Regular Session - March 31, 2004
1515
NEW YORK STATE SENATE
THE STENOGRAPHIC RECORD
ALBANY, NEW YORK
March 31, 2004
3:03 p.m.
REGULAR SESSION
LT. GOVERNOR MARY O. DONOHUE, President
STEVEN M. BOGGESS, Secretary
1516
P R O C E E D I N G S
THE PRESIDENT: The Senate will
please come to order.
I ask everyone present to please
rise and repeat with me the Pledge of
Allegiance.
(Whereupon, the assemblage recited
the Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag.)
THE PRESIDENT: In the absence of
clergy, may we bow our heads in a moment of
silence.
(Whereupon, the assemblage
respected a moment of silence.)
THE PRESIDENT: Reading of the
Journal.
THE SECRETARY: In Senate,
Tuesday, March 30, the Senate met pursuant to
adjournment. The Journal of Monday, March 29,
was read and approved. On motion, Senate
adjourned.
THE PRESIDENT: Without
objection, the Journal stands approved as
read.
Presentation of petitions.
Messages from the Assembly.
1517
Messages from the Governor.
Reports of standing committees.
Reports of select committees.
Communications and reports from
state officers.
Motions and resolutions.
Senator Morahan.
SENATOR MORAHAN: Thank you,
Madam President.
I move that the following bills be
discharged from their respective committees
and be recommitted with instructions to strike
the enacting clause: 2943, 3049, 3050, 3809,
3815, 4051, 4056, 4059, and 4400.
THE PRESIDENT: So ordered.
SENATOR MORAHAN: Thank you.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator
Fuschillo.
SENATOR FUSCHILLO: Thank you,
Madam President.
On behalf of Senator Kuhl, please
place a sponsor's star on Calendar Number 119.
THE PRESIDENT: So ordered.
SENATOR FUSCHILLO: On behalf of
Senator Skelos, on page number 27 I offer the
1518
following amendments to Calendar Number 407,
Senate Print Number 4835, and ask that said
bill retain its place on Third Reading
Calendar.
THE PRESIDENT: The amendments
are received, and the bill will retain its
place on the Third Reading Calendar.
SENATOR FUSCHILLO: Thank you.
THE PRESIDENT: Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Madam President,
are there any substitutions at the desk?
THE PRESIDENT: Yes, there are,
Senator.
SENATOR SKELOS: I ask that they
be made at this time.
THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary
will read.
THE SECRETARY: On page 5,
Senator Balboni moves to discharge, from the
Committee on Veterans, Homeland Security and
Military Affairs, Assembly Bill Number 9778
and substitute it for the identical Senate
Bill Number 6176, First Report Calendar 616.
On page 5, Senator Balboni moves to
discharge, from the Committee on Veterans,
1519
Homeland Security and Military Affairs,
Assembly Bill Number 5044 and substitute it
for the identical Senate Bill Number 6520,
First Report Calendar 617.
On page 36, Senator Alesi moves to
discharge, from the Committee on
Investigations and Government Operations,
Assembly Bill Number 10037 and substitute it
for the identical Senate Bill Number 6228,
Third Reading Calendar 533.
And on page 41, Senator Velella
moves to discharge, from the Committee on
Labor, Assembly Bill Number 10244 and
substitute it for the identical Senate Bill
Number 6536, Third Reading Calendar 614.
THE PRESIDENT: Substitutions
ordered.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Madam President,
there's a privileged resolution at the desk by
Senator Paterson. Could we have the title
read and move for its immediate adoption.
THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary
will read.
THE SECRETARY: By Senator
1520
Paterson, Legislative Resolution Number 4200,
urging the New York State Congressional
delegation to act to preserve democracy on the
Island of Haiti.
THE PRESIDENT: On the
resolution, all in favor please signify by
saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
THE PRESIDENT: Opposed, nay.
(No response.)
THE PRESIDENT: The resolution is
adopted.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Whomever wishes
to cosponsor the resolution, they should
notify the desk.
THE PRESIDENT: Any member who
does not wish to cosponsor the last resolution
they should notify the desk.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Madam President,
just for clarification, if you wish to sponsor
the resolution, you should notify the desk.
THE PRESIDENT: If you wish to
sponsor the last resolution, please notify the
1521
desk.
SENATOR SKELOS: Madam President,
there will be an immediate meeting of the
Finance Committee in the Majority Conference
Room.
THE PRESIDENT: There will be an
immediate meeting of the Finance Committee in
the Majority Conference Room.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Madam President,
there's a privileged resolution at the desk by
Senator Bruno. Could we have the title read
and move for its immediate adoption.
THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary
will read.
THE SECRETARY: By Senator Bruno,
Legislative Resolution Number 4181, commending
the Sorensco Babe Ruth League of East
Greenbush, New York, upon the occasion of
their 50th season of play.
THE PRESIDENT: All those in
favor signify by saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
THE PRESIDENT: Opposed, nay.
(No response.)
1522
THE PRESIDENT: The resolution is
adopted.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Madam President,
if we could go to the noncontroversial reading
of the calendar.
THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary
will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
248, by Member of the Assembly Tonko, Assembly
Print Number 1154C, an act to amend the
Vehicle and Traffic Law, in relation to
snowmobiles, all-terrain vehicles, personal
watercraft and such dealers.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 49.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
434, by Senator Little, Senate Print 5670A, an
1523
act to amend and ratify a tribal state compact
between the St. Regis Mohawk Tribe and the
State of New York.
SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is laid
aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
455, by Senator Volker, Senate Print 2299, an
act to amend the Real Property Tax Law, in
relation to a taxing district's obtaining the
incidents of ownership.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 49.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
471, by Senator McGee, Senate Print 2776C, an
act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in
relation to persons authorized to supervise.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
1524
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 48. Nays,
1. Senator Duane recorded in the negative.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
538, by Senator LaValle, Senate Print 6334, an
act to amend the Education Law, in relation to
providing for bias-related crime prevention
measures.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect on the same date and in
the same manner as Chapter 597 of the Laws of
2003.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 49.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
1525
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
548, by Senator Meier, Senate Print 1272, an
act to amend the Vehicle and Traffic Law, in
relation to authorizing the commissioner to
suspend a person's driver's license.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect on the first of January.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 48. Nays,
1. Senator Duane recorded in the negative.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
562, by Senator Little, Senate Print 6331, an
act to amend the Highway Law, in relation to
the designation of the "Adirondack Veterans'
Memorial Highway."
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
SENATOR DUANE: Lay it aside,
please.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is laid
1526
aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
572, by Senator Padavan, Senate Print 5584A,
an act to amend the Real Property Tax Law, in
relation to the temporary commercial incentive
area boundary commission.
SENATOR PATERSON: Lay it aside.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is laid
aside.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
574, by Senator Trunzo, Senate Print 5920, an
act to amend the Town Law, in relation to
including the Fire Island Pines fire district
of Suffolk County.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 51.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
575, by Senator Balboni, Senate Print 5932, an
1527
act to amend Chapter 354 of the Laws of 2003
relating to authorizing the incorporated
village of Port Washington.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 50. Nays,
1. Senator Bonacic recorded in the negative.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
576, by Senator Morahan, Senate Print 5972, an
act to authorize Bethel Gospel Fellowship,
Incorporated, to file an application.
SENATOR MORAHAN: Lay it aside
for the day.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is laid
aside for the day.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
614, substituted earlier today by Member of
the Assembly Weinstein, Assembly Print Number
10244, an act to amend the Labor Law and the
1528
Arts and Cultural Affairs Law, in relation to
employment permits.
THE PRESIDENT: Read the last
section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 9. This
act shall take effect on the same date as
Chapter 630 of the Laws of 2003.
THE PRESIDENT: Call the roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 51.
THE PRESIDENT: The bill is
passed.
Senator Bruno, that completes the
noncontroversial reading of the calendar.
SENATOR BRUNO: Madam President,
can we at this time return to motions and
resolutions.
I believe there is a privileged
resolution at the desk by Senator Spano. I
ask that it be read in its entirety and move
for its immediate adoption.
THE PRESIDENT: The Secretary
will read the resolution.
THE SECRETARY: By Senator Spano,
Legislative Resolution Number 3612, mourning
1529
the death of former New York State Senator and
Mayor of Yonkers John E. Flynn.
"WHEREAS, It is the custom of this
Legislative Body to pay tribute to citizens of
the State of New York whose lifework and civic
endeavor serve to enhance the quality of life
in their communities and the great State of
New York; and
"WHEREAS, It is with great sorrow
and deep regret that this Legislative Body
records the passing of former New York State
Senator and Mayor of Yonkers John E. Flynn,
noting the significance of his purposeful life
and accomplishments; and
"WHEREAS, John E. Flynn of Yonkers,
New York, died on September 23, 2003, at the
age of 91; and
"WHEREAS, A lifelong resident of
Yonkers, John E. Flynn attended New York
University and Columbia University; and
"WHEREAS, John E. Flynn served as
the general superintendent of Alexander Smith,
Inc., vice president of DeYorgi, Inc., in
New York City, and vice president of Gramatan,
Inc., in Yonkers, New York; and
1530
"WHEREAS, In 1961, John E. Flynn
was elected mayor of Yonkers for the first of
his three successive terms. During his tenure
as mayor, he created the Yonkers Parking
Authority, the Yonkers Youth Board, the Police
Cadet Corps, the Recreation Program for the
Handicapped, established the Human Rights
Commission and the Mayor's Community Relations
Committee, consolidated Parks and Recreation
into the Department of Parks, Recreation and
Conservation, developed the first Senior
Citizens Center, and constructed the Murray
Skating Rink; and
"WHEREAS, John E. Flynn was elected
to the New York State Senate in 1966 and
served ten consecutive terms. During his
twenty years in Albany, he had approximately
650 bills signed into law and served as
chairman of the Senate Standing Committees on
Aging, Cities, Disabled and Civil Service and
Pensions; and
"WHEREAS, In addition, John E.
Flynn was a member of the Governor's
Commissions on Acupuncture and Constitutional
Tax Limits, as well as the vice chairman of
1531
the State Commission on Causes of Educational
Unrest; and
"Whereas, A true citizen of
Yonkers, John E. Flynn believed in giving back
to the community he loved so much. He was a
trustee of St. John's Riverside Hospital in
Yonkers, a member of the board of directors of
the Westchester County Salvation Army, a
president of the Yonkers Rehabilitation
Center, the C.Y.O, and the United Givers Fund,
vice president of the Yonkers Recreation
Commission, Boy Scouts, and the New York State
Jaycees, and a member of Rotary and numerous
other civil and fraternal organizations; and
"WHEREAS, The quintessential civic
leader, John E. Flynn was the recipient of a
multitude of awards, honors, and certificates
of recognition, acknowledging his efforts of
in-depth magnitude, including the New York
State Jaycee Distinguished Service Award, the
Catholic Youth Achievement Award, the DeMolay
Supreme Youth Award, and the B'nai B'rith
Brotherhood Award; and
"WHEREAS, John E. Flynn also
received the 1975 Legislator of the Year Award
1532
from the United States National Council of
Senior Citizens and an Honorary Degree of Law
from Mt. St. Vincent College, Riverdale,
New York, in 1976, and an Honorary Degree from
Mercy College at Dobbs Ferry in 1980; and
"WHEREAS, Truly an extraordinary
person who has led an exemplary life of public
service, John E. Flynn had one philosophy that
he asked all to practice: 'While it is nice
to be important, it is more important to be
nice'; and
"WHEREAS, John E. Flynn
distinguished himself in his profession and by
his sincere dedication and substantial
contribution to the welfare of his community;
and
"WHEREAS, John E. Flynn's
commitment to excellence and his spirit of
humanity carried over into all fields of
enterprise, including charitable and civic
endeavors; and
"WHEREAS, John E. Flynn is survived
by his daughters, Joan Natoli, Arlene
Modzelewski, Elizabeth Flynn, and Judith
Flynn-Chen, and nine grandchildren and seven
1533
great-grandchildren; and
"WHEREAS, John E. Flynn, throughout
his career and life, served his community and
the people of the State of New York with
intelligence and caring dedication,
continuously striving to effectively fulfill
the duties of his position and contributing
significantly to the legislative process and
the quality of life of his constituents and
the communities of the State of New York; now,
therefore, be it
"RESOLVED, That this Legislative
Body pause in its deliberations to mourn the
death of former New York State Senator and
Mayor of Yonkers John E. Flynn, and be it
further.
"RESOLVED, That a copy of this
resolution, suitably engrossed, be transmitted
to the family of John E. Flynn."
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Bruno.
SENATOR BRUNO: Mr. President,
thank you, and colleagues.
We've just heard, in this
resolution, the chronicle of a great man's
1534
life who passed who, as we heard, served as
mayor, served here in this chamber. But all
of us knew Senator Flynn not as John Flynn but
as Chippy Flynn. And I didn't know until I
read that that came, apparently, from his
having pitched in semipro ball. And the name
stuck with him, Chippy, as the Chippewas team
or something.
But, you know, he was here ten
years when I arrived. And a member that's
been here ten years when a freshman comes in,
everyone looks to and looks up to and kind of
relates to in whatever ways.
You know, if you ever met a
gentleman, Chippy Flynn was a gentleman. When
we hear about all the things he did, it was
all public service -- all relating, all
achieving. He worked -- and his district was
not a favorable district to his party when he
was first elected. And yet he had the
acclamation of all of the people there.
Senator Spano followed him in
office in that area, and to his credit he has
been representative, following in the
footsteps of Senator Flynn.
1535
I called Chippy a number of times,
I remember, trying to find my way through the
maze that's around here sometimes. He was
always responsive, he was always upbeat, he
always had a good word. And you just never
forget that. I talked with him not too long
before he died, I believe he was in Florida, a
week or so before. You would not know that he
was even sick, and he was pretty ill.
So you talk about a courageous guy,
a brave heart. That was Chippy. And when I
was visiting with him, I knew he was kind of
struggling with conversation. So it wasn't a
long conversation, but I had the impression
that he was trying to make me feel good. It
wasn't anything about him.
And, you know, I just share this
thought with you -- and I think it was in the
resolution -- the one thing Chippy always said
that we all should remember: "It's nice to be
important, but it's more important to be
nice."
Thank you.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Spano.
1536
SENATOR SPANO: Thank you, Mr.
President.
You know, over the years those of
us who are lucky enough to serve in this
chamber have an opportunity, unfortunately, to
speak so often about those who have gone
before us. And, you know, when you get up --
and I've been sitting here trying to reflect
some thoughts about Senator Flynn. You start
to think about, you know, your own mortality
and what it is this all worth, what are we
doing in this job called the New York State
Senate.
And then we sit and say: Will
anyone remember? Will anyone remember
anything that we have done, and will there be
an impact on our community, on the people in
this state once we are out of here?
And I go back and I think back to
1966 -- I was 13 years old -- in a grammar
school in Yonkers. And we had a field day
that day, and it was a nice -- it was in the
month of May. And someone came to visit the
school, and they said, "Senator Flynn is
coming to visit the school." And we were all
1537
so very happy. He would come in, and he had a
great Irish wit about him and would come in:
"Hey, how are ya?" You know, and he'd look
over -- he walked over to me, hit me on the
top of the head: "You're Spano." He says:
"How ya doin'?" And I was in awe that this
Senator even knew who I was and touched me.
And I never forgot that. When I go
to sixth-grade classes, I tell them all the
time about how Senator Flynn visited us in our
grammar school. I never forgot the fact that
he was there, and went back 22 years later to
run for the Senate to succeed him to represent
the city of Yonkers. "Yunkers," as he would
always call it.
As I remember, he sat over next to
Marty Golden, in that area of the chamber.
And there was nobody that ever got up on the
floor of this Senate or back home in Yonkers
who had more of a love for his community and a
passion for the people he represented.
And I saw him as the nicest person
in the world. And I saw him bang the desk
when they might talk about hurting tenants,
hurting seniors, hurting people with
1538
disabilities, not helping the cities like the
city of Yonkers. And he was always there to
fight.
You know, I watched his career. I
learned a lot from him from that first day
that he touched me as a grammar school
student. And I watched him over the years.
And, you know, little things you notice. You
know, I would always know Senator Flynn was in
town because I would see his car and I'd see
his license plate, and I always knew -- and I
would notice over the years his license plate
went from 35 down to, when he retired, his
plate number was 13. And why do you remember
that? I don't know. You know.
But as a member of the Assembly, a
young member of the Assembly, I remember
walking in, coming into his office, having to
go through Ken Riddett -- Ken Riddett, who was
Senator Flynn's counsel then -- having to go
through Ken Riddett to maybe scrounge around
to get my name on a resolution once in a
while. As a Republican member of the
Assembly, you know, it was a little tough
going. And it was always Senator Flynn who
1539
would give me that opportunity, make sure that
I had a helping hand.
In Yonkers, to this day, if I get
up at a senior event and I mention the name
"John Flynn," the seniors start with applause.
Here's a guy who has been out of office for
more than 18 years, and the people remember
him and remember that he was the mayor of the
city when they built the first senior center
in Yonkers. They remember it was Flynn Manor
down on Riverdale Avenue that was a senior
citizen housing project that bore his name and
has a room there with all of his plaques down
there that all the senior citizens in Flynn
Manor can see on a regular basis.
They remember the John Flynn who
was there with the C.Y.O. and the Boys Club
and the Chippewa Club, as Senator Bruno
mentioned -- all the boys and girls clubs in
the city of Yonkers, that he was there.
He was the type of politician who
attended every funeral in the city of Yonkers.
And I remember that there was one time we were
pulling up at a funeral home -- we were
traveling together, and we had a little bit of
1540
time to kill, and he said, "Go up to Park
Avenue." I said all right. So I drove up.
He said, "Pull over here by the funeral home."
I said, "Well, is someone there, Senator?" He
says, "Yeah, there are cars in the driveway,
so there's someone there. So let's stop." I
waited in the car that day.
But, you know, he walked in, he
knew everybody in the city. And as he touched
me in that grammar school class that day, he
touched every person in the city of Yonkers.
And he showed that he cared; he cared about
the people that he represented.
Six hundred and fifty bills signed
into law. That's a record, I think, for any
member of the State Senate. To head the
Select Committee on the Disabled. The day he
retired, I remember the group of people with
disabilities who put together a benefit for
him, just thanking him, and the tears in the
eyes of the young people with disabilities and
their parents who said, "We're going to lose a
champion." And Senator Flynn turning to me
and making me promise that whatever we ever
do, don't forgot about that population. And I
1541
was glad to become the chair of the Mental
Health and Developmental Disabilities
Committee to follow that.
He always stopped, he listened, he
cared. He wasn't looking over your shoulder
for the next person to talk to. You really
knew that he made eye contact. He was -- and
Senator Bruno said it well -- he would always
end his comments with: While it's nice to be
important, it's more important to be nice."
And that certainly was not a cliche, it was
something that he lived by. And he always
stopped his comments at the end and said "God
bless you."
And every opportunity he got up to
speak before any organization, the people just
loved the guy.
We will miss him. We certainly
missed him. And I -- the way we started, we
said: Will anybody remember? I'm glad that
many of us in this chamber will remember
Senator Flynn. The members of his family, who
unfortunately could not be here today,
certainly remember Senator Flynn.
I mentioned Ken Riddett, who's
1542
worked for the Senator. And also in the
Senate gallery we have a Saratoga Court of
Claims judge, Judge Tim Collins. Tim Collins
received his first job from Senator Flynn back
in 1986, and then later became counsel to
Senator Bruno and held that position as
counsel to the Majority until his appointment
to the position of the Court of Claims. And
I'm very glad that Judge Collins is here today
seated in the gallery.
So, Senator Bruno, thank you.
Thank you for giving me an opportunity to get
up on the floor here to speak about someone
who always cared. The last comments that I
had with him -- and he was very frail, very
ill -- was he said, "Don't forget the
Westchester Institute for Human Development."
And I remember one quick story I'll
tell you, then I'll sit down. When I took
over in 1987 as a member of the Senate, we
had -- I had a list of a number of people
calling me and saying, you know, "Thank you
for the grant and the member item that you're
going to give us." And I wasn't sure where
these were coming from.
1543
And on the way out, Senator Flynn
had sent letters out to all of the groups that
he funded over the years and said "I
recommended to Senator Anderson that we
re-fund those groups, and I'm sure Senator
Spano will be able to deliver that."
And that's a true story. And it
was close to probably a million dollars. And
I used that pretty well with Senator Anderson
to get what I needed.
But it tells you about a guy that,
even when he was retiring, made sure that that
level of commitment to the people who put him
in office as the mayor of the city and as a
member of the State Senate, he never forget
them.
So we will always remember, we will
always remember Chippy Flynn for his smile,
for everything he did, for all the people he
touched. And I'm so glad that he visited that
St. Peter's School that one day back in 1966,
because he had a profound effect on my life.
And so God bless you, Senator
Flynn.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
1544
Hoffmann.
SENATOR HOFFMANN: Thank you, Mr.
President.
My recollections of Senator Flynn
stem from a slightly different perspective. I
was a member of the Syracuse City Council in
the early '80s. And in those years, the
members of the city councils around the state
would travel once a year to Albany to meet
with Senator Flynn in his capacity as chair of
the Cities Committee. And he provided
tremendous inspiration to those of us from
Buffalo in the far west, to Yonkers in the
east, as well as the New York City
counterparts, as to how we should be
approaching policy.
Much has already been said about
his kindness and his demeanor. But he did
something else for those of us who made this
trip. He would validate our reason for coming
into the capital to lobby on behalf of the
cities we represented.
Senator Flynn, who began his career
in the city of Yonkers and had served as the
chief executive of a city experiencing
1545
tremendous diminution of its tax revenue,
understood the kind of fragile balance that
every city in this state was facing. He had
lived through the '60s. He had experienced
what was euphemistically referred to in the
newspapers as urban decay. He understood the
whole concept of the flight to the suburbs by
the people who had assets and simultaneous
loss of manufacturing jobs into other parts of
the country or even offshore, leaving a poor
core to many of these cities without the
support they needed to champion their
interests.
And as Senator Spano said and as
Senator Bruno said, it was Senator Flynn who
often recognized the unique responsibility to
provide that voice for the people had been in
fact abandoned by so many of the other
institutions and powerful people who had
served them in the past. He recognized that
imbalance, and he always tried to find ways to
encourage us, when we came into Albany as city
councillors, to find creative ways to tap into
those institutions that he had helped develop.
He had worked with the other mayors
1546
in the '70s to develop things like urban
development action grants, urban development
and community development programs. He knew
that there were special needs of cities, and
he provided some very unique handholding
activities for us when we would come in here.
He was, in fact, an inspirational force for
members of city government all over this
state.
And it was a great honor for me,
when I took office in this chamber in 1985, to
be able to serve with Senator Flynn in the
capacity as State Senator. Because only then
could I actually put some of the pieces
together to see how very challenging it was
for him to do the job that he had to do for
his own city, his own constituency, and at the
same time provide that wonderful support
system for members of the city councils all
over this state.
We used to love to have our picture
taken with him after he swore us in as
officers of our little organization. So you
would have pictures of city council members
from Utica, Buffalo, Rochester, Binghamton,
1547
and Syracuse, all standing proudly surrounding
Senator "Chippy" Flynn. That was the
highlight of our trip to this capital.
Governors and other officers didn't really
count that much.
It was seeing Chippy Flynn that
made us feel good about what we did and sent
us back to our cities with a renewed
commitment to deliver for our people. And we
always left with that wonderful sense of
accomplishment that only comes when a person
of his stature says "Good luck, and God bless
you."
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
question is on the resolution. All those in
favor signify by saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Those
opposed, nay.
(No response.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
resolution is adopted.
Senator Velella.
SENATOR VELELLA: Can we return
to reports of standing committees. I believe
1548
there's a report of Finance Committee at the
desk.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Reports
of standing committees.
The Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Senator Johnson,
from the Committee on Finance, reports the
following nominations:
As a member of the State Commission
of Correction, Alan J. Croce, of Mattituck.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
LaValle.
SENATOR LaVALLE: Thank you, Mr.
President.
I'd like to compliment Governor
Pataki on once again reappointing Chairman
Croce to his position in the Commission on
Corrections.
Alan Croce has -- if you look at
his background, it's a very, very strong
background in criminal justice: Served as our
undersheriff for many, many years in Suffolk
County and was appointed to the commission,
and the Governor appointing him as the chair.
He has dedicated himself, has
1549
energized the commission because he has been
energetic and professional about his duties
and his responsibilities. He has served in
this position the longest of anyone as
chairman, and he certainly deserves
reappointment.
And, Alan, continue the great job
that you have done and the energy and vitality
that you've brought to the commission.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Nozzolio.
SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Mr. President,
on the nomination.
I rise to support this renomination
of Alan Croce, echoing the comments of my
colleague Senator LaValle. That as chairman
of the Crime Victims, Crime and Corrections
Committee, we have to work very closely with
the Commission on Corrections.
I must say the Commission on
Corrections has been under excellent
stewardship during these past years, as Alan
Croce has time and time again proven to
members of this Legislature, this house, the
Assembly and the Governor that the Corrections
1550
Commission has been a wonderful partner with
local governments in their challenging
development of new correctional facilities and
the maintenance of their current correctional
facilities across this state.
I could think of no finer
appointment than this. I appreciate all the
work that the commission has done under
Commissioner Croce's leadership and urge my
colleagues to unanimously support this
wonderful renomination.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Volker.
SENATOR VOLKER: Mr. President,
very quickly. I guess I'm one of the few
people around who was here when this
commission was formed many years ago. And
Senator LaValle and I were talking, I believe
it was formed a few years after the Attica
uprising.
Probably Alan Croce -- and I think
this is absolutely true, and I've interviewed
every one of the chairmen of the commission.
And we turned down a couple of chairmen, if I
remember right, many years ago -- is probably
1551
the finest chairman that I think in all the
years that I can remember of the commission.
He's spent a tremendous amount of time working
on local prisons, which is primarily what the
Commission on Corrections is charged with
doing.
I want to commend him. I want to
commend the Governor for putting Alan in that
position.
But I think that there just is not
a realization that our prison system, both on
a state level and a local level, is reputed
throughout the country to be one of the
models. And there's a lot of criticism here
because some of the people who -- I don't want
to -- I guess I'd characterize them as
pro-inmate groups -- would like you to think
that our system is not as highly regarded as
it is throughout the country.
But I can assure you that one of
the reasons it is so highly regarded, one of
the reasons we have the only major prison
system in the country that is declining in
inmate population -- not only in inmate
population, but declining dramatically in the
1552
number of nonviolent people in our system --
is New York. And there are many people coming
in from outside who tried to use New York as a
lever for other states.
But the problem in New York is it's
really a model for the rest of the country.
And Alan Croce is one of the reasons it is a
model for the rest of the country.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Marcellino.
SENATOR MARCELLINO: Thank you,
Mr. President.
I would also like to thank the
Governor for this fine appointment, this fine
reappointment. Alan Croce is a good friend
and a very capable administrator on this
commission. He's done a heck of a job, as
you've heard from Senator Volker and Senator
Nozzolio, no better experts on crime and
corrections that these two gentlemen.
And I know for a fact that Alan
Croce is a fine person because no less than
his wife told me so.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Onorato.
1553
SENATOR ONORATO: Mr. President,
I rise to join my colleagues in commending the
Governor on this wonderful nomination. I'm
happy that the Governor recognizes what all of
us in this chamber recognize about the quality
of Alan Croce.
He's been in since 1997. And I can
assure you that he's always had an open door,
sometimes an open cell for all of us. But I
want to thank him for always responding to all
of the requests that I have made of him, and
he's responded in a magnificent and judicious
manner.
And I congratulate the Governor and
I urge all of my colleagues to make it a
unanimous decision on your renomination.
Congratulations, Alan.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Trunzo.
SENATOR TRUNZO: Mr. Chairman, I
also rise to second the nomination of Alan
Croce.
I've known Alan for many, many
years, even before he was the chairman of the
Commission of Corrections. I've known him
1554
back him when he was with the Suffolk County
correction officers group and all that group.
And he's been an outstanding individual, and
you've heard all that has been said by those
who have to do with criminal justice and what
have you.
But at any rate, Alan is a great
individual. He's done an outstanding job in
the position that he's had. And I commend the
Governor for reappointing him to this position
for another term.
Thank you.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Johnson.
SENATOR JOHNSON: Yes. Being
from Suffolk County, I've known Alan for quite
a while. He's done an outstanding job in the
sheriff's department and an outstanding job in
Corrections. And certainly I'm proud as well
to add my name to the list of those seconding
the nomination of Alan Croce.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Libous.
SENATOR LIBOUS: Thank you,
Mr. Chairman.
1555
I am not from Suffolk County, but I
would tell you although I have no direct
relationship with Mr. Croce through my
committee, I have known him on a personal
basis and certainly through some work he's
done with our local county corrections
officials. And once again, the Governor has
sent us a true professional and a gentleman,
and I am honored to stand here and support his
nomination.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Does any
other member wish to be heard on the
nomination?
The question, then, is on the
confirmation of Alan J. Croce as a member of
the State Commission of Corrections. All
those in favor signify by saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Opposed,
nay.
(No response.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
nominee is confirmed.
Commissioner Croce is with us today
in the gallery. He's accompanied by his wife
1556
and our colleague, Assemblywoman Pat Acampora,
in the back of the chamber.
And, Commissioner Croce, on behalf
of the Senate, we extend to you our thanks for
the great work that you have done and our best
wishes for your future work.
Thank you.
(Applause.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
Secretary will continue to read.
THE SECRETARY: As a member of
the Metropolitan Transportation Authority,
David S. Mack, of Kings Point.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Johnson.
SENATOR JOHNSON: David S. Mack
has done a wonderful job in his community in
many respects -- civic, philanthropic,
connected with his alma mater and mine,
Hofstra University. But more than that, he's
put in ten years on the MTA. All the advances
we've made in transportation and financing of
transportation, in new methods of paying with
a card to get in and out of these subways and
trains, all those innovations really were
1557
advanced by David S. Mack, demonstrably the
outstanding member of the board and always
looking to improve conditions for the
commuters and the residents of the City and
the Island as well. And, I might say, up the
Hudson River way.
So certainly he's done a great job.
He deserves to be renominated, as the Governor
has done. I commend the Governor on that
nomination, and I'd like to advance it at this
time.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Marcellino.
SENATOR MARCELLINO: Thank you,
Mr. President. I rise again, this is a banner
day for the Governor. He's got two aces in
his hand today in reappointments.
David Mack is a fine individual.
I've known him for a number of years, being
from Long Island. David is a well-known
individual. If there's a charity this man
doesn't work for and contribute to, I don't
know what it is. He is just one superior, one
decent person who believes in giving back to
his community and giving back to this great
1558
country and this great state of New York
because he got a lot out of it.
So, ladies and gentlemen, he's a
fine person, he will do an even better job
than he did before, I know, because he's that
kind of an individual. Thank you to the
Governor for this nomination. I second it.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Lachman.
SENATOR LACHMAN: Yes, I hadn't
had the pleasure of meeting Mr. Mack for I
believe his previous two appointments to the
MTA commission, and I did have that pleasure
today. He's obviously a very qualified person
and serves under Peter Kalikow as the deputy
chairman of MTA.
In answer to questions of the
Finance Committee, he made it quite clear that
he believes that the fares should not go up,
that the fares should remain the same. And
that is very important to me.
Now, one of my colleagues, Senator
Parker, raised the issue of greater
transparency in terms of the records, in the
future, of the MTA, and he said he will do
1559
everything possible to achieve that.
I think it's an excellent
reappointment by the Governor, and I will be
proud to vote for him.
Thank you.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Schneiderman.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Thank you,
Mr. President.
We have two appointments to the
MTA, and I will address both of them together,
Mr. Mack and Ed Watt.
I have had a lot of experience
working with the MTA, against the MTA, on the
MTA. But I want to say that Mr. Mack is
certainly an example of someone who comes from
a background and brings the wisdom from that
background to the MTA -- and that we do have
problems. And there have been historical
problems. But the current MTA management, and
I say this as someone who has sued them
frequently, is making substantial changes for
the better.
It is becoming more transparent, we
are moving in the right direction, and that is
1560
going to make it easier for those of who are
advocates to fight for more funding for the
city to keep the fares down. Because
ultimately the responsibility is not with the
board of the MTA, the responsibility lies
here. If we don't provide them money, there's
nothing they can do.
So I commend the Governor for this
appointment. I know Mr. Mack, members of his
family. And he's not just someone who gives
back, he comes from a family who gives back in
many different areas. And I've worked with
many members of the family, and I look forward
to working further with him on the MTA.
I also want to add -- I don't think
he's here today -- the second appointment to
the MTA, Ed Watt, of the Transport Workers
Union, another great addition to the team. As
there's new leadership in the MTA, there is
new leadership at the TWU that is making a
tremendous difference for all of us who ride
the buses and subways. And we look forward to
further good works in the years to come.
Thank you.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
1561
Malcolm Smith.
SENATOR MALCOLM SMITH: Thank you
very much, Mr. President.
I also rise to commend the Governor
on his appointment today. Obviously Mr. Mack
is a clear example of someone who is doing
well by doing good. His entire family have
been very supportive of our entire state. He
has been very supportive and very helpful to
me personally as it relates to particular
stations in my district, along our railroad
line.
And although we made our
acquaintance in a very strange way, I will
tell you one thing he proves is that you never
know who you're talking to. And when we had
the opportunity to face each other in a
professional way, the result was a $10 million
contribution toward the repairs of stations in
my district, and he was one who led that
charge. And I do appreciate that.
Insofar as Mr. Ed Watt is
concerned, who is also within my district, I
also want to thank the Governor for his
forthright concept around selecting
1562
individuals who represent the Transport
Workers Union. I think that's very important
for them to be able to have some sort of
insight and involvement on the inside of the
track, so to speak.
So this is a banner day, as Senator
Marcellino said, for the Governor.
Mr. Mack, always a pleasure seeing
you. And you will continue to do the fine job
that you have been doing.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Balboni.
SENATOR BALBONI: Yes, Mr.
President. It is great to be able to rise for
a constituent and a friend.
Mr. Mack is one of the preeminent
names on Long Island and in this state. But I
also get a chance to talk with him
professionally about his expertise and his
concern over the safety issues surrounding our
transportation systems. And as we all know,
we talked about last week about how we really
try to focus our attention on trying make
everything as safe as possible.
David Mack's in the forefront.
1563
He's a gentleman who has had a long career in
and around law enforcement. He has a great
rapport with many of the law enforcement
agencies in this state. And he also brings a
reach and a grasp that is much broader than
most bring to government. And the fact that
he would want to do this is really a message
for all of us that it's not just -- you can do
good works in many ways. And I think that
he's decided that it's not just being
philanthropic in terms of the arts and the
charities, but it's also in terms of his time
to make us all a little safer.
So I look forward to working with
you in your position. I wish you many good
years of this. And I think we're all very
proud to have somebody like you in this
position.
Thank you, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Any
other Senator wish to be heard on the
nomination?
Senator Maltese.
SENATOR MALTESE: Yes, Mr.
President. I know my colleagues have said a
1564
great deal about the experience and background
of the nominee, David S. Mack. But like so
many of my colleagues, I've come to know him
over the years and wish to add my words to his
eminent qualifications.
I think we all know that there's
more to government than background experience.
There's dedication involved. And here we have
all those qualities all wrapped up in one
candidate. Certainly the lack of debate,
except for praising comments, at the Finance
Committee meeting; so many people have
indicated their approval of this fine
nomination.
We would do well to have him on the
MTA board, as a member of the MTA board
because of his grasp of the issues and because
of his personal qualities, exemplary qualities
that lend so much to the MTA board. As a
representative of the city, I especially feel
that he can lend a great deal to the board,
and I welcome his nomination by Governor
Pataki.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
question, then, is on the confirmation of
1565
David S. Mack as a member of the Metropolitan
Transportation Authority. All those in favor
signify by saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Those
opposed, nay.
(No response.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
nominee is confirmed.
David Mack is with us today in the
gallery. And, Mr. Mack, we wish you well with
your important duties going forward.
Congratulations, sir.
(Standing ovation.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
Secretary will continue to read.
THE SECRETARY: As an alternate
nonvoting member of the Metropolitan
Transportation Authority, Ed Watt, of Far
Rockaway.
As a member of the Finger Lakes
State Park, Recreation and Historic
Preservation Commission, Mike Sigler, of
Ithaca.
As a member of the Lake George Park
1566
Commission, John Pettica, Jr., of Kattkill
Bay.
As a member of the Taconic State
Park, Recreation and Historic Preservation
Commission, Lucy R. Waletzky, M.D., of
Pleasantville.
As a member of the Firefighting and
Code Enforcement Personnel Standards and
Education Commission, Leon Szczerbinski, of
North Tonawanda.
As a member of the Medical Advisory
Committee, Steven E. Barnes, D.O., of Silver
Creek.
As director of the Municipal
Assistance Corporation for the City of
New York, Martin S. Berger, of New York City.
And as a member of the State
Council on the Arts, Judith O. Rubin, of
New York City.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Lachman.
SENATOR LACHMAN: Yes, Mr.
President, I was unaware that one or two of my
colleagues coupled the nomination of David
Mack with Ed Watt.
1567
But I believe that Ed Watt himself
deserves appreciation for what he's done on
the Metropolitan Transit Authority, and I
think it emphasizes a principle which is
essential: that even nonvoting members who
represent the working men and women of
America, regardless of what unions they belong
to, should be applauded for what they are
doing. Otherwise, how will we know how the
workers feel if this man or, in other
authorities, women who are working people are
not on the commission?
And I am proud to support Ed Watt
as an alternate member of the MTA.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
question is on the confirmation of the
above-named nominees. All those in favor
signify by saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Those
opposed, nay.
(Response of "nay.")
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
nominees are confirmed.
The Secretary will continue to
1568
read.
THE SECRETARY: Senator Johnson,
from the Committee on Finance, reports the
following bills:
Senate Print 6052, Senate Budget
Bill, an act making appropriations for the
legal requirements;
Senate Print 6658, by the Senate
Committee on Rules, an act making
appropriations for the support of government;
And Senate Print 6659A, by the
Senate Committee on Rules, an act in relation
to providing for the administration of certain
funds.
All bills ordered direct to third
reading.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: All
bills directly to third reading.
Senator Velella.
SENATOR VELELLA: Mr. President,
can we take up Calendar Number 670 at this
time.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Velella, we have to do a substitution. Can we
do that first?
1569
SENATOR VELELLA: Do the
substitution first.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Okay,
thank you.
The Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: In relation to
Calendar Number 670, Senator Johnson moves to
discharge, from the Committee on Finance,
Assembly Bill Number 9552 and substitute it
for the identical Senate Bill Number 6052,
Third Reading Calendar 670.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER:
Substitution ordered.
The Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
670, Assembly Budget Bill, Assembly Print
Number 9552, an act making appropriations.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN:
Explanation.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Johnson, an explanation has been requested by
Senator Schneiderman.
SENATOR JOHNSON: Mr. President,
this bill provides for making debt service
payments for the fiscal year 2004-2005
1570
normally appropriated to pay all the bonds and
the various authorities and state debt, et
cetera, et cetera, et cetera. And that's it.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 60.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: In relation to
Calendar Number 671, Senator Johnson moves to
discharge, from the Committee on Finance,
Assembly Bill Number 10401 and substitute it
for the identical Senate Bill Number 6658,
Third Reading Calendar 671.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER:
Substitution ordered.
The Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
671, by the Assembly Committee on Rules,
Assembly Print Number 10401, an act making
1571
appropriations for the support of government.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
is there a message of appropriation and
necessity at the desk?
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: There
is.
SENATOR SKELOS: Move to accept.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
question is on whether to accept the message
of appropriation and necessity. All those in
favor signify by saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Those
opposed, nay.
(No response.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
message of appropriation and necessity is
accepted.
The bill is before the house.
Read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect --
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN:
1572
Explanation.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Johnson, an explanation has been requested of
Calendar 671.
SENATOR JOHNSON: This bill
appropriates approximately $9.6 billion to
various state departments and agencies to meet
scheduled state payments due from April 1st to
April 18th, roughly two weeks, a little more
than that. And that's all that bill does.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
last section.
Senator Sabini.
SENATOR SABINI: On the bill, Mr.
President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Sabini, on the bill.
SENATOR SABINI: Mr. President,
once again we're faced with a late budget. It
should be no surprise to anyone in this room.
We heard some noise earlier in this year that
there was going to be a package of reform
passed by both houses through a conference
committee. Of course, despite the work of
that committee, it's late. The budget is
1573
late, as it has been for a generation now.
And I stand here as someone who
talks to a lot of people in the streets of our
neighborhoods in New York City who don't
really understand why we don't get our work
done on time. It doesn't make any sense to
them. And yet it happens year after year
after year.
There are over 200 members of this
Legislature on both sides of this building,
and I think the combined intelligence and
experience and resolve, I believe, with the
respect I have for the members of this body
and the Assembly, could get this done on time
and present a united front to the people of
the state with an intelligent spending plan
that can be worked out amongst intelligent
people. But it doesn't happen.
We know why it doesn't happen. It
doesn't happen because the institutional
bodies in this building benefit from the fact
that it doesn't happen on time. There are
many groups, interest groups, some of the
interest groups I support, that benefit from
if not being on time, because it gives them
1574
more time to negotiate and play political
gamesmanship with the proverbial -- and we've
heard it for a long time now -- three men in a
room. It benefits them as well.
But it really doesn't benefit the
people of the State of New York, it doesn't
benefit the taxpayers, it doesn't benefit
local government, it doesn't benefit the
school districts who are waiting to find out
what monies they can slot in.
This year we have a new excuse; we
waited for the Zarb Commission. We sort of
knew what was going to come out anyway.
Intelligent people could have figured out
where we were going with this. There's a
court order. It's pretty clear. Yet we're
late again.
And it's bipartisan in its failure,
and it's bicameral in its failure. And a
member of the Assembly who belongs to the
majority party, my party in that body, said to
me the other day: "You know, you just don't
understand how Albany works." And my response
is: It doesn't. It doesn't.
It is shameful that we as a body
1575
will now pass these extenders and do what
normal Americans would never do. When faced
with a deadline, let's leave town. Let's
leave. Let's punt for two weeks and let some
faceless folks in budget offices and in
leadership staff positions do some more
negotiating while we're somewhere else. It's
not right.
And no matter what kind of spin you
want to put on it, no matter what sort of this
pseudo-intelligence that we know better than
the folks in the street, we don't. We don't.
And the sooner we wise up to that, the better
off everyone will be. We really don't know
better than they do, because they know when
they're assigned a task that has to be done at
a certain time, it gets done. It's not that
tough.
There are several bills that have
been offered by the majority in this house
that would make the budget process move
smoother. There's a conference committee now.
The conference committee should be looking at
ideas that haven't been looked at yet. I know
Senator Krueger and Senator Paterson both have
1576
bills that would require us to work until the
budget is passed, that we don't go away on a
recess when a budget is due. And I believe
those should be looked at as well.
Now, we did this thing a couple of
years ago of not paying the members of the
Legislature while a budget hasn't been passed.
And we see how effective that's been. Not
very effective at all. The only thing it's
affected is people's sort of moving around
their expenses.
What we really should be doing is
coming to an agreement as intelligent women
and men in this Capitol and come up with a
spending plan that's rational, that works, and
that's timely. I'm delighted we have a
conference committee, and I know members of
this body have worked on hard on that
conference committee to reform the budget
process. But the fact that that conference
committee has not come up with a plan already
further underlines the fact that what we're
doing is really dysfunctional.
And so I will be voting no on this
and on other extenders. Thank you.
1577
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Krueger.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Thank you,
Mr. President. On the bill.
I share my colleague Senator
Sabini's frustration. And I too will be
voting no on this bill.
And he highlighted one bill I have
that if we had passed this bill would in fact
assure that we do stay and continue to work
through the, I guess, break we're about to
take to get the budget done. It's S4682,
which would require the Legislature to meet
daily if it fails to pass a state budget prior
to April 1st. Of course we would allow
religious holidays off. And I think our
constituents would find that reasonable.
But who is kidding who, as Senator
Sabini has said. The fact that we now don't
see paychecks clearly is not a reason we are
motivated to continue to do our work and get
the people's business done. As was pointed
out, I think, on this floor already today, we
who won't get paychecks can go to banks and
get loans. That is not holding us accountable
1578
to the people of New York. But a series of
budget reform proposals would.
And I too am excited about the fact
that we still have a budget reform conference
committee meeting between the two houses. And
I believe that they have agreed on any number
of issues, two way, that we need to move
forward on. It won't solve our problem as of
April 1st, tomorrow, but it could help us
address these problems next year, because it's
the 20th year of a late budget. And of course
just getting a budget on time is not the
assignment. It has to be a good budget for
the people of New York State.
And I'm hoping if we can open up
our process to more budget transparency, if we
can require standardized accounting procedures
for our budget, if we can assure that
legislators have those budget documents on
their desks, in my opinion, at least ten days
before we are voting on these budget bills, if
we can have ongoing standing conference
committees to negotiate not just at the last
minute or in fact after April 1st, as Senator
Sabini pointed out, but starting from day one
1579
when we get up here, and know we are facing a
budget each and every year and that we have
responsibilities relating to that budget --
that if we can see eye to eye, if we can come
up with some agreements between the two houses
in the budget conference committees that are
going on today, that maybe this is the last
time that we will have to go home and explain
to our constituents why yet again we do not
have a budget for them on April 1st.
But in fact, in objection to the
fact that we have moved nowhere yet, I will
also be voting against the extender bill
today.
Thank you, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Schneiderman.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Thank you,
Mr. President.
Twenty years is very long time.
And I must say, as someone who spent most of
my life in the private sector, I think it's
pretty clear that the only thing preventing us
from passing a budget on time every year is a
lack of political will. We have the money.
1580
In fact, since the Governor announced his
Executive Budget, we've come up with -- we've
identified significant new resources. Senator
Bruno has acknowledged it.
Senator Paterson earlier today laid
out a plan that actually comes in slightly
less than the Executive Budget that would
enable us to fully fund our obligations under
the Campaign for Fiscal Equity case.
We have the money. We know what we
need to do. It's simply a lack of political
will. It's an abdication of our
responsibility.
And there are ways we could
probably get this done. Senator Krueger
alluded to some of them. I know we are now
rushing to try and get our budget reform
conference committee to come up with something
so at least we can put a good face on the fact
that we're about to adjourn in the middle of
what should be intensive negotiations over the
budget.
But that really is not good enough.
I mean, it's good to reform the budget
process. But the reform that would make the
1581
most difference, frankly, is for us to pass
bills that Senator Paterson has sponsored,
Senator Krueger has sponsored, requiring us
just to stay here. Let's stay here.
You look at negotiations -- when I
was involved in negotiations over a deal, we
wouldn't break for 12 days in the middle of
the negotiation. Just stay there till you get
it done. If you break, it's over. And that's
true in labor negotiations. That's true
really everywhere except here.
So 20 years is an unhappy
anniversary. I am going to vote no on this
extender also. We can pass a budget on time.
We just have to take responsibility for our
actions. And I think if we all stayed here,
we would find a way to pass a budget pretty
quickly.
So whatever proposals come out of
the budget reform committee, let's keep our
eye on the real target. There are some good
things we can do. Forward funding of school
budget payments is critical. Let's pass a
two-year school budget this year so that every
year school districts aren't put at risk and
1582
thrown into confusion by the lateness of the
budget. That's a good thing. But it's a good
thing by way of making our own
irresponsibility hurt a little less.
Let's do something that actually
gets a budget passed on time. And I
respectfully submit the way to do that is for
us to stay here. We're prepared to do it.
Our leader sponsors a bill requiring us to do
it. I'm going to vote no, and I hope that at
some point during my tenure here we are going
to come up with a commitment. Because it's
not coming up with a procedure, it's simply
coming up with a commitment to the people of
the State of New York that we are going to
meet our constitutional obligation and pass a
budget on time.
Thank you, Mr. President.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 40. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
1583
THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
the negative on Calendar Number 671 are
Senators Duane, L. Krueger, Parker, Sabini,
and Schneiderman. Ayes, 55. Nays, 5.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: In relation to
Calendar Number 672, Senator Johnson moves to
discharge, from the Committee on Finance,
Assembly Bill Number 10402A and substitute it
for the identical Senate Bill Number 6659A,
third Reading Calendar 672.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN:
Explanation.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER:
Substitution ordered.
The Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
672, by the Assembly Committee on Rules,
Assembly Print Number 10402A, an act in
relation to providing for the administration
of certain funds.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
1584
is there a message of necessity at the desk?
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: There
is.
SENATOR SKELOS: Move to accept.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
question is on whether to accept the message
of necessity. All those in favor signify by
saying aye.
(Response of "Aye.")
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Those
opposed, nay.
(No response.)
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The
message is accepted.
The bill is before the house.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN:
Explanation.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Senator
Johnson, an explanation has been requested by
Senator Schneiderman.
SENATOR JOHNSON: This bill
provides language extending various provisions
of the law which would otherwise expire on
March 31, 2004. That is today. These bills
include the following provisions, which I will
1585
not read.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 60.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER: The bill
is passed.
Senator Skelos.
SENATOR SKELOS: Mr. President,
there will be an immediate conference of the
majority in the Majority Conference Room, and
the Senate will stand at ease.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER:
Immediate conference of the Senate Majority in
the Majority Conference Room.
Senator Ada Smith.
SENATOR ADA SMITH: There will be
an immediate conference of the Senate Minority
in the Minority Conference Room.
ACTING PRESIDENT MEIER:
Immediate conference of the Senate Minority in
1586
the Minority Conference Room.
The Senate will stand at ease.
(Whereupon, the Senate stood at
ease at 4:14 p.m.)
(Whereupon, the Senate reconvened
at 5:02 p.m.)
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Morahan.
SENATOR MORAHAN: Madam
President, may we go back to the reading of
the controversial calendar.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: The
Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
434, by Senator Little, Senate Print 5670A, an
act to amend and ratify the tribal state
compact between the St. Regis Mohawk Tribe and
the --
SENATOR HASSELL-THOMPSON:
Explanation.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Little, an explanation has been requested.
SENATOR LITTLE: Thank you.
In 1993, a compact was negotiated
between the St. Regis Mohawk Tribe and the
1587
State of New York. This compact had the
approval of the federal Indian Gaming
Regulatory Act and was approved by them on
December 4, 1993. The compact at that time
was negotiated by Governor Cuomo and did not
have legislative approval.
In 1999, a lawsuit was filed by the
Upstate Citizens for Equality, saying that the
compact should have had legislative approval.
The goal of the lawsuit was not to close the
casinos but to force some revisions to include
monetary payment.
On June 12, 2003, in a 4 to 3 vote,
the New York State Court of Appeals voted that
this compact should have legislative approval.
The bill that is before you today
does two things. Number one, it ratifies the
compact. And let me say that in the meantime
the Akwesasne Mohawk casino was built in
Hogansburg on the reservation by the St. Regis
Mohawk Indian Tribe. The casino is up and
running. It employs between 400 and 600
people, some on a part-time, some on a
full-time basis, some Native American, some
non-Native American.
1588
So this bill before us today
ratifies that compact and validates it. The
second thing that this bill does is that it
allows this casino to have slot machines, and
it also provides for revenue sharing.
The slot machines, once they're put
in, will have a -- has a proposal that has
been agreed upon where in the first four
years, 18 percent of the net drop revenue will
go to the State of New York. Then it goes up
to 22 percent and finally reaches 25 percent
of the revenue.
Of that revenue that goes to the
state, 25 percent of that revenue will go back
to the two counties, St. Lawrence County and
Franklin County and to the towns who are
affected by a loss of property tax and school
tax because of the land claims involved. The
two counties will split the share that they
get and allocate it to those towns
appropriately.
This has been agreed upon by the
tribe and will then be -- this amendment will
then be agreed by the Department of Interior
and the Indian thing.
1589
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Hassell-Thompson.
SENATOR HASSELL-THOMPSON: Thank
you. I appreciate the explanation. I have
voted no --
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Are you
on the bill, Senator Hassell-Thompson?
SENATOR HASSELL-THOMPSON: Yes,
on the bill only.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Hassell-Thompson, on the bill.
SENATOR HASSELL-THOMPSON: Thank
you. I have no questions for the sponsor.
On the bill, just very quickly. I
have voted no on the legislation, and I will
be voting no today because this -- the compact
does not include all of the reservations.
Particularly, it does not include the Oneidas.
And therefore, I will be continuing to vote
no.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Thank
you.
Senator Hoffmann.
SENATOR HOFFMANN: Thank you,
Madam President.
1590
I want to compliment Senator Little
on a very thoughtful explanation. And I know
this is very important to her district and her
constituents. And I applaud her willingness
to carry the message from her localities. And
I think she has done an admirable job of
explaining one of those issues that is very
difficult for me to explain to my
constituents, and that is why they are
entitled, in Senator Little's district, to
receive revenue at the local level from a
casino operation run by Native Americans where
in Oneida County and Madison County a very
similar casino provides no revenue for those
localities.
And many people have asked over a
long period of time how this situation came to
exist. For those of you who were not here in
those years, this was the first casino of its
type. There were very few in the United
States at the time. The Congress, in its
wisdom, provided Native Americans with a
revenue stream by giving them a special
opportunity to enter into gambling that was
not made available to other individuals.
1591
The Indians took advantage of this.
I remember saying at the time that I'm sure
that many of my Native American friends would
have preferred to have discovered gold or oil
on their nationland, but if this was their
only opportunity for a revenue stream, then
they were well entitled to it.
However, the compact required
government approval. And therein lies the
difference of opinion as to how this compact
should differ from the compact that the Oneida
nation operates. The compact with the Oneida
nation was signed only by the Governor of this
state. Mario Cuomo signed that compact; it
did not come to this Legislature for
legislative approval.
At the time, I was the Senator who
represented the area both at the casino and of
the nation homeland. The casino, for the
record, is in Oneida County, just over the
line. The nationland is located within the
jurisdiction of Madison County. Presently I
only represent the nationland, I do not
represent the casino itself.
But my constituents in Madison
1592
County and my constituents in other sections
of Oneida County have repeatedly asked why
they cannot be given the same treatment of the
people in other parts of this state where
compacts have been negotiated and then brought
to the Legislature and a clear revenue stream
is guaranteed to local governments.
I maintain, and my constituents
maintain, that the Oneida Nation compact is an
illegal compact because it was never brought
to this Legislature for a vote and
ratification. I will not support a compact in
another part of the state until the Oneida
compact is renegotiated and a fair revenue
stream is directed to the localities that are
in its immediate area.
Thank you, Madam President.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Thank
you, Senator Hoffmann.
Senator Liz Krueger.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Thank you,
Madam President. If the sponsor would yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Little, will you yield?
SENATOR LITTLE: Yes, Madam
1593
President.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Thank you.
I appreciate Senator Hoffmann's explaining
some of the history of this.
How does your bill change or modify
the existing compact? I mean, I understand
the issue of it was passed in '93, it went
through a court process, the expectation is
that the Legislature needs to pass something.
But you're also changing the '93 compact. Can
you explain how this changes it?
SENATOR LITTLE: Certainly.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Thank you.
SENATOR LITTLE: The bill
actually takes the existing compact, ratifies
and validates it. It then adds an amendment
to the compact, and that is in the bill under
Section 1 of F. And that amendment is
authorized pursuant to Section 1 of this act
and has been approved or deemed approved by
the Secretary of the Interior.
That amendment is the part that
adds the slot machines and allows them to have
1594
slot machines. And the actual purpose of this
is because the casino is located about 20
miles north of Malone, near the Canadian
border, a very remote area. Competes with the
Montreal casinos. And they are trying to have
the same attraction as other casinos have.
In allowing them to have slot
machines, they are giving a share of the
revenue to the State of New York and to the
local counties and the towns within them.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Madam
President, if the sponsor will continue to
yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Little, will you continue to yield?
SENATOR LITTLE: Yes, Madam
President.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Thank you.
That was very helpful to me.
So it leads me to my next question,
which is since there is litigation in the
courts right now that may determine that slot
machines and VLT machines are not
1595
constitutional, how would this law, with the
modification as you described it, impact what
happens in this casino, assuming that case is
found -- excuse me, the case finds that these
machines are unconstitutional in New York
State?
SENATOR LITTLE: Well, I doubt it
would change the outcome. But in the
meantime, this compact and this amendment
would allow for the casino to have slot
machines until such time as any court case is
finalized, and the appeals process and all.
But in the meantime, this would be
allowed. The revenues will come to the State
of New York. The local governments would get
some revenue back from it as a -- in
compensation for the lost tax revenues that
they have lost through the land claims.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Thank you.
Madam President, on the bill.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Krueger, on the bill.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Thank you.
I appreciate the sponsor's explanations to my
questions.
1596
I will vote against this bill, not
necessarily because I think in the long-term I
could not change my mind on this issue, but
rather it seems to me at this moment in
history, moving forward with this law when we
are all awaiting a legal decision by the
courts as to the constitutionality of slot
machines or video lottery terminal machines,
that we ought to wait and see what the courts
tell us before we move forward.
Second, I respect Senator
Hoffmann's argument from earlier that this
would in fact continue an inequity within even
casinos in the state of New York, that some
could have machines, some could not.
Finally, we had a compact that was
passed in '93. My understanding of some of
the deals that have gone forward between the
state and other tribes since have led us to
believe that we perhaps ten years ago weren't
as wise as we could be about negotiating fair
funding back to the State of New York as its
share of revenue for casino gambling.
And so I would add that if we were
modifying this compact such that we were
1597
actually evaluating significant new revenue to
the State of New York under the terms that
have been applied to other casino compacts or
agreements with tribes since then, that that
might also help argue at least an equity
argument between this specific compact in this
specific part of the state and other parts of
the state and other agreements we've come to.
So it seems to me that we ought to
be waiting for the court decision. We ought
to be evaluating all of the negotiations the
State of New York goes into with any group on
any kind of casino and have at least a
reasonable standard, an equitable basis both
for state monies coming in at the state level
and the local level.
We ought to reevaluate older
compacts in light of what we now know about
agreements that have been made both in the
state and other states about contracts or
compacts between states and various Native
American reservations.
And we also should put this in
context, although I don't believe it is
specific to Senator Little's bill, we should
1598
put this in the context of the larger question
I think we are all struggling with, since our
budget continues to make -- or our proposed
budget argues that we're going to pay for
education throughout the State of New York
into the future based on the revenue from VLT
and slotlike machines, that we should also be
evaluating this individual decision in the
context of where do we really stand on the
argument that gambling revenue should be our
stream of funding for the future of our
schools.
And I think these questions are
much larger than Senator Little's bill. But I
think the timing today for the State of
New York is to look at the larger picture and
not necessarily move forward on one specific
issue that in fact would complicate and even
add to inequities in the programs and the
operation of gambling casinos in the State of
New York.
So I will be, with all due respect,
voting no on this bill today and think we
should look at it in a larger context.
Thank you, Madam President.
1599
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Nozzolio.
SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Madam
President, on the bill.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Nozzolio, on the bill.
SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Madam
President, I rise on this measure as I have in
the past.
I am somewhat shocked by my
downstate colleagues' assessments of these
legal matters. That I have, as many of us
upstate have, land under siege by land claims.
64,000 acres in the center of my district has
been in litigation for 22 years relative to
the Cayuga Indian nation.
I'm not sure Senator Krueger's
comments about the VLTs and the litigation now
pending regarding VLTs have any relevance
whatsoever to Indian gaming. That the Indian
gaming has been immune from legal challenges
from the states for years. But be that as it
may.
I rise to comment on Senator
Little's bill because I have the greatest
1600
respect for Senator Little, that she has
worked very hard on this measure. And it's my
understanding that those localities within
Senator Little's bill support this measure.
And that to me, that's what should be relevant
to -- Madam President, can I have some order,
please.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Can we
have some quiet so we can listen to Senator
Nozzolio.
Thank you.
SENATOR NOZZOLIO: Thank you,
Madam President.
That Senator Little is asking her
colleagues to support this measure because
local governments in Senator Little's
jurisdiction have reflected agreements in this
legislation that have been worked out on an
individual basis with an individual Indian
nation. Those relationships are extremely
complex, and one size does not fit all in the
context of negotiations with specific Indian
nations. They're complicated interactions.
And that I think the overriding
sentiment of this legislation is that yes,
1601
this body, because of past litigation, does
have the responsibility and the authority to
oversee Indian compacts; that prior compacts
entered into by Governor Cuomo -- done so with
reckless disregard for the Legislature, with
no input from the Legislature, with no
approval process by the Legislature -- were
wrong. We believed they were wrong. The
courts have certified that that action by
Governor Cuomo was wrong.
And that's what Senator Little is
here presenting to, in effect, fix: having
this Legislature reflect upon an agreement
that was made in conjunction with Senator
Little's constituents, with the Executive of
this state, with Senator Little's input, and
reviewed by Senator Little, in presenting the
legislation to us for consideration.
I hope that what we establish here
today is a rock-solid precedent that says that
those legislative measures that come before
this body that are honed by the local Senators
directly impacted by those claims and by those
negotiations, by that compact, would in fact
be articulated by the Senator representing
1602
that area.
Senator Little does a wonderful job
in representing her area. She is today, by
this legislation, establishing a precedent
that the local Senator who proffers this bill
is in fact doing so with the clear
understanding of her local or his local
governments that are impacted by this measure.
Someday I may be before this
Legislature, before this chamber asking for my
colleagues' review of particular issues
relative to Indian land claims and Indian
compacts in my senatorial district. I am
listening to Senator Little today. I hope
that all our colleagues in this chamber listen
to Senator Little.
Likewise, when I am entrusted with
the possibility responsibility of bringing a
similar type of measure, if it ever comes to
that point, before this house, I would respect
the courtesy of my colleagues to listen to me.
That's the precedent that's being
accomplished here today, Madam President.
That's the reason why I am supporting this
legislation, because I believe it's paramount
1603
that we listen to the local representatives
who are closest to these very important
negotiations and very important issues that
impact local governments, localities within
that Senator's district.
Thank you, Madam President, for the
opportunity to comment on this measure.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Thank
you, Senator Nozzolio.
Senator Wright.
SENATOR WRIGHT: Thank you, Madam
President.
I too rise in support of this bill
and want to commend Senator Little in terms of
her efforts on this legislation.
Let's not forget that these
commitments have been in place over a decade.
Let's not forget that the facility is there,
the jobs are there, this has been an ongoing
institution for a number of years. Let's not
forget this was negotiated in good faith and
the bill that is before us was negotiated in
good faith.
It's not about court decisions. If
we waited in this chamber for pending court
1604
decisions. There wouldn't be much for us to
do. It's not about equity, because all of us
know there are numerous things that we do
daily here today that are not equitable to
everybody in this state.
So those are not the issues before
us. The issue is consistency. The issue is
good faith. We have been consistent with the
Niagara agreement, we have been consistent
with the good-faith negotiations that were
conducted and that have been concluded.
I, for one, one support the bill
and encourage my colleagues to do likewise.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Sabini.
SENATOR SABINI: Madam President,
would the sponsor yield for a question?
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Little, will you yield?
SENATOR LITTLE: Yes, Madam
President.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR SABINI: Madam President,
through you, if the sponsor would address the
1605
fact that this legislation results from the
2003 Court of Appeals decision. And I'm just
wondering, since that decision invited
legislation action, what happens if we don't
do anything, in the sponsor's judgment?
SENATOR LITTLE: Well, if we
don't do anything, Senator Sabini, I believe
that the casino that has been built that is
operating, has over 400 people employed there,
will have to cease to operate because it would
be operating illegally.
That casino at the present is
supervised by the State Police. The Indian
Tribal Council pays the State Police to
operate in that casino. We would end up
having our State Police hold jurisdiction over
an illegal casino.
The casino itself is illegal
because it has not been validated, the
compact. Therefore, we need to do that for it
to continue to exist.
SENATOR SABINI: Madam President,
if the sponsor would continue to yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Little, will you continue to yield?
1606
SENATOR LITTLE: Yes, Madam
President, I yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR SABINI: What I'm trying
to get at is that this bill didn't pass both
houses last year, despite the fact that it
passed in this house. And if we don't pass
it, there's a threat that the jobs would
disappear and that the development, the cash
and plant and equipment that costs a lot of
money, that the tribe -- and I believe
Caesar's is the operator of the casino -- that
money would be lost, the jobs would be lost.
But more importantly, as of now,
since they're not operating with legislative
approval, since this is worked out to get your
counties of St. Lawrence and Franklin part of
the revenue stream, as well as the state, are
we sort of in a limbo here where they could
continue to operate but not pay? That's what
they've been doing for the past year, is it
not?
SENATOR LITTLE: Under the
compact that was negotiated by Governor Cuomo,
1607
there was no revenue sharing and the state
didn't get any money and the local governments
didn't get any money.
You're right, the bill that I
proposed last year was simply a validation of
the compact. Since that time, we have been
able to negotiate with the tribal council and
the St. Regis Mohawk Indians to allow them to
have slot machines, which they feel they need
to be competitive. And in order to get the
slot machines, they are willing to salary
revenue with the state and with the local
governments, who have lost a lot of property
tax revenue.
SENATOR SABINI: Madam President,
if the sponsor would continue to yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Little, will you continue to yield?
SENATOR LITTLE: Yes, Madam
President.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: The
Senator continues to yield.
SENATOR SABINI: So this is just
very similar to the type of arrangement that
was made in the state of Connecticut in a
1608
matter of a couple of days, and they've
negotiated this over a couple of years -- and
to the benefit of localities that, frankly,
where revenue has been a little tight, jobs
have been a little right.
And by them sharing in the success,
they're now willing to sort of help all the
boats in those counties float a little higher
with some revenue.
But my question goes toward if we
don't ratify this, what is the danger of the
operation closing, since it didn't close last
year?
SENATOR LITTLE: Well, I think
it's only been because it was allowed to
continue while we ratified this compact.
We are not the only state who had
to ratify a compact after the fact because it
was not ratified by the legislature at the
time that the compact was negotiated. I had
the names of the other states; I believe it
was New Mexico and Arizona, but I'm not
positive. They also, in those cases, the
legislature had to ratify the compact
afterwards.
1609
I believe that there was an
understanding to allow the casino to continue
to operate while this Legislature would ratify
the compact. There's a lot to be lost by the
St. Regis Mohawk Indian Tribe and the people
that depend upon this place for their jobs.
There's a lot to be lost by the Native
Americans who work there. And there's a lot
to be lost by the local governments who can
share in the revenue stream, as well as the
state's General Fund.
SENATOR SABINI: Madam President,
if the sponsor would continue to yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Little, will you continue to yield?
SENATOR LITTLE: Yes, I will,
Madam President.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR SABINI: What I'm just
not getting is who is -- who established the
understanding they can continue to operate,
and when does that understanding expire? So
that we know what timetable we're under and
whose jurisdiction we're under to prevent the
1610
loss of those jobs and the revenue we're
talking about, which is significant revenue
for those counties.
SENATOR LITTLE: Well, I believe
it's the Bureau of Indian Affairs, who is
willing to allow the casino to operate while
we go through this ratification and validation
process. I believe it would probably be the
Attorney General has also agreed to this
process.
SENATOR SABINI: If the sponsor
would continue to yield.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Little, will you continue to yield?
SENATOR LITTLE: Yes, Madam
President.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: The
Senator yields.
SENATOR SABINI: What I'm getting
toward is, at what point does the Department
of Interior and the Bureau of Indian Affairs
have the authority or the hammer to come down
on the Akwesasne property? Which in effect
would be devastating financially to the
counties' employment situation and also to the
1611
anticipated revenue that this agreement would
bring in. Because I'm trying to get toward
the immediacy of this.
SENATOR LITTLE: Thank you.
I believe that the Court of
Appeals, when they made the decision that this
needed ratification, and it was a 4-to-3
decision, assumed that the Legislature would
ratify that compact by the end of last year's
session. Since it was the end of the session
and it didn't get ratified, they allowed it to
go to this.
I would assume that if this body
were to vote no as far as the ratification,
that then the Bureau of Indian Affairs would
begin to look at this a little differently. I
believe that they are relying on our good
faith to ratify and validate an existing
compact that was approved in 1993 by
then-Governor Cuomo.
SENATOR SABINI: Thank you, Madam
President. On the bill.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Sabini, on the bill.
SENATOR SABINI: I think the
1612
sponsor has demonstrated exactly why I think
this is important that we move forward with
this.
This state is going to be asking
for lots of agreements around the state for
much bigger properties and much more, frankly,
higher-employment areas perhaps than this
property is. And if the federal government,
which regulates Indian gaming, sees that a
compact that was worked out that was generous
enough to share revenue with counties and the
State of New York in what will probably be our
smallest gaming property in the state in our
lifetimes -- if we're going to reject that,
then I would think that the federal government
is going to look rather askance at us making
future commitments that aren't validated to
tribal gaming throughout the state.
We're going to be asking for that
as -- we've established the precedent as part
of our budget. If you disagree with the
premise that you don't like financing a lot of
our state on gaming, I can understand that.
But if you buy into the idea that some of our
revenue is going to have to come from gaming,
1613
if we reject this compact, that in effect is
sending a really wrong signal to the folks in
Washington who regulate Indian gaming that
we're really not -- we're serious in the
general but not in the specific.
And this is the smallest specific
example we're ever going to get. And I think
we should heed Senator Little's call and pass
the bill.
Thank you.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Onorato.
SENATOR ONORATO: On the bill,
Madam President.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Morahan.
Just one moment, Senator Onorato.
SENATOR MORAHAN: Senator, please
excuse the interruption.
Would you recognize Senator Duane
and have the last section read so he can vote
and get out of here, which that's okay by me.
(Laughter.)
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Read the
last section.
1614
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Duane.
SENATOR DUANE: What a guy.
No, Madam President.
(Laughter.)
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Duane votes no.
Withdraw the roll call, please.
Senator Onorato.
SENATOR ONORATO: On the bill.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Onorato, on the bill.
SENATOR ONORATO: I want to
compliment Senator Little on her initiative on
this. I'm definitely going to support this
here.
I'm really not totally in favor of
the concept of gambling itself. But in view
of the fact that these casinos are currently
operating and not contributing anything at all
to the state, I think it's commendable on your
part that you were able to negotiate with the
tribe to finally give something back to the
1615
state. And I think it's high time.
Perhaps this is going to set a
precedent for the rest of the casinos that are
going to be opening up in the state under the
Indian jurisdiction, that they should not be
the only ones to share in the profits, it
should be shared by all the people of the
State of New York.
I therefore urge my colleagues to
support this legislation.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Thank
you, Senator.
Senator Schneiderman.
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Thank you,
Madam President. On the bill very briefly.
I have heard in the debate today,
as we've heard at various occasions so far
this year, the admonition from some of my
colleagues from other parts of the state that
we have to respect the wishes of the Senator
who represents a district with regard to
matters in that district. And I think that
that is a commendable sentiment.
I have to say, though, representing
the City of New York, I find that that
1616
sentiment falters, it seems, when we come
south of the Westchester line. The City of
New York, we have had the right to deal with
our rent laws taken away from us by the state,
we do not have control over our finances.
And, as of the latest estimates, the City of
New York is currently sending more than
$3.5 billion more to the rest of the state
than we're receiving.
We're not asking for more than our
fair share, but I think we deserve our fair
share. And we shouldn't be having to raise
property taxes and sales taxes in the city
while continuing to subsidize every other part
of the state.
So I respect Senator Little and the
good work she's trying to do on behalf of her
constituents, but I hope we can have some
equal application of this principle of respect
for local sovereignty when it comes to the
five boroughs of the City of New York.
I am going to support this
legislation, Madam President, and I would love
to get support for this principle applied in
other areas as well.
1617
Thank you.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Read the
last section.
Senator Padavan.
SENATOR PADAVAN: I'd like to
explain my vote.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Padavan.
SENATOR PADAVAN: I'm just going
to explain my vote, because I know Senator
Monahan wants us to vote and get out of here.
SENATOR MORAHAN: I thought you
were going to ask my name right --
SENATOR PADAVAN: Now he really
wants us to get out of here.
(Laughter.)
SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN: Not all of
us, Frank.
1618
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Padavan, to explain his vote.
SENATOR PADAVAN: Madam
President, some of the previous speakers
alluded to the fact that as a result of action
in the courts, these compacts, which were
negotiated by a prior governor, had to come
back to us for ratification. Otherwise, the
operations were illegal.
What you should also know is that
the plaintiffs in that case, which consisted
of the Saratoga Chamber of Commerce, myself,
other legislators and other organizations,
were the vehicle by which that became a
reality.
The same group, however, is in
court, as I think someone mentioned, on the
issue as to whether or not slot machines and
VLTs are legal under our State Constitution.
Now, what's different here
primarily, as Senator Little has explained
more than once, is the fact that the original
compact has been amended in the statute to
include a thousand slot machines. And as we
have said many, many times in other places and
1619
on other occasions, it's very unwise for us to
be leading with our chins and counting on
revenue and actually projecting to spend that
revenue on a source of income that in a matter
of days, if not weeks, may turn out to be
totally illegal.
I realize that doesn't change the
conditions that we're now faced with with
regard to this bill. There are many other
issues relevant to casinos and slot machines
and VLTs throughout this state that we could
talk about and I will not talk about.
But with regard to the very present
issue, it is rather ironic that the reason you
have an opportunity to do this is because the
same people who sued and won gave you that
opportunity, but they are the very same people
who are in court today that will deny you the
slot machines that you've included and which
is the basic source of revenue that will be
distributed to localities of this state.
There is an irony there.
I vote no.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Padavan will be recorded in the negative.
1620
Announce the results.
THE SECRETARY: Those recorded in
the negative on Calendar Number 434 are
Senators Duane, Hassell-Thompson, Hoffmann,
L. Krueger, Padavan, and Stachowski. Ayes,
54. Nays, 6.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
562, by Senator Little, Senate Print 6331, an
act to amend the Highway Law, in relation to
the designation of the "Adirondack Veterans'
Memorial Highway."
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Read the
last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 3. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 60.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: The bill
is passed.
THE SECRETARY: Calendar Number
572, by Senator Padavan, Senate Print 5584A,
1621
an act to amend the Real Property Tax Law, in
relation to temporary commercial incentive.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Liz Krueger.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: To explain
my vote, Madam President.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Just one
moment, Senator Krueger.
Read the last section.
THE SECRETARY: Section 2. This
act shall take effect immediately.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Call the
roll.
(The Secretary called the roll.)
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Krueger, to explain her vote.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Thank you.
I just wanted to go on record --
and I will be brief, because I respect Senator
Morahan's earlier point about the hour -- this
is a bill that would open up to the City of
New York the right to reevaluate the
boundaries and meet to discuss the boundaries
of the Industrial Commercial Incentive Program
that was created in the '80s.
1622
What I want to say, though, is
this, like many other laws that are on the
books in New York State, are in fact
across-the-board, as-of-right tax exemption
programs. This program allows businesses who
are building in almost all of the city of
New York, nearly all of each of the
boroughs -- with one exception, in a section
of Manhattan -- to, as of right, get
exemptions from their real estate taxes. In
the year 2003, this program alone translated
into a $2.3 billion tax exemption for the City
of New York -- the largest, I might add, of
the real estate tax exemption programs.
I feel that anything, any kind of
model program that is allowing our tax dollars
not to be collected, and thus we don't have
that money for other important public services
in the City and State of New York, should be
going through a thorough review where people
are evaluating what are these projects, is the
exemption from taxes in the best interests of
the State of New York and the City of New
York, and that carte blanche right of --
basically right-of-existence tax exemptions
1623
are the kind of model New York State should be
taking a serious look at as we move forward.
So I'll vote for this bill, but I
do want to go on record that these are exactly
the kinds of programs we should be
investigating much more thoroughly.
Thank you, Madam President.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Thank
you, Senator Krueger.
Announce the results.
THE SECRETARY: Ayes, 61.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: The bill
is passed.
SENATOR MORAHAN: Madam
President, will you please recognize Senator
Montgomery.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Montgomery.
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Yes, Madam
President, I would like unanimous consent to
be recorded in the negative on Calendar 548.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Without
objection.
SENATOR MONTGOMERY: Thanks.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
1624
Morahan.
SENATOR MORAHAN: Madam
President, is there any housekeeping at the
desk?
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Senator
Hoffmann.
SENATOR HOFFMANN: Yes, Madam
President.
On page 38, I offer the following
amendments to Calendar Number 555, Print
Number 5746, and ask that said bill retain its
place on the Third Reading Calendar.
Thank you.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: The
amendments are received and adopted, and the
bill will retain its place on the Third
Reading Calendar.
Senator Morahan.
SENATOR MORAHAN: Is there any
other further housekeeping?
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: No.
SENATOR MORAHAN: I understand
there's a petition to discharge. Would you
recognize Senator Krueger.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: Thank
1625
you.
Senator Liz Krueger.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: Thank you,
Madam President. I do have a motion at the
desk. I would like to have it called up at
this time.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: The
Secretary will read.
THE SECRETARY: Senate Print
5922, by Senator L. Krueger, an act to amend
the Legislative Law.
SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER: This is a
motion to petition my bill out of committee.
It's S5922, an act to amend the Legislative
Law, in relation to registration filing fees
for certain lobbying entities.
I will just highlight that I would
also hope that at some point we will take a
look at my bill S4685, which would require
members of the Legislature to be physically
present for votes, given the absence of
members in the chamber as I give this motion
tonight.
Let's face it. Lobbying reform is
desperately needed in the state of New York.
1626
There are $120 million that were spent on
lobbying in this year alone. Public
authorities have become the fourth branch of
government, to quote Comptroller Alan Hevesi.
Billions of dollars are contracted out through
the State of New York each year without any
review of the lobbying that was involved with
the procurement or influencing of those
contracts.
Again, nine large state authorities
contracted for nearly $4 billion in the year
2002. The MTA recently awarded the largest
single contract in its history for producing a
thousand subway cars, a contract expected to
be worth $3 billion alone. And yet our
lobbying laws do not require any serious
reporting of this information for us, the
Legislature, and the public to understand the
process that is gone through to award state
contracts and money.
Unlike most other states, New York
law does not require lobbyists to reveal their
efforts to sway the awarding of state
contracts. This is the biggest loophole in
the state's Regulation of Lobbying Act of
1627
1977.
In June 2003, Governor Pataki
signed his Executive Order 127, which requires
would-be contractors to reveal the names of
their lobbyists. But these records are kept
on paper with individual agencies and
authorities and do not include the fees
lobbyists are charging, nor do the forms
always indicate what contract the lobbyist is
trying to influence.
Many state contracts are written
not to go to the lowest bidder but rather to
the most qualified bidder. Demonstrating such
qualifications is one of the biggest
industries in Albany. So much money is
involved, and so little is known about it
because no financial disclosure is required.
No one keeps track of all the money spent
wining and dining the right people to win
these contracts. This lack of accountability
and oversight all but invites corruption in
our city.
We knew this last year. We almost
moved and should have moved on legislation in
both houses that was agreed upon by the
1628
Governor to address this major loophole in our
lobbying law. I urge that the Legislature
must take the steps to protect the integrity
of the procurement process by enacting a
procurement lobbying reform law, as I have
proposed and others have proposed.
With respect to the Executive
orders in the rule-making process, the way in
which regulations are implemented can benefit
groups which can in turn prompt intense
lobbying efforts. The public should have the
opportunity to know when groups and
individuals attempt to go around the public
process and influence decisions through
informal mechanisms.
This proposal, my lobbying reform
bill, is about promoting open good government,
bolstering confidence in the practices
employed by state and local governments and
contracting for goods and services.
Taxpayers, including both the public and the
business community, have a right to know who
is vying for government contracts and how they
are working to influence those decisions.
I know there is broad support for
1629
this disclosure. It has come from the
Assembly, from the Lobbying Commission, as
well as from the editorial pages throughout
the state, including the Albany Times Union,
Newsday, the Syracuse Post-Standard, the Troy
Record, and The New York Times.
My bill is a bill that I think
everyone sitting here today agrees with and
everyone who should and I hope would be
sitting here, if they were in their chairs for
us today, would agree with: it is time for
New York State to do what the majority of
other states have already done, have an
accurate, fair, open process for documentation
and recording of lobbying fees, who are people
working for, who are their clients, how much
are they getting paid, what is the assignment.
That is what we owe the public. We
are spending their money, and we are not
accountable enough to them. And I hope that
my colleagues will join me in voting for my
motion to discharge my bill, S5922, because I
know that most of them are on record as
supporting this kind of lobbying procurement
reform.
1630
Thank you, Madam President.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: All
those Senators in favor of the petition out of
committee please signify by raising your hand.
THE SECRETARY: Those Senators in
agreement are Senators Andrews, Breslin,
Brown, Hassell-Thompson, L. Krueger, Lachman,
Montgomery, Onorato, Parker, Paterson, Sabini,
Schneiderman, M. Smith, and Stachowski.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: The
petition is lost.
Senator Morahan.
SENATOR MORAHAN: Madam
Chairperson, there being no further business
in front of the Senate, I move that we adjourn
till 11:00 o'clock tomorrow, which will be
April 1st.
ACTING PRESIDENT McGEE: On
motion, the Senate stands adjourned until
Thursday, April 1st, at 11:00 a.m.
(Whereupon, at 5:49 p.m., the
Senate adjourned.)