Regular Session - June 16, 1999
5498
NEW YORK STATE SENATE
THE
STENOGRAPHIC RECORD
ALBANY, NEW YORK
June 16, 1999
11:09 a.m.
REGULAR SESSION
SENATOR JOHN R. KUHL, JR., Acting President
STEVEN M. BOGGESS, Secretary
5499
P R O C E E D I N G S
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senate will come to order.
I ask the members to take their
chairs and everybody to rise and join with me
in saying the Pledge of Allegiance to the
Flag.
(Whereupon, the assemblage recited
the Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag.)
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: In the
absence of clergy, may we bow our heads in a
moment of silence.
(Whereupon, the assemblage
respected a moment of silence.)
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Reading
of the Journal.
THE SECRETARY: In Senate,
Tuesday, June 15, the Senate met pursuant to
adjournment. The Journal of Monday,
June 14th, was read and approved. On motion,
Senate adjourned.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Hearing
no objection, the Journal stands approved as
read.
Presentation of petitions.
5500
Messages from the Assembly.
Messages from the Governor.
Reports of standing committees.
Reports of select committees.
Communications and reports from
state officers.
Motions and resolutions.
The Chair recognizes Senator
Farley.
SENATOR FARLEY: Thank you,
Mr. President. On page 10 I offer the
following amendments to Calendar Number 371,
Senate Print 1469A, and I ask that Senator
Spano's bill will retain its place on the
Third Reading Calendar.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:
Amendments to Calendar Number 371 are received
and adopted, and the bill will retain its
place on the Third Reading Calendar.
Senator Skelos, we have one
substitution at the desk.
SENATOR SKELOS: Please make the
substitution.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the substitution.
5501
THE SECRETARY: On page 38,
Senator Johnson moves to discharge, from the
Committee on Rules, Assembly Bill Number 8164A
and substitute it for the identical Third
Reading Calendar, 1433.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
substitution is ordered.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, I
believe there are two privileged resolutions
at the desk, Resolution 2053 and 2054. If we
could have the titles read and move for their
immediate adoption.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the titles to Resolution
2053 and 2054.
THE SECRETARY: By Senator Bruno,
Legislative Resolution Number 2053, honoring
Lieutenant Colonel Robert E. Newman upon the
occasion of his retirement upon 18 years of
active service with the United States Army and
the United States Army National Guard.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
question is on the resolution. All those in
favor signify by saying aye.
5502
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Opposed,
nay.
(No response.)
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
resolution is adopted.
The Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: By Senator Bruno,
Legislative Resolution Number 2054, honoring
Officer Colleen Goldston upon the occasion of
her designation as the recipient of the John
J. Givney Award, May 21, 1999.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
question is on the resolution. All those in
favor signify by saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Opposed,
nay.
(No response.)
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
resolution is adopted.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
if we could take up the noncontroversial
calendar.
5503
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the noncontroversial
reading of the calendar.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
239, by Senator Farley, Senate Print 1918, an
act to amend the Banking Law, in relation to
charges.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Santiago, to explain her vote.
SENATOR SANTIAGO: Thank you,
Mr. President. To explain my vote.
I appreciate that the stores,
grocery stores and the retailers, are probably
consider -- are losing -- are probably losing
an unreasonable loss at this time. I've
explained to Senator Farley that I'm very
comfortable with the grocery stores raising
their prices, but I think that to raise it
5504
from 50 cents to a dollar is just too much,
and for some people an extreme -- an -- it's a
burden on probably the people that could
afford it least.
I would support a raise to 75 cents
or a slower incremental raise over a couple of
years. I do support the idea that we have a
sliding-fee scale based on the amount of the
check. I think that's an excellent idea.
Senator Farley and I support that concept, and
we've discussed that in the past.
However, as the bill now stands, I
must vote against it. And I hope that there's
a compromise legislation, if it passes the
Assembly, that we could come to some
agreement.
But I hope, Senator Farley, you
understand that, you know, it's very difficult
to vote for this bill as it now reads. I just
think it puts a burden on the population that
I represent.
Thank you.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Santiago will be recorded in the negative.
Announce the results.
5505
THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
the negative on Calendar Number 239 are
Senators Kuhl, Onorato, and Santiago. Ayes,
37. Nays, 3.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
435, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 3268, an
act to authorize the apportionment of state
building aid.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There a
local fiscal impact note at the desk.
The Secretary will read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 40.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
652, by Member of the Assembly Morelle,
Assembly Print Number 6317, an act to amend
5506
the General Business Law, in relation to the
sale of monuments.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect on the first day of
November.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 40.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
700, by Member of the Assembly Weinstein,
Assembly Print Number 6933A, an act to amend
the Lien Law, in relation to liens on molds.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 40.
5507
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
772, by Senator Trunzo, Senate Print 4408A, an
act to amend the Public Authorities Law, in
relation to the recovery.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This
act shall take effect on the 90th day.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 40.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
803, by Senator Leibell, Senate Print 2661A,
an act to amend the Retirement and Social
Security Law, in relation to benefits.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside.
5508
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
866, by Senator DeFrancisco, Senate Print
1151, an act to amend the General Obligations
Law, in relation to extending.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 40.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
896, by Member of the Assembly Harenberg,
Assembly Print Number 1269A, an act to amend
the Military Law, in relation to date of
membership.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
5509
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 40.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
980, by Senator Goodman, Senate Print 5084A,
an act to amend Chapter 912 of the Laws of
1920.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect on the 60th day.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 40.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1030, by Senator Goodman, Senate Print 5348A,
an act to amend the Alcoholic Beverage Control
Law, in relation to powers and operations.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 6. This
5510
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 39. Nays,
1. Senator Kuhl recorded in the negative.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1039, by Member of the Assembly Lafayette,
Assembly Print Number 121, an act to amend the
Banking Law, in relation to the geographic
distribution.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect on the 60th day.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Santiago, to explain her vote.
SENATOR SANTIAGO: Yes.
Mr. President, this legislation amends the
Community Reinvestment Act. And we all know
5511
that that's the law that requires banks to
invest and contribute to the neighborhoods
that I represent and neighborhoods that some
of my colleagues represent, which is
particularly poor neighborhoods.
This bill looks to the new
millennium. It updates the Community
Reinvestment Act by allowing examiners to
consider whether a bank provides computer and
electronic banking services evenly, in both
terms of geography and economic class.
Let me be clear about one point,
however. This law is designed to be a carrot
and not a stick. It does not penalize a bank
during its CRA exam for not offering computer
banking services if it's not a regular part of
their business. It instead will provide CRA
credit to those banks which do offer services
and make an effort to promote these services
to poor urban and rural communities through
measures like advertising and customer
training.
And finally, let me just thank you,
Senator Farley. Thank you for helping me with
this bill and for working so closely with me.
5512
I really appreciate your support during the
entire process. You've always been a pleasure
to work with, and I'd like to thank you
publicly for that.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Santiago will be recorded in the affirmative.
Announce the results.
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 45.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1055, by Senator Rath, Senate Print 125, an
act to amend the Education Law, in relation to
the composition.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect on the 90th day.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 45.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
5513
1063, by Member of the Assembly Harenberg,
Assembly Print Number 7009A, an act to amend
the Education Law, in relation to the
supervision.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 45.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1124, by Senator Skelos, Senate Print 4337A,
an act to authorize the Village of Rockville
Centre.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is
a home rule message at the desk.
The Secretary will read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
5514
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 45.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1174, by Senator Goodman, Senate Print 5671A,
an act to amend the Real Property Tax Law and
the Administrative Code of the City of New
York.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 51. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 45.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1294, by the Assembly Committee on Rules,
Assembly Print Number 8220, an act to amend
the Insurance Law, in relation to eligibility.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
5515
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 45.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1295, by Senator Marchi, Senate Print 5589, an
act to amend the Education Law, in relation to
courses.
SENATOR DUANE: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1324, by Senator Wright, Senate Print 2425B,
an act to amend the Economic Development Law
and the Public Authorities Law, in relation -
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
5516
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 45.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1350, by Senator Meier, Senate Print -
SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1372, by Senator Morahan, Senate Print 5794 -
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is
a home rule message at the desk.
The bill will be starred at the
request of the sponsor.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1381, by Senator Marchi, Senate Print 2529A,
an act to amend the Navigation Law, in
relation to pilotage fees.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
5517
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 45.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1386, by Senator Larkin, Senate Print 2533, an
act to authorize retroactive membership.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is
a home rule message at the desk.
The Secretary will read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 45.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1389, by Senator Maltese, Senate Print 4372,
an act to amend the Administrative Code of the
City of New York, in relation to the
establishment.
5518
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is
a home rule message at the desk.
The Secretary will read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 14. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 45.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
SENATOR ONORATO: Lay the bill
aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed, gentlemen. Do you want a motion to
reconsider the vote by which the bill passed
the house?
The Secretary will call the roll on
reconsideration.
THE SECRETARY: In relation to
Calendar Number 1389.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 45.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
5519
is laid aside.
The Secretary will continue to call
the noncontroversial calendar.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1412, by Senator Johnson, Senate Print 2698,
an act to amend the Retirement and Social
Security Law, in relation to providing.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 45.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1413, by Senator Velella, Senate Print -
SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1414, by Senator Marchi, Senate Print 3605A,
an act to amend the Not-for-Profit Corporation
5520
Law, in relation to increasing.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This
act shall take effect January 1.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 45.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1415, by Senator Leibell, Senate Print 3796A,
an act to amend the General Municipal Law, in
relation to benefits.
SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is
a home rule message at the desk.
The bill will be laid aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1416, by Senator Larkin, Senate Print 3971, an
act to amend the Racing, Pari-Mutuel Wagering
and Breeding Law, in relation to off-track
betting and simulcasting.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
5521
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 45.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1417, by Senator Wright, Senate Print 3994, an
act to amend the Public Service Law and the
State Administrative Procedure Act.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This
act shall take effect in 90 days.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 45.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1418, by Senator Alesi, Senate Print 4124A, an
5522
act to amend the Workers' Compensation Law, in
relation to liability.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1419, by Senator Bonacic, Senate Print 43 -
SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1420, by Senator Marchi, Senate Print 4457, an
act to amend the Not-for-Profit Corporation
Law, in relation to authorizing.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect on the 30th day.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
5523
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 45.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1421, by Senator Goodman, Senate Print 4993,
an act to amend the State Finance Law, in
relation to requirement.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 45.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1424, by Senator Seward, Senate Print 5207, an
act to amend the County Law, in relation to
requiring.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
5524
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect in 30 days.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 45.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1425, by Senator Alesi, Senate Print 5212, an
act to amend the Insurance Law, in relation to
the minimum remuneration.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 45.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1426, by Senator Alesi, Senate Print 5213, an
act to amend the Public Health Law.
5525
SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1427, by the Assembly Committee on Rules,
Assembly Print Number 8075, an act to amend
the Real Property Tax Law, in relation to
requiring.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 45.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1428, by Senator Leibell, Senate Print 5479A,
an act to amend the Retirement and Social
Security Law, in relation to permitting.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
5526
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 45.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1429, by Senator Alesi, Senate Print 5587, an
act to amend the Tax Law, in relation to the
affixation.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This
act shall take effect in 180 days.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1430, by Senator Lack, Senate Print -
SENATOR SKELOS: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
5527
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1432, by the Assembly Committee on Rules,
Assembly Print Number 8128A, an act to amend
the Environmental Conservation Law, in
relation to regulations.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1433, substituted earlier today by the
Assembly Committee on Rules, Assembly Print
Number 8164A, an act to amend the
Environmental Conservation Law, in relation to
the management.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
5528
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1434, by Senator Stachowski, Senate Print
5713, an act to amend the Executive Law, in
relation to eligibility.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1435, by Senator Johnson, Senate Print 5718A,
an act to amend the Environmental Conservation
Law, in relation to authorizing.
5529
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
SENATOR LEIBELL: Section 2.
This act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1436, by the Senate Committee on Rules, Senate
Print Number 5815, an act to amend the
Administrative Code of the City of New York,
in relation to the authorization.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
5530
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1437, by the Senate Committee on Rules, Senate
Print Number 5816, an act to amend the
Administrative Code of the City of New York,
in relation to permitting.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1438, by the Senate Committee on Rules, Senate
Print Number 5817, an act to provide for
pension credit.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
5531
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1439, by Senator Goodman, Senate Print 5834,
an act to amend the Public Health Law, in
relation to office.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1440, by Senator McGee, Senate Print 5836, an
act to amend the Navigation Law, in relation
to operation.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This
5532
act shall take effect on the first day of
January.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1441, by Senator Meier, Senate Print 5848, an
act to amend the Social Services Law, in
relation to the family loan programs.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1442, by Senator Meier, Senate Print 5850, an
act to amend the Social Services Law, in
5533
relation to permitting.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1443, by Senator LaValle, Senate Print 5857,
an act to amend the Education Law, in relation
to removing.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect on the first day of
January.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
5534
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1444, by Senator DeFrancisco, Senate Print
5880, an act to amend the Tax Law, in relation
to providing.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 7. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1445, by Senator Meier, Senate Print 5887, an
act in relation to creating a demonstration
program.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
5535
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1446, by Member of the Assembly Tocci,
Assembly Print Number 3084A, an act to amend
the New York State Veterans Bill of Rights.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1447, by Senator Meier, Senate Print 5908, an
act to amend the Tax Law and the
Administrative Code of the City of New York.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 18. This
5536
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1448, by Senator Morahan, Senate Print 5909,
an act to amend the Not-for-Profit Corporation
Law, in relation to corporations.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is
a home rule message at the desk.
The Secretary will read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1449, by the Assembly Committee on Rules,
5537
Assembly Print Number 8272A, an act to amend
the Banking Law, in relation to criteria.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1450, by Senator Goodman, Senate Print 5920A,
an act to amend the General Municipal Law and
Chapter 130 of the Laws of 1998.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect July 1.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
5538
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1451, by Senator lack, Senate Print 5924, an
act to amend the Insurance Law, in relation to
a guarantee.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1452, by the Assembly Committee on Rules,
Assembly Print Number 8237, an act to amend
Chapter 942 of the Laws of 1983.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
5539
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1453, by Senator Meier, Senate Print 5933 -
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1454, by the Assembly Committee on Rules,
Assembly Print Number 8226, an act to amend
the Criminal Procedure Law, in relation to
removal.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect on the first day of
November.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
5540
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1455, by Senator Maziarz, Senate Print 5947,
an act to amend the General Business Law, the
Personal Property Law, the Public Service Law
and the State Finance Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 6. This
act shall take effect September 1.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1456, by Assemblyman Canestrari -
SENATOR SKELOS: Lay it aside
temporarily.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside temporarily.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1457, by Senator Leibell, Senate Print 3921,
an act to amend the Retirement and Social
Security Law.
5541
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
Senator Skelos, that completes the
reading of the noncontroversial calendar.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
would you please call up Calendar Number 1110.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read Calendar Number 1110.
Before the Secretary reads, can we
have a little order in the chamber, please.
Senator Spano, Senator Padavan, Senator
Mendez, Senator Smith. Staff members, take
their seats. Senator Balboni, take the
conversation out of the chamber.
The Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1110, by Senator Leibell, Senate Print 5328B,
5542
an act to amend Chapter 338 of the Laws of
1998.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
is there a message of necessity at the desk?
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is.
SENATOR SKELOS: Move to accept.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
motion is to accept the message of necessity
on Calendar Number 1110. All those in favor
signify by saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Opposed,
nay.
(No response.)
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
message is accepted. The bill is before the
house.
The Secretary will read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
5543
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
if we could go to the controversial calendar,
please, starting with Calendar Number 803, by
Senator Leibell.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the controversial
calendar.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
803, by Senator Leibell, Senate Print 2661A,
an act to amend the Retirement and Social
Security Law, in relation to benefits.
SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Leibell, an explanation of Calendar Number 803
has been requested.
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yes,
Mr. President.
This bill intends to provide parole
officers who suffer job-related heart disease
with the presumption that the heart disease is
5544
job-related. Specifically, the bill requires
that the parole officer successfully pass a
physical examination prior to entry into
service, and that physical exam did not
disclose any evidence of heart disease.
Additionally, it provides that it
shall be presumptive evidence that a parole
officer who suffers from heart disease which
results in disability or death incurred the
heart disease in the course of their
employment.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
if Senator Leibell would yield for some
questions.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator,
do you yield?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yes, I do.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR PATERSON: Senator, what
would be the way of rebutting a presumption
that heart disease was job-related? In other
words, how would you ever know if any physical
5545
ailment, malady or disease was caused through
the person's job unless you individually
determined the amount of time they were
spending overtime, stress, and other excesses?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Well, Senator,
before they come into the job, of course, as I
noted, you're going to have to successfully
pass a physical examination prior to the entry
into service. And that physical exam would
disclose if there was in fact any heart
disease.
As to what circumstances would
rebut this, that would be up to a medical
professional. It would be beyond me to say.
SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you,
Senator.
Mr. President, if Senator Leibell
would yield for another question.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Do you
continue to yield, Senator Leibell?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
5546
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR PATERSON: So, Senator,
if someone comes to the job and they are not
suffering from heart disease and it
accumulates later, we are making a presumption
it was job-related. How long could the person
have been working at the job when the
condition would arise? Could it be as much as
20 years?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yeah, it could
be.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you,
Senator.
Mr. President, if Senator Leibell
would yield for another question.
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Leibell yields.
SENATOR PATERSON: So therefore,
if we were going to compare this particular
employee with anyone else in society within
10, 15, 20 years, isn't it possible that
anyone else could acquire heart disease just
5547
by the nature of their own age?
SENATOR LEIBELL: That's why it
would be a rebuttable presumption. That would
be for medical professionals to be able to
determine that.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you,
Mr. President. If Senator Leibell would yield
for another question.
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
continues to yield.
SENATOR PATERSON: Senator, what
is the position of the relevant medical
conferences or associations on this type of
distinction as to how someone acquired
something, especially considering the fact
that until the ailment presents itself, often
the medical profession cannot diagnose a
disease prior to its taking effect?
SENATOR LEIBELL: I'm not sure
that I completely understand your question.
But I think the answer you're looking for is
probably still a technical medical answer,
5548
which certainly I would not be equipped to
give you.
As to what would cause this sort of
a disease, as to whether it was related to the
specific job, those are things that medical
professionals would have to answer. It's
beyond my scope to answer that. I don't have
that expertise.
But what we are doing here is we
are creating that presumption.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you.
Mr. President, if Senator Leibell
would continue to yield.
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR PATERSON: Therefore,
Senator, in order to create the medical
presumption, there must be -- we must have
evidence already, even though this is not a
medical determination, but sheerly just
statistics, that individuals in this line of
work are more prone to developing heart
5549
disease; is that correct?
SENATOR LEIBELL: I think that is
correct, yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
if Senator Leibell would continue to yield.
SENATOR LEIBELL: I do.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
I'd like to know if Senator Leibell can give
us any of that information right now. In
other words, what the statistics are for those
who would be unfortunate enough to be
suffering from heart disease, what the
statistics are between the affected, as
represented in this bill, and the regular -
and the general society.
SENATOR LEIBELL: I certainly
would not, Senator, have any information
available to me today as to what the
statistics would be.
I would note, though, this is
legislation that's comparable to laws that are
5550
already on the books for police and fire.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Right. Thank
you, Senator.
If Senator Leibell would continue
to yield.
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR PATERSON: Senator, as a
preface to my question, what I'm interested in
knowing in this particular class that's
affected by this particular legislation here,
Calendar Number 803, is what the relevance of
the statistics would be in order to establish
this type of presumption. In other words,
that there's a significant likelihood that a
person working in this line of work, as are
corrections officers, would be more likely to
suffer from heart disease.
And so what I just want to know is
that the evidence is not just a preponderance,
but it is clear that there is a risk that
someone takes to their life by working in this
5551
particular endeavor.
SENATOR LEIBELL: No, as I
noted -- and we've discussed this type of bill
before. Throughout this session, we've
discussed legislation like this -- that those
who serve in police and fire and corrections,
and now we're also including parole, have
uniquely difficult and professionally very
stressful jobs, much more so than the average
citizen of this state would confront.
Is it likely that -- or is it
possible that they could develop heart disease
and it could be related to something entirely
outside of their job, something genetic,
possibly? And the answer to that is yes.
That's why it's a rebuttable presumption.
We create the presumption here in
this legislation, or we attempt to, as we have
in other statutes, because of the difficulty
and unique nature of the work. We've
presented that before to this legislative body
on numerous occasions for others, to indicate
that those who deal with the criminal justice
system, those who deal with emergency services
such as fire, face unique health problems.
5552
And heart disease is certainly at the
forefront.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you,
Mr. President. If Senator Leibell would
continue to yield.
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yes.
SENATOR PATERSON: Interestingly
enough, Senator Leibell, I read one of those
reports that actually the most stressful
career, based on the effects on the
individuals, is actually in the print media
and also in the radio and television media.
Which I felt was ironic, since the individuals
who work in that area often, I thought, caused
stress to other professions, that they would
be the ones that suffered the most.
The question that I have for you
is -
SENATOR LEIBELL: I'll be happy
to look at legislation in that area, Senator.
SENATOR PATERSON: (Laughing.)
No, that's okay, Senator, you don't really
have to do that.
5553
The question that I have for you is
what I'm really just looking for is that I
recognize that we have established this
legislation over a period of time and that
we've established it with other groups. And
so because of that, I was wondering why we
hadn't already done this.
And so to determine whether or not
we should do it now, I was just trying to
learn what statistic or information it was
that compelled you to bring this legislation
before us now. Because clearly, if it is the
case, we would want to do it. But what I
wanted to elicit from you was what the
catalyst was, since we hadn't done it
previously.
SENATOR LEIBELL: My
understanding is this is not new legislation,
although it was not passed here previously.
It was passed in the Assembly last year. And
apparently at that time there was -- there's
consistently been evidence that's been made
available concerning those who work in the
criminal justice system, the stressful nature
of their work.
5554
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you,
Mr. President. If the Senator would be
willing to yield.
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR PATERSON: I think the
reason that I raised it, Senator, is because
police officers, it's -- even without the
statistics, it's almost a fait accompli. If
you become a police officer, you're walking
around in conditions every day where your own
life is at risk. And we just lost a police
officer in New York City about a month ago.
Firefighters, the same thing. Two
weeks ago on Friday, we lost a firefighter in
New York City. Firefighters, just by the
nature of the work that they do, are
automatically put in that position.
But when we come to parole
officers, I'm not going to say that I have an
idea of what the stresses are in that
particular profession. I'm just saying that
5555
it doesn't jump out at me as something that we
immediately should do, not knowing the full -
SENATOR LEIBELL: Senator, as you
say, when you take a look at police and fire,
to you that's a fait accompli. Similarly to
myself, it would seem self-evident with
respect to this.
And just as we can search for
statistics to bear that out with police and
fire, we can similarly search for statistics
here. And possibly my threshold in the
criminal justice system may be somewhat
different than yours may be. But to me, it's
just as apparent for parole officers as it is
to you -- and to me -- for police and fire.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you,
Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Waldon, why do you rise?
SENATOR WALDON: Thank you very
much, Mr. President. Would the gentleman from
Westchester yield?
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
5556
Leibell, do you yield to a question from
Senator Waldon?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR WALDON: Thank you very
much. Thank you very much, Mr. President.
Senator Leibell, are you aware of
the various assignments within the Division of
Parole in regard to those who are required to
carry weapons?
SENATOR LEIBELL: I'm somewhat
familiar with them, yes. I've worked with
them in the past.
SENATOR WALDON: Would the
gentleman continue to yield?
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Leibell?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: He
continues to yield.
SENATOR WALDON: If you are,
Senator, then you know that many of the parole
officers are assigned to warrant squads or
other kinds of duties where they go into the
5557
South Bronx or other areas across the state to
get people who are technical and other
violators of parole and to apprehend them and
bring them in. It's not just the New York
City Police Department or other municipal
departments who are required with a warrant to
go and return these people to the system.
Are you aware of that?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yes, I am aware
of that.
SENATOR WALDON: Would the
gentleman continue to yield?
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Leibell?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR WALDON: Senator, if you
are aware of that, then you may also be
aware -- and please let me know if you are -
of situations where parole officers are
actually engaged in shoot-outs. I'm sure that
you may have heard -- is that correct?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yes. In fact,
when I was a prosecutor in Westchester County,
5558
I was involved in such a case.
SENATOR WALDON: One last
question, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Leibell, do you continue to yield?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yes, I do.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR WALDON: To your
knowledge, in handling those cases, Senator,
were you made aware through the interface with
the parole officer or from other information
received that the kinds of tension and stress,
anxiety, back pain, cold sweats, fear
generated for police officers and other
similar law enforcement personnel could have
occurred in those situations where parole
officers were in fact exposed to gunfire?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Absolutely,
Senator. And with respect to your line of
questioning, I've known many people in this
professional position. I've known them in a
professional capacity, I've known them
socially. And I would view this as a
particularly dangerous position. It's one
5559
that can cause a great deal of stress.
And in fact, I have personally
known many people who have felt the effects of
the stress that comes from their job.
SENATOR WALDON: Thank you very
much, Senator.
If I may, Mr. President, on the
bill.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Waldon, on the bill.
SENATOR WALDON: To my knowledge,
my personal knowledge, the frequency of
encounters and shoot-outs, et cetera, with
parole officers is not the same as most of the
police officers who work the warrant squad,
who work -- or who work in the detective
bureau. However, one time facing down a
revolver firing at you is really sufficient to
create the kinds of stress that can create
problems throughout the rest of your career.
And from my personal knowledge,
that those who live in my community who happen
to be parole officers, sometimes they face the
dangers even if there's no weapon fired. In
apprehending someone who is a very violent
5560
person, the same kind of tension occurs.
So I think we should give the
parole officers the same consideration as we
do other law enforcement personnel. And I
applaud Senator Leibell for bringing this to
us for our consideration.
Thank you, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Schneiderman, why do you rise?
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Thank you,
Mr. President. If the sponsor will yield to a
question.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Leibell, do you yield to a question?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yes, Mr.
President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Yes,
Senator Leibell, I just want to make sure I
understand. What is the administrative
proceeding in which this presumption would
apply and in which the rebuttal by competent
evidence would be required?
SENATOR LEIBELL: It would be a
5561
normal disability hearing.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: And under
the auspices of what agencies would that be
taking place or does that take place?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Within the
retirement system.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Is that
the same sort of proceeding for a city -
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Schneiderman, are you asking Senator
Leibell -
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Oh, yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: I hate to
say that -
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Through
you, Mr. President. No, that's all right.
You're doing a fine job of keeping this in
line, sir.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
stenographer will note those remarks for the
record. Thank you.
Senator Leibell, do you yield to a
question?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yes, I do, Mr.
President.
5562
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Thank you,
Senator.
Is there a different set
administrative procedure for city as opposed
to state parole officers?
SENATOR LEIBELL: My
understanding is it is separate.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: And if the
sponsor will continue to yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Leibell?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: I'm not
sure I understand what kind of competent
evidence would have to be introduced to rebut
this. But it seems to me that it might be -
have to be fairly intrusive -- evidence that
would involve a fairly intrusive inquiry into
someone's diet, lifestyle, and other factors
that might have contributed to heart disease.
Has there been any evaluation of
5563
the types of inquiry that might be undertaken
within the pension system or by those who are
responsible for rebutting this presumption and
what kinds of personal information they might
be required to get out about parole officers?
SENATOR LEIBELL: There hasn't
been an inquiry by me, but there certainly is
a history and a line of cases with respect to
other people who would have this or who would
benefit from this sort of a presumption with
respect to heart disease, where there have
been hearings.
Now, you make the interesting point
if you had somebody who has led a particular
lifestyle -- had not been watchful of their
weight, for instance, and had been
excessive -- that may very well be in fact
evidence that could be used to rebut.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: If the
sponsor would continue to yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Leibell, do you continue to yield?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
5564
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Is there
any requirement that the beneficiaries of this
legislation would make available medical
records, fill out questionnaires, or otherwise
provide information relating to things such as
whether or not they smoked, what their diet
was, whether they'd had other kinds of medical
conditions or problems?
SENATOR LEIBELL: When you make
application for this sort of a disability, you
would have to make information available.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: If the
sponsor will continue to yield.
What sort of information do you
have to make available?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Well, for
instance, I'm sure there would be a litany of
questions that would be asked on an
appropriate form. I mean, I have not seen the
form, but with respect to your various and
general -- your general health conditions.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Okay.
And, Mr. President, on the bill.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Schneiderman, on the bill.
5565
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: I thank
the sponsor for his time.
I find I'm a little bit puzzled at
this point about the nature of the inquiry
we're undertaking. I think that, sympathetic
as I am to people who suffer stress on the
job, it sounds like we're sort of operating in
a little bit of a vacuum here. I'm not sure I
understand what the nature of the inquiry
that's possible is.
The variation in duties among
parole officers is so severe, and the
variation in the types of caseloads and
stresses and strains is so much greater than
for others who are covered under similar
statutes, that it seems to me that some sort
of thorough inquiry really needs to be
undertaken before this kind of extension of
law is made. And I think for that reason I
have serious concerns about this bill at this
time.
Thank you.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
5566
act shall take -
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Dollinger, why do you rise?
SENATOR DOLLINGER: If Senator
Leibell would just yield to one quick
question.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Leibell, do you yield to one quick question
from Senator Dollinger?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yes.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Through you,
Mr. President. We have a number of these
presumptions in the heart law for firefighters
and others. What is the evidence that the
presumption is actually overcome? Is there -
there must be, since we've had the heart bill
for police and fire I think now for something
like twenty years. Do you have any evidence
of sort of a chronological record of how many
times someone asserts the presumption and it's
actually overcome on behalf of the -
SENATOR LEIBELL: I don't have
any statistics on that.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Again,
through you, Mr. President, just to clarify.
5567
We really don't know whether this
is a rebuttable presumption or an irrebuttable
presumption with -
SENATOR LEIBELL: It's rebuttable
by statute, we do know that.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: I understand,
Mr. President. But just to clarify, we don't
know -- I mean, if it were a hundred percent
of the time the presumption governed, then
even though we refer to it as a rebuttable
presumption, it becomes irrebuttable by virtue
of fact, in fact.
SENATOR LEIBELL: No. No.
Because it could still be rebuttable, but in
all the cases that came before them, it was
justified, the end result, by the hearing
officer.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Again,
through you, Mr. President. I agree with
Senator Leibell's formulation -
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: You're
asking Senator Leibell to yield to -- is it
another quick question, Senator Dollinger?
SENATOR DOLLINGER: It's a
follow-up to the quick question. Which will
5568
also be quick.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: I was
just going to suggest, Senator Dollinger, that
you never ask for an interpretation from the
Chair as to what your interpretation is of
quick.
Senator Leibell, do you continue to
yield?
SENATOR LEIBELL: For a quick
answer, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: If there were
a hundred percent of the cases that were
unable to rebut the presumption, then it would
be a de facto irrebuttable presumption; you
could draw that conclusion, couldn't you, that
if the presumption had never been overcome and
hence the person was always entitled to
benefits in the event heart disease is
determined to causally be related to the death
or injury or the disability?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Mr. President,
this sounds a little bit like a law school
issue. If you had one case and only one case
5569
arose, and that person was under it pursuant
to this statute even though with the
presumption it would be under a disability as
a result of heart disease, by your standing
that would be one hundred percent and
therefore de facto irrebuttable, and I would
not think that that would be correct.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Thank you,
Mr. President. Just briefly, on the bill.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Dollinger, on the bill.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: I appreciate
the clarification from my colleague from
Westchester County about the nature of
rebuttable and irrebuttable presumptions.
But I still think that as we embark
on doing something like this, it would be
helpful to know, since we've set up other
rebuttable presumptions about linkage between
heart disease -- and, in some cases,
established for police and fire lung
disabilities and other kinds of disabilities.
As we link them to, though, the presence of
those disabilities on behalf of certain
employees, but I think we have a long enough
5570
track record now to be able to make some
evaluation about whether the presumption works
as a rebuttable presumption, which is
oftentimes overcome, or whether it's a de
facto irrebuttable presumption and hence what
we're doing is we're creating a benefit, a
disability benefit for a disease that crops up
regardless of its causal relationship to
employment.
I've voted in favor of bills of
this type in the past, Mr. President. But I
think it's time for us to just take a look at
the linkage between these presumptions to see
whether they are really rebuttable both in law
and in fact or whether what they really
constitute is an irrebuttable presumption
which I believe -- or at least I take from
Senator Leibell's answers that he's not
intending to create an irrebuttable
presumption.
It's just not the mere fact of
heart disease that qualifies you for
disability benefits, it creates a presumption.
The government or the entity that is
challenging that disability retirement or that
5571
disability benefit would then be able to
overcome it. It's really a question of the
amount of evidence necessary to overcome and
the circumstances under which it occurs.
I think it would be interesting
just to -- I think for all of us, whenever we
do one of these bills in the future -- to have
some kind of information about that.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Breslin, why do you rise?
SENATOR BRESLIN: Mr. President,
for a brief couple of questions from -
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Leibell, do you yield to a question from
Senator Breslin?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR BRESLIN: Senator
Leibell, I recall we did police officers and
firemen, I believe, last year, and corrections
offers earlier, and now parole officers. Are
there any other groups that you might consider
prospectively that we might want to include,
like maybe the Senate?
5572
SENATOR LEIBELL: If you mean
Senators, we will not be considering members
of the Senate.
SENATOR BRESLIN: We will not be
considering members of the Senate. How
about -
SENATOR LEIBELL: I'm not aware
of any others right now.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Breslin.
SENATOR LEIBELL: No, I'm not
aware of any others right now.
SENATOR BRESLIN: Excuse me,
Mr. President. Through you, if you will.
SENATOR LEIBELL: I yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR BRESLIN: Is there an
overall criteria that we're using? Is it the
carrying of a weapon or is it the designation
of police-officer status, that we're trying to
include a particular group and only that
group?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Well, a weapon
in and of itself, Senator, would not be the
5573
criteria, because we include firefighters.
And the nature of their job in the vast
majority of cases, possibly unless they're a
fire marshal, that we would include that as
the sole standard alone.
But certainly the use of -- the
carrying of a weapon, the potential for having
to use that in your professional capacity.
Although correction officers, in the vast
majority of cases, don't, and that's one of
the most dangerous jobs there is.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Breslin.
SENATOR BRESLIN: Through you,
Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Leibell, do you continue to yield?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yes, sir.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR BRESLIN: Could we then,
with that analysis, begin to say that possibly
a social worker, a caseworker who confronts
sometimes unhappy clients on a daily basis
might be included?
5574
SENATOR LEIBELL: You know, I
would say that that would be very unlikely.
In the vast majority of cases, they would not
be exposed with the regularity, the
consistency that someone who is in this type
of job in the legislation before the house
today would be exposed to.
SENATOR BRESLIN: Thank you very
much, Senator Leibell.
On the bill, please, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Breslin, on the bill.
SENATOR BRESLIN: I guess -- I'm
very supportive of any police officers,
firemen, and the tremendous risks that they
suffer on a day-in, day-out basis.
However, I have serious concerns
about the subjective nature of taking a group
at random, it seems at times -- parole
officers -- to include in this group. And
possibly we need a designation that everyone's
included, all workers. And possibly even
members of the Senate. And possibly even
members of the Senate in the latter part of
the spring and early summer, just for that
5575
time frame.
So other bills of this nature, I've
supported totally. I have serious
reservations about this one.
Thank you, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Hevesi, why do you rise?
SENATOR HEVESI: Thank you,
Mr. President. Would the sponsor yield to a
few questions, please?
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Leibell, do you yield to a question from
Senator Hevesi?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR HEVESI: Thank you.
Senator, I'm a little bit concerned
about the potential fiscal implication were
this piece of legislation to be enacted. Can
you explore that for me, please?
SENATOR LEIBELL: It's very
minimal, Senator. Dependent upon the number
of members granted an increase in benefits, a
10 percent increase in disability cases would
5576
bring an annual cost to the state of $700. A
25 percent increase in disability cases would
cost the state $2,100.
SENATOR HEVESI: Thank you. Mr.
President, if the sponsor would continue to
yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Leibell, do you continue to yield?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR HEVESI: Thank you,
Senator. Do we have any kind of projection or
assumption on exactly how many -- I understand
that you've -- we have numbers here on per
case, per individual -- who would then be
eligible for -- to collect disability as a
result of the legislation?
Do we know how many individuals
that this could potentially impact so that we
can apply that to the numbers that you have
here and make a determination as to the
aggregate fiscal impact?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Senator, I
don't know how you would determine that until
5577
you have some experience. And there's no
experience because it's not legislation now.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Hevesi.
SENATOR HEVESI: Mr. President,
through you.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Leibell?
SENATOR LEIBELL: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR HEVESI: Senator, I'm
sure you are concerned, as I am concerned, now
that the budget is months late and we're going
to potentially enact a piece of legislation
that we don't really know the fiscal impact
of.
And while I can appreciate that
it's very difficult to ascertain exactly how
many individuals would affected by this,
before I decide whether or not to vote on this
bill, I'd like to know whether similar
legislation has been passed concerning parole
officers in other states or whether there is a
comparable group of individuals within New
5578
York State who we might be able to do some
extrapolation on the numbers.
SENATOR LEIBELL: Senator, I'm
not familiar with what other states are doing
in this area.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Hevesi.
SENATOR HEVESI: Thank you. On
the bill.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Hevesi, on the bill.
SENATOR HEVESI: Thank you.
Mr. President, on the bill.
I have a general sense from my
experiences with parole officers that the job
that they perform is exceedingly dangerous.
And Senator Waldon articulated some of those
dangers. And in fact, earlier this year I
actually went with a -- the head of the New
York State Parole Officers throughout Albany
and experienced what they experience on a
day-to-day basis.
And there is a significant element
of danger involved in the jobs that they
conduct and the tasks that they perform. And
5579
to that end, it is consistent with the
provisions and protections that we have
provided for other members of the uniformed
services.
On the other hand, I am concerned
about a fiscal impact here, that we really
don't know what it might be, particularly in
light of the fact that the state budget is so
late.
And the final concern that doing
this, even if it's appropriate, raises the
question that we now have to make an
evaluation every time another group, however
deserving they may be, another group requests
this privilege or this right to be extended to
them.
So I just -- I'm a little
uncomfortable with it. I'll probably wind up
voting for the bill. And I appreciate,
Senator, your efforts on behalf of parole
officers. But there is a little bit of
trepidation or, better yet, pause for
deliberation when we see this bill before us.
Thank you, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
5580
Paterson, why do you rise?
SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
I listened to the discussion, and I heard very
good points brought out. But I feel that -
as they say, there's that expression, it's a
good idea whose time has come. And this is a
good idea whose time may not be gone, but
we're getting very close to it.
Because what I'm beginning to think
is the case is that there are several other
lines of work that can come in here and can
definitely put on the record that the degree
of difficulty of performing those jobs is very
difficult now.
We now have a piece of legislation
we passed in this house where we're giving
teachers the right to expel students for ten
days without a hearing. And I don't know
whether or not we should be doing that, but
that's what we did. But certainly, whether
you agree with it or you don't -- and I don't
know that I agree with it -- you do have to
recognize that the difficulty of being a
teacher -- I mean, how many times have we
found that out, just in our most recent days,
5581
that being a teacher is a difficult profession
and often a risky profession, and that there
are dangers commensurate with trying to
perform those duties.
Should the teachers have this same
legislation? I don't know what the degree of
difficulty is for the parole officers, so I
don't know whether the teachers should have it
or not. I'm just saying that it's becoming
something that is assimilating into something
that I don't know that it was intended to be
when it was first drafted.
And if the relevant documentation
can be shown, I think I would have to vote for
the legislation. I'm open on this. But I'm
also very concerned about what we're starting
to do. And as Senator Hevesi pointed out so
adroitly, the fiscal impact, it's a little
bit, at a time -- I guess it's Senator
Dollinger, who stands in this same place and
goes through the whole issue of the fiscal
impacts. But I'll spare you that,
Mr. President.
But just suffice it to say that it
is of great concern that we don't create some
5582
kind of standard when we're going to give
special protection that is needed by workers
in certain areas. But we just need to know to
what degree we can help them, to what degree
we can afford it, and to what degree they must
first meet the burden before we establish the
proof.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect in 90 days.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
the negative on Calendar Number 803 are
Senators Connor, Duane, and Paterson. Ayes,
53. Nays, 3.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
Senator Duane, why do you rise?
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you,
Mr. President. I was hoping to be given
unanimous consent to vote in the negative on
Calendar Number 239 and Calendar Number 866.
5583
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Hearing
no objection, Senator Duane will be recorded
in the negative on Calendar Number 239 and
Calendar Number 866.
Senator Waldon, why do you rise?
SENATOR WALDON: Mr. President,
thank you for your attention. I also
respectfully request unanimous consent to be
recorded in the negative on Calendar 239.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
objection, hearing no objection, Senator
Waldon will be recorded in the negative on
Calendar Number 239.
The Secretary will continue to read
the controversial calendar.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1295, by Senator Marchi, Senate Print 5589, an
act to amend the Education Law, in relation to
courses of instruction.
SENATOR McGEE: Lay the bill
aside temporarily.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside temporarily.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1350, by Senator Meier, Senate Print 5776, an
5584
act to amend the Tax Law, in relation to hotel
and motel taxes.
SENATOR McGEE: Lay the bill
aside temporarily.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside temporarily.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1389, by Senator Maltese, Senate Print 4372,
an act to amend the Administrative Code of the
City of New York.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
SENATOR McGEE: Lay the bill
aside temporarily.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside temporarily.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1413, by Senator Velella, Senate Print 3279A,
an act to amend Chapter 576 of the Laws of
1975.
SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation.
SENATOR McGEE: One moment,
please.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Velella, an explanation of Calendar Number
5585
1413, Senate Print 3279A, has been requested
by Senator Paterson.
SENATOR VELELLA: Thank you.
Senator, this is a bill that would
add the following medical schools to a list of
approved out-of-state schools which the
Commissioner of Education is authorized to
contract with in order to provide New York
State residents with expanded opportunities to
study medicine or dentistry and, as a return,
require them to serve for a period of time in
underserviced areas for a period of three
years.
The schools that are added are the
University of Padua in Padua, Italy; the Royal
College of Surgeons in Dublin, Ireland; St.
George's University School of Medicine in
Grenada; and the Ross University School of
Medicine in Dominica.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, Mr.
President. Senator, that was Grenada.
SENATOR VELELLA: I'm sorry,
Grenada.
5586
SENATOR PATERSON: The question I
have for you is whether or not you think this
is necessary at a time when medical schools
are actually cutting back on the number of
students that they teach, considering the fact
that we really have a surplus of doctors in
our society.
SENATOR VELELLA: Well, Senator,
I don't know that I agree with your statement
that we have a surplus of doctors. But this
program does provide an incentive, which I
know you must be very much interested in, that
if a student takes part in a program, they
must be a resident of the state and agree to
practice in an area of the state which has a
shortage of physicians for a period of three
years following their licensure. Failure to
practice in the area obligates the students to
reimburse the state according to a formula
which would reimburse them for any monies that
were advanced.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President.
Senator, I actually agree with you.
5587
There never seems to be a doctor around when I
need one. So I agree with you on that part.
But the point that -
SENATOR VELELLA: If I may,
Senator, if you'll suffer an interruption. It
depends on your HMO plan. If you're a member
of the plan, they're usually available. If
you're not a member, they're not.
SENATOR PATERSON: Yes. That
opens up a whole opportunity for discussion
which I'm sure we'll -- we won't make our
colleagues suffer through.
But the question that I have for
you is, how were the schools chosen for the
program?
SENATOR VELELLA: Senator, I
really couldn't tell you. I assume that a
group of -- I can only guess at it, that a
group of colleges band together to try and
encourage New York State residents to come to
their facility to get some additional
revenues, because the state pledges to support
some of the cost of their education. And they
have probably gone out and tried to band
together and offer this bill up. And this
5588
bill was suggested to me by a representative
that they retain, to put on our calendar.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Do -
Mr. President, if the Senator would yield
to -
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Velella, do you continue do yield?
SENATOR VELELLA: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR PATERSON: Do any of the
medical societies or physicians' societies
have any position on this?
SENATOR VELELLA: To the best of
my knowledge, I have no statement from the
Medical Society or from any other interested
party, either for or against the bill. I
don't believe that they have any stated
position.
No, we have -- I just checked with
my office people, and they tell me they have
had no communication on the bill.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
5589
Waldon, why do you rise?
SENATOR WALDON: Would the
gentleman yield to a question or two?
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Velella, do you yield from Senator Waldon?
SENATOR VELELLA: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR WALDON: Thank you very
much, Mr. President.
Senator Velella, I noticed the
schools are in nations where the language of
the country is not English. Is there a
requirement that the students applying for
those schools be fluent in the languages of
those particular countries; i.e., Padua,
Italy?
SENATOR VELELLA: I do know that
the students from New York State that go to
one or two of these schools, and I would
assume the others, are required to go down to
the school, I believe it's like three weeks in
advance. And they are given an intensive
language course in the foreign language. And
also many of the classes are taught in both
5590
the language of that particular country and in
English.
But I do know that -- you notice we
don't have a Guadalajara school down in Mexico
here. They already are part of the program
that these people are trying to get into. And
I know that they have the requirement that
they take an intensive three-or-four-week
course in the language.
SENATOR WALDON: Would the
gentleman yield again, Mr. President?
SENATOR VELELLA: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR WALDON: Thank you, Mr.
President.
Senator, do you have any knowledge
or awareness of the number of
African-American, Caribbean-American, Latino
students who have been admitted to these
colleges historically?
SENATOR VELELLA: No, Senator. I
wouldn't even look to that. I would look to
eligible young people who have graduated
college, seeking a medical career, that have
5591
an opportunity to study abroad.
So I wouldn't even be looking -
I've never taken any interest into what color
they are or what their national origin is, I
just look at students that are looking to go
to a foreign school and how we can help them.
SENATOR WALDON: One more
question.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Velella, do you continue do yield?
SENATOR VELELLA: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR WALDON: Senator, I did
not mean to imply that the students wouldn't
be qualified. I wouldn't want someone
operating on me not to be qualified no matter
what their color. So that wasn't intended in
my question. But I appreciate your response.
Thank you, Mr. President. Thank
you, Senator.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
5592
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Record
the negatives and announce the results.
THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
the negative on Calendar Number 1413 are
Senators Breslin, Connor, Duane, Hannon,
Marcellino, Onorato, Paterson, Schneiderman,
and Seabrook. Ayes, 47. Nays, 9.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
Senator Padavan, why do you rise?
SENATOR PADAVAN: Mr. President,
by unanimous consent I'd like to be recorded
in the negative on Calendar Number 239.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
objection, hearing no objection, Senator
Padavan will be recorded in the negative on
Calendar Number 239.
Senator Smith, why do you rise?
SENATOR SMITH: Mr. President, I
request unanimous consent to be recorded in
the negative on 1413 and 239.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
5593
objection, hearing no objection, Senator Smith
will be recorded in the negative on Calendar
Number 239 and 1413.
Senator McGee.
SENATOR McGEE: Mr. President,
would you please call up Calendar 573.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read Calendar Number 573.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
573, by Senator Trunzo, Senate Print 4412A, an
act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in
relation to the permissive revocation.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
McGee.
SENATOR McGEE: Is there a
message of necessity at the desk, Mr.
President?
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is.
SENATOR McGEE: I move to accept
the message.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
motion is to accept the message of necessity
on Calendar Number 573. All those in favor
signify by saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
5594
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Opposed,
nay.
(No response.)
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
message is accepted. The bill is before the
house.
The Secretary will read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect on the first day of
November.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 55. Nays,
1. Senator Duane recorded in the negative.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
Senator McGee.
SENATOR McGEE: Mr. President,
will you please call up Calendar 815.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
815, by Senator Leibell, Senate Print 5446B,
5595
an act to amend the Retirement and Social
Security Law, in relation to providing.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
McGee.
SENATOR McGEE: Is there a
message at the desk?
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is.
SENATOR McGEE: I move to accept
the message.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
motion is to accept the message of necessity
on Calendar Number 815. All those in favor
signify by saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Opposed,
nay.
(No response.)
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
message is accepted. The bill is before the
house.
The Secretary will read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
5596
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 56.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
Senator McGee.
SENATOR McGEE: Mr. President,
would you please call up Calendar 860.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
860, by Senator Rath, Senate Print 118B, an
act to amend the State Administrative
Procedure Act, in relation to access to data.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
McGee.
SENATOR McGEE: Is there a
message at the desk?
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is.
SENATOR McGEE: I move to accept
the message.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
motion is to accept the message of necessity
on Calendar Number 860. All those in favor
signify by saying aye.
5597
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Opposed,
nay.
(No response.)
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
message is accepted. The bill is before the
house.
The Secretary will read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect in 180 days.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 56.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
Senator McGee.
SENATOR McGEE: Mr. President,
will you please continue the controversial
bills.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will continue to call the
controversial calendar.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
5598
1415, by Senator Leibell, Senate Print 3796A,
an act to amend the General Municipal Law, in
relation to benefits.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
There is a home rule message at the
desk.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 56.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
Senator Duane, why do you rise?
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you,
Mr. President.
SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Duane, why do you rise? So you could sit back
down and listen to Senator Paterson?
SENATOR DUANE: Senator.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Paterson, why do you rise?
5599
SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
when Senator Duane stood up, it was during the
roll call. I think he wants to explain his
vote.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Duane, now why do you rise?
SENATOR DUANE: Because Senator
Paterson is correct.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: On which
calendar bill number did you wish to explain
your vote, Senator?
SENATOR DUANE: 1415.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 1415.
All right. You wish to be recorded in the
negative?
SENATOR DUANE: Yes,
Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Why don't
you tell us why you wish to be recorded in the
negative.
SENATOR DUANE: Though I enjoyed
our camaraderie and repartee right prior to
this, I do want to comment that I think it's
really a shame that this body is voting on yet
another bill -- misguided bill, ill-informed
5600
bill, a bill which unfortunately and sadly
will only continue to spread misinformation on
how it is that HIV is contracted.
I would think that by 1999 the New
York State Senate would have more knowledge of
how it is that HIV is and is not spread, and
also that we would realize that tuberculosis
is a treatable disease, though, sadly, HIV is
not a treatable disease. It is spread with
much more difficulty than this bill and the
previous bills which we voted on in this body
would lead people to believe.
So with the sincere wish that in
the future as we consider these bills, we
consider it in light of what is accurate
public-health information, that we won't have
to vote on more of these misguided and
ill-informed pieces of legislation which sadly
serve to stigmatize people with HIV.
Thank you, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
objection, hearing no objection, Senator Duane
will be recorded in the negative on Calendar
Number 1415.
The Secretary will continue to call
5601
the controversial calendar.
But before that, Senator Paterson,
why do you rise?
SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
I'd like to also be recorded in the negative
on Calendar Number 1415.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
objection, hearing no objection, Senator
Paterson will be recorded in the negative on
Calendar Number 1415.
The Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1418, by Senator Alesi, Senate Print 4124A, an
act to amend the Workers' Compensation Law, in
relation to liability.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
will read the last section.
SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Alesi, an explanation been requested by
Senator Paterson.
SENATOR ALESI: Thank you,
Mr. President. This would simply state that
anyone who is injured on the job but who is
performing an illegal act would not qualify
5602
for workers' compensation.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
that makes perfect sense to me. If Senator
Alesi would yield for a question.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Alesi, do you yield?
SENATOR ALESI: That would make
perfect sense to me, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR PATERSON: Senator Alesi,
what in a situation -- let me give you an
example. Suppose the employee was driving a
car that was not registered, so the employee,
although committing an illegal act, is unaware
that they are committing an illegal act; it's
actually the employer who had the unregistered
vehicle.
And my question is, would there be
any opportunity for the individual to
demonstrate special circumstances that would
allow them to qualify for workers'
compensation? Ignorance of the law is no
5603
excuse in the legal community, but here we're
talking about in the compensation community.
And I'm wondering if this would be an
exception that you would think was meritorious
of some consideration.
SENATOR ALESI: Mr. President,
through you.
Senator, it's clear we both read
the memo from the Trial Lawyers. So my
response to you would be this, that the
Workers' Compensation Board does have some
latitude in determining cases. And in the
case that you described, I'm sure that they
would recognize that that wasn't necessarily a
conscious illegal act on the part of the
employee.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
if Senator Alesi -- I figured if he yielded
once, he'll yield again. But we should ask
him.
SENATOR ALESI: There are limits
to everything, Mr. President. But I will
yield another time, yes.
5604
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR PATERSON: Then, Senator,
it's your opinion that this legislation would
not diminish or in any way negate the
opportunity for the Workers' Compensation
Board to perhaps make an award in this
circumstance such as the one I described?
SENATOR ALESI: Through you,
Mr. President.
No, it would not limit that, as
I've already described. And furthermore, it
simply recognizes that the disability benefits
section of workers' comp already takes into
account a nonpayment for illegal acts.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you, Mr.
President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
Excuse me, Senator Dollinger. Why
do you rise?
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Just one
question for the sponsor, if he'll continue to
5605
yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Alesi, do you yield to a question, one
question, from Senator Dollinger?
SENATOR ALESI: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Is there a
definition of the phrase "illegal act" in
other places in the Compensation Law? My
concern is that Senator Paterson brought up
one possibility. Another possibility is we've
attached -- we've made either violations or
misdemeanors out of all kinds of reporting
conduct and other types of conduct.
My question is, does the illegal
act require a misdemeanor or a felony, or is
it a violation as well?
SENATOR ALESI: Through you,
Mr. President.
The bill clearly states that if the
employee is convicted of an illegal act, by
virtue of being convicted the conviction would
define what the illegal act would be. And the
denial, based on the decision and
5606
determination of the Workers' Comp Board,
would be sufficient.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Thank you,
Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Record
the negatives and announce the results.
THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
the negative on Calendar Number 1418 are
Senators Connor, Dollinger, Duane, Gentile,
Onorato, Paterson, Schneiderman, and Waldon.
Ayes, 48. Nays, 8.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
Senator McGee.
SENATOR McGEE: Mr. President,
please call up Calendar 1426.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read Calendar Number 1426.
5607
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1426, by Senator Alesi, Senate Print 5213, an
act to amend the Public Health Law.
SENATOR DUANE: Explanation.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Alesi, an explanation has been requested of
Calendar Number 1426 by Senator Duane.
SENATOR ALESI: Thank you,
Mr. President.
This bill is fashioned after the
child abuse reporting laws that we have in
this state already. It recognizes the growing
problem of abuse that occurs in the elder
population, whether it is in nursing homes or
other facilities. It also includes those who
are physically or mentally incapacitated and
who are under care in some other facility.
It would require that anybody who
is in a professional capacity that comes into
contact with someone who appears to be abused
would be required to report that suspected
abuse to the appropriate agency or
authorities.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Duane.
5608
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you,
Mr. President. Would the sponsor yield to a
question?
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Alesi, do you yield?
SENATOR ALESI: Be happy to.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR DUANE: I agree that
mandatory reporting of abuse of mentally or
physically incapacitated persons is a very
good idea, and it's time that the state did
that.
I'm wondering also whether or not
the sponsor agrees that reporting of
bias-related incidents based on sexual
orientation or anti-Semitism or racism is
something that also should be reported in the
State of New York.
SENATOR ALESI: Mr. President,
through you. As the issue that Senator Duane
raises is not part of this particular bill, my
opinions on that will remain for another day.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Duane.
5609
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you,
Mr. President. On the bill.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Duane, on the bill.
SENATOR DUANE: I again applaud
this piece of legislation. I think that this
kind of reporting is very important and
something which is overdue in the state of New
York.
But I also would urge my colleagues
to keep in mind that another area of crime
which is not reported in the state of New York
is bias-related crime. In fact, only a
handful of reporting agencies, out of the 500
law-enforcement agencies that could, report
bias incidents of any type at all. And of
those, we don't know what smaller number of
those report bias incidents based on sexual
orientation.
Even so, when these statistics are
gathered, bias based on sexual orientation is
the third highest form of bias-related
incidents, behind anti-Semitism and racism.
And I just would urge my colleagues to make it
part of the agenda of this session to make it
5610
possible in New York State for us to have
reporting on bias-related crimes.
Thank you, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect on the first day of
November.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 56.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1419, by Senator Bonacic, Senate Print 4377B,
an act to amend the Real Property Actions and
Proceedings Law, in relation to new owners.
SENATOR GENTILE: Explanation.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Bonacic, an explanation has been requested by
Senator Gentile.
SENATOR BONACIC: Thank you,
Mr. President.
This is a piece of legislation
5611
where we're amending the Real Property Actions
and Proceedings Law in relation to new owners
of buildings for which administrators have
been appointed, pursuant to Article 7A. This
is an agreed-upon bill. Assemblyman Lopez is
carrying it in the Assembly.
And what the legislation will do,
it will create more affordable housing to
tenants in New York City. What has been
happening in New York City since the mid-'80s,
we had, believe it or not, about 86,000
abandoned buildings, people just walking -
owners walking away. And due to the city's
efforts in a very aggressive policy, they've
been taking over many of those abandoned
buildings, expending city money to
rehabilitate them, and then looking for a new
owner to come over and enter into regulatory
agreements, and then a new owner would upkeep
them.
We're now down to 16,000 abandoned
buildings in the city of New York, in the
metropolitan area, of which still we have to
focus on and try to convert into affordable
housing.
5612
So this legislation -- what happens
now, if an owner abandons a building, the
tenants petition the court to have an
administrator appointed. The administrator
then -- all city-owned money -- will upgrade
the buildings, a lien will go on the building.
Then they will look for a new owner, enter
into a regulatory agreement. And that lien,
of which the city invested in that abandoned
building, will be evaporated over 15 years.
And the agreement that they enter into with
the new owner is for 30 years.
So it's been a very successful
program. We have roughly 2300 units,
apartments, that are in -- under the
administrators, waiting for this law to pass
so we can then get it into affordable housing
and get it to a new owner.
That's what the legislation is.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Gentile, why do you rise?
SENATOR GENTILE: Yes, would the
sponsor yield for a question or two?
SENATOR BONACIC: I do.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
5613
sponsor yields.
SENATOR GENTILE: Thank you,
Mr. President. Through you, Mr. President.
Senator, while the intent of the
legislation is certainly worthwhile and lofty,
there are some questions about the actual
wording of the bill that trouble me. For
example, in these regulatory agreements, the
way I read this bill, is there any provision
being made for either the judge or the
administrator, the 7A administrator, to have
any -- be involved in any of these
transactions or any of the decisions that come
under the regulatory agreements that this bill
will authorize?
SENATOR BONACIC: Yeah, the
administrator has oversight. And he makes -
he makes suggestions to the judge as to, you
know, who the building should be sold to.
They talk about the details of the regulatory
agreement -- whether we'll have rent
restructuring, whether there will be an
increase in the rent just to cover the cost of
improvements.
And I may say, since these policies
5614
have been in effect, there has never been one
displaced tenant in this transition of going
from an abandoned building, from the old
owner, going to administrator, court
proceeding, new owner, never had one displaced
tenant, to the city's credit.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Gentile.
SENATOR GENTILE: Yes, if the
sponsor will continue to yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Bonacic, do you continue to yield?
SENATOR BONACIC: I do.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: He
continues to yield.
SENATOR GENTILE: Senator, in
this legislation, however, it indicates that
the agreement is between the city and the new
owner. It does not mention in any way any
oversight or involvement by the judge or by
the 7A administrator.
SENATOR BONACIC: Yeah, that is
correct. But let me try to clarify your
misconception.
The administrator has the oversight
5615
responsibility to the judge when the building
gets abandoned. It is -- can be a private
person that's appointed. And the
administrator, since it's the city's money, is
really communicating with the City of New York
officials as to how they're going to proceed,
what new owner is in the wings, how much money
are they going to invest in this particular
building, how much is going to be
rent-restructured, and what improvements are
going to be made.
Now, that's a judicial, mechanical
process that takes part in a judicial
proceeding. Any agreement is with the City of
New York and the new owner.
SENATOR GENTILE: If the sponsor
would continue to yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Bonacic, do you continue to yield?
SENATOR BONACIC: I do. I do.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR GENTILE: Through you,
Mr. President.
You mentioned also rent
5616
restructuring. Does this bill, the way it's
written, allow HPD, New York City Housing
Preservation, to override in rent
restructuring -- as provided in this bill, to
override the Rent Stabilization Law, the Rent
Control Law, and the Emergency Tenant
Protection Act?
SENATOR BONACIC: It's my
understanding that this legislation would do
that. It would give the power to the city,
the administrator to restructure and raise the
rent.
But the rents are geared strictly
for the cost of the capital improvements. So
you're upgrading the living conditions and the
quality of life of the tenants. That's the
purpose of it. It's not made to charge more
than what the cost of improvements are.
SENATOR GENTILE: If the sponsor
will continue to yield.
SENATOR BONACIC: I do.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR GENTILE: Thank you.
In that, Senator, there are some
5617
words in this legislation that are rather
vague when we talk about helping the tenants
and improving the lot of the tenants in the
building. For example, it indicates here that
best efforts would be made by HPD to minimize
involuntary economic displacement of tenants.
My question to you is, what is
meant here by "best efforts," left solely in
the legislation as "best efforts"?
SENATOR BONACIC: Well, if we
didn't have the program, we'd have 86,000
abandoned buildings that all the tenants would
have to get out of, because it wouldn't be
habitable, it would be rat-infested, and we
would have not kept them -- to keep them in a
condition where we would put any human being
in.
So the whole purpose of the program
is to make sure that the water is clean, that
the plumbing works, that the wiring is safe,
that the building is habitable. And the city
puts their money into the building and then
tries to find an owner, a new owner -- and
sometimes they're not waiting in the wings,
because these are buildings that are very
5618
badly deteriorated, in high-crime zones. And
then what they do is they make an investment
and they try to keep the rent as low as
possible, and most times subsidizing what they
actually invested in the building to try to
keep the tenants there.
And the proof of the pudding is
there hasn't been one displaced tenant when
they've reduced the amount of abandoned
buildings in New York City from 86,000 to
16,000 that they have now. So I don't think
we can -- I mean, we can ask about it. But
you've never had a displaced tenant that said,
"Hey, I can't afford the rent restructuring
and I don't want to stay here," because it's a
heck of a lot better now than it was with the
old owner.
SENATOR GENTILE: If the sponsor
would continue to yield.
SENATOR BONACIC: I do.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR GENTILE: Through you,
Mr. President.
We mentioned the best efforts to
5619
prevent the economic displacement of tenants.
That's in this legislation. But, Senator, in
this legislation there is no specific
requirement for HPD -- or any governmental
agency, for that matter -- to provide those
loans or grants to actually rehabilitate those
affected buildings. Am I correct about that?
SENATOR BONACIC: Well, the whole
purpose of the program and the policies is to
accomplish that. Just for your own
information, we -- rent restructuring
authority already exists in other statutes
utilized by the HPD, which is the New York
City Department of Housing Preservation and
Development. You have it in Article 8, you
have it in Article 8A, and you have it in
Article 15.
So we're just now expanding the
authority to Article 7A housing, which will
provide the city with the ability to transform
these buildings into a source of permanent
affordable housing.
SENATOR GENTILE: But you would
agree with me that there is no requirement in
this bill for rehabilitation?
5620
SENATOR BONACIC: Well, I will
say to you that the whole essence of the
policy is to do rehabilitation. So I think
your concerns are unfounded in view of the
past success of the city's policies. And I
know you certainly would want to see more
increased affordable housing, you know, for
your residents in Brooklyn and the rest of the
metropolitan area.
SENATOR GENTILE: If the sponsor
would continue to yield.
SENATOR BONACIC: I do.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR GENTILE: Through you,
Mr. President.
What also concerns me is the fact
that by the provisions of this bill, aren't we
in effect allowing owners of deteriorated
buildings to benefit from an increased market
value in the buildings as a result of this
rehabilitation? And also allowing the lien to
evaporate over a period of years, doesn't that
increase the market value of the buildings for
the purpose? And in effect -- I understand
5621
what the purpose is, but in effect, doesn't
that reward the very landlords that -
SENATOR BONACIC: Allowed it to
fall into disrepair.
SENATOR GENTILE: -- allowed it
to happen?
SENATOR BONACIC: I think it's a
good concern. There is no intent -- in fact,
there is language in this legislation where
the prior owner cannot use a straw man, new
owner, to buy the property, where the real
equitable owner or the beneficial owner is the
one that let the building go into disrepair.
Conceivably, though, to answer your
question specifically, old owner walks away,
we're in court, the administrator and New York
City puts money into the building,
rehabilitates the building, and they find a
new owner. It's conceivable that the old
owner will stand to benefit minimally to
expedite the transfer of the property to the
new owner. But there is never a windfall,
there is never a big profit at the expense of
New York City.
The loan evaporates after getting
5622
15 years of affordable housing and management
by the new owner. So that's the trade-off.
We feel -- in most cases the abandoned, old
owner gets nothing, just walks away,
disappears. Can't find him. But -- and we
get a minimum of 15 years of new affordable
housing under a new owner before the loan goes
away. And normally, if they've survived 15
years, they live up to the agreement of 30
years.
SENATOR GENTILE: If the sponsor
would continue to yield.
SENATOR BONACIC: I do.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR GENTILE: You would agree
with me, though, Senator, that we're not only
talking about owners who abandon their
buildings, but that those who might get a
windfall from this could be owners who allowed
their buildings to be in disrepair but have
not abandoned those buildings?
SENATOR BONACIC: As far as -
I'm not an administrator of the program, but I
will tell you what the people from the City of
5623
New York who -- who administrates this program
tells me, that they never, never have an old
owner reap the benefits of a plan to let their
building go into disrepair so they can get the
City of New York to invest city taxpayer money
for them to make a sale where they now see a
massive increase in profits as a result of the
city's infusion of capital.
Here's where the administrator and
the judge and the City of New York have
oversight. And any return to the old owner is
minimal, at best.
SENATOR GENTILE: Or so we say.
SENATOR BONACIC: So they say.
SENATOR GENTILE: So they say.
Will the sponsor continue to yield
for one or two more questions?
SENATOR BONACIC: I do.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR GENTILE: Thank you.
Now, in your legislation it
provides for both rent restructuring and the
forgiving of the loans -- the evaporating of
the liens, I should say. Does the 15-year
5624
requirement of this bill, which requires that
housing be for persons of low income, would
that still apply if in the agreement the
agreement only provided for rent restructuring
but not for -- does not include the forgiving
of the liens?
SENATOR BONACIC: Could you
rephrase that question? I don't think I
understood what you were getting at.
SENATOR GENTILE: Sure. The
legislation allows both rent restructuring and
the evaporation of the liens placed against
the building.
SENATOR BONACIC: That's correct.
SENATOR GENTILE: Either or both.
SENATOR BONACIC: Or both.
SENATOR GENTILE: If the
regulatory agreement only included the rent
restructuring, the increasing of the rent, did
not also provide for the evaporation of New
York City liens against the building, would
that -- would the requirement, the other
requirement that for 15 years that this
building be for low-income housing, would that
still be in effect if the -- if one or other
5625
of the two options, the liens or the rent
restructuring, were not in the agreement?
SENATOR BONACIC: As I understand
it, you need the evaporation in order to
attract new owners to come into these kinds of
investments. That's point number one. And
you need the rent restructuring in order to
capture the substantial infusion of money that
the city has to do to make it habitable. And
it's up to, I think, $18,000 per unit the city
would invest to make the buildings safe to
keep the tenants there.
So I don't know if that answers
your question. But I think we need both all
of the time -- in most cases, both happen.
You need the carrot, the economic incentive to
get the new owner, and you need the rent
restructuring to offset the massive amount of
monies to get the building back into repair.
SENATOR GENTILE: If the sponsor
would yield for one additional question.
SENATOR BONACIC: I do.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR GENTILE: You mentioned,
5626
Senator, that there has not been one tenant
displaced in the history of the program.
However, the legislation does provide for
suitable temporary relocation arrangements, in
the event that such happens, for tenants.
My question again is the
definition: What are we talking about when
we're talking about suitable temporary
relocations?
SENATOR BONACIC: Well, I think,
as a practical matter, sometimes when the city
enters the picture and the owner abandons the
building, the building is basically unsafe.
And the city would love to keep the -- as a
practical matter, they would love the tenants
to be able to stay there while they're fixing
it up, but they have the responsibility to
make sure that no harm comes to those tenants.
And if the building is in real bad
shape, I would assume that they'd put the
tenants in hotels or other apartments until
they make the repairs and then allow them to
move back in in a much safer building. I
think that's how it works.
SENATOR GENTILE: But that is not
5627
included in the bill.
SENATOR BONACIC: It is not.
And, I mean, we're not micromanaging every
physical aspect that you go through. But
that's the intent, and that's what would
happen as a practical matter.
SENATOR GENTILE: Thank you,
Senator.
SENATOR BONACIC: You're welcome.
SENATOR GENTILE: On the bill,
Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Gentile, on the bill.
SENATOR GENTILE: While I applaud
Senator Bonacic on the intent of the
legislation here, it just seems to me that
many of these are a best-hope provision. We
hope for the best, and we hope that HPD will
do the right thing and certainly rehabilitate
the buildings and raise rents only for the
purpose of rehabilitating the buildings; will,
in case of displacements, find suitable -
whatever that suitable accommodation might be,
and also not be in a situation where owners
who have allowed the building to deteriorate
5628
would reap a windfall from the increased
market value by allowing the liens to
evaporate over time.
Those are my concerns that, while
the intent is good here, there are real
vagaries, that we're giving basically the
authority to HPD and to the -- and to a new
owner to enter into a regulatory agreement
without much input or oversight, if any -
because it's not clear in this legislation -
from the court or from the 7A administrator.
Given those vagaries in the bill, I
have real problems of putting tenants in that
position of increased rents and the
possibility of allowing landlords that don't
deserve it to have windfall profits.
So I would ask my colleagues in
that to consider that in this vote. Thank
you, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
5629
(The Secretary called the roll.)
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce
the results.
THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
the negative on Calendar Number 1419 are
Senators Connor, Gentile, Paterson, Rosado,
and Schneiderman. Ayes, 53. Nays, 5.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1430, by Senator Lack, Senate Print 5635, an
act to amend Chapter 83 of the Laws of 1995.
SENATOR McGEE: Lay the bill
aside temporarily.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside temporarily.
Senator Schneiderman, why do you
rise?
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: I'd like
to request unanimous content to be recorded in
the negative on Calendar Number 1415, Senate
Bill 3796A.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
objection, hearing no objection, Senator
Schneiderman will be recorded in the negative
5630
on Calendar Number 1415.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Thank you.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will continue to read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1453, by Senator Meier, Senate Print 5933, an
act to amend the Social Services Law.
SENATOR DUANE: Explanation,
please.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Meier, an explanation of Calendar Number 1453
has been requested by Senator Duane.
SENATOR MEIER: Thank you,
Mr. President.
Mr. President, as you know, in the
1997-'98 series of budget legislation, the
Legislature implemented the Learnfare program.
This legislation before us today would modify
that legislation.
The existing statute requires that
all social services districts have Learnfare
in place by September of 1999 for children in
grades one through six. This legislation
makes three primary modifications. The first
is that it somewhat delays and stretches out
5631
that implementation schedule so that one-half
of school districts within each social
services district must implement Learnfare by
September of 1999, and then we would phase in
the full implementation by September of the
year 2000.
Secondly, the bill before the house
takes a requirement in existing law, which
requires that a child be referred to
counseling after three unexcused absences, and
adds a requirement that the child's parents or
other responsible household head be added to
that counseling requirement.
The third change that the bill
before the house makes to existing law is to
delay the sunset date. Present law would
sunset the Learnfare program in July of the
year 2000. This bill would take that sunset
date to July of the year 2005. The purpose of
that, of course, is to give us time to take a
look at the new implementation schedule and to
review the results.
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Duane, why do you rise?
5632
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you,
Mr. President. Would the sponsor yield to
some questions?
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Meier, do you yield to a question?
SENATOR MEIER: Of course,
Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you.
Has there been any study or
evaluation done on the effectiveness of the
original legislation, the original period?
SENATOR MEIER: Mr. President,
there has been a review of the data that is
available from the implementation as it is at
this point.
Presently, we have some 140 schools
located within 43 social services districts,
including the city of New York. That involves
some 15,000 students who are enrolled in the
program. There have been 1,277 referrals for
counseling, and that is the result of three
unexcused absences within an academic quarter.
It is significant that the sanction
5633
piece, which comes into effect after four
unexcused absences, has only been utilized in
97 cases. 97 cases of sanctions out of 1277
counseling referrals would seem to indicate
that monitoring the attendance of these pupils
and then requiring the counseling session
would seem to promote school attendance.
There have been so far reported,
after initial sanctions of the 97 cases, only
two cases of repeat necessity of referral. So
the available data would seem to suggest that
this does promote school attendance. And of
course it is an undergirding principal of
Learnfare that we want to try to start
breaking the cycle of dependency, if you will,
early on by promoting school attendance,
school graduation, and all that learning and
education means.
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you.
Through you, Mr. President, if the
sponsor could continue to yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Meier, do you yield to yield?
SENATOR MEIER: Yes, I do,
Mr. President.
5634
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR DUANE: Can you tell me
who it is that performed this study?
SENATOR MEIER: This is a result
of data that has been gathered by the State
Office of Temporary and Disability Assistance,
and it's been done by canvassing the
participating school districts.
SENATOR DUANE: And it was -
just to continue on that point, it was not
done by an outside study, it was done
in-house?
SENATOR MEIER: Well,
Mr. President, the study was done by the State
Office of Temporary Assistance and Disability
Assistance, canvassing school districts and
social services districts. I presume that's
the most reliable way to get the information,
to go to the people who are out on the street.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you,
Mr. President. Through you, if I could
continue with some questions.
5635
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Meier, do you yield?
SENATOR MEIER: Yes, I do.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR DUANE: Is there evidence
that children in New York whose families
receive TADA funding attend school at a lower
rate than those that are non-TADA, that don't
get that funding?
SENATOR MEIER: Mr. President,
the initial data would suggest as much. If we
have some 15,000 students enrolled in the
program, and 1,277 counseling referrals,
that's a rate of a little over 8 percent,
which would seem to exceed the normal absentee
level in most school districts.
I mean, understand -- and there may
be a philosophical difference here, but there
is a philosophical reason behind this. And
that is that we in New York State have decided
that there is, in effect, a social contract
with the needy. That is observed in our
Constitution, that is observed in statute,
that the needy and their children should be
5636
provided for so that no New Yorker should have
to live below a certain level of human
existence.
This, however, rests on the
proposition, Learnfare does, that contracts -
social contracts are like other contracts,
they're two-way streets, and that we as a
society ought to have the right to ask for the
observance of certain kinds of conduct, which
would include ensuring that one's children
receive an education so that they have a
better chance to escape welfare dependency.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: Mr. President, if
the sponsor would continue to yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Meier, do you continue to yield?
SENATOR MEIER: Yes, Mr.
President.
SENATOR WALDON: The sponsor
yields.
SENATOR DUANE: I acknowledge
there may very well be a philosophical
difference. Be that as it may, what exists
5637
exists.
But what I'm trying to get at is I
understand the 8 percent of the children who
were studied out of the 15,000, I believe the
sponsor said. But what I can't figure out
is -- and there may not be an answer, but is
that compared to 15,000 that are non-TADA? Or
we just don't know that? In other words, is
the 15,000 sample, 8 percent of them receive
counseling, as compared to 15,000 students
someplace who are non-TADA qualified?
SENATOR MEIER: Mr. President, I
understand the question. But the point I was
making is that roughly 8 percent of that
sampling would seem to exceed the normal
absentee level in terms of the overall student
body in every school district.
Now, I understand, Mr. President,
that averages can be deceiving. If you're
standing with one foot in a bucket of ice
water and one foot in a bucket of boiling
water, on average you're comfortable. But
this would seem to give us a sampling.
And what that legislation seeks to
do is to extend the implementation schedule,
5638
to give the school districts and counties in
the state of New York more time to implement
the program so they can do it in an orderly
fashion. It sunsets the law in the year 2005.
And at that time, we'll have a more complete
set of data to review.
SENATOR DUANE: Mr. President, if
the sponsor would continue to yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Meier, do you continue to yield?
SENATOR MEIER: Yes, I do, Mr.
President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR DUANE: Presently, each
school district has different guidelines for
how it is that Learnfare is -- well, different
guidelines for Workfare -- for Learnfare,
excuse me. As I read this bill, it isn't
putting any structure into the guidelines,
that in fact we're expanding the program but
still not incorporating any guidelines. So
will it be a similar situation that guidelines
will differ from school district to school
district?
5639
SENATOR MEIER: Mr. President,
the bill provides for implementation through
the negotiation of an agreement between the
local social services district and the school
districts where we are implementing this.
And indeed, it is precisely the
point that we do not seek from Albany to
micromanage how school districts handle the
subject of school attendance, and that those
issues are best addressed at the local level.
But I think you will find across
the state that most schools recognize excused
absences for the same reasons -- for
illnesses, for deaths in the family, for
family emergencies and so forth. So I think
you will find a degree of uniformity, but it
will be done according to local standards and
will be implemented by locally negotiated
agreements.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: Through you,
Mr. President, if the sponsor would continue
to yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
5640
Meier, do you continue to yield?
SENATOR MEIER: Yes,
Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR DUANE: I raise that only
in the context of how it is that we're going
to study the effectiveness of the Learnfare
programs as they vary from district to
district.
The other area that I am concerned
about is whether or not, in the study that was
done, whether or not there was any look at the
effectiveness of truancy-prevention programs
in terms of what the percentages are in each
school district and whether truancy-prevention
programs end up having an impact on school
attendance as opposed to only the Learnfare
project in and of itself without the
truancy-prevention programs.
SENATOR MEIER: Well,
Mr. President, that was the point I thought I
was making, that of the over 1,200 referrals
for counseling, out of that cohort only 97
resulted in sanctions. That would seem to
5641
indicate that counseling -- once we identify a
student as a truancy problem, that counseling
is effective.
I would suggest that this
legislation, which adds the additional
requirement of parental involvement in
counseling, would only further serve to make
that counseling effective.
SENATOR DUANE: And a final
question, Mr. President, if the sponsor will
yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Meier, do you yield?
SENATOR MEIER: Yes, I do.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR DUANE: Is the sponsor
aware of anything that's being done to expand
programs such as the Attendance Improvement
and Dropout Prevention Program?
SENATOR MEIER: Well, again,
Mr. President, that is what this bill seeks to
do, by providing a better implementation
schedule, by encouraging parental involvement
in individual school districts across the
5642
state. There very well may be programs to
implement attendance improvement, but I would
add that I thought that that is a good part of
what the schools are in the business of doing,
is making sure that the kids, regardless of
whether their households may be
family-assistance recipients, of making sure
that the kids attend school.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you. On
the bill.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Duane, on the bill.
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you.
I am concerned that while we're
collecting statistics, we're not comparing
them to anything. There's no comparison being
made to students that are not TADA receivers.
And also, while we have the aggregate numbers,
we don't have a breakdown by school district
to school district and have a way to compare
them with what guidelines are in place and
what programs are in place.
And I think that while I do agree
5643
that philosophically we probably have a
different point of view -- which will be
exacerbated by the sanctions which are going
to come into effect -- I still think that we
could be using this time to make a better
study about what it is that actually works for
students who are poor or come from poor
families as well as for students that come
from more advantaged families.
So my point is even if we disagree
at the root philosophically, that there is
always room to use what information we have to
provide for better programs as we go into the
out years.
Thank you, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce
the results.
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 55. Nays,
5644
3. Senators Duane, Paterson, and Schneiderman
recorded in the negative.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
Senator Mendez, why do you rise?
SENATOR MENDEZ: Thank you.
Mr. President, I wish unanimous consent to be
recorded in the negative in Calendar Number
1419. I was out of the chamber when the vote
was taken.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
objection, hearing no objection, Senator
Mendez will be recorded in the negative on
Calendar 1419.
The Secretary will continue to read
the controversial calendar.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1456, by Member of the Assembly Canestrari,
Assembly Print Number 5126, an act authorizing
the reopening.
SENATOR McGEE: Lay the bill
aside temporarily.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside temporarily.
Senator McGee.
5645
SENATOR McGEE: May we please
return to the reports of standing committees.
I believe there's a Rules Committee report at
the desk.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: We will
return to the order of reports of standing
committees.
There is a Rules report at the
desk. I'll ask the Secretary to read.
THE SECRETARY: Senator Bruno,
from the Committee on Rules, offers up the
following bills directly for third reading:
Senate Prints 1202A, by Senator
LaValle, an act to amend the Education Law;
2075, by Senator Trunzo, an act to
amend the Administrative Code of the City of
New York;
2347, by Senator DeFrancisco, an
act to amend the Navigation Law;
2403, by Senator LaValle, an act
relating to the granting of retirement system
death benefits;
2543C, by Senator Marcellino, an
act to amend the Environmental Conservation
Law;
5646
2884, by Senator Saland, an act to
amend the Judiciary Law;
3365A, by Senator Wright, an act to
amend the Tax Law;
3514B, by Senator Spano, an act to
amend the Labor Law;
3805, by Senator Trunzo, an act to
amend the Retirement and Social Security Law;
3828, by Senator Saland, an act to
amend the State Finance Law;
3893, by Senator Bonacic, an act to
amend the Executive Law;
3897, by Senator Saland, an act to
amend the State Finance Law;
4032, by Senator Goodman, an act to
amend the Executive Law;
4061A, by Senator Oppenheimer, an
act to legalize;
4067, by Senator Leibell, an act to
amend the Administrative Code of the City of
New York;
4135A, by Senator Volker, an act to
amend the Civil Practice Law and Rules;
4188, by Senator Maltese, an act to
amend the Administrative Code of the City of
5647
New York;
4244B, by Senator Hannon, an act to
amend the State Finance Law;
4323A, by Senator McGee, an act to
amend the Economic Development Law;
4489, by Senator Larkin, an act to
amend the Racing and Pari-Mutuel Wagering Law;
4529, by Senator Leibell, an act to
amend the Penal Law;
4585B, by Senator Maziarz, an act
to amend the Public Health Law;
4640, by Senator Hannon, an act to
amend Chapter 904 of the Laws of 1984;
4680A, by Senator Stafford, an act
to amend the Public Health Law;
4689A, by Senator Alesi, an act to
redistribute;
5049, by Senator Alesi, an act to
amend the Public Authorities Law;
5055, by Senator Hoffmann, an act
to amend the Agriculture and Markets Law;
5356, by Senator Nozzolio, an act
to amend the Education Law;
5385A, by Senator DeFrancisco, an
act to amend the Executive Law;
5648
5462B, by Senator Maziarz, an act
to amend the Public Health Law;
5488, by Senator Bonacic, an act to
enable the County of Ulster;
5492, by Senator Larkin, an act to
amend the Racing and Pari-Mutuel Wagering Law;
5499A, by Senator Larkin, an act to
amend the Racing and Pari-Mutuel Wagering Law;
5577, by Senator Trunzo, an act to
amend the Public Authorities Law;
5586A, by Senator Stafford, an act
relating to constituting;
5590, by Senator Nozzolio, an act
to amend the Executive Law;
5601, by Senator Saland, an act to
amend the Social Services Law;
5643A, by Senator Marcellino, an
act to amend the Environmental Conservation
Law;
5674, by Senator Spano, an act to
amend the Labor Law;
5699A, by Senator Seward, an act to
amend the General Municipal Law;
5716A, by Senator Johnson, an act
to amend the Environmental Conservation Law;
5649
5717A, by Senator Johnson, an act
to amend the Environmental Conservation Law;
5797A, by Senator Johnson, an act
to amend the Environmental Conservation Law;
5914, by Senator Johnson, an act to
amend the Environmental Conservation Law;
5915, by Senator Johnson, an act to
amend the Environmental Conservation Law;
5916, by Senator Johnson, an act to
amend the Environmental Conservation Law;
5917, by Senator Johnson, an act to
amend the Environmental Conservation Law;
5918A, by Senator Johnson, an act
to amend the Environmental Conservation Law;
5935, by the Committee on Rules, an
act to amend Chapter 141 of the Laws of 1994;
And 5953, by Senator Smith, an act
directing the Department of State.
All bills directly for third
reading.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
McGee.
SENATOR McGEE: Mr. President, I
move to accept the Rules Committee report.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
5650
motion is to accept the report of the Rules
Committee. All those in favor signify by
saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Opposed,
nay.
(No response.)
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The Rules
report is accepted. The bills are ordered
directly to third reading.
Senator Gentile, why do you rise?
SENATOR GENTILE: Mr. President,
I just rise to inquire how I was recorded on
Calendar Number 1418.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Gentile, the Secretary has you recorded as
being in the negative on Calendar Number 1418.
Is that your pleasure?
SENATOR GENTILE: I would ask
unanimous consent to be recorded in the
affirmative on 1418.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
objection, hearing no objection -
SENATOR GENTILE: Thank you.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: -
5651
Senator Gentile will be recorded in the
affirmative on Calendar Number 1418.
Senator Stachowski, why do you
rise?
SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Mr.
President, may I have unanimous consent to be
recorded in the negative on Calendar 1413.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
objection -
SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Thank you.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: -
hearing no objection, Senator Stachowski will
be recorded in negative on Calendar Number
1413.
Senator McGee.
SENATOR McGEE: Mr. President, I
would ask that we return to the Senate
Supplementary Calendar 56A and read the
noncontroversial items.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
will read the noncontroversial reading of
Senate Supplemental Calendar 56A, which is on
the members' desks.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1458, by Senator LaValle, Senate Print 1202A,
5652
an act to amend the Education Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect on the first day of
July.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 58.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1459, by Senator Trunzo, Senate Print 2075, an
act to amend the Administrative Code of the
City of New York.
SENATOR WALDON: There is a home
rule message at the desk.
The Secretary will read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
5653
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 58.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1460, by Senator DeFrancisco, Senate Print
2347, an act to amend the Navigation Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 58.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: In relation to
Calendar Number 1461, Senator LaValle moves to
discharge, from the Committee on Civil Service
and Pensions, Assembly Bill 4250 and
substitute it for the identical third reading,
1461.
SENATOR WALDON: Substitution is
ordered.
The Secretary will read.
5654
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1461, by Member of the Assembly Vitaliano,
Assembly Print 4250, an act relating to the
granting of retirement system death benefits.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 58.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1463, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 2884, an
act to amend the Judiciary Law.
SENATOR DUANE: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is laid aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1464, by Senator Wright, Senate Print 3365A,
an act to amend the Tax Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
5655
THE SECRETARY: Section 6. This
act shall take effect December 1st.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 58.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1465, by Senator Spano, Senate Print 3514B, an
act to amend the Labor Law and the Urban
Development Corporation Act.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 6. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 57. Nays,
1. Senator Duane recorded in the negative.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1466, by Senator Trunzo, Senate Print 3805, an
5656
act to amend the Retirement and Social
Security Law.
SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1467, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 3828, an
act to amend the State Finance Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 58.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1468, by Senator Bonacic, Senate Print 3893,
an act to amend the Executive Law.
SENATOR DUANE: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
5657
1469. In relation to Calendar Number 1469,
Senator Saland moves to discharge, from the
Committee on Finance, Assembly Bill 7644 and
substitute it for the identical third reading,
1469.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
substitution is ordered.
The Secretary will read.
SENATOR DUANE: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1470, by Senator Goodman, Senate Print 4032,
an act to amend the Executive Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 38. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 58.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
5658
1471. In relation to Calendar Number 1471,
Senator Oppenheimer moves to discharge from
the Committee on Rules and substitute it for
the identical third reading, 1471.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
substitution is ordered.
The Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1471, by Member of the Assembly Tocci,
Assembly Print 6880A, an act to legalize,
validate, ratify and confirm.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is
a local fiscal impact note at the desk.
The Secretary will read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 58.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1472, by Senator Leibell, Senate Print 4067,
5659
an act to amend the Administrative Code of the
City of New York.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
will read the last section.
SENATOR LEIBELL: Section 5.
This act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 58.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1474, by Senator Maltese, Senate Print 4188 -
SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is
a home rule message at the desk.
The bill will be laid aside at the
request of the Acting Minority Leader.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1476. In relation to Calendar Number 1476,
Senator McGee moves to discharge, from the
Committee on Rules, Assembly Bill 5337A and
substitute it for the identical third reading,
1476.
5660
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
substitution is ordered.
The Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1476, by Member of the Assembly Destito,
Assembly Print 5337A, an act to amend the
Economic Development Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect on the 180th day.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 58.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1477, by Senator Larkin, Senate Print 4489, an
act to amend the Racing, Pari-Mutuel Wagering
and Breeding Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
SENATOR DUANE: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
5661
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1478, by Senator Leibell, Senate Print 4529,
an act to amend the Penal Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect on the first day of
November.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1479, by Senator Maziarz, Senate Print 4585B,
an act to amend the Public Health Law and the
Insurance Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
5662
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1480. In relation to Calendar Number 1480,
Senator Hannon moves to discharge, from the
Committee on Rules, Assembly Bill 8236 and
substitute it for the identical third reading,
1480.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
substitution is ordered.
The Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1480, by the Assembly Committee on Rules,
Assembly Print 8236, an act to amend Chapter
904 of the Laws of 1984.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
5663
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1481, by Senator Stafford, Senate Print 4680A,
an act to amend the Public Health Law.
SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1482, by Senator Alesi, Senate Print 4689A, an
act to redistribute 1998 bond volume
allocations.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 17. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1483. In relation to Calendar Number 1483,
Senator Alesi moves to discharge, from the
5664
Committee on Commerce, Economic Development
and Small Business, Assembly Bill 471 and
substitute it for the identical third reading,
1483.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
substitution is ordered.
The Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1483, by Member of the Assembly Destito,
Assembly Print 471, an act to amend the Public
Authorities Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
Last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1484, by Senator Hoffmann, Senate Print 5055,
an act to amend the Agriculture and Markets
5665
Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 10. This
act shall take effect on the first day of
April.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1485, by Senator Nozzolio, Senate Print 5356,
an act to amend the Education Law.
SENATOR DUANE: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1486, by Senator DeFrancisco, Senate Print
5385A, an act to amend the Executive Law and
the Parks, Recreation and Historic
Preservation Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
5666
THE SECRETARY: Section 8. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1487, by Senator Maziarz, Senate Print 5462B,
an act to amend the Public Health Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect on the first day of
April.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1488, by Senator Bonacic, Senate Print 5488,
an act to enable the County of Ulster.
5667
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is
a home rule message at the desk.
The Secretary will read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 8. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1489, by Senator Larkin, Senate Print 5492, an
act to amend the Racing, Pari-Mutuel Wagering
and Breeding Law.
SENATOR DUANE: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1490, by Senator Larkin, Senate Print 5499A,
an act to amend the Racing, Pari-Mutuel
Wagering and Breeding Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
5668
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
SENATOR DUANE: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1491, by Senator Trunzo, Senate Print 5577, an
act to amend the Public Authorities Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1493. In relation to Calendar Number 1493,
Senator Nozzolio moves to discharge, from the
Committee on Rules -
SENATOR DUANE: Lay it aside.
5669
THE SECRETARY: -- Assembly Bill
8130A and substitute it for the identical
third reading, 1493.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
substitution is ordered.
The Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1493, by the Assembly Committee on Rules,
Assembly Print 8130A, an act to amend the
Executive Law.
SENATOR DUANE: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1494, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 5601, an
act to amend the Social Service Law, the
Family Court Act, and the Civil Practice Law
and Rules.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Lay the bill
aside, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1495, by Senator Marcellino, Senate Print
5643A, an act to amend the Environmental
5670
Conservation Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1496, by Senator Spano, Senate Print 5674, an
act to amend the Labor Law, in relation to
funds.
SENATOR McGEE: Lay it aside
temporarily.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside temporarily.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1497, by Senator Seward, Senate Print 5699A,
an act to amend the General Municipal Law.
SENATOR DUANE: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside.
5671
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1498. In relation to Calendar Number 1498,
Senator Johnson moves to discharge, from the
Committee on Rules, Assembly Bill 8165A and
substitute it for the identical third reading,
1498.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
substitution is ordered.
The Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1498, by the Assembly Committee on Rules,
Assembly Print 8165A, an act to amend the
Environmental Conservation Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 58. Nays,
1. Senator LaValle recorded in the negative.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
5672
1499. In relation to Calendar Number 1499,
Senator Johnson moves to discharge, from the
Committee on Rules, Assembly Bill 6044A and
substitute it for the identical third reading,
1499.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
substitution is ordered.
The Secretary will read the title.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1499, by Member of the Assembly Sweeney,
Assembly Print 6044A, an act to amend the
Environmental Conservation Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 58. Nays,
1. Senator LaValle recorded in the negative.
SENATOR WALDON: The bill is
passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1500. In relation to Calendar Number 1500,
5673
Senator Johnson moves to discharge, from the
Committee on Rules, Assembly Bill 8479A and
substitute it for the identical third reading,
1500.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
substitution is ordered.
Secretary will read the title.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1500, by the Assembly Committee on Rules,
Assembly Print 8479A, an act to amend the
Environmental Conservation Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 58. Nays,
1. Senator LaValle recorded in the negative.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1501. In relation to Calendar Number 1501,
Senator Johnson moves to discharge, from the
5674
Committee on Rules, Assembly Bill 8169 and
substitute it for the identical third reading,
1501.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
substitution is ordered.
The Secretary will read the title.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1501, by the Assembly Committee on Rules,
Assembly Print 8169A, an act to amend the
Environmental Conservation Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This
act shall take effect on the first day of
January.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1502. In relation to Calendar Number 1502,
Senator Johnson moves to discharge, from the
Committee on Rules, Assembly Bill 8117 and
5675
substitute it for the identical third reading,
1502.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
substitution is ordered.
The Secretary will read the title.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1502, by the Assembly Committee on Rules,
Assembly Print 8117, an act to amend the
Environmental Conservation Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1503, by Senator Johnson, Senate Print 5916,
an act to amend the Environmental Conservation
Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
will read the last section.
5676
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1504, by Senator Johnson, Senate Print 5917,
an act to amend the Environmental Conservation
Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 58. Nays,
1. Senator LaValle recorded in the negative.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1505, by Senator Johnson, Senate Print 5918A,
5677
an act to amend the Environmental Conservation
Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect November 1st.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes -
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Dollinger, to explain his vote on Calendar
Number 1505.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Briefly,
Mr. President, we'd like to give the Neptune
Award to Senator Johnson to all these bills
apparently regulating the fishing of all the
fish in the sea.
So we're going to give you the
Neptune Award, Senator Johnson, for carrying
these eight bills, and we'll deliver our
trident to you later this week.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: How do
you vote, Senator Dollinger?
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Aye,
5678
Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Dollinger will be recorded in the affirmative.
Announce the results.
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1507, by Senator Smith, Senate Print 5953, an
act directing the Department of State to
examine and investigate the use.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
Senator Skelos, that completes the
reading of the noncontroversial calendar,
Calendar Number 56A.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
5679
is there any housekeeping at all at the desk
that should be done?
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Skelos, yes, there is one motion we have we'd
like to take up. You want to return to the
order of motions and resolutions?
SENATOR SKELOS: Yes. Yes,
Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Meier.
SENATOR MEIER: Mr. President, on
behalf of Senator Saland, please remove the
sponsor star from Calendar Number 645.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
sponsor star is removed from Calendar Number
645.
Senator Smith, why do you rise?
Senator Montgomery, why do you
rise?
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Mr.
President, I would like unanimous consent to
be recorded in the negative on several bills.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
objection -
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Okay, thank
5680
you.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: -
hearing no objection -- Senator Montgomery,
why don't you list the bills for us.
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: All right.
Calendars 239, 866, 1413, 1415, 1418, 1419,
and 1453.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
objection, Senator Montgomery will be recorded
in the negative on Calendar Numbers 239, 866,
1413, 1415, 1418, 1419, and 1453.
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Thank you.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Bruno.
SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President,
can we at this time take up the reading of the
controversial calendar, supplemental.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the controversial
supplemental calendar, Calendar 56A.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1463, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 2884, an
act to amend the Judiciary Law and the Uniform
City Court Act.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
5681
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 6. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1466, by Senator Trunzo, Senate Print 3805, an
act to amend the Retirement and Social
Security Law.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Explanation.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Trunzo, an explanation of Calendar Number 1466
has been requested by Senator Dollinger.
SENATOR TRUNZO: Mr. President,
this bill is a chapter amendment to Chapter
300 of the Laws of 1998, where we granted
retirement credit for a period of workers'
compensation leave for members of the New York
City Employees Retirement System who are
transit operating and bridge and tunnel
employees. However, we inadvertently omitted
5682
the bridge and tunnel officers, sergeants and
lieutenants, from the benefits. This
legislation corrects the oversight.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Dollinger.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Through you,
Mr. President, if Senator Trunzo would just
yield to a couple of quick questions.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Trunzo, do you yield to a question from
Senator Dollinger?
SENATOR TRUNZO: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Are there
currently employees in the City of New York
who get this benefit, the workers' -
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Dollinger, excuse the interruption. It's just
a little noisy in the chamber. I know that
Senator Trunzo can't hear with the
conversation going on right next to him. So
Senator Lack, if you could take that
conversation away from Senator Trunzo, he
might be able to hear the question.
5683
I think Senator Trunzo can now
hear.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Thank you,
Mr. President. Through you, could Senator
Trunzo just tell me what other employees of
the City of New York, if any, now get this
benefit, credit for their periods of workers'
compensation leave on their pension benefit,
Mr. President?
SENATOR TRUNZO: I didn't quite
hear the question. I'm sorry.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: I
apologize -
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: I was
wrong. I'm sorry, Senator Dollinger. Would
you speak a little louder?
SENATOR DOLLINGER: This, as you
know, Mr. President, is unusual for me, since
I'm usually heard most times.
Senator Trunzo, what current
employees of the City of New York get this
benefit, this -- in other words, the credit
for their workers' compensation benefits in
their pension calculation?
SENATOR TRUNZO: All of them do,
5684
from my understanding, except for the ones
that we happen to have unfortunately left out
of this legislation last year; that is,
Tri-Borough Bridge and Tunnel Authority. When
we did the legislation last year, Chapter 300,
we included the Triborough Bridge and Tunnel
Authority personnel, but unfortunately forgot
to include the sergeants and the lieutenants
from this benefit.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Dollinger.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Through you,
Mr. President, what I'm -
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Trunzo, do you continue to yield?
SENATOR TRUNZO: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Do the other
employees of the City of New York -- not the
TBTA personnel, but the other employees of the
City of New York, the comparable employees,
the sergeants, lieutenants of the New York
City Police Department or the Housing Police
or the Transit Police, do they also have this
5685
benefit?
SENATOR TRUNZO: The transit
police have it. The transit police have that.
A few people have that particular clause right
now in the City of New York.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Through you,
Mr. President, just to clarify. The transit
workers have it. Do the regular police
officers have it?
SENATOR TRUNZO: I'm not sure
about the regular police at this point.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Through you,
Mr. President, if Senator Trunzo will continue
to yield for just one other question.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Trunzo, do you continue to yield?
SENATOR TRUNZO: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: What is the
cost of this measure to the pension plan, and
who would pay it? And have they asked us to
pay it or asked us to do this knowing that
they've got to pay for it or somebody else is
going to pay for it?
5686
SENATOR TRUNZO: According to the
bill, the fiscal note indicates that the cost
to the employer would be approximately
$200,000 per year.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Through you,
Mr. President. I'm not sure I heard the
answer and I'm not sure I understood it.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Trunzo, could you repeat the answer for
Senator Dollinger, please?
SENATOR TRUNZO: According to the
fiscal note that's on this legislation, the
cost would be -- to the employer would be
approximately 200,000 per annum.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Final
question, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Trunzo, do you continue to yield?
SENATOR TRUNZO: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: This measure
is retroactive, as I understand it, to 1998,
back 17 or 18 months. Why would we make the
bill retroactive that far back? I mean, how
5687
many people would be affected? Will there be
a lump sum that will be required to be paid by
the TBTA at that time?
SENATOR TRUNZO: The problem was
that they were originally excluded from the
original bill, from the Chapter 300. And so
we had to make it retroactive to the date of
the original legislation that passed. That
these should have been in that piece of
legislation back in 1998.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Okay. Just a
final question, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Trunzo, do you continue to yield?
SENATOR TRUNZO: How many final
questions you got?
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Did the TBTA
ask us to do this bill? The Authority, the
actual Authority asked us to do this bill?
SENATOR TRUNZO: Yes, we got this
from the Authority.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Thank you,
Mr. President.
5688
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1468, by Senator Bonacic, Senate Print 3893,
an act to amend the Executive Law.
SENATOR DUANE: Explanation.
SENATOR BRUNO: Lay it aside
temporarily.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside temporarily.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1469, by Member of the Assembly Schimminger,
Assembly Print 7644, an act to amend the State
Finance Law.
SENATOR DUANE: Explanation.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Saland, an explanation of Calendar 1469 has
5689
been requested.
SENATOR SALAND: Thank you,
Mr. President.
Mr. President, what this bill would
do would be to merely expand the current
authority of the Comptroller to deposit monies
for use in the Linked Deposit Program. The
current level is $100 million. This bill
would propose to expand that to $150 million.
And what the Linked Deposit Program
is, and I'm sure most of the members are
familiar with, it is a program whereby the
state or certain state authorities agree to
deposit monies in certain banking institutions
and accept a lower interest rate, generally 2
or 3 points lower. Those monies are then used
for lower-interest-rate loans to businesses
that that bank may be dealing with.
And it's been a very successful
program, has leveraged a considerable amount
of additional dollars. Some 600-plus loans
have been instituted, and the monies that
we've provided have been more than doubled by
the money that it's leveraged.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
5690
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1474, by Senator Maltese, Senate Print 4188,
an act to amend the Administrative Code of the
City of New York.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is
a home rule message at the desk.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Explanation.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: An
explanation, Senator Maltese, has been
requested by the Acting Minority Leader.
SENATOR MALTESE: Mr. President,
this is a bill that would amend the
Administrative Code of the City of New York in
relation to the establishment of a 25-year
retirement program for members of the New York
City Employees Retirement System employed as
5691
fire-alarm dispatchers. The terminology
"fire-alarm dispatchers" is specifically
spelled out in the bill, indicating the
personnel that would be covered by the
provisions of this bill.
At the present time, I am advised
that there are 172 members that would be
covered by this plan. The plan would be
entirely contributory, entirely covered by the
members themselves.
The fire-alarm dispatchers are men
and women who are subject to a great deal of
stress. Their normal work day is a 12-hour
shift. In many cases, because of their small
numbers and fact that the work is so arduous,
stressful and demanding, many times they work
over their shifts.
Unlike their colleagues at 911, who
are largely -- largely are able to make use of
computers and many of the decisions are
triggered by computer programs that are built
into the system, fire-alarm dispatchers,
during times of high call volume, must make
decisions about safe deployment and relocation
of fire units throughout New York City so that
5692
no neighborhood will be lacking in fire
department coverage. At times they divert
different equipment to the areas that the
calls are made in connection with.
The -- naturally, since the job is
so stressful and since it goes over all types
of shifts, the -- as a result, the members are
subject to a great many infirmities and
disabilities that are accentuated by any
stressful job.
It's a provision that would cover
them for this -- the 25-year retirement.
The -- it would opt in after a hundred -- they
would have 180 days to opt in, and after that
time they wouldn't be able to opt in. And in
addition, they would not be able to transfer
from any other position that wasn't in a
comparable line.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Dollinger.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Thank you,
Mr. President. Will Senator Maltese just
yield to a couple of quick questions?
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Maltese, do you yield for a question?
5693
SENATOR MALTESE: Sure.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Through you,
Mr. President.
Will this plan affect current
employees? You talked about the opting-in
provision after 180 days. Will that apply to
people just at the start of employment or at
any point in their 25-year career? In other
words, will this affect current employees?
SENATOR MALTESE: Mr. President,
through you.
It will affect all current
employees, the 173 personnel presently on.
Those employees will have the 180 days to opt
in. As far as new employees, it will also
give them the 180 days after their employment
to opt in.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Through you,
Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Maltese, do you continue to yield?
SENATOR MALTESE: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: If an
5694
employee had twenty years in and wanted to
elect this plan and only had five years to
build up the credits, they would make the
exclusive contribution to build up enough
credits to fund their pension after 25 years'
retirement regardless of age; is that correct?
SENATOR MALTESE: Mr. President,
yes, that is actuarially sound, I'm told.
They would have that option even if they had
the twenty years in, to be able to opt into
the program for 180 days.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Final
question, Mr. President, through you.
What is the current plan that
they're in? Is it a standard twenty-year
partial with age requirement or -
SENATOR MALTESE: Presently
they're in a twenty-year retirement plan. The
present plan is funded by a 3 percent
contribution. This would add an additional
6 percent contribution. They would then be
giving 9 percent of their pay to pay for not
only this program but their other life
insurance and pension plan.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Through you,
5695
Mr. President, one question that arose in
that, if Senator Maltese will continue to
yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Maltese, do you continue to yield?
SENATOR MALTESE: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: The entire
9 percent would be paid for by the employee,
the 3 percent normal contribution plus the
6 percent on top of that?
SENATOR MALTESE: It would be 9
percent, which would include the 3 percent
they're paying now, the additional 6 percent
which would fund this plan.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: And again,
through you, Mr. President, the employer
continues to make the 3 percent contribution
or to make no contribution?
SENATOR MALTESE: My
understanding is that the 3 percent presently
pays their retirement and pension program, and
that the 6 percent would then cover only this.
So it would be 6 plus 3, which would be
5696
9 percent.
And then also, just as an added
fact, they would not be able to retire -
there is, in a way, an age provision, because
they wouldn't be able to retire until age 55,
currently.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Well, is
this -
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Dollinger, you're asking Senator Maltese to
yield, or was that sufficient?
SENATOR DOLLINGER: I'd ask him
to yield, Mr. President, but I'll yield just
for an answer, because he knows what the
question is.
SENATOR MALTESE: Well, I'm
sorry, Senator Dollinger, you lost me in
there.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Well, through
you, Mr. President, is this a 55-age-plan
retirement, or -
SENATOR MALTESE: No.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: I thought it
was 25 years -
SENATOR MALTESE: It is.
5697
Mr. President, presently they can retire at
55. This would have no age restriction. It
would be 25 years at any age.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: I'm done,
Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 14. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1477, by Senator Larkin, Senate Print 4489, an
act to amend the Racing, Pari-Mutuel Wagering
and Breeding Law.
SENATOR DUANE: Explanation.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Larkin, an explanation of Calendar Number 1477
has been requested by Senator Duane.
SENATOR LARKIN: Yes,
Mr. President.
5698
Senator Duane, this bill here is a
simple bill that over the last few years, many
owners of horses have assumed a dual
responsibility of jockey, of trainer, of
walker, because of the high cost of operating
horses at various tracks. The question come
up about some of them have been injured in
their capacity as a jockey. Under the
existing law, they weren't covered under 2 or
4.
So what we're trying to say is that
everybody who does that who's licensed to do
that as a 2 or a 4 would be adequately
covered. Because right now you could ride a
horse as an owner, but as the designated
jockey you could be injured, it could be
fatal, it could be incapacitating for life,
and there's no way you can have any benefits.
This is covering those that only
act in that capacity and are licensed to act
in that capacity.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
5699
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1481, by Senator Stafford, Senate Print 4680A,
an act to amend the Public Health Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Explanation,
Mr. President.
SENATOR BRUNO: Lay it aside
temporarily.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside temporarily.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1485, by Senator Nozzolio, Senate Print 5356,
an act to amend the Education Law.
SENATOR DUANE: Explanation,
please.
SENATOR BRUNO: Lay it aside
temporarily.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
5700
bill aside temporarily.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1489, by Senator Larkin, Senate Print 5492, an
act to amend the Racing, Pari-Mutuel Wagering
and Breeding Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Bruno.
SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President, I
believe that we ought to emphasize that bills
are being laid aside because members are not
here prepared to debate the bills.
The chances are good we're not
going to get back to this calendar, because we
are in a shut-down mode, the regular session
is supposed to end tonight, and it's our
intent to do the best that we can to end the
session today.
So when we run back through these,
if these bills are dead, they're dead. So if
anyone wants a bill to be debated, they better
be in the chamber and they ought to be here to
hear the discussions that are going on.
Thank you, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
5701
SENATOR DUANE: Explanation,
please.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Larkin, an explanation of Calendar Number 1489
has been requested by Senator Duane.
SENATOR LARKIN: Senator Duane,
this is another racing bill. Just for your
information -- I know you don't serve on our
committee -- but quite some time ago, the
chairman of the Racing Committee in the
Assembly and myself and our respective staffs
had a meeting with all the racing industry,
off-track betting and everything else, and one
of the items that come up about all of the
harness tracks was this specific bill here.
Because we're forcing tracks to race and lose
$80,000 or $90,000 a day when there's no way
for them to recoup that on their attendance or
in the betting. It's also ensured that we're
not getting the best quality of horses.
Specifically, in Senator Meier's
district, Senator Bonacic's district, and some
of the other places, Senator Spano's district,
the purses are getting so low since 1998 that
it's becoming a hardship on them.
5702
And this has been agreed upon by
all the harness tracks together, because it's
in their best benefit because they're going to
have to go out of business. If they go out of
business, they're going to have to lay a lot
of people off, Senator.
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1490, by Senator Larkin, Senate Print 5499A,
an act to amend the Racing, Pari-Mutuel
Wagering and Breeding Law.
SENATOR DUANE: Explanation.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Larkin, an explanation of Calendar 1490 has
been requested by Senator Duane.
5703
SENATOR LARKIN: Senator Duane,
this is another bill that was discussed at our
meeting and agreed on.
The revenues are based on a
percentage of the total handle at our racing
tracks and at the off-track betting. For
example, back prior to your coming here, in
1998 the fund earned approximately 70,000 or
more in awards than the fund is statutorily
allowed to have. And with the new emphasis on
improving the track, some of the legislation
that we've done in this house, we find that
we're doing it every year, trying to make
amends to the fund.
We've brought the fund up to a
level for the first time in ten years. We now
feel it's time to let this handle by itself.
And it's agreed upon by the tracks, the owners
and everybody else. And it does return the
money to where it's intended to go.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
5704
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1493, by the Assembly Committee on Rules,
Assembly Print 8130A, an act to amend the
Executive Law.
SENATOR DUANE: Explanation.
SENATOR BRUNO: Lay it aside for
the day.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay it
aside for the day.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1494, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 5601, an
act to amend the Social Services Law, the
Family Court Act, the Civil Practice Law and
rules.
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Explanation.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Saland, an explanation has been requested on
Calendar 1494 by Senator Montgomery.
SENATOR SALAND: Thank you, Mr.
President.
5705
Mr. President, this is Governor
Pataki's program bill, the Child Support
Enforcement Improvement Act of 1999. It would
do a number of things. Included among them,
it would provide computer access to workers'
comp records to get child support attachment
enforcement. It will increase penalties for
criminal nonsupport, including a new D felony
classification.
It would provide mandatory counsel
fees in an instance where a punitive father
disputes paternity after a 95 percent
likelihood finding on a DNA test. It would
provide civil penalties in addition for
evading, attempting to evade paternity
testing.
It would provide some clarification
of the recent Kennedy decision with respect to
the suspension of motor vehicle licenses where
there are arrearages.
And also it would provide for the
elimination of a grant where a parent is not
cooperating in either establishing paternity
or attempting to establish or modify or
enforcing a support order.
5706
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Montgomery.
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Mr.
President, if Senator Saland would answer a
couple of questions.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Saland, do you yield to Senator Montgomery?
SENATOR SALAND: Yes, Mr.
President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Senator
Saland, it is my understanding that the bill
also authorizes the license of a person who is
no longer under a current order to pay child
support, that their license could also be
revoked. Is that in the bill?
SENATOR SALAND: When I referred
earlier to the Kennedy decision, that decision
was one in which the court was concerned with
what constituted arrears. The law currently
requires some four months in arrears before
you can have the revocation of, among other
things, a motor vehicle license.
And, excuse me, I'm looking for the
5707
particular section of the bill as I respond to
you.
I see a reference to that on page
3, Section 4, and I believe you'll also find
reference to it over on page 5, in subsection
A. And one of the things that concerned the
court was exactly when those arrears ran.
And I believe among the concerns
was where there was a case that had been
pending for quite some time and the court
entered an order fixing the support obligation
and retroactively saying that you owe arrears
for a period of however many months and shall
pay so many dollars with respect to those
arrears, that that particular situation be
distinguished, where there was already
arrearage in excess of four months, from a
situation in which there was an old
outstanding order that someone had chosen to
ignore for a period of four or more months.
The effort in this bill is to try
and in effect address the issues that were
raised in the Kennedy case.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Montgomery.
5708
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: If you would
continue to yield, Senator Saland.
SENATOR SALAND: Yes, Mr.
President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Now, does
the bill remove the language that stated
essentially that the mother's refusal to sign
the acknowledgment would not be deemed as a
failure to cooperate in establishing
paternity? Is that language now removed from
this bill?
SENATOR SALAND: Can I ask you to
repeat that, please, Senator Montgomery?
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: There was
language in the bill prior that -- to the
effect that the mother's refusal to sign the
acknowledgment would not be deemed a failure
to cooperate in establishing the paternity for
the child. So if the mother refused to sign,
that would not be deemed failure to cooperate;
is that -
SENATOR SALAND: Senator
Montgomery, I'm looking at page 28 of the
5709
bill, and I'm not quite sure where the -
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: On page 21
of the bill, Senator Saland, line 18 through
20, that language is removed: "The mother's
refusal to sign the acknowledgment shall not
be deemed a failure to cooperate in
establishing paternity." That language is now
removed, is that the case?
SENATOR SALAND: When you say
removed, beginning at -
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: On page 21,
line -- I think it begins on line 18.
SENATOR SALAND: Oh, I'm sorry,
I'm looking at the wrong page. I take that
back.
Correct, that language has been
removed from the bill.
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: So in the
event that there is some doubt in the mother's
mind, does that mean that she is still going
to be sanctioned even though there's some
question, perhaps, in her mind?
SENATOR SALAND: I do not believe
that the section to which you refer relates to
public assistance benefits. It's primarily a
5710
section that deals with the gathering of
statistics for purposes of purely accumulation
of data. I do not believe that that section
in and of itself would be adequate in order to
deny any benefits.
I would call your attention,
however, to page 28, which is where I thought
you were going in your initial inquiry, to
Section 66 of the bill. That's the section
which deals with the elimination of benefits
for somebody who fails to cooperate.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Montgomery.
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Okay, if
the -- if Senator Saland would continue to
yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Saland?
SENATOR SALAND: Yes,
Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Does the
bill now include a sanction for the full
family?
5711
SENATOR SALAND: Yes, I thought I
had referred to that in my opening comments.
And that again -- I would again
call your attention to Section 66 of the bill.
It replaces the 25 percent of household grant
penalty for noncooperation.
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: So in other
words, in noncooperation cases, the entire -
all the benefits are cut off?
SENATOR SALAND: There are
exceptions, and those exceptions certainly
deal with things such as allegations of
domestic violence. The bill refers to the
requirement that there be good cause found by
the agency before somebody's benefits could be
denied.
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Senator
Saland -- Mr. President, if the Senator would
continue to yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Saland, do you continue to yield?
SENATOR SALAND: Yes,
Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
5712
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Does the
bill require that the counties now put in 50
percent of the child support passthrough, the
counties now -
SENATOR SALAND: The passthrough
has been increased from $50 to $100. There's
no change in whatever the existing law is. It
merely increases the amount from $50 to $100.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Montgomery.
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: All right.
Thank you, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 67. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Record
the negatives and announce the results.
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 58. Nays,
1. Senator Montgomery recorded in the
negative.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
5713
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1496, by Senator Spano, Senate Print 5674.
SENATOR SKELOS: Lay it aside
temporarily.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside temporarily.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1497, by Senator Seward, Senate Print 5699A,
an act to amend the General Municipal Law.
SENATOR DUANE: Explanation,
please.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Seward, an explanation of Calendar Number 1497
has been requested.
SENATOR SEWARD: Yes,
Mr. President. This bill creates a new set of
economic criteria for the eligibility as an
economic development zone which is consistent
with the original law's rationale that these
zones should be placed in an area that must be
characterized by pervasive poverty, high
unemployment, and general economic distress to
be eligible for the designation.
The additional criteria under this
5714
bill would include really five criteria, an
unemployment rate equal to or higher than the
state's rate, a rate of poverty for
individuals at least 20 percent, number of
households receiving public assistance is
15 percent -
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Seward. Senator Seward, excuse me just a
minute.
Senator Duane, I don't -- could you
hear that?
SENATOR DUANE: Yeah, but I'm
focusing very sharply. Thank you.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: If we
could have members take the conversation out
of the chamber. Recognize that for each
minute you slow us down, it's going to extend
the session another minute.
Excuse me again for the
interruption, Senator Seward. I think Senator
Duane should be able to hear you now.
SENATOR SEWARD: Thank you,
Mr. President.
As I was stating, this bill adds
additional criteria for additional economic
5715
development zones to be created in the state.
And the criteria would include that the
unemployment rate would have to be higher than
the state rate, the rate of poverty for
individuals in the zone would have to be at
least 20 percent at the poverty rate, the
number of households receiving public
assistance would have to be at 15 percent or
more, that the county is considered a
nonmetropolitan area, and the fifth one would
be that no other economic development zone
would be located in that county.
But the bill creates six additional
zones, three of which would have to meet these
additional criteria. The other three would
continue to have to meet the existing criteria
that are already in the law. This is designed
to have new zones to be placed in areas that
for whatever reason have not been successful
in obtaining the EDZ designation in the past
but are obviously in great need.
Now, the economic development zone
program, in my estimation, and I'm sure
everyone here would agree, has been highly
successful in helping to spur economic
5716
development in this state. And this
legislation would help extend the benefits to
even more areas of our state, and I think that
would be a very positive thing for the state
to proceed on.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you. If
the sponsor would just yield to a couple of
questions.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Seward, do you yield to a question?
SENATOR SEWARD: Certainly.
SENATOR WALDON: The Senator
yields.
SENATOR DUANE: I just want to
clarify. So three would be in counties that
presently don't have economic development
zones now, and three could go into counties
that do have them and then we'll have
additional ones; is that correct?
SENATOR SEWARD: That's basically
it. Three of the additional six zones created
under this legislation would have to meet
those additional criteria that I mentioned.
5717
The other three could go anywhere in the state
as long as they met the criteria that are
already in the law.
SENATOR DUANE: Through you,
another question, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Seward, do you continue to yield?
SENATOR SEWARD: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR DUANE: The sponsor
indicated that it's possible that an area that
had trouble putting together, I guess, a board
or whatever, the public mass to create such a
an economic development zone, would now
perhaps be more able to do that. But I'm
wondering if -- there's nothing in the law
that would strengthen a board or to provide
assistance to make a board that could really
do the job. And I'm just wondering why that
isn't part of this as well.
In other words, if they couldn't do
it before, what is it in here that would make
it possible for them to put together an
economic development zone that could work?
5718
SENATOR SEWARD: Well,
Mr. President, the -- I think you are -- that
Senator Duane is asking about something that
is certainly not covered under the bill in
terms of a community's ability to come up with
a successful application.
I think that how this bill would
help would be adding additional zones. In the
past, we have -- I think the original bill,
there were 40. And just a couple of years
ago, I think we added another 12. And this
would continue the trend of adding more zones
to be created in the state. And that alone,
in my estimation, does give more communities
of our state an opportunity to submit
successful applications, just from increasing
the number of zones that are available.
SENATOR DUANE: Through you,
Mr. President, a final question.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Seward, do you continue to yield?
SENATOR SEWARD: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR DUANE: My concern has to
5719
do, then -- it sounds as if we're lowering the
bar, or raising the bar -- anyway, making it
easier to create a zone, but that that may not
improve the economic climate. Are we making
it easier to create a zone for places where
they haven't been able to get it together to
put together a zone in the past?
SENATOR SEWARD: Well,
Mr. President, I wouldn't describe it as
lowering the bar, so to speak, on this,
because we're talking about -- in terms of
additional criteria, we're talking about
communities that have a rate of poverty of
20 percent, 15 percent on public assistance,
and unemployment rates that are higher than
the state average. And so these are
communities that obviously are in need of
economic stimulation, and that's what we hope
to accomplish under the bill.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
5720
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
please call up Calendar Number 1481, by
Senator Stafford.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1481, by Senator Stafford, Senate Print 4680A,
an act to amend the Public Health Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation,
please.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Stafford, an explanation of Calendar Number
1481 has been requested by Senator Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Actually,
Mr. President -
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Mr.
5721
President -
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: You wish
to modify that request?
SENATOR PATERSON: Yeah, I was
going to spare Senator Stafford from giving an
explanation if he'd just like me to go right
to my question.
SENATOR STAFFORD: Sure.
SENATOR PATERSON: Because I
actually find the bill to be quite pertinent.
But in the original print of the
bill, the Minority leaders had appointments,
and now, in what appears to be this final
draft, I don't see a Minority leader
appointment on this bill.
SENATOR STAFFORD: I think that
is true. I guess this goes along the lines of
a discussion we had the other day. There are
many areas -- commissions, committees -
responsibilities where I think all of us would
like to be involved. I know when I first got
here, I wanted to be in everything, and I
found that that really wasn't possible.
I think we have to be careful about
commissions being unwieldy. I think we can
5722
overdo it with numbers. I think this is a
good bipartisan approach. It also has
business leaders -- not leaders, it has
business individuals, it has people in the
medical profession. And I think we try to do
our best to keep it efficient.
I really wish everybody could be
involved. Sparta didn't do too well. Athens,
that was a problem. I guess they were pure
democracies. I'm for them. I want to be in
them, and I want to be the president. But
actually -- theoretically. Theoretically.
But on a serious note, efficiency,
I think, really is what this boils down to.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
I think one of the reasons -- I agree with
Senator Stafford that everybody here would
like to be involved in as many activities as
they could be, and on all the committees and
commissions and the different types of groups
that we put together.
But one of the reasons that we
consolidate and we create leadership positions
5723
is to have the few represent the many and to
hopefully truncate the process and speed it
up. So to that end, we have five -- we have
four leaders in the Legislature, and when
meeting with the Governor, we have a fifth
leader. And it's just my opinion that we
don't want to ruin that process where
everybody is pretty much represented through
their leader.
And for that reason, I strongly
suggest that the Minority leaders, both
Assemblyman Faso in the Assembly and Senator
Connor right here in the Senate, had been
included on that bill.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
SENATOR PATERSON: Party vote in
the negative.
SENATOR SKELOS: Affirmative.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Record
5724
the party line votes. Announce the results.
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 36. Nays,
23. Party vote.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
SENATOR GOODMAN: Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Goodman, why do you rise?
SENATOR GOODMAN: I rise to ask
if you would be good enough to record me in
the negative on two bills previously passed.
Calendar Number 1394, passed yesterday -- I
realize that my vote probably cannot be
included on that particular bill, but I would
like it noted that had I been in the chamber,
I would have voted in the negative on that
bill.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
record will so reflect, Senator Goodman.
SENATOR GOODMAN: I appreciate
that.
I'd also be grateful if you'd
record ne in the negative on 1462, passed
earlier today.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
5725
objection -
SENATOR GOODMAN: Thank you.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 1462,
Senator Goodman, has not passed at this point.
SENATOR GOODMAN: Thank you.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will continue to read.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
would you please call up 1485, by Senator
Nozzolio.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1485, by Senator Nozzolio, Senate Print 5356,
an act to amend the Education Law.
SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Nozzolio, an explanation has been requested.
SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Who requested
the explanation, Mr. President?
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Paterson, were you requesting the explanation
on Calendar Number 1485?
SENATOR PATERSON: Yes, I did,
Mr. President.
5726
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: That's
what I thought.
Senator Paterson, Senator Nozzolio,
has requested the explanation.
SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Thank you,
Mr. President. I would be glad to provide an
explanation to Senator Paterson.
This measure allows the Department
of Education to establish rules and
regulations to provide for the certification
of chiropractors as acupuncturists, provided
that those rules and regulations are not more
restrictive than the rules and regulations
provided for other professionals and entities
who seek licensure as acupuncturists.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
I'm having trouble -
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Did you
hear the explanation, number one, Senator
Paterson?
SENATOR PATERSON: No, I didn't,
but I was going to pretend that I did and go
right to my question.
5727
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Well, I
had a hard time hearing it also.
Please, will the members take their
conversations out of the chamber. Senator
Volker, Senator Marcellino.
Assemblywoman John, we welcome your
presence, but please, if you have to have a
conversation, take it out of the chamber.
Senator Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: If the Senator
would yield for a question.
SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Be glad to.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR PATERSON: Senator, what
are the prerequisites to becoming an
acupuncturist in the state? Not specifically,
but if someone is trained in a field that's
related, how long would it take them, let's
say, to create a situation where they would be
certified by the Department of Education to
become an acupuncturist?
SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Mr. President,
Senator Paterson's insightful, thorough
question could be answered directly by looking
5728
at Chapter 772 of the Laws of 1980, which
established the provisions for acupuncture
licensing, certification, training and
regulation within the State Education
Department.
SENATOR PATERSON: If the Senator
would yield for another question.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Nozzolio, do you yield to another question?
SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Mr. President,
I'd be happy to yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR PATERSON: Senator, I
think I can vote for this legislation, but I
do see the Medical Society has raised some
sort of an objection, and I got the objection
by telephone. I'm not exactly sure what it
is. Can you address the Medical Society's
concern?
SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Mr. President,
through you, that I have not seen the specific
objections of the Medical Society or any other
group regarding this legislation.
But I think the answer, the essence
5729
of your question, if I may, that the -- there
are nontraditional doctors that are certified
acupuncturists. You do not have to be an M.D.
in this state to be a certified acupuncturist.
That what we're saying with this provision is
that chiropractors, as a matter of course,
because of their training and background, if
they meet the other regulations required by
the State Education Department for certifying
this activity, that the profession of
chiropractor would not be excluded from
consideration for a license to be an
acupuncturist in New York State.
SENATOR WALDON: Senator
Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Senator
Nozzolio, I know we're supposed to address our
remarks through the Chair, but I'm sure
Mr. President won't mind if I direct this
solely to you, because I know you've wanted to
hear me say this for five years. But you have
convinced me.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
5730
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
on the first active list would you please call
up Calendar 1389, by Senator Maltese.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read Calendar Number 1389.
It's on the members' first calendar, regular
calendar for the day.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1389, by Senator Maltese, Senate Print 4372,
an act to amend the Administrative Code of the
City of New York.
SENATOR WALDON: There is a home
rule message at the desk.
The Secretary will read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 14. This
act shall take effect immediately.
5731
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
on the same active list would you please call
up Calendar Number 1456, by Senator Breslin.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1456, by Member of the Assembly Canestrari,
Assembly Print 5126, an act authorizing the
reopening of the twenty-year retirement plan.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is
a home rule message at the desk.
The Secretary will read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
5732
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
would you please, on Senate supplemental
calendar, would you please call up 1468, by
Senator Bonacic.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1468, by Senator Bonacic, Senate Print 3893,
an act to amend the Executive Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Paterson, why do you rise?
SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
I laid this bill aside for Senator Duane, who
seems to be out of the chamber for a moment.
Might we lay that aside for a couple of -
SENATOR SKELOS: We will lay it
aside temporarily, but the admonition that
Senator Bruno gave us in terms of people being
in the chamber ready to debate applies both to
the Majority and the Minority.
So I would urge all members, if
5733
they can, when their bills are going to be
called up or they wish to debate a bill, to
please be in the chamber.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
will be laid aside temporarily.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
if we could return to motions and resolutions
and adopt the Resolution Calendar in its
entirety.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: We will
return to the order of motions and
resolutions.
There is a Resolution Calendar on
the members' desk. The motion is to adopt the
Resolution Calendar. All those in favor
signify by saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Opposed,
nay.
(No response.)
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Resolution Calendar is adopted.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, I
5734
believe there's a privileged resolution at the
desk by Senator Balboni. If we could have the
title read and move for its immediate
adoption.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the title of the
privileged resolution by Senator Balboni.
THE SECRETARY: By Senator
Balboni, Legislative Resolution 2045, honoring
Barry M. Dennis, Esquire, upon the occasion of
his retirement after nearly two decades of
dedicated service to Nassau County, July 8,
1999.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
question is on the resolution. All those in
favor signify by saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Opposed,
nay.
(No response.)
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
resolution is adopted.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
if you could call up Senator Bonacic's bill at
5735
this time, Calendar Number 1468.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read Calendar Number 1468.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1468, by Senator Bonacic, Senate Print 3893,
an act to amend the Executive Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
if we could return to order of presentation of
petitions, I believe we have a treat from
Senator Dollinger.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Yes.
Mr. President, if we're on the presentation of
petitions section, I'm going to invoke a -- I
think it's safe to say this is a seldom-used
5736
device in this house. But it is my
understanding, Mr. President, that this gives
me the opportunity to present two petitions
which were gathered, one I believe exclusively
in my district, and the other throughout
western New York.
The first is a petition that
relates to a bill that was in the Assembly
last year which is also being considered this
year. And it generally relates to Bill A651F,
which is a bill with respect to trigger locks.
It relates to the unfortunate, tragic death of
a young boy named LaRalle Nesmith in my
district when he was inadvertently shot and
killed by another youngster. It has about
4600 signatures, Mr. President.
I would present them to you as the
custodian of the Senate and for, I believe,
filing with Mr. Boggess, as the Secretary,
which I assume is what happens.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: If you'd
like to walk those up and present them -
SENATOR DOLLINGER: I'd be glad
to, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: -- to the
5737
Secretary.
Senator Dollinger, I'm not the
custodian of the Senate. I think that's a
paid position, and I'm not getting paid.
(Laughter.)
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: If you'd
like to walk that up. And you have a second
petition?
SENATOR DOLLINGER: I do. I'll
pass these to counsel.
The second petition, Mr. President,
contains about 14,000 signatures, largely from
western New York, and relates to a bill that I
have sponsored and a position with respect to
the funding of Ralph Wilson Stadium,
improvements to the stadium in exchange for
lifting the NFL blackout in western New York.
This also relates to a piece of legislation.
It is addressed to the members of the New York
State Legislature. And I offer this petition
at this time.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Thank
you, Senator Dollinger.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
5738
there is going to be a meeting of the Rules
Committee at 2:45. There's going to be a
conference of the Majority at 3:00 p.m. until
4:00 p.m., at which time we'll resume
business. But we're going to just stand at
ease now until at least 3 o'clock, to see if
any messages come up or whatever may happen
during this period of time so we can continue
with our business.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There
will be a meeting of the Rules Committee, a
meeting of the Rules Committee in the Majority
Conference Room at 2:45. A meeting of the
Rules Committee in the Majority Conference
Room, Room 332, at 2:45.
Session will stand at ease until
3:00, and at 3:00 there will be a meeting of
the Majority Conference in the Majority
Conference Room.
The Senate stands at ease.
(Whereupon, the Senate stood at
ease at 2:35 p.m.)
(Whereupon, the Senate reconvened
at 3:03 p.m.)
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President.
5739
ACTING PRESIDENT NOZZOLIO:
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
would you please recognize Senator Paterson.
ACTING PRESIDENT NOZZOLIO: Sena
tor Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
good to see you. There will be a 3:30
conference -- there will be a conference of
the Minority in the Minority Leader's
Conference Room, 314, at 3:30 sharp. 3:30
sharp.
ACTING PRESIDENT NOZZOLIO:
Minority conference, 3:30 sharp, in Room 314.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
just a reminder that the Majority will be
conferencing now in the Majority Conference
Room, and that we will reconvene at 4:00 p.m.
(Whereupon, the Senate stood at
ease at 3:04 p.m.)
(Whereupon, the Senate reconvened
at 4:30 p.m.)
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Senate will come to order. I ask the members
5740
to find their places, staff to find their
places.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
if we could return to reports of standing
committees, I believe there's a report of the
Rules Committee at the desk. I ask that it be
read at this time.
SENATOR WALDON: We'll return to
the order of reports of standing committees.
There is a report of the Rules Committee at
the desk.
I direct the Secretary to read.
THE SECRETARY: Senator Bruno,
from the Committee on Rules, reports the
following bills:
Senate Print 5752, by the Senate
Committee on Rules, an act to amend the
Insurance Law;
5757, by Senator Seward, an act to
authorize the County of Cortland;
5763, by Senator Trunzo, an act to
amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law;
5811A, by Senator Goodman, an act
to amend the Real Property Tax Law;
5741
5823, by Senator Nozzolio, an act
to amend the Civil Practice Law and Rules;
5831, by Senator Volker, an act to
amend the Criminal Procedure Law;
5853, by Senator Meier, an act to
amend the Social Services Law;
5871, by Senator Saland, an act to
amend Chapter 81 of the Laws of 1995;
5872, by Senator Saland, an act to
amend Chapter 706 of the Laws of 1996;
5874, by Senator Bruno, an act to
amend the Highway Law;
5876A, by the Senate Committee on
Rules, an act to amend Chapter 41 of the Laws
of 1997;
5894, by Senator Marcellino, an act
to amend the Environmental Conservation Law;
5897, by Senator Velella, an act to
amend the Education Law;
5910, by Senator LaValle, an act to
amend the Education Law;
5941, by the Senate Committee on
Rules, an act to amend Chapter 491 of the Laws
of 1995;
5949, by Senator Farley, an act to
5742
amend the Public Authorities Law;
5952, by Senator Fuschillo, an act
in relation to authorizing;
5955, by the Senate Committee on
Rules, an act to amend the Local Finance Law;
5965, by the Senate Committee on
Rules, an act providing for the election;
5806, by Senator Farley, an act to
amend the Public Authorities Law;
5738, by the Senate Committee on
Rules, an act to amend the Tax Law;
5739, by the Senate Committee on
Rules, an act to amend the Tax Law;
5795A, by Senator Morahan, an act
in relation to authorizing;
5796, by Senator Morahan, an act in
relation to authorizing;
And 5827, by Senator Breslin, an
act authorizing the Commissioner of Education.
All bills ordered direct to third
reading.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Move to accept
the report.
5743
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
motion is to accept the report of the Rules
Committee. All those in favor signify by
saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Opposed,
nay.
(No response.)
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The Rules
report is accepted. The bills are ordered
directly to third reading.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
on the first active list, could we take up
Calendar 1350, by Senator Meier.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1350, by Senator Meier, Senate Print 5776, an
act to amend the Tax Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Secretary
will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
5744
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, I
believe there's some housekeeping at the desk.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Return to
motions and resolutions.
Senator Farley.
SENATOR FARLEY: Thank you,
Mr. President. On behalf of Senator Balboni,
on page 19 I offer the following amendments to
Senate Print 1530 -- I'm sorry, to Calendar
Number 695, Senate Print 1530, and I ask that
that bill retain its place.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
amendments are received, and the bill will
retain its place on the Third Reading
Calendar.
SENATOR FARLEY: On behalf of
Senator Hannon, Mr. President, on page 29 I
offer the following amendments to Calendar
957, Senate Print 4870, and I ask that that
5745
bill retain its place on the Third Reading
Calendar.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
amendments to Calendar Number 957 are received
and adopted, and bill will retain its place on
the Third Reading Calendar.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
if we could go to the first supplemental
calendar and call up Calendar Number 1473.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1473, by Senator Volker, Senate Print 4135A,
an act to amend the Civil Practice Law and
Rules and the Judiciary Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Is there a
message at the desk?
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is.
SENATOR SKELOS: Move to accept.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
motion is to accept the message of necessity
on Calendar Number 1473. All those in favor
5746
signify by saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Opposed,
nay.
(No response.)
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
message is accepted. The bill is before the
house.
The Secretary will read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 10. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
on the same calendar, if we could call up
Senator Stafford's bill, Calendar Number 1492.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
5747
1492, by Senator Stafford, Senate Print 5586A,
an act relating to constituting Chapter 57A of
the Consolidated Laws.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Is there a
message of necessity at the desk?
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is.
SENATOR SKELOS: Move to accept.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
motion is to accept the message of necessity
on Calendar 1492. All those in favor signify
by saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Opposed,
nay.
(No response.)
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
message is accepted. The bill is before the
house.
The Secretary will read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 11. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
5748
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
on this same calendar, Calendar Number 1496,
Senator Spano's bill, if we could lay it aside
for the day.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read.
Lay it aside for the day?
SENATOR SKELOS: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
will be laid aside for the day.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: If we could take
up Supplemental Calendar 56B,
noncontroversial.
SENATOR WALDON: The Secretary
5749
will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1508, by the Senate Committee on Rules, Senate
Print 5752, an act to amend the Insurance Law,
in relation to salaries.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1509, by Senator Seward, Senate Print 5757, an
act to authorize the County of Cortland to
transfer.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There's a
home rule message at the desk.
The Secretary will read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
5750
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1510, by Senator Trunzo, Senate Print 5763, an
act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in
relation to the sale of salvaged inflatable.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This
act shall take effect on the same date as a
chapter.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1511, by Senator Goodman, Senate Print
5811A -
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Lay it aside,
5751
please.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1513, by Senator Volker, Senate Print 5831, an
act to amend the Criminal Procedure Law, in
relation to expanding.
SENATOR WALDON: The Secretary
will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1514, by Senator Meier, Senate Print 5853, an
act to amend the Social Services Law -
SENATOR DUANE: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: In relation to
Calendar Number 1515, Senator Saland moves to
5752
discharge, from the Committee on Rules,
Assembly Bill Number 7699 and substitute it
for the identical Third Reading Calendar,
1515.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
The substitution is ordered.
Read the title.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1515, by Member of the Assembly Weinstein,
Assembly Print Number 7699, an act to amend
Chapter 81 of the Laws of 1995.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: In relation to
Calendar Number 1516, Senator Saland moves to
discharge, from the Committee on Rules,
5753
Assembly Bill Number 7698 and substitute it
for the identical Third Reading Calendar,
1516.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
substitution is ordered.
The Secretary will read the title.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1516, by Member of the Assembly Weinstein,
Assembly Print Number 7698, an act to amend
Chapter 706 of the Laws of 1996.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1517, by Senator Bruno, Senate Print 5874, an
act to amend the Highway Law, in relation to
certain bridges.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There's a
5754
home rule message at the desk.
The Secretary will read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1518, by the Senate Committee on Rules, Senate
Print Number 5876A, an act to amend Chapter 41
of the Laws of 1997.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect on the same date as a
chapter of the Laws of 1999.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
5755
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1519, by Senator Marcellino, Senate Print
5894, an act to amend the Environmental
Conservation Law, in relation to extending.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect October 1.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1520, by Senator Velella, Senate Print 5897,
an act to amend the Education Law -
SENATOR SKELOS: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1521, by Senator LaValle, Senate Print 5910,
an act to amend the Education Law, in relation
to the regulations.
5756
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect -
SENATOR DUANE: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: In relation to
Calendar Number 1522, Senator Bruno moves to
discharge, from the Committee on Rules,
Assembly Bill Number 8650 and substitute it
for the identical Third Reading Calendar,
1522.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
substitution is ordered.
Read the title.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1522, by the Assembly Committee on Rules,
Assembly Print Number 8650, an act to amend
Chapter 491 of the Laws of 1995.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
SENATOR DUANE: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside.
5757
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1523, by Senator Farley -
SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There's a
home rule message at the desk.
The bill will be laid aside.
SENATOR FARLEY: Who laid that
bill aside?
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Paterson laid that bill aside, Senator Farley.
You might want to talk to him.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1525, by Senator Fuschillo, Senate Print 5952,
an act in relation to authorizing the State
University of New York.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 10. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
5758
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1526, by the Senate Committee on Rules -
SENATOR SKELOS: Lay it aside
temporarily.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1528, by Senator Farley, Senate Print 5806, an
act to amend the Public Authorities Law, in
relation to amending the Schenectady
Metroplex.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 17. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1529, by the Senate Committee on Rules, Senate
Print Number 5738, an act to amend the Tax Law
and Chapter 535 of the Laws of 1987.
5759
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 6. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
the negative on Calendar Number 1529 are
Senators Dollinger, Gentile, Leibell, and
Saland. Ayes, 55. Nays, 4.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1530, by the Senate Committee on Rules, Senate
Print Number 5739 -
SENATOR SKELOS: Lay it aside
temporarily.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: In relation to
Calendar Number 1531, Senator Morahan moves to
discharge, from the Committee on Rules,
Assembly Bill Number 8585B and substitute it
for the identical Third Reading Calendar,
5760
1531.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
substitution is ordered.
The Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1531, by the Assembly Committee on Rules,
Assembly Print Number 8585B, an act in
relation to authorizing.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: In relation to
Calendar Number 1532, Senator Morahan moves to
discharge, from the Committee on Rules,
Assembly Bill Number 8586 and substitute it
for the identical Third Reading Calendar,
1532.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
5761
substitution is ordered.
The Secretary will read the title.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1532, by the Assembly Committee on Rules,
Assembly Print Number 8586, an act in relation
to authorizing the Town of Haverstraw.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is
a home rule message at the desk.
The Secretary will read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: In relation to
Calendar Number 1533, Senator Breslin moves to
discharge, from the Committee on Rules,
Assembly Bill Number 8692 and substitute it
for the identical Third Reading Calendar,
1533.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
5762
substitution is ordered.
The Secretary will read the title.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1533, by the Assembly Committee on Rules,
Assembly Print Number 8692, an act authorizing
the Commissioner of Education.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
Excuse me, read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
SENATOR WALDON: The bill is
passed.
Senator Paterson, why do you rise?
SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
I laid aside Calendar Number 1523, by Senator
Farley, and he's explained that bill to my
satisfaction. If a member of the Majority
would like to take it up, I'd like to take it
up and vote on it, speak in favor of it,
generally advocate it, whatever Senator Farley
5763
would like.
SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you,
Senator.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1523, by Senator Farley, Senate Print 5949, an
act to amend the Public Authorities Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is
a home rule message at the desk.
The Secretary will read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect on the same date.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Paterson, to explain his vote.
SENATOR PATERSON: It's a great
bill, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Announce
the results.
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
5764
is passed.
Senator Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: Never mind.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Dollinger, why do you rise?
SENATOR DOLLINGER: May I have
unanimous consent to be recorded in the
negative on Calendar Number 1350,
Mr. President?
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
objection -
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Thank you.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: -
hearing no objection, Senator Dollinger will
be recorded in the negative on Calendar
Number -- 1350?
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Yes,
Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: 1350.
Senator Gentile, why do you rise?
SENATOR GENTILE: I too ask for
unanimous consent to be recorded in the
negative on Calendar Number 1350.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Without
objection, hearing no objection, Senator
5765
Gentile will be recorded in the negative on
Calendar Number 1350.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
on the main calendar we have a supplemental
active list. So if we could take up Calendar
Number 553.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
553, by Member of the Assembly Weprin,
Assembly Print Number 5937A, an act to amend
the Civil Practice Law and Rules.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Would you then
5766
call up Calendar Number 673 and 911.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read Calendar Number 673.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
673, by Member of the Assembly E. Sullivan,
Assembly Print Number 4735B, an act to amend
the Education Law, in relation to
streamlining.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect on the 60th day.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
The Secretary will read Calendar
Number 911.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
911, by Senator Stafford, Senate Print 4393,
an act to amend -
SENATOR DUANE: Explanation.
THE SECRETARY: -- the General
5767
Municipal Law, in relation to the provision of
ambulance services.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: There is
a home rule message at the desk.
Senator Stafford, an explanation of
Calendar Number 911 has been requested by
Senator Duane.
SENATOR STAFFORD: Thank you,
Mr. President.
We are most fortunate in our area
to have excellent ambulance units emergency -
providing emergency services. And also in
this county there's a very, very strong county
office that covers these responsibilities,
disaster preparedness. And of course we're a
bit cognizant of how important this is with
the tragedy we had -- let me see now. Time
passes so quickly. What was it, last year or
the year before last that we had the ice
storm? It was last year. Not this past year,
but a year ago this past year. There we are.
So, Mr. President, we have a home
rule request.
And we have really seen the county
organization, the county office strengthen.
5768
As you probably know, we were very
unfortunate, in some people's eyes, to have
the Plattsburgh Air Force Base close. That
was a very, very tough blow. On the other
hand, that was a facility that the Emergency
Services Disaster Preparedness Office was able
to take over. That although it was so
unfortunate that we did lose the air base, we
were able to have this facility turned over to
the county, and the county has now taken it
over.
So at the present time,
municipalities have the option now to have
these contracts and not fire districts. And
this is actually a fire district taking this
over, the county fire district.
And it's a bit different in our
county, as I say, because of the new -- really
the office that, as I say, has been
strengthened. We have a gentleman there who
did a tremendous job during the disaster, and
he's really building what we think is going to
be a model for other areas.
And therefore, the home rule
request came in, and we think it's just very,
5769
very good for this county to be able to
contract with these various fire districts
that will be able to provide fire services and
ambulance service.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Senator
Duane, are you standing?
SENATOR DUANE: No, I'm actually
looking at something. The explanation -
SENATOR STAFFORD: As has been
pointed out, and this is very understandable,
although up in our area we do have a lot of
deer and bear -- we used to vote them all, but
that's changed, fortunately. I think it's
better that we have -- but we're relatively
highly populated. And frankly, the volunteer
service is getting to be a bit of a problem,
so these contracts are important.
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you.
Explanation satisfactory.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The
Secretary will read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: Call the
roll.
5770
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: The bill
is passed.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President, I
believe if we could return to motions and
resolutions, we have one motion.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL: We will
return to the order of motion and resolutions.
The Chair recognizes Senator
Seward.
SENATOR SEWARD: Yes,
Mr. President. On page -- well, I offer the
following amendments to Calendar Number 1527,
Senate Print Number 5965, and I ask that the
said bill retain its place on the Third
Reading Calendar.
ACTING PRESIDENT KUHL:
Amendments to Calendar Number 1527 received
and adopted. The bill will retain its place
on the Third Reading Calendar.
SENATOR SKELOS: Madam President.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: If we could call
5771
up Calendar 1530.
THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary
will read.
THE SECRETARY: In relation to
Calendar Number 1530, Senator Bruno moves to
discharge, from the Committee on Rules,
Assembly Bill Number 8698 and substitute it
for the identical Third Reading Calendar,
1530.
THE PRESIDENT: The substitution
is ordered.
The Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1530, by the Assembly Committee on Rules,
Assembly Print Number 8698, an act to amend
the Tax Law, in relation to extending.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 58. Nays,
1. Senator Dollinger recorded in the
negative.
5772
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
SENATOR SKELOS: Madam President.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: If you could
call up Calendar Number 1514, by Senator
Meier.
THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary
will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1514, by Senator Meier, Senate Print 5853, an
act to amend the Social Services Law, the
Penal Law, and the Tax Law.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
SENATOR DUANE: Explanation.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Meier, an
explanation has been requested by Senator
Duane.
SENATOR MEIER: Thank you, Madam
President.
THE PRESIDENT: You're welcome.
SENATOR MEIER: Madam President,
this bill basically recodifies, with some
minor changes, existing Social Services Law in
5773
New York State which makes the misuse of food
stamps a crime.
There are fundamentally two changes
that are made in this bill. The first was at
the express suggestion of the district
attorney's office of New York City,
Mr. Morgenthau's office, requesting that the
statute be moved from the Social Services Law
to the Penal Law. And the reasoning that they
had was that district attorneys and the
criminal courts are more familiar dealing with
the criminal law.
The second thing that the bill does
is it changes the classifications by dollar
amount of the amount of food stamps involved
as it relates to the severity of the
penalties. Fundamentally, the classification
system leaves intact the old system for
food-stamp recipients in terms of the dollar
amount involved. For example, below a
thousand dollars remains a misdemeanor, a
thousand dollars and up would remain an E
felony.
But the classifications are split
out for middle people; in other words, an
5774
unscrupulous merchant or someone who would
traffic with regard to food stamps on the
black market. And the classifications are
kicked up for them into a higher category at a
lower dollar amount. So there's a distinction
made between food-stamp recipients and those
who create the black market in food stamps,
which is deemed by the D.A. in the City of New
York to be a problem.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 6. This
act shall take effect on the first day of
November.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Madam President,
we're trying to work our way through, as you
know, the supplemental calendar. And looking
around, there are a number of members whose
bills are going to be coming up that have been
5775
laid aside to be debated. So again, I would
urge those who have bills to be debated and
those who wish to debate to please be in the
chamber so that we can proceed in an orderly
fashion.
Madam President.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: If we could call
up Calendar Number 1521, by Senator LaValle.
THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary
will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1521, by Senator LaValle, Senate Print 5910,
an act to amend the Education Law, in relation
to the regulations.
SENATOR DUANE: Explanation.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator LaValle,
an explanation has been requested by Senator
Duane.
SENATOR LAVALLE: This bill,
Madam President, is born out of situations and
a concern by the Dental Society -- that is in
support of this legislation -- that there have
been situations where dentists have used
anesthesia and may not have had the kind of
5776
necessary training that they should have.
And this bill simply says that a
dentist that is employing conscious sedation,
deep sedation, must have a certificate in
order to use this methodology in their dental
office.
And again, this bill emanates from
concerns that the dentists have, is supported
by the Dental Society. And myself and the
chairman of the Assembly Education -- Higher
Education Committee, Mr. Sullivan, are the
sponsors of this legislation.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect in 180 days.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Madam President,
would you please call up Calendar Number 1511,
by Senator Goodman.
5777
THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary
will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1511, by Senator Goodman, Senate Print 5811A,
an act to amend the Real Property Tax Law and
the Administrative Code of the City of New
York.
SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Paterson,
did you request an explanation?
SENATOR PATERSON: Yes, I did,
Madam President.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Goodman,
an explanation has been requested by Senator
Paterson.
SENATOR GOODMAN: Madam
President, this is an important and rather
complex piece of legislation which I'll try to
clarify to the best of my ability. It relates
to the question of the assessment of real
estate in the City of New York, and also to a
very important relief measure which is
appended to it, which would provide a tax
abatement and reduction with respect to co-ops
and condominiums in the City of New York.
5778
To take the last and most
refreshingly delightful part of this first, it
contemplates roughly a $160 million reduction
in co-op and condo taxation, to recognize the
fact that co-ops and condos are a class of
housing which have often been overtaxed. The
Mayor has done a rather remarkable job,
despite the elimination of the commuter tax,
in making this cut in the co-op and condo tax,
which is very important in keeping the
economic base of the city intact.
Now, with regard to the assessment
situation, let me indicate to you in
broad-brush terms how this works. There are
various ways of evaluating real estate, as I
think this house is generally aware. One
relates to the question of the last sale of a
home in a category which determines the
general and broad valuation. The second is to
take the profit and loss statement of that
housing and to use that for some sort of
projection of the potential future income of
that piece of property.
This bill essentially goes to the
use of the profit and loss information, which
5779
is believed by both the city and the Real
Estate Board of New York and a great number of
other experts to be a fairer method of
valuation of the real estate in New York City.
And I believe that in the
utilization of this, we come up with a variety
of numbers for the various classes of property
in New York. As is generally known, based on
past experience, I'm sure, the Class 1
properties in New York are the small
homeowners arrayed in the -- around the city.
Class 2 are the co-ops and condos. Classes 3
and 4 relate to commercial and utility
properties in the City of New York.
So what this seeks to do, once
again, is to place these in juxtaposition and
in proper proportion, and in doing so will
come up with the fairest possible approach to
the property taxes to be levied within the
city, based upon what's believed to be the
most appropriate assessment technique.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
Senator Connor.
SENATOR CONNOR: Thank you, Madam
5780
President.
THE PRESIDENT: You're welcome.
SENATOR CONNOR: Madam President,
I have an amendment at the desk. And I ask
that it be called up, waive its reading, and
that I explain.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator, we'll
review the amendment at this time. Thank you.
Senator, the reading will be -- and
explaining will be waived. The amendment is
ruled to be germane.
SENATOR CONNOR: Thank you, Madam
President. On the amendment.
As Senator Goodman explained, there
are two main features -- three, actually -- to
his bill. And one feature would eliminate the
comparability grounds, or, as they call it,
the sales grounds for challenging an
assessment in New York City and Nassau County.
We saw this bill standing alone
last year, and there were some 22 votes
against it, including four -- three or four
Republicans. The concern with that provision
of the bill was that it would result in some
inequities in assessments and would open the
5781
door -- and would actually make challenging an
assessment a very expensive and difficult
proposition, because people in effect would
have to use the equalization method. That
would certainly require lawyers in the
certiorari proceeding. Not a problem for
large commercial property holders, but there's
a category that would be covered by it of
cooperative and condominium large buildings
that have been somewhat successful. I know in
my own district, on Sunday I spoke with the
head of a co-op board where the co-op had had
their assessment lowered by $900,000. This
particular person said to me, "Senator, the
abatement provision" -- the other provision of
Senator Goodman's bill -- "continuing the
abatement provision puts a couple hundred
dollars in the pocket of our cooperators, but
they saved a lot more money, a lot more money
by the co-op having the ability to get that
assessment lowered by $900,000," using the
comparability sales analysis to challenge
their assessment.
My amendment would provide that the
existing method of challenging an assessment
5782
be continued -- as opposed to Senator
Goodman's bill, which would eliminate it -
and that the abatement provision be extended.
That's the amendment. It's very simple. It
would continue the abatement program for the
co-ops and condos, and it would -- the
amendment, as it says, would continue -- would
make sure that the comparability method of
challenging an assessment be continued and
applied to property in those classes in New
York City and Nassau County.
Madam President, I think this is
the best way to ensure that our cooperative
and condominium-owning residents receive fair
treatment, receive a full economic benefit of
abatements, as well as the ability to ensure
that their assessments are fair and equitable
because comparable properties have the same
level of assessment.
So I urge my amendment be adopted.
THE PRESIDENT: The question is
on the amendment. All those in favor signify
by saying aye.
SENATOR CONNOR: Party vote in
the affirmative.
5783
SENATOR SKELOS: Party vote in
the negative.
THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary
will call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 23. Nays,
36. Party vote.
THE PRESIDENT: The amendment is
defeated.
On the bill, the Secretary will
read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 13. This
act shall take -
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Madam
President, if Senator Goodman will yield for a
question.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Goodman,
do you yield to a question from Senator
Paterson?
SENATOR GOODMAN: Yes, I will,
Madam President.
SENATOR PATERSON: Senator
Goodman, if the sales of related properties
are not allowed in the proceeding, then that
5784
would leave only two other solutions for a
person seeking action in a certiorari
proceeding. One would be the equalization
method, which, as Senator Connor pointed out,
would incur great expense and would need a
specific type of legal advice not really
available to small tenants and commercial
property owners. The other is a procedure
that's not even really used in New York City.
And so my question to Senator
Goodman is, what is the relief for someone who
is disputing what would be an inequity, other
than the one that is basically being removed
for New York City in this bill?
SENATOR GOODMAN: Senator, let me
try to respond to this as lucidly as I can
with a stock market analogy.
One could argue, with some degree
of justification, that the price of a stock,
what a stock is worth, is represented by its
last sale in the market. On the other hand,
one could also argue that what a stock is
worth is reflected in its earning statement,
which can be projected in various ways to
determine the future prospects of the
5785
corporation.
Similarly, with regard to
buildings, it seems to me you could argue that
this building valuation question, the
so-called assessment of a piece of real
estate, could be argued based upon the
utilization of a recent sale or the last sale,
projecting that across the entire class, as
opposed to taking the profit and loss
statements of the buildings that are under
consideration for specific equalization and
evaluation and using that profit and loss as
the basis for that evaluation.
It's my judgment, and that of the
Real Estate Board of New York, which speaks
for realty owners generally, that the
preferable method is the one that I've
indicated. And that's why the city has sought
to shift over into that method. I happen
personally to agree with their thinking, and I
can tell you that the only people I know of
who are in favor of the retention of this at
the moment are the certiorari lawyers.
What is a certiorari lawyer? It's
a specialist whose sole income is earned from
5786
an attempt to downgrade the valuation put on a
building on behalf of a client, in order to
obtain a reduction of the real estate tax.
And there's a contingency fee charged by such
certiorari lawyers. They take a percentage of
the reduction for their fee.
Now, I think that the fact that the
certiorari lawyers are the only ones in
support of this gives us sort of a commonsense
measure of the fact this is not necessarily in
the best interests of real estate as a whole.
And I would respectfully suggest your premise
is not quite accurate when you say that an
individual is less likely to get an adjustment
in payment under this system that the city
proposes as opposed to the other.
Now, with regard to the splendid
piece of work that's been done by the Mayor
and his budget director and his tax officials
in making available the reduction and, in
effect, the subsidization of co-op and condo
taxes, I think this is a very significant
thing which should be emphasized. It's
generally known and has been for some time
that co-ops and condos get the short end of
5787
the stick in property taxation in New York
City. Basically, the co-ops and condos are in
such a condition that they are often
disadvantaged to the advantage of the one- and
two-family homeowners, for the simple reason
that, as Abraham Lincoln said, "I favor the
common man because there are so many more of
them." You favor the normal one- or
two-family homes because there are so many
more of them, and that's the basis on which
they've managed over the years to get a
disproportionate relief in terms of real
estate taxes.
So that I think these things
suggest generally the correctness of the
city's approach.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you,
Madam President. On the bill.
What's very disappointing is that
two basically unrelated issues are addressed
by this piece of legislation. They're tied
together. I'm certainly in favor of the first
part, the co-op/condo conversion part of the
legislation.
5788
The second part of the bill, I'd
like to turn Senator Goodman's attention to a
June 1998 decision in a case involving
Saratoga Racing, Incorporated, versus
Williams. While the court decision does not
in any way affect the issues that are being
discussed in this particular bill, nonetheless
there is dicta that basically states that the
best evidence that would establish
equalization would come really from an
assessment of property as it was disposed
between a buyer and a seller. Meaning exactly
what that bill eliminates would actually cure
the situation in its best form.
These were certainly the
expectations of those who would have been the
recipients, those state residents who would
have benefited from our 1997 Tax Reform Act
when it was first included, but it is now
denied in New York City.
While I see the overwhelming merits
in a lot of this legislation, I would just
like to caution all of us that these types of
situations where we put these issues together
make it very difficult for some of us to reach
5789
an informed decision.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 13. This
act shall take effect immediately.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Duane,
why do you rise?
SENATOR DUANE: I actually had
some questions as well, if the sponsor would
continue to yield.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Goodman,
will you yield to a question?
SENATOR GOODMAN: Will you
withdraw the roll call, Madam President?
THE PRESIDENT: Yes, Senator
Goodman.
SENATOR GOODMAN: As a point of
order, perhaps the Senator would prefer to
explain his vote. I'm not certain what your
desire is, but we normally do not interrupt a
roll call unless you wish to withdraw -
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Duane, do
you wish to withdraw the roll call in order to
5790
ask a question?
SENATOR DUANE: Yes, Madam
President.
SENATOR GOODMAN: I have no
objection, if that's the Senator's wish, Madam
President.
THE PRESIDENT: Without
objection, the roll call is withdrawn.
Senator Duane, you may proceed with
a question.
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you very
much, Madam President. And thank you to the
sponsor.
I was hoping that the sponsor could
comment on the consequences of removing the
ability to challenge an assessment during a
downturn in the real estate market in New York
City.
SENATOR GOODMAN: I don't know on
what you premise your question, but there's no
diminution of the right to challenge or to
bring a certiorari proceeding in this bill
that I'm aware of.
SENATOR DUANE: Madam President,
through you.
5791
More specifically, for a large
property owner to not be able to use
assessments of surrounding properties, whether
or not that would -- you believe that would be
a negative situation for a property owner in a
market downturn, in a real estate market
downturn.
SENATOR GOODMAN: I think,
Senator, your question reveals that I may have
not have been sufficiently explicit in my
explanation. I tried to make it clear to you
that what we're dealing with here is a
last-sale concept versus a
profit-and-loss-statement concept in the
valuation. This is what is known as the
assessment. And your question does not, I
think, reveal your awareness of the
distinction that I have just made.
The city's approach to this will
remove -- will alter the use of the last sale
as the principal criterion and substitute
therefore the use of the profit and loss
statement, which goes to the question of the
profitability of a given building, not just at
this moment but in the future as well.
5792
SENATOR DUANE: Through you,
Madam President.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Goodman,
do you continue to yield?
SENATOR GOODMAN: Yes, I will.
THE PRESIDENT: Go ahead, Senator
Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: As I understand
it, presently, though it would seem at first
blush that while the market is doing -- the
real estate market is doing well -- which
thankfully, thanks to our hard work, it is,
particularly in Manhattan -- that it would
seem that that would in fact increase revenues
for the City of New York, because the
assessments of surrounding properties would be
going up. So logic would dictate that in fact
that would mean more revenue for the city.
However, what ends up happening,
since you are taxed at a percentage of the
assessment -- of which it's far too
complicated to really go through how that
percentage is arrived at, but if you use that
benchmark of surrounding properties, in fact
properties end up paying a less high
5793
percentage towards that assessment, which
leads properties surrounding it to say, Me
too, me too, we also should be paying a less
percent.
Is that not your reading of what
happens under the system where you can use the
surrounding properties?
SENATOR GOODMAN: No, I think
there's a misperception here. What happens in
a rising market, obviously the last sale
criterion is one which is going to rise as
sales prices increase the property.
In a rising market, by the same
token, there is the likelihood that there are
increased rentals, which in turn generate
richer profits to the building, and those
profits are reflected in the profit and loss
statements of the building, and they in turn
reflect a higher value. So in both instances,
the fluctuations in the market are reflected
in the assessment.
SENATOR DUANE: Through you,
Madam President.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: Perhaps, then,
5794
I'm not quite understanding what in reality
will be happening.
Even -- from what you're saying, it
would lead me to believe that even more
properties would dispute their assessment with
the argument that they believe that they
should be paying a lower percentage of their
assessment, as do buildings which have already
gone through that process. And therefore, the
city could potentially lose revenue that way.
SENATOR GOODMAN: What is your
question, Senator?
SENATOR DUANE: Well, that -- my
question is, is that we are -- it seems to me
that -
SENATOR GOODMAN: Your question
is who invented this nutsy set of ground
rules, is that a fair -
SENATOR DUANE: That's an
excellent question.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Duane, do
you have a question? You are authorized to
ask a question, sir.
SENATOR DUANE: Madam President,
though, I'm going to refuse to yield to my
5795
colleague's question on that, because it's too
complicated. But -- but my sort of more -
and I don't know who invented it.
But I guess the question I wanted
to ask is, are we not in a conundrum having to
do with -- a conundrum having to do with
balancing the needs of the city being able to
count on a consistent revenue stream versus
the ability of property owners to have a
broader range of options when it comes to
assessing -- to being assessed for property
taxes?
SENATOR GOODMAN: May I attempt
to penetrate the complexities of this with a
statement that I think you will agree too?
PIn response to your question, you
and I share a concern for the well-being of
tenants and the owners of co-ops and condos,
I'm sure. What this does, as a totality of
the piece of legislation, is to grant a
special preferment to the owners of co-ops and
condos by reason of a $160 million tax
subsidization which the city is willing to
provide, even though it's under increased
budgetary pressure due to the revocation of
5796
the commuter tax.
Frankly, when that tax was
repealed, I was greatly concerned that it
would crowd out this benefit to co-ops and
condo owners, both of whom populate our
districts in larger than normal proportions
relative to the rest of the city.
And I can only say to you that this
is a good deal for them, and that the way this
bill balances out because of that, the
disadvantages they unfortunately suffer in
terms of their shares versus Classes 1 and 3
and 4, are not -- are more than canceled out
and overweighted by the benefit in the tax
reduction which they enjoy as owners of co-ops
and condos.
SENATOR DUANE: Through you,
Madam President, if the sponsor will continue
to yield.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Goodman,
do you continue to yield?
SENATOR GOODMAN: It's always a
pleasure to have a late-afternoon bit of
exercise at your discretion, Senator. Of
course I will yield.
5797
THE PRESIDENT: Assuming that is
a yield, Senator Duane, you may proceed with a
question.
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you very
much. And I need to preface this by saying my
seven years on the New York City Council did
not nearly prepare me for the complexities of
the issues of co-op and condo taxation and the
different class shares.
But that said, I think that the
Senator and I share the concern of equalizing
the tax burden on Class 1 and Class 2
properties. And how it is that we arrive at
what is the best way to do that, keeping in
mind the importance of maintaining a steady
stream of revenue to the City of New York -- I
think I will forgo the question I was going to
pose and instead make this be the -- my
statement on the bill and indicate that though
it's a bit of a tough call, that I will be
voting yes on this.
Thank you, Madam President.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Madam
President. If Senator Goodman would yield for
5798
one last question.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator, do you
yield?
SENATOR GOODMAN: Yes, Senator,
with pleasure.
THE PRESIDENT: Thank you,
Senator Goodman.
Go ahead, Senator Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Senator, I
know we may have gone over this before, but I
just want to ask one more time. If this
method of value, if this tax sales method is
so bad, then why aren't we doing it statewide?
Why are we just removing New York City and
Nassau County from the process and leaving the
rest of the state under the protections that
existed from our 1997 tax act?
SENATOR GOODMAN: Senator, I
didn't suggest that this method was so bad.
What I think you must understand is that in
the way that the city's real estate taxation
scheme works, you have these four classes of
real estate, each one of which is assessed in
accordance with a capped formula.
In this situation, it is quite
5799
manifest that over the years, the co-op and
condo and, indeed, the high-rise apartment
buildings which constitute Class 2 have
consistently taken a back seat, by virtue of
pure political pressure and understandable
weight of numbers in the determination of how
these formulas would be applied.
In plain language, the people in
the city council who reach these conclusions
are more responsive to the one- and two-family
homeowners because there are so many more of
them and at election time, needless to say,
they cast a great many more votes than the
poor folks who live in high-rise buildings who
are a small percentage of that total.
So that what has happened over the
years is that you have a disadvantaged
group -- mainly the one- and two-families,
whom I've been battling for a number of years,
since my population in my district obviously
is very much more heavily populated with that
class of renter and homeowner -- or apartment
dweller, I should say. And the result is that
what we have here is a very specific -- is the
Bagel King adding anything to your question?
5800
Marty, be my guest. Do you wish
to -
So why don't I just cut it off
there and say that I think you should, as one
who also represents apartment dwellers, be
very well pleased with this, and we shouldn't
expend too much energy looking a gift horse in
the mouth.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 13. This
act shall take effect immediately.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 57. Nays,
2. Senators Breslin and Dollinger recorded in
the negative.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Madam President,
would you please call up Calendar Number 1522.
THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary
will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
5801
1522, substituted earlier today by the
Assembly Committee on Rules, Assembly Print
Number 8650, an act to amend Chapter 491 of
the Laws of 1995.
SENATOR DUANE: Explanation.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Skelos,
Senator Duane has asked for an explanation.
Senator Spano, excuse me.
SENATOR SPANO: Thank you, Madam
President.
Chapter 491 of the Laws of 1995
that I sponsored allowed for the creation of
the establishment of an alternative dispute
resolution program to handle workers'
compensation claims. This statute is due to
expire December 31, 2000. What this bill does
is to extend that statute for five years,
through December 31, 2005.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: If the sponsor
would yield for a couple of questions.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Spano,
will you yield?
SENATOR SPANO: Yes.
THE PRESIDENT: Thank you,
5802
Senator.
Go ahead, Senator Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you.
Does this preclude a worker being
able to go to civil court to address their
concerns, their grievance?
SENATOR SPANO: This would not
take the right of any employee in the state
from exercising their right to go to court and
civil court, at all, Senator Duane. All this
would do is give the opportunity to opt into
the alternative dispute resolution to deal
with the claim of workers' compensation.
SENATOR DUANE: And one last
question, through you, Madam President.
That would be with the agreement of
both parties?
SENATOR SPANO: That would be
with the agreement of the union, subject to
the collective bargaining agreement that they
would negotiate.
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you, Madam
President.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
5803
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 59.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Madam President,
would you please call up Calendar Number 1295,
on the first active list, by Senator Marchi.
THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary
will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1295, by Senator Marchi, Senate Print 5589, an
act to amend the Education Law, in relation to
courses of instruction.
SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation.
THE PRESIDENT: Who requested the
explanation? Senator Paterson, did you
request the explanation, sir?
SENATOR PATERSON: Yes, I did,
Madam President.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Marchi,
an explanation has been requested by Senator
5804
Paterson.
SENATOR MARCHI: Since I share a
birthday with him, I will always honor that
request. But it may be the end of the happy
birthday.
(Laughter.)
SENATOR MARCHI: I hope not.
Madam President, under Section 801
of the Education Law of the State of New York,
there is a provision that the Board of Regents
and the State Education Department provide for
the, quote, courses of instruction in
patriotism and citizenship in certain historic
documents. That's within quotation marks,
"courses of instruction in patriotism and
citizenship in certain historic documents."
And among those documents that are listed,
Madam President, in Section 801 are the
Declaration of Independence and the New York
State Constitution.
It provides also for the provision
by the Board of Regents of the State of New
York to provide the instructional guidance in
addressing those items that are part of our
state treasury of historical documents,
5805
seminal documents on the jurisprudence and
rights of the people of this state.
I refer now to the Declaration of
Independence, which is cited specifically.
I'm not -- this is not a proposal, these are
direct quotes from the Declaration of
Independence. As many of you know, the
Declaration of Independence, in New York State
Education Law, would specifically -- and I'm
recommending that it specifically include that
language in the declaration that reads "We
hold these truths to be self-evident; that all
men are created equal" -- and the words at
that time, in 1776, used it in its general
sense of all human beings are created equal -
"that they are endowed by their creator with
certain unalienable rights; that among these
are life, liberty, and the pursuit of
happiness."
This amendment to the bill would
say to take these words, which are taken from
the Declaration of Independence specifically,
and to highlight them and to grant the
instruction, which the Board of Regents then
held a responsibility for doing. The language
5806
of this bill would also mandate emphasis by
the teachers in the prescribed courses of
instruction on the phrases from the
Declaration of Independence which say
"appealing to the Supreme Judge of the
world" -- "Supreme Judge," meaning someone
that you have to answer to -- and "reliance on
the protection of Divine Providence."
We have in this implicitly a
theistic consideration in attributing to the
Creator the fact that we all enjoy, or should
enjoy, certain unalienable rights; among
these, life, liberty and the pursuit of
happiness.
In the preamble of the State
Constitution, which is also cited in Section
801 of the Education Law, the citation in the
preamble reads as follows: "We, the people of
the State of New York, grateful to Almighty
God." They didn't say the president or
anybody else, "to Almighty God." This is the
preamble to the Constitution of the State of
New York today. And tomorrow, unless it is
amended out. And no one has introduced a bill
to amend that out.
5807
"We, the people of the State of New
York, grateful to Almighty God for our
freedom, in order to secure its blessings, do
establish this Constitution." And that also
would be highlighted.
I made a request to the Board of
Regents and to the State Education Department
for just what guidance was provided to
instructional personnel, which they suggested
begin at the age of 8 and upward. And they
sent me a lot of material. Because in
considering the Constitution of the State of
New York, they also would describe the
agencies that form government -- the Senate,
the Assembly, the Governor, and the people who
have it operate -- and the relationships and
certain considerations that be -- that ought
to be examined.
At some point, Madam President, it
was also suggested that, in addition to that,
that there be added to it instruction on
subjects such as the Holocaust, slavery, and
the famine in Ireland. This is the famine in
the 1840s in Ireland.
Nowhere, nowhere in this
5808
instruction in the material that was provided
to the schools of this state is any reference
made to the Creator, to the Divine Judge of
the world, as the Declaration of Independence
cited. And it is suggested in this document,
in this bill that we do this.
I had many responses from around
the country, from many clergymen, from all
kinds of people, from citizens who felt -- on
an interdenominational basis, that were
supportive of this sentiment. I had a letter
just -- the most recent one is from the Most
Reverend Henry J. Mansell, the bishop of
Buffalo.
"Dear Senator Marchi: I write in
support of your bill requiring the
highlighting of the words "Creator" and
"Supreme Judge" in the Declaration of
Independence and in the New York State
Constitution, as required to be taught in New
York State school courses on patriotism.
"We approach the end of the century
that has seen the most rapid progress in
science and technology in history. It has
also been the most murderous and barbarous in
5809
history, with tens of millions of people
killed at the hands of Godless ideologies.
"In our own country, the clouds of
secularism and materialism hover dangerously
over us. We are in need of renewed
enlightenment as to our roots, expressed in
the fundamental documents of the country. It
is critically important as well that we
promote an acute awareness of our
accountability before God as Creator and
Supreme Judge.
"Once again, Senator Marchi, I am
deeply grateful for your sensitivity," and so
forth, some complimentary remarks that I
treasure. But all supportive of this feeling.
I didn't want to prescribe a
prayer. I didn't want to instruct that a
prayer be of a nondenominational nature or a
prayer that was nonsectarian. I was appealing
to the very provisions that are in this law,
801 of the Education Law, and to the seminal
documents that sustain this country.
I immediately had a Staten Islander
who objected, and he was the chairman of the
Atheists of America. He's entitled to express
5810
his views, and I certainly wouldn't deny him
that right. God does believe in him, however,
so I think things will work out in the final
analysis.
I pick up a coin, and I see "In God
we trust." We give the Pledge of Allegiance,
"under God," we say. Are these vacuous words?
Do they mean nothing at all? Is this all
make-believe? It has a specific impact.
And I engaged in numerous programs,
some of which will be televised in July and
August by various elements of media, radio and
television. And in virtually all cases, even
with critical analysis, they expressed a great
deal of interest.
In the state of New Jersey, the
assembly passed a bill that prescribes, among
other things, a measure -- this bill requires
principals and teachers of public schools of
conduct -- this is the Assembly of the State
of New Jersey, to conduct the following oral
recitation from the Declaration of
Independence before the opening of each school
day: "We hold these truths to be
self-evident; that all men are created equal;
5811
that they are endowed by their creator with
certain unalienable rights; that among these
are life, liberty, and the pursuit of
happiness; that to secure these rights,
governments are instituted among men, deriving
their just powers from the consent of the
governed." This bill takes effect
immediately.
I don't know what the final vote on
it was, but it was very heavily in favor. And
it came out of the standing committee
unanimously, unanimously, both parties. There
was no partisan division on it. I understand
that it is in progress in the senate and that
the governor expects to sign it. So it's not
an idea that, after taking on life, did not
make an impact and an appeal on others.
So I would suggest, Madam
President, that we give this serious
consideration. I'm not asking for a prayer.
I'm not asking for a moment of reflection.
I'm just asking for a look and consideration
at those seminal documents and those seminal
sentiments that sustain this nation.
And I submit that if we do these
5812
things, it will not be to the damage of this
country. It will not be to the damage or
detriment of the people of this state. And it
certainly should not offend anyone where the
sentiment of God as a spirit permeates
virtually every theistic portion of our
population, regardless of what their term
is -- "Allah," "God," whatever.
But this -- the fact that this
profession of faith in a Supreme Being and a
Supreme Judge, which means also an accounting,
is also -- constitutes as well a positive
step, takes a positive step in developing a
more wholesome attitude. And in the
context -- you know, we talk about values and
whose values -- mine, yours, or somebody
else's. But the fact that it -- the fact that
we acknowledge the existence of Almighty
God -- God bless America, and our
responsibilities under it -- certainly, I
think, will have a beneficial effect in this
country and in this state in particular, where
it applies.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Yes, Madam
5813
President.
THE PRESIDENT: Why do you rise?
SENATOR PATERSON: Well, I was
actually going to ask Senator Marchi to yield
for a question.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Marchi,
do you yield for a question?
SENATOR MARCHI: Yes, Senator.
THE PRESIDENT: Go ahead, Senator
Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Senator, there
are many times when we have passed legislation
to promote action for which law has already
sustained. And in this particular case, we
already command, through our social studies
syllabus, through our history requirements,
through our specific references to these same
seminal documents, that teachers teach these
particular documents.
But what we often do in law-making,
what we often try to accomplish is to focus
specific attention on a situation that needs a
certain redress. And I would imagine, from
the explanation, that that's what Senator
Marchi is trying to do today.
5814
My question is, is there something
that is not being taught, is there a fashion
in which these documents and certainly the
references therein, the spiritual references,
are not being taught that compels the Senator
to create an addendum to our existing law and
to focus us on teaching these specific
references?
Was that clear, Senator?
SENATOR MARCHI: Yes, the
question is clear, Senator.
And in fairness, I want to respond
that I'm not talking about whatever the
frailties of our own system is and how we
behold our fellow man. Meaning men and women,
to be politically correct.
Are we animals? Are we the highest
created level of animals? Or are we something
more? Why do we invoke God's blessing unless
there is something unique and special about
each and every individual? Why do we speak of
loving our neighbor? Because we are not
animals. We have physical beings, but we are
individuals with immortal souls, with a
spirit, a conscience, an awareness of right
5815
and wrong. The natural law, you don't have to
go back to Christians and Jews and Islamics or
anybody else, going back to -- going back to
our -- to the ancient Greeks. We are
something special, each and every one of us.
Each and every one of us. And we have these
responsibilities.
Are we aware of that? What I'm
saying here is are we -- is there something
that's failing? Yes. It would seem to me
that we are not reinforcing the respect that
we should have for each other and for our
fellow human beings. And because they are
special, they are God's children. They're not
just a higher order of animals.
So I don't like to see it steeped
in a secularism that has no place when we
equate it to the dignity that belongs to each
and every individual. Where does dignity come
from? It doesn't come from the fact that we
developed and we -- through a process of
evolution to a physical essence that now has
dignity.
What is dignity? How do you
definite dignity? Dignity is defined in terms
5816
of personality, of a person created in a
divine image, of a person having a supreme
responsibility. And we have that
responsibility. It's not the responsibility
that might makes right. We make an awful lot
of mistakes, and we try to help each other
correct them. But unless we come down to the
fundamentals of our existence and the views
with which we hold other individuals as
precious, very, very precious -- because they
are something special. Because they are
created in a divine image.
So I can't answer your question
adequately in the sense that is there a
specific failing. We are not reinforcing
that -- those very considerations that are
basic to a decent civilization.
Our response that was critiqued,
pro and con -- I'm not pro-Clinton. To the
contrary, perhaps, on many matters of policy.
But when the slaughter was taking place, many
people in the free world were offended. And
when we read of the atrocities that were being
committed, we were offended. Can we respond
to them all? No, I guess we can't. But we
5817
have to make a better effort.
But I think, basic to all that,
laws are not going to do it. They can help.
They can help. They're helpful guidance, and
they're the best that we can bestow. But it
has to come from what we conceive and what we
believe to be a human being. And that has no
reference to the condition of that human
being.
And that's why it's a very
difficult question. It's not an unfair
question, Senator, I'm not suggesting that at
all. But I'm looking for a way to strengthen
and reinforce and give more life. And I
believe that if we -- these things which we
say automatically -- otherwise, why have it in
our preamble? Might as well take it out. It
has no place. It plays no useful role. A
nice role, or a feel-good role, maybe, I don't
know.
But if this has substance, it does
play a role. And it should play a role in
every conscious moment of our lives, that we
are children of God. And in that which was
the pronunciation unanimously of the
5818
Declaration of Independence -- and they had
their faults, too -- we begin to see the
formation of a better view and a better
understanding.
And we had to go through a Civil
War. And that's why the Board of Regents
wanted slavery, the circumstances that
undergirded slavery included in some of the
companion instructional material that was to
be studied by generations of Americans.
But we go back to the centrality of
the dignity of the human being and the
importance of the seminal documents I think is
so overwhelming that it's almost a res ipsa
loquitur in terms of its desirability as a
matter of Board of Regents instructional
effort to give it a highlight in the society
in which we live in.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Madam
President, if Senator Marchi would yield for
another question.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Marchi,
do you yield?
SENATOR MARCHI: Yes.
5819
THE PRESIDENT: Go ahead, Senator
Paterson, with another question.
SENATOR PATERSON: Madam
President, in many ways what Senator Marchi is
trying to accomplish is in -- very much in the
same spirit as what our forefathers were
intending when they wrote the seminal
documents to which Senator Marchi refers.
That many of the founding fathers of this
country were deists, and they had a lot of
kind of spiritual beliefs that they
interpreted metaphysically.
Now, I understand your admonition
to us yesterday about public demonstrations.
And I won't engage in one. But if I were to
take out a dollar, which I couldn't -- neither
could any of my colleagues at this point in
the process. But if I were to do that,
apparently you can see on a dollar a point at
which you see what appears to be a garden, and
it's in front of a desert. It's part of a
picture on a $1 bill. And that was supposed
to represent the pilgrimage from the desert
into the garden of the New World. Which is,
of course, what we now know as America.
5820
That even the year of the
Declaration of Independence, 1776, if you took
those numbers and added them up, some of the
formulators took note that it added up to the
age 21, which was the age of majority, as was
interpreted through the Constitution.
So there was a lot of this type of
feeling and sentiment about fundamental rights
and fundamental humanistic law running through
our major documents.
Senator Marchi makes a point, and
I'd like to ask him -
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Meier.
SENATOR MEIER: Well, I was going
to ask if there was a question, since I
believe Senator Paterson asked for the floor
to ask one. But I understand he's getting
there, so I'll sit back down.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Paterson,
there is a question forthcoming?
SENATOR PATERSON: Yes, Madam
President, there is a question coming.
THE PRESIDENT: Forthcoming,
Senator.
SENATOR PATERSON: Forthcoming.
5821
THE PRESIDENT: Soon.
SENATOR PATERSON: In the future.
THE PRESIDENT: Thank you.
SENATOR PATERSON: The question
would be, to Senator Marchi -- unless Madam
President would like to answer the question -
with respect to the errors of history to which
Senator Marchi referred, we have a Declaration
of Independence, and he wants -- Senator
Marchi would like to turn our attention to the
specific reference of "all men are created
equal." And yet another one of the documents,
the United States Constitution, still to this
day contains a provision -- Article 4, Section
2, Clause 3 -- which is the provision that
allows for the recovery of runaway slaves.
So if we're going to be teaching
these documents, I would think that it would
be an enhancement to point out that that
article, which still exists in the
Constitution today, is completely antithetical
to what's represented in the Declaration of
Independence. And I wanted to know if Senator
Marchi thought that that should be part of the
expanded teaching that he's offering in this
5822
bill.
SENATOR MARCHI: Well, there were
a lot of -- that is perhaps one of the
smallest of what in my religion is called
venial sins today, of runaway slaves.
The crude bargaining of -- when it
came down to representation in the Congress of
the United States -- not in the House of -
not in the Senate, but in the House itself,
they said "We have to count all our people."
"Yeah, but you have slaves, and you're
counting them as whole people, and you treat
them as chattels." So they bargained it out.
So you were three-fourths of a person. Or
two-thirds. I forget what the formulation
was.
SENATOR PATERSON: Three-fifths.
SENATOR MARCHI: So -- well, I
had a friend of mine said, "I like Patrick
Henry's definition of freedom much better than
yours." I forget what I had taken, because I
have a reputation for being a fairly open sort
of a guy. I said, "Do you realize that
Patrick Henry was a slave owner?"
Jefferson sometimes has been
5823
belabored because he owned slaves. Washington
emancipated his slaves. But the real
Jefferson manifested himself in the Northwest
Ordinance, and he made sure that slavery was
not permitted in all those states that all the
way up to Minnesota were developed.
Are there failings today? Yes,
there are, Senator. There are. And where
there are, they don't measure up to the Albert
Schweitzers or the Mother Teresas or the
people who believe, believe, that there's a
long way to go. And we don't stop trying.
And we don't go up and say, well, we're nice
people and everybody else isn't. We try to be
nice, and we try to be better. And that's our
objective.
But we do that because we are
children of God. We know there's a right. We
know there's a wrong. We don't stand in
judgment, you're wrong or you're right.
Because we -- in those very same documents,
they mention that God is the lawgiver. And
that's why I hesitate ever to say, "Oh, you're
absolutely wrong," even morally. That has to
be decided Upstairs. Certainly not in our
5824
realm.
But in our own Constitution in this
state, Senator, we have the -- "We, the people
of the State of New York, grateful to Almighty
God for our freedom, in order to secure its
blessings, do establish this Constitution."
Now, no one is suggesting -- are
you suggesting that we take that out? I don't
think so. I don't think so. Because I
believe that in your heart of hearts, you
believe in that personal dignity, that, as the
Italians say, the "amore proprio," and they
bastardize it in Europe and they say "amour
propre," in French. Love of self, loving our
neighbor as ourselves.
These are important considerations.
And they're so basic to how we react to each
other. And I really don't -- I can't see any
adequate substitute, on the example that you
gave, that we still have that provision in the
Constitution.
We also have on the dollar, I
think, a little eye at the head of the
triangle. I'm not sure what that means. I
think it has some mysterious, mystic meaning.
5825
And maybe it would not, under a moralistic
jeweller's eye, stand close scrutiny. But in
any event, there it is.
But of course, that dollar bill
does say "In God we trust." Which perhaps
might have been suggested by someone who just
felt -- just wanted everybody to feel good
when they got the money.
But this is serious stuff. It's so
basic to our civilization. And so necessary,
I think, when it is felt acutely, as it
motivates us in trying to live up to the
mandate that's implicit in being children of
God.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Madam
President, I want to thank the Senator i
grazio, which in Italian means "the gracious
Senator," for his answers to my questions.
He's someone who I admire.
And on the bill, I just wanted to
point out that the article to which the
Senator referred, which for purposes of
population counted Africans brought to this
country as 3/5 of a man, was actually taken
5826
out of the Constitution. But the article that
provides for the recovery of runaway slaves is
still in the Constitution.
So if the Senator is asking me
would I like to take it out, yes, I would like
to take it out. Or at least -- not even as
much to take it out, because that would be in
some way referring to history in an
anachronistic way. And if we don't really
fully learn about history, we might inevitably
be condemned to repeat it.
But I think what's more important
is that some of the values that Senator Marchi
is promoting in this legislation, and some of
the spiritual messages that he would like us
to receive, I think would be more aptly
applied to some of the idiosyncratic
references in our past documents, which in
many ways were discriminatory on the basis of
race, religion, on the bases of age and gender
and sexual orientation, as opposed to the
values of just saying them for the purpose of
just eliciting what would be a spiritual
response.
And I was just saying that if we're
5827
going to be doing this, we might want to
actually apply it to situations where we might
demonstrate how they might have been done more
in compliance with the spiritual message that
the passages from these seminal documents
offer.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
Senator Dollinger.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Madam
President, will Senator Marchi yield to a
couple of questions, please?
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Marchi,
do you yield?
SENATOR MARCHI: Yes.
THE PRESIDENT: Go ahead, Senator
Dollinger.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Through you,
Madam President.
Senator Marchi, the section that
you quote in your bill from the Declaration of
Independence, are you familiar with the phrase
that immediately follows that declaration of
the inalienable rights of life, liberty, and
the pursuit of happiness? Do you know what
5828
the phrase is that follows that section?
SENATOR MARCHI: I would prefer
that you put it in full context so that I get
a sense of balance.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Okay, right.
What I'd like to do is just read you that
provision. You quote the provision about
holding truths self-evident, that among these
are life, liberty and the pursuit of
happiness. The next phrase, "that to secure
these rights, governments are instituted among
men, deriving their just powers from the
consent of the governed."
My question, through you, Madam
President, is isn't that the critical line in
the Declaration of Independence? That's the
critical line, that it's a declaration that
governments exist to preserve those rights,
that is the foundation for the notion that we
are declaring our independence from Great
Britain. From the point of view of patriotism
and civics, isn't that the great line in the
Declaration of Independence?
It's not what we believe, but that
governments are created by people to put those
5829
beliefs into action, with the consent of the
governed. Isn't that the critical notion in
the Declaration of Independence, even more
critical than the articulation of the rights?
SENATOR MARCHI: Madam President,
the -
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Marchi.
SENATOR MARCHI: Senator
Dollinger raises the question, and I believe
Senator Patrick Moynihan, who probably would
favor my bill, says that this is the consent
of the governed and this is the compact with
the people. But it's preceded by defining
those people: children of God. And that God
gave them rights that are unalienable. So
that as we elaborate and consent -- when we
trespass we trespass even by consent,
consensual processes. We are departing from
the wellspring that gave us our existence -
we are children of God. And what better to
say that instituted among -- among men, as you
put it, is this ability and this capacity to
create those institutions to -- for our
governance.
So a free people, mindful of the
5830
fact that there are rights that are not
alienable, you cannot take it away from them,
also have the responsibility for organizing
themselves and to function. That follows, of
course, with respect for the right of the
minority. It follows with so many of the
principles that you articulate so well when
you speak on these subjects.
But the basis, the basic stone that
the -- is our very essence as human beings.
It's not a compact among animals, it's a
compact among creatures of God. And we're
reminded that we have a Supreme Judge and that
we're accountable to that Creator.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Through you,
Mr. President. We went from Madam to Mr.
quickly. Excuse me, Mr. President.
Will Senator Marchi yield for just
other question? Then I'll address the bill.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Marchi, do you continue to yield?
SENATOR MARCHI: Yes. Yes,
Senator.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Do you know,
Senator Marchi, how the New York delegation to
5831
the Philadelphia convention voted on the
Declaration of Independence?
SENATOR MARCHI: Well, I wrote a
doctoral thesis on the -- and I read all of
the -- in tribute to the Fifth Avenue Library
and Columbia University and a few other
institutions where I could get original
documents. And I read newspaper articles in
secured facilities where they'd lock you in,
you know.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: I think this
is called a softball question. Do you know
how the New York delegation voted at the
Philadelphia convention on the Declaration of
Independence?
SENATOR MARCHI: No, I -- well,
go ahead and tell me. When you get to be my
age, sometimes your memory isn't as fresh -
SENATOR DOLLINGER: I can
appreciate that, Senator, and -
SENATOR MARCHI: -- and clear as
the crystal young man that you are.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: No, I -- I'm
simply reading, Senator Marchi, I'm not -- I
don't have any independent recollection.
5832
New York abstained in Philadelphia,
didn't vote on the Declaration of
Independence. The New York delegation was
instructed not to vote but simply to go back
to New York to report to the Legislature
before it voted. So New York actually
abstained in Philadelphia and didn't sign the
Declaration until it had been approved by the
remainder of the Congress.
SENATOR MARCHI: Well, if you
want to be historic -- if you want to be
contemporary, of course, the same thing
happens with all of us. Sometimes we're not
there when we should be. And that goes for
all of us.
Then the -- when the 14th, 15th and
16th Amendments were making their way, do you
know that we hesitated to adopt them? Finally
we adopted them, and the Democratic
Legislature unadopted them. By that time,
other states had passed it. So then it became
the law anyway. This goes off so far back -
we Republicans committed so many sins
thereafter, Democrats did very noble things.
So, I mean, that's buried and in
5833
the past. But we are here, we're going into
the new millennium. And we go in, hopefully,
with a spirit and a conviction that we are
children of God.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Thank you,
Senator Marchi. I greatly appreciate the font
of wisdom from this bill jumps.
But through you, Mr. President, as
I sit here today, I have -
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: Excuse
me, Senator Dollinger. You're now on the
bill?
SENATOR DOLLINGER: On the bill,
Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: Thank
you very much.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: As I stand
here today and consider this bill, I clearly
understand the motivation for this bill. But
I have a concern about the emphasis placed on
one portion of our treasured documents to the
exclusion of others, and perhaps to the
deemphasis of others.
And I have always been intrigued by
the phrase about inalienable rights, which of
5834
course many people think comes from the
Constitution, but is actually found in the
words of Thomas Jefferson in the Declaration
of Independence. But my concern, Senator
Marchi, is that it seems to me, from the point
of view of teaching people in America about
what their country stands for, that it is not
just that our founding fathers articulated
inalienable rights. That had been done
before. It had been done in the documents
from John Locke. It had been done in English
documents. It was part of Rousseau's New
Enlightenment thinking. The notion that
people had rights was not a new notion.
But the critical notion that the
Declaration of Independence sets forth, the
critical notion that nowhere appears but -
for the first time appears in the handwriting
of Thomas Jefferson, is the phrase that comes
after it, the phrase that is the critical
touchstone for democracy, the phrase that's
the critical touchstone for this state and
this nation: the source of the power of
government, that it is to secure these rights
that governments are instituted among men,
5835
deriving their just powers from -- using the
phrase that's never, really never been used
before -- from the consent of the governed.
And I would suggest, Senator
Marchi, that while your attempt to focus on
the issue of the Creator creating rights as
being a critical component of America -- I
agree with that, that notion of some
inalienable rights, something that we have as
human beings that we are given by our
Creator -- that the greater lesson of the
Declaration of Independence, the greater
lesson of America, the greater lesson of New
York State, the lesson we need to teach our
children, is that it is governments created by
men, deriving their power from the consent of
the governed, that are the hallmark to
preserve those rights, to secure those rights.
We don't have them without a government that
draws its consent from the governed.
And my concern, Senator Marchi, is
that while you focus on the Creator as having
given us those rights, you deemphasize the
notion that it is government, with the power
of the people behind it, that must protect
5836
those rights. And my concern in voting for
this bill is that I would teach my children
that God has given them something, with a
strong emphasis, and not with the same
emphasis tell them that they in their
government participation, through the power of
their vote, through the power of their elected
leaders, which is the power of the consent of
the governed -- that without their
participation, they will not be able to secure
those rights and maintain them forever.
And my fear is that when we pass
this, which is motivated from the spirit of
letting children know what God gave them, that
they will lose the fact that men can take it
away from them if they don't participate in
their democracy. So my fear, Senator Marchi,
is that by emphasizing one portion, we will
lose our power to emphasize the more critical
portion, that what God has given them men can
take away unless they exercise the power of
governance, unless they participate in their
government.
You have said, Senator Marchi, and
I think I quoted you directly, it's so
5837
important that children learn about the
founders' belief in God. I would suggest it's
so important, equally as important -- and
should be a part of this bill before I can
vote for it -- that they must realize that it
is men who can take those rights away. And it
is the history of mankind, as too often
demonstrated, as you have so often brilliantly
articulated on this floor, that our history is
littered, littered with the casualties of men
taking away others' inalienable rights. I
remember your fabulous description of the
Armenian tragedy and the Armenian destruction
that -- the terrible time that the Armenians
had in the destruction of their homeland. And
I think too often we forget that it is people
who take away those rights given from God.
I would strongly suggest, Senator
Marchi, that the true civics lesson in the
Declaration of Independence lies not so much
in saying that God gave us our rights but,
more importantly, that it is we, the people -
we, the people who believe in the power of
governments that govern with the consent of
the governed can secure those rights for
5838
eternity, that is the most important message
of the Declaration of Independence.
I'm afraid that if we pass this
bill and require simply one reference without
the other, we will lose the greatest message
given in history, which is contained in this
document.
SENATOR MARCHI: Madam -- no
Madam. Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Marchi.
SENATOR MARCHI: I prayerfully
hope that this bill passes. But the
sentiments you expressed, Senator, are
excellent. And they spring, I think, from
your deep faith -
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Absolutely.
SENATOR MARCHI: -- in the
dignity of the individual and the human being
and the obligations that we have morally. You
made a very, very moral statement for -- for
the application of what I'm talking about.
So I hope we have a last section
and we have -
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
5839
Senator Duane, why do you rise?
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you,
Mr. President. I was hoping that the sponsor
would yield to a few questions as well.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Marchi, do you yield?
SENATOR MARCHI: Yes. Yes, I
will.
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you very
much, Senator. In an effort to not ask you to
restate the purpose for the introduction of
this legislation, I would like to focus on one
area and see if we can find some common
ground.
I heard over and over again the
sponsor -- through you, Mr. President -
discuss that one of the major purposes of this
bill is to make sure that tolerance and
dignity is something that is dwelled upon in
the schools, that it is something that is made
a part of the very fabric of schools, that
they are values that are instilled in the
students in the school as well as within the
entire school community. And I heard over and
over again dignity as being one of the major
5840
components or outcomes that the sponsor hopes
to have result from this legislation.
Is that an appropriate
characterization?
SENATOR MARCHI: Fair enough.
SENATOR DUANE: In that -
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Duane, do you have another question
now of Senator Marchi?
SENATOR DUANE: Sort of. Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: Okay.
Senator Marchi, do you continue to yield?
SENATOR MARCHI: You're asking me
to yield to a question?
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: Yes,
Senator.
SENATOR MARCHI: Yes, Senator, of
course.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: I agree that this
is a very, very important value, as are other
values which need to be instilled in schools
through the school community, hoping that it
is something that comes to the school and
5841
throughout the neighborhood through the family
as well.
And I was wondering if the sponsor
would also agree that the goal of tolerance
and dignity for students within a school can
only ultimately make it possible for dignity
and tolerance to be values shared throughout
neighborhoods, throughout the state, and
hopefully throughout all of the communities in
the nation, for that matter.
SENATOR MARCHI: Well, it's been
the objective and the pursuit of 200 years of
endless effort, of trial and error, of all
kinds of experiences. But hopefully we're
making our way there.
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you. Thank
you.
Mr. President, I believe that
there's an amendment at the desk.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: There
is, Senator Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: And I would waive
the reading of the amendment, if the president
so desires.
SENATOR MARCHI: I understood,
5842
Senator, you had offered an amendment, and by
the rules, you submitted copies, so I am
familiar with the -
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: Excuse
me. Senator Marchi, are you asking Senator
Duane to yield? Do you have a question for
him?
SENATOR MARCHI: Well, I'm just
saying that the rules require that it -- the
amendment be shared, and the Senator has done
this. So I'm familiar with it. I have no
objection to his -
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: Thank
you, Senator Marchi.
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you,
Mr. President. If I may describe the
amendment.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: We've
reviewed the amendment. You may describe it
and move forward.
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you very
much, Mr. President.
The amendment at the desk is the -
is really legislation entitled "Dignity for
All Students Act." And what this legislation
5843
would do is to put into place policies
throughout the state of New York that would
ensure that schools are safe and respectful
for all students, regardless of their ethnic
group identification, race, national origin,
gender, sexual orientation, religious
background, et cetera.
It would mean that the Commissioner
of Education would be authorized -- indeed,
directed -- to implement policies that would
make sure that school environments around the
state are safe, that a curriculum would be put
forward and students would be required to take
it that would have the aim of fostering an
appreciation of different kinds of people, to
make sure that tolerance of different kinds of
people were taught, that no student should
ever have to be in fear of being intimidated
because of who they are or who they are
perceived to be.
I think that among many other
pieces of legislation which we have seen come
before this body during this legislative
session dealing with issues of violence and
discrimination in schools, in some cases
5844
leading to gun violence and other forms of
violence in schools -- we've all seen the
terrible violence on television and in the
newspapers which has happened because of
unfortunate circumstances in schools which has
led students to act out sometimes in violent
manners.
And what this legislation seeks to
do is from the earliest time on in school to
foster an atmosphere in school where kids
would not have to fear that they're at risk of
physical violence, where they are not in fear
of being verbally harassed or made fun of,
called names. That it would be the
responsibility of the administration and of
teachers to foster a safe environment where
there would be zero tolerance for bias-related
language. I don't have to tell you what those
words are. You've heard those words, sadly.
But to make schools, to the best efforts
possible, free of that form of discrimination
and intolerance.
And I think in many ways it's
complementary to the spirit of Senator
Marchi's legislation, in that ultimately
5845
legislation such as ours would hope to restore
tolerance and dignity to all students in
schools, through different avenues but with
the same result.
And I would urge my colleagues to
support this amendment to the bill and make
dignity for all students a reality in the
schools in the state of New York.
Thank you, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: The
question is on the amendment. All those in
favor signify by saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: All
those opposed, nay.
(Response of "Nay.")
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: The
amendment is defeated.
Senator Connor.
SENATOR CONNOR: Thank you,
Mr. President. I have an amendment served on
the sponsor at the desk. I would just like to
call it up, waive its reading, and explain.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Connor, you may proceed with the
5846
amendment.
SENATOR CONNOR: Thank you,
Mr. President.
My amendment follows in the course
of what Senator Marchi has proposed. I think
it's admirable what he's doing here. And my
amendment would add to his legislation the
requirement that the Pledge of Allegiance be
taught with special emphasis on the words "one
nation under God." And I think it's
self-explanatory, and I certainly hope my
amendment passes.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Marchi -- first of all, Senator Marchi
on the amendment.
SENATOR MARCHI: Yes, on the
amendment.
I have certainly no violent
difference with you on the subject. But if
you go back to Section 801, which was adopted
in 1980, I -- 1980 or 1988, but then was
amended because of the whole question of the
Pledge, and that gave rise to the instruction
on certain subjects, the courses of
instruction 801 and then 802, on the question
5847
of the flag -- we're getting into an area
which would require extended discourse and
debate.
And the responsibility is assigned
to the -- the Regents shall determine the
subjects to be included in such courses of
instruction on patriotism and in humanity -
on the question of human rights issues. And
it does give them that province.
It is possible, under amendments
that were made in 1994, 1996, a body of laws
which has suggested to them -- and perhaps you
might want to provide them, rather than get
into the question of how we're going to
amend -- I don't know whether you would
provide for the amendment of Section 801
altogether, because it is a rather complicated
item.
So that I believe that if you
follow the footsteps that were selected in
1994 and 1996, as add-ons -- that's where the
famine in Ireland and the Holocaust came in -
that there may be a way in which you can
effect a change. And I would recommend it.
It was in -- you will find it in the chapters
5848
of the Laws of 1994 and 1996. But it's not in
the statute books yet. It's instructions
given to the Board of Regents.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: The
question is on the amendment. All those in
favor signify by saying aye.
SENATOR CONNOR: Party vote in
the affirmative.
SENATOR MEIER: Party vote in the
negative.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: The
Secretary will call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 24. Nays,
36. Party vote.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: The
amendment is defeated.
On the bill, read the last section.
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Mr.
President, to explain -
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Montgomery, why do you rise?
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: -- my vote.
Can I explain my vote?
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: We
5849
have to call the roll first.
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Call the
roll.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: Read
the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: Call
the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Montgomery, to explain her vote.
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: I'm -- I've
been instructed that I have 3/5 of my time to
explain, so I'll go quickly.
I want to just make sure that my
colleagues know what we are amending. So I'm
going to read into the record, Mr. President,
Senator Marchi's -- the bill that Senator
Marchi is amending. I'm not reading his
language, I'm reading the bill that is already
in law.
It says, on page 2, line 6, "The
Regents shall determine the subjects to be
included in such courses of instruction in
5850
patriotism, citizenship, and human rights
issues, with particular attention to the study
of the inhumanity of genocide, slavery -
including the Freedom Trail and Underground
Railroad -- the Holocaust, and the mass
starvation in Ireland from 1845 to 1850, the
history, meaning, significance, and effect of
the provisions of the Constitution of the
United States, the amendments thereto, the
Declaration of Independence, the Constitution
of the State of New York, and the amendments
thereto."
So I just want my colleagues to
know that in fact what Senator Marchi is
trying to do is already in law. It is not
even necessary that this language go in. But
nonetheless, I am voting for it, because it is
already part of our statutes.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Montgomery will be recorded in the
affirmative.
Senator Duane, to explain his vote.
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you very
much, Mr. President.
Though I have the utmost respect
5851
for the sponsor of the legislation and the
values which he holds dear, and for the most
part agree with them in spirit, if not across
the board, and try to uphold them in my own
personal life, I believe that this legislation
would begin a slippery slope towards the
teaching of religion and, more specifically, a
religion in our public schools. And for that
reason, I just can't support it.
I very firmly believe that our
protections for freedom of religion in the
Constitution has in fact created an atmosphere
in the United States where perhaps religions
are stronger than anyplace else in the entire
world. And to my mind, since freedom of
religion is not broken, that we don't need to
fix it through this by introducing religion
into public schools.
Thank you, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Duane will be recorded in the
negative.
Senator Paterson, to explain his
vote.
SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
5852
I've -- I voted in the affirmative on the
amendment. I'm sorry, I thought the amendment
had been voted on. I'm sorry.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: The
Secretary will announce the results.
THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
the negative on Calendar Number 1295 are
Senators -- those recorded in the negative on
Calendar Number 1295 are Senators Duane,
Hevesi, Schneiderman, Seabrook, and Waldon.
Ayes, 55. Nays, 5.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: The
bill is passed.
Senator Morahan, why do you rise?
SENATOR MORAHAN: Mr. President,
I would ask for unanimous consent, without
objection, to change -- to be recorded in the
negative on Calendar Number 1529, Senate Bill
5738.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: With
out objection, you will be recorded in the
negative.
SENATOR MORAHAN: May I go on,
Mr. President? I hope I'm doing this the
right way.
5853
On 6/14 I was out of the chamber
for Calendar Item 1333, Senate Bill S4405.
Had I been in the chamber, I would have cast a
negative vote.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: The
record will so reflect.
SENATOR MORAHAN: Thank you,
Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Seabrook, why do you rise?
SENATOR SEABROOK: Yes,
Mr. President. With unanimous consent, I
would like to be recorded in the negative on
Calendar 980.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: With
out objection.
Senator Sampson, why do you rise?
SENATOR SAMPSON: Mr. President,
I'd like unanimous consent to be recorded in
the negative on Calendar Number 980.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: With
out objection.
Senator Meier, why do you rise?
SENATOR MEIER: Mr. President, I
rise to ask that the Secretary bring -- or
5854
read, rather, Calendar 667.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: The
Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
667, by Member of the Assembly Hill, Assembly
Print Number 7549A, an act relating to the
payment of a lottery prize.
SENATOR DUANE: Explanation.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Hannon, an explanation has been
requested.
SENATOR HANNON: I'm sorry,
Mr. President, I didn't hear. Who asked for
the explanation?
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Duane asked for the explanation.
SENATOR HANNON: This is a bill
that has, in a different form, passed this
house in regard to describing situations when
a lottery ticket having been lost, and all of
the circumstantial evidence being -- pointing
in one direction might be -- that
circumstantial evidence could be considered
the equivalent of the winning lottery ticket
and presented to the Lottery Commission for
5855
approval of payment.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: Through you,
Mr. President, would the sponsor yield?
SENATOR HANNON: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Hannon, do you yield?
SENATOR HANNON: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: This legislation
provides more leniency for someone who missed
a chance to claim their prize?
SENATOR HANNON: Yes. But with
careful circumscribing of when that chance may
occur so that we are sure to a moral certitude
that the individual who has all of the
circumstantial evidence is the person who
really had the ticket.
SENATOR DUANE: Okay.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: Read
the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
5856
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: Call
the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 60.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: The
bill is passed.
Senator Meier.
SENATOR MEIER: Thank you,
Mr. President. Could we now return to the
order of messages from the Assembly.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: We
will return to the order of messages from the
Assembly.
I hand down a message from the
Assembly. The Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: The Assembly
returns Senate Bill Number 3651, with a
message that it has concurred in the passage
of the same, with amendments. Senator Padavan
moved to concur in said amendments.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: The
amendment is concurred, and the bill is before
the house.
The Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
5857
449, by Senator Padavan, Senate Print 3651A,
Assembly Reprint Number 30,000, an act to
amend the Real Property Tax Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: Read
the last section.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Lay it aside,
Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Dollinger, why do you rise?
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr.
President, I just laid the bill aside because
there were -- on the original version of this
bill, Senators Breslin, Dollinger, Duane,
Kruger, Montgomery, Paterson, Santiago,
Schneiderman, and Stavisky voted against this
bill. I understand in a conversation with -
well, I just wanted to alert the other members
that the bill, as I understand it, is just a
series of technical amendments and one minor
correction to the last bill. And I'd just
advise my colleagues that those were the
members who voted against it the first time
around.
This is Calendar Number 449;
correct?
5858
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: That's
correct, 449.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Why don't we
just do the same vote, since it was the same
bill.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Meier.
SENATOR MEIER: We consent to
recording the same vote as on the bill when it
was previously before the house.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Thank you,
Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: With
out objection, please record the Senate vote.
The same vote.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr.
President.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Dollinger.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr.
President, after consultation with the Deputy
Majority Leader, it appears as though we
cannot have that same vote.
I would simply, however, recommend
that my colleagues who were in the chamber who
5859
voted against it the first time around, it's
the same bill with some minor technical
amendments. I think the objection that we
raised the last time around is the same
objection.
And I'd ask you to just read the
last section and then call the roll.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: Read
the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 8. This
act shall take effect July 1.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: Call
the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
the negative on Calendar Number 449 are
Senators Breslin, Dollinger, Duane,
Montgomery, Paterson, and Schneiderman. Ayes,
54. Nays, 6.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: The
bill is passed.
Senator Meier.
SENATOR MEIER: Mr. President,
may we now call up Calendar 1462, which is
found in the first supplemental calendar.
5860
SENATOR OPPENHEIMER:
Explanation, please.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: The
Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1462, by Senator Marcellino, Senate Print
2543C, an act to amend the Environmental
Conservation Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Meier.
SENATOR MEIER: Mr. President, is
there a message of necessity at the desk?
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: Yes,
there is.
SENATOR MEIER: I move acceptance
of the message of necessity.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: The
motion is to accept the message of necessity.
All those in favor say aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: All
those opposed, say nay.
(Response of "Nay.")
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: The
message is accepted.
5861
Read the last section.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Explanation.
SENATOR MARCELLINO: We tried.
Mr. President, I think they want an
explanation.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Marcellino, Senator Dollinger has
asked for an explanation.
SENATOR MARCELLINO: And I'll be
glad to give him one.
Mr. President, in 1996 we did a
Pesticide Registry Act, which I and several
other senators were co-prime sponsors to.
That act allowed us to collect a certain
amount of documentation and information
relative to pesticide usage throughout New
York State.
One -- or some groups, particularly
the New York Public Interest Research Group
and Environmental Advocates, put out a report
in 1998, based heavily on the documentation
provided by the Pesticide Registry Act, in
which they stated that New York is plagued by
pesticides, New York State. In the executive
summary, they particularly stated that
5862
downstate -- and I'm reading, and I quote.
This is from the executive summary:
"Downstate urban and suburban counties report
more pesticide use than rural and other
upstate counties. The data reveal a striking
pattern that shows substantially more
pesticide use in downstate urban and suburban
areas than in rural and other upstate
counties. New York, Manhattan, Kings, Nassau,
Suffolk and Westchester Counties dominate the
overall county rankings. The use of such
large amounts of toxic pesticides in densely
populated and geographically small downstate
areas can pose significant public health
risks. This kind of intimate exposure has the
potential to affect people, particularly
vulnerable populations such as infants,
children, and the elderly, on
an-around-the-clock basis."
A constituent came into my office
and said to me, "Senator, I was in my house
doing some housework, my child was out playing
in the back yard. I looked out the kitchen
window to notice a mist come flying across
through the hedges." She went outside and
5863
noticed a person standing there holding a
power hose, spraying the trees that border her
property. He was dressed in almost like a
space suit, the way she described it. He had
a facial mask on, an inhaler to protect his
face, clothing to protect his garments. He
was totally draped. And he was spraying. Her
child had no such protection. She was very
concerned, ran outside, grabbed the child and
moved him inside. She felt she should have
been warned, yet there was nothing in the law
to do that.
Another constituent came to me and
said, "Senator, I was sitting in my house, in
my bedroom, and all of a sudden -- with the
window open, taking a nice summer day and
getting some breeze. And all of a sudden, a
mist came flying through the window." He
looked outside -- after closing the window -
and noticed a similar occurrence. A gentleman
was out there spraying the hedges, and the
spray from the hose was rising up in the air
and traveling and impacting his way of life
and impacting his lifestyle.
He would also have liked to have
5864
been notified in advance so that he could have
taken some precautions. He didn't object to
the fact that his neighbor was protecting his
shrubs or his foliage. They were expensive
trees, and he understood the reason. But he
just would have liked to have been warned so
that he could have closed his window, perhaps
covered the pool which they happen to have
had, cover the sandbox where the children
played.
The other lady would have liked to
have been able -- another constituent said
when that happened, a similar occurrence
happened to her, they had laundry hanging out,
and she had to bring the laundry back inside
and rewash it because she didn't want it to be
contaminated.
What we are proposing in this
particular bill is basically a homeowners
infringement protection act. We want to
protect homeowners from having their rights
infringed upon, having their lifestyle
infringed upon. Not by anybody doing
something illegal, but just to give them good
warning. It's a good-neighbor act. It says
5865
if you're going to spray trees, you should be
providing your neighbors whose houses can be
impacted, whose properties can be impacted,
give them at least 48-hour notice so that they
can take whatever precautions they wish to
take.
We're not saying don't spray.
We're not saying don't do what you feel you
have to do to protect your property. We're
just saying warn your neighbors, let them
know.
Current law requires pesticide
applicators who come to your property to put
down application to put little flags on the
front lawn or around the property to mark the
fact that the property has been treated, give
you a warning to stay off of it. Our bill
would also require that same behavior of
homeowners. Homeowners right now can go out
and put an application on the lawn and are not
required -- although I've noticed in recent
years many do put up some kind of notification
to let their neighbors know that the lawn has
been treated.
Again, it doesn't say don't do it.
5866
It just says this lawn has something on it,
why don't you stay off it for a while. Not
that you should be walking on your neighbor's
lawn anyway, it's private property. But we're
just telling you that their lawn has been
treated so that if you're walking your dog on
the sidewalk, you might not want to let the
dog go running on the property. If kids are
playing, you might not want to let them play
on the lawn.
Pesticide applicators, among
others, have been somewhat opposed to the
bill. And one can understand that. They feel
it's going to impact their right to make a
living, it's going to increase the cost of
doing business, and a whole host of other
reasons.
So we worked with these people and
negotiated and talked and discussed, and we
came to some ground rules. We said basically
if you're going to spray shrubbery -- this
would include lawns -- less than five feet in
height and the object of the spraying is
within 15 feet of your property line, all you
have to do is go over to your neighbor and
5867
warn them, give them 48 hours' notice, at
least, and say, Look, I'm going to do that.
If the tree is above that height or
if the shrubs are above that height and the
spraying equipment is a high-powered device,
then you have to go a little bit more
distance. We say if it's within 50 yards or
150 feet. This is not a hard thing to do.
You can pace that off. If there's an abutting
property line there on the neighbor's
property, you walk over and you go and inform
the neighbor, give them some notice.
This could be accomplished -- we've
talked to applicators. This could be
accomplished quite simply. All they have to
do is when they inspect the site to determine
what they're going to do, walking the site
with the homeowner, they simply have to take
it, pace it off: Okay, there's a neighbor
over there, that's the one I have to notify.
Walk over, hang a slip on the neighbor's door
which basically says what you're going to
spray and when you're going to spray it.
We're not asking them to do
something that they don't ordinarily do. I
5868
obtained my own lawn applicator by that very
means. He signed up one of my neighbors, went
around the community saying, basically, "I
signed up your neighbor. Would you like a
lawn application as well?" I checked him out,
he was licensed, he had all the credentials, I
checked him with Consumer Protection Agency in
our county. He had a good reputation. I
signed him up to do the work.
That's the way I would contend that
most people get their applicators, by that
very means. We're not telling the applicators
to do any more than that. When they go around
soliciting other business that they've already
signed up somebody, all they have to do is
notify these people: This is what we're
doing. They're walking up and down the
street. I wasn't even an abutting property to
that other neighbor. They found me by just
going knocking on doors. It wasn't that hard.
All we're saying is go to the person next
door, within the ranges we discussed, and do
it.
We've got some provisos in this
that basically ask the homeowner, if they're
5869
doing a granular application, to flag the
property as well. We try to avoid it. We put
some language in the bill that says if you're
applying pesticides to a small area, less than
a hundred square feet, you don't have to do
anything. What we're trying to do is avoid
somebody going out and spraying dandelions in
one little patch or covering one little spot
or grandma spraying a rosebush, a small bush
near the house, that she doesn't have to give
48 hours' notice to somebody on that. So
we've limited that. We've tried to cut out
that problem.
The bill is common sense. It's a
good-neighbor bill. It's a commonsense bill.
It is, as the bill says, limited to New York
City, Nassau and Suffolk Counties, and
Westchester County, in conjunction with the
report by NYPIRG and Environmental Advocates
which basically said downstate has the
greatest problem. We think that with
downstate and Westchester, we cover
approximately two-thirds of the population of
the state of New York.
And with this group, under this
5870
experiment, we can begin to show that this
plan can work, will not put people out of
business, will not be a detriment to the
applicators, will not cause undue stress to
anybody, and perhaps it will spread.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Oppenheimer, you have a question -
SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: Yes. Would
the sponsor yield?
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC: -
for Senator Marcellino?
SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: Yes.
SENATOR MARCELLINO: It would be
my pleasure to yield to the former ranker on
the Environmental Conservation Committee.
SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: Your dear
buddy. Okay.
Why do you think it's necessary
only to cover the eight counties downstate and
not the -- we are 62 counties in this state.
And why are we not covering all counties in
your bill?
SENATOR MARCELLINO: Many of
our -- as I said earlier, this -- let me
correct that. As I said earlier, this bill
5871
covers approximately two-thirds of the
populated area -- or the population of New
York State already. We are trying to impact
those areas where the greatest impact occurs.
There has been strong opposition by
Farm Bureau, who basically say that it isn't
necessary in the rural farm areas of upstate
New York where you don't have the density of
population, where you don't have the
compactness of population, that the
notification law would be a burden, an
unnecessary burden on these areas.
We feel that by doing the downstate
communities where the greatest impact would be
felt, where the greatest protection would be
provided, we're serving the greatest need.
SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: Are you
aware -- if you would yield again, through
you, Mr. President -
SENATOR MARCELLINO: Absolutely.
SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: -- that the
majority of the New York City pesticide
applications which are referenced in the
statistics you mentioned earlier, they are
interior applications which are not covered by
5872
notice?
SENATOR MARCELLINO: I would
suggest, Senator, that if you lived in
Brooklyn, Bronx, Queens, Staten Island, other
than Manhattan, you would find that you would
have enough outdoor applications where you
have trees and shrubs.
The one last tree left in
Manhattan, which we're trying to protect and
preserve at this point in time as a shrine to
the environment, we don't think has to be
sprayed.
I don't mean to be facetious or
make light of it, but the other boroughs do
have a need.
SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: I was just
saying that the majority of the applications
in New York City are interior ones.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Oppenheimer, do you have another
question?
SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: Yes, if you
would yield again, the sponsor.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Marcellino, do you continue to yield?
5873
SENATOR MARCELLINO: It would be
my pleasure.
SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: There seems
to be, in your bill, a complex set of heights
and setbacks and type of spraying equipment.
And the majority of applications that go
directly to lawns are not covered in your
bill; is that correct?
SENATOR MARCELLINO: Absolutely
not correct, Senator. Lawns -- if the Senator
will yield to a question.
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Oppenheimer, would you yield for a
question from Senator Marcellino?
SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: Sure.
SENATOR MARCELLINO: Senator, do
you have a lawn in front of your house on your
property? How high is the grass?
SENATOR OPPENHEIMER:
(Gesturing.)
SENATOR MARCELLINO: Let the
record show she refers to something
approximately 3 inches in height.
By my ability in mathematics, 3
inches is less than 5 feet. If you applied a
5874
granular application -- if you applied a
granular application, you would have to flag
your property under this bill. If you hired
Chemlawn to come in and spray your grass, they
would have to notify at least -- give your
neighbors at least 48 hours' notice. They're
required to do that under this bill as well.
And if you sprayed it with a hose, a garden
hose, which is about a
60-pound-per-square-inch force, you would have
to give your neighbors notification.
Grass is absolutely covered. Lawn
applications are absolutely covered by this
bill. You talk about a complex set of
heights. Five feet, the height of an average
person, 5 feet. We can give or take a few
inches, I don't think anybody's going to sue
you. You've got to notify somebody within 15
feet of the abutting property line. That's
simply done. Because usually when you're
doing that, you're pointing your object down
and there is a de minimis amount of spread in
the spray. If it's above 5 feet, you're
aiming the gun up. So if it sprays up, it
travels greater, we say you have to go at
5875
least 50 yards, or 50 paces.
This is not complex. This is a
basic, simple thing. Everybody can figure
this one out. As the applicator walks the
property and checks it out, they can simply
pace it off. This is not rocket science.
This is simple.
We put in some spray numbers. We
said at least 25 pounds per square inch,
because we wanted to make sure we incorporated
everything but the little push can that is
done. That's why that's in there. We feel
it's important to do that. Otherwise we would
have a hole as to what is under the code and
what isn't, what kinds of devices are used.
The typical devices used by the
professional applicators will be covered by
this legislation. The pump-up devices which
build up a certain amount of pressure, all
will exceed at least 25 pounds per square inch
when you do that. So we feel they're covered
as well. We think this had to be done to
protect Grandma Marcellino from going out and
hand-pumping her favorite rosebush, and we
just didn't want to make her have to notify
5876
her neighbors and give them 48 hours'
notification.
SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: Thank you,
Senator. I think I'll just talk on the bill
for a moment or two -
ACTING PRESIDENT BONACIC:
Senator Oppenheimer, on the bill.
SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: -- because
it sounds so good. You know, sometimes the
names of things sound so much better than the
thing actually is.
The fact is that almost everybody
in the environmental community is opposed to
this bill and supports Assembly 1461, which is
the bill that they see as comprehensive. It
covers all pesticide applications, it covers
all applications in schools and daycare
centers, it is not complex, it covers the
entire state of New York, it doesn't single
out eight counties. And, by the way, the
other counties of this state are -- their
options are foreclosed so they can't even opt
into this.
And, in addition, this is
something -- well, as I said, it applies only
5877
downstate, which kind of makes you wonder why
this body isn't dealing with the entire state.
Now, the fact is that the cancer
rate is 6 percent higher outside of New York
City, and that cancer rates are growing more
rapidly outside of New York City. In the
city, the incidence of invasive cancers are -
is about 3 percent, and it's 12½ percent for
the rest of our state. Why are we not looking
at the rest of our state?
I'm going to try and cover this
more quickly, leaving out some of these facts.
In 1997, since it was mentioned that the
farmers are the reason this is not covering
the entire state, commercial pesticide
applicators applied or sold to farmers a total
of 16½ million pounds of pesticides and 2.4
million gallons of pesticides. This is an
incredible amount of pesticides going into our
land and onto our trees and into our food.
And the description of -- there's a
description of possible toxic effects, which I
will briefly discuss. There's neurotoxicity,
which includes -- well, it would give you a
headache, it would give you dizziness.
5878
There's the effect of carcinogens. There are
epidemiological links between pesticides and
childhood cancers, non-Hodgkin's lymphoma,
multiple myeloma, leukemia, and breast and
prostate cancers. It also affects birth
defects. These pesticide applications produce
reproductive abnormalities like infertility
and miscarriage. And they're also immune
suppressors. And the most heavily used
products upstate are some of the most
hazardous. And new pesticide products are
proliferating all the time.
There's a really dangerous illogic
in our system in this country, and it's based
towards accepting a pesticide use until the
mounting proof of harm is totally
incontestable. Pesticides such as DDT,
dieldrin, and chlordane were once widely used
and claimed to be safe. And they are now
banned because of serious harmful effects.
What I'm saying -- and the reason I
voted for this in committee was because I had
very high hopes that the two bills, the one in
the Assembly, 1461, and this one, S2543, would
conference, that we could have a conference
5879
committee that would bring these two bills
together.
But, you know, to just deal with
New York City and a couple of the suburbs when
the counties with the highest cancer rates are
Clinton County, which has the highest rate for
total invasive malignant cancers as well as
for prostate cancer, Rockland County has the
highest incidence of breast cancer, Hamilton
County has the highest rates of non-Hodgkin's
lymphomas, Schuyler County has the highest
incidence of ovarian cancers -- it's just
unreasonable to say that we should only have
this protection in eight counties when there
are 62 counties in this state and they all
need protection.
So I am going to be voting against
this. The Environmental Advocates have given
this two smokestacks. And I certainly hope
that others will join me in voting no and hope
that we will be able to get a conference
committee going that will draw together the
excellent Assembly bill and this bill and try
and work to a conclusion that's satisfactory
to all.
5880
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Marcellino.
SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr.
President, thank you. Just a point, a couple
of points that need to be made.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Marcellino, on the bill.
SENATOR MARCELLINO: The Assembly
bill is a second bill. We at one time had a
same-as. And the bill that passed the
Assembly two years ago, it was substantially
very similar in scope, in concept, to the one
we are talking about on this floor today.
We have made some amendments to the
bill. Their bill is a little bit too
simplistic. It requires everything -
everybody to notify for any application
whatsoever, give a neighbor 48 hours' notice.
So if I want to put Plus-2 and kill some
dandelions on my lawn, I have to tell my
neighbor 48 hours in advance. This bill makes
a criminal out of somebody for doing basic
lawn care. It's unnecessary.
The flagging is all that's needed
on that. Notify the people and let them know
5881
that it's there. It's private property you're
talking about, Senator. There's no reason for
people to be walking on other people's front
lawns. If they know there's a pesticide or
they know there's an application on that
property, they'll stay off. So warning them
ahead of time is a kind of -- well, making a
criminal out of a homeowner for that is, I
think, a little bit far out.
Schools are in the other bill. The
school boards don't want this problem of
having to get involved with sending home
letters every time they put down some type of
pesticide out in the field. That would be a
burden on them. But in fact, you have an
elected school board. They're an elected body
and have a perfect right to set a standard.
If they want to notify the people in their
community, all that school board has to do is
tell the superintendent to do it and he'll do
it. Or she'll do it. So that can be
accomplished. You don't need state
legislation for that.
Daycare centers. They have to meet
health and safety codes. If you're interested
5882
in how they treat your children, you ask. I
know a number of people, some who work for me,
who put their children in daycare. You go to
them, you sign a contract and you say what are
you going to do, how is my child treated, how
do you keep this place clean, where does my
child play and how does he or she come in
contact with it. They'll tell you, and you'll
know. And if you don't like what they tell
you, don't put your child in the daycare
center. You don't need state legislation for
that. It goes beyond the pale to require that
sort of thing.
With respect to the cancer studies,
I would suggest to you, Senator, that there is
no definitive study that connects cancer with
pesticides. Do we suspect? Yes. Do I
suspect? Yes. Do I know for a fact? No.
And the rules and the science on this topic
are muddy at best.
So I would suggest that we have a
bill on the floor which covers a lot of
ground, deals with the issue clearly, is
easily enforced and easily dealt with and
easily understood and doesn't force people
5883
into breaking laws unnecessarily. But it just
says to them, be a good neighbor, be a
comprehensive person -- a decent person and
treat your neighbor with some respect and give
them a little bit of a heads-up when you're
doing something.
SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: Thank you,
Senator. If I may.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Oppenheimer.
SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: I have -
well, a couple of things.
The first thing I would say is that
my wish is that we get a conference committee
going. Neither bill is going anywhere unless
we get a conference committee going. The
Assembly bill is much closer to what I desire
and what the environmental community wants,
but unless we get our heads together, we have
nothing. And there is no companion bill live
in the Assembly now on yours, and we have
nothing here that is a companion to the
Assembly bill.
I would very much like to see
action. I understand what you're saying about
5884
maybe getting too minute. But on the other
hand, I think with 62 counties, they deserve
coverage as well as -- you know, the other
counties deserve it as well as the eight.
But here I have before me -- you
said there is nothing that is known to be a
carcinogen. In -
SENATOR MARCELLINO: I didn't say
that.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Marcellino, why do you rise?
SENATOR MARCELLINO: No, no, I
didn't say nothing was known to be a
carcinogen, Senator. I said the cause and
effect on pesticides causing cancer is muddy
at best. That's what I said.
SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: Well, I -
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Oppenheimer.
SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: If I may, I
would just like to enter in the record that -
this was put out in 1997 by our New York State
DEC, its Pesticide Sales and Application
Database. And the first line says "Known
carcinogens." And under that it says that
5885
there have been 1,438,000 pounds of known
carcinogens that are used in our state. So -
and this is known. The next line under that
is "Probable and likely" carcinogens. So
there are known, and -- and we do put a lot of
it on our earth.
I just am hopeful that we can get a
conference committee going as soon as
possible.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Spano.
SENATOR SPANO: Thank you,
Mr. President.
I think rather than us spending a
great deal of time in talking about other
bills that are in the other house and what is
not included in this bill, I think it would be
more productive for us to talk about a bill
that's on the floor and what is included.
And the fact that Senator
Marcellino has taken the leadership to move
forward to protect the areas of Long Island,
New York City, and Westchester County. And
not worrying about what counties' options are
foreclosed, but to say what options do exist
5886
for the residents of those communities that
will be protected with some uniform standards
for consumer pesticides that currently don't
exist in this state of New York.
And I'm very happy that Senator
Marcellino amended this bill to include
Westchester County. That there are -- I don't
think it's relevant at this point that -
whether or not there's a companion bill in the
Assembly. This bill is before us. Why?
Because the Governor sent a message of
necessity on this bill. And I'm sure that, as
he did that for this bill, if the Assembly
chose to either take this bill up or have a
bill printed of their own, I'm sure the
Governor would grant that same courtesy for
them.
I think what this bill does here is
recognizes the public health risks that exist
currently, rather than getting into the
clinical decisions, the studies of whether or
not it's cancer-causing. I think it's pretty
obvious that it's obnoxious, that there are
applicators who are unprofessional, that there
are individuals across the state who have a
5887
total disregard for their neighbors, a total
disregard for their environment, a total
disregard for the health and the safety of our
families and their families. And this bill
will put a stop -- will go a long way towards
putting a stop to that total disregard.
So I think the all-or-nothing
attitude is not productive. What we should
say is that we have a start here. We have a
recognition that there need to be these type
of uniform standards, that we need to provide
some safety, a safety net for the people who
live in these counties that are covered.
And for us to say that maybe we may
oppose this bill -- or, as some groups have
suggested, we oppose this bill, why, because
it doesn't include the entire state of New
York -- is not productive at all. Should we
start -- where do we start? We do this with
so many other measures that come before us
here, that we will start by protecting a
certain number of people or different
geographical areas in this state and build
upon that. And give us a chance, as we start
the process, to evaluate how it is working and
5888
evaluate the health and the safety and the
risks that are -- that exist across the state.
So I think that this -- we should
be commending Senator Marcellino for moving
forward and showing the leadership and saying
he is going to lead by saying that we need
these uniform standards, that we are going to
send a message out to those unprofessional
applicators that these standards are going to
exist in this state, and we're going to send
the message out to individuals in this state
that this commonsense approach is something
that should be adopted by -- not only by an
act of the Legislature, but by the common
sense of individuals before they decide to go
out and use pesticides on their own properties
that will have an impact on their neighbors.
So Senator Marcellino, I think we
are -- certainly it's a good day today that
we're moving forward in this direction, and
I'm very happy to see this bill on the floor.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: Can we
just have a little quiet in the house, please.
Thank you.
Senator Schneiderman.
5889
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Thank you,
Mr. President. If the sponsor would yield to
a couple of questions.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Marcellino, would you yield for a
question from Senator Schneiderman?
SENATOR MARCELLINO: My pleasure.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Schneiderman.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Senator
Marcellino, the hour is getting late and I
don't want to take too much time going over
the same territory. But just to clarify
something that came up in the dialogue between
yourself and Senator Oppenheimer.
It is true, is it not, that a
substantial number of active ingredients in
pesticides that are used in New York State,
throughout New York State, have been
classified by the Environmental Protection
Agency as known, probable, likely, or possible
carcinogens, is it not?
SENATOR MARCELLINO: That's true.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: And I take
it that your concern that you spoke about so
5890
eloquently, about the need for protecting
people from this spray, is motivated by the
fact that we suspect or know that pesticides
currently in use can cause -- pose health
hazards to people, particularly children; is
that not correct?
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Marcellino.
SENATOR MARCELLINO: What we're
doing with these things is we're saying to
people that there are labeled instructions on
the pesticides and the federal government
labels them, and it tells you how to use them.
And the manufacturers tell you how to use
them. And the basic statement is if you use
them correctly, the federal government says it
it's okay. If you have certain training with
certain types of chemicals, if these are
nonrestricted chemicals, then the average
homeowner can purchase them over the counter.
Again, there are labeled instructions on these
things.
Part of this legislation basically
says that a store would put up a sign saying
"Read the labels. Make sure you use the
5891
pesticides according to the labeled
instructions." If you do so, according to the
manufacturer and according to the federal
government, these things are safe to use.
This bill is designed to allow a
homeowner to be proactive and take precautions
and protect as they see fit when a neighbor's
trees are being sprayed. This is what we're
trying to do. We're not trying to cure cancer
here. That's for other people. What we're
trying to do is to let people take protections
and protective actions to defend themselves.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: If the
sponsor would continue to yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Marcellino, would you continue to
yield to a question from Senator Schneiderman?
SENATOR MARCELLINO: Certainly.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Schneiderman.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: With
reference to the study by Environmental
Advocates and the New York Public Interest
Research Group that you referred to earlier,
the study relating to the gross quantities -
5892
or the comments related to the gross
quantities of pesticides used in New York City
and other counties in the downstate area, that
included pesticides used inside buildings in
the city of New York, did it not?
SENATOR MARCELLINO: I believe
so.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: And in
fact, when it comes to the things that are
actually covered by this legislation before
us, which relates to the spraying of outside
areas, if you -- there are many other counties
other than the counties of the city of New
York where more outside spray pesticides are
used than the counties of the city of New
York; is that not true?
SENATOR MARCELLINO: I don't know
what's used outside or inside in other
counties for a fact.
But what I can state, as I refer
back to this report -- whether you agree with
it or not, the report says downstate urban and
suburban counties report more pesticide use
than rural and other upstate counties. And
they specifically name Westchester, Nassau,
5893
Suffolk, and the counties of New York City.
Those are covered by this bill.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: But -- if
the sponsor will continue to yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Schneiderman.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: If the
sponsor will continue to yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Marcellino, will you continue to yield
to Senator Schneiderman for a question?
SENATOR MARCELLINO: I continue
to yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Schneiderman.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: I'd hate
to lose Senator Oppenheimer's support based on
geography here for a well-intentioned piece of
legislation. It is not -- there's no magic
line that -- where Westchester -- I see
Senator Spano is very excited about
Westchester being included in this, and I
appreciate why.
When you get to Putnam County, you
get to Rockland County, the lawns being
5894
sprayed in those counties pose as much danger
to their neighbors as in the counties covered
by this bill, do they not?
SENATOR MARCELLINO: The article
that you're talking about, the report that
you're talking about goes on on page 4 and
says basically Nassau and Suffolk Counties,
for example, had a wider range of heavily used
products, many of them lawn-care products
combined with fertilizers. It follows up with
the same thing with the downstate area and the
suburban counties.
We are covering two-thirds of the
state or two-thirds of the population of the
state, Senator.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: I guess
my -
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Schneiderman.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Yes, thank
you. If the sponsor would continue to yield.
My question, though, is if this is
something -- this is a permissive bill, is it
not, Senator? This just permits local
governments to enact laws; is that not
5895
correct?
SENATOR MARCELLINO: It allows
them to opt into this plan. They cannot write
their own laws. They must take this proposal
and they must take this procedure, whatever
the state adopts. The state has the right to
make the plans.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: But other
local governments in other parts of the state
are foreclosed under current law from adopting
such a procedure, or other, similar
procedures; is that not true?
SENATOR MARCELLINO: This state
empowers the counties that were mentioned in
it. It does not unempower them, because they
don't have that right now.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Just to
clarify, though, under the existing case law
my understanding is that, for example, if
Rockland County, with the highest breast
cancer rate in the state, wanted to enact
these laws, it could not now, in the absence
of being included in this legislation.
SENATOR MARCELLINO: Senator, we
said that at the very beginning. Nassau
5896
County tried to enact its own spraying
legislation, and the courts struck it down.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: So I think
that I -- Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Schneiderman.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: I think
that this bill has many commendable provisions
in it. I honestly do not understand why it
shouldn't be permissive for other counties in
the state.
And in accordance with that, I
believe there's an amendment at the desk.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: Yes,
there is, Senator Schneiderman. Will you give
us a moment to review the amendment?
Senator Schneiderman, I've reviewed
your amendment and found it to be germane.
The reading is waived, and you may speak on
the amendment.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Thank you,
Mr. President, on the amendment.
All this amendment does is take the
provisions of this bill which are permissive
and allow local governments to protect -- to
5897
opt into this scheme to provide for some
notification.
And Senator Oppenheimer's comments
indicate many people feel that the protections
in this bill may not go far enough. It is a
step, though. This would allow the other
counties in the state the benefit of this
legislation, allow them to opt in.
As Senator Oppenheimer pointed out,
the parts of the state with the
fastest-growing rates of cancer are not in the
counties covered by this. As Senator
Oppenheimer pointed out and as I also
mentioned, the report that designates the
counties that are included in this bill, when
you take out the gross amounts of pesticides
that are actually sprayed indoors and are not
covered by the bill, the New York City
counties fall out.
And if you look at the real problem
that's addressed by this bill, people spraying
their lawns without notification, it's really
the other suburban counties and urban counties
upstate where the biggest problem is.
And I do not understand how you can
5898
support this bill and watch Senator Spano's
laudable enthusiasm for having his county
included in and say to the citizens of Monroe
County, "You're not allowed to opt into this,
you're not allowed to provide for
notification." Much less the citizens of
Rockland County.
We keep hearing the expression
"downstate." Well, downstate -- I mean,
listen, I had the occasion to walk some lawns
and go door to door in Rockland County
recently, and I observed pesticides being
sprayed. Why shouldn't the people of Rockland
County, with the highest breast cancer rate in
the state, have the opportunity of
notification, as people are going to in other
counties?
So my amendment simply extends this
permissive legislation to the rest of the
state so that we can allow other counties,
including the areas with the highest-growing
cancer rates -- including areas where,
according to the very report Senator
Marcellino referred to, when you take out the
indoor applications in New York City, you have
5899
higher gross amounts of pesticides being
sprayed than you do in the counties covered by
this bill -- to opt into this scheme.
I think it's a friendly and good
amendment to a well-intentioned piece of
legislation that is an important step forward.
And I would urge that we not discriminate
against the citizens of Rockland County,
Putnam County, and all the counties above
those two counties and to the west of those
two counties.
And I note that there are some
counties that in this report have
extraordinarily high levels of pesticides,
whether you accept all of the results or not,
that would not be covered here, including
Orange County, including Erie County.
Rockland County I've already mentioned. I
think we have to allow them to opt in.
And therefore, I would move this
amendment and urge everyone to vote yes.
Let's pass a bill that covers the whole state.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: The
question is on the amendment. All those in
favor signify by saying aye.
5900
(Response of "Aye.")
SENATOR PATERSON: Party vote in
the affirmative.
SENATOR MEIER: Party vote in the
negative.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: The
secretary will call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 24. Nays,
36. Party vote.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: The
amendment is defeated.
Senator Schneiderman.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Thank you,
Mr. President. On the bill.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Schneiderman, on the bill.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: I think
that there is a dilemma that people who are
reviewing this bill now in its current form
face. I do think that it sends a serious and
problematic message to provide for an optional
scheme to some local governments and not to
others. I think it's not a good way for us to
proceed, particularly when -- based on my
5901
reading of the data.
And I think -- Senator Marcellino
has referred to a report by to organizations
that I have a lot of respect for,
Environmental Advocates and the Public
Interest Research Group. When I read the
report, I don't really see the distinction
that he's talking about, because of the factor
of indoor pesticides.
I think that there are many people
who feel, environmentalists who feel that we
should provide a comprehensive, statewide
program that goes further than this.
However, I think that the
provisions in this bill are a good first step.
And that's why it troubles me so greatly that
we are excluding some of the areas of the
state where lawns are being sprayed and where
all of the incidents that you described -- or
the problems that Senator Spano described that
make him so excited that Westchester is
included in this -- exist today.
And I think it's a real shame that
this legislation does not include Rockland
County, Putnam County. If you're going to
5902
include downstate, let's include all of
downstate and not discriminate.
And I think that the drafters of
the bill and the leadership really in this
case has done a disservice to the other areas
of the suburbs that I think everyone has to
acknowledge need regulation and neighbor
notification of this type.
Thank you.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Balboni.
SENATOR BALBONI: Mr. President,
I'd like to just speak on the bill, please.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Balboni, on the bill.
SENATOR BALBONI: I think it's
important, when we take the opportunity to
advance a measure that has not seen this floor
before by a Majority member, to put the bill
into context.
As much as we have heard from
people who have concerns about the bill, about
studies and about poisons and about
pesticides, the reality of this bill is that
there's going to be no empirical way of
5903
determining that this bill has saved one life,
has reduced one person's exposure to
pesticides.
And that's because pesticides and
the pesticide treatment and cancer and breast
cancer are things that continue to elude us in
solution. We have been frightened on Long
Island for a very long time with the rate of
breast cancer, prostate cancer, ovarian
cancer. But when we try to search for the
solutions, there is no bright line, there is
no final cause.
So what are we doing here? We are
chipping away. We are trying to search for
answers that make sense, things that will both
accommodate the concerns in this case of the
farming communities with the suburban
communities and the urban communities.
What Carl Marcellino has done today
is such a common practice in the practice of
law. There's an old saying that in a contract
negotiation, if both sides are unhappy just a
little bit with the result, then it's a good
result. Because in a negotiation, both sides
have to give something up.
5904
I have considered my
environmental -- my personal environmental
record on my votes for the last ten years to
be a great source of pride. But I'll tell you
now on this floor, I don't understand where
some of the advocates are coming from. You
mean to tell me because it's not the bill that
everybody wants, you vote against it? Because
it doesn't go far enough, so suddenly we
should discard it?
That is accepting a premise that is
frankly unacceptable. This is a courageous
act by my colleague from Long Island, because
of all the heat he's getting because it just
doesn't go far enough or it goes too far.
But in reality, Mr. President, what
we're doing today is trying as best we can
with a human-made system that is imperfect at
best to define the conduct by our pesticide
applicators that will give people notice so
they can protect themselves. And anybody who
says information is bad, well, you just don't
get it.
This is an important measure, but
it won't be the last when it comes to this
5905
issue. It may not be the best, but it comes
from a man who believes very passionately in
trying to provide the best information
possible.
Mr. President, I plan on voting yes
and working for greater solutions in the
future. Thank you, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: Thank
you, Senator. Read the last section.
SENATOR MORAHAN: On the bill.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: I'm
sorry, Senator Morahan, on the bill.
SENATOR MORAHAN: Mr. President,
I had asked that serious consideration be
given to the inclusion of Rockland County to
this measure. I came here, as many know, at
the closing hours of this session. And
unfortunately, it was a little bit too late
for me to get that done.
I did get a commitment, and all
should know, that if -- we can opt into this
in the next session. And that the -- I have
already sent letters to both county executives
of the two counties that I represent, to the
chairmen of the two legislatures that I
5906
represent, to the majority and minority
leaders of the two legislatures that I
represent, asking them to develop the home
rule legislation that I will need to get
Rockland County included into this program.
I just wanted to say that for the
record. Thank you, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: Read
the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 6. This
act shall take effect on the first day of
March.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: Call
the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: I'm
sorry, Senator LaValle.
SENATOR LAVALLE: To explain my
vote, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator LaValle, to explain his vote.
SENATOR LAVALLE: Mr. President,
much of what I wanted to say was said by
Senator Spano, who articulated the position
very, very well.
5907
But I just wanted to pick up from
what Senator Balboni talked about and
compliment Senator Marcellino for his efforts
in bringing this bill before us. It's a
positive bill. It's a bill that has many
positive things that Long Islanders and other
people who are included in this bill really
want.
Lastly, it's to his credit that he
has carried this bill. Many years ago I had
an opportunity to bring people together at a
luncheon meeting with Assemblyman DiNapoli,
the Assembly sponsor, and I thought we had
made a great deal of headway. But some of the
stakeholders got involved in this bill and
made it very difficult to negotiate and bring
this to a conclusion.
So, Senator Marcellino, you are to
be congratulated for your efforts in bringing
this bill, your stick-to-it-iveness in
bringing this bill before the house.
I vote aye, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Stachowski, to explain his vote.
SENATOR STACHOWSKI: Mr.
5908
President, in explaining my vote, I just
wanted to say the check's in the mail. I vote
no.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Stachowski will be recorded in the
negative.
Senator LaValle will be recorded in
the affirmative.
Senator Padavan.
SENATOR PADAVAN: Mr. President,
I rise to explain my vote.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Padavan, to explain his vote.
SENATOR PADAVAN: I think Senator
LaValle said it extremely well in terms of
pointing to Senator Marcellino and saying that
he did a yeoman's job in getting this bill
before us.
Is it everything we would want?
No. I don't know how many things that we do
here are. Does it cover every part of the
state? No. But at least it gives an
opportunity to move forward in a direction
that we have not been moving forward on.
On behalf of the people of New York
5909
City who are covered, all five boroughs, in
terms of the benefits of this legislation, I
thank Senator Marcellino for his hard work.
It was a very, very difficult task. Most
people don't know how difficult it was.
And so I vote aye and thank Senator
Marcellino again.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Padavan will be recorded in the
affirmative.
Senator Oppenheimer, to explain
your vote.
SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: This is a
one-house bill. That's principally the thing
I am objecting to the most.
I want to see some action on this.
It's that I have not seen action, I have not
seen the conference committee. I voted for
this bill when we had our En Con meeting,
committee meeting. I want to see something
happen.
And I do applaud Senator Marcellino
for coming -- and coming to this point. But
the fact is, it's a one-house bill. We have
no action. And what I'm praying for is some
5910
action. We need a notification bill. We need
it for the whole state. But we need it as
soon as possible.
I'm voting no.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Oppenheimer will be recorded in the
negative.
Senator Marcellino, to explain his
vote.
SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr.
Chairman, just briefly.
I would suggest that if we want
action, if we want activity, if we'd like a
better bill, the way to go -- the way not to
go is to vote against this bill. Voting
against this bill says no to protecting
two-thirds or at least offering the protection
to two-thirds of the people in this state.
Is this bill perfection, as
mentioned before? No. But by rejecting it
and calling it a detriment to the environment
I think is disingenuous at best.
I vote aye.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Marcellino will be recorded in the
5911
affirmative.
The Secretary will announce the
results. We apologize for the confusion over
Senator Markowitz's vote.
(Laughter.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Announce the results.
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 40. Nays,
20.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: The
bill is passed.
Senator Meier.
SENATOR MEIER: Mr. President, on
behalf of Senator Nozzolio, would you place a
sponsor star on Senate Bill 5590A, Calendar
1493.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: So
ordered. The bill is starred.
Senator Meier.
SENATOR MEIER: Mr. President,
could we return to the regular -- could we
return to the regular calendar -
Mr. President, could we have some
order in the chamber.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: Can we
5912
please have some order in the chamber.
Senator Meier.
SENATOR MEIER: Could we return
to the regular calendar and call up Calendar
871, please.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: The
Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
871, by Senator Lack, Senate Print 4218A, an
act to amend the Judiciary Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: Read
the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2 -
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Paterson, why do you rise?
SENATOR PATERSON: In the
briefest form possible, could Senator Lack
explain to us what the assignment of debt
known as champerty is?
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: May we
please have some quiet.
Senator Lack.
SENATOR LACK: Thank you, Mr.
President.
Mr. President, I will attempt very
5913
shortly to explain champerty. And in keeping
with the admonition I've just gotten, I will
explain it very shortly.
Champerty first became a statute in
New York in 1809. It's an archaic English
common-law title which pertains to the
purchasing of claims purely for the
commencement of lawsuits.
We are faced today with an
amendment to current Section 489 of the
Judiciary Law. The need for the amendment,
which is really a clarification in terms of
the scope of the statute, arises because of an
extant federal court proceeding and a decision
recently by Judge Sweet of the Southern
District of New York, to which we are replying
to in kind in terms of its effect on our
champerty statute.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you,
Senator.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: Read
the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
5914
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: Call
the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
the negative on Calendar Number 871 are
Senators Breslin, DeFrancisco, Farley, Kuhl,
and Nozzolio. Ayes, 55. Nays, 5.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: The
bill is passed.
Senator Larkin.
SENATOR LARKIN: Did they get us
as negative?
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: On the
last bill, Senator, you want to be recorded in
the negative?
SENATOR LARKIN: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: With
out objection.
Senator Kuhl also recorded in the
negative. Without objection, so ordered.
Senator Rath.
SENATOR RATH: I also wish to be
recorded in the negative.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: On the
5915
last bill?
SENATOR RATH: On the last bill.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Rath, without objection, will be
recorded in the negative on 871.
SENATOR GOODMAN: Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Goodman.
SENATOR GOODMAN: May I ask that
a notation be made of the fact that in the
last -- Calendar Number 1462, that my vote
should be recorded in the affirmative? I'm
not certain that I heard -- I was out of the
chamber when the roll was called. But I wish
to be recorded in the affirmative. Is that
clear?
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: With
out objection, so ordered.
SENATOR GOODMAN: Thank you,
Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
what does that make the final -- we never read
the names of the negatives, so I'm just
5916
wondering what that makes the final vote
tally.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: On
which calendar, Senator Paterson?
SENATOR PATERSON: Calendar 1462.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: The
Secretary will read the negatives on Calendar
1462 and announce the results.
THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
the negative on Calendar Number 1462 are
Senators Breslin, Connor, Dollinger, Duane,
Gonzales -- Senator Goodman going to the
affirmative -- Senators Kruger, Lachman,
Markowitz, Montgomery, Nanula, Onorato,
Oppenheimer, Paterson, Rosado, Sampson,
Schneiderman, Seabrook, Smith, and Stachowski.
Ayes, 41. Nays, 19.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Thank you,
Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: Thank
you, Senator Paterson.
Senator Meier.
SENATOR MEIER: Mr. President, is
5917
there any housekeeping at the desk?
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator McGee.
SENATOR McGEE: Mr. President, on
behalf of Senator Nozzolio, I wish to call up
his bill, Print Number 3776A, recalled from
the Assembly, which is now at the desk.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: The
Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
578, by Senator Nozzolio, Senate Print 3776A,
an act to amend the Executive Law.
SENATOR McGEE: Mr. President, I
now move to reconsider the vote by which this
bill was passed.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: The
Secretary will call the roll on
reconsideration.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 60.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator McGee.
SENATOR McGEE: Mr. President, I
now offer the following amendments.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: The
5918
amendments are received.
Senator McGee.
SENATOR McGEE: Mr. President, on
page Number 33 I offer the following
amendments to Calendar Number 1068, on behalf
of Senator LaValle, Senate Print 5206B, and
ask that said bill retain its place on the
Third Reading Calendar.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: The
amendments are received, and the bill will
retain its place on Third Reading Calendar.
SENATOR McGEE: Thank you, Mr.
President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Meier.
SENATOR MEIER: Mr. President, if
there are any substitutions, could we have
those at this time, please.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: The
Secretary will read the substitutions.
THE SECRETARY: On page 22,
Senator Volker moves to discharge, from the
Committee on Rules, Assembly Bill 6238 and
substitute it for the identical third reading,
810.
5919
On page 30, Senator Volker moves to
discharge, from the Committee on Rules,
Assembly Bill 8561A and substitute it for the
identical third reading, 991.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Substitutions ordered.
Senator Mendez.
SENATOR MENDEZ: Mr. President,
there will be a Minority conference tomorrow
at 10:00 a.m. in Room 314.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: There
will be a Minority conference tomorrow at
10:00 a.m. in Room 134.
Senator Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Oh, I just
wanted to wish you a good evening,
Mr. President.
(Laughter.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: Thank
you, Senator Paterson.
Again, we apologize for the
confusion caused by Senator Markowitz.
(Laughter.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ:
Senator Meier.
5920
SENATOR MEIER: Mr. President,
there will be a meeting of the Rules Committee
tomorrow morning at 9:30 a.m. in the Majority
Conference Room. That will be followed at
10:00 a.m. by a meeting of the Majority
conference.
And at this time, there being no
further business, I move the Senate stand
adjourned until Thursday, June 17th, at
10:30 a.m.
ACTING PRESIDENT MAZIARZ: There
will be a meeting of the Rules Committee
tomorrow morning at 9:30 a.m. in Room 332.
There will be a Majority conference
at 10:00 a.m. in Room 332.
Without objection, the Senate
stands adjourned until 10:30 tomorrow,
June 17th.
(Whereupon, at 8:09 p.m., the
Senate adjourned.)