Regular Session - March 6, 2000
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NEW YORK STATE SENATE
THE STENOGRAPHIC RECORD
ALBANY, NEW YORK
March 6, 2000
3:15 p.m.
REGULAR SESSION
LT. GOVERNOR MARY O. DONOHUE, President
STEVEN M. BOGGESS, Secretary
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P R O C E E D I N G S
THE PRESIDENT: The Senate will
come to order.
I ask everyone present to please
rise and repeat with me the Pledge of
Allegiance.
(Whereupon, the assemblage recited
the Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag.)
THE PRESIDENT: With us today to
give the invocation is the Reverend Peter G.
Young, from Blessed Sacrament Church in
Bolton Landing, New York.
REVEREND YOUNG: Let us pray.
Dear God, as we enjoy this
beautiful March sunshine and Your gift of good
fortune, we continue to seek Your love and
guidance on our Senators and their staffs. We
gather to dedicate our representative efforts
for the benefit of our New York State citizens
with Your blessings and love.
We ask You this in Your name.
Amen.
THE PRESIDENT: Reading of the
Journal.
THE SECRETARY: In Senate,
1006
Saturday, March 4th, the Senate met pursuant
to adjournment. The Journal of Friday,
March 3rd, was read and approved. On motion,
Senate adjourned.
THE PRESIDENT: Without
objection, the Journal stands approved as
read.
Presentation of petitions.
Messages from the Assembly.
Message from the Governor.
Reports of standing committees.
The Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Senator Hoffmann,
from the Committee on Agriculture, reports:
Senate Print 1824, by Senator Kuhl,
an act to amend the Agriculture and Markets
Law;
1888, by Senator Padavan, an act to
amend the Agriculture and Markets Law;
2728, by Senator Kuhl, an act to
amend the Agriculture and Markets Law and the
Vehicle and Traffic Law;
And 2729, by Senator Kuhl, an act
to amend the Agriculture and Markets Law.
All bills ordered direct to third
1007
reading.
THE PRESIDENT: Without
objection, all bills reported direct to Third
Reading.
Reports of select committees.
Communications and reports from
state officers.
Motions and resolutions.
Senator Fuschillo.
SENATOR FUSCHILLO: Thank you,
Madam President.
On behalf of Senator Maltese, I
move that the following bill be discharged
from its respective committee and be
recommitted with instructions to strike the
enacting clause: Senate Print Number 5595A.
THE PRESIDENT: So ordered.
Senator Fuschillo.
SENATOR FUSCHILLO: Thank you,
Madam President. Amendments are offered to
the following Third Reading Calendar bills:
Sponsored by Senator Seward, page
9, Calendar Number 85, Senate Print 5207;
Senator Nozzolio, page number 12,
Calendar Number 158, Senate Print Number 5108;
1008
Senator Nozzolio, page number 19,
Calendar Number 248, Senate Print Number
6282A;
Senator Marchi, page number 27,
Calendar Number 346, Senate Print Number 2618;
And Senator Meier, page number 10,
Calendar Number 103, Senate Print Number 5853.
I now move that these bills retain
their place on the order of third reading.
THE PRESIDENT: So ordered.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Madam President,
if we could take up the noncontroversial
calendar.
THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary
will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
22, by Senator Volker, Senate Print 103A, an
act to amend the Penal Law, in relation to
loitering.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect on the first day of
November.
1009
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 42. Nays,
1. Senator Duane recorded in the negative.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
43, by Senator Alesi, Senate Print 3485A, an
act to amend the State Administrative
Procedure Act, in relation to adjudicatory
proceedings.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 6. This
act shall take effect on the 180th day.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 44.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
99, by Senator Hannon, Senate Print 6097A, an
act to amend the Public Health Law and the
Insurance Law, in relation -
SENATOR DUANE: Lay it aside.
1010
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is laid
aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
206, by Senator Skelos, Senate Print 1075, an
act to amend the Social Services Law -
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Lay it aside.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is laid
aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
254, by Senator Hannon, Senate Print 813, an
act to amend the Criminal Procedure Law, in
relation to imposing plea bargaining
limitations.
SENATOR CONNOR: Lay it aside.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is laid
aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
306, by Senator McGee, Senate Print 2451, an
act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in
relation to requiring school bus and other
motor vehicle drivers involved in personal
injury accidents involving school buses.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
1011
act shall take effect on the first day of
September.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 43. Nays,
1. Senator Duane recorded in the negative.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
328, by Senator Fuschillo, Senate Print 561,
an act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law,
in relation to requiring certain information
on disabled children.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect on the 180th day.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 44.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
329, by Senator Fuschillo, Senate Print 562B,
an act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law,
1012
in relation to criminal-history checks.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last -
SENATOR DUANE: Lay it aside.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is laid
aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
330, by Senator Goodman, Senate Print 790, an
act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in
relation to restricting bus drivers from
working with suspended licenses.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This
act shall take effect immediately.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 44.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
331, by Senator Bruno, Senate Print 908, an
act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in
relation to the disqualification of a bus
driver in certain instances.
SENATOR CONNOR: Lay it aside.
1013
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is laid
aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
332, by Senator Bruno, Senate Print 909A, an
act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in
relation to drivers of small school buses.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect in 180 days.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 44.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
333, by Senator Johnson, Senate Print 977A, an
act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law and
the Education Law, in relation to the
receiving and discharging of passengers.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect September 1.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
1014
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 44.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
334, by Senator Skelos, Senate Print 1020, an
act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in
relation to requiring school bus drivers to
insure all passengers have left the bus prior
to exiting.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect on the first day of
September.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 43. Nays,
1. Senator Duane recorded in the negative.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
335, by Senator Trunzo, Senate Print 1076B, an
act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in
relation to increasing penalties.
1015
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect in 90 days.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 44.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
336, by Senator Trunzo, Senate Print 3278, an
act in relation to requiring the Commissioners
of Motor Vehicles, Transportation and
Education to develop a uniform definition.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 44.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
337, by Senator Trunzo, Senate Print 4753A, an
1016
act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law and
the Education Law, in relation to instruction
for school bus drivers.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 44.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
338, by Senator Trunzo, Senate Print 5561, an
act in relation to requiring the Governor's
Traffic Safety Committee to study the effects.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 46.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
1017
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
345, by Senator Marchi, Senate Print 1639B, an
act to amend the Education Law and the Vehicle
and Traffic Law, in relation to prohibiting
standing passengers on school buses.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect on the 90th day.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 46.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Gentile.
SENATOR GENTILE: Yes, Madam
President, just to explain my vote on Number
345, Calendar Number 345.
I just note that my good colleague
from Staten Island, Senator Marchi, is the
sponsor of this bill, along with Assemblyman
Vitaliano in the Assembly, also a member of
the Staten Island delegation. It looks as if
today is a school bus safety day.
And I just want to state for the
record not only my vote in the affirmative on
this bill but on the others. And given the
1018
circumstances as it is in the Senate, had I
the opportunity to go on as a sponsor of this
bill, I would have been a sponsor in the
Senate.
But nevertheless, I want to have
Senator Marchi know and the people of Staten
Island know that I am fully in support of this
measure.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Gentile,
you will be so recorded as voting in the
affirmative.
The bill is passed.
Senator Skelos, that completes the
reading of the noncontroversial calendar.
SENATOR SKELOS: Madam President,
if we could take up the controversial
calendar.
THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary
will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
99, by Senator Hannon, Senate Print 6097A, an
act to amend the Public Health Law and the
Insurance Law, in relation to health
maintenance organization.
SENATOR DUANE: Explanation,
1019
please.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Hannon,
an explanation has been requested.
SENATOR HANNON: This bill is a
technical amendment to a chapter that was
signed last year. It just makes sure that
some of the provisions in regard to the
Insurance Law for the hospitals covered by the
bill would be properly adhered to.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 46.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
206, by Senator Skelos, Senate Print 1075, an
act to amend the Social Services Law and the
Family Court Act, in relation to proof of a
neglected or abused child.
SENATOR DUANE: Explanation,
please.
1020
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Skelos,
an explanation has been requested.
SENATOR SKELOS: Star the bill.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
withdrawn.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
254, by Senator Hannon, Senate Print 813, an
act to amend the Criminal Procedure Law, in
relation to imposing plea bargaining
limitations.
SENATOR DUANE: Explanation,
please.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Hannon,
an explanation has been requested.
SENATOR HANNON: Yes, Madam
President.
This amends the Criminal Procedure
Law to prevent an offense defined as a
pedophilic offense -- and which is a felony -
from being plea-bargained down to a
misdemeanor.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: Sorry, Madam
President. With all apologies, it was
incredibly difficult to hear that. I'm
1021
wondering if the sponsor would repeat that.
There was a lot of background noise, and I
couldn't hear it.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Hannon,
could you repeat your explanation, please.
And I'll ask that (striking gavel).
SENATOR HANNON: The bill would
take certain offenses, felony offenses that
are defined in the Penal Law, separated out by
the bill, and call them pedophilic offenses,
and prevent those offenses from being
plea-bargained down to a misdemeanor.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: Madam President,
would the sponsor yield to a few questions?
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Hannon,
will you yield for two questions?
SENATOR HANNON: Two questions?
Whatever the number is, yes.
THE PRESIDENT: Go ahead, Senator
Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you, Madam
President. I actually said "a few."
THE PRESIDENT: Well, you had
that authorization. Go ahead.
1022
SENATOR DUANE: Two would be a
couple. "A few" is more.
I'm wondering if the sponsor shares
the belief that district attorneys may need to
have some leeway in deciding what plea should
be put forward and whether or not there would
be more flexibility in having a plea bargain.
And that we might be better served to trust
district attorneys to have that leeway.
SENATOR HANNON: District
attorneys, in implementing their discretionary
authority, do so in light of the public policy
that we set on a statewide basis.
And in this case, I believe this
would be a certain statement that a limitation
of that general ability should be put in law.
SENATOR DUANE: Through you,
Madam President, if the sponsor would continue
to yield.
THE PRESIDENT: Go ahead, Senator
Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: Is it not true,
though, that there are times when a plea is
used because though a defendant may have
committed a terrible, terrible crime which we
1023
believe should be punished, that the evidence
may not be strong enough, particularly in
light of what the person that had been
perpetrated upon, or the child who was
perpetrated upon, in terms of what testimony
they may give may not be strong enough to get
a felony, and thus a lesser charge, in a
district attorney's opinion, may be a charge
which could stick with the testimony which may
be elicited from a child?
SENATOR HANNON: The premise
inherent in your question is something I
reject. I believe that far too often under
such an excuse, but really because of the
pressure of cases, they take plea bargaining.
And I think in this case the
protection of our youth demand that there not
be such a reduction in sentence.
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you, Madam
President. If I may speak on the bill.
THE PRESIDENT: On the bill,
Senator Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: I'm very
concerned about taking away the discretion
from district attorneys when prosecuting these
1024
terrible crimes. I'm very concerned that
there may be a time or there may be now
occurrences when a district attorney, because
they are forced to only go for a felony, would
have to drop the case altogether. And I don't
believe that that is in the best interest of
justice.
So because of these reasons, I'm
encouraging my colleagues to vote no on this,
to trust district attorneys to get the best
possible case prosecuted and to get the
highest level of justice and punishment put
forward in these dreadful, heinous cases.
Thank you, Madam President.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 6. This
act shall take effect on the first day of
November.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 47. Nays,
1. Senator Duane recorded in the negative.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
1025
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
329, by Senator Fuschillo, Senate Print 562B,
an act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law,
in relation to criminal-history checks on
school bus attendants.
SENATOR DUANE: Explanation,
please.
SENATOR FUSCHILLO: Thank you,
Madam President.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator
Fuschillo, an explanation has been requested.
SENATOR FUSCHILLO: Thank you,
Madam President.
Current law enacted in 1985
required school bus drivers to have criminal
background checks -- but only permitted, did
not require, the same for school bus
attendants.
This legislation would mirror that
and require background checks for school bus
attendants.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you, Madam
President. Would the sponsor yield to a few
questions?
1026
THE PRESIDENT: A few, rather
than two, Senator Duane?
SENATOR DUANE: It's actually
three.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator
Fuschillo, would you yield for three
questions?
SENATOR FUSCHILLO: I'd be happy
to.
THE PRESIDENT: Go ahead, Senator
Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you very
much.
I'm wondering why it is that in
these background checks that the bus drivers
will have to pay for the service.
SENATOR FUSCHILLO: The school
bus attendants, not the bus drivers.
SENATOR DUANE: Excuse me.
SENATOR FUSCHILLO: That's the
way it was written originally, Senator, for
school bus drivers. We've just mirrored the
legislation and changed the law from
"permitted" to "require."
And a review of the 2500 school bus
1027
attendants that there are in New York State
have shown that the school districts have
picked up the cost.
SENATOR DUANE: Through you,
Madam President.
SENATOR BRUNO: Go ahead, Senator
Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: Does the sponsor
know whether or not the state has
traditionally picked up the fee for these kind
of background checks?
SENATOR FUSCHILLO: For school
bus drivers? School bus drivers? Yes, they
have.
SENATOR DUANE: And do you know
when it is that there was a shift in policy
towards school bus personnel being asked to
pay the freight, so to speak?
SENATOR FUSCHILLO: You're
confusing me. School bus drivers or school
bus attendants?
SENATOR DUANE: Well, now I'm
talking about a general policy for anyone that
works in a -
SENATOR FUSCHILLO: No, I don't
1028
know.
SENATOR DUANE: If the sponsor
will continue to yield.
THE PRESIDENT: I believe this is
your third question. Go ahead, Senator Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: Uh-oh.
Does the sponsor know how much the
fee is and how many school districts in New
York State have implemented this policy?
I combined it into an A and a B, 3A
and 3B.
SENATOR FUSCHILLO: The fee is
$79 for a criminal background check.
And the majority of -- we have not
contacted all the school districts throughout
New York State that are hiring school bus
attendants, but our review has showed
approximately 90 percent of them are absorbing
the cost.
So there's no cost. There was no
cost that we saw to any applicant who wants to
be a school bus attendant.
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you, Madam
President.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
1029
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect on the 90th day.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 47. Nays,
2. Senators Duane and Smith recorded in the
negative.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
The record will reflect that
Calendar Number 206, Senate Bill Number 1075,
has been starred by the sponsor.
The Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
331, by Senator Bruno, Senate Print 908, an
act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in
relation to the disqualification of a bus
driver in certain instances.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 4.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN:
Explanation.
SENATOR STAVISKY: Explanation,
1030
please.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Skelos,
an explanation has been requested.
SENATOR SKELOS: Just lay the
bill aside temporarily.
Is there any housekeeping at the
desk?
THE PRESIDENT: The bill has been
laid aside temporarily, Senator.
Senator, there's a privilege
resolution by Senator LaValle.
SENATOR SKELOS: I don't think
we're quite ready for that yet.
THE PRESIDENT: There's nothing
other than that, Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: We'll stand at
ease.
THE PRESIDENT: The Senate stands
at ease.
(Whereupon, the Senate stood at
ease at 3:35 p.m.)
(Whereupon, the Senate reconvened
at 3:37 p.m.)
SENATOR BRUNO: Madam President.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Bruno.
1031
SENATOR BRUNO: Can we at this
time call up Calendar Number 331.
THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary
will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
331, by Senator Bruno, Senate Print 908, an
act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in
relation to the disqualification of a bus
driver in certain instances.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN:
Explanation.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Bruno, an
explanation has been requested.
SENATOR BRUNO: Madam President
and colleagues, this is a bill that we have
done before in this chamber. And it really
calls for the disqualification of a bus driver
who tests positive for the use of drugs.
And I know there's a concern that
someone might inadvertently be tested
positive. And for a person to lose their
license is a very serious thing, and I
recognize that.
But if you take a look at the way
that testing is done, it pretty much
1032
eliminates the possibility of errors. Because
when there's an infraction, an alleged
infraction, a specimen is taken, a urine
specimen. It is separated into two parts.
One part is put in reserve, and the other part
is sent for testing.
If it tests positive, then the
employee is notified that that's the case, and
the employer is not. And the employee has 72
hours to petition and appeal that there's some
error. Because sometimes they may be taking
medication or something that could affect them
in a negative way.
If they want to appeal, the second
part of the same specimen is then sent to a
totally independent and separate lab. If that
comes back positive, the employer is notified,
and they are then dismissed.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator
Schneiderman.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Madam
President, if the sponsor would yield to a
couple of questions -- a few questions, excuse
me.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Bruno,
1033
will you yield to a few questions?
SENATOR BRUNO: Yes, Madam
President.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Through
you, Madam President.
THE PRESIDENT: Go ahead,
Senator.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: I
appreciate the description of the two-part
sampling process. Could the sponsor identify
where in the bill that process is specified to
require that you follow the procedure in
dividing the sample in two parts that's
provided here?
SENATOR BRUNO: Pardon? Is it
required in the law?
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Where in
the bill does it require this procedure you
just talked about?
SENATOR BRUNO: It is federal law
that that procedure takes place. And what
we're doing dovetails with the federal law so
it becomes one.
So you are correct in that it is
not specified, but it is present in federal
1034
law.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: And can I
ask what -- through you, Madam President -
what federal law provides for that? Because
I'm unaware of it, and it's not cited in the
memos that I've got on the bill.
SENATOR BRUNO: I believe it's
Title 49, but don't hold me to that. We might
ask Senator Connor if he might be more of a -
I think it's Title 49.
Senator Onorato agrees with me, so
it must be right.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Through
you, Madam President.
THE PRESIDENT: Thank you,
Senator.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: And
coaching from over here not allowed, George.
I have here Part 382 of Title 49,
which are the regulations at issue. And I
will be glad to hand them along. They do not
provide for the two-part test that you've just
identified, articulated, and which frankly
sound likes a pretty good system to me.
So I am -- if there's some other
1035
provision that we should be looking at, as far
as I can tell, it's not in the state law and
it's not in the federal regulations that have
been cited. Is there someplace else we should
look?
SENATOR BRUNO: Many times in
this chamber we depend on our very learned
counsel. My counsel is the most learned.
(Laughter.)
SENATOR BRUNO: And my most
learned counsel tells me that it is definitely
in the federal law, and that's why other than
three or four of your colleagues last year
supported this legislation.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Well,
through you, Madam President, I'm not going to
get into the dispute about my counsel being
more learned than yours.
But let me move on to another
issue. You've identified a two-part process
which sounds pretty good, based on a single
sample. What about the innocent bus driver
where a sample itself is flawed? You're
talking about dividing up a sample. But if
the sample is flawed, is there any remedy in
1036
this bill or the federal regulations for that
bus driver?
You just ate a bunch of rum raisin
ice cream, and for some reason it shows up
positive in the sample. Is there any remedy
for that?
SENATOR BRUNO: I believe that
with the 72-hour time frame that this calls
for, if an individual that has been accused is
aware and will seek whatever remedy that that
individual can -- whether it's a physician
that had prescribed, or whatever the resource
might be -- that they can avail themselves of
whatever protection they think is appropriate.
And again, Senator, I share your
concern. This is not intended to put bus
drivers who are innocent out of a job. But
I'm sure, Senator, that you agree that our
most valuable possessions are our youngsters.
And we have had instance after instance in
this state where we have had accidents, we
have had people who have been tested positive
with drinking, they end up back on the job,
they've been tested positive with drugs, they
end up back on the job, only to hurt young
1037
people or potentially hurt them again. That's
what this is all about.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Through
you, again, Madam President.
I am -- did not -- again, I -- it
may be in there, I don't see it, either in -
if the Senator could identify where in this
bill or in the federal regulations the 72-hour
provision is found. Because I don't see that
in either of them.
SENATOR BRUNO: I believe it's in
Part 382 of the regulations.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Through
you, Madam President. Actually, let me,
speaking on the bill, thank the sponsor -
SENATOR BRUNO: Thank you.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: -- and
Senator Onorato as well.
The -- on the bill. I have Part
382 of the regulations here. I think Senator
Bruno is correct in stating the obvious,
nobody wants anyone under the influence of
drugs or alcohol driving a school bus. I have
a daughter in private school. That's the last
thing anybody wants.
1038
However, I think this is something
we should be able to fix. This came up last
year, and I don't think it's been corrected
since then. I honestly do not believe that
the provisions that you have identified are in
either this bill or in the federal
regulations. I think it's something that we
should deal with.
Furthermore, in the current
regulations, anytime a school bus driver fails
a random drug or alcohol test, he immediately
is referred to a substance abuse treatment
program and is taken off the job automatically
for six months, has to undergo extensive
additional random drug and alcohol tests, and
has a provision to challenge the sample and
the finding.
I think that this bill, while
well-intentioned, can do a lot of
unintentional harm. I think that the
provisions of it that would do the harm can be
fixed. And I do think that we should fix it
before we pass this legislation.
Thank you.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
1039
section.
Senator Stavisky.
SENATOR STAVISKY: I just want to
explain my vote.
THE PRESIDENT: Go ahead,
Senator.
SENATOR STAVISKY: I'm going to
vote no. The sponsor was asked if there were
any provisions for an individual who either
failed or obtained a false positive reading.
And the lack of a second-chance opportunity to
reevaluate the false positive reading troubles
me very much.
If there were something in the bill
that provided for a remedy, for an appeals
process, then I would be happy to vote for it,
because I think we all agree on the need for
this legislation. But I vote no.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator, you will
be recorded as voting in the negative.
Read the last section.
Senator Lachman.
SENATOR LACHMAN: Thank you,
Madam Chair.
On this bill, my problem, Senator
1040
Bruno, is I don't think it goes far enough.
In analyzing a measure such as this, there is
a possibility -- and I think it exists here -
that what Senator Bruno is attempting to do is
a very worthwhile goal and objective. But
there's more to it than just punitive
measures.
Over the last few months, Senator
Oppenheimer -- who as you know is the ranking
member of the Education Committee -- and I
have sent questionnaires, with the aid of our
distinguished Senate Minority staff and
counsel, to approximately -- oh, I would say,
approximately 750 school districts in the
state of New York.
Surprisingly -- and for anyone who
sends out a survey in academic life, if you
get a 3 or 5 or 10 percent return, it's
considered to be excellent. We received a
75 percent return from school boards
throughout the length of the state. We also
included 150 bus companies in this response.
And there is no question that the
issue that you raise is important. And I am
not going to oppose your bill. But I am only
1041
saying that there are other things and other
issues, of a nonpunitive nature, that could
lead to greater safety for our most precious
possession, our children.
Now, the school boards have made a
suggestion -- and through you, Madam Chair, I
would like to have the Majority Leader's
opinion on the suggestion -- of the
possibility -
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Bruno, do
you yield to a question?
SENATOR BRUNO: Yes, Madam
President.
THE PRESIDENT: All right. Go
ahead, Senator Lachman. Do you have a
question?
SENATOR LACHMAN: -- the
possibility of dividing the commercial
driver's license and separating a driver of a
school bus from the driver of a truck.
That does not exist today. Many of
these school boards responded that there are
insufficient funds available to hire competent
school bus drivers. And it's a different
issue from that of truck drivers.
1042
SENATOR BRUNO: Thank you,
Senator. And I think that's something that we
ought to look at. As you noted, that is not
on this particular bill, but it's something
additional that we can do to help provide for
the safety of our children.
As you know, and we agree with you,
there are other things we can do that are
nonpunitive but helpful. I think Senator
Trunzo's bill that passed earlier relates to
training, additional training, indoctrination
of safety measures for drivers. That's a very
positive thing.
So I agree with you, and I think
that's something that we ought to look at and
take a very serious look at.
SENATOR LACHMAN: Through you,
Madam Chair, will the Majority Leader yield
for one more question?
SENATOR BRUNO: Yes, Madam
President.
THE PRESIDENT: Go ahead, Senator
Lachman.
SENATOR LACHMAN: In light of the
evidence of this report and this study -- and
1043
it will be made available to the Majority
leadership -- is it not wiser for us to
perhaps have a larger bill where not only one
test but several tests leading to the safety
and security of our children are included?
SENATOR BRUNO: Senator, as you
know, we had hearings all over the state on
this issue of school bus safety. I think it
was one of the most successful things that we
have done in terms of getting input. And
there were more things that people had
recommended, recognized that we ought to
contemplate and look at. And we're going to
continue to do that.
But today we are dealing with these
14 bills that you have before you. And I am
concerned with this particular one which
passed this house before, and you indicate
that you will support, and I would like to
conclude the discussion on this, take action
on this, and then at your leisure, ours, and
others', discuss the merits of other
proposals.
SENATOR LACHMAN: Thank you.
SENATOR BRUNO: Thank you,
1044
Senator.
SENATOR LACHMAN: Thank you.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator
Oppenheimer.
SENATOR OPPENHEIMER: Well,
Senator Lachman really spoke to most of the
issues that interested us. And we do want to
share this with you, and we are pleased to
hear that the Majority Leader is going to look
at some of these suggestions that we have,
because we did get a wonderful response.
And I guess the main issue really
was it's so hard to find workers, to find
people who qualify. And the point that was
brought up by Senator Lachman, which is we
ought to have a separate licensing
procedure -- I'm not talking loud enough -- we
have to have a separate licensing procedure
for them, because the commercial driver's
license, the requirements, are quite different
whether you're a truck driver or a school bus
driver.
Another problem we found is low
wages. And we have seen that some of the
school districts have tried to advertise in a
1045
variety of ways, from radio to newspapers, and
they are not having much success. They also
have tried television.
And therefore, we have to do
something to improve the -- I think the pay
and the conditions. Part of the problem was
also that this work is part-time. And in this
economy where we have so few people who are
not fully employed, it's very hard to find
part-time workers. Perhaps we could find some
work that they could do in conjunction with
this part-time work of driving the school bus.
But these are just a couple more of
our ideas. And I'm happy that you'll be
looking at it, and I will be supporting this
bill.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This
act shall take effect immediately.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Hevesi,
to explain your vote?
SENATOR HEVESI: No, Madam
President, I have a question for the sponsor,
if he would be so kind as to yield.
1046
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Bruno,
will you yield for a question?
SENATOR BRUNO: Yes, Madam
President.
THE PRESIDENT: Go ahead, Senator
Hevesi.
SENATOR HEVESI: Thank you.
Senator Bruno, I voted for this
legislation last year, and I intend to vote
for it again today. I wish there were some
more safeguards in the bill, but I very much
like the concept here and what you're trying
to do.
I want to bring a situation to your
attention that I -- I don't sit on the Senate
Transportation Committee, or I would have done
it in the committee. But as it directly
pertains to this bill, there is a loophole
currently in the law where, if we knew about
it in time, I believe we would have been able
to amend this bill. And I would even ask if
you would consider amending this bill for the
following situation.
It happened two months ago in a
courtroom in Kings County, where a gentleman
1047
who was a school bus driver in the New York
City public school system was arrested on a
domestic violence charge. And during the
course of the trial, based on the
circumstances of his arrest, it came out that
he was a regular user of marijuana, including
on days when he was transporting students to
and from school, admittedly by evidence that
was brought into the court and by his own
testimony.
But the charges on which he was
ultimately convicted did not mandate his
dismissal as a school bus driver, and the
district attorney's office was unable, under
current law, to inform the Board of Education
of this individual's propensity to use
marijuana.
So I would suggest to you that we
should have something in the law which
suggests that if that kind of information is
available, that that individual be subject to
a drug test immediately, by whatever school
district that bus driver serves in, so that we
can prevent -- and this gentleman is out there
today, I'm convinced, transporting students,
1048
though he used to smoke marijuana and probably
still does.
I'd just like to get your comment
on that. It's a bad situation. I think we
can fix it.
SENATOR BRUNO: I agree with you,
that's a terrible situation.
And of course this legislation
becoming law, that individual would not be
driving the bus, wouldn't be able to drive the
bus, because they would lose their license -
and then whatever other criminal penalties
would ensue from the use of drugs, illegal use
of drugs. That person might be a maintenance
person, might still work for the school
district, but would not be able to drive a
bus.
So I think that's why it's
important that we have the support in the
other house, see if we can't get this passed
and get it into law.
SENATOR HEVESI: Madam President,
one following question.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Bruno,
will you yield for an additional question?
1049
SENATOR BRUNO: Yes, Madam
President.
THE PRESIDENT: Go ahead, Senator
Hevesi.
SENATOR HEVESI: Senator Bruno,
the situation that I just outlined, the
problem with that situation is the individual
was never drug-tested. And there is no
compelling authority to make that individual
undergo a drug test, even though he had
admitted in open court.
That's the problem that I'm seeking
to address here.
SENATOR BRUNO: He was convicted,
I thought you said. Wasn't he convicted?
SENATOR HEVESI: Of a non-drug
offense. A domestic violence charge that does
not warrant his testing for narcotics or his
dismissal as a school bus driver.
So he very well likely is out there
driving kids today. That's the problem.
SENATOR BRUNO: I understand now
what your question is. And that particular
situation, you're right, isn't covered in what
we're doing. But it covers specifically a
1050
driver who may have been in an accident or was
randomly tested.
And that's the situation that we
should look at, as we're looking at so many
other things.
SENATOR HEVESI: Thank you.
SENATOR BRUNO: We're going to be
in session, I hope, Madam President and
Senators, until at least June 15th, which is
our date to adjourn, I think on the 16th. And
so we'll have plenty of time to talk about and
look at some other meaningful things to ensure
the safety of our young people.
So we welcome your support.
SENATOR HEVESI: Thank you.
Madam President, briefly on the
bill.
THE PRESIDENT: On the bill,
Senator Hevesi.
SENATOR HEVESI: Thank you.
I commend Senator Bruno on this
legislation. I support it, though again I
wish there were more safeguards in there. And
I'm very much pleased that you will entertain
possible legislation to close this loophole,
1051
which right now is a glaring loophole in the
law and is quite obviously compromising the
safety and security of schoolchildren in New
York State.
This is one of those clear-cut
examples: Here's the problem, here's the
solution. Let's do it and get it done.
Thank you, Madam President.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator
Dollinger.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Thank you,
Madam President. I promise the president I'll
be extremely brief.
This is the perfect kind of bill,
this whole package of bills, the 14 bills that
we did, that we should send off to a joint
conference committee. I know that many of my
colleagues have signed a joint conference
committee letter. It ought to be a part of
law.
These bills, which we seem to do
year after year after year, which embody the
ideas that Senator Hevesi talks about, Senator
Bruno talks about, they're a whole batch of
great ideas to protect kids that get on school
1052
buses. Why can't we make them laws? Let's
have a joint conference committee about school
bus safety, let's do it, let's get it done
this year before the 16th of June. We can do
it if we're prepared to have joint conference
committees that really work.
I'd welcome Senator Bruno telling
the Speaker that we'll have a joint conference
committee about school bus safety. Let's take
the ideas and make them law. The only way to
do it is to do it through a joint conference
committee. It's easy.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This
act shall take effect immediately.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
the negative on Calendar Number 331 are
Senators Duane, Markowitz, Santiago,
Schneiderman, Smith, and Stavisky. Ayes, 45.
Nays, 6.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
1053
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: I believe that
completes the calendar for today. And if we
could go back to motions and resolutions,
there's a privilege resolution, 3256, at the
desk, by Senator LaValle. May we please have
it read in its entirety and move for its
immediate adoption.
THE PRESIDENT: You're correct,
Senator, that does complete the reading of the
controversial calendar.
Motions and resolutions.
The Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: By Senator
LaValle, Legislation Resolution Number 3256
welcoming the members of a delegation
representing the University of Messina,
Sicily, upon the occasion of their visit to
the New York State Senate on Monday, March 6,
2000.
"WHEREAS, It is the sense of this
Legislative Body to recognize those
organizations and institutions which represent
the rich cultural heritage of the citizens of
the State of New York; and
1054
"WHEREAS, This Legislative Body is
honored to welcome the members of a delegation
representing the University of Messina,
Sicily, upon the occasion of their visit to
the New York State Senate on Monday, March 6,
2000; and
"WHEREAS, Today, all over Italy
there is a strong interest in Italian-American
affairs. Italians have become interested in
the social, economic, and political
achievements of Italian-Americans and are
taking steps to strengthen the cultural ties
with them.
"In February 1999, under the
initiative of Dr. Marcello Saija, a professor
at the University of Messina, the Museum on
Emigration was inaugurated on the island of
Salina. It was an important event for Sicily
and the surrounding small islands because it
offered the general public the occasion to
begin reexamination of Italian emigration, a
social phenomenon that profoundly affected
life in southern Italy.
"A delegation from the University
of Messina has traveled to New York to explore
1055
possibilities for student exchanges and
cooperation for cultural enrichment programs,
as well as support for the collection of
material for the Museum on Emigration in
Salina; and
"WHEREAS, The delegation from the
University of Messina, led by Professor
Gaetano Silvestri, President of the
University, includes the following members:
Professor Gaetano Silvestri, President of the
University of Messina and one of Italy's most
accredited scholars of constitutional law,
well-known abroad for his studies on the
electoral systems. On several occasions, he
was appointed by the Italian Parliament to the
Superior Council of the Justice and to several
committees for institutional reforms. Today
he is a scholar of constitutional law for the
Law School at the University of Messina; and
"WHEREAS, Professor Marcella
Fortino Silvestri, wife of the president, is a
scholar in family law at the University of
Messina and author of several scholarly works
on this subject which have been adopted as
texts at several Italian law schools. She is
1056
now Director of the Juridical Studies Program
in the Department of Political Science at the
University of Messina.
"Professor Giuseppe Butta, Dean of
the Political Science Division at the
University of Messina, is a well-known scholar
in political philosophy. He has done much
research on the American constitutional system
and has many contacts with universities
throughout the United States. His recent
visit to the United States was to present the
English edition of Rosmini's writings. He is
a scholar and full professor of the History of
Political Doctrines at the University of
Messina.
"Dr. Silvana Broccio Butta, wife of
the dean, teaches Italian literature at the
Scientific 'Liceo' Salvatore Quasimodo of
Messina. She is also very much involved in
environmental issues and, on this matter, is
associated with various agencies throughout
Italy; and
"WHEREAS, Professor Marcello Saija,
Director of the International Political
Studies Program at the University of Messina,
1057
an historian, has done extensive research on
the Yugoslavia of the 1900s. He is also a
scholar of the crisis of the 'Italian liberal
state' and the advent of Fascism. His most
famous publication is a volume on the role of
the Italian prefects during the political
crisis that brought the Fascist regime.
Currently he holds the chair of History of
Political Institutions at the University of
Messina and also directs the University's
Program in Social Services in the city of
Modica (Ragusa); and
"WHEREAS, Dr. Laura Saija, daughter
of Professor Saija, holds a degree in civil
engineering and is interested in urban
problems; now, therefore, be it
"RESOLVED, That this Legislative
Body pause in its deliberations to welcome the
members of a delegation representing the
University of Messina, Sicily, upon the
occasion of their visit to the New York State
Senate on Monday, March 6, 2000; and be it
further
"RESOLVED, That copies of this
Resolution, suitably engrossed, be transmitted
1058
to the members of the delegation from the
University of Messina, Sicily."
THE PRESIDENT: Senator LaValle.
SENATOR LAVALLE: Thank you,
Madam President.
Last year I had the very rare
opportunity to travel to Sicily, with
Assemblyman DiNapoli, to visit the University
of Messina and other parts of Sicily. It was
a trip that I was quite excited about, because
my grandfather came from Messina.
And I didn't realize how much of an
emotional and uplifting and wonderful trip it
was to visit Messina and be in various places
and see the customs and the foods that our
family had adopted once my grandparents had
gotten to this country.
The University of Messina is a
comprehensive university and is well thought
of in Italy.
I was accompanied on that trip by
Dr. Mario Mignone, who is the architect of the
Center for Italian Studies Program at the
State University at Stony Brook. Professor
Mignone was very helpful in bringing about
1059
bringing the parties together so that we could
talk about student exchanges, cultural
exchanges.
But there was one other piece. And
during that trip we were accompanied by Peter
Galluzzo from my district, who has a home on
Salina, and whose family had a rather large
home there. And Mr. Galluzzo donated that
home to the university, and a museum has been
set up to study emigration.
It is very important that we as
members -- and I know many members in this
chamber travel to other places to establish
relationships, exchange programs, and so
forth.
I would like to introduce, as we
welcome this delegation, Professor Giuseppe
Butta. Professor Butta, if you'll just -
Professor Marcello Saija. Marcello.
Professor Silvana Broccio Butta. Dr. Laura
Saija. And Dr. Literio Bonina.
We welcome you to our state; we
welcome you to the Senate chamber where we do
business for the people that we represent in
New York State.
1060
And we hope that your visit here
will further bond and bring relationships and
cultural exchanges, open avenues and
opportunities for our students, and to make
sure that the museum that we started in the
house of Peter Galluzzo's family will prosper
and expand, and that people here who have
families who came to this country from Sicily
might have various pictures and other things
that they will contribute to the museum.
I know that one of our very
esteemed Senators would also -- and the
longest-serving senator, state senator in the
country, in the United States, would also like
to welcome you. And I yield to Senator
Marchi.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Marchi.
SENATOR MARCHI: Madam President.
(In Italian.) Although we are
members of several parties, at this moment we
do not subscribe to any party; in fact, we are
unanimous in welcoming you with joy in our
chamber. We want you to have a pleasing and
fulfilling stay here in this country, and I
hope that you will be returning many times.
1061
I have been in your country, and I
have also been to the Strait of Messina, where
I was able to observe the reconstructed city
that had suffered a tremendous earthquake back
in 1908. You have rebuilt that city well.
I know that in your neighboring
territory you have the town of Syracuse, which
gave us that great historical figure
Archimedes and the endless process that
Messina and indeed all of Sicily has
contributed so abundantly to the well-being of
this world in arts, sciences, cultural
developments, literature, philosophy, and in
fact every ennobling human activity.
I also wish personally that you
will ultimately complete the famous proposed
bridge or tunnel to unite Sicily with the
mainland. Even though there may be some
temporary dislocations, my judgment is that it
would be widely received with great pleasure.
In any event, I want you to enjoy
your stay here in America. I have also
visited Sicily on numerous occasions and
anticipate the pleasure of returning often.
I believe I express the unanimous
1062
sentiment of everybody in this chamber,
including our beautiful Madam President, that
we will also see each other early and often.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Skelos.
Thank you, Senator Marchi, for your
eloquent words.
(Laughter.)
SENATOR SKELOS: Madam President,
I just -- I missed part of it. Could the
stenographer please read that back for us?
(Laughter.)
THE PRESIDENT: So ordered.
(Laughter.)
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Onorato.
SENATOR ONORATO: Madam
President, on behalf of the New York State
Conference of Italian-American Legislators,
I'm Senator Onorato, I'm the president.
And two years ago, we did make a
wonderful trip to Sicily with our delegation.
And I would like to welcome you here to the
Senate chamber.
And I hope that you were able to
get some of the conversation that took place
on the last bill that we took. It happened to
1063
be about our schoolchildren and how we wanted
to protect them from bus drivers who are using
drugs.
So I understand a little later on
we are going to be meeting with you, we're
hosting a little dinner.
And again, I want to welcome you to
America and to the New York State chambers.
Ben venuto.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator LaValle.
SENATOR LAVALLE: I would like to
open up sponsorship of the resolution to the
members of the chamber.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Madam President,
with the consent of the Minority, we'll put
everyone on the resolution. If you do not
wish to sponsor it, please notify the desk.
THE PRESIDENT: All right. All
those who do not wish to be included in this
resolution should notify the desk.
SENATOR SKELOS: And then notify
Senator Marchi.
THE PRESIDENT: In English.
On the resolution. All those in
1064
favor signify by saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
THE PRESIDENT: Opposed, nay.
(No response.)
THE PRESIDENT: The resolution is
passed.
And as President -- go ahead. Go
ahead, Senator Morahan.
(Applause.)
THE PRESIDENT: On behalf of the
Senate, without question -- I don't know
whether I can express it as eloquently as
Senator Marchi has. There's no way of my
knowing. But I want to welcome you here, wish
you a cordial visit, and our very best wishes
to you in your endeavors.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Is there any
housekeeping at the desk?
THE PRESIDENT: No, Senator,
there is not.
SENATOR SKELOS: There being no
further business to come before the Senate, I
move we adjourn until Tuesday, March 7th, at
3:00 p.m.
1065
THE PRESIDENT: On motion, the
Senate stands adjourned until Tuesday,
March 7, 3:00 p.m.
(Whereupon, at 4:15 p.m., the
Senate adjourned.)