Regular Session - June 11, 2002
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NEW YORK STATE SENATE
THE STENOGRAPHIC RECORD
ALBANY, NEW YORK
June 11, 2002
3:19 p.m.
REGULAR SESSION
SENATOR RAYMOND A. MEIER, Acting President
STEVEN M. BOGGESS, Secretary
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P R O C E E D I N G S
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
Senate will come to order.
I ask everyone present to please
rise and join me in the Pledge of Allegiance
to the Flag.
(Whereupon, the assemblage recited
the Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: In the
absence of clergy, may we bow our heads in a
moment of silence.
(Whereupon, the assemblage
respected a moment of silence.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Reading
of the Journal.
THE SECRETARY: In Senate,
Monday, June 10, the Senate met pursuant to
adjournment. The Journal of Sunday, June 9,
was read and approved. On motion, Senate
adjourned.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Without
objection, the Journal stands approved as
read.
Presentation of petitions.
Messages from the Assembly.
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Messages from the Governor.
Reports of standing committees.
The Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Senator Stafford,
from the Committee on Finance, reports the
following nominations.
As a member of the State Liquor
Authority, Edward F. Kelly, of Holmes.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
I'd like to move the nomination. If you could
recognize Senator Leibell, please.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Leibell.
SENATOR LEIBELL: Thank you very
much, Mr. President. I am pleased to rise and
to speak on this nomination. I've had the
opportunity to do that before, and I'm pleased
once again.
I have known Ed Kelly and the Kelly
family probably for a couple of decades now.
And as I've said repeatedly, we're
particularly glad when the Governor, as he
always does, sends us a fine name, because we
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certainly know how much we need good people,
men and women, in government.
We have been most fortunate to have
Ed Kelly serving as commissioner of the New
York State Liquor Authority, and we're very
pleased once again to have this nomination in
front of us. Ed brings us to many years of
the experience, both in the private sector and
in the public sector. I can tell you
firsthand that within my district his family
is well known and much loved.
He has served all of our
constituents, throughout the course of many
years, in a variety of ways and will continue
to serve all the residents of New York State
in this position.
Mr. President, I move the
nomination.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
question is on the confirmation of the
nomination of Edward F. Kelly as a member of
the New York State Liquor Authority. All
those in favor signify by saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Those
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opposed, nay.
(No response.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
nominee is confirmed.
Mr. Kelly is with us today in the
gallery. He is accompanied by his wife,
Nancy.
And, Mr. Kelly, we congratulate you
and we wish you well with your duties.
(Applause.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: As a member of
the Board of Trustees of the State University
of New York, Aminy I. Audi, of Fayetteville.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Hoffmann.
SENATOR HOFFMANN: Thank you, Mr.
President. I am deeply honored to rise in
support of the reappointment of Aminy Audi to
the Board of Trustees of the State University
of New York.
Ms. Audi is, in the succinctest
possible language, one of the preeminent
citizens of Central New York. She is the
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executive vice president and partner of
Stickley Furniture.
She was at one time a freelance
writer and reporter for the Voice of America.
Her commitment to democracy and the American
way is manifest in virtually every aspect of
her daily life.
Stickley, as many people might
know, employs a number of individuals from all
over the world. And it is with enormous pride
that anyone who walks through that factory
sees people integrating into the American
system in one of the most beautiful ways
possible. And all of them speak with loving
admiration of the proprietor of that company,
Ms. Aminy Audi.
Mrs. Audi has won numerous awards,
far too many for us to read today. But if I
could just highlight a few, Mr. President.
She was a recipient of the "Women in the Homes
Industries Today" Woman of the Year Award in
manufacturing in the year 2000. She's a
founding member of the Central New York's
Women's Fund.
She was a recipient of the
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Fayetteville Chamber of Commerce Citizen of
the Year Award, which she shared with her
husband, Alfred, in 1999. She was a recipient
of the Ernst & Young Upstate New York
Entrepreneur of the Year Award in 1997.
And the list goes on and on,
including Post-Standard Woman of Achievement
in Business in 1991, one of the most
distinguished awards in our area.
I am delighted that Mrs. Audi has
chosen to continue her service on the board.
We appreciate her dedication to education.
And her willingness to serve is something that
we should all take great pleasure in today.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Farley.
SENATOR FARLEY: Thank you, Mr.
President.
I rise to also second the
nomination of Mrs. Audi. As somebody that has
been a professor at the university for over
thirty years, and somebody that's been very
interested in the State University, I applaud
her for being willing to serve. And we're
indeed so fortunate to have somebody as
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remarkable as this young lady serving us on
the Board of Trustees for the State
University.
My daughter, who is an attorney for
Stickley and for Mrs. Audi, has said that she
is truly one of the most remarkable women that
she has ever known.
And I think that, Mrs. Audi, the
State of New York is really blessed to have
you serve our great State University. We
appreciate the Governor reappointing you. And
we're very fortunate to have you and thank you
for your service.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
DeFrancisco.
SENATOR DeFRANCISCO: Everyone is
rising without any hope to get a discount on
furniture or to in some way get the favor of
this great lady.
I just wanted to mention something
from a different angle. Aminy has been on the
board for some time now, the SUNY board, and
she does a great job. Recently, without
getting into the various issues, on a very
sensitive issue I found out that she's a very
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active person on the board. She's someone
who's willing to come forward if she thinks
that something is awry. And she's a person of
her word and of utmost integrity.
So we are truly fortunate to have
you on the board, and we're very fortunate the
Governor was wise enough to continue you on to
another term.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
question is on the confirmation of Aminy Audi
as a member of the Board of Trustees of the
State University of New York. All those in
favor signify by saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Those
opposed, nay.
(No response.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
nominee is confirmed.
Mrs. Audi is with us today in the
gallery. And we congratulate you and wish you
well with your duties.
(Applause.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
Secretary will read.
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THE SECRETARY: As a member of
the New York State Energy Research and
Development Authority, William F. Edwards, of
Cicero.
As a member of the Port Authority
of New York and New Jersey, Henry R.
Silverman, of New York City.
As a member of the New York State
Bridge Authority, Edmund A. Fares, of Monroe.
As a member of the Niagara Frontier
Transportation Authority, Eunice A. Lewin, of
Buffalo.
As members of the Port of Oswego
Authority, David W. Buske, of Oswego, and
Christopher C. Dain, of Oswego.
As a member of the Board of
Trustees of Cornell University, Edward V.K.
Cunningham, Jr., of LaGrangeville.
As a member of the Correction
Medical Review Board, Michael M. Baden, M.D.,
of New York City.
As a member of the Republic Airport
Commission, Meredith Rudolph Payne, of
Amityville.
As a member of the Medical Advisory
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Committee, Carl P. Sahler, Jr., M.D., Ph.D.,
of Canandaigua.
As a member of the Advisory Council
on Alcoholism and Substance Abuse Services,
Karl J. Kabza, of Saranac Lake.
As a member of the State Office of
Science, Technology and Academic Research
Advisory Council, Richard A. Lippe, of
Woodbury.
And as a member of the Board of
Visitors of Helen Hayes Hospital, Claire
Dayton, of Greenville Center.
SENATOR SKELOS: Move the
nominations.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
DeFrancisco.
SENATOR DeFRANCISCO: I'd like to
just speak briefly on one of the nominees.
William F. Edwards is a member of
the New York State Energy Research and
Development Authority. Another great Central
New Yorker has been appointed to a very
important board for our state.
And I just wanted to mention very
briefly, since he was unable to be here, that
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he is the president of Niagara Mohawk and one
of the senior vice presidents of National
Grid, USA.
He's been involved in the community
in the Central New York area for many, many
years. And I know he serves with my wife,
Linda, on the Elmcrest Children's Center
board, but he's on many, many other boards in
the community.
Not only is he an important person
in the community, well-educated, with a lot of
good business and energy sense, but he is a
person who gives as much as he gets from the
community. So I'm very happy to rise in
support of his nomination.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Leibell.
SENATOR LEIBELL: Mr. President,
may I rise at this time to speak on the
reappointment of Edward Cunningham?
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Yes.
SENATOR LEIBELL: I don't believe
Van is here today, and my colleague Senator
Saland is out of the chamber at the moment.
But I did not wish to miss the opportunity to
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speak on behalf of Van Cunningham, whom I have
known for a great many years and know of his
devotion to Cornell University. He has served
long and well for that university in a variety
of capacities.
I can tell you within my own
district how hard he works, how hard he works
at recruiting youngsters, how hard he works as
making sure that all of our educational
institutions throughout New York State provide
the very finest in education.
So I'm very pleased to rise and
support and move the nomination of Van
Cunningham and thank him once again for the
fine job he has done for all of New York State
and particularly for Cornell University.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
question is on the confirmation of the
nominees. All those in favor signify by
saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Those
opposed, nay.
(No response.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
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nominees are confirmed.
The Secretary will continue to
read.
THE SECRETARY: As a member of
the State Liquor Authority, Joseph Zarriello,
of Colonie.
SENATOR SKELOS: Move the
nomination.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
question is on the confirmation of Joseph
Zarriello, of Colonie, as a member of the New
York State Liquor Authority. All those in
favor signify by saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Those
opposed, nay.
(No response.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
nominee is confirmed.
Mr. Zarriello is with us today in
the gallery. And, sir, we congratulate you
and again wish you well with your duties.
(Applause.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
Secretary will continue to read.
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THE SECRETARY: As a member of
the Board of Trustees of the City University
of New York, Hugo M. Morales, M.D., of
Yonkers.
SENATOR SKELOS: Move the
nomination.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Lachman.
SENATOR LACHMAN: I was very
impressed with the nominee when he appeared
before both the Higher Education and when he
appeared also at the Finance Committee. His
background in psychiatry might even be of help
to him once he joins the CUNY Board of
Trustees have.
However, I've always stood up and
said that what CUNY lacks, and I hope that
Dr. Morales understands this, is that it lacks
a faculty, a full-time faculty that is
sufficient for a great university. In fact,
Vice Chancellor Hershenson said that,
unequivocally, the 50 to 60 percent full-time
faculty that CUNY has is a tremendous,
tremendous detriment to the future of the
university and is much lower than SUNY and the
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private colleges.
Now, I have looked at two CUNY
campuses that Dr. Morales might want to look
into as well. One is a campus composed
primarily of a minority population; the other
is an outer-borough population. And their
full-time faculty equivalencies, and the money
they receive, is far less than other college
campuses within CUNY. I'm referring
specifically to the City College of New York,
CCNY, and the College of Staten Island.
The undergraduate full-time
students in spring 2002 were 6,000 at the
College of Staten Island and about 4,500 at
City. Now, their full-time faculty at City
College was 487 and the College of Staten
Island, 290.
The expenditures and financial
resources were, at the College of Staten
Island, $7,000 per student per year, and at
City College was almost $10,000 per student
per year.
In terms of their total
instructional staff, CCNY had 750 full-time
faculty, whereas the College of Staten Island
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had only 444.
This is really unacceptable in
terms of a major university. And since we all
have a very high opinion of Dr. Morales, we
all expect that he will be involved in
changing this and improving this in the
future.
Thank you kindly.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
question is on the confirmation of Dr. Hugo
Morales as a member of the City University of
New York Board of Trustees. All those in
favor signify by saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Those
opposed, nay.
(No response.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
nominee is confirmed.
Dr. Morales is with us today in the
gallery. And congratulations, Doctor, and we
wish you well.
(Applause.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Reports
of select committees.
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Communications and reports from
state officers.
Motions and resolutions.
Senator Farley.
SENATOR FARLEY: Thank you, Mr.
President.
On behalf of, Mr. President,
Senator Meier, I wish to call up his bill,
Senate Print 7135B, recalled from the
Assembly, which is now at the desk.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1251, by Senator Meier, Senate Print 7135B, an
act to amend the Social Services Law.
SENATOR FARLEY: Mr. President, I
now move to reconsider the vote by which this
bill was passed, and I ask that it be restored
to the order of third reading after the
reconsideration.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll on reconsideration.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 41.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
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Farley.
SENATOR FARLEY: Yes, Mr.
President. I now move to discharge, from the
Committee on Rules, Assembly Print 10216A and
substitute it for Senator Meier's identical
bill.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER:
Substitution ordered.
SENATOR FARLEY: The Senate Bill
was first passed, voted, unanimously. I now
move that the substituted Assembly bill have a
third reading at this time.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1251, by Member of the Assembly Ortiz,
Assembly Print Number 10216A, an act to amend
the Social Services Law.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
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THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 41.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
SENATOR FARLEY: Thank you, Mr.
President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Farley.
SENATOR FARLEY: On behalf of
Senator Maziarz, I wish to call up his bill,
Senate Print 6877A, recalled from the
Assembly, which is now at the desk.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
665, by Senator Maziarz, Senate Print 6877A,
an act to amend the Chapter 433 of the Laws of
1997.
SENATOR FARLEY: Mr. President, I
now move to reconsider the vote by which this
bill passed, and I ask that the bill be
restored to the order of third reading.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll on reconsideration.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 41.
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ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Farley.
SENATOR FARLEY: Mr. President, I
now move to discharge, from the Committee on
Rules, Assembly Print Number 11104A and
substitute it for Senator Maziarz's identical
bill.
The Senate Bill on first passage
was voted on unanimously. I now move that the
substituted Assembly bill have its third
reading at this time.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
665, by the Assembly Committee on Rules,
Assembly Print Number 11104A, an act to amend
Chapter 433 of the Laws of 1997.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 41.
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ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
SENATOR FARLEY: Thank you, Mr.
President.
On behalf of Senator Velella, Mr.
President, I wish to call up his bill, Senate
Print 7456A, which was recalled from the
Assembly, and it is now at the desk.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1270, by Senator Velella, Senate Print 7456A,
an act to amend the Education Law and others.
SENATOR FARLEY: Mr. President, I
now move to reconsider the vote by which this
bill passed, and I ask that the bill be
restored to the order of third reading.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll on reconsideration.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 42.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Farley.
SENATOR FARLEY: Mr. President, I
now offer the following amendments.
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ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
amendments are received and adopted.
SENATOR FARLEY: I now move to
discharge, from the Committee on Rules,
Assembly Print 11627, and substitute it for
Senator Velella's identical bill, 7456B.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER:
Substitution ordered.
SENATOR FARLEY: Thank you, Mr.
President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Marcellino.
SENATOR MARCELLINO: Thank you,
Mr. President. I move to recommit Senate
Print Number 7476, Calendar Number 1301 on the
order of third reading, to the Committee on
Rules, with instructions to said committee to
strike out the enacting clause.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: So
ordered.
SENATOR MARCELLINO: And, Mr.
President, I wish to call up Senator
Hoffmann's bill, Print Number 6511, recalled
from the Assembly, which is now at the desk.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
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Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
948, by Senator Hoffmann, Senate Print 6511,
an act to amend the Agriculture and Markets
Law.
SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr.
President, I now move to reconsider the vote
by which this bill was passed.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll on reconsideration.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 42.
SENATOR MARCELLINO: Mr.
President, I offer the following amendments.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
amendments are received and adopted.
Senator McGee.
SENATOR McGEE: Thank you. Mr.
President, on behalf of Senator Larkin, on
page number 36 I offer the following
amendments to Calendar Number 831, Senate
Print Number 6764, and ask that said bill
retain its place on Third Reading Calendar.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
amendments are received and adopted, and the
4380
bill will retain its place on the Third
Reading Calendar.
SENATOR McGEE: Thank you, Mr.
President.
Mr. President, on behalf of Senator
DeFrancisco, on page number 53 I offer the
following amendments to Calendar Number 1106,
Senate Print Number 6165, and ask that said
bill retain its place on Third Reading
Calendar.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
amendments are received and adopted, and the
bill will retain its place on the Third
Reading Calendar.
SENATOR McGEE: Thank you, Mr.
President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: You're
very welcome, Senator McGee.
SENATOR McGEE: Mr. President, on
behalf of Senator Maltese, on page number 56 I
offer the following amendments to Calendar
Number 1143, Senate Print Number 5852B, and
ask that said bill retain its place on Third
Reading Calendar.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
4381
amendments are received and adopted, and the
bill will retain its place on the Third
Reading Calendar.
SENATOR McGEE: Thank you, Mr.
President.
Mr. President, on behalf of Senator
LaValle, on page number 60 I offer the
following amendments to Calendar Number 1193,
Senate Print Number 7147, and ask that said
bill retain its place on Third Reading
Calendar.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
amendments are received and adopted, and the
bill will retain its place on the Third
Reading Calendar.
SENATOR McGEE: Thank you, Mr.
President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: You're
very welcome, Senator McGee.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
are there any substitutions to be made?
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Yes,
there are. Should we do those now?
The Secretary will read the
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substitutions.
THE SECRETARY: On page 6,
Senator Alesi moves to discharge, from the
Committee on Rules, Assembly Bill Number
3116E, and substitute it for the identical
Senate Bill Number 2218C, Third Reading
Calendar 99.
On page 7, Senator Marcellino moves
to discharge, from the Committee on Rules,
Assembly Bill Number 9599B and substitute it
for the identical Senate Bill Number 4730B,
Third Reading Calendar 136.
On page 10, Senator Saland moves to
discharge, from the Committee on Rules,
Assembly Bill Number 11197 and substitute it
for the identical Senate Bill Number 5131B,
Third Reading Calendar 245.
On page 12, Senator Spano moves to
discharge, from the Committee on Rules,
Assembly Bill Number 9740 and substitute it
for the identical Senate Bill Number 6158,
Third Reading Calendar 305.
On page 13, Senator Morahan moves
to discharge, from the Committee on Rules,
Assembly Bill Number 1489A and substitute it
4383
for the identical Senate Bill Number 370A,
Third Reading Calendar 333.
On page 28, Senator Sampson moves
to discharge, from the Committee on Rules,
Assembly Bill Number 3672C and substitute it
for the identical Senate Bill Number 1720B,
Third Reading Calendar 674.
On page 29, Senator Fuschillo moves
to discharge, from the Committee on Rules,
Assembly Bill Number 4955A and substitute it
for the identical Senate Bill Number 2586A,
Third Reading Calendar 699.
On page 41, Senator LaValle moves
to discharge, from the Committee on Rules,
Assembly Bill Number 9990 and substitute it
for the identical Senate Bill Number 1210A,
Third Reading Calendar 928.
On page 43, Senator Hoffmann moves
to discharge, from the Committee on Rules,
Assembly Bill Number 9547 and substitute it
for the identical Senate Bill Number 6915,
Third Reading Calendar 950.
On page 44, Senator Marcellino
moves to discharge, from the Committee on
Rules, Assembly Bill Number 6881C and
4384
substitute it for the identical Senate Bill
Number 4164B, Third Reading Calendar 964.
On page 50, Senator Morahan moves
to discharge, from the Committee on Rules,
Assembly Bill Number 5133B and substitute it
for the identical Senate Bill Number 4132C,
Third Reading Calendar 1064.
On page 54, Senator Trunzo moves to
discharge, from the Committee on Rules,
Assembly Bill Number 3387A and substitute it
for the identical Senate Bill Number 2033A,
Third Reading Calendar 1121.
On page 56, Senator Marcellino
moves to discharge, from the Committee on
Rules, Assembly Bill Number 10494 and
substitute it for the identical Senate Bill
Number 5542A, Third Reading Calendar 1140.
On page 58, Senator Maltese moves
to discharge, from the Committee on Rules,
Assembly Bill Number 11107 and substitute it
for the identical Senate Bill Number 6747,
Third Reading Calendar 1169.
On page 60, Senator McGee moves to
discharge, from the Committee on Rules,
Assembly Bill Number 9865 and substitute it
4385
for the identical Senate Bill Number 6284,
Third Reading Calendar 1186.
On page 62, Senator McGee moves to
discharge, from the Committee on Corporations,
Authorities and Commissions, Assembly Bill
Number 5861 and substitute it for the
identical Senate Bill Number 3078, Third
Reading Calendar 1305.
On page 63, Senator Maltese moves
to discharge, from the Committee on Veterans
and Military Affairs, Assembly Bill Number
9629 and substitute it for the identical
Senate Bill Number 6121, Third Reading
Calendar 1313.
And on page 63, Senator Velella
moves to discharge, from the Committee on
Transportation, Assembly Bill Number 10667 and
substitute it for the identical Senate Bill
Number 6951, Third Reading Calendar 1315.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER:
Substitutions ordered.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
if we could adopt the Resolution Calendar in
its entirety at this time.
4386
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
question is on the adoption of the Resolution
Calendar in its entirety. All those in favor
signify by saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Those
opposed, nay.
(No response.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
Resolution Calendar is adopted.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
would you please recognize Senator Bonacic.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Bonacic.
SENATOR BONACIC: Thank you, Mr.
President.
I would like to just take a moment
to report to this chamber the results of the
Bowlerama for the Bone Marrow. I wanted to
thank the senators in this chamber who
participated. It was cochaired by myself and
Assemblyman Jeff Aubry.
There were roughly 50 teams. There
were spectators; there were people who donated
4387
prizes. And we raised, that evening, $25,000.
I would just like to mention that
I, for one, have never seen a 300 game being
bowled. And that night we had three
individuals that bowled a 300 game. And I
think it's worth mentioning their names. It
was Tom Shepard, who happened to be on my
team; Mike Haverly, Jr., who just happened to
be on my team; and Joseph Walton, who was on
Senator Kuhl's team.
But the one gentleman I mentioned,
this Mike Haverly, Jr., was a 16-year-old
individual whose mother works for Senator
McGee.
And in addition, there was one
other team that finished first, a
Mr. Speckhardt, Rick; Wendy Race; Michael
Haverly, Jr., and Tony Impellizzeri.
We had about 300 people
participating. And whether you bowled 300,
whether you bowled under 100, whether you were
there just as a spectator, I told the people
at a luncheon today that what we did from this
event will probably save a life, and that in
itself should make everyone a winner and feel
4388
good.
Thank you, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
at this time if we could go to the
noncontroversial reading of the calendar.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
Secretary will read the noncontroversial
calendar.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
39, by Senator LaValle, Senate Print 6043B, an
act to amend the Education Law, in relation to
reporting requirements.
SENATOR DUANE: Lay it aside,
please.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
274, by Senator Marcellino, Senate Print
4754B, an act to amend the Navigation Law, in
relation to the use of tow chains.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
4389
act shall take effect on the first day of
November.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 52.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
283, by Senator McGee, Senate Print 3065A, an
act to amend the Election Law, in relation to
the declination of designations.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 52.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
315, by Senator Volker, Senate Print 3210C, an
act to amend the -
4390
SENATOR HEVESI: Lay it aside,
please.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
343, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 4893A, an
act to amend the Domestic Relations Law and
the Family Court Act, in relation to changing.
SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside,
please.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
359, by Senator Marcellino, Senate Print 6076,
an act to amend the Public Health Law and the
State Finance Law, in relation to body
piercing and tattooing.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect on the same date and in
the same manner as Chapter 562 of the Laws of
2001.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
4391
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 52.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
674, substituted earlier today by Member of
the Assembly Perry, Assembly Print Number
3672C, an act authorizing the City of New
York.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 52.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
699, substituted earlier today by Member of
the Assembly Sweeney, Assembly -
SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Lay the
bill aside.
4392
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
753, by Senator Trunzo, Senate Print 1563, an
act to amend the Education Law, in relation to
payment of tuition and fees.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect on the first day of
August.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 52.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
759, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 6979A, an
act to amend the Domestic Relations Law, the
Family Court Act and the Social Services Law,
in relation to the rights of grandparents.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 5. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
4393
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 52.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1008, by Senator Velella, Senate Print 7330A,
an act to amend the Labor Law and the State
Finance Law, in relation to actions.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect on the first day of
November.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 51. Nays,
1. Senator Rath recorded in the negative.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1125, by Senator Leibell, Senate Print 3245A,
an act to allow members of the New York State
Teachers' Retirement System to obtain credit.
4394
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 52.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1158, by Senator Maltese, Senate Print 6855A,
an act to amend the Retirement and Social
Security Law, in relation to authorizing
accidental disability retirement benefits.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 54.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
4395
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1229, by Senator Velella, Senate Print 6761A,
an act to amend the Real Property Tax Law, in
relation to the payment of taxes.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect on the first day of
January.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 54.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1266, by the Assembly Committee -
SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1303, by Senator Skelos, Senate Print 417B, an
act to amend the Criminal Procedure Law, in
relation to the period of limitation.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
4396
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Lay it
aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1305, substituted earlier today by Member of
the Assembly Gunther, Assembly Print Number
5861, an act to amend the New York State Urban
Development Corporation Act.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect 180 days.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 54.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
4397
1306, by Senator Stafford, Senate Print 3920,
an act to amend the Public Officers Law, in
relation to gifts offered.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect on the first day of
January.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 54.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1307, by Senator Stafford, Senate Print 3927,
an act to amend the Public Officers Law, in
relation to allowing state officers and
employees.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
4398
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 53. Nays,
1. Senator Duane recorded in the negative.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1308, by Senator Stafford, Senate Print 3928,
an act to amend the Public Officers Law, in
relation to business and professional
activities.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 54.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1311, by Senator Wright, Senate Print 5206A,
an act to amend the Public Service Law, in
relation to protection of customers.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
4399
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect 180 days.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 54.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1312, by Senator Velella, Senate Print 5842A,
an act to amend the Retirement and Social
Security Law, in relation to providing
accidental disability retirement benefits.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: There is
a home-rule message at the desk.
Read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 54.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
4400
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1313, substituted earlier today by Member of
the Assembly Sweeney, Assembly Print Number
9629, an act to amend the Education Law, in
relation to the eligibility of Vietnam and
Persian Gulf veterans for tuition awards.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 54.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1315, substituted earlier today by Member of
the Assembly Cymbrowitz, Assembly Print Number
10667, an act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic
Law and the Insurance Law, in relation to
devoting.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This
4401
act shall take effect on the same date as
Chapter 536 of the Laws of 2001.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 54.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1316, by Senator Farley, Senate Print 6966A,
an act to amend the Public Officers Law, in
relation to relation to waiving the residency
requirement.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 54.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1317, by Senator DeFrancisco, Senate Print
4402
7157, an act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic
Law, in relation to authorizing the City of
Syracuse.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: There is
a home-rule message at the desk.
Read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 54.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1318, by Senator Velella, Senate Print 7334B,
an act to amend the Retirement and Social
Security Law, in relation to certain
impairments.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Lay it
aside.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Lay the
bill aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1319, by Senator Nozzolio, Senate Print 7445,
4403
an act to amend the Town Law, in relation to
the dissolution and diminishing area.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: There is
a home-rule message at the desk.
Read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 56.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1320, by Senator Wright -
SENATOR SKELOS: Lay it aside for
the day.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Lay the
bill aside for the day.
Senator Skelos, that completes the
noncontroversial reading of the calendar.
SENATOR SKELOS: Thank you, Mr.
President. If we could go to the
controversial reading of the calendar.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
4404
Secretary will read the controversial
calendar.
THE SECRETARY: On page 4,
Calendar Number 39, by Senator LaValle, Senate
Print 6043B, an act to amend the Education
Law, in relation to reporting requirements of
foreign students in the United States.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Schneiderman.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Thank you
Mr. President. On the bill very, very
briefly.
The reason that I think this bill
really is, although well-intentioned,
misdirected, is that the reporting
requirements that it addresses really are
already handled by the federal government.
I'm concerned that we are requiring
additional work from the State Police that is
redundant. We're not providing them with
resources. And quite frankly, I think that
what this is going to lead to is a pile of
information about nonresident alien students
sitting in boxes at State Police headquarters.
The federal government is handling
4405
this, and I think we should direct all of our
efforts to seeing that they do a good job. I
am going to be voting no.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
LaValle.
SENATOR LAVALLE: Mr. President,
on the bill.
This bill certainly at any time,
but today it is probably more important that
we know and understand what foreign students
are coming into the country that have enrolled
in a program at one of our universities -- and
by the way, there are 55,000 foreign students
that are being educated within the state of
New York at both our public and nonpublic
postsecondary schools.
We equally must know when a student
comes to this country on a visa and leaves
during the year. We must also be able to have
a reporting system that our State Police and
local law enforcement personnel know and
understand that there are people who were
either going to come -- received a visa, were
going to come to this country, never showed
up, or came to this country, were being
4406
educated and then disappeared.
In regard to the reporting, while
working on this legislation, I asked various
colleges and universities for just general and
basic information, and we had a very difficult
time receiving basic information, directory
kinds of information, statistical information.
I think it is not an extraordinary
burden on our colleges and universities,
particularly at this juncture. Because we
must, after 9/11, make sure that we are going
the extra mile to have all the possible
information that we can have on individuals
who are coming into our country.
This bill does not target any group
or any individual. It merely says, of those
55,000 students: Where are you? Are you here
being educated? Have you left? What country
do you come from, and when are you returning,
and what is your degree? Very basic
information.
I know that the universities and
colleges, regardless of what legislation we
have had -- whether it is reporting crime on
the campus or other activities on the
4407
campus -- of course find it's more paperwork
and distracts them from the basic mission that
they have. I think this legislation -- worked
on it with staff and met with people from the
universities to try and be as accommodating as
we possibly could be.
Thank you very much, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Any
other Senator wish to be heard on the bill?
Debate is closed.
Read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
the negative on Calendar Number 39 are
Senators Andrews, Duane, Hassell-Thompson,
Mendez, Montgomery, Paterson, Sampson,
Schneiderman, M. Smith, and Stavisky. Also
Senators L. Krueger, Santiago, and A. Smith.
Ayes, 44. Nays, 13.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
4408
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
315, by Senator Volker, Senate Print 3210C, an
act to amend the Real Property Tax Law, in
relation to providing a tax exemption.
SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Volker, Senator Paterson has requested an
explanation.
SENATOR VOLKER: Mr. President,
the story on this bill is it already -- it
passed earlier this year, but what occurred
was -- and the bill was limited to some local
jurisdictions.
We've been advised that there have
been several bills signed by the Governor that
involve small counties. And therefore, what
we did was to make some changes so this
included the entire county of Wyoming.
And that's the difference, is that
initially this included, I think, a village
and maybe a town. The -- we've been apprised
that that is virtually impossible to do. And
that there is a possibility, however, that we
might -- and I want to make this very clear
because, Dan, when we were talking, that there
4409
is a possibility that this bill could be
signed and could become law, and I want you to
understand that.
And so that was what was changed
from the B print to the C print, that it
includes all of the county of Wyoming, which
is one of the smaller counties in the state,
would be able to include their volunteer
firefighters and ambulance workers, would be
able to get the exemption.
Of course, it's all voluntary and
so forth. But it is possible that this bill,
should it pass the Assembly, would become law.
I just want you to understand that.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Hevesi.
SENATOR HEVESI: Thank you, Mr.
President. On the bill.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Hevesi, on the bill.
SENATOR HEVESI: Thank you, Mr.
President.
I don't know if I've mentioned this
before, but I think we should do a statewide
bill instead of the ten similar bills that
4410
we've passed in this house. And so I'll be
voting no on this.
But I do think we should do a
statewide bill. And I hope other people share
in that opinion.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Liz Krueger.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: On behalf
of Dan Hevesi, please, let's do a statewide
bill. We've heard this before.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Any
other Senator wish to be heard on the bill?
Senator Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: I'm with Senator
Hevesi as well. We should do a statewide
bill. And I think it should be named for
Senator Hevesi when it passes this chamber.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Maybe
we'll call it Dan's Law.
Any other Senator wish to be heard
on the bill?
Debate is closed, then.
Read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect on the first day of
4411
January.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 57. Nays,
1. Senator Hevesi recorded in the negative.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
343, by Senator Saland, Senate Print 4893A, an
act to amend the Domestic Relations Law and
the Family Court Act, in relation to changing.
SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Saland, Senator Paterson has requested an
explanation of Calendar 343.
SENATOR SALAND: Thank you, Mr.
President.
Mr. President, this bill is
virtually identical to the original version,
prior to the A print, that we did earlier this
year. The difference in the bill effectively
is a technical amendment which is the result
of the Uniform Child Custody Jurisdiction Act,
the UCCJA, having been amended to become the
4412
UCCJEA, by adding the word "enforcement" in
it.
The bill basically is a change
which takes references to "visitation" in
sections of the Family Court Act and the
Domestic Relations Law and changes that to
"parenting time."
And the basis for that is, very
simply, that a parent is a parent and is
visiting when he or she may be going to see
someone in a hospital or in an institution of
whatever nature, but when he or she may be
spending time with a child or their children,
that would more appropriately be connoted as
parenting time.
And to do otherwise effectively
makes a parent placed in the position -
places the parent in the position where they
are viewed as being almost something akin to
third parties, not enjoying time as a parent
but being privileged to have the opportunity
to visit.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
if I could just interrupt, there will be an
4413
immediate meeting of the Rules Committee in
the Majority Conference Room.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER:
Immediate meeting of the Rules Committee in
the Majority Conference Room.
Senator Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
if my friend Senator Saland would yield for a
question.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Saland, do you yield for a question?
SENATOR SALAND: Certainly,
Senator Paterson.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
sponsor yields.
SENATOR PATERSON: There's a
concern that the use of the term "parenting
time" might be interpreted in Family Court
such that perhaps the noncustodial parent,
particularly the noncustodial father, would
try to assert that the parenting time is not
really visitation, but it's parenting, and
would then diminish from the child support
payments that the noncustodial parent is
making to the court.
4414
Do you see that as a valid concern?
Do you think that the passage of this bill
would in any way even present a risk in this
type of fashion?
SENATOR SALAND: Senator
Paterson, I do not.
If you could advise me as to where
that concern is coming from, because I have
not received any memos to that effect other
than one back in March from the New York State
chapter of NOW.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
I think Senator Saland has answered the
question quite sufficiently, but I would point
out that I have in my hand Exhibit A, the same
document that Senator Saland is referring to
from March of this year.
SENATOR SALAND: Suffice it to
say, in my humble opinion, that that memo
paints with certainly far too broad of a
brush, is rather territorial and judgmental,
to say the least.
We have not heard from anybody else
4415
other than NOW on this issue. This bill is
not intended to be anything but a change in
terms from "visitation" to "parenting time."
As you know, Senator Paterson,
because we've joined in these efforts, we've
done some pretty substantial things over the
course of the past half a dozen or so years to
improve support collections in New York State.
I've had a very active role in a number of
those endeavors and initiatives.
And I can assure you, if I had a
slightest concern that this would in any way,
shape or form impair support collections or in
any way, shape or form reduce the obligation
constituted under court order or by way of
agreement, I would never consider bringing
this bill before this body.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Any
other Senator wish to be heard on the bill?
Debate is closed, then.
Read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 29. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
4416
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
the negative on Calendar Number 343 are
Senators Balboni, Duane, Hassell-Thompson,
Hevesi, Meier, Montgomery, Santiago, and A.
Smith. Ayes, 50. Nays, 8.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
699, substituted earlier today by Member of
Assembly Sweeney, Assembly Print Number 4955A,
an act to authorize the North Amityville
Housing Rehabilitation Association,
Incorporated.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
I laid this bill aside earlier for Senator
Dollinger, who is currently in the Rules
Committee. And I wondered if we might lay it
aside temporarily and await the return of the
Rules Committee, the Rules report, and Senator
Dollinger.
SENATOR MORAHAN: No objections,
Mr. President.
4417
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Without
objection, the bill is laid aside temporarily.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1266, by the Assembly Committee on Rules,
Assembly Print Number 11231, an act to amend
Chapter 557 of the Laws of 2001.
SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation,
please.
SENATOR MORAHAN: Lay it aside
temporarily.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Lay the
bill aside temporarily.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1303, by Senator Skelos, Senate Print 417B, an
act to amend the Criminal Procedure Law, in
relation to the period of limitation.
SENATOR MORAHAN: Lay it aside
temporarily.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Lay the
bill aside temporarily.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1318, by Senator Velella, Senate Print 7334B,
an act to amend the -
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Lay the
bill aside temporarily.
4418
SENATOR MORAHAN: Mr. President,
is there any housekeeping at the desk?
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: No,
there is not, Senator.
SENATOR MORAHAN: We'll stand at
ease for a few moments.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
Senate will stand at ease.
(Whereupon, the Senate stood at
ease at 4:14 p.m.)
(Whereupon, the Senate reconvened
at 4:17 p.m.)
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Would you please
call up Calendar Number 1303.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
Secretary will read Calendar 1303.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1303, by Senator Skelos, Senate Print 417B, an
act to amend the Criminal Procedure Law, in
relation to the period of limitation.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Paterson.
4419
SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
I was wondering if Senator Skelos would tell
us about the period of limitation and perhaps
might explain the entire bill.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
this would amend the Criminal Procedure Law to
extend the statute of limitations in a
prosecution for a sex offense against a child
less than 18, from five years after the child
has reached 18, to 15 years.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Mr.
President, if the sponsor would yield to a
question.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Skelos, do you yield for question from Senator
Liz Krueger?
SENATOR SKELOS: Absolutely.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
sponsor yields.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Thank you,
Senator.
I understand this bill has been
dealt with in previous years, and I'm new this
year. And I think I support this bill. I was
wondering, does this bill apply -
4420
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Could we
have the doors to the chambers closed. Could
we have the doors to the chambers closed.
Could we have order in the
chambers, some courtesy to the members trying
to debate the bill.
Senator Krueger.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Thank you,
Mr. President, Senator Skelos.
This would apply to and override
any other bill we deal with in sexual abuse.
So when we passed a bill in this house not
that long ago that applied to clergy and
sexual abuse and mandatory reporting, this
bill would in fact extend the statute of
limitations in any scenario including that?
SENATOR SKELOS: This would
expand the statute of limitations in these
cases from five to 15 years after the child
reaches the age of majority, which is 18.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Thank you.
That was actually my only question.
Mr. President, on the bill.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Krueger, on the bill.
4421
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Thank you.
I know there are concerns about extending
statutes of limitations. But I think, again,
as we see year after year, as we get more
evidence that we can use, as we have more DNA
evidence that becomes available, particularly
in situations of sexual abuse, and we have
more data and ways to ensure that even later
on, beyond traditional statute of limitations,
we have the opportunity to prosecute and find
guilty people who are guilty of crimes on
solid evidence, that I think the time is ripe
to extend the statute of limitations,
particularly in situations of sexual abuse and
harassment.
So I am glad to learn of this bill
and the opportunity to vote for it today, and
hope that my colleagues will also.
Thank you very much.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Any
other Senator wish to be heard on the bill?
Senator Hevesi.
SENATOR HEVESI: Thank you, Mr.
President. On the bill.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
4422
Hevesi, on the bill.
SENATOR HEVESI: I spoke on this
bill last year. This is, in my opinion, not a
good bill, this is a great bill.
And we -- I don't know what to do
to get the Assembly to pass this. But in
between the time when Senator Skelos brought
this to the floor last year and this year, you
really could have no more strong argument for
extending the statute of limitations to
15 years than the clergy scandal which has
exploded.
Irrespective of that, this bill was
a great bill last year also, and it should
have been passed by the Assembly and signed
into law last year too, for some of the
reasons that Senator Krueger has spoken about
and of course Senator Skelos, that
particularly with DNA evidence and rape kits
sitting dormant in warehouses, not having been
tested, where if you, six years after an
offense has been committed, can then convict
somebody, not only is it unjust for the
victim, but it is actually unjust for
everybody else out there in society who now is
4423
a potential victim of somebody who we could
have taken off the streets.
And the same argument applies for
all of the offenders in the church. To
suggest right now that at age -- five years
after 18, or at age 23, somebody who was
abused when they were a minor can no longer
seek criminal redress, is just -- it flies in
the face of all kinds of logic of what we know
about the psychology of somebody who has been
victimized as a youngster, particularly by
somebody in a position of authority, and the
shame that goes along with it, which precludes
them, most oftentimes, from having the
maturity or the courage or what have you -
and I don't mean that in the pejorative -- to
come forward.
It may be a little more easy now
for people to come forward because it is -
we've seen so many more cases of people coming
forward. It makes it easier for victims to do
so. But still, it's much better public policy
to allow until the age of 33, which is what
Senator Skelos's bill does, an individual to
come forward, to say: When I was or 10 or 15
4424
or whatever age, I was abused, it was
horrible, I'm only coming to terms with it
now. But I want justice. I want justice.
And we should give these
individuals who have been so horribly
victimized, a crime for which the victim will
suffer forever -- it's not as if their
suffering will cease at some point, even if
justice is meted out to the perpetrators. But
in addition to that, all the other individuals
who would be victimized and who have been
victimized -- we have seen, Mr. President,
case after case after case, which I have said
repeatedly on this floor is only a small
example, if we extrapolate outwards, the
number of individuals that we don't know about
yet who have been victimized repeatedly by the
same individuals.
That not to extend the statute of
limitations which would put somebody
potentially in jail who has victimized
somebody, that simply says the following. It
says we are going to expose -- and this is in
a proactive thing, so I guess let me speak in
the passive voice -- we are not going to
4425
prevent as a Legislature people from being
victimized by recalcitrant sexual offenders by
extending the statute of limitations.
We've got to do this. We've got to
do this. It's essential, absolutely
essential. I don't know what the problem is
in the other house. The only argument that
I've heard against extending the statute of
limitations -- and this one is only for sexual
offenses, I would support it for all violent
felony offenses, completely eliminating it.
But the only argument that I've
heard against it is that memories fade it and
it's potentially unfair to somebody who's been
accused. To which I've always responded that
the burden of proof is on the prosecution to
prove in a criminal matter beyond a reasonable
doubt. And it seems to me that the passage of
time is a hindrance to the prosecution and an
asset to the defense. And if that's true,
that argument against extending the statute of
limitations doesn't hold water.
It's time for us to pass this
legislation. And incidentally, while we're on
the subject, we've got a week and a half left.
4426
We passed some months ago the clergy
notification bill, which I didn't love that
bill, and I know the Assembly has some
problems with it. I would have done things
differently, as very often many of us would
draft legislation differently. But we've got
to pass something before this session is done.
I mean, we've got to. I would take an
imperfect bill over nothing any day of the
week, particularly on this issue that's so
critical.
I believe it was Senator Saland's
bill that requires notification to a child
abuse hotline. I believe, since any
allegation of sexual abuse by a member of the
clergy is by definition a criminal offense, it
should go to a district attorney. But short
of that, I'll take notification to a
child-abuse hotline. Let's do something on
this.
These are pressing, critical,
critical issues. In many ways, these issues
are more pressing and critical than the school
governance bill, which is also very, very
important. Because we're dealing with
4427
life-and-death issues here. We're dealing
with individuals who may be victimized, be
sexually abused or worse in the future if we
don't take action.
This is not hyperbole. I'm not
trying to be dramatic for effect here. This
is serious stuff. And the fact that we have
not acted on this, though we acted on Senator
Skelos's bill a year ago, have seen the
terrible abuses that have taken place within
the Catholic Church -- and now we have an
another opportunity this year. If we don't
seize it, we will have failed, Mr. President,
miserably, on behalf of everybody in this
state.
And it cuts across gender lines.
This is boys and girls who have been
victimized. This is for adults, this is for
children, this is for everybody. Let's do the
right thing and pass this bill today, tell the
Assembly to please pass this, and let's come
to terms on a notification bill of sexual
offenders amongst clergy to mandate the
reporting in those instances.
This is life-and-death stuff. It's
4428
time to act.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Any
other Senator wish to be heard on the bill?
Debate is closed, then.
Read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 4. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 58.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
699, by Member of the Assembly Sweeney,
Assembly Print Number 4955A, an act to
authorize the North Amityville Housing
Rehabilitation Association, Incorporated.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Dollinger.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr.
President, just on the bill very briefly. I'm
going to vote against this bill, and I'll ask
for unanimous consent to vote against the
other partial property tax exemption bill
4429
that's in the stack.
I just informed my good friend
Senator Fuschillo that it appears as though
you have taken the lead in the sweepstakes of
who can have the most -- Senator Skelos was
the proud leader, with eight properties. This
is a sextuplet bill, it's got six properties
that we're going to grant retroactive partial
property tax exemptions for.
So, Senator Fuschillo, the title is
yours: Grand assessor of Nassau County.
You've wrested the title away from Senator
Skelos. Although I quite frankly have to
admit I expect that Senator Skelos will
produce at least a couple more bills before
the end of the session.
Senator Balboni, who is running far
behind, will be there with a number of them.
And we'll continue to do the property tax
exemption work for Nassau County.
A statewide bill would again be -
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
would Senator Dollinger yield for a question?
SENATOR DOLLINGER: I'd be glad
to, Mr. President.
4430
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Dollinger yields.
SENATOR SKELOS: Did you sit on
the Task Force on Reapportionment and
Redistricting?
SENATOR DOLLINGER: I did indeed,
Senator.
SENATOR SKELOS: Did we have
hearings throughout the state?
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Yes, we did.
If he's asking me to yield, Mr.
President, for another question, I will yield
and answer yes.
SENATOR SKELOS: Senator
Dollinger, shouldn't you know that Babylon is
in the county of Suffolk, not in the county of
Nassau?
SENATOR DOLLINGER: You know,
you're absolutely right. Mr. President,
Senator Skelos has once again come upon an
idiosyncrasy that it's also -- the contagion
that has been inflicting Nassau County has
moved silently into Suffolk. I find from
Senator Sampson's bill that it's moved its way
into Queens.
4431
In some ways it's like West Nile
virus, or what do they called those horned
toads or the horned beetles that are eating up
the tree in the Central Park? Senator
Montgomery and Senator Krueger know all about
it.
But this is the new contagion.
It's moved from Nassau, it's spread into
Suffolk, it's on its way to Queens, it's going
to go to Brooklyn. Before you know it, it
might even come upstate.
Now, mind you, it will probably
never come to the 54th Senate District,
because of course that district is represented
by a Democrat named yours truly, and the
chance that this house would actually pass a
bill that had my name on it probably would
make it somewhat remote that the disease will
actually come to Monroe County.
But I agree with you, Senator
Skelos. I regard this as a greater tragedy
that it's now spread to Suffolk County. It
seems to me that we ought to put this
contagion to an end. We've got the perfect
inoculation, Mr. President. It's called the
4432
statewide vaccine against partial property tax
exemptions. The easy way to do it is just to
pass a statewide bill that will allow
assessors to do that.
Make it a both-ways bill. If it's
tax-exempt for part of the year or if it's
tax-exempt and then bought by someone for
for-profit uses, flip it to the other side.
Do a both-ways bill.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: I would like to
ask my colleagues from Monroe County to search
far and wide for a tax exemption bill in the
54th Senate District so that we could put
Senator Dollinger's name on the bill, record
it, and pass it with his objection.
(Laughter.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Any
other Senator wish to be heard on the bill?
Read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
4433
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 57. Nays,
1. Senator Dollinger recorded in the
negative.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
Senator Dollinger.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Mr.
President, consistent with my remarks earlier,
could I have also have -- and again, worried
about the spread of contagion to Brooklyn, I'd
like unanimous consent to be recorded in the
negative on Senator Sampson's bill, Calendar
Number 674.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Without
objection, Senator Dollinger will be recorded
in the negative on Calendar 674.
SENATOR DOLLINGER: Thank you.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1266, by the Assembly Committee on Rules,
Assembly Print Number 11231, an act to amend
Chapter 557 of the Laws of 2001 amending the
General Business Law.
SENATOR PATERSON: Explanation.
4434
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Velella, Senator Paterson has requested an
explanation of Calendar 1266.
SENATOR VELELLA: Senator, this
is a sunset provision which is going to be
added to Chapter 557 of the Laws of 2001,
which increased consumer protection for monies
used toward funeral goods and services. These
are the monies that would be set aside,
prearrangement contracts.
This is part of an agreement last
year that was reached between the two houses
and the Governor to put a sunset provision
into the law so that we could reevaluate the
effectiveness of the law. It requires all
money used to purchase funeral merchandise to
be held in trust in an interest-bearing
account, prohibits funeral directors from
accepting any consideration from an insurance
company for the promotion of an insurance
policy that is payable at the death of the
insured for burial or funeral expenses, and
prohibits any company from giving any
consideration to a funeral firm for the
purpose of inducing the sale of any contract
4435
or policy.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Krueger.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Thank you,
Mr. President. If the sponsor would yield to
a question.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Velella, do you yield?
SENATOR VELELLA: Yes, Mr.
President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
sponsor yields.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Thank you,
Mr. President.
Senator Velella, in your
explanation you stated that this legislation
was passed with an agreement with the Governor
to have a sunset provision. I'm new up here.
Why would we pass a consumer protection bill
in one year only to at that time agree to
sunset it the following year.
SENATOR VELELLA: At the time
there was some question as to whether or not
this was the most effective way for New York
State to provide for prearrangements.
4436
There are -- there is a group of
legislators and some individuals who think
that we ought to be doing a different type of
system where we can allow insurance companies
to sell insurance policies for preneed -- for
predeath arrangements.
So that that bill that we passed,
which basically mirrored the Gottfried law -
and Assemblymen Gottfried and Grannis were
very, very instrumental in passing these
original bills, where you have these separate
trusts set up by funeral directors -- by
continuing that and not allowing companies to
sell insurance, there are people who feel that
this may not be the way to go.
What we decided to do, with the
Governor when he signed that into law,
continuing it, was give us a few years to look
at it and evaluate it again, and this is the
extender that would come back. The
alternative would have been to veto the bill,
come back and again and try to repass it.
So when we ended session, we agreed
with the Governor and the Assembly that we
would do a sunset provision. This is
4437
basically a chapter amendment, although the
interceding year took place.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Mr.
President, if the sponsor would yield to an
additional question.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Velella, do you continue to yield?
SENATOR VELELLA: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
sponsor yields.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Thank you,
Senator Velella.
What are we doing to study this
issue? Because I was reading about it, and I
have my own concerns from a consumer
perspective what it would mean to offer this
insurance. Some of the numbers that I saw led
me to believe it wasn't a very good deal.
SENATOR VELELLA: What are we
doing?
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Well, yes.
And I'm on the Consumer Protection
Committee, although, again, I've only been
here 15 weeks. When are we scheduling open
public hearings so that people can come in -
4438
SENATOR VELELLA: Well,
Senator -
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: -- to share
their concerns and for us to study the issue?
SENATOR VELELLA: If we had to
schedule public hearings for every sunset
provision in all of the laws that we have, I
don't think any of us would have enough time.
That depends on whether the
chairman would like to set hearings on that.
Many times the Minority sets up Minority task
forces to have hearings on issues. If you
choose to do that, you may do that.
We can do anything we want to
reevaluate those provisions in the law that we
have set. So if you decide to have Minority
task force hearings or Senator Krueger
hearings, you can do it. We don't stop you.
We're not binding you in any way. We're
giving you the opportunity by passing this
sunset to say: I'm going to look at this
issue.
And everyone in this chamber has
the right to look at it in any way they see
fit. And when we decide to either extend it
4439
or replace it with something different, I'm
sure you will take the floor and tell us what
you have done to evaluate whether or not it's
an effective or ineffective law.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Mr.
President, if the Senator will continue to
yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Velella, do you continue to yield?
SENATOR VELELLA: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
sponsor yields.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Thank you,
Senator.
So you've explained to me that you
don't necessarily support my idea of an open
public hearing of both houses to study the
bill. But you did reference in your
explanation that the intention of the sunset
clause was to give the Legislature an
opportunity to study the issues.
If not open hearings, how will the
Legislature be studying the issue further?
SENATOR VELELLA: Any way each
individual legislator or the chairman of the
4440
Consumer Affairs Committee or the chairman of
the Insurance Committee or any other committee
that thinks they may have jurisdiction deems
it proper for them to look at the bill.
We're going to be passing shortly a
school board governance bill which has a
seven-year sunset, and we're going to
supposedly be looking at whether or not that's
going to be a good idea seven years from now.
Now, seven years from now, the only
thing we're guaranteed is that Senator Marchi
and I will be here. We may have a new Senate,
we may have a new Assembly, we may have a new
governor. We'll probably have new majority
and minority leaders, a new speaker. But
Marchi and Velella will be here. So have
faith that the system works. We will protect
the interests in the future.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Mr.
President, if I might speak on the bill.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Of
course. Senator Krueger, on the bill.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Thank you
very much.
I've been thrown by the seven-year
4441
analysis. Excuse me, I thought we were only
talking about the sunsetting of one year on
this bill.
My reading of this was that the
Governor recognizes these are complex issues
relating to the sale of preneed funeral
insurance that require further study. I am
not on the Insurance Committee; I am on the
Consumer Protection Committee.
I do hope and urge this house to
approach this study by having open public
hearings, perhaps a joint hearing of Consumer
Affairs and the Insurance Committee. I would
be happy to work on that. I think it is
critical on an issue that in fact of course
affects every New Yorker at some point, their
death and planning for their death, that we
give serious consideration to the realities of
consumer concerns as well as industry
concerns, both insurance and funeral industry
concerns.
So while I am still not sure how I
will vote on this bill and look forward to
more information, I think it is one of the
issues, unlike perhaps any number of other
4442
sunsetted bills, that is critical that we
bring in public participation, that we hear
from people not only in our own state but do
homework as to the other states that have had
prepaid funeral insurance, how much money is
going into those policies versus the return
for people, the advantages and disadvantages.
In fact, the little research I've
been able to do so far leads me to believe
that there are extraordinary cost differences
between the model we have in place where you
can prepay for a funeral through a trust
versus paying for funeral insurance in
advance. And I worry that people will be
confused and misled about these differences
and we will end up going down the road with
the repeal of this good consumer protection
bill from a year ago resulting, in a year from
now, finding ourselves in a situation where
very often older people are being exploited
unfairly and lose money on a proposition.
So I am still waiting to make my
decision on this bill, appreciate the
Senator's comments, but do believe this is a
bill that is critical for open hearings and
4443
public participation.
Thank you.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: Will the Senator
yield for a question?
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Krueger, will you yield for a question from
Senator Duane?
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you.
Through you, Mr. President.
Are you aware -- is the Senator
aware that I served on a legislative body
before coming here to the Senate chamber?
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Yes, I knew
you were in the New York City Council before
you came to the New York State Senate.
SENATOR DUANE: And through you,
Mr. President, if the sponsor would continue
to yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Well,
it's Senator Krueger you want.
4444
SENATOR DUANE: Would the Senator
continue to yield.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Yes, I do,
Senator Duane.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR DUANE: And during the
time that I served on the New York City
Council, did there come many, many, many times
when we had public hearings on legislation?
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Yes, I am
very familiar with large numbers of City
Council hearings. I in fact testified at
large numbers of open public City Council
hearings.
SENATOR DUANE: And through you,
Mr. President, if the Senator would continue
to yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator,
do you continue to yield?
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Yes, I do,
Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR DUANE: And at those
4445
hearings, in addition to advocates in social
policy and academics, the New York City
administration would also testify at those
hearings?
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Mr.
President, yes, it is my experience that we
would call in -- excuse me, that the City
Council would call into their hearings
government agency representatives from
throughout the government, including the
mayor's administration, to discuss important
issues with the public.
SENATOR DUANE: And through you,
Mr. President, if the Senator would continue
to yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator,
do you yield?
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Yes, Mr.
President, I do.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR DUANE: And I'm wondering
if you believe that in fact we council members
often ended up crafting better legislation as
a result of listening to the administration
4446
and its agencies, as well as advocates and
people from the academic fields, as well as,
say, if we were doing a bill similar to this,
people from the industry?
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Mr.
President, to respond to the Senator, not only
do I think that that's a better model, as it
related to the New York City Council process,
but I would agree that it's a better model as
it relates to how our Congress operates, both
the U.S. House of Representatives and the U.S.
Senate, and how, at least my understanding is,
many state legislatures operate throughout
this country.
SENATOR DUANE: And if the
Senator would continue to yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator,
do you continue to yield?
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Yes, Mr.
President, I do.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR DUANE: And if the
Senator could just tell us again how long
she's been here in the New York State Senate.
4447
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: I believe,
Senator Duane, that this is my 15th week in
the chambers.
SENATOR DUANE: And through you,
Mr. President, if the Senator would continue
to yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator,
do you continue to yield?
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Yes, Mr.
President, I do.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR DUANE: And do you know
how many public hearings there have been on
legislation since you've been here, from the
committees you serve on?
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Mr.
President, I do not believe there have been
any public hearings scheduled on any committee
that I sit on during the time that I've been
here.
SENATOR DUANE: Thank you, Mr.
President. Thank you.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
last section.
4448
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Libous, to explain his vote.
SENATOR LIBOUS: Mr. President,
thank you. I want to applaud Senator Velella
for putting this sunset provision in the bill.
I am quite familiar with this. And
I think what this allows us to do is to
examine the bill after a certain period of
time to see what its effectiveness is. I
think there are a number of people in New York
State who, while they think that the original
legislation was probably good legislation, I
for one will be very interested in seeing the
performance.
So, Senator Velella, I want to say
thank you for putting the sunset provision in.
I think it's the right thing to do. And I
think by doing that it provides all of the
answers to what my colleagues on the other
side of the aisle were kind of requesting.
4449
Because if there was no sunset provision,
there would be no opportunity for us to review
the bill.
So I think it's the right thing to
do, and I vote aye.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Libous will be recorded in the affirmative.
Senator Krueger, to explain her
vote.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Thank you
very much.
I appreciate the Senator's
comments, because it's reaffirmed my decision
to vote no on the bill. Of course we can
study the bill even if we don't repeal it
today, sunset the bill. We can repeal the
bill at any time that we've done our study and
found that it was not an effective bill.
And I'd argue that since the bill
is less than a year old, the need to sunset it
at this point in time is not called for. But
rather, to continue my argument before, we
should be studying the issue, we should be
investigating the pros and cons. And if we in
fact discover that this was not a good bill,
4450
we should at that time repeal the bill.
So I do vote no, because I don't
think we need to have a sunset provision. So
thank you for the clarification.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Liz Krueger will be recorded in the negative.
The Secretary will announce the
results.
THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
the negative on Calendar Number 1266 are
Senators Andrews, Duane, Gentile,
Hassell-Thompson, Hevesi, L. Krueger, Maziarz,
Morahan, and Stavisky. Ayes, 49. Nays, 9.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
Senator Bruno.
SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President,
can we at this time take up Calendar Number
1270.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
Secretary will read Calendar 1270.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
1270, substituted earlier today by the
Assembly Committee on Rules, Assembly Print
Number 11627, an act to amend the Education
4451
Law, in relation to reorganization.
SENATOR BRUNO: Is there a
message at the desk?
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: There is
a message at the desk.
SENATOR BRUNO: I would move that
we accept the message.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: All
those in favor of accepting the message of
necessity signify by saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Those
opposed, nay.
(No response.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
message is accepted.
The bill is before the house.
Senator Bruno.
SENATOR BRUNO: Thank you, Mr.
President and colleagues.
The bill before us, as you know,
changes the way schools in New York City will
be governed. And we've been referring to it
as the governance bill. We passed a bill, I
believe about two weeks ago here in this
4452
chamber, and at that time we observed and
commented that this was historic. For decades
people have talked about changing the way
schools are managed in the city. Never has
the Legislature been able to get together with
the Executive and with the Mayor of the city
to accomplish such a dramatic change.
The Assembly passed this bill last
night. They made some revisions, in agreement
with the Governor, with the Mayor, and with
us. So we are passing and giving final
passage to this bill.
And I want to applaud the members
here from the city that have been involved in
this issue, from the time Senator Marchi
started the school system in New York -- oh,
no.
(Laughter.)
SENATOR BRUNO: That came a
little bit after the Senator's time.
But in 1994, I believe Senator
Marchi did the Marchi Commission and talked
about the schools and what might be done to
improve the quality of the education that
takes place there.
4453
And here we are today, with Senator
Padavan having been very, very involved, and
Senator Maltese, and so many others -- Senator
Espada. But Senator Velella, who is now the
sponsor of this legislation that is before us,
will take his place in the history books as
the sponsor of this legislation and as the
only Senator, to my knowledge, that served as
a school board president for several years.
So that he knows, firsthand, secondhand,
third-hand, what needed to get done.
So we commend him, we applaud him
for your diligence, for your persistence, and
for all of your good deeds on behalf of not
just your constituency but the entire
constituency of New York City and,
consequently, in the state.
Mayor Bloomberg said last night, as
we joined he and the Governor and President
Randi Weingarten of the United Federation of
Teachers, announcing their agreement, there
isn't a greater or better investment that we
can make in that city or in this state than
investing in our young people to give them the
very best education to allow them to go out
4454
and meet the challenging world that they must
face.
So we're proud of this work that
we're doing here today. We're proud that we
were able to take a leadership position, pass
this bill two weeks ago, and that we can
partner with the Speaker and with the Assembly
in getting it done together.
So this is an important moment in
our lives, the lives of the people in
New York, the people in this state. So I want
to commend you, my colleagues, whom I'm sure
will be supportive, and welcome your comments
and your observations as we continue to
discuss this critically important issue to all
of us.
Thank you, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Velella.
SENATOR VELELLA: Thank you, Mr.
President. I'm going to be brief and explain
what the basic differences are between this
bill and the bill which we passed last week.
I think, as Senator Bruno
indicated, this is a historic time. I have
4455
been in the Legislature for almost 30 years,
and I have been supportive of this concept and
sponsored this legislation when I was in the
Assembly, and throughout all the mayors that I
have served under, going back to Beame, Koch,
Dinkins, Giuliani, and now Mayor Bloomberg.
I think that the time has come
when, as I said on the last bill, the buck has
to stop somewhere when we blame people for the
problems of education in the City of New York.
Now, we can take this bill and nitpick it
apart -- because I don't like everything in
this bill that I'm sponsoring. I have some
problems with some of the things in this bill.
And last week the members of the Minority did
an excellent job at nitpicking apart certain
parts of the bill that they did not like.
But I think the difference is,
while I don't like some of the things in this
bill, I say that we have to get started doing
something. It's better to light that candle
than to curse the darkness. We need to get
started to reform and revise the system of
education in the City of New York which has
failed. It is not doing the job it should be
4456
doing.
And there are parts to this, as I
outline them, that I'm not happy with. But
let us start with the differences. And there
are five basic differences. There may be a
couple of technical things, and if you have a
question, feel free to ask them.
But first we put into this bill a
maintenance of effort. And last week many of
you pointed out that there was no maintenance
of effort in that bill that we proposed, but
we talked about doing one for the five big
cities. So the Speaker wanted to put it in
this bill, and we put into this bill what we
would have done for the five cities in a
separate bill. And I think we'll be seeing
very shortly a bill for the other four cities.
So while we didn't differ on it in
terms of the need for maintenance of effort,
we certainly feel that that is what was
needed. It is in this bill rather than in
another bill. And if that made the Assembly
happy, so be it. It gets the bill done.
One part that I don't agree with is
the seven-year sunset. As I said to Senator
4457
Krueger in the prior bill, the only thing I
can be sure about happening seven years from
now as far as leadership in this state is that
Senator Marchi will be here and I will be
here. Other than that, I don't know what
senators, what assemblymen, what governor will
be here. But we are leaving ourselves at the
mercy of those people who will be here seven
years from now.
Now, I don't think that that's
sound policy. I think that that's really a
bad policy. And I hope within the next seven
years we're going to have the intestinal
fortitude to stand up and address that.
Because I don't think we ought to have a
system where our kids are being educated and
in seven years, if we should have a governor,
a majority leader, or a speaker who wants to
be stubborn, they can just sit there and say:
We're not renewing your system of education.
And all of a sudden, the old system that
didn't work comes back into existence.
It's putting a chip on the table to
politicize the education of our young people.
I don't think we should have it. But I'm not
4458
going to throw the bill out to just say we
can't do anything, we need to repeal it, we
need to take out that section that has a
seven-year sunset clause in it. This is
better than nothing.
And while I don't agree with that,
I'm going to work very hard in the future to
try and eliminate that, it's part that the
Speaker insisted.
Now, there are some that say there
were more political motives to this bill and
to the sunset provision. And it gives an
opportunity to put the next mayor of the City
of New York, assuming that Mayor Bloomberg
might be reelected, the next one to come in
will have to come up here and beg us to try
and extend the system that we're putting in
place now. I don't think we should start any
mayor off at that level. So I don't
particularly agree with that sunset provision.
But in order to get the main part
of this bill done, to start reforming the
governance of schools in the city of New York,
we're going along with it. And that's the
basic difference between the Minority position
4459
of the other day and our position. We're
willing to compromise and accept something to
get something started, to get it done, rather
than to just nitpick and say "If it isn't my
way, I don't want it."
Additionally, the third difference
is the chancellor will need a waiver if his
qualifications aren't up to the qualifications
of the statute. We had a different provision
in the law where he could have a deputy
chancellor fill the need for those provisions.
Under this bill, the chancellor will need a
waiver, very much as the present chancellor is
operating with an existing waiver.
There will be a two-year extension
of the Wicks Law, which wasn't touched in the
prior bill. And school boards will stay in
existence to June 30, 2003, with a task force
established with 10 members from the Senate
and 10 members from the Assembly to come up
with an idea and make recommendations to us on
what we should do to replace the school
boards.
That will be the basic provisions
of the bill, in addition to all the other
4460
things that we had in the bill that we passed
last week.
As I said, there are some parts to
this bill I don't like. But to get started,
we need to pass this bill today. And I would
hope that with the help of all of you in this
house, you will put some nitpicking, partisan
differences aside, and let's get this bill
into law. Let's give the Mayor an opportunity
to reform the system.
We won't have to worry about a
school board system where everybody is
pointing to everybody else. The mayor says:
"I'm not responsible, it's the chancellor's
job." The chancellor says: "I'm not
responsible, it's the school board, members of
the Board of Education that are my bosses that
give me the problem." And the board members
turn around and say: "It's the mayor's job,
because he's the guy who has the money."
We're going to stop that. We're
going to say the buck stops at the mayor's
office.
I commend Mayor Bloomberg for
standing up, like other mayors before him, and
4461
saying "I want to reform the system, I want to
take the burden on my back, I want to stand
before the voters for reelection and show them
what I can do." Let's give him the chance.
Let's support this bill.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Padavan.
SENATOR PADAVAN: Thank you, Mr.
President.
I appreciate very much and applaud
Senator Velella and his explanation of some of
the salient issues contained in this
legislation. And without repeating everything
he said, because it doesn't really require
repetition, I think it is important to
emphasize that we have now an opportunity -
and I emphasize the word "opportunity" -- for
a mayor to be totally engaged with this system
of education, engaged and responsible and
accountable, unlike mayors prior to this date.
To select a chancellor to wrap his arms around
that system and obviously to have an
incentive, heretofore nonexistent, to provide
the resources to make that system work as well
as it can.
4462
Now, on that point, if I lived far
removed from the City of New York and read the
many things that are printed and heard some of
the words that are articulated by legislators,
I would have the impression that the system in
the City of New York that educates 1.1 million
children is in total disarray and no child
gets educated and every school board is
corrupt.
I assure you who might have gotten
that impression, that is not the case. As I
look around this chamber, I see many
legislators who are a product of that public
school system, myself included. Someone might
debate the issue, but I don't think we did
that badly. My children attended the public
school system in my district, and I'm proud to
say they did extremely well, as I'm sure many
of your children.
Many of the school boards in
Queens, in my area, and Bay Ridge, Brooklyn,
and Staten Island and the Bronx, Manhattan,
have done an outstanding job of being
advocates on behalf of the children in the
system. And it all boils down to educating
4463
kids. And that's what this should all be
about. So to blanket the entire system and to
say no child is being educated, no school
board works well, everybody should be
replaced, words to that effect, is wrong.
It's simply not the case.
Having said that, however, there
are many children who are not having their
potential maximized within the framework of
the system, largely due to resources that are
not available. We know, all of us certainly
from the city know that many of our children
come from dysfunctional families,
socioeconomic backgrounds, foreign countries,
where there is no support at home, where there
is no parent to make sure that the homework is
done and that problems are addressed in the
school and elsewhere if necessary. It's just
not there.
So how do you deal with that?
Longer school days, summer school,
after-school programs? A system that is more
engaged in terms of dealing with that
youngster?
Addressing needs. Needs. And that
4464
was the essence of the Campaign for Fiscal
Equity court case and the decision rendered by
Judge DeGrasse, 98 pages in length.
And how do you do that? By getting
those resources in there. And how do you do
that? By getting a mayor who is accountable
who will have to provide those resources
because, he says -- and I believe him -- "my
tenure as mayor will be evaluated and rated
based on how well I do to improve the
education of those children who are not
getting a proper education."
So he's going to have to put in the
resources to do it, because you and I know
without them it's just not going to happen.
Now, Senator Velella mentioned this
seven-year sunset. It came as a surprise to
me yesterday, as it did to everybody else.
We did a degree, and I think a
significant degree, of governance reform in
1996. We took away patronage from the school
boards. We provided more accountability
between the superintendents and principals.
We did a whole host of things. Many of those
things have produced some positive results, I
4465
might add. But we didn't have a sunset
provision. We said if we have to make more
changes or evolve into something even better,
we will do it. And we are doing it.
We did custodian reform. You
remember the days when the principal reported
to the custodian, in effect. We changed that.
We didn't have a sunset provision in there.
We did away with principal tenure, to make
them more accountable. We didn't have a
sunset in there.
Why this is here is beyond my
ability to understand. And it has a problem.
If for some reason, as Senator Velella pointed
out, nothing is done at the end of those
years, everything we're going to do today
implodes and we revert back to the system
currently in effect.
Now, I ask you this rhetorical
question. How do 32 elected school boards all
of a sudden reappear? Impossible. Or a
central board of education reappear? It's
ludicrous.
But the Assembly insisted upon it.
And we don't want to stand in the way of
4466
progress by refusing to do the bill because of
that reason.
One of the other things Senator
Velella mentioned is maintenance of effort.
Maintenance of effort can be defined in many
different ways. We have defined it in terms
of legislation that has been before this
house, and passed by this house in prior
years, as saying that the City of New York and
the other four cities, the dependent school
districts, shall maintain a level of education
funding on a percentage basis commensurate
with that, over an average of three years.
And when the state, as it has repetitively,
year after year, increases aid to education,
that those localities, those cities must do
likewise. That's what maintenance of effort
means.
And again referring back to Judge
DeGrasse's decision, he pointed out that in
the City of New York, over a specific time
frame, the city's portion of the education
budget went from 41 percent down to
37 percent. And as he said, the city has not
maintained its effort.
4467
Now, what's in this bill? What's
in this bill is a maintenance of effort
provision -- and I call it that with quotes -
which says that there is a base year, and it's
this fiscal year, and the city shall not
provide funding any less than that.
Well, that's something. It's
better than nothing. It means they can't cut
next year when we add, unless there's
something catastrophic. And there's a
safeguard in there, if you will, to allow that
to happen.
But generally speaking, in future
years the city could not have an education
budget less than the current fiscal year 2003.
Which means, again, if we add money, it will
be on top of. Unless, getting back to what I
said before, the mayor, who will be
accountable for the productivity associated
with this new venture, continues to add
resources, as we certainly hope he will.
Now, the other issue relates to the
community school boards. I said earlier that
there are many community school boards -- and
I certainly could point to those in my
4468
district -- who as advocates are very, very
effective in giving an opportunity for
parents' associations and others interested in
the education of their children to coalesce
behind an initiative to draw attention to
problems that exist in individual schools or
districtwide. They might be space problems,
they may be a variety of issues of working
with the school-based leadership councils that
we mandated in 1996.
They do an effective job. There
are many -- there are 32 school districts -
I'm in no doubt don't do an effective job.
Now, it seems to me that a better
approach was one engendered in our bill that
we passed a week ago, where we said we keep
the school boards but between now and a fixed
point in time we will evaluate their efficacy
and determine whether or not we want to
eliminate them, change them, keep them, or
whatever we think, through the public hearing
process, is the most appropriate thing to do.
But what the Assembly insisted upon
is that we sunset them now and then have a
task force to evaluate not what to do with
4469
them, but what to replace them with. That is
a debatable proposal.
I think our original way made more
sense. I think this is the cart before the
horse. We're prejudging, and I don't think
that's, if I had my choice, the right way to
go.
The other issue relevant to that is
something called the Justice Department. Many
of you will recall several years ago we passed
a bill changing the method by which school
board members were elected. We went from an
archaic system of paper ballots and cascading
votes that nobody understood, myself included,
to a machine.
SENATOR CONNOR: I understood it.
SENATOR PADAVAN: Yes, Senator
Connor understood it.
But nevertheless, the average
person didn't. And I think it was a detriment
to people voting. But nevertheless, we went
to a machine voting system, one that was more
efficient and I think far better.
In any event, the Justice
Department had to review that. Guess what?
4470
They said no. In the three counties, you
can't do it.
When they get a copy of this
bill -- and I can assure you they will -- and
they see that we not only changed the election
process, we eliminated this elected body, I
think you can guess what their reaction is
going to be. They're going to say: No, no,
no, no, you are dealing with minority voting
rights and you can't do that, not without some
very careful review.
Why we are holding ourselves up to
that particular result I find somewhat
disturbing, because we need not do it that
way. We can keep them, have public hearings,
and present to the Justice Department a case
for making a change, whatever that change
turns out to be. Not to prejudge it and
present them with a fait accompli, because I
think their reaction is going to be quite
negative.
Having said all of that, obviously
I intend to vote for this bill, for the
reasons I articulated at the very beginning.
It's a major step forward in terms of ensuring
4471
that there will be additional resources in the
system, there will be more accountability,
there will be a committed mayor, whomever he
or she may be, there will be some cost savings
certainly from the transfer of nonpedagogical
functions to other city agencies.
The School Construction Authority
will be revamped in terms of its governance,
which I think will make it more effective in
terms of building schools and maintaining
schools at less cost, more rapidly.
There are many other good things in
this bill. And so for that reason, I will be
voting for it. But I do want the record to
show the concerns that I and hopefully many
others have with regard to some of these
provisions that are herein contained.
Thank you, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Connor.
SENATOR CONNOR: Thank you, Mr.
President.
Last week I opposed the bill that
we considered then, and nearly every Democrat
in this chamber opposed it. The objections we
4472
articulated were that that bill lacked a
maintenance of effort provision, which this
bill has, that that bill seemed to have a
whole section dealing with the possibility of
vouchers. This bill does not have that.
There was a nepotism provision or an
elimination of an antinepotism provision,
which we objected to, which has been taken
care of in this bill.
There was a fourth point which
Senator Velella mentioned that we objected to,
and -- the waiver. That bill did not require
a waiver for someone who didn't have academic
credentials, and we raised that issue.
So I'm happy to say this bill
addresses those major concerns. I want to
congratulate the Majority here. But more so,
even, I want the congratulate the Assembly
Majority and the Speaker for hanging tough on
those very, very important issues and,
together with our colleagues here, getting
those matters addressed.
Let me say, though, Mr. President,
we had mayoral control. Until 1969, the mayor
controlled the school board in New York City.
4473
And legislators stood on this floor and on the
floor of the Assembly in the late '60s,
announced the system was broken, and they for
the first time in decades were going to do
major changes in the governance of New York
City's schools.
They were going to have a new form
of Board of Education, appointed a different
way, not just by the mayor. They were going
to have elected community school boards and
community districts to give communities and
parents a role.
And they hailed this in the late
'60s as the birth of a new era for New York
City's public schools. And indeed, the
leaders of the day said: This is the first
time -- and forget decades, Mr. President, it
was the first time since in the 19th century
that there had been a change in governance of
New York City's public school system.
What went wrong? Well, some of the
problems in New York City's schools can't be
managed away. As Senator Padavan pointed out,
both last week, from the DeGrasse decision,
and today, resources matter, and resources
4474
that address special needs. And New York City
does have a lot of children, a lot of
schoolchildren who have very special needs.
Language needs, support kind of needs because
of the absence of parent thing.
One thing, though, I would disagree
with Senator Padavan about is he mentioned
that we have a lot of children whose parents
are foreigners. Yes, and some of the
best-performing children in New York City's
public schools are the children of immigrants.
I see that in my son's own school. You look
around New York City and you see that
certainly in all of the schools. Whether they
be Hispanic immigrants or Russian immigrants
or Asian immigrants, certainly some of the
highest achievers come from homes where the
parents' use of English is very limited but
where there is a real tradition of the parents
encouraging their children to study, to read,
to achieve.
That said, there are many, many
needs. And it's a huge system, Mr. President.
So let me say this. I am not overly sanguine
that we have solved all the problems by doing
4475
this, any more than the Legislature in the
late '60s, when they departed from mayoral
control -- which had been in place since, I
believe, the 1880s -- when they departed from
that and hailed a new era seemed to have
gotten it right.
One of the problems is really our
neglect of some salient governmental and
budget principles got us here. Why, in 1969,
did they come up with a Board of Education of
two mayoral appointees and five appointees,
one each from the borough presidents?
That wasn't an accident, Mr.
President. That reflected where the real
budgetary power in New York City was at the
time. We had a relatively weak mayor,
budgetarily, and a very strong -- remember? -
Board of Estimate. And it made sense to make
the borough presidents partners in the Board
of Ed because they controlled the
pursestrings, together with the mayor, through
the Board of Estimate.
It's not that those legislators in
the late '60s got it wrong, came up with,
whoa, a Board of Ed with five borough
4476
president appointees and only two mayoral
appointees. At the time, those borough
presidents had clout. There was no budget, no
city contract that could be entered into, no
project done in New York City that cost money
without the concurrence of the Board of
Estimate. So it made a lot of sense to have
the Board of Ed reflect the people who held
the pursestrings at the time; namely, the
Board of Estimate.
The Board of Estimate got abolished
through court decisions some 12, 14 years ago.
We never changed the governance system in the
schools. We never changed the governance
systems. Now we had a dissonance. The mayor
was suddenly, under the new city charter, a
strong mayor with strong budgetary powers. No
more need he or she answer to the Board of
Estimate; i.e., the borough presidents.
Yet we left in place a school
governance system that placed power in the
hands of the appointees of the borough
presidents, who were no longer fiscal partners
with the mayor.
So for that reason, Mr. President,
4477
while I don't think changing governance is
going to solve the problems -- I think
resources will -- I think it makes eminently
good sense for us now for reflect the real
political reality when it comes to budgetary
powers in New York City. The mayor has it.
The borough presidents don't have it. We need
to change that structure. We need to reflect
the real strength, the real power to provide
resources to the schools.
The maintenance of effort provision
is good. What's more important, Mr.
President, is no longer can a mayor stand up
at a town hall meeting -- and they all have
them. At least certainly Mayor Giuliani,
Mayor Koch, Mayor Dinkins. I think -- I'm
sure this mayor will have them as he gets
going, the so-called town hall meetings where
parents and others stand up and say: "Look at
this. You call this a textbook? It's 30
years old, missing half its pages."
No longer will a mayor be able to
say: "Listen, the city gives billions of
dollars to the Board of Ed, but I don't have
any power over what they do with it. I have
4478
no power. Talk to the Board of Ed and their
appointee, the chancellor. I just give them
the money. They decide what they do with it."
No longer can mayors duck.
I say to Mayor Bloomberg: I wish
you well in managing the school system. I
also say you got what you wished for. I hope
it works out for you. Because there's nowhere
to run, nowhere to hide. Put up the money,
manage it, and be accountable to the residents
in New York City, to our schoolchildren and
parents. There's no more pointing the finger
at the Board of Ed. It's your Board of Ed
now. It's your chancellor, Mayor. Deliver
the goods, no excuses.
I'm voting aye, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Malcolm Smith.
SENATOR MALCOLM SMITH: Thank you
very much, Mr. President.
And let me thank, obviously, my
leader, Senator Connor, Senator Bruno, both
leaders of this house, Assemblyman Silver,
also Padavan, Velella, and some of those other
members on the task force for probably
4479
tackling what is the number-one concern and
issue around the state today.
Some will ask, how did we get here?
Was it simply because the Mayor pressed his
way forward on this issue? Was it simply a
matter of timing? Mr. President, I would
challenge many of those thoughts to hopefully
get to the point where we recognize we got
here today because of each and every person
sitting in this chamber.
I believe everyone has begun to
realize, as they have begun to realize the
same with the Rockefeller Drug Laws, that
things have clearly come to a point where
there was a need for change.
If you look at each and every one
of us in terms of why we're in this chamber
and why we are here and what we believe we are
supposed to do, and some of that reflects in a
very benevolent sense. And that is we are
here to do the right thing, we are here to do
what we think is the good thing in terms of
how other people's lives are shaped and
formed.
Today we are passing a bill that
4480
will probably change the course of this
particular state. Because we are now giving
every single child in at least the city of
New York -- and perhaps in the five cities,
subsequent to this -- the opportunity to dream
their dream and to basically accomplish their
dream by being educated in a proper way.
Senator Connor raised the question
of resources. And clearly while this bill
gives the mayor the opportunity to control and
manage the system by having the ability to
reward and punish those who do not perform in
the capacity in which they are hired to do so,
there clearly needs to be some resources there
as well.
This bill becomes interesting
because, as I have moved through this
particular chamber and other venues dealing
with groups, it seems to me when you run into
a particular piece of legislation or agreement
where not everybody is happy, as in most
negotiations, that means that something was
done right.
Clearly, there is one side that has
problems with the sunset, they have problems
4481
with the removal of the school boards. There
is the other side that is happy about the
maintenance of effort, along with some other
particular details that are in the bill.
But what becomes I think critically
important to everyone in this chamber, Mr.
President, is that we don't fall into that
particular verbal disease that we tend to run
to every now and then as the future becomes
apparent to us, and that is the verbal disease
of "I told you so" or "I was right." What I
hope is that we don't get to the point where
we want to be proud to say "I told you so" or
"I told you I was right."
If in fact there comes a time when
we can talk to the mayor or his
superintendents or the principals and we see
there is something that might need to be
corrected in the system, I hope we take the
time to speak to the mayor or speak to the
chancellor. Because, in speaking to them, we
then will allow ourselves to be a part of
correcting something that we tried to correct
here today.
We will have the opportunity,
4482
assuming there is less bureaucracy than is in
play right now -- and I believe that will be
so with this bill. But we will have the
opportunity as individuals who can relate to
and speak to the superintendents or the
principals or the mayor. We will have the
opportunity to provide correction to something
that might be wrong or something that we might
see in the system that may be wrong.
What I'm hoping that we don't do is
just sit back and say "Well, I told you so. I
was right. Let's just let the system run off
the track, as it is now running, and let's do
nothing to correct it. Let's just wait for
the seven years to pass, or let's just wait
till we have the opportunity to sit back and
make some changes in school governance again."
What my challenge is to all of my
colleagues here, those that are downstate and
upstate, is when that time comes, let's please
not fall into that particular situation.
Let's not run in the other direction and just
say: Well, you wanted it, you got it, now
it's up to you. Let's just remember that this
is bigger than all of us. This particular
4483
bill, this particular need, the particular
void that we're trying to fill has really
nothing to do with each and every one of us
individually.
What it really has to do with is
Mrs. Jones and her two kids who she is trying
to make sure get a decent education. She's
working two jobs. She wants her children to
be educated so they have the opportunity to go
out there to become productive citizens. She
wants to make sure that her child who is in
special ed seems to have the opportunity to
still become educated and go forward with his
life and to be productive.
The young lady who is now working
two jobs, who is no longer married, has a son
who is running amuck in the system, now you
have a system hopefully that will be able to
monitor this particular child's behavior and
correct it.
Remember, those are the issues and
the concerns that we need to rest in our
minds, and not so much about our intellectual
ability as legislators to come up with some
corrective measures or some finger-pointing
4484
moments when this bill or certain things in
the bill may need to be addressed. Whether it
is the 13 members on the board or it's the way
the trustees have dealt with the School
Construction Authority, whether it is the way
the teachers perform, the bottom line is it's
about those individuals who are on the bottom
of the food chain. And those individuals
represent John and Mary and Susan and Alice
and Michael and all those individual children
who are now saying: I hope that I will be
able to stand before this body one day and say
that I was educated, I was educated well in a
system that is extremely large.
So, Mr. President, I will be voting
aye today. But I will be voting aye with the
understanding that I am also going to monitor
this particular process as it is going
forward. And I will continue to stay as
micro-ly involved in this process. It may not
be a perfect bill. It may be a bill that we
think there needs to be some corrective
measures after today.
But the bottom line is after today
we need to make sure that we are still there
4485
so when the time comes and we need to have
some input as to how some things can be made
differently, we take the time to do that. And
we do not get to the point where we just
simply say "I told you so, I thought I was
right."
I will be voting aye.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Lachman.
SENATOR LACHMAN: While my
distinguished colleagues were talking, I was
writing two setting of remarks down.
This is a very difficult bill to
work on and a very difficult bill to vote on.
But there have been, as my colleagues have
mentioned, major positive improvements on the
bill that this chamber voted on just a week
ago.
It gives the mayor great powers in
education, powers that the mayor had between
1896 and 1969. It took us over thirty years
to change those powers. I'm not certain, as I
said last week, that governance is the key to
the issue. But certainly, as I think Senator
Connor had mentioned, and others before,
4486
mayors will no longer have the privilege and
distinction of blaming the school system on
either 32 community school boards or the
Central Board of Education.
Now, I differ with my learned
colleague Senator Velella. I think it's good
that we have the seven-year sunset law in
this. I think one of the problems we had in
the past is we had 30 years and 40 years and
50 years of centralization, decentralization
six times since 1805, and we didn't have a
sunset provision built into it.
After sunset, there is sunrise.
And I believe in the next seven years if we
find there are problems in this bill, there
will be an opportunity to change it.
And for the record, I want it to be
stated that the Mayor has gone even further.
The Mayor has said publicly again and again
that if after three years there is not marked
improvement in the educational achievement of
the children of the city of New York, then not
only has the bill failed, but the Mayor has
failed.
The Mayor has to be commended
4487
because he has taken a major, major issue of
controversy and has made it the signal issue
of his administration -- as Ed Koch did with
housing, as Rudy Giuliani did with crime.
This is probably going to be even more
controversial than the decision of those two
previous mayors.
Now, everyone has mentioned their
agreement that the maintenance of effort is a
very, very important change to the City of
New York.
I feel that of the 13 members of
the Board of Education, the five appointed by
the boroughs, the borough representatives,
must be parents of children. Today you have a
seven-member board; only one of those members
has a child in the public schools. At least
we will have a 13-member board where five will
have children in the public schools. And when
these children graduate or leave the public
schools, there will have to be change. And I
think that's a very, very important issue.
I also think it's very important
that this bill have what last week's bill
lacked, and that is that no member of this
4488
governance board, which I believe is now
called the Board of Education, shall work for
the City of New York in any capacity or shall
work for the Board of Education in any
capacity.
Unlike the CUNY Board of Trustees,
where members of that board have jobs in the
city administration. And unlike the current
situation where the Central Board of Education
and community school board members have family
members who work for the Board of Education if
they themselves do not work for the Board of
Education.
So those are some of the major
provisions of improvement. But there are
others as well that I think can be mentioned
and should be mentioned before we actually
vote on this measure today.
Basically, basically I'm concerned
about the sunset provisions dealing with the
community school boards. I share Senator
Padavan's reservations. There are community
school boards that are good, there are
community school boards that are fair, and
there are community school boards that are
4489
poor and not doing their job.
I would hope that next year when
this committee of 20, composed of 10
representatives by the Speaker and 10 by the
Majority Leader of this chamber, when they get
together really analyze and discuss what to do
with community school boards. Perhaps even
continuing voting in members of community
school boards, with changes.
Or, if that is not done, appointing
community school board members who represent
the parents of the children, the consumers of
the New York public school system. I would
hope that we will be as open-minded as that
next year. And I have a major concern about
that.
Another concern that I have, which
really has not been discussed in this chamber,
is that there is no educational vision, there
is no educational philosophy behind this bill.
We have come to believe, because of our
frustrations and the failures of the children,
that there can be a quick fix, and that quick
fix is a change in governance. Even though in
almost 200 years we have gone from
4490
centralization to decentralization to
centralization to decentralization and now
back to centralization.
What I'm hoping is that before this
legislation sunsets, before the three years
the Mayor says his administration will be
responsible for the success or failure of the
school system, that we do develop a vision of
education, a philosophy of education, that
will not only serve the city well but will
lead to the achievement of the public
schoolchildren throughout the City of
New York.
The waiver, the power of the waiver
which the Commissioner of Education has
received, is also an important change from the
previous bill that we discussed in this
chamber. Harold Levy received the waiver.
Barbie Wagner did not receive the waiver. The
mayor is not absolute in this. He has to
coordinate now with the State Education
Department and the Commissioner of Education
in terms of who would be appointed chancellor.
Also, I am led to believe that the
Board of Education will now have certain
4491
though limited roles in executing the
decisions made by the board, both financial
and fiduciary decisions as well as areas in
terms of chief operating officers.
These are all improvements as to
what we voted on last week. So the question
is, how am I going to vote? I'm going to vote
yes on this imperfect bill. And I'm going to
vote yes on this imperfect bill because I
discovered this weekend, when I spoke to
parents of children in the public schools and
parents of children in the nonpublic school
and children themselves, that people are fed
up and they want change. I'm not certain this
is the correct change. But I do know if we
don't accept this change, we're not going to
have change for many years more in the future.
So relying upon, relying upon the
collective wisdom of this chamber and the
Assembly and their leadership, I hope and I
pray this bill in governance will become an
improvement over the past bill and enable us
to develop a vision of education that allows
for the education of every single child in the
city, regardless of income, regardless of
4492
race, regardless of ethnicity, regardless of
where they came from.
I am therefore voting yes.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Hevesi.
SENATOR HEVESI: Thank you, Mr.
President. On the bill.
Last week, Mr. President, I stood
up and spoke for about 15 or 20 minutes in
support of the earlier version of Senator
Velella's bill. In fact, I was surprised to
find that I was the only Democrat who
supported it. So I'm not going to get into a
whole long discussion about why mayoral
control is so terribly important. I've done
that already.
This bill that's before us I think
is even better than last week's bill. There
are three fundamental changes. I believe -
well, let me -- I'm not sure if I've heard
another Democrat pass judgment opposed to the
seven-year sunset provision. I know Senator
Lachman thought it was a good idea. So I
don't want anybody to think this is a direct
partisan issue. I think the seven-year sunset
4493
is a bad idea. I agree with some of my
colleagues on the other side of the aisle.
Having said that, this bill is
better. It does away with the local school
boards. Which, you know, they're good in some
areas, a couple of areas, but they're
absolutely horrible, dysfunctional, and an
incredible distraction to true educational
reform. Not to mention the lost money that we
poured down the administrative drain on the
local school boards. We've got to get rid of
them. This bill does it. So it's better than
last week's bill.
And finally, I stood on the floor
last week as all my Democratic colleagues were
calling for maintenance of effort and I said I
really have mixed feelings about it. Because
while it's good in theory, if the City of
New York gets into a fiscal crisis, you could
theoretically have a situation where the mayor
is forced, because of a state legislative
action that requires a maintenance of effort,
to cut police and fire and increase spending
for education. That's bad public policy.
So I said ah, I'm not really sure
4494
about a maintenance of effort. But this bill
has a maintenance of effort that absolutely
takes into consideration that one concern I
had about it, which is yes, maintenance of
effort, additional spending in each successive
year, with the one very intelligent exception
being that if the city is in fiscal crisis
that provision doesn't apply.
So this is a good bill. I'm going
to stop there and do one other thing, because
Senator Connor was very clear in communicating
very loudly to Mayor Bloomberg -- and I know a
lot of us share this opinion. And some of my
colleagues are reticent about supporting this
change because they have not, they feel -- and
I don't know if I agree with this -- they feel
that they have not heard a clearly articulated
educational -- aside from governance reform, a
clearly articulated educational reform plan.
So let me say the following,
because I touched on this two weeks ago. And
I'm going to go in a direction here that I
have not really heard before. I'm going to
give some specifics on where I think we should
go educationally in a detailed way. Okay?
4495
And this is more important, this
one factor that I think we have to focus on is
more important than pumping money into the
system, it is more important than getting the
most qualified teacher in the classroom, it's
more important than having lower class size,
it's more important than universal pre-K, more
important than having adequate supplies in the
school building -- than everything else. And
sometimes people pay lip service to it, but
never really go after it. So I'm going to do
that today.
What we have to do in this system
is get parents -- not involved in running the
school system. I really -- you know, it's -
I don't think it's necessarily a bad thing.
But that seems to be everybody's priority. I
am much less concerned with parents running
public schools, passing judgment over
million-dollar budgets and curriculum
decisions than I am in them getting involved
in their own child's education. Which that
simple fact will improve performance more than
any of the other issues that I mentioned here.
More than money. More than teacher quality.
4496
More than everything else.
Here's what I think we need to do,
Mr. President. I and I hope that Mayor
Bloomberg, who now has -- will have, as a
result of this bill, free rein to do what he
wants to, will hear what I'm saying here and
really go after this. I think there should be
a deputy chancellor for parental
involvement -- you know, I'd love to do it
statutorily. If I was involved in this
process, I might have suggested it -- whose
job is to get parents involved in their own
child's education. That is his mission, that
is his function.
Now, Mr. President, about a month
ago I went to a Met game with two
underprivileged African-American kids from
Nassau County, one of whom had been
essentially adopted, was being mentored by a
30-year-old woman who went to Brown undergrad,
Columbia Law School, and is, you know, a
tremendously successful attorney with a
white-shoe firm in Manhattan. She had adopted
this kid, essentially.
And while we're sitting there
4497
watching the Met game, she explained to me how
one of the children came from a family that's
not ideal where the father was never around
and where the mother was not involved in the
child's education. For whatever reason. I'm
not casting aspersions on her. I don't know
the reasons. It could be she was not prepared
to do that educationally, it could be that she
didn't have the time to do it because she was
working hard, or it could be that she was
apathetic, as some parents unfortunately are.
But the point of this story is that
my friend, the attorney, told me that she, in
the process of mentoring this child, sat down
with the kid and started to do homework with
the child, who had never, outside of the
school, had anyone show an interest in the
schoolwork. And she said, without
exaggeration, that his eyes lit up and he got
excited and he was into it. Now that somebody
cared about the work, he cared about it. It's
absolutely essential.
Here's what we need to do. Here's
my specific plan for parental involvement,
after we appoint a deputy chancellor for
4498
parental involvement. Number one, since so
many kids in the New York City public school
system are the children of immigrants, we need
to replicate, on a massive scale, a program
that exists as I know it in one school in my
Senate district, P.S. 220, where, if you go,
go to any one of the graduations coming up, in
New York City public schools, 80 to 90 percent
of the kids, if you look at them amongst the
faces, are immigrant kids or minority kids.
They're essentially a majority; there's no
minority there. Okay?
P.S. 220 has a program where the
parents of the immigrant children and anyone
else who is interested come into the school
after hours and are taught by the most
dedicated teachers (a) in English instruction
and (b) how to teach their children. I mean,
it's brilliant in its simplicity. It's
absolutely brilliant. And the parents love
it, because they want to get involved.
And in fact, sometimes what happens
are the people who are running this program
target some immigrant families where the
culture is that the parents should not get
4499
involved in the child's education and they try
and break that down, very sympathetically and
very wisely. They do that.
And so that's what we need to do,
number one, on that massive level. Okay? Get
the parents involved by giving them the
skills.
Number two, number two, create a
program where you say to parents: Here's the
program. You come in every Monday night for
two hours, you come in every Wednesday night
for two hours, or you do on it on the weekend,
and you actually work with your own child
under the direct supervision of the people in
the school. You do it and we monitor it.
Not even as -- and you don't
present it as an option. Present it as
something that is essentially mandatory and
watch it be infectious. Okay?
And if that doesn't work, what you
then do -- and this is the only way I would
shore support a tax increase that New York
City. I would suggest a temporary tax
surcharge, income tax surcharge, analogous
with the "Safe Streets, Safe City" surcharge,
4500
and put into what I will call a parental
involvement incentive fund where, if a parent
completes this program where they are, through
this program, directly involved with their
child's education consistently from one
semester to the next, which will show results,
that that parent of that child who is involved
will be offered a tax incentive.
Incentivize it. That's the way to
go it about it. For any family out there
where the parent cannot get involved because
the parent is -- there's only one parent in
the household, they're too busy working or
they don't have the skills or what have you,
have the high schools in that same district
take the honor students and require of those
honor students to adopt kids in the elementary
schools as a Big Brother academic mentoring
program. And we'll find the money to finance
it.
And if you start to do these
things, Mr. President, if you get the parents
involved every single day in their child's
education, you will produce results more
dramatic than if you had all the resources
4501
that we are always here clamoring for. And
now that Mayor Bloomberg is going to have
control of the system, I strongly suggest that
he make parental involvement the primary
focus, even more than all the other very
worthy educational reforms that we need. Make
it for once -- don't just pay lip service to
it, make it for once the primary focus of our
system. That way we can start to achieve real
reform.
I'll be voting aye.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Hassell-Thompson.
SENATOR HASSELL-THOMPSON: Thank
you, Mr. President.
Last week I too spoke on this bill,
and I am very happy to see that three of the
four issues that I raised concerns about have
been addressed in this bill.
But one of the concerns that I
continue to have is the sunset on school
boards. Many people here feel that they
should prescribe what roles parents should and
should not play in the school system. But I
know that in many of the schools in my
4502
district, one of the most successful schools,
most of the successful schools, are those
schools where there's true parent
participation.
Now, whether or not that should -
whether or not there are models that could be
used in other districts to help to support
that, we may not ever know. But one of the
things I certainly intend to do is to lobby
every member of this 20-member board that you
will choose today to make sure that in the
restructuring that there is some way in which
we will have advisory committees that will
allow some participation on the part of
parents to continue to be involved with their
children.
We don't have the kinds of
attendance, perhaps, in many schools in terms
of how parents participate. There's no real
consistency from district to district. Not
even in my own district from school to school
is there -- could I be able to give you
statistics that say I have certain
percentages.
But to a school where we have good
4503
involvement -- we even have a program called
"Building Bridges." And it's a program that
was designed by parents, in cooperation with
teachers who are committed and dedicated to
helping our children to learn, to create
workshops on weekends for parents. And
they're not paid to come into the school. But
twice a month they come and give all-day
workshops to work with parents to assist them
in the kinds of curriculum that are being
offered to their children, so that they have a
sense of what is happening.
Too often what we fail to realize
is that many of the schools in our districts
are the products of parents who did not
themselves finish their own education. And
there is still an intimidation on the part of
many parents going into school systems.
They're not made to feel comfortable. And
there was a wave when parents used to go and
volunteer. And schools became intimidated by
parents and made to impossible for parents to
come.
And so when you do that and you
expect parents that then respond, it is very
4504
difficult to get them to come back into what
is considered a hostile environment. Because
parents are under siege in most school
systems. And we can pretend that we don't
know that, but they are.
And so because of that, we have not
generated the kind of support that parents
need to feel when they come to advocate on
behalf of their children. And I certainly
know and I certainly have had experience with
parents who come and behave totally
inappropriately to teachers and to
administrators. But they are in the minority
in terms of number.
The majority of parents who is take
the time to come to school and to be involved
with their children do so because they care.
And many times they are dependent upon an
education system to give their children many
things that they are not themselves able to
give. Culturally, education is not the same
from culture to culture. And how families
feel about it and have their participation,
there is not the kind of training ground that
I believe that should happen.
4505
I believe that many of our school
districts are a disaster. I think that all
the superintendents that we have, I think that
that's a disaster. Every burg, every hamlet
doesn't need their own superintendent. We
don't need to be paying that kind of money.
So there are a lot of reforms that
we certainly could impose in terms of how we
reform the system. But certainly while I
cannot readily say that I would allow myself
to vote against this bill if all of the
efforts have been put into it to really
improve the system -- we're not there. But I
could not vote with it without declaring that
I think that our desire to dissolve our school
boards is going to prove to be a very
disastrous thing for many of our communities.
Our school boards are the basis for
the relationship between children and parents
that exist. And in those schools where they
work, they work well. And in those districts
where they do not, I believe that we should be
taking remedial kinds of measures to improve
them or to dismiss them.
But I certainly do not think that
4506
we should be throwing out the bathwater with
the baby, particularly because many of them
are the major support base, culturally, for
families in our communities.
So I will, certainly with a
tremendous amount of reluctance, I will vote
in favor. But I certainly will continue to
work between now and the sunset of the school
boards to make my voice heard and to make sure
that what we put in place has some replication
that allows for true and full participation of
parents and community in what happens in our
school system. Because believe it or not,
they are their tax dollars that are going to
pay for this experiment that we're about to
do.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Stavisky.
SENATOR STAVISKY: Mr. President,
I remember the 1969 school wars, so to speak.
And I remember the fiscal crisis of the 1970s.
And history seems to be coming back in the
same kind of cycle that some of the historians
describe.
I had grave misgivings about
4507
mayoral control. And I think the reason I
have such misgivings was that it was taught to
me by my husband. He used to say that mayoral
control is wrong. He used to talk about how
mayoral agencies will be fighting amongst each
other for control of the education dollar,
particularly when the dollar becomes scarce.
And as a result of his concern back
in the '70s when he chaired the Education
Committee in the Assembly, we passed a measure
known commonly as the Stavisky-Goodman Law.
And as I read this bill, I believe that the
Stavisky-Goodman provision, which is currently
in the law and has been for twenty years or
so, will be repealed.
I often say to myself when I look
at these bills, using not only my own
background and judgment, but I say to myself:
What would Leonard say? And I think Leonard
would say that what we really need is a
fiscally independent school district of New
York. That was his position. But that's not
one of the choices. Unfortunately, that is
not one of the choices.
He was a believer in school boards,
4508
as I am. And I think we do indeed have a
problem with the Voting Rights Act in
eliminating school boards, as we seem to be
doing, in effect.
Having said that, last week's bill
I thought was an atrocity. And I still
believe that the real issue here is proper
funding, fair funding, equitable funding for
our schools. And the true solution is
implementation of Judge DeGrasse's decision,
as well as forcing the city to maintain its
fair, its proper contribution to the education
dollar.
Now, having said that, I'm going to
vote for this bill, with misgivings,
particularly with the sunset provision. But I
say to myself that things sunset, but very
often when you see a sun you don't know if
it's a rising sun or a setting sun. And I
hope that this legislation will be a rising
sun and will provide the kind of
accountability that is lacking currently.
And, Mr. Chairman, I vote aye.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Gentile.
4509
SENATOR GENTILE: Thank you, Mr.
President. On the bill.
I, much like Senator Connor,
applaud the Mayor for his desire to have
mayoral control of the school system.
Certainly more accountability, as Senator
Connor said, is a good thing, something
that -- accountability -- no one can defuse
that responsibility if there is mayoral
control. So I applaud this bill for the
aspects of mayoral control.
However, I believe that the aspect
of mayoral control didn't -- this bill didn't
have to make mayoral control mutually
exclusive with community and parental
involvement. Unfortunately, that's what this
bill does in making the mayoral control and
community and parental input mutually
exclusive.
This school governance plan
effectively hands the control of my Brooklyn
schools over to the Mayor while providing only
symbolic input for local communities and
parents. Now, I've long championed reform in
the New York City school system. But really
4510
my first priority is to do the right thing for
the schoolchildren in the Brooklyn public
schools that I represent. And this bill
unfortunately fails to consider the school
districts that work well.
You know, I hear a lot, when we
talk about mayoral control -- and I heard a
lot in the debate here today. One thing I
haven't heard that much about is talk about
the schoolchildren. We hear about governance
and control, but we haven't heard much about
the schoolchildren themselves.
That's what I talk about when I
speak to the parents and school board members
in my district. And I talk to them about
smaller class sizes, about knowing about the
buildings and the conditions of the buildings
that the schools in my district are in, about
the types of new equipment that they need,
about the new books and the new technologies
that my local schools need to have.
That's the kind of things we need
to know. Those are the kinds of things that
we need to talk about. And the parents and
the educators in the districts that I
4511
represent -- District 21, District 20 -- are
overwhelmingly in support of the continued
involvement, the local involvement of the
community school boards.
And why is that? Why is that?
That is so because, because as a result of the
local community involvement of parents and
community members in the school board we have
in District 20, District 21, particularly, we
have good schools, we have good teachers, we
have good principals, we have good
superintendents, and we have involved and
responsible parents. And that has resulted in
some of the highest test scores and
achievements in the City of New York in the
district -- the schools that I represent in my
district.
So given that situation, why would
it be reasonable for any school in my district
or any parent in my district, any community
member of my district to want to transfer that
local control, which has been so successful in
my area, why would we want to transfer that
control now to either the chancellor, in
downtown Brooklyn, or ultimately the mayor at
4512
City Hall? It doesn't make reasonable sense
for the people in my district.
In fact, on February 20th of 2002,
a resolution was unanimously passed by
Community School Board District 20 in Brooklyn
calling for the continued support of community
boards and parental participation in public
schools. It talks about -- and I have a copy
of it here -- it talks about school boards
being that important link between parents,
schools, and the community at large.
This resolution by Community School
Board District 20 was passed unanimously by
the entire board. And I know these
individuals personally, so I know that some of
these individuals are Democrats, some of these
individuals are Republicans, and they span the
spectrum.
So this is not a partisan issue.
This is an issue about community. And these
members, both Democrat and Republicans on this
board, unanimously passed this resolution
calling on the Legislature to maintain that
community parental input into the public
schools.
4513
There's a reason, my friends, my
colleagues, that two of the five Assembly
members yesterday who voted against school
governance in this bill in the Assembly, both
Assembly members Peter Abbate and William
Colton, both represent school districts within
my Senate district.
Now, that is significant, because I
think they realize what I realize about this
community and the schools that I represent.
The simple fact is that the schools in my
district perform well. Our teachers, our
administrators, our principals are hardworking
and they're professional. They're supported
by active and involved community parents and
school board members.
We don't need to light a candle -
that's what I heard said here. We don't need
to light a candle. Our flame is burning
brightly in Districts 20 and 21. The bottom
line is performance, and our children are
receiving a high-quality education. And so
therefore I ask if that system is not broke,
why do we need to fix it? Why are we forced
to change the system that is working for us?
4514
Now, I truly understand the Mayor's
desire to directly control those poorly
performing schools. I applaud those efforts,
I really do. But the governance bill that we
will pass -- or hopefully not pass here -- but
if passed by the Legislature today, indirectly
punishes the schools in my Brooklyn district
that are performing well.
And people say, well, you have
parents on the central board under this bill.
Well, parents on the central board are
somewhat illusory in the sense that they are
not given any support staff under this bill to
serve on that central board. There's only one
from the entire borough.
And certainly without support staff
services and no input to really be a
full-fledged member of that board, they will
not certainly be able to compete or
participate in any meaningful way with the
members appointed by the mayor, who have
complete support staffs available to them.
Certainly the mayor's appointments
also are not appointed for a term of office,
they're appointed to serve at the pleasure of
4515
the mayor. So that if there should be a
controversial issue, I'm afraid that those
members appointed by the mayor will do and
vote as a bloc for the mayor rather than vote
in their own stead, because of the fact that
they are not serving a term, they are serving
at the pleasure of the mayor. That concerns
me.
Even with the maintenance of effort
provisions that are now put into this bill,
there is still no guarantee, absolutely no
guarantee in this bill that my Brooklyn
schools will continue to receive the resources
they need to continue to excel. There's
nothing in this bill that guarantees that
those resources will continue.
Certainly I would much rather see
the mayor of the City of New York use his
political clout and his political capital
spent on closing the $300 million gap in
school aid that the cities are being
shortchanged, as we all know about. That
money that we can use to hire new teachers,
new administrators, rebuild crumbling schools,
reduce class sizes, and invest in new
4516
technologies.
That not being the case before us
here today, unfortunately, I will be joining
my colleagues in the Assembly, Assemblyman
Abbate and Assemblyman Colton, in making a
statement here on the floor today that this
bill need not be mutually exclusive, mayoral
control and community input. That not being
the case before me here today, I will vote no.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Andrews.
SENATOR ANDREWS: Thank you, Mr.
President. On the bill.
Today I stand before you as a
former school board member, as a graduate of
the New York City school system. And as a
student in New York City school system in
1969, I remember the struggle for
decentralization and the strike, because I was
a student in the school system at that time.
And today I happen to represent the school
district where I was a student, and am now
also a professor at a local college in that
community.
This bill for school governance is
4517
needed because there needs to be changes in
the educational system in New York City.
However, there are some problems that I have
with this bill as relates to community school
boards and their involvement and the community
involvement and, even more important, parent
involvement in the education of their
children. Because the parents are the
taxpayers, and their children are the
commodity that we are here to educate.
But still, despite those concerns,
I will vote yes on this bill. Because as we
know historically and as we see today, the
education of our children has not taken place
for all of our children in the city of
New York. And I hope that this task force
that's established to look at school boards or
the school boards, and also look at parent
involvement and the involvement of parents in
the education of their children, that it
really takes a hard look and makes some
revisions to this bill to include parent
involvement and community involvement.
So with those two concerns and some
other concerns that I will not belabor the
4518
body with this evening because they have been
touched on by other colleagues, I will vote
yes on this bill, Mr. Speaker.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 34. This
act shall take effect July 1.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Ada Smith, to explain her vote.
SENATOR ADA SMITH: Thank you,
Mr. President.
I have great concerns about the
lack of parent involvement and the deletion of
the school boards. But I put forth a
challenge to the Mayor of the City of
New York, to find a means of having more
parent involvement, whether it be by his
appointments to the school board or through
his influence with this task force that is
being established.
We must have the parent
involvement, and we must have people who can
4519
bring back the information to our communities.
With all of the faults, I'm willing to vote
yes, because there must be change.
Thank you.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Ada Smith will be recorded in the affirmative.
Senator Montgomery.
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes, Mr.
President. I'm going to join my colleague
Senator Gentile who I believe is also voting
no on this legislation. And I want to be on
record why I'm voting no.
I have said from the beginning of
any discussion about governance reform that we
should not by any means eliminate the Board of
Ed as at least a quasi-independent group of
people who are solely responsible to the
children and education.
With this bill, we have given
absolute authority to the Mayor for every
possible decision. Eight out of the 13
members of the board, including the
chancellor, will be responsible solely to the
Mayor. And since we have four people who are
appointed by the borough presidents, who we
4520
say are supposed to be parents of the
children, they're supposed to be parents of
public schoolchildren -- we, however, give
them absolutely nothing to support them in
their work.
And this board has basically no
authority, as I read the legislation, to make
any decisions as it relates to education and
the system. So it is just window dressing.
There is no parent involvement here.
And we know that the Mayor's
decisions will be governed by the power of the
union, the power of people who support him
with their money, and the corporations in the
city of New York and possibly across this
country. So who will we go to when we want to
talk about what is happening in a school? And
I have a son in school now. And who will we
be able to speak with when we find that a
school is absolutely not functioning? Do we
now have to go to the Mayor, as a PTA, and
talk about that? Obviously, that's where we
have to go.
And Senator Hevesi I understand has
talked about parents and their necessary
4521
involvement. I'm a parent, and I will not
accept the blame for a system failing as a
parent. And I think we are heading in that
direction when we say we want parent
involvement and we want to enforce it in any
way, whatever.
So I'm voting again against this.
And I hope that it doesn't wreck the system.
But I can say in no uncertain terms that when
we give up, we are reversing entirely any
involvement of community or parents, any power
that we may have. And when we give up the
possibility of influencing the system
entirely, we I think, I believe, there is a
good possibility that we will impede the
system's being able to be responsible to our
children.
So, Mr. President, for those
reasons I'm voting no.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Montgomery will be recorded in the negative.
Senator Liz Krueger, to explain her
vote.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Thank you,
Mr. President.
4522
This has probably been the most
educational debate that I have listened to on
the floor of the Senate in my short period
here. And I appreciated that, and I
appreciated so many of the comments that
people made.
Senators Velella and Padavan gave
excellent background arguments for the bill,
which is a superior bill by leaps and bounds
from the bill that we passed here just a week
ago.
Senator Connor and Senator Lachman
gave a fascinating history of the changes of
the pendulum swing of government, governance
responsibility for the education system in
New York City.
I think it's clear to me, and I
think it should be clear to all of us that
there aren't any poison pills in this bill,
but there's also no magic bullets. If we
think that we solve the issue in public
education in New York City by passing this
bill today -- and I will support passage of
this bill today -- we are wrong. But what I
am glad to see through this bill and a closing
4523
of this process is the fact that now that we
will move forward, we'll support mayoral
accountability and control of the New York
City school system. And I for one do support
more mayoral control and holding that mayor
accountable through the voting box for
addressing the issues of our schools.
We still clearly have many issues
to address. The concerns about people both
originally brought up by Senator Padavan and
extolled upon by any number of other senators
here is even if the community school board
model has not worked -- and I think I come
from an interesting district for this, because
I'm in School District 2. We perhaps are one
of the best school districts in the City of
New York. But it was the first school
district who called for the closing of the
community school district process. They felt
that they didn't serve an effective role.
But I don't think anyone in this
chamber argues: we need to come up with a
model that assures parental participation in
the school system. One size does not fit all.
There are all kinds of needs out there and
4524
different and unique communities in our city,
in response to different needs of schools.
And for parents who have special
needs and issues that they need to address on
the New York school system, no one really
believes -- and I'm sure the mayor would be
the first to agree with me -- that we're going
to start a line up the front steps of City
Hall where each individual parent -
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Krueger, the rules provide two minutes.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: I'm sorry.
Thank you very much, Mr. President.
But we need a model. And so the
twenty people who will be deciding what
happens post-school boards play a critical
role.
I think perhaps the most important
thing that was said here on the floor tonight,
since so many people have spoken before -
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Krueger, how do you vote?
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Thank you.
-- is there's no more excuses -
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator.
4525
Senator.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: -- now we
can deal with the real issues -
THE WITNESS: Senator, you're
now -- please don't make me rule you out of
order.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: I'm sorry.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: How do
you vote, Senator?
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: I will vote
for this bill, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Liz Krueger will be recorded in the
affirmative.
Announce the results.
THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
the negative on Calendar Number 1270 are
Senators Gentile, Montgomery, and Santiago.
Ayes, 55. Nays, 3.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
Senator Morahan.
SENATOR MORAHAN: Yes, Mr.
President. Would you please lay aside for the
day Calendar 1318.
4526
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Calendar
1318 will be laid aside for the day.
SENATOR MORAHAN: Can we return
to reports of standing committees.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Reports
of standing committees.
The Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Senator Bruno,
from the Committee on Rules, reports the
following bills:
Senate Print 2736, by Senator
Padavan, an act to amend the Education Law;
4670, by Senator Trunzo, an act to
amend the Highway Law;
6155A, by Senator Marchi, an act to
amend the General Municipal Law;
6776, by Senator Leibell, an act in
relation;
7171, by Senator DeFrancisco, an
act to amend the Economic Development Law;
7253, by Senator Leibell, an act to
amend the General Municipal Law;
7263A, by Senator Leibell, an act
to amend the General Municipal Law;
7268A, by Senator Morahan, an act
4527
to authorize;
7292, by Senator LaValle, an act to
amend the Executive Law;
7297, by Senator Bruno, an act to
amend the Tax Law;
7301, by Senator Morahan, an act
authorizing;
7315, by Senator Nozzolio, an act
to amendment the Parks, Recreation and
Historic Preservation Law;
7338, by Senator Padavan, an act to
amend the Parks, Recreation and Historic
Preservation Law;
7358, by Senator LaValle, an act to
amend Chapter 534 of the Laws of 1993;
7429A, by Senator Andrews, an act
to authorize;
7462, by Senator Balboni, an act to
amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law;
7465, by Senator Leibell, an act to
amend the Retirement and Social Security Law;
7479, by Senator Saland, an act to
amend the Criminal Procedure Law;
7486, by Senator Rath, an act to
amend Chapter 537 of the Laws of 1997;
4528
7493, by Senator Leibell, an act to
amend the Retirement and Social Security Law;
7497, by Senator Skelos, an act to
authorize;
7509, by Senator Volker, an act to
amend the Criminal Procedure Law;
7514, by Senator Saland, an act to
amend the Social Services Law;
7515, by Senator Saland, an act to
amend the Social Services Law;
7519, by Senator Velella, an act to
amend Chapter 19 of the Laws of 1994;
7528, by Senator Leibell, an act to
amend the Retirement and Social Security Law;
7529, by Senator Padavan, an act to
amend the Local Finance Law;
7530, by Senator Padavan, an act to
amend Chapter 130 of the Laws of 1998;
7542, by the Senate Committee on
Rules, an act to amend the Tax Law;
And Senate Print 7583, by Senator
Spano, an act to amend the Education Law.
All bills ordered direct to third
reading.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
4529
Morahan.
SENATOR MORAHAN: Move to accept
the report, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: All
those in favor of accepting the report of the
Rules Committee signify by saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Those
opposed, nay.
(No response.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
report of the Rules Committee is accepted.
Senator Morahan.
SENATOR MORAHAN: Is there my
housekeeping at the desk, Mr. President?
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Alesi wants to be recognized, Senator.
Senator Alesi.
SENATOR ALESI: Thank you, Mr.
President.
I would ask unanimous consent to be
recorded in the negative on Calendar 1266,
Senate Bill 7428.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Without
objection, Senator Alesi will be so recorded.
4530
Senator Paterson.
SENATOR PATERSON: Mr. President,
I'd like to announce a conference of the
Minority tomorrow morning at 10:15 a.m. in the
Minority Conference Room.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER:
Conference of the Minority tomorrow morning,
10:15 a.m.
Senator McGee.
SENATOR McGEE: Mr. President, on
behalf of Senator Hannon, on page 50 I offer
the following amendments to Calendar 1060,
Senate Print Number 7289, and ask that said
bill retain its place on Third Reading
Calendar.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
amendments are received and adopted, and the
bill will retain its place on the Third
Reading Calendar.
SENATOR McGEE: On behalf of
Senator Morahan, Mr. President, on page number
51 I offer the following amendments to
Calendar Number 1066, Senate Print Number
4735, and ask that said bill retain its place
on Third Reading Calendar.
4531
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
amendments are received and adopted, and the
bill will retain its place on the Third
Reading Calendar.
SENATOR McGEE: Thank you, Mr.
President.
Mr. President, on behalf of Senator
Maltese, I move that the following bills be
discharged from their respective committees
and be recommitted with instructions to strike
the enacting clause: Senate Number 7538 and
Senate Number 7539.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: So
ordered.
SENATOR McGEE: Thank you, Mr.
President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Morahan.
SENATOR MORAHAN: Mr. President,
there being no other business in front of the
Senate, I move that we adjourn until June 12th
at 11:00 a.m.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: On
motion, the Senate stands adjourned until
June 12th at 11:00 a.m.
4532
(Whereupon, at 6:19 p.m., the
Senate adjourned.)