9 Its scenic campus is a mecca each
10 year for thousands of visitors from across the
11 state, continent and other countries;
12 The United States Military
13 Academy is in the forefront of our state's
14 outstanding institutions of higher learning;
15 and
16 WHEREAS, 46 years ago the late
17 James T. McNamara, then a member of the New York
18 State Assembly and a member of the Academy's
19 class of 1939, was the author of the state
20 Legislature's first West Point Day Resolution,
21 and
22 WHEREAS, for decades our nation
23 has enjoyed the legacy of freedom and the United
24 States Military Academy at West Point has played
25 a vitally significant role in the maintenance of
3035
1 peace and freedom, and
2 WHEREAS, the members of this
3 legislative body are equally as proud to
4 commemorate this event marking April 16th, 1997
5 as West Point Day in New York State,
6 NOW, THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED,
7 that this legislative body pause in its
8 deliberations to celebrate the establishment of
9 the United States Military Academy at West Point
10 and to memorialize Governor George E. Pataki to
11 proclaim April 16, 1997 as West Point Day in New
12 York State, and
13 BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED, that a
14 copy of this resolution, suitably engrossed, be
15 transmitted to Governor George E. Pataki.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: The
17 Chair recognizes Senator Larkin.
18 SENATOR LARKIN: Joe?
19 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President,
20 Senator Larkin, for the moment, is deferring to
21 me, and I thank you for that.
22 I want to add just a welcome to
23 General Daniel Christman, who has joined us here
24 with these cadets from West Point. We are
25 privileged, and we are honored to have you
3036
1 here. General Christman is an example for all
2 the cadets, for all of us, as a person that we
3 can all look to in major accomplishments in his
4 life. Not enough that he gets to be a general
5 in the United States Army out of West Point, he
6 has a Master's in civil engineering, in public
7 affairs, I believe from Princeton, and he has a
8 law degree, George Washington University -
9 academically very impressive. But what is most
10 impressive is that he followed, as many of these
11 cadets will, Generals like Patton, Pershing,
12 MacArthur, Eisenhower, Schwartzkopf, who have
13 distinguished themselves as representatives of
14 the free world throughout the world.
15 So, General, we are honored to
16 have you here and we respect your leadership on
17 behalf of all the people of New York State and
18 the United States, and the example, the
19 leadership, that you provide to the candidates,
20 the cadets that are with you who will some day,
21 one of which may be addressed as General, has
22 accomplished.
23 I want to just take this moment
24 to also welcome and congratulate Bryan Campbell,
25 Cadet who is here who is a constituent of mine,
3037
1 and, General, thank you very much for that, and
2 General Traub is here. And, General, would you
3 stand up? This gentleman is the class of '28.
4 (Applause).
5 Looks as if he's jogging about
6 ten miles a day and still lifting about 210.
7 So we welcome you all here. We
8 truly are honored, and I would like now, Mr.
9 President, to defer to our very distinguished
10 Senator, Colonel Larkin.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
12 Colonel.
13 SENATOR LARKIN: Thank you, Mr.
14 President.
15 It is my honor and privilege to
16 offer before this house the resolution that you
17 heard read recognizing the United States
18 Military Academy at West Point. I am proud to
19 continue in the process that started with a
20 member of the class of 1939 this resolution.
21 I would like to again extend a
22 personal welcome to General Dan Christman, the
23 class of 1965, and his staff and members, the
24 West Point Society.
25 You know, 195 years ago, West
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1 Point was chosen to be the home of the Academy.
2 When you think of who's gone there and what they
3 did in their life, Grant, Lee, Eisenhower,
4 Patton, Schwartzkopf, these leaders share in a
5 knowledge that you will, as you go forward not
6 only strengthen the military, but you strengthen
7 the nation and you provide the people of our
8 country with pride and joy because you are the
9 most proud, you are the exceptional, you are
10 screened across the nation and we only accept
11 for service academies the best, the brightest
12 and those who will carry forward.
13 When General -- at that time,
14 excuse me, Colonel Sylvanus Thayer became
15 superintendent at West Point, he was an engineer
16 officer and, you know, it was funny because for
17 a long time he stressed the fact that engineers
18 should be the only persons chosen to be the
19 superintendent, but his actions were in two
20 phases. He wanted to strengthen the academic
21 and he wanted to strengthen the courage and
22 commitment. He was highly decorated, well
23 respected.
24 So when you look at today's
25 position, 195 years later, when you think we are
3039
1 now back to where Sylvanus Thayer was we haven't
2 missed a superintendent, General Christman, who
3 is an engineer officer.
4 General Christman has served in
5 combat in Vietnam; he's had combat engineers,
6 served as an adviser to two chairmen of the
7 Joint Chiefs of Staff. I think one of the
8 things that we look at today is, we have an
9 Academy here that most of us look at and say,
10 you know, West Point is a beautiful place and
11 many of us visit there. As a matter of fact,
12 General, I've heard that some people want to
13 come out and be environmentalists and check the
14 grass on the new golf course. I don't know
15 about that.
16 I'd like to have the cadets, as I
17 introduce you, to please stand.
18 First of all, the distinguished
19 Superintendent of the United States Military
20 Academy, an individual I call a friend, the
21 class of 1965, General Dan Christman.
22 (Applause)
23 We're also very fortunate to have
24 here today with us the Brigade First Captain,
25 Deputy -- he won a promotion too quick I see -
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1 Leticia Gasdick from California. (Applause)
2 Cadet Bryan Campbell, from my
3 home town, Troy, New York. (Applause)
4 Cadet Kristen Carlson, from
5 Staten Island. (Applause)
6 Cadet Douglas Chapman, from Great
7 Valley. (Applause)
8 Cadet Aaron Coombs, from
9 Addison. (Applause)
10 Cadet Sean Kilbride, from Garden
11 City. (Applause)
12 Cadet Jeramie D. Fitzgerald, from
13 Amherst. (Applause)
14 Cadet Kirsten Krucker, from
15 Suffern. (Applause)
16 Cadet Jaimie Leonard, from
17 Warwick. (Applause)
18 Cadet James Nati from Pine City.
19 (Applause)
20 Cadet Stephen Rubright, from New
21 York City. (Applause)
22 Cadet Allison Saunders, from New
23 York City. (Applause)
24 Cadet Paul Voelke, from my
25 district, Monroe, New York. (Applause)
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1 Cadet Marie Elizabeth Wolff, from
2 Queens. (Applause)
3 Cadet Vasiliki Zorbas, from Bay
4 Side.
5 SENATOR GOLD: That's Queens
6 too.
7 SENATOR LARKIN: Today's cadets,
8 as you view them, represent the bright young
9 people that will lead our nation. We have with
10 us here today first team as we call them. I
11 don't know how many corps we got here, I don't
12 know, you tell them at lunchtime about it but,
13 Mr. President, we must realize that the
14 challenges faced by today's corps of cadets are
15 vastly different than those encountered by many
16 of their predecessors.
17 Today's second lieutenants must
18 know how to move troops and equipment in hours
19 not like it used to take many of us leaders, in
20 months. The cadets sitting here today will be
21 asked to serve their nation in Bosnia, Congo,
22 Europe, the Far East.
23 Today's Army serves not only
24 abroad but here at home, Mr. President. I must
25 report that I'm especially fortunate to
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1 represent the region that bears witness every
2 day to what West Point means, not just in our
3 economics.
4 Every day you can see something
5 happening at West Point that has to do with the
6 quality of life in the Hudson Valley. West
7 Point is not an island within New York State.
8 The Long Grey Line participates not only in our
9 economy but in the hearts and souls of our
10 community. The corps brings its daily life to
11 our citizens, whether it's in education,
12 scouting, clean-up, religion, education,
13 training kids from inner cities, they're there
14 day in and day out.
15 Duty, honor -- excuse me, honor,
16 duty and country and a concern for others, Mr.
17 President. It is upon this bedrock of values
18 that each Cadet will build his or her career.
19 It is an unchanging standard that we in New York
20 must strive to embody. It is upon this bedrock
21 that the future leaders of the United States
22 Army will lead soldiers into harm's way if
23 necessary to preserve the freedom on which our
24 nation is founded.
25 We owe a debt of gratitude to the
3043
1 United States Military Academy for bestowing on
2 the state of New York all that is good in our
3 nation. We thank General Christman, his faculty
4 and staff and the corps of cadets for continuing
5 to build on the bedrock that was started on
6 these shores of the Hudson almost two centuries
7 ago.
8 Thank you very much.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
10 We're on the resolution. All in favor signify by
11 saying aye.
12 (Response of "Aye.")
13 All opposed nay.
14 (There was no response. )
15 The resolution is passed
16 unanimously, and the Chair would like to take
17 this opportunity to welcome the commander and
18 the cadets of the Academy. We wish you well,
19 wish you long life, good health and Godspeed.
20 (Applause)
21 Senator Larkin, would you like to
22 open this resolution up to the entire house?
23 SENATOR LARKIN: I most certainly
24 will. I think it's a privilege, and I would ask
25 that everyone join with me because in signing
3044
1 onto this resolution, you're also saying we
2 thank you for being here and for serving our
3 country.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: We
5 will open it up to the entire chamber. Anyone
6 who wishes not to be on it, please notify us.
7 Otherwise everybody will be placed on this
8 resolution.
9 SENATOR BRUNO: I would at this
10 time ask for a Rules Committee meeting in Room
11 328.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
13 There will be an immediate meeting of the Rules
14 Committee in Room 328, an immediate meeting of
15 the Rules Committee in Room 328.
16 Senator Bruno.
17 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President, I
18 believe there is another privileged resolution
19 at the desk, by Senator Larkin. I would ask
20 that the title be read and move for its
21 immediate adoption.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: We
23 will move Resolution 1050, by Senator Larkin.
24 The Secretary will read the title.
25 THE SECRETARY: By Senator
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1 Larkin, Legislative Resolution Number 1050,
2 honoring Edward D. Miller upon the occasion of
3 his retirement after 38 years of dedicated
4 service to the Chase Manhattan Corporation.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
6 Question is on the resolution. All in favor
7 signify by saying aye.
8 (Response of "Aye.")
9 All opposed nay.
10 (There was no response. )
11 The resolution is passed.
12 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President, I
13 believe there is a resolution at the desk, by
14 Senator Rath. I would ask that its title be
15 read, move for its immediate adoption.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
17 Secretary will read the resolution by Senator
18 Rath.
19 THE SECRETARY: By Senator Rath,
20 Legislative Resolution commemorating the 150th
21 Anniversary of Temple Beth El of Greater
22 Buffalo, New York.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
24 Chair recognizes Senator Rath. Excuse me. If we
25 could please have some order in the chamber. I
3046
1 thank you.
2 Senator Rath.
3 SENATOR RATH: Mr. President, I'd
4 like to move for immediate approval.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
6 Question is on the resolution. All in favor
7 signify by saying aye.
8 (Response of "Aye.")
9 All opposed nay.
10 (There was no response. )
11 The resolution is passed.
12 SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President, I
13 believe there is another resolution at the desk
14 by Senator Smith. I would ask its title be read
15 and move for its immediate adoption.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
17 Secretary will read Resolution 1052, by Senator
18 Smith.
19 THE SECRETARY: By Senator Smith,
20 Legislative Resolution Number 1052 commemorating
21 the 25th Anniversary of the Rockaway Revue,
22 Inc.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
24 Question is on the resolution. All in favor
25 signify by saying aye.
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1 (Response of "Aye.")
2 All opposed nay.
3 (There was no response. )
4 The ayes have it. The resolution
5 is passed.
6 Senator Bruno, we have a
7 substitution at the desk. Can we take care of
8 that?
9 SENATOR BRUNO: Yes, please do,
10 Mr. President.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
12 Secretary will read.
13 THE SECRETARY: On page 5,
14 Senator Maltese moves to discharge from the
15 Committee on -- excuse me, the Committee on
16 Consumer Protection Assembly Bill Number 3627,
17 and substitute it for the identical Third
18 Reading Calendar 607.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
20 Substitution is made.
21 Senator Bruno, we are at the
22 non-controversial calendar.
23 SENATOR BRUNO: I believe we're
24 ready at this time, Mr. President, for the non
25 controversial calendar.
3048
1 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
2 Secretary will read.
3 THE SECRETARY: On page number
4 22, Calendar Number 318, by Senator DeFrancisco,
5 Senate Print 1939, an act to amend the Parks,
6 Recreation and Historic Preservation Law, in
7 relation to requiring operators.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
9 Read the last section.
10 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
11 act shall take effect on the 1st day of April.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
13 Call the roll.
14 (The Secretary called the roll. )
15 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 48, nays 2,
16 Senators Kuhl and Maltese recorded in the
17 negative.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: The
19 bill is passed.
20 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
21 363, by Senator Cook, Senate Print 722, an act
22 to amend the Executive Law, in relation to
23 reports by registered charitable organizations.
24 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
25 Read the last section.
3049
1 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
2 act shall take effect in 90 days.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
4 Call the roll.
5 (The Secretary called the roll. )
6 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: The
8 bill is passed.
9 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
10 449, by Senator Volker, Senate Print 3456, an
11 act to enact the Criminal Procedure Law Reform
12 Act of 1997.
13 SENATOR PATERSON: Lay aside,
14 please.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: Lay
16 the bill aside.
17 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
18 455, by member of the Assembly DiNapoli,
19 Assembly Print 5299, an act to amend the
20 Environmental Conservation Law, in relation to
21 the definition of a public body.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
23 Read the last section.
24 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
25 act shall take effect immediately.
3050
1 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
2 Call the roll.
3 (The Secretary called the roll. )
4 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: The
6 bill is passed.
7 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
8 458, by Senator Lack, Senate Print 3511-A, an
9 act authorizing the State University of New York
10 to lease and contract for the design.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
12 Read the last section.
13 SENATOR BRUNO: Is there a
14 message at the desk?
15 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
16 There is a message of necessity at the desk.
17 SENATOR BRUNO: I ask the message
18 be read at this time.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
20 Read the message. Move to accept the message.
21 All in favor signify by saying aye.
22 (Response of "Aye.")
23 Opposed nay.
24 (There was no response. )
25 The message is accepted.
3051
1 Read the last section.
2 THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This
3 act shall take effect immediately.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
5 Call the roll.
6 (The Secretary called the roll. )
7 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: The
9 bill is passed.
10 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
11 468, by Senator Velella, Senate Print 3883, an
12 act to repeal Section 4227 of the Insurance Law,
13 relating to limitations on new business.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
15 Read the last section.
16 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
17 act shall take effect immediately.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
19 Call the roll.
20 (The Secretary called the roll. )
21 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: The
23 bill is passed.
24 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
25 470, by Senator Alesi, Senate Print 4012, an act
3052
1 to amend the Insurance Law, in relation to
2 making various technical corrections.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
4 Read the last section.
5 THE SECRETARY: Section 16. This
6 act shall take effect immediately.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
8 Call the roll.
9 (The Secretary called the roll. )
10 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 50.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: The
12 bill is passed.
13 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
14 520, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 3791-A.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
16 Excuse me. Gentlemen, ladies, if we could have
17 some order in the house it would be a big help
18 up here. Thank you. I'm sorry.
19 Continue, please.
20 THE SECRETARY: An act to amend
21 the Surrogate's Court Procedure Act, in relation
22 to the advance payment of fees of a guardian ad
23 litem.
24 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
25 Read the last section.
3053
1 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
2 act shall take effect immediately.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
4 Call the roll.
5 (The Secretary called the roll. )
6 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 51.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: The
8 bill is passed.
9 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
10 528, by Senator Rath, Senate Print 3641, an act
11 to amend the Real Property Tax Law, and the Real
12 Property Law, in relation to taxation of
13 converted condominium units.
14 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
15 Read the last section.
16 THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
17 act shall take effect immediately.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
19 Call the roll.
20 (The Secretary called the roll. )
21 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 51.
22 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: The
23 bill is passed.
24 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
25 530, by Senator Rath, Senate Print 4054, an act
3054
1 to amend the Village Law, in relation to making
2 technical changes.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
4 Read the last section.
5 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
6 act shall take effect on the same date as such
7 chapter.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
9 Call the roll.
10 (The Secretary called the roll. )
11 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 51.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: The
13 bill is passed.
14 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
15 592, by Senator Trunzo, Senate Print 4421-A, an
16 act to provide a retirement incentive for
17 certain public employees.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
19 Read the last section.
20 SENATOR BRUNO: Is there a
21 message at the desk?
22 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
23 There is a message of necessity at the desk.
24 SENATOR BRUNO: Move its
25 acceptance.
3055
1 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: Move
2 the approval of the message of necessity. All
3 in favor say aye.
4 (Response of "Aye.")
5 Opposed nay.
6 (There was no response.)
7 The ayes have it. The message is
8 approved. Read the last section.
9 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
10 act shall take effect immediately.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
12 Call the roll.
13 (The Secretary called the roll. )
14 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 51.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: The
16 bill is passed.
17 Senator Bruno, that completes the
18 controver... the non-controversial calendar.
19 SENATOR BRUNO: Can we at this
20 time, Mr. President, return to the order of
21 standing committees. I believe there is a
22 report from the Rules Committee at the desk.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
24 Secretary will read the report of the Rules
25 Committee.
3056
1 THE SECRETARY: Senator Bruno,
2 from the Committee on Rules, reports the
3 following bill direct to third reading: Senate
4 Print 4119-A, by Senator Velella, an act to
5 amend the Insurance Law.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
7 This bill needs a message. Without objection,
8 we'll move it to the Third Reading Calendar.
9 SENATOR BRUNO: Lay it aside
10 until the message arrives, Mr. President.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: Lay
12 the bill aside until we get a message.
13 Senator Meier, why do you rise?
14 SENATOR MEIER: Mr. President, I
15 ask unanimous consent to be recorded in the
16 negative on Calendar 318.
17 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
18 Without objection.
19 Senator Seward.
20 SENATOR SEWARD: Yes, Mr.
21 President. I'd like to place a sponsor's star
22 on Calendar Number 404.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: A
24 sponsor's star will be placed on Calendar Number
25 404 at the request of Senator Seward.
3057
1 SENATOR SEWARD: Thank you.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
3 Senator Bruno, may we take up the controversial
4 calendar, please.
5 SENATOR BRUNO: Can we at this
6 time, Mr. President, take up the controversial
7 calendar.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
9 Thank you, sir. Secretary will read Calendar
10 Number 449, Senate Bill Number 3456.
11 THE SECRETARY: On page 28,
12 Calendar Number 449, by Senator Volker, Senate
13 Print 3456, an act to enact the Criminal
14 Procedure Reform Act of 1997.
15 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Explanation.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
17 Senator Volker, an explanation has been
18 requested.
19 SENATOR VOLKER: Mr. President,
20 this is a bill that passed this house
21 unanimously the last two years and passed also,
22 a piece of this passed as part of the Criminal
23 Justice Omnibus Act of 1996, which did not pass
24 unanimously and was voted on 47 to 12 by this
25 house.
3058
1 What this bill involves is that
2 -- it's a comparatively small bill; that is, it
3 is only a three-page bill -- but in all honesty
4 it does have some wide repercussions in dealing
5 with, again, a problem that has been occurring,
6 in all honesty, on a regular basis in this state
7 involving the Court of Appeals and the Appellate
8 Division reinterpreting the law in this state
9 and the Constitution, superseding rulings that
10 have been in place for many, many, many years,
11 allowing criminals to go free in cases that can
12 only be termed as hypertechnical rulings that
13 allow, in effect, clearly guilty defendants to
14 go free.
15 On this floor here earlier this
16 week, we discussed another bill and the saying
17 was that people were frightened that somehow
18 this was going to create some sort of havoc in
19 the criminal justice system. I can assure you
20 that some of the rulings that are being, in
21 effect, changed in this bill involve cases that
22 have created havoc in the criminal justice
23 system, and I suspect very strongly it's partly
24 because the Court of Appeals doesn't completely
25 understand what has been occurring out in the
3059
1 streets of this state, and to a certain extent
2 throughout this country.
3 Now, there are a series of
4 changes that are involved here, but let me just
5 quickly get through them because I went through
6 pages of this sort of thing and ironically
7 though they come down to two very specific
8 areas.
9 One area involves the case called
10 the Ranghele case which is a case that threw out
11 and has thrown out a number of murder cases,
12 frankly, as well as other felony cases, and they
13 relate to the failure to produce pre-trial
14 statements and by no means, by the way, does
15 this bill dramatically change that ruling except
16 what happened here is that the Ranghele case
17 basically said, even if the failure to produce a
18 pre-trial statement as regards a witness did not
19 prejudice the defendant or, in fact, was done
20 inadvertently that after the entire proceeding
21 was done the courts went back and threw the
22 whole proceeding out, the whole trial, because
23 of the fact that the technical rulings of the
24 law were not specifically followed.
25 In the O'Dougherty case, that
3060
1 case involves a section of the law that says
2 that within 15 days or 15 days prior to the
3 arraignment, the prosecutor must offer to the
4 defense the -- his intent to offer statements of
5 identification evidence, or confessions by the
6 defendant.
7 In a number of cases, the
8 prosecutor, in fact, was not even aware of some
9 evidence that later came up either during the
10 trial or afterwards and the prosecutor did
11 inform the defendant -- the defendant, of
12 course, already knew about it because the
13 defendant was involved in the statements and in
14 the identification -- a number of cases were
15 thrown out on that basis.
16 What this bill would say is that
17 the prosecutor must give the defendant
18 reasonable time to review such confessions or
19 whatever is involved, and if necessary adjourn
20 the case to give the defense their opportunity
21 to make sure that the defendant is given his
22 proper -- proper due.
23 Another section of the law that
24 has been, I think, probably one of the most
25 abused by the courts, and I hate to say this but
3061
1 I think it's a fact, was a famous case here in
2 New York which is called People vs. Ricks and
3 Mack, in which prior to the trial and during the
4 process of picking a jury the defendant had been
5 present, but the defense attorney left the
6 defense to the defendant, to leave the room. In
7 fact, a lot of defense attorneys would rather
8 not have the defendants there for the entire
9 process.
10 In any case, two jurors went
11 before the judge and said that they had read
12 some pre-trial publicity and, therefore, didn't
13 feel that they should be jurors. The two were
14 dismissed as jurors. The defense attorney did
15 not object to the fact that the defendant wasn't
16 there. After the whole trial was over, it was
17 used as a means of overturning the entire
18 decision in the murder case.
19 What this bill would say is and
20 would allow the right to be present at all
21 stages of the proceeding is absolutely essential
22 and is sacred but that, if the defense attorney
23 himself, his own -- the person who makes the
24 decision doesn't object, doesn't ask that the
25 defendant be there explicitly, doesn't bring up
3062
1 any kind of objection, and there's no showing of
2 any prejudice -- in this case there was no
3 showing of any prejudice because the jurors were
4 dismissed -- then the trial can obviously
5 proceed and that can't be used as a means of
6 dismissing the case.
7 Another major piece of this would
8 be in identification testimony, and I think this
9 particularly applies to New York City. There
10 have been a number of cases where there have
11 been line-ups and there have been identifica
12 tions by witnesses. By the time the trial comes
13 up, it's years later, two things could occur.
14 One, the defendant very often looks tremendously
15 different, and one of the reasons he looks
16 tremendously different is by deliberation -- by
17 deliberate -- deliberate attempt to do so.
18 The second thing is it's so long
19 in the future that the witness may not actually
20 recognize that person from the time that he
21 actually identified -- he or she identified him
22 in the line-up, so the other -- by the way, the
23 other thing is, and this happens in some of the
24 mob trials, there's threats against the
25 witnesses who are now not really willing to
3063
1 identify the person because they're afraid, by
2 intimidation.
3 All this would say is that it
4 would allow the introduction of evidence by the
5 law enforcement people that that person did
6 identify the defendant as the perpetrator of the
7 crime during a line-up or in a statement or
8 whatever. Of course, the defendant has the
9 right to make all sorts of objections and bring
10 in any kinds of evidence he can to still object
11 to that identification, but the idea here is
12 that -- is not to set the situation up that is
13 so super-technical that, in effect, the
14 defendant can use some sort of vehicle to get
15 out of a conviction even though he's guilty.
16 So basically, and there are a
17 couple of other provisions, one relating to
18 preclusion orders. There has been a very
19 technical decision made that says that the
20 prosecutor can appeal a suppression motion but
21 can't appeal a -- an order, a pre-trial order
22 precluding evidence. It's not in the law; it's
23 just that by court decision this kind of
24 situation has occurred and has allowed clearly
25 guilty defendants to be able to escape justice.
3064
1 So this is a series -- what this
2 sets up is a series of situations where the
3 defendant is not by any means necessarily
4 prejudiced but allows the trial to move ahead
5 without the technical violations that have been
6 created by court statute, and I think levels the
7 playing field in a whole series of these cases.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
9 Senator Waldon.
10 SENATOR WALDON: Senator Volker
11 yield to a question?
12 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
13 Senator Volker, do you yield to Senator Waldon?
14 He yields.
15 SENATOR WALDON: Thank you very
16 much, Mr. President. Thank you, Senator
17 Volker. Senator, the history of this bill is
18 that it was passed in our house. Is there a
19 history of its passing in the Assembly?
20 SENATOR VOLKER: No, although
21 pieces of this bill -- the omnibus act of last
22 year which passed this house, pieces of that
23 bill did pass, and in fact in last year's -- a
24 couple of last year's criminal justice bills
25 there was some pieces of the bill that was part
3065
1 of the Procedure Act of last year, but this bill
2 as such, no, you're right, did not pass the
3 Assembly.
4 SENATOR WALDON: Would the
5 gentleman yield to another question?
6 SENATOR VOLKER: Certainly.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: He
8 yields. Before you do, Senator Waldon, please,
9 can we have some quiet and can we keep the door
10 over there closed so we don't hear the noise
11 from the outside. I appreciate that.
12 Senator Waldon.
13 SENATOR WALDON: Senator Volker,
14 it is my understanding that the meaning of the
15 Ranghele decision is that the party who is best
16 able to produce witness statements and to locate
17 and provide evidence regarding the trial is duty
18 bound to do so. Wouldn't this proposal that you
19 are submitting for our consideration remove the
20 burden from the prosecution which could be
21 perhaps characterized as encouraging
22 prosecutorial misconduct?
23 SENATOR VOLKER: No, I don't
24 think so at all. In fact, I -- I know so. We
25 still -- the Ranghele case, well, I explained it
3066
1 to reporters and I know you understand it very
2 well. This bill does not take away the
3 obligation of the prosecutor to provide or to
4 produce pre-trial statements of the witnesses.
5 The problem has been that in a
6 number of cases, the prosecutor was not aware of
7 the pre-trial statements until the trial is in
8 motion or until and, in fact, after the trial is
9 over. Then the question becomes, since it was
10 not through negligence of the prosecutor and in
11 particular, while the trial is in motion, the
12 prosecutor then provides those statements to the
13 defense attorney and gives the defense attorney
14 whatever is necessary for him to be able to
15 prepare his -- to continue to prepare his case,
16 and remember that this would be -- this is the
17 judicial decision would allow the judge to see
18 it. If the judge says, Look, you should have
19 known, and/or it did prejudice the defendant
20 then the case is going to be thrown out.
21 There's nothing in this bill that
22 would not allow that. It's just that we're
23 changing -- in effect, changing the super
24 technical interpretation that Ranghele -- the
25 Ranghele case has developed over the years that
3067
1 basically said that any kind of omission by the
2 prosecutor, even if inadvertent and even though
3 he tries to remedy it, as soon as he is aware of
4 it, is grounds for throwing the case out
5 entirely.
6 SENATOR WALDON: Would the
7 gentleman -- Mr. President, would the gentleman
8 yield again?
9 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
10 Senator, do you yield?
11 SENATOR VOLKER: Yes.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: He
13 yields, Senator.
14 SENATOR WALDON: Senator Volker,
15 I'm listening very carefully to what you're
16 saying, and it appears that what you're saying,
17 to my ear, all prosecutors would, under all
18 circumstances, without reservation turn over all
19 evidence to the defense side, but it is my
20 understanding that that has not been the
21 history.
22 Part of it is that our judicial
23 proceeding is a very adversarial process, and
24 people like to win and when one wants to win,
25 sometimes one takes undue advantage of the other
3068
1 and, again, it is my understanding that Ranghele
2 makes it a duty of the prosecutor to turn over
3 the evidence, and this would remove that duty.
4 Am I still unclear following your
5 explanation?
6 SENATOR VOLKER: The duty to turn
7 over the statements is, in fact, there before
8 Ranghele. Ranghele -- what the Ranghele case
9 stood for is an extension of that duty to the
10 point where any kind of omission or any kind of,
11 for instance, in some cases the pre-trial
12 statements were statements that really had
13 nothing to do with the -- ultimately with the
14 resolution of the case and were so minor that
15 the district attorney was not even aware that
16 they were there.
17 Now, to answer your question, by
18 the way, would all prosecutors be totally
19 diligent? Probably not. I think that's true,
20 and that's why this would not overrule their
21 duty. They still have the duty to turn over the
22 statement, and they have the duty to do it as
23 soon as they become aware of it and if, after
24 the trial is over, it's found that they should
25 have been aware of it and they weren't, or they
3069
1 didn't turn over the statements, this -- this
2 provision would not -- would not change the fact
3 that a judge could certainly throw that case out
4 just as it is under Ranghele now.
5 What we're trying to do is give
6 the option where it was a very honest omission
7 and where there was no really prejudice to the
8 case, the determination of no necessarily lack
9 of prejudice, that case could still go on.
10 SENATOR WALDON: Mr. President,
11 would the gentleman yield once again?
12 SENATOR VOLKER: Sure.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: The
14 Senator yields, Senator Waldon.
15 SENATOR WALDON: Senator Volker,
16 earlier when you were explaining the bill, if I
17 recall correctly, you mentioned something about
18 the police officers giving witness
19 identification -
20 SENATOR VOLKER: Right.
21 SENATOR WALDON: -- testimony,
22 but under what you're proposing now, wouldn't it
23 change the obligation of the police officer?
24 Wouldn't it allow the police officer greater
25 latitude in presenting evidence on the trial or
3070
1 at the trial that before this time if this were
2 to become law, would be excluded?
3 SENATOR VOLKER: Not really. The
4 only thing that it would do is, on the issue,
5 and I know you're aware of it, the technical
6 nature, and we discussed this at the committee
7 just the other day, the technical nature of
8 line-ups and pre-trial identification and all
9 that sort of thing. What this would do is to
10 cause the possibility that, in certain cases,
11 that testimony could be given as to the fact
12 that the witness who may be -- may not want to
13 testify for, maybe because of coercion or
14 because of the years that have gone by since the
15 case -- since the incident happened, may be
16 unable to identify that person because of a
17 change in the person's features, and so forth,
18 but was able to identify that person clearly in
19 line-ups earlier, that the law enforcement
20 officer can testify only that person did
21 identify the defendant, the person in this case
22 as the person who -- who was identified.
23 Interesting thing about that is
24 it was suggested to me there's a reverse to
25 that. It could also be used, by the way,
3071
1 against the prosecution because you could
2 potentially have a police officer put on the
3 stand to say that that person's identification
4 at the time was of somebody else in the first
5 instance which I think maybe some people didn't
6 think of, which actually could fall on the
7 defense side because right now that would never
8 happen.
9 SENATOR WALDON: Would the
10 gentleman yield again, Mr. President?
11 SENATOR VOLKER: Certainly.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: He
13 yields, sir.
14 SENATOR WALDON: I appreciate
15 your patience, Senator Volker.
16 Not related to this proposal but
17 related to this proposal, last year and this
18 year, is it your recollection that the Governor
19 has moved to, with a sharp knife, cut away those
20 monies that traditionally were in the budget for
21 defendants' rights for the legal aid and/or
22 defense counsel for those who are imprisoned or
23 who are arrested and who are indigent to be able
24 to defend themselves while at the same time -
25 while at the very same pregnant moment, putting
3072
1 extremely large sums of money on the
2 prosecutorial side of the budget.
3 SENATOR VOLKER: Senator, I must
4 be honest with you. As you know I am, try to be
5 honest. Two years ago I asked the budget
6 director if there was somewhat of a mistake in
7 the budget because all the funds for prosecution
8 and defense had been initially eliminated.
9 Later some of the funds were restored. The
10 answer is that there were cuts in both the
11 prosecution and the defense. In fact, that has
12 occurred this year. This year there hasn't been
13 as much cutting on the prosecution side as on
14 the defense side, that's true, but as you well
15 know, the Legislature restored virtually all the
16 money on the defense side, so I think the answer
17 is, although there were some cuts in the -
18 certainly cuts in the defense, there were also
19 cuts in the prosecution over the last two years
20 also.
21 SENATOR WALDON: If I may
22 continue, Mr. President, would the gentleman
23 continue to yield?
24 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
25 Senator, do you continue to yield?
3073
1 SENATOR VOLKER: Certainly.
2 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: He
3 continues to yield.
4 SENATOR WALDON: Senator Volker,
5 I will trust the advice that I have received.
6 It may not be accurate, and I will share it with
7 you and please correct me if you know better
8 than the advice I have received. It is my
9 understanding from my advisers that the ratio of
10 money that Governor Pataki recommended to us,
11 prosecution side or defense side, previous
12 budget was 60-40. This year it is 80-20, and in
13 previous lines there was greater equity.
14 Certainly those who are unable to
15 afford defense in the history of this country
16 have been afforded every opportunity to defend
17 themselves. Part of the reason that this nation
18 was created was that people were running from
19 the booted heel of those who were in charge and
20 who were the authority and who, with complete
21 abandon, foisted their will on those who were
22 less able to -- than themselves to assume power,
23 but not going back that far as to when the
24 nation was founded, just talking about the last
25 couple of years.
3074
1 Is it your understanding that
2 that is the approximate ratio of the money put
3 on the prosecutors' side versus the defenders'
4 side?
5 SENATOR VOLKER: You're
6 absolutely right, Senator, the 60-40; I don't
7 know about the 80-20 but let me just point out
8 to you something that is not generally known
9 although that 60-40 ratio is the ratio that this
10 Legislature -- Republicans, Democrats, Assembly,
11 Senate -- has generally used as far as direct
12 state money; there is a lot of other money that
13 goes to the defense side, in fact from local
14 governments as well as areas such as IOLA, which
15 is not figured into it, which is a fund that
16 comes from attorney accounts and a lot of that
17 money, most of that money, in fact goes to
18 defense -- defense people. So there is a lot of
19 ways in which -- and that's one of the ways for
20 the establishment of the 60-40, that I often
21 said that there's no -- there's no fund around
22 to support the death penalty but there's big
23 money opposing it and always has been from the
24 private sector and from the local public sector
25 and from all sorts of foundations.
3075
1 You're right that this year the
2 initial Governor's budget has cut back from the
3 60-40, I don't know if it's 80-20, you may be
4 accurate. I don't know, but before this session
5 is over, Senator, I would predict that this
6 ratio would end up generally about what it was
7 in the past.
8 SENATOR WALDON: Would the
9 gentleman continue to yield, Mr. President?
10 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
11 Senator Volker, you continue to yield?
12 SENATOR VOLKER: Yes.
13 SENATOR WALDON: Senator Volker,
14 let me thank you for this colloquy. You and I
15 serve on the same committee, you as the
16 chairman. We have much dialogue about these
17 issues. Our dialogue has never been contentious
18 though philosophically sometimes we are far
19 distant, but we've always, in my opinion, I hope
20 that you will feel the same way or do feel the
21 same, we have always dialogued openly, honestly
22 and for the purpose of trying to find the kernel
23 of truth that allows the state to govern itself
24 better than it's governing itself at the
25 moment.
3076
1 In that regard, are you at all
2 troubled by the overwhelming number of
3 prosecutor-driven proposals which are sent to
4 our committees? By that, I mean we do not often
5 see bills proposed which have as the first
6 consideration the defendants' side, but we see
7 many, many bills originating, perhaps even most
8 of them originating from the Governor's office,
9 with a prosecutorial mentality inherent in the
10 bill. Does that at all trouble you?
11 SENATOR VOLKER: Let me -- let me
12 just say this that no, I'm really not troubled
13 by it. I -- I think, although I sometimes am
14 concerned by, I think the impression that's
15 being made that somehow some of the court cases
16 are really just balancing the equities. I have
17 to tell you something, that -- and I have never
18 been one -- I don't believe I've ever been one
19 that has been a severe critic of the courts
20 although I have to admit to you that there's
21 been some times in the last few years I mean we
22 have late budgets in part here because of the
23 decision by the Court of Appeals that is not
24 well known, the so-called "bankers decision",
25 that sent the process here into chaos and we got
3077
1 to pass two budgets every year now which has
2 been a major decision. The press doesn't
3 understand it; in fact, we don't completely
4 understand it. It changed our process here for
5 a century. You look at these cases, and I think
6 that the most -- the biggest problem with these
7 cases lies not in the fact that they fall so
8 strongly on the defense side, but because they
9 don't deal with justice. In other words, a lot
10 of the cases say, Well, it probably didn't
11 prejudice the defendant, but we're going to
12 throw the case out anyway because they didn't
13 follow this hypertechnical rule. It's not that
14 the real -- the rights to that defendant were
15 prejudiced, in fact so much so that one thing
16 about it, if the rights of the defendant were so
17 prejudiced, actually the Court of Appeals could
18 throw the case out entirely and not even allow
19 appeal in certain cases and there's ways it
20 could be done, but the Court of Appeals, I
21 think, realized that in certain of these cases
22 that what they were doing was making a decision
23 that basically said, even though we knew that
24 this person is guilty, even though the evidence
25 was clear, there was a technical rule that
3078
1 wasn't followed and, therefore, we're going to
2 throw this case out, not thinking of the impact
3 that that case could have on future cases and
4 that's the problem with Ranghele. It has had
5 the impact of allowing hundreds of defendants,
6 because of that super-technical rule to go
7 free.
8 So my response to that is it
9 doesn't trouble me because what really troubles
10 me is that we have embarked on a situation in
11 this state, I think, where if the law is not
12 being followed as such, but what's happening is
13 that it's being interpreted way beyond what this
14 Legislature intended when we passed a whole
15 series of statutes in dealing with the criminal
16 law.
17 Beyond that, by the way, I would
18 be very concerned, and if we go too far, then
19 you will -- then you should be the first one to
20 criticize me, and I should be criticized but I
21 do not believe that any of these provisions in
22 here goes beyond the bounds of justice for both
23 the defense and the prosecution.
24 SENATOR WALDON: Thank you very
25 much, Senator.
3079
1 If I may, Mr. President, on the
2 bill.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
4 Senator Waldon, on the bill, please.
5 SENATOR WALDON: I respectfully
6 disagree with Senator Volker. I think that if
7 we were to change the guarantees of the Ranghele
8 case that we are creating a serious problem for
9 ourselves. It is very clear now what can and
10 cannot be done in these evidentiary situations.
11 Why make murky waters -
12 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
13 Senator, excuse me. Ladies and gentlemen, if we
14 could please have some quiet so we can hear the
15 Senator. I thank you.
16 Senator?
17 SENATOR WALDON: Why make murky
18 waters of crystal clear judicial streams? I
19 think we ought to leave Ranghele where it is.
20 If a defendant does not make certain
21 protestations during trial, now he can appeal.
22 I believe, under this proposal he loses that
23 right. Again, why muddy the waters which are
24 clear?
25 But I think the cogent thing that
3080
1 Senator Volker said which should really cause us
2 to think is that the judges are, and I'm
3 paraphrasing and I apologize if I'm not as
4 accurate as he was in his description, the
5 judges are going beyond the letter of the law in
6 their interpretation, but it is my
7 understanding, my brothers and sisters, in fact,
8 that that is their right, that this nation was
9 founded on separation of powers.
10 We have the executive branch, the
11 legislative branch and the judicial branch and
12 the balance of peer has to be kept separate and
13 apart and the judiciary, the judicial, the
14 judges, the justices have a right to interpret,
15 I think if you're familiar with that, we're
16 creating problems for ourselves and even though
17 I previously voted for this, I was wrong. I was
18 in error. I did not sufficiently do my home work
19 and read as carefully as I should have what
20 we've been given today to consider. I did not
21 get proper advice before this year. This
22 session I have. I did not read carefully
23 between the lines before. This year I have, and
24 I see a danger in what's being submitted for our
25 consideration, and I see a stop sign on the road
3081
1 that we're traveling which says, let's
2 reconsider this proposal.
3 I think it's time for us to take
4 a very strong stand against this and I would
5 encourage anyone within sound of my voice to
6 review before the debate is over, this bill and
7 to consider voting against this bill. Recognize
8 also that Senator Volker did respond when I said
9 what was the action taken in the Assembly and it
10 turned out no action was taken. That should
11 cause us to pause and to think.
12 This is a one-house bill. It's
13 part of the criminal justice package of the
14 Governor. If I did not know better, I would
15 think that prosecutors were drafting this and
16 submitting it for our consideration. So I
17 encourage all of you to vote no on this
18 proposal.
19 I thank Senator Volker, and I
20 thank you very much, Mr. President.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
22 Senator Gentile.
23 SENATOR GENTILE: Mr. President,
24 on the bill.
25 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
3082
1 Senator Gentile, on the bill.
2 SENATOR GENTILE: I speak from
3 experience as a prosecutor on this bill and the
4 prosecutors in this state under the decision of
5 the People v. Rosario, still have an obligation
6 to produce statements of witnesses prior to
7 beginning of a trial. That -- that obligation
8 remains. As soon as a witness' statement -
9 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
10 Senator Gentile. Senator Skelos, why do you
11 rise?
12 SENATOR SKELOS: If I could just
13 interrupt for a moment to have the last section
14 read for the purposes of Senator Leichter
15 voting.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
17 Secretary will read.
18 THE SECRETARY: Section 10. This
19 act shall take effect immediately.
20 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
21 Call the roll.
22 (The Secretary called the roll. )
23 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
24 Senator Leichter, how do you vote?
25 SENATOR LEICHTER: No.
3083
1 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
2 Senator Leichter will be recorded in the
3 negative. Withdraw the roll call. Senator
4 Gentile.
5 SENATOR GENTILE: Thank you, Mr.
6 President.
7 As I was saying, under the People
8 v. Rosario, prosecutors still have an obligation
9 to make known and produce statements of
10 witnesses when they become available or known to
11 the prosecutor or should have known -- should
12 have been known to the prosecutor. That
13 requirement still stands. The obligation under
14 United States vs. Brady, the Supreme Court
15 decision requires a prosecutor to produce any
16 exculpatory evidence upon its discovery,
17 immediately upon its discovery. That's still an
18 obligation of a prosecutor.
19 So the prosecutor is not running
20 wild in a situation like this. Under People v.
21 Ranghele what has happened is that this
22 requirement has been carried to the extent
23 whereby if, for example, a witness were to have
24 an entry in a diary and that diary were not
25 known to a prosecutor and an entry relating to
3084
1 something in the case, at any time after the
2 trial, if that entry were made known, that would
3 be, under Rangalli, a per se rule. There would
4 be a reversal of a conviction and a new trial
5 ordered even if that entry were duplicative or
6 equivalent of another statement that was turned
7 over to the defense.
8 The fact is that that is an
9 unrealistic expectation of prosecutors. If
10 someone were to write something on a matchbook
11 cover that related to the case and that match
12 book cover were not known to the prosecutor or
13 could not have been known to the prosecutor
14 until some time after or never known but
15 discovered at some point, the per se rule under
16 Rangalli would require a new trial even if that
17 statement had no effect on the outcome. It
18 would not have an effect on the outcome of the
19 trial.
20 This rule, this Rangalli rule is
21 a prosecutor's nightmare. It's been something
22 that has affected the cases in New York State
23 for too long. This rule is a bad rule. This
24 bill should be supported.
25 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
3085
1 Senator Abate.
2 SENATOR ABATE: Yes. Would
3 Senator Volker yield to two questions?
4 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
5 Senator Volker, do you yield?
6 SENATOR VOLKER: Certainly.
7 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: He
8 yields.
9 SENATOR ABATE: Yes. In terms of
10 just clarification for the record, my colleague,
11 Senator Gentile, talked a little bit about it.
12 You wish under this proposed legislation to
13 overturn the ruling of the Court of Appeals in
14 Ranghele which required a new trial when
15 material was not turned over, any Rosario
16 material was not turned over. Do you interpret
17 the language you're proposing in any way to
18 modify the Brady obligation?
19 SENATOR VOLKER: No, sir as such,
20 no. Matter of fact, I assume we did send you a
21 memo on that.
22 SENATOR ABATE: I just want it on
23 the record so that I understand.
24 SENATOR VOLKER: I understand.
25 No, the answer is no.
3086
1 SENATOR ABATE: So that any
2 material that's in the possession of the
3 district attorney that tends to exculpate the
4 defendant would still, if it was not disclosed
5 to the defendant, would require a new trial even
6 if this became law?
7 SENATOR VOLKER: I think that's
8 required by both U.S. and federal constitutional
9 law, and I think to abrogate that would put us
10 in a situation where it would make the statute
11 unconstitutional. So the answer to that is yes.
12 SENATOR ABATE: The other
13 question is, and it says that I seek advice from
14 you, Senator, to make a change. Right now, the
15 law says that prior identification, whether it
16 be a photo identification or line-up is
17 considered bolstering and is not admissible if
18 the -- whether the victim can make the in-court
19 identification or not.
20 My concern is that this bill now
21 says even if the witness can identify the
22 defendant in court, will there still be -- will
23 it still become admissible, these prior photo
24 identifications even if an in-court identifi
25 cation has been made because in that situation
3087
1 you have a bolstering situation? It's not
2 required for the people to make a case.
3 SENATOR VOLKER: Yeah, it doesn't
4 change the photo identification piece, so we
5 just reported a bill out, I think, as you know
6 which would do that, but this bill does not
7 change that. This relates to the present
8 process and to the fact that under certain
9 circumstances where the line-up, the previous
10 identification is put in, that there could be -
11 there could be a law enforcement officer or
12 whatever to testify as to that identification
13 assuming that that identification was part of a
14 trial in certain cases where the witness was
15 either reluctant or unable to identify years
16 later whatever, at the trial itself.
17 SENATOR ABATE: So -
18 SENATOR VOLKER: So it would not
19 change -- Let me just finish. As I understand
20 it, the previous ruling on lack of the
21 photographic evidence was -- is not changed. If
22 that were to be changed, that would be by a
23 separate bill that we just talked about in our
24 committee the other day.
25 SENATOR ABATE: O.K. So let me
3088
1 just clarify it again. If the witness can make
2 an in-court identification of the defendant -
3 SENATOR VOLKER: Yeah.
4 SENATOR ABATE: -- then it would
5 still be impermissible to introduce at trial a
6 prior identification, whether it be a photo
7 identification or a line-up?
8 SENATOR VOLKER: That's correct.
9 SENATOR ABATE: That would be
10 considered bolstering?
11 SENATOR VOLKER: Yes.
12 SENATOR ABATE: That would only
13 be admissible if the witness could not make an
14 in-court identification.
15 SENATOR VOLKER: Yes, that's
16 correct or a misidentification.
17 SENATOR ABATE: Or a mis
18 identification.
19 SENATOR VOLKER: And if you
20 remember, on the photo you're entitled to the
21 Wade hearing and all that protection, but that's
22 not in this bill. That change is not in this
23 bill.
24 SENATOR ABATE: Yes. On the
25 bill.
3089
1 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
2 Senator Abate, on the bill.
3 SENATOR ABATE: I will be voting
4 for this bill and the concerns are if we really
5 want to produce reform in the criminal justice
6 system, it has to be comprehensive and it has to
7 look at what results will expedite the cases,
8 and will produce earlier and open discovery.
9 My concern is we deal with the
10 prosecution side here and we talk about open and
11 early discovery. Why isn't that part of this
12 bill? Victims want open and early discovery. It
13 means that cases can be resolved that much
14 faster. Defendants want open and early
15 discovery, because they need to have enough
16 information to determine and their lawyers need
17 that information to determine if they want to
18 take a plea or go to trial. The courts
19 benefit. The earlier people get this discovery,
20 the better it is and I guess my query is, and if
21 -- my query is, why isn't this part of the
22 bill, open and early discovery?
23 That would be, along with these
24 reforms, would produce a dramatic change in how
25 the criminal justice system responds to the
3090
1 rights of defendants and responds to the needs
2 of crime victims.
3 And I'd also like to see in this
4 bill, and hopefully the good Senator Volker
5 would not only include early discovery reform
6 within this bill because then we would have a
7 balanced approach that Senator Waldon is talking
8 about, but penalties against the district
9 attorney when the district attorney does not
10 disclose Brady material. It should not have to
11 take an appeal to raise that issue. Brady
12 material, as we all know, is fundamentally
13 critical to prepare the defense in that trial.
14 There should be enough
15 disincentive placed upon the district attorney
16 so that no district attorney, because they are
17 aggressive, they want to assure a conviction,
18 fails in their responsibility to turn over these
19 exculpatory materials. So I am hoping that when
20 this is not a one-house bill but we have a
21 two-house bill that talks about these kinds of
22 issues in this bill or the other issues that I'm
23 raising, there will be a balanced approach. We
24 will get a bipartisan support for this effort,
25 not just the Senate but the Assembly.
3091
1 So I look forward to working with
2 Senator Volker's office to make these reforms
3 and include them in the bill.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
5 Read the last section, please.
6 THE SECRETARY: Section 10. This
7 act shall take effect immediately.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
9 Call the roll.
10 (The Secretary called the roll. )
11 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
12 Senator Waldon, to explain his vote.
13 SENATOR WALDON: Thank you very
14 much, Mr. President.
15 I would like everyone here to
16 understand that this is not the same bill as
17 last year. I think there was an inadvertent
18 slip in Senator Volker's response to my
19 questions, and I'm sure in his explanation of
20 his vote he can correct this if he wishes to,
21 but this is not the same bill as last year.
22 There are differences.
23 Mr. President, I respectfully ask
24 to be recorded in the negative.
25 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
3092
1 Senator Waldon in the negative.
2 THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
3 the negative on Calendar Number 449 are Senators
4 Leichter, Markowitz, Montgomery, Paterson,
5 Rosado, Sampson, Santiago, Smith and Waldon.
6 Ayes 49, nays -
7 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
8 Senator Connor.
9 THE SECRETARY: Also Senator
10 Connor. Ayes 48, nays 10.
11 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: The
12 bill is passed. Senator Skelos.
13 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President at
14 this time, if we could take up Calendar 692,
15 Senate Print 4119-A, by Senator Velella.
16 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
17 Secretary will read.
18 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
19 692, by Senator Velella, Senate Print 4119-A, an
20 act to amend the Insurance Law, in relation to
21 homeowners insurance.
22 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
23 is there a message at the desk?
24 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
25 Yes, Senator Skelos, the message of necessity is
3093
1 at the desk.
2 SENATOR SKELOS: Move to accept.
3 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: On
4 the message, motion to accept has been made.
5 All in favor say aye.
6 (Response of "Aye.")
7 Opposed nay.
8 (There was no response.)
9 The message is accepted,
10 Senator.
11 SENATOR SKELOS: Last section,
12 please.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: Read
14 the last section. .
15 THE SECRETARY: Section 13. This
16 act shall take effect immediately.
17 SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: An
19 explanation has been requested by Senator
20 Paterson.
21 SENATOR VELELLA: Yes, Mr.
22 President.
23 This bill is a continuation of
24 the coastal insurance bill that we passed last
25 year. It's a one-year extender and basically
3094
1 extends the program that we put in place to try
2 and relieve the pressure that was on the coastal
3 communities of our state as a result of a
4 shortage of availability of homeowner
5 insurance.
6 It continues on this year which
7 addresses the need for inner city insurance for
8 one year and it creates a temporary panel on
9 catastrophic insurance to come back and review
10 with us the need in this state to establish a
11 cat' fund which other states have.
12 We have several proposals before
13 the Insurance Committee to look at the
14 possibility of creating a catastrophic funds so
15 that when -- and we know it will hit, we don't
16 know when -- when a major hurricane does hit
17 Long Island or the coastal areas of our state
18 that we will have in place a fund sufficient to
19 insure those people who are the victims of this
20 catastrophe, that the monies will be available,
21 the insurance will be available and that we will
22 be able to deal with that problem when it
23 occurs.
24 There are several proposals that
25 we are looking at in the Insurance Committee,
3095
1 how to fund this. We've looked at other states
2 such as Texas, Florida, California. I am not
3 sure yet which direction we should be going in.
4 That's why we ask that this task force be
5 created with appointments by both of the houses,
6 with appointments by the Governor, to take a
7 good hard look at what we'll do with
8 catastrophic insurance.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
10 Senator Paterson, why do you rise?
11 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, Mr.
12 President. If Senator Volker would yield for a
13 few questions. I'm sorry, Senator Velella. I
14 always ask Senator Volker so many questions.
15 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
16 Senator Velella, Senator Velella, will you
17 yield?
18 SENATOR VELELLA: Yes.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
20 Senator Velella yields; Senator Volker refuses.
21 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, Mr.
22 President. I'll ask Senator Volker some of
23 questions I have in private.
24 Senator, I'm just taking a look
25 at this piece of legislation. We just brought it
3096
1 out of committee today, Senator, and I'm
2 somewhat unfamiliar with it. I do remember we
3 brought this bill before us on March 13th of
4 last year, and you and I discussed it and one of
5 the questions I asked you then was about the
6 rate plans for NYPIUA, and in Section 1 of the
7 bill right here in the first paragraph, if you
8 could explain what the whole rating system will
9 be for the policyholders.
10 SENATOR VELELLA: Are you
11 serious? Do you want me to explain the entire
12 rate structure and how it's determined and what
13 the factors are?
14 SENATOR PATERSON: Well, I'd like
15 an abridged explanation of the rate structure.
16 SENATOR VELELLA: O.K. Well, the
17 way rates are set is we have actuaries that look
18 at the experience and they look at the claims
19 that have been made, the premiums that have been
20 paid, they project out, based -- as actuaries
21 what the risk factors are and fair and
22 reasonable premiums to cover that risk and cover
23 the operation are made by the panel of experts.
24 How an actuary arrives at the
25 actual numbers is something that I've got to
3097
1 confess I don't have a sufficient education to
2 really explain to you. We have nine different
3 types of tests that an actuary must pass in this
4 state to be certified. It's like trying to
5 explain to you why a doctor performs a medical
6 procedure. He's educated, he's qualified. We
7 have supposedly the best actuaries available
8 that look at the marketplace, look at the
9 demands, look at the claims and set rates based
10 on that.
11 NYPIUA was formed because there
12 were a lot of companies that did not want to
13 issue insurance, particularly fire insurance in
14 the inner city. We formed that so that we could
15 have a joint group assume that risk, spread the
16 risk which is the principle of insurance and
17 have actuarially sound premiums put forward for
18 this.
19 It's a platter of right.
20 Companies that write other business in this
21 state participate into it. It's sort of a
22 forced underwriting procedure that we do so we
23 can provide fire insurance to people who own
24 properties in the inner cities where, if we left
25 the insurance companies on their own, they would
3098
1 choose not to write this.
2 SENATOR PATERSON: Mr.
3 President.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
5 Senator Paterson.
6 SENATOR PATERSON: Senator
7 Velella's point is well taken.
8 General questions like the one I
9 asked often earn the direction of over
10 simplification and I suppose that what I should
11 really do is just raise to Senator Volker if we
12 would yield to another question.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
14 Senator Velella, do you yield to another
15 question?
16 SENATOR PATERSON: Sorry, to
17 Senator Velella.
18 SENATOR VELELLA: Yes, I yield.
19 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
20 Senator Velella yields, sir.
21 SENATOR PATERSON: My concern is
22 really about the adjustment of rates itself and
23 particularly the increase of rates and how this
24 section of the legislation would affect the
25 prior approval system. I'm just wondering if
3099
1 any of the members will be able to raise or
2 adjust rates without consulting or coming back
3 to the Insurance Department or whatever the
4 appropriate authority would be.
5 SENATOR VELELLA: I'm sorry. I
6 was distracted because somebody was trying to
7 give me the information you had sought. Could
8 you just repeat the question.
9 SENATOR PATERSON: O.K. You
10 should ask Senator Volker; he knows this cold.
11 SENATOR VELELLA: Well, he's
12 counseled me for numerous hours on this bill.
13 SENATOR PATERSON: My question
14 was just the effect that the section of the
15 legislation, Section 1, is going to have on the
16 prior approval system, on the adjustment of
17 rates, whether or not there might be increases
18 in rates without approval of the state Insurance
19 Department or -
20 SENATOR VELELLA: Oh, no. The
21 answer to that is no. The board of actuaries
22 that look at this and make the recommendations
23 based on the availability, based on the
24 experience, based on all the underwriting
25 criteria will make a recommendation to the
3100
1 Superintendent of Insurance. Then the
2 superintendent approves the rate or does not
3 approve the rate. He may even at some point
4 decide if in his discretion he wants to hold a
5 public hearing on that rate he can always do
6 that. He generally doesn't. Companies come in
7 and might contest what an actuary says. He then
8 evaluates the evidence and then either makes a
9 ruling for or against the proposed rate.
10 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you,
11 Senator.
12 SENATOR VELELLA: You're welcome.
13 SENATOR PATERSON: Then, if I am
14 to -- if I am to infer from those remarks that
15 there would be no opportunity to actually change
16 the rates by the individual companies, then that
17 satisfies my concern.
18 I have just one last question if
19 the Senator would yield.
20 SENATOR VELELLA: Yes.
21 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
22 Senator, do you yield? Senator Velella yields.
23 SENATOR PATERSON: Senator
24 Velella, my question is just simply we passed
25 this legislation last year. We sunsetted the
3101
1 legislation for this point. Is there any reason
2 why we would not just establish permanency or
3 should I take from your original remarks that
4 there still isn't enough data or we have not
5 really acquired enough information to let us
6 know whether or not this should be a permanent
7 system?
8 SENATOR VELELLA: Well, I think
9 yes, you can take from my remarks that this is
10 an area where we have a state of flux. We're
11 dealing with very difficult issues to try and
12 evaluate, the cost of a hurricane hitting, the
13 cost of what -- what type of policy will allow
14 us to have availability in the marketplace, and
15 at the same time deliver a premium that is
16 reasonable to a homeowner, the issue of inner
17 city fire coverage. These are all things that
18 are in a state of flux.
19 I do want to -- I do have an
20 obligation to correct something you said. I can
21 not and nothing I said guarantees you what the
22 rates will be in the future. There is a
23 mechanism in place to prevent unconscionable
24 increases but the increases that might result in
25 premiums are subject to the Superintendent's
3102
1 approval based on data that's presented to him
2 by actuaries which can be contested by either
3 consumer groups or insurance carriers, like any
4 other insurance that we have in this state.
5 Rates cannot be guaranteed into the future, so I
6 am not saying to you that there is no
7 possibility a rate may be increased.
8 As it is now, we believe that
9 rates will remain basically the same and that's
10 why we only have a one-year extender because
11 this is an issue that's in a state of flux. We
12 have to get better evaluations of the market
13 place, some better programs in place. We have
14 many bills that have been filed by our Senators
15 with ideas as to how we might stabilize that
16 market, ideas about whether or not deductibles
17 should be raised to keep the insurance afford
18 able, whether or not that's the right thing to
19 do in the marketplace. Joint underwriting
20 groups have been -- made proposals. Re-insurers
21 of the state of New York and the national groups
22 have come in and said they can provide
23 reinsurance to lower the premium.
24 There are a battery of things
25 that have to be done. That's why we think a
3103
1 one-year extender is something that we should
2 have.
3 SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, Mr.
4 President. On the bill.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
6 Senator Paterson, on the bill.
7 SENATOR PATERSON: On the bill.
8 Senator Velella should be assured, as much as we
9 would like to preserve the lowest rates possible
10 for policyholders, we recognize the fact that
11 there could be a fluctuation in the rates based
12 on a number of actuarial figures.
13 We're just happy to hear from
14 Senator Volker -- Senator Velella's, remarks
15 that we're going to be able, through this
16 process, to make sure that the Superintendent of
17 Insurance is involved.
18 We also would suggest that there
19 is as immediate a conference with the Assembly
20 because our fear is what could really be the end
21 of NYPIUA and there are so many policyholders
22 around this state who run great risks from being
23 in the geographic locations particularly where
24 they are, that we're somewhat concerned that any
25 delay or any possibility of this sort of
3104
1 coverage running out would certainly inure to
2 their detriment and this is the reason that we
3 would encourage that some permanency be
4 established in this legislation as soon as is
5 reasonable.
6 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
7 Senator Dollinger.
8 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Would the
9 sponsor yield to one question?
10 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
11 Senator Velella, would you yield to Senator
12 Dollinger?
13 SENATOR VELELLA: Yes.
14 SENATOR DOLLINGER: When we did
15 the prior bill, I asked you have a couple
16 questions regarding the applicability of the
17 coastal zone insurance program in upstate New
18 York, and particularly on the south shore of
19 Lake Ontario. Can I assume from this bill since
20 it is just an extender, that the program and the
21 participation in Lake Ontario where we have
22 exceptionally high water as a result of the very
23 wet spring we've had there, Lake Ontario is way
24 up, we expect storms that could have significant
25 damage in the community of Greece or Hamlin,
3105
1 some of the communities that Senator Maziarz,
2 Senator Nozzolio and I share, can we be assured
3 that the program -- the insurance program will
4 continue to be in effect for them for the next
5 year as well?
6 SENATOR VELELLA: We are
7 extending whatever is in existence now will be
8 in effect for the next year of that if they are
9 eligible under the program, and I believe they
10 are, that would continue. We've taken nothing
11 out of the authorizations in this bill. We're
12 simply continuing on for one year because, as
13 you pointed out, Senator Maziarz, Senator
14 Nozzolio has pointed out to me there are some
15 unique problems in upstate that don't really
16 reflect the problems we're addressing on the
17 coastal areas in downstate. However, they are
18 just as important and any program should include
19 them, yes.
20 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Yes, just to
21 Senator Velella, it's my intention, Senator, I'm
22 going to give you just a short little memo maybe
23 after the session or after the recess period for
24 a couple weeks just to bring you up to date on
25 some of the additional insurance-related
3106
1 problems that I have experienced and my
2 constituents have experienced in dealing with
3 the high water problem on Lake Ontario, and I
4 would just urge -
5 SENATOR VELELLA: I believe there
6 is also some federal insurances that are
7 available, federal programs that play into this
8 and we ought to tailor our program to that, and
9 we'll be happy to work with you.
10 SENATOR DOLLINGER: Again through
11 you, Mr. Chair, just on the bill.
12 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
13 Senator Dollinger, on the bill.
14 SENATOR DOLLINGER: In upstate
15 New York, we don't actually get to flood level
16 because the water rises but it doesn't reach
17 flood level, so we don't trigger the federal
18 protection but nonetheless when the water rises
19 and the lake winds kick up, you have worse than
20 a flood; you actually have the equivalent of
21 huge waves pounding the shoreline, substantial
22 erosion, damage to homes, not covered by the
23 federal flood plan because it doesn't rise high
24 enough enough to constitute a flood but
25 nonetheless it's the equivalent of a flood for
3107
1 insurance purposes and I'll will give you a memo
2 on that and maybe it can be included in the
3 discussions.
4 Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
5 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: Read
6 the last section, please.
7 THE SECRETARY: Section 13. This
8 act shall take effect immediately.
9 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
10 Call the roll.
11 (The Secretary called the roll. )
12 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 58.
13 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: The
14 bill is passed.
15 Senator Skelos.
16 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
17 would you call up Calendar Number 336.
18 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
19 Secretary will read.
20 THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
21 336, by member of the Assembly Tocci, Assembly
22 Print 2958, an act to amend the Retirement and
23 Social Security Law, in relation to establish
24 ment of a presumption.
25 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
3108
1 Read the last section.
2 THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
3 act shall take effect immediately.
4 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO:
5 Call the roll.
6 (The Secretary called the roll. )
7 THE SECRETARY: Ayes 58.
8 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: The
9 bill is passed.
10 SENATOR SKELOS: Is there any
11 housekeeping to take care of?
12 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: I
13 believe the house is clean, sir.
14 SENATOR SKELOS: The house is
15 clean?
16 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: The
17 house is clean, sir.
18 SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
19 there being no further business, I move we
20 adjourn until Monday, May 5th, 1997 at 3:00
21 p.m., intervening days to be legislative days,
22 and we wish everybody good health.
23 ACTING PRESIDENT MARCELLINO: The
24 Senate will stand adjourned until Monday, May
25 5th, at 3:00 p.m., intervening days to be
3109
1 legislative days. Everybody take care and come
2 back healthy.
3 (Whereupon at 12:32 p.m., the
4 Senate adjourned.)
5
6
7
8
9
10