Regular Session - January 12, 2009

                                                            50



         1                 NEW YORK STATE SENATE

         2

         3

         4                THE STENOGRAPHIC RECORD

         5

         6

         7

         8

         9                   ALBANY, NEW YORK

        10                   January 12, 2009

        11                       3:12 p.m.

        12

        13

        14                    REGULAR SESSION

        15

        16

        17

        18  SENATOR NEIL D. BRESLIN, Acting President

        19  ANGELO J. APONTE, Secretary

        20

        21

        22

        23

        24



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         1                 P R O C E E D I N G S

         2                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    The

         3       Senate will come to order.

         4                  I ask everyone to please rise for

         5       the Pledge of Allegiance.

         6                  (Whereupon, the assemblage recited

         7       the Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag.)

         8                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    The

         9       invocation today will be given by the Reverend

        10       Peter Young, from Mother Theresa in Albany.

        11                  Father Young.

        12                  REVEREND YOUNG:    Let us pray.

        13                  By being a Senator you have been

        14       accepted into a leadership position so that

        15       you can more fully serve the people of

        16       New York State.

        17                  In this spirit of community, our

        18       prayer today will be to better achieve the

        19       goal of dedicated representation and the power

        20       that is entrusted to all of our legislative

        21       leadership.  May you attain your satisfaction

        22       in your services to your constituents.

        23                  May we today welcome our newly

        24       elected Senators and our Secretary of the



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         1       Senate.

         2                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Thank

         3       you, Father Young.

         4                  The reading of the Journal.

         5                  THE SECRETARY:    In Senate,

         6       Friday, January 9, the Senate met pursuant to

         7       adjournment.  The Journal of Thursday,

         8       January 8, was read and approved.  On motion,

         9       the Senate adjourned.

        10                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:

        11       Without objection, the Journal stands approved

        12       as read.

        13                  Presentation of petitions.

        14                  Messages from the Assembly.

        15                  Messages from the Governor.

        16                  Reports of standing committees.

        17                  Reports of select committees.

        18                  Communications and reports from

        19       state officers.

        20                  Motions and resolutions.

        21                  Senator Smith.

        22                  SENATOR SMITH:    Mr. President, I

        23       have a privileged resolution at the desk.  I

        24       ask that the title be read and that we move



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         1       for its immediate adoption.

         2                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    The

         3       Secretary will read.

         4                  THE SECRETARY:    By Senator Smith,

         5       Senate Resolution Number 7, that Angelo J.

         6       Aponte, of Staten Island, New York, be, and he

         7       hereby is, elected Secretary of the Senate for

         8       the years 2009-2010.

         9                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:

        10       Senator Smith.

        11                  SENATOR SMITH:    Mr. President, I

        12       rise to support and nominate Angelo Aponte to

        13       be the Secretary of the Senate for this

        14       2009-2010 session.

        15                  Angelo Aponte is someone I have

        16       known back as far as Mayor Koch.  We served

        17       together in that administration.  He served

        18       within City Hall with myself, in addition to

        19       serving as commissioner of the Department of

        20       Consumer affairs, one who's familiar with the

        21       law, a distinguished background in both

        22       fields.  He also served in the State of

        23       New York as Secretary of DHCR, a very

        24       distinguished career there as well.



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         1                  He has been a dedicated servant to

         2       the public, in his most recent position

         3       serving as vice president for finance and

         4       administration of Staten Island College as

         5       well.

         6                  And I believe that the State of

         7       New York and this conference, its members,

         8       will be well served as the Secretary for the

         9       Senate.

        10                  It gives me great pleasure to make

        11       that nomination this morning.

        12                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Thank

        13       you, Senator Smith.

        14                  The question is on the resolution.

        15       All those in favor please signify by saying

        16       aye.

        17                  (Response of "Aye.")

        18                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Nay?

        19                  (No response.)

        20                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    The

        21       ayes have it.

        22                  The resolution is adopted.

        23                  Congratulations, Angelo.

        24       Congratulations to Angelo Aponte.



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         1                  (Standing ovation.)

         2                  (Whereupon, Angelo Aponte was sworn

         3       in, by Senator Malcolm Smith, as Secretary of

         4       the New York State Senate.)

         5                  SENATOR SMITH:    Congratulations.

         6                  (Standing ovation.)

         7                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:

         8       Senator Smith.

         9                  SENATOR SMITH:    Yes,

        10       Mr. President, I have a privileged resolution

        11       at the desk.  I ask that this title be read

        12       and move for its immediate adoption.

        13                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    The

        14       Secretary will read.

        15                  THE SECRETARY:    By Senator Smith,

        16       Senate Resolution Number 8, providing for a

        17       Temporary Senate Committee on Rules and

        18       Administration Reform.

        19                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    The

        20       question is on the resolution.  All those in

        21       favor signify by saying aye.

        22                  (Response of "Aye.")

        23                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:

        24       Opposed, nay.



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         1                  (No response.)

         2                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    The

         3       resolution is adopted.

         4                  Senator Smith.

         5                  SENATOR SMITH:    Yes,

         6       Mr. President, on the resolution.

         7                  I believe, colleagues, this is, as

         8       we stated last week, a moment we can all be

         9       very proud of.  As distinguished members of

        10       this body, we have taken an oath of office for

        11       this session, and we also have indicated to

        12       the citizens of this state that we will do

        13       business differently in the State of New York.

        14                  This particular resolution is a

        15       resolution that forms a Temporary Committee on

        16       Rules and Administration Reform.  It's one

        17       that the public has asked for, one that I know

        18       back in 2005 Senator Bruno had a similar task

        19       force he put forward.  On that particular task

        20       force there were members of the Majority.

        21                  We will have a bipartisan

        22       commission.  In addition to having a

        23       bipartisan commission, in an effort to show

        24       that we are working together, this particular



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         1       Rules Administration Committee will come back

         2       in 90 days.  We are not asking for them to

         3       come back in a year.  And within those 90

         4       days, we will ask that they will bring new

         5       rules forward that we will debate and adopt.

         6                  Most significantly, Mr. President,

         7       we are also asking for dual chairmanships of

         8       this committee.  I have spoken to the Minority

         9       Leader, Dean Skelos, and we have agreed that

        10       Senator Bonacic as well as Senator Valesky,

        11       David Valesky, will chair this committee, in

        12       the spirit of bipartisanship -- a first for

        13       this chamber, where such a task force is being

        14       chaired by members of the opposite party.

        15                  It gives me great pleasure to

        16       support this resolution.  I think it's a great

        17       sign to the people of the State of New York

        18       that we are prepared to do things differently.

        19                  And I thank my colleagues.  I thank

        20       Senator Skelos for his cooperation and his

        21       partnership, and I know that Senator Bonacic

        22       and Senator Dave Valesky will do a great job

        23       and come back with a great report within the

        24       first 90 days.



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         1                  Thank you, Mr. President.

         2                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Thank

         3       you, Senator Smith.

         4                  Senator Klein.

         5                  SENATOR KLEIN:    Mr. President,

         6       I'd like an opportunity to speak on the

         7       resolution.

         8                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    You

         9       may proceed.

        10                  SENATOR KLEIN:    Thank you,

        11       Mr. President.

        12                  I too want to congratulate our

        13       Majority Leader, Malcolm Smith, on putting

        14       forth this resolution.  Putting together,

        15       appointing a Temporary Senate Committee on

        16       Rules and Administration Reform is really our

        17       first step in ushering in a new Albany.

        18                  If we're going to effectively do

        19       the people's business, if we're effectively

        20       going to deal with the problems of New York

        21       State, we need to do that in a bipartisan

        22       fashion.  And I think by putting together this

        23       commission or committee to actually look into

        24       ways we can reform the rules, that's how we're



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         1       going to achieve that.

         2                  You know, we talk about all the

         3       things we need to do -- taking care of our

         4       economic crisis, taking care of other issues

         5       that are near and dear to our heart.  But at

         6       the same time, we can't accomplish that unless

         7       the rules of this legislative body are more

         8       democratic.

         9                  I know not everyone is satisfied

        10       with the speed that we move towards this

        11       reform.  But I want to tell you something.  We

        12       waited 44 years; we can wait another 90 days,

        13       and we can do it right.  Because what this

        14       committee will do will make sure that the

        15       advocates all over this state -- the editorial

        16       boards, the good-government groups -- that for

        17       so long advocated for reform in our house have

        18       a seat at the table.

        19                  And that's the way it should be.

        20       Because what we're looking forward to is sort

        21       of a different type of governing, something

        22       that I call grass-roots governing, decisions

        23       made from the bottom up.

        24                  And I think, through this committee



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         1       and the hearings that will be held, we'll come

         2       up with ways that we can run this legislative

         3       body in a more democratic fashion and, just as

         4       importantly, in a more bipartisan fashion.

         5                  I vote yes on this resolution.

         6                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Thank

         7       you, Senator Klein.

         8                  Senator Hassell-Thompson.

         9                  SENATOR HASSELL-THOMPSON:    Thank

        10       you, Mr. President.

        11                  I rise to support this resolution

        12       and also to say that for the last eight years,

        13       I have worked with my colleagues in this

        14       chamber to make the Senate a better place to

        15       operate and do business of the State of

        16       New York.

        17                  The reforms that we pass today will

        18       make the Senate the type of legislative body

        19       that it was meant to be:  An open body, a

        20       deliberative body, and one that the people of

        21       the State of New York can be proud of.  For

        22       which this is a very important signal, too,

        23       that we send of our commitment to changing the

        24       way things are done.



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         1                  The year that I came to the Senate,

         2       we went into a dark place of rule changes that

         3       stifled the voice of the people that were sent

         4       to this legislative body on behalf of the

         5       people of the State of New York.  We are now

         6       offering an opportunity for those voices to be

         7       heard, for those debates to be carried, and

         8       for this Senate to deliberate in a way that

         9       will benefit all members and all residents of

        10       the State of New York.  For this I am very

        11       grateful.

        12                  Thank you, Mr. President.

        13                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Thank

        14       you, Senator Hassell-Thompson.

        15                  Senator DeFrancisco.

        16                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Just one

        17       question.  I don't know who to direct it to.

        18       Senator Smith?  Senator Klein?  It doesn't

        19       matter to me.

        20                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    You

        21       can direct it right to the chair, if you

        22       would.

        23                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    I'd request

        24       the sponsor to just confirm that the



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         1       bipartisan commission that's being appointed

         2       to study in a bipartisan fashion, that has

         3       bipartisan chairmen, is it true that the

         4       membership is four Democrats and two

         5       Republicans?  I just want to ask if that's in

         6       fact the case.

         7                  SENATOR SMITH:    No, it's six and

         8       three.

         9                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Six

        10       Democrats and three Republicans?

        11                  SENATOR SMITH:    That's correct.

        12                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Thank you.

        13                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:

        14       Senator Craig Johnson.

        15                  SENATOR CRAIG JOHNSON:    Thank

        16       you, Mr. President.

        17                  I also rise in support of this

        18       resolution.  I first want to commend Majority

        19       Leader Smith for his leadership and his vision

        20       and putting his actions behind the words that

        21       he has spoken for so long.

        22                  This is an important first step for

        23       reforming this great body of ours.  And I

        24       think what's really a great demonstration of



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         1       the commitment that we are showing is these

         2       meetings are not going to take place behind

         3       closed doors, but it's going to involve public

         4       hearings and it's going to allow the advocates

         5       and hopefully the public themselves, the

         6       people that we represent, the opportunity to

         7       weigh in on how this Senate operates.

         8                  I'm thankful for the leadership

         9       that Majority Leader Smith has already shown

        10       in proposing this commission to undertaking

        11       rules reform.  I thank him for his leadership,

        12       and I'll be voting yes in favor of the

        13       resolution.

        14                  Thank you very much, Mr. President.

        15                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:

        16       Senator Valesky.

        17                  SENATOR VALESKY:    Thank you,

        18       Mr. President.

        19                  Just briefly, we have a tradition

        20       in this house of at times reading resolutions

        21       or the text of resolutions into the record.

        22       At times we don't do that.  I just wanted to

        23       share for the members a couple of the

        24       paragraphs of this resolution, in the spirit



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         1       of this effort.

         2                  We're finding that the Senate finds

         3       a need for a thorough review of the

         4       legislative process in this Senate and the

         5       administration of this Senate, that the Senate

         6       is committed to reforming the rules of the

         7       Senate as well as the administration of the

         8       Senate generally, to create a more

         9       participatory and transparent legislative

        10       process.  And the effort to change this

        11       legislative process, in order to ensure a more

        12       open, effective and responsive Senate, should

        13       be undertaken openly and with the input of the

        14       public and interested organizations.

        15                  I share the spirit of the

        16       resolution, as the co-chair of this committee,

        17       and declare today on the floor of the Senate

        18       that I look forward to working closely and

        19       cooperatively with Senator Bonacic, my

        20       co-chair in this effort.

        21                  Thank you.

        22                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Thank

        23       you, Senator Valesky.

        24                  The resolution is adopted.



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         1                  Senator Flanagan.

         2                  SENATOR FLANAGAN:    Mr. President,

         3       I have a resolution at the desk, I believe.

         4       Amendment at the desk, excuse me.

         5                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    The

         6       Secretary will read.

         7                  THE SECRETARY:    By Senator

         8       Flanagan, Senate Resolution Number 67, to

         9       adopt the rules of the Senate for the years

        10       2009-2010.

        11                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Anyone

        12       wishing to be heard on the resolution?

        13                  Senator Flanagan.

        14                  SENATOR FLANAGAN:    Mr. President,

        15       I'd like to be heard on the resolution.

        16                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    You

        17       may proceed.

        18                  SENATOR FLANAGAN:    Thank you.

        19                  I guess I sort of get to go first

        20       on this side.  And I was talking to my

        21       colleague Senator Lanza, and part of what I

        22       was thinking -- I'm not sure who said this,

        23       but a lot of where you stand depends on where

        24       you sit.



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         1                  And I have a new seat today; I want

         2       to thank Senator Smith for giving me a new

         3       seat.  Unfortunately, I'm stuck with Lanza and

         4       Robach on each of my sides here, but --

         5                  (Laughter.)

         6                  SENATOR FLANAGAN:    -- we can talk

         7       about that later.

         8                  I want to talk about a couple of

         9       different things in relation to this

        10       resolution and in reference to the past

        11       resolution that just passed, and recognize a

        12       couple of basic things.

        13                  While we debate and deliberate a

        14       number of these things here, and these issues

        15       in this chamber, what does it really mean to

        16       the public?  And how do we actually go back

        17       and translate to the public what it is that

        18       we're doing here?  Because the reality is it's

        19       challenging enough for each of us

        20       individually.

        21                  And I don't think we should kid

        22       ourselves, to what really -- what is a motion

        23       to discharge?  What is a canvass of agreement?

        24       What does it mean to have power vested in the



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         1       Temporary President of the Senate?  How does

         2       that translate to the average person in Utica

         3       or Nassau County or Plattsburgh?  What does it

         4       mean to their life?

         5                  So I look at that as somewhat of a

         6       backdrop for what we're doing here today.  And

         7       as we move forward, and in listening to the

         8       comments from some of my colleagues, I do

         9       think it is important to recognize some of the

        10       changes that we've seen already.  Now, I'm not

        11       naive to the process.  I'm fortunate enough to

        12       be starting my 23rd year here in this chamber,

        13       and I have spent 16 years in the Minority.  So

        14       I know where I stand, and I know where I sit.

        15                  And in that context, I look at what

        16       we're offering in our resolution and compare

        17       it to what is being advanced by the Majority.

        18       And I recognize, and I think the public will

        19       recognize, and my colleagues will, that we

        20       play a slightly different role.  And part of

        21       that role is to be the loyal opposition.

        22                  I think I view part of our

        23       responsibility to advance issues, to push an

        24       agenda, and yes, periodically to make people



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         1       uncomfortable by pushing the envelope, by

         2       raising issues that sometimes people don't

         3       want to talk about and reminding people where

         4       they came from.

         5                  So what I would respectfully offer

         6       on behalf of my colleagues in the Senate

         7       Republican conference is this resolution,

         8       which in essence, Mr. President, mirrors the

         9       resolution that was offered by the Senate

        10       Democrats in January of 2007.

        11                  The difference between what I'm

        12       offering and what we will see, I think,

        13       relatively shortly is that this is the whole

        14       ball of wax, and what we've been given today

        15       is a lot less.

        16                  And that's okay, as long as we're

        17       honest with the public as to what we're doing.

        18       Because the reform agenda that came about, it

        19       didn't need a temporary committee, it didn't

        20       need more study, it didn't need more debate,

        21       it didn't need more public hearings.  Because

        22       it was advanced and it was voted on by this

        23       body, and it was a focal point of the reform

        24       and the change agenda, and there was outspoken



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         1       advocacy by many of my colleagues in the

         2       Majority advancing exactly what I'm offering

         3       today for the body's consideration.

         4                  Now, will I support the rule

         5       changes that will come ultimately?  Yes, I

         6       will.  And I think my colleagues will as well.

         7       But it's not enough.  So what we're trying to

         8       do is advance exactly what was offered before.

         9                  And I like to hear that the public

        10       should weigh in and that the advocates should

        11       weigh in and that the media should have a

        12       chance.  I don't know, I keep abreast, I

        13       think, as well as anybody.  There's a heck of

        14       a lot that's been written on the subject

        15       already.  There's a lot of advocacy groups

        16       that have weighed in quite heavily on this

        17       issue, and they haven't really deviated.  I

        18       don't think we need any more time.

        19                  We are arguing for more

        20       transparency, more disclosure.  No disrespect

        21       to Senator Breslin or to Senator Smith, to

        22       diffuse some of the power of the Majority

        23       Leader and to make sure that rank-and-file

        24       members have more to say.



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         1                  In terms of committee involvement,

         2       how to get a bill on a committee, how to get a

         3       bill out of a committee, how to advance a bill

         4       on the floor, how to stimulate the debate on

         5       the floor, and how to get issues before the

         6       public that sometimes may not have gotten here

         7       in the past.

         8                  This is a true reform agenda.  It's

         9       the full step forward, not a baby step,

        10       Mr. President.

        11                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Thank

        12       you, Senator Flanagan.

        13                  Would anyone else like to be heard

        14       on this resolution?

        15                  All those in favor say aye.

        16                  (Response of "Aye.")

        17                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    All

        18       those opposed, nay.

        19                  (Response of "Nay.")

        20                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    I

        21       believe the nays have carried.  The resolution

        22       is defeated.

        23                  Senator Bonacic.

        24                  SENATOR BONACIC:    Thank you,



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         1       Mr. President.

         2                  I have also an amendment to

         3       Resolution Number 9, if I may.

         4                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    The

         5       Secretary will read.

         6                  THE SECRETARY:    By Senator

         7       Bonacic, Senate Resolution Number 68, to adopt

         8       the rules of the Senate for the years

         9       2009-2010.

        10                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    You

        11       may proceed, Senator Bonacic.

        12                  SENATOR BONACIC:    This amendment

        13       would basically allow equal resources for each

        14       Senator to run their office.  If you are a

        15       chairman or a ranker, you would get a little

        16       bit more.  And as to each other, a chairman or

        17       a ranker, because it should be proportionate

        18       to the balance of power, those reimbursements

        19       should be almost equivalent.

        20                  Also, the amendment provides that

        21       the committee members' makeup be proportionate

        22       to the representation.  For example, we have a

        23       Health Committee; I just happened to take

        24       that.  There's 11 members.  Should be, I would



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         1       say, a majority of one of the Democrats, six

         2       to five, in proportion to the balance of power

         3       in this chamber.

         4                  Just a couple of things I'd like to

         5       share with you.  But before I do that, I want

         6       to thank our Majority Leader for keeping the

         7       staff allocations the same till April 1st, to

         8       allow an orderly transition.  You didn't have

         9       to do that.  You did it, and I thank you for

        10       it.

        11                  Number two, the culture in Albany

        12       is wrong.  It has been wrong for many, many

        13       years.  And I blame that on the longstanding

        14       leadership of the Speaker and our prior

        15       Majority Leader.  And what was that culture?

        16       It was to empower leadership and disempower

        17       members.  That's wrong.

        18                  So when we talk of equal

        19       representation and resources, we're talking of

        20       giving that particular Senator the power to

        21       represent 320,000 people.  Because when a

        22       Senator is punished, half the allocation goes

        23       to the Minority member, double goes to the

        24       Majority member.  You're not punishing the



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         1       Senator, you're punishing the people.

         2                  I don't believe for one moment that

         3       when anyone became a Senator here they

         4       intended to punish any of the constituents in

         5       the State of New York who are represented by a

         6       Minority member.

         7                  It's time to change the culture.

         8       And that's something you have been talking

         9       about for the past couple of years.  I've been

        10       handed a list of newspaper articles with many

        11       of you quoted -- changing, reform,

        12       bipartisanship, equality.  I'm hopeful you're

        13       going to do that, because in the next 90 days

        14       we're going to work on rule changes.

        15                  But on this point in particular,

        16       when I was a Majority member back in April of

        17       2007, I put a bill forward that called for

        18       equal resources.  You know what?  We got 10

        19       Democrats on that bill.  And thank you,

        20       Malcolm Smith, our Majority Leader:  You were

        21       one of them.  As well as you, Senator Valesky.

        22                  And I applauded, privately, Liz

        23       Krueger when she took on litigation to change

        24       the system for equal resources.



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         1                  This is not to embarrass anyone

         2       today.  This is an opportunity for change, to

         3       change the culture.  I look forward to the

         4       next 90 days.  I look forward to working with

         5       you.  We face real fiscal challenges.  We need

         6       the talent, the intelligence and the

         7       cooperation of every Senator here to get

         8       through this year.

         9                  And I just want to leave you with

        10       one other thought before we run.  It has been

        11       said that we should live so that when your

        12       children think of fairness and integrity, they

        13       think of you.

        14                  My hope, as someone who has

        15       advocated reform as a member of the Senate

        16       Majority, is reform can now happen.  If so,

        17       the credit will go to those who, at a time of

        18       great triumph, were benevolent to those were

        19       not, fair to those who were not, and who

        20       recognized, at a time in our nation's history

        21       when it was clearer than ever that all people

        22       are created equal, that we can represent

        23       320,000 equally.

        24                  And treating all members equally,



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         1       that will be the only way to ensure democracy

         2       and equal representation.

         3                  Thank you, Mr. President.

         4                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Does

         5       anyone else wish to be heard on this

         6       resolution?

         7                  Senator Diaz.

         8                  SENATOR DIAZ:    Thank you, sir.

         9                  Mr. President, I'm going to refer

        10       to my colleagues on the other side.

        11                  For six years I have been in this

        12       chamber representing the 32nd Senatorial

        13       District in Bronx County, one of the poorest.

        14       For six years I have been asking for staff.

        15       For six years I have been working with six

        16       staff members, trying to help my community,

        17       while other members in the Majority, they used

        18       to have 25 staff members, 30 staff members.

        19                  For six years I have been asking,

        20       give me money to fix my office so the people

        21       in my district can go to a decent office, like

        22       the Majority members used to have.

        23                  For six years I have been asking to

        24       give me some phones because my six staff had



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         1       to share three lines.  So when three of them

         2       were on the phone, the other three had to wait

         3       till one line opens.

         4                  So I understand your pain.  I

         5       understand what you're saying, because I lived

         6       through that for six years.  And because I am

         7       a minister, the pastor of a church, I would

         8       agree with you.  Just because I am the pastor

         9       of a church.  Just because I am an evangelical

        10       preacher, I would say yes, let's share.  Let's

        11       help them.  Let's be equal.

        12                  If I were not a pastor, if I were

        13       not a preacher, I would say suffer a little

        14       bit --

        15                  (Laughter.)

        16                  SENATOR DIAZ:    -- as I have

        17       suffered.

        18                  (Laughter.)

        19                  SENATOR DIAZ:    Thank you,

        20       Mr. President.

        21                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:

        22       Senator Adams.

        23                  SENATOR ADAMS:    Thank you,

        24       Mr. President.



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         1                  I heard Senator Diaz.  I remember

         2       when I was elected and I went to my Senate

         3       office that it was in the same condition, had

         4       the same furniture as Marty Markowitz used to

         5       have almost 20-some years ago.  And we

         6       attempted to get funds, as Diaz just stated,

         7       to renovate.  And I was denied.

         8                  I took money from my pension and

         9       tore down the walls, and my staff went in and

        10       we painted, put down new carpet, put new

        11       furniture inside.  Because as Senator Bonacic

        12       stated, it doesn't matter if a constituent is

        13       from Troy, New York, or Troy Avenue in

        14       Bedford-Stuyvesant.  We were sent here to

        15       represent them.

        16                  And so you can complain that the

        17       train is not moving fast enough, but thank

        18       you, we're on the right track.  We're on the

        19       right track.  Because I do acknowledge,

        20       Leader, I do acknowledge that some of the

        21       finest people in the State of New York are on

        22       both sides of this aisle.  And we are in the

        23       process of putting our state in the right

        24       direction.



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         1                  Because when a terrorist attacks

         2       this state, they do not stop to ask "Is it a

         3       Democrat or Republican we're destroying?"

         4       When a family member is starved or can't

         5       afford to fill up their car -- when we pull

         6       into a service station, they don't say take a

         7       buck off a gallon because they're a Senator.

         8                  We are all in this together.  And

         9       yes, you had an opportunity to bring us all

        10       together.  You failed.  Now join the team.

        11       Let's do this.  Let's stop complaining about

        12       what we're doing wrong and make sure we do

        13       what is right for the people of the State of

        14       New York.

        15                  So I'm not going to hold grudges,

        16       in my short period of time, for the thousands

        17       I had to put in my district office.  I'm not

        18       going to hold grudges.  Because something is

        19       more important than anything else in here.  It

        20       is important that we help the everyday

        21       New Yorker who is catching hell.  Who is

        22       catching hell.

        23                  I want to give you one short story,

        24       and I tell it often.  Two hunters in the



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         1       forest are hunting live game.  They come up

         2       against a lion.  One of the hunters looks at

         3       the other and says, "Let's run."  The other

         4       hunter says, "We can't outrun a lion."  The

         5       first hunter says, "I don't have to outrun a

         6       lion, I just have to outrun you."

         7                  (Laughter.)

         8                  SENATOR ADAMS:    This is what

         9       we've become.  We're no longer concerned about

        10       dealing with the lion of foreclosure, the lion

        11       of our everyday American can't send their

        12       children to college, the lion of unemployment,

        13       the lion of high taxes.  All we want to do is

        14       outrun each other.

        15                  And without realizing that when the

        16       lion of all of those issues becomes filled

        17       with devouring you or me, he's still in the

        18       jungle.  We must come together and decide how

        19       we get rid of the lion and not each other.

        20                  I'm committed.  I hope you're

        21       committed.  I know Vincent Leibell is

        22       committed.  I know Lanza is committed.  I know

        23       others on that side of the aisle I've had

        24       conversations with are committed.



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         1                  Today is our day to prove the

         2       pundits, the editorial boards, to prove

         3       everyone wrong.  The best men and women in

         4       this state sit in this chamber.  Now it's time

         5       to put our A game on and bring home the

         6       victory to the people of the State of New

         7       York.  I'm willing to do it.  And I think we

         8       can build a team around a marquee player named

         9       Malcolm Smith.

        10                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Thank

        11       you, Senator Adams.

        12                  The question is on Senator

        13       Bonacic's resolution.  All those in favor say

        14       aye.

        15                  (Response of "Aye.")

        16                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    All

        17       those opposed say nay.

        18                  (Response of "Nay.")

        19                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    The

        20       nays have it.  The resolution is defeated.

        21                  Senator Smith.

        22                  SENATOR SMITH:    Mr. President, I

        23       have another resolution at the desk.  I ask

        24       that it be read and move for its immediate



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         1       adoption.

         2                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    The

         3       Secretary will read.

         4                  THE SECRETARY:    By Senator Smith,

         5       Senate Resolution Number 9, providing for the

         6       adoption of the rules of the Senate for 2009.

         7                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:

         8       Senator Smith.

         9                  SENATOR SMITH:    Yes,

        10       Mr. President.

        11                  Today we put forth a resolution not

        12       for the sake of political rhetoric, and not

        13       for the sake of political promises, but for

        14       the true reason why we all took the call to

        15       represent districts around the State of

        16       New York.

        17                  There has been too long a period of

        18       time when we have tried to represent our

        19       constituency by doing what we think is best,

        20       as opposed to doing what is best.

        21                  Today, this resolution that we're

        22       putting forth for rules changes is a first

        23       step.  And I think that needs to be

        24       underscored to all our members, and it needs



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         1       to be underscored to the public as well.  This

         2       is not the final day for rules reform.

         3                  However, we are now here, on this

         4       date.  We have to move forward with something

         5       that says to the public that we are serious.

         6       Today we are here saying just that.

         7                  Are you going to be a hundred

         8       percent happy?  Probably not.  Are you going

         9       to be a hundred percent sad about it?  I would

        10       hope not.  Do I know that we have more to do?

        11       Absolutely.

        12                  But today we're putting forth a

        13       resolution that will allow all of us to go

        14       back to our districts, to go back, if we

        15       choose, to talk to the press.  And when they

        16       say to you, "Well, you started out, but this

        17       is not good enough," we can all say the same

        18       thing:  Yes, maybe it's not good enough.  But

        19       guess what?  We did two things today.

        20                  One, we said to the public that we

        21       are going to tell you the truth and we're

        22       going to do it.

        23                  Two, we also said to them that we

        24       heard what you said.  We heard the cry, we



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         1       heard the calling for change.  And that's what

         2       we're going to do with the adoption of these

         3       two resolutions today.

         4                  This one changes several things.

         5       One, it restores the motion to discharge.  We

         6       think this is important.  That makes a

         7       rank-and-file member truly feel like a member.

         8                  Two, it will allow members to

         9       cosponsor bills with one another.  Senator

        10       Libous decides he wants to cosponsor a bill

        11       with Senator Klein, God bless him.  That's a

        12       good thing.

        13                  Three, it will allow members' votes

        14       to be counted on amendments.  There's no

        15       reason why, as we talk about transparency,

        16       where the public will not have the ability to

        17       see and hear about debates, see and hear about

        18       how we vote.

        19                  And wouldn't it be wonderful if we

        20       brought a bill to the floor that was defeated.

        21       What is wrong with that?  Congress does it,

        22       City Council does it, I think local

        23       governments do it.  Why shouldn't we do that

        24       here as well?



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         1                  We will also be able to have a dual

         2       reference -- and I think that's modeled by the

         3       Assembly -- where it provides a check and a

         4       balance.  It allows our members, when a

         5       committee chair -- whether it's Senator Diaz,

         6       whether it's Senator John Sampson -- if in

         7       fact we feel that there is some jurisdiction

         8       that needs to be discussed on one of those two

         9       committees, that can happen.  As opposed to

        10       the chairman just moving it through.

        11                  So again, Mr. Chairman -- and I

        12       know a number of my colleagues want to talk

        13       about it, but I do want to applaud Senator

        14       Skelos, Senator Libous, and Senator Bonacic,

        15       who will be part of that new committee,

        16       because of their willingness to be a part of

        17       this.

        18                  We've had some discussions early

        19       on, and I think we are sending a message.  The

        20       62 -- not half, the 62.  We are all in this

        21       together.

        22                  I think this sends a great message

        23       to the public that this is the day that will

        24       go down in history that the State Senate of



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         1       New York has decided it was time to listen to

         2       the public, as opposed to preach to the

         3       public, by saying we're going to make this

         4       rules adoption and make this place much more

         5       participatory and much more functional for the

         6       members themselves.

         7                  Thank you very much.

         8                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Thank

         9       you, Senator Smith.

        10                  Senator Liz Krueger.

        11                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you,

        12       Mr. President.

        13                  Nice to see you up there,

        14       Mr. President.

        15                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    It's

        16       nice to be here.

        17                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    I stand to

        18       support this package of rules changes.

        19                  And I agree with some of my

        20       colleagues who spoke earlier from the other

        21       side.  It's not as far as we can go.  I don't

        22       believe it's as far as we will go.  That's why

        23       I am so pleased that our new Majority Leader

        24       has agreed to create a committee with a



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         1       mandate, a deadline, and members of both

         2       parties to be participating in it.

         3                  But I also want to highlight some

         4       of the things that my new Majority Leader just

         5       spoke on, because these are the issues -- I

         6       did hold a legislative task force on rules

         7       reform, and I did listen to the public come

         8       and testify.  And several of the key issues

         9       that I saw as a new Senator when I got here in

        10       2002, and lived with since then, are issues

        11       we're addressing right away.

        12                  And I think colleagues on both

        13       sides of the aisle do understand how important

        14       it is that we're making the changes we are

        15       right now, on the first day of Malcolm Smith

        16       being the Majority Leader in an actual day of

        17       session.

        18                  And one of those again, as he just

        19       mentioned, is allowing open cosponsorship of

        20       bills.  I watched so many times bills that

        21       colleagues on both sides of the aisle would

        22       privately say were so important, but we

        23       couldn't bring them to the floor because there

        24       wasn't enough momentum.



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         1                  I remember distinctly handing one

         2       of my colleagues the buck slips of 23

         3       Democrats, saying, "Take them now, cosponsor

         4       the bill with 23 Democrats along with the

         5       33 Republicans that had sponsored the bill at

         6       the time, and what leader could stop us from

         7       bringing that bill to the floor for debate?"

         8       And I was told no, they weren't allowed to

         9       accept 23 signatures to show that we could

        10       move that bill.

        11                  And it was Timothy's Law, and it

        12       took us several years more to finally pass

        13       that bill.

        14                  So I understand how important open

        15       sponsorship is.  And I also understand how

        16       important it is to have our votes recorded, to

        17       no longer have canvasses of agreement where we

        18       dance around procedural votes.  As opposed to

        19       being able to say "I voted for this" or "I

        20       voted against this."

        21                  And the fact is, I think we were

        22       one of the only legislatures in the country

        23       who had invented that concept of a canvass

        24       rather than having recorded votes.



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         1                  And some of us might have tough

         2       times explaining some of our votes going

         3       forward.  And that's what we get hired to do,

         4       to make tough decisions in the best interests

         5       of 19 million New Yorkers, and to be able to

         6       explain and justify the positions we take on

         7       the floor of the New York State Senate.

         8                  And I think it is very important

         9       that we're going back to the earlier rules

        10       around motions to discharge.  And I agree with

        11       my colleague who spoke about the importance of

        12       reforming the committee process.  And I

        13       believe we will, through the committee that

        14       was created today, I believe we will make more

        15       progress on that.

        16                  And something that I know my leader

        17       wanted to mention, but he didn't, so I will,

        18       just for the record -- his concern about

        19       ensuring we use the Internet and other

        20       electronic media to make sure that the public

        21       has fuller access to the information about our

        22       legislation and the votes that we take.

        23                  So I want to thank Malcolm Smith

        24       for investing in that plan.  He spoke of it



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         1       last week, about using new technology.  What

         2       do we all talk about all the time?  The

         3       importance of increasing transparency and

         4       accountability in government.

         5                  So the concept that the 62 of us

         6       and our staff can get on a Senate computer and

         7       find out much more information than the other

         8       19 million New Yorkers?  It's not right.

         9       Everyone should have access to as much

        10       information as possible.

        11                  And it's going to mean we have more

        12       questions to answer, and our jobs might be

        13       tougher and more people might ask us harder

        14       questions.

        15                  But I would argue that in the

        16       21st century our ability to be a better

        17       government, a more transparent government, and

        18       a more accountable government can be easily

        19       driven by the new technologies that are out

        20       there, that are available, that will become

        21       more and more cost-effective.  So I also want

        22       to thank him for including that in the rules

        23       reform we do today.

        24                  I know we can do more; I know we



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         1       will do more.  But as someone who has argued

         2       for changing the rules of this Legislature

         3       from before I got into office, I want to thank

         4       Leader Smith for taking these first steps

         5       today.  I know they're not our last steps, and

         6       I'm very proud to be able to vote for these

         7       reforms today.

         8                  Thank you, Mr. President.

         9                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Thank

        10       you, Senator Krueger.

        11                  Senator Winner.

        12                  SENATOR WINNER:    Thank you,

        13       Mr. President.

        14                  It's my privilege to be able to

        15       rise and discuss these rules change today.

        16       And I commend Senator Smith for bringing forth

        17       a comprehensive proposal.

        18                  However, I do agree with my

        19       colleagues that this proposal does not go far

        20       enough.

        21                  Frankly, one thing that's being

        22       overlooked here is the fact that this

        23       committee is going to report in April, and a

        24       substantial portion of the legislative session



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         1       will be over by then.  In particular, all of

         2       the motion to discharge opportunities will be

         3       over by the fourth week in April.

         4                  And that will preclude a lot of the

         5       opportunities, that individual members that

         6       you're touting to have all this power will be

         7       precluded from exercising those abilities

         8       between now and then, to a large degree.

         9                  Additionally, I don't know what is

        10       so difficult about changing the rules to have

        11       accommodated Senator Bonacic's proposal in

        12       particular.  Particularly the suggestion that

        13       we have equal resources is something that's

        14       been adequately advocated on your side of the

        15       aisle for many, many years.  In fact, Senator

        16       Krueger in fact litigated that matter and is

        17       more familiar with the arguments in favor of

        18       that than anyone else in the room.

        19                  Certainly if you're able to

        20       accomplish the ability to cosponsor bills and

        21       you're able to accomplish the elimination of

        22       the canvass, you're certainly able to

        23       accomplish the minimal language that would be

        24       necessary to provide for the equal sharing of



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         1       resources, and certainly able to accomplish

         2       the minimal ability to be able to have

         3       proportional representation on committees.

         4                  I mean, if proportional

         5       representation on committees is not the

         6       ultimate issue of fairness, I don't know what

         7       could be.  I mean, what is fair about being

         8       nonproportional?  What is particularly fair

         9       about a two-to-one representation on the

        10       commission to reform the rules?

        11                  I mean, right off, we're starting

        12       out on the wrong foot.  We've got now a

        13       disproportional representation on reforming

        14       the house rather than a proportional

        15       representation on reforming the house.

        16                  And additionally, believe it or

        17       not, isn't it ironic that here we are taking

        18       voice votes on resolutions rather than

        19       recorded votes.  I mean, we should be having

        20       recorded votes.  Everybody's going to be proud

        21       of recorded votes.

        22                  So to that extent, I think that we

        23       have not only failed to accommodate what are

        24       the minimal suggestions of the Brennan



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         1       Commission with respect to the reform of the

         2       rules, but, additionally, we're contradicting

         3       and putting sort of a smokescreen to avoid

         4       doing anything particularly in the spirit of

         5       that which you advocated during the campaigns

         6       between now and whenever whatever is adopted.

         7                  Which we don't know what will be

         8       adopted, because it is going to be two-to-one

         9       directed by members of your side of the aisle.

        10                  With that, I think that inasmuch as

        11       we do have between now and April in order to

        12       deal with the procedures that are going to be

        13       dealt to us with regard to this rules changes,

        14       I'd like to be able to ask Senator Smith if he

        15       would yield to a few questions as to how some

        16       of these rules that are being proposed and

        17       changes that are being proposed are going to

        18       operate.

        19                  Would Senator Smith yield to a

        20       series of questions as to the operations of

        21       the new rules that are put forth in your

        22       resolution?

        23                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Excuse

        24       me.  Senator Winner, I don't believe Senator



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         1       Smith has the floor.

         2                  SENATOR WINNER:    I know.  I have

         3       the floor.

         4                  So I'm asking Senator Smith if

         5       he'll yield to some questions as to the rules

         6       that he is proposing.

         7                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:

         8       Senator Winner, I don't believe he has the

         9       floor to yield.  You have the floor.

        10                  SENATOR WINNER:    Well,

        11       Mr. President, I think the normal procedure

        12       that at least I used to remember is that if I

        13       want to ask questions of the sponsor as to the

        14       provisions of his proposal, will he yield for

        15       some questions as it relates to those

        16       proposals?

        17                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    I

        18       would ask if Senator Smith would like to

        19       stand --

        20                  SENATOR SMITH:    Yeah, sure, I'll

        21       answer a couple of questions, Mr. President.

        22                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    And,

        23       Senator Winner, I would also say that I can be

        24       corrected at any time, because I'm not telling



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         1       you that I would be absolutely correct in all

         2       of my rulings.

         3                  SENATOR WINNER:    I understand,

         4       Senator, that none of us are infallible with

         5       regard to our interpretations of the rules.

         6                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    I

         7       appreciate that.

         8                  SENATOR WINNER:    Senator Smith,

         9       one of the proposals in here as it relates to

        10       the elimination of the canvass of agreement is

        11       as it relates to motions to discharge.

        12                  Now, is this proposal sort of

        13       similar to the proposal that exists currently

        14       in the New York State Assembly rules?  Or is

        15       this an entirely new crafting of your own?

        16                  SENATOR SMITH:    I'm not familiar

        17       with the Assembly's rules at this point.  I'm

        18       dealing with the --

        19                  SENATOR WINNER:    I'm sorry,

        20       Senator, I can't hear.

        21                  SENATOR SMITH:    I said I'm not

        22       familiar with the Assembly's rules.  I'm

        23       dealing with that we had discussed before,

        24       prior to us taking over the Majority.



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         1                  And this is simply a canvass of

         2       agreement in that votes will be recorded, as

         3       opposed to in the past, where we would have, I

         4       guess, a canvass of agreement, as you have put

         5       it before.

         6                  SENATOR WINNER:    So would you

         7       agree, Senator, that --

         8                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:

         9       Through me, Senator Winner, if you would.

        10       Thank you.

        11                  SENATOR WINNER:    Thank you.

        12                  Mr. President, I would ask Senator

        13       Smith whether or not he would agree that under

        14       this rule there will be a printed roll call,

        15       and I would ask him as to what form that

        16       printed roll call will be on a motion to

        17       discharge vote.

        18                  SENATOR SMITH:    Yes, Mr.

        19       President, there will be a printed roll call.

        20       And we also will have further transparency by

        21       having it on the Internet.

        22                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:

        23       Senator Winner.

        24                  SENATOR WINNER:    Mr. President,



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         1       if Senator Smith would continue to yield.

         2                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:

         3       Senator Smith, do you continue to yield?

         4                  SENATOR SMITH:    Yeah, I yield for

         5       another question.

         6                  SENATOR WINNER:    Senator Smith,

         7       will there be any notations on the roll call

         8       to differentiate a motion to discharge from a

         9       procedural vote or a vote on the merits of a

        10       particular piece of legislation?

        11                  SENATOR SMITH:    Mr. President,

        12       I'm advised by counsel that we will have a

        13       notation as such.

        14                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Thank

        15       you very much, Senator Winner.

        16                  Thank you, Senator Smith.

        17                  SENATOR WINNER:    If Senator Smith

        18       would continue to yield, Mr. President.

        19                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:

        20       Senator Smith?

        21                  SENATOR SMITH:    I'll yield for

        22       another question.

        23                  SENATOR WINNER:    Senator Smith,

        24       if I could ask you a hypothetical question as



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         1       far as procedure is concerned, as it relates

         2       to whether a particular type of motion is in

         3       order or whether it's not in order.

         4                  In the event that Senator X would

         5       file a motion to discharge a particular bill

         6       from the Committee on Health or any other

         7       committee, in the event that the bill is then

         8       reported from the Committee on Health to a

         9       subsequently referred committee -- let's say a

        10       few hours or a day before the motion was

        11       scheduled to be heard -- would that preclude

        12       the motion to discharge from being in order

        13       and being heard on the floor?

        14                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:

        15       Senator Smith.

        16                  SENATOR SMITH:    Mr. President, I

        17       think that would be basically a point of

        18       order.  And at that point you deal with the

        19       presiding officer.

        20                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Thank

        21       you, Senator Smith.

        22                  SENATOR WINNER:    If Senator Smith

        23       would continue to yield.

        24                  SENATOR SMITH:    One more



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         1       question, Mr. President.

         2                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    One

         3       more question, Senator Winner, through me.

         4                  SENATOR WINNER:    One more

         5       question?

         6                  SENATOR SMITH:    Yes.  I have

         7       another meeting I need to get to.

         8                  SENATOR WINNER:    Senator, if

         9       Senator Smith would indicate whether or not he

        10       feels that the Majority, pursuant to the new

        11       rule that states that a motion to discharge

        12       has to be present on a calendar of motions to

        13       discharge for a five-day period, does the

        14       Majority have the obligation to promptly print

        15       the calendar for discharges?

        16                  For instance, such as calendars are

        17       printed on a regular day, will the calendar

        18       for motions to discharge be regularly printed

        19       forthwith after the motions are submitted?

        20                  SENATOR SMITH:    Mr. President, I

        21       quite frankly appreciate my distinguished

        22       colleague's questions, because it really

        23       allows us to put further transparency to what

        24       we're trying to do.



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         1                  And I appreciate the fact that your

         2       question is exactly what we plan on doing.  I

         3       would hope, during discussion, he might be

         4       involved with the committee, because I think

         5       the expertise he offers is one that we would

         6       use.

         7                  And the answer is yes.

         8                  Thank you very much, Mr. President.

         9                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Thank

        10       you, Senator Smith.

        11                  On the resolution, Senator Winner.

        12                  SENATOR WINNER:    Well, Mr.

        13       President, in all due respect, I understand

        14       that Senator Smith has another commitment.

        15                  But perhaps someone else who is

        16       familiar with these rules would yield to some

        17       questions as it relates to the procedures

        18       involving motions to discharge and amendments

        19       and also on the committee reports.  Perhaps

        20       Senator Krueger.

        21                  SENATOR SMITH:    Point of order,

        22       Mr. President.

        23                  We've indicated that we have a

        24       Rules and Administration Committee that we



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         1       have put forth.  I think it would do us well

         2       for my distinguished colleague, Senator

         3       Winner, who -- I think he's right.  I think

         4       the questions that he is asking are

         5       thoughtful, I think they're insightful.  And I

         6       think that is something that we would love to

         7       have him a part of so that we can make sure we

         8       get this right the first time.

         9                  So perhaps if my colleague would

        10       appreciate the time element, that he would

        11       allow us to move the agenda but yet still have

        12       those questions put forward to the Rules and

        13       Administration Committee, of which Senator

        14       Bonacic will be co-chairman.  And I'm sure he

        15       would work very closely with Senator Winner,

        16       as I see he has some very insightful thoughts

        17       and questions.

        18                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Thank

        19       you very much, Senator Smith.

        20                  SENATOR WINNER:    Mr. President,

        21       on the point of order.  I believe Senator

        22       Smith raised a point of order.  I don't know

        23       what the point of order was, but I would be

        24       glad to respond to the point of order.



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         1                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    You

         2       may respond, Senator Winner.

         3                  SENATOR WINNER:    Thank you,

         4       Mr. President.

         5                  In all due respect to our Majority

         6       Leader, as I pointed out in my initial

         7       remarks, these are the rules that we have to

         8       live by between now and the middle of April.

         9                  And as a result, there are certain

        10       procedures that are being touted as being

        11       reforms that are in fact questionable as to

        12       whether or not they will, de facto, be reforms

        13       or whether they will act as the same type of

        14       subterfuge that the New York State Assembly

        15       Majority has operated under for several

        16       decades.

        17                  And those have been every single

        18       opportunity to thwart the opportunity of the

        19       Minority to bring a motion to discharge has

        20       been present.  And whether it's failure to

        21       print the calendar, whether it's moving a bill

        22       from one committee to another just hours or

        23       minutes before the motion is scheduled to be

        24       heard, whether it's creating undue time limits



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         1       to prevent the bill from ever being

         2       considered, whether it's limiting the number

         3       that can be considered in a day, those have in

         4       fact created a circumstance whereby there have

         5       been very few, if any, motions to discharge

         6       authorized and allowed on the floor of the

         7       New York State Assembly.

         8                  I just don't want you to fall into

         9       the same trap of touting reform but knowing

        10       full well that it's not going to happen.

        11                  So under those circumstances,

        12       Mr. President, I don't think the Senator's

        13       point is well taken.

        14                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    And

        15       that was really a statement rather than a

        16       response to a point of order.

        17                  Senator Klein.

        18                  SENATOR WINNER:    I believe I

        19       still have the floor.

        20                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:

        21       Proceed.

        22                  SENATOR WINNER:    Thank you.

        23                  Will Senator Krueger yield to a

        24       question?



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         1                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Excuse

         2       me, we're back to the same situation.  Senator

         3       Krueger does not have the floor.  You have the

         4       floor.

         5                  SENATOR WINNER:    Will Senator

         6       Krueger yield to a question on --

         7                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    You're

         8       out of order.

         9                  SENATOR WINNER:    With all due

        10       respect, Mr. President, I'm asking the Senator

        11       to yield to a question with regard to her

        12       remarks.  Something that in my judgment,

        13       humble judgment, is clearly in order as a

        14       necessary ability to engage in any type of

        15       debate in this house.  Without that, we would

        16       never be able to talk to one another.

        17                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:

        18       Senator, in order to accommodate you, I've

        19       been told that Senator Krueger is more than

        20       willing to yield to you.

        21                  SENATOR WINNER:    Thank you.

        22                  Senator Krueger --

        23                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Senator

        24       Winner.



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         1                  SENATOR WINNER:    Through you,

         2       Mr. President.

         3                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Thank

         4       you very much.

         5                  SENATOR WINNER:    Senator, you

         6       made the statement in your remarks that we are

         7       no longer going to, quote, dance around

         8       procedural votes, unquote, as it relates to

         9       eliminating the canvass of agreement and

        10       imposing a change in the motion to discharge

        11       procedure.  And therefore I believe you

        12       indicated there would be recorded roll call

        13       votes and they would properly reference what

        14       an individual's position is on the respective

        15       bill that's under consideration.

        16                  Is that an accurate representation?

        17       And if so, does that mean that we are going to

        18       be having, for sure, debates on the merits

        19       with respect to the motions to discharge bills

        20       that we bring before this house?

        21                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    For the

        22       record, I'm not the sponsor of the resolution,

        23       so I want to be careful to not misspeak any

        24       language of the resolution.



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         1                  My understanding is that we will

         2       not have canvasses of agreement, we will

         3       actually have votes up or down as individual

         4       Senators, and that we will be going back for

         5       this period of time -- until the Rules and

         6       Administration Committee makes final

         7       recommendations, we will be going back to the

         8       model that the Senate used prior to the

         9       changes effective 2001.

        10                  And I was not here under those

        11       rules.  You actually were the Majority then.

        12       It was right before I joined the Senate when

        13       we made the changes, so it is my

        14       understanding -- and again, I might defer to

        15       some of my colleagues on either side of the

        16       chamber who were here then, pre-2001.  It was

        17       my understanding that at that time, yes, there

        18       was actual debate on motions to discharge on

        19       the floor of the Senate, and there were votes.

        20                  But again, I want to be careful not

        21       to misspeak a point in history where -- I

        22       don't know if you were here yet, Senator, but

        23       I wasn't.

        24                  SENATOR WINNER:    Mr. President,



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         1       if the Senator will continue to yield.

         2                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:

         3       Senator Krueger, do you continue to yield?

         4                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Yes, I do,

         5       Mr. President.

         6                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Yes,

         7       Senator Winner.

         8                  SENATOR WINNER:    Senator Krueger,

         9       my question I think is fairly simple and

        10       straightforward.  Do you consider a vote as to

        11       whether to discharge a bill from committee as

        12       a vote on the merits with respect to the

        13       individual vote that you're taking?  Or do you

        14       consider it to be a procedural vote only?

        15                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    I hope that

        16       it will be both.  It will be both a debate on

        17       the actual substance of why this bill should

        18       come out of committee for a vote.  But I

        19       also -- which is more the procedural can we

        20       move this bill out of committee to the

        21       calendar.

        22                  But I also assume, and maybe that's

        23       the difference you and I are having, because I

        24       wasn't here when we did it that way.  I assume



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         1       that there will be actual substantive

         2       discussion of why any individual bill is so

         3       important that it merits a motion to discharge

         4       out of committee.

         5                  SENATOR WINNER:    Thank you,

         6       Senator Krueger.

         7                  On the resolution, Mr. President,

         8       so as to not prolong this much longer, because

         9       I can't --

        10                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Thank

        11       you.

        12                  SENATOR WINNER:    There are a

        13       couple of other areas in here that I think

        14       that we need to make sure that the Majority is

        15       not sliding toward the Assembly Majority types

        16       of interpretation of particular votes.

        17                  And while I take Senator Valesky

        18       and his reported quotes at his word, whereby

        19       he has indicated that there are going to be

        20       recorded votes on motions and on amendments

        21       and on legislation, that I also hope that

        22       there is not going to be a wholesale use of

        23       what has been touted in the Assembly or

        24       utilized in the Assembly to thwart any types



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         1       of recorded votes, and that is a rather narrow

         2       interpretation of what constitutes

         3       germaneness, which has been utilized rather

         4       adversely to silence the Minority.

         5                  But time will tell.  And we'll give

         6       you the benefit of the doubt today that you're

         7       going to deal with that in good faith.  And we

         8       will soon find that out, because obviously

         9       there is going to be a lot to amend here.

        10       There are going to be lots of great amendments

        11       that we're going to put forth, in particular

        12       when we get to this wonderful budget process

        13       that everybody is going to be so proud of.

        14                  And also I think that there is an

        15       opportunity here when we go forward on these

        16       amendments, in the amendment process and the

        17       motion to discharge process, to make sure that

        18       the members of your side of the aisle are in

        19       fact true to their word as it relates to their

        20       efforts to reform this process.  Because it

        21       will become very transparent very, very

        22       quickly if that is not the case.

        23                  So in the spirit of bipartisanship

        24       today, I think -- and also knowing full well



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         1       that we have to have a set of rules in order

         2       to operate in the temporary basis under which

         3       these rules are there, I thank you for the

         4       opportunity to debate these rules today, and

         5       hope that the pronouncements that have been

         6       made in the media and during the campaigns and

         7       elsewhere will bear fruition and that a lot of

         8       those abuses that still currently exist in the

         9       other house of this Legislature are not

        10       incorporated and don't find their way and wind

        11       their way into the procedures that you're now

        12       planning to put in place.

        13                  Thank you.

        14                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Thank

        15       you, Senator Winner.

        16                  Senator Klein.

        17                  SENATOR KLEIN:    Thank you,

        18       Mr. President.  I'd like an opportunity to

        19       speak on the resolution.

        20                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    You

        21       may proceed, Senator Klein.

        22                  SENATOR KLEIN:    Thank you,

        23       Mr. President.

        24                  Again, I want to thank Majority



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         1       Leader Smith and also single out Senator Liz

         2       Krueger for all the hard work she has done

         3       over the years to reform our process.

         4                  I think it's clear, and I think

         5       everyone is in agreement, that what we're

         6       doing here today is a modest first step.  But

         7       it's also a very important beginning.  And

         8       what we are doing today is a lot more than has

         9       been done in the past, and I think we should

        10       all applaud this small step forward but

        11       eventually a giant step forward in reforming

        12       our process.

        13                  Because I think what we are doing

        14       today is making sure we're empowering

        15       rank-and-file members.  The best way we can

        16       reform this legislative body is by making sure

        17       that everyone has a say in the process,

        18       whether or not you were elected as a Democrat,

        19       whether you were elected as a Republican.

        20                  And I do just want to concentrate

        21       on one piece of this bill, which is permitting

        22       open-bill sponsorship, which is authorizing

        23       any Senator to join on any bill as a

        24       cosponsor.



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         1                  Again, I think a lot of the

         2       Senators who spoke before me mentioned that

         3       many don't really know, meaning our

         4       constituents, what all this floor procedure

         5       really means.  I know Senator Flanagan was

         6       very articulate in talking about that.

         7                  And I want to tell you something.

         8       My four years in the Minority, I had a very

         9       hard time explaining to my constituents,

        10       explaining to interest groups why I wasn't

        11       allowed to sponsor a bill -- or cosponsor a

        12       bill.  Forget about sponsoring a bill and

        13       actually have any chance of that bill passing,

        14       but actually cosponsoring meaningful

        15       legislation.

        16                  I remember I did a lot of work in

        17       trying to repeal the five-year statutory

        18       limitation on rape.  And I was successful.

        19       And Senator Skelos, who was the eventual

        20       sponsor of that legislation, did allow me, at

        21       the end of the day, to be a sponsor.  I thank

        22       you for that.

        23                  But I think we need a much more

        24       open process.  Not by asking permission of the



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         1       sponsor of the bill, not asking permission of

         2       the respective leaders of our conferences, or

         3       not even asking an individual member whether

         4       or not they want to sponsor a bill.

         5                  If our constituents feel that this

         6       is an issue of importance, if an individual

         7       legislator feels that this is an issue of

         8       individual importance, we should have the

         9       ability to cosponsor that legislation.

        10                  So again, it may not seem like a

        11       lot.  But this one piece I think at least will

        12       make most Senators -- I hope all of us -- feel

        13       that we're really doing the people's business

        14       when we come up to Albany.

        15                  I thank you, and I vote yes on this

        16       resolution, Mr. President.

        17                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Thank

        18       you, Senator Klein.

        19                  Senator Schneiderman.

        20                  SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN:    Thank you,

        21       Mr. President.

        22                  I'd like to thank Senator Smith,

        23       our Majority Leader, for sponsoring this

        24       resolution.



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         1                  And I just have to say that

         2       listening to some of my colleagues on the

         3       other side of the aisle, of the late majority,

         4       brings back fond memories.

         5                  I disagree with -- oh, he's gone --

         6       Senator Flanagan.  Well, John, I do disagree

         7       with you when you make the point where you

         8       stand depends a lot on where you sit.  I

         9       understand that point of view.  But I do think

        10       that where you sit really should more be a

        11       matter of conduct than of words.

        12                  And I would urge all of you to take

        13       a look at what we're doing and take a look at

        14       what you did in the last ten years, and

        15       consider this.  Words are very cheap in

        16       Albany.  Look at our actions.  Today we move

        17       forward to make the Senate a somewhat more

        18       transparent, democratic place.  We move

        19       forward to actually enact reforms.

        20                  In the last ten years, you have

        21       changed the rules twice when you had the power

        22       and both times made it a less democratic, less

        23       transparent place.

        24                  Now, we can spend a lot of time



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         1       reminiscing about the abuses of the past and

         2       about not being able to get our names on bills

         3       and having constituents in your office

         4       demanding that you sponsor a bill which you

         5       were prevented from sponsoring.  But it's time

         6       to move on.  Let's move on.

         7                  Let's look at these rules reforms.

         8       Ask yourself a simple question.  Do these

         9       rules reforms, in their own modest way, move

        10       us forward or backwards?

        11                  And I would suggest to you there is

        12       no possible argument that these do not move us

        13       forward.  For the first time since I've been

        14       here we are changing the rules to open things

        15       up, to make it more democratic, to make it

        16       more transparent.

        17                  When you changed the rules to

        18       eliminate the requirement that we record the

        19       votes of Senators so our constituents couldn't

        20       tell how we voted on motions, was that moving

        21       things forward?  I don't think so.  I don't

        22       think so.

        23                  When you made us jump through

        24       bizarre loops to get any sorts of resources,



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         1       was that making the place more democratic,

         2       more transparent?  I don't think so.

         3                  I don't know, Senator Duane and I

         4       had a great time the year we couldn't get

         5       supplies at all -- paper clips, pencils,

         6       paper.  Was that really the kind of conduct

         7       that you now want to call on us to emulate?

         8                  I would suggest to you that you

         9       have to look at actions.  And today, for the

        10       first time since I've been here, we are

        11       enacting rules reforms that actually make this

        12       a more democratic, more transparent place.

        13       And we are acknowledging that we have further

        14       to go.

        15                  Nothing like this has ever happened

        16       since I've been here.  Senator Smith is saying

        17       we know this is a first step, we're

        18       demonstrating that we're on the path of reform

        19       by making sure these rules expire earlier than

        20       we're required to by appointing a bipartisan

        21       committee to consider and report back.  We are

        22       trying to move forward.

        23                  Is this going to be hard?  Does

        24       anyone with power give it up easily?  No.  But



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         1       this is a good-faith effort.  And this is the

         2       first time since any of us have been here that

         3       we're moving forward with reforms that

         4       actually open this up, that give a little bit

         5       more hope, that give a little bit of

         6       encouragement to the reformers among us and to

         7       the reformers outside that we can change, we

         8       can devolve power, we can become a more

         9       democratic, transparent and efficient body.

        10                  I could not be prouder to be here

        11       today and to see that in our first week in

        12       power we're not just talking, we're not just

        13       putting rhetoric on a bad bill or a bad

        14       resolution.  I would say we're not just

        15       putting lipstick on a pig, but it's been

        16       overused in recent months.

        17                  (Laughter.)

        18                  SENATOR SCHNEIDERMAN:    This is

        19       not a pig.  This is reform.

        20                  I proudly vote yes and urge

        21       everyone to vote yes.

        22                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Thank

        23       you, Senator Schneiderman.

        24                  Senator Squadron.



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         1                  SENATOR SQUADRON:    Thank you,

         2       Mr. President.

         3                  Thank you all.  It's a great honor

         4       to be standing for the first time as a member

         5       of this body.  It's a great honor to be a

         6       member of this body, a great honor to be

         7       speaking, for the first time that I stand as a

         8       member of this body, on Senator Smith's

         9       resolution.

        10                  I am very glad that you're the

        11       leader of this body and am very proud that I

        12       have the opportunity to speak on such a

        13       resolution on my inaugural day.

        14                  Certainly it's not a day when we're

        15       waving a magic wand and fixing everything.  I

        16       don't think that's how the world works.  It's

        17       not even the way that a strange place called

        18       Albany works.

        19                  But we are certainly today in a

        20       real way fixing something, and in a way that I

        21       think all of the members -- in fact, members

        22       on both sides of the aisle -- are proving

        23       they're deeply committed to.  And it's

        24       heartening for a new member to see how



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         1       committed folks across this chamber are to the

         2       kind of change that I called for.

         3                  I'm new here; I don't have a great

         4       deal of experience here as a member.  I do

         5       have a great deal more experience not as a

         6       member of this body.

         7                  And let me tell you, the rules of

         8       this body are not something that people think

         9       about specifically across this state.  But the

        10       effects of the rules of this body are

        11       something that make a difference in people's

        12       lives every day across this state, from the

        13       eastern end of Long Island, where another new

        14       member comes from today, Senator Foley, all

        15       the way up to Western New York and Buffalo,

        16       where Senator Stachowski and Senator Thompson

        17       are from, among others.

        18                  And by changing the way we operate,

        19       we will be offering the people of this state

        20       the ability to hold us all accountable for

        21       what we do and don't do in this very tough

        22       year and in the ensuing years, as we get past

        23       even these beginning reforms that are more

        24       than has ever happened, as far as I



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         1       understand.

         2                  Although if anyone knows of a

         3       greater day for reform in this body in the

         4       last couple of decades, I would love to hear

         5       about it -- perhaps afterwards in the lounge I

         6       was recently introduced to.

         7                  Today is not just a call for change

         8       with the security that it won't happen.  It's

         9       not a call for a mere headline.  Today is the

        10       beginning of real change, because of the

        11       conviction that it must happen and will

        12       happen.

        13                  And I'm very, very proud to be a

        14       member of this body today.  I am proud to

        15       support this resolution, and the previous one

        16       that passed, and work over the next 90 days

        17       and the upcoming years to say to the people of

        18       New York, please, hold us accountable.  That's

        19       why you elected us.

        20                  Thank you, Mr. President.

        21                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Thank

        22       you, Senator Squadron.  And congratulations on

        23       your first speech.

        24                  SENATOR SQUADRON:    Thank you.



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         1                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:

         2       Senator Duane.

         3                  SENATOR DUANE:    Thank you,

         4       Mr. President.

         5                  Something did come to mind; I was

         6       wondering who told Senator Squadron about the

         7       lounge.

         8                  (Laughter.)

         9                  SENATOR DUANE:    But really my

        10       greatest regret is that Senator Larraine

        11       Hoffman is not here for this day.

        12                  All right.  Let me start over.

        13                  (Laughter.)

        14                  SENATOR DUANE:    You know,

        15       actually, it's sort of exciting for me, after

        16       ten years, to have a debate like this about

        17       reform.  And I just think in and of itself,

        18       that is sending a message to New Yorkers.

        19                  And, you know, debates about reform

        20       and rules are always going to be contentious.

        21       I mean, even in one-house bodies, which I came

        22       from -- it seems so long ago -- we had

        23       contentious debates about rules and rules

        24       reform.  And I think it's incredibly healthy



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         1       for our democracy.

         2                  I mean, I am very glad to get rid

         3       of the canvass of agreement.  Good riddance.

         4       It was just really, you know, a concept whose

         5       time should never have arrived.  And I think

         6       that people going on the record is a very good

         7       thing, and for people to have the courage of

         8       their convictions is a good thing.

         9                  And I actually don't think that the

        10       breakdown is always going to be on a partisan

        11       basis.  It hasn't been to this point, and I

        12       don't expect that it will be going forward.

        13                  And I remember when Assemblymember

        14       Grannis was being confirmed as the

        15       environmental commissioner, that one of the

        16       things that made me think so highly of him was

        17       that I knew that when he was in the Assembly,

        18       that all of his bills were open to everyone to

        19       sign onto.

        20                  And while my colleagues on the

        21       other side of the aisle didn't particularly or

        22       necessarily take me up on the offer at the

        23       time, I always offered my bills to everyone

        24       for them to sign onto.



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         1                  And even if I had grudges about

         2       that and, you know, that this one didn't let

         3       me sign on, or that one -- you know what?  My

         4       grudges don't matter anymore, because those

         5       days are gone.  And that's -- I mean, that

         6       really is huge.  You know, there won't be any

         7       bad feelings about that anymore.

         8                  So even, you know, the things that

         9       we're doing today -- and we could disagree on

        10       whether it's a small step or a large step or a

        11       middle step.  It's still a step worth noting

        12       that's going to bring us really to, I think, a

        13       new and better era where we'll have a better

        14       opportunity to work together during these

        15       incredibly difficult times.

        16                  And I think the other thing is no

        17       matter -- and I say this from personal

        18       experience -- no matter what the rules are or

        19       what's going on, one person in this chamber

        20       can make a huge difference.  And no matter

        21       what the rules are, no matter what's going on,

        22       I really think determination and a strong

        23       belief in what it is that you're doing is

        24       really what makes the difference.



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         1                  And I think that each and every one

         2       of us are here because we have those strong

         3       beliefs.  And every voice here is one that

         4       needs to be and should be heard.  And that

         5       passion that each one of us brings here is

         6       what's going to change things for all

         7       New Yorkers.

         8                  So I'm excited about our ability to

         9       work together, and I commit to work together

        10       with everyone who's in here.

        11                  Thank you.

        12                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Thank

        13       you, Senator Duane.

        14                  Senator Pedro Espada.

        15                  SENATOR ESPADA:    Thank you,

        16       Mr. President.

        17                  And I must lead by saying that this

        18       debate here -- indeed, this resolution -- is

        19       not as procedural as it might be to others.

        20       This is a very personal matter to me.

        21                  In 2002, on the pathway towards

        22       bipartisanship, I was allowed to join the

        23       majority conference, then led by Senator

        24       Bruno.  I got to know many of the members of



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         1       the Republican minority now.

         2                  I was always treated with respect.

         3       I was allowed as a Democrat to pass historic

         4       legislation that evened the playing field for

         5       students of CUNY and SUNY.

         6                  And now, today, I'm at the

         7       precipice of making another type of history

         8       consistent with bipartisanship.  And I have to

         9       thank Senator Smith, a person I've known for

        10       over 30 years, for the spirit and the reality

        11       that he has crafted into this resolution.

        12                  Because, indeed, it is a pathway

        13       towards bipartisanship.  It is a bridge to our

        14       future, when our children and grandchildren --

        15       and, by the way, I have nine of them, of the

        16       latter -- can really see a future without

        17       artificial divisions that were there in 2002.

        18                  And those barriers were brought

        19       down by Senator Bruno, and we broke the color

        20       barrier then.  First person of color to be

        21       allowed to participate as a Democrat in 2002.

        22                  So Senator Skelos and the

        23       Republican minority now understand how to get

        24       it right.  We today, here, clearly understand,



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         1       and historically, waiting for 40 years for the

         2       opportunity, understand how to get it right.

         3                  And it's for all of those reasons,

         4       and in the spirit of unity, that I support

         5       this resolution.

         6                  Thank you so very much.

         7                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Thank

         8       you, Senator Espada.

         9                  Senator Stavisky.

        10                  SENATOR STAVISKY:    Thank you,

        11       Mr. President.

        12                  I think that 12 months from now,

        13       when they do the year-end wrap-up, they're

        14       going to talk about a new era, a new

        15       bipartisanship that hopefully will continue

        16       for many years to come.

        17                  In my Senate district we say that a

        18       long journey begins with a single step.  And I

        19       think we took that step today, and I

        20       congratulate Senator Smith for leading us on

        21       the beginning of a long journey.

        22                  Thank you, Mr. President.

        23                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Thank

        24       you, Senator Stavisky.



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         1                  To close for the Minority, Senator

         2       DeFrancisco.

         3                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Thank you.

         4                  I think that Senator Schneiderman

         5       stated it very accurately, that conduct is

         6       much louder than words.

         7                  Today the Majority is touting these

         8       new reforms -- it may be a small step, it may

         9       be a historic step; we've heard different

        10       characterizations.  The fact of the matter is

        11       is that conduct speaks a lot louder than all

        12       of those words.

        13                  For the life of me, I don't think

        14       that anyone is possibly surprised or in any

        15       way is wool being pulled over anyone's eyes by

        16       this debate today.

        17                  The conduct over the many years

        18       that the Majority was in the minority is that

        19       the rules are horrible.  The rules are not

        20       fair.  I've got volumes of quotes -- and I'm

        21       not going to single out anyone or try and

        22       embarrass anybody -- about how these rules

        23       changes are essential and fair, the rules

        24       changes that we submitted, the amendments.



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         1       That was right when they were your amendments.

         2                  There were speeches on the floor,

         3       you made amendments for these various

         4       amendments that we're making, when we were in

         5       the majority.

         6                  You had filed a lawsuit -- somebody

         7       spent some money or got a good pro bono

         8       attorney to file a lawsuit to try to change

         9       the rules the way you wanted the rules.

        10                  Some of you, including the Leader

        11       and Senator Krueger, cosponsored John

        12       Bonacic's bill for equal staffs and the like

        13       and spoke eloquently on the floor when you

        14       were in the minority.

        15                  Liz Krueger had hearings -- the

        16       minority task force or whatever she mentioned

        17       it was -- about rules changes, and she learned

        18       a lot.

        19                  Now, ladies and gentlemen, I don't

        20       think anybody is going to be surprised with

        21       this analysis, and that is how possibly can

        22       you go through all of those efforts and argue

        23       so vigorously for so many years, bring

        24       lawsuits, study, and during the campaign, in



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         1       order to take over the majority, tout reform,

         2       the Brennan reforms that you're going to do as

         3       your first priority, and come up with these

         4       four minor changes and say we'll defer the

         5       rest until we have had a chance to let people

         6       forget about it.  And, you know, I don't think

         7       anybody is being fooled.

         8                  So all I want to say is you're in

         9       the majority.  You can provide any rules you

        10       want.  You don't have to file a lawsuit

        11       anymore, you don't have to campaign on it

        12       anymore, you don't have to debate about it

        13       anymore, you don't have to say a word.  You

        14       can now do with your vote exactly what you

        15       claimed was necessary for the many years you

        16       were in the minority.

        17                  So all I wanted to do is basically

        18       set the record straight.  Conduct is a heck of

        19       a lot more important words touting these as

        20       real reforms.

        21                  Thank you, Mr. President.

        22                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Thank

        23       you, Senator DeFrancisco.

        24                  For a final close by the Minority,



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         1       Senator Skelos.

         2                  SENATOR SKELOS:    Thank you,

         3       Mr. President.

         4                  I rise today to comment on some of

         5       the words that were spoken by my good friends

         6       on the other side of the aisle.

         7                  I read from an article in the Times

         8       Union, an op-ed by Lawrence Norden, who is

         9       counsel at the Brennan Center.  And he

        10       mentions in a positive way that both Senator

        11       Smith, the Majority Leader, and I have spoken

        12       about the importance of independence of

        13       committees, the equal resources.

        14                  And, Senator Bonacic, I know when

        15       you mentioned prior Majority Leaders and

        16       Speakers not doing something, you didn't

        17       include me.

        18                  SENATOR BONACIC:    Absolutely not.

        19                  (Laughter.)

        20                  SENATOR SKELOS:    Thank you.

        21                  But I also go on in this article,

        22       and I'd like to point out, about the

        23       resolution that Senator Smith has put forward

        24       today, and they mention that the "new proposed



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         1       rules resolution, scheduled for a vote today,

         2       falls short of his present and past

         3       statements."

         4                  It says some positive things about

         5       the resolution.  And I know, you know, a lot

         6       of the issues that are within the Brennan

         7       Center report and recommendations were

         8       strongly supported by Senator Valesky, and I'm

         9       surprised he didn't support it today.

        10                  But it says here:  "There is

        11       nothing wrong with these changes, but they

        12       fall short of the kind of comprehensive reform

        13       the Senate needs if it's to become the

        14       deliberative, open, representative,

        15       accountable body that the Senate Democrats

        16       promised before the November elections."

        17                  Then it also goes on to say, "The

        18       Democrats already have a road map to rules

        19       reform -- one sponsored by none other than

        20       Malcolm Smith in January 2007, when he was

        21       still minority leader.  When Smith introduced

        22       that resolution, every Senate Democrat

        23       supported it.  His earlier proposal, like most

        24       of the Brennan Center's recommendations, makes



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         1       it clear how little the Senate Democrats have

         2       proposed now that they have a majority."

         3                  So, Mr. President, I would urge to

         4       reconsider the resolutions that were defeated

         5       by my good friends in the Majority, on the

         6       Democrat side, all 32 of you rejecting those

         7       proposed resolutions, which we think were very

         8       positive.

         9                  And I would quite frankly urge my

        10       colleagues on this side of the aisle -- of

        11       course, vote as you wish -- to vote against

        12       the resolution.

        13                  And, Senator Duane, I agree with

        14       you.  This was a wonderful day in debating

        15       reform, debating change.  And I'm confident

        16       that throughout the legislative session there

        17       are going to be many bills that are important

        18       to us individually -- important to you,

        19       Senator Duane -- that are going to come to

        20       this floor, and we're going to have an open

        21       and frank debate about the merits of that

        22       legislation.

        23                  So again, Senator Smith, we have

        24       taken a step forward in a positive way, and I



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         1       think the fact that we are looking at reform

         2       today is positive.  But we urge you to take

         3       those additional steps, not wait until

         4       April 14th or April 13th when the Senate

         5       session is a good part of the way through, but

         6       put them in effect now.  They don't need to be

         7       debated, certainly Senator Bonacic's proposed

         8       resolution.

         9                  It's simple.  Support it.  Support

        10       the Brennan Center, which every single one of

        11       you has heralded as the example of reform.

        12       Support the Brennan Center, as you have in the

        13       past.

        14                  Thank you.

        15                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:

        16       Senator Smith, to close for the Majority.

        17                  SENATOR SMITH:    Yes, thank you

        18       very much, Mr. President.

        19                  My colleagues -- Senator Squadron,

        20       Senator Liz Krueger, Senator Schneiderman,

        21       Senator Klein, Senator Valesky, Senator

        22       Bonacic, Senator Winner, Senator DeFrancisco

        23       and my partner in this body, Senator Skelos --

        24       this is a very historic day for us.  I think



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         1       there was not a person on this floor that said

         2       something wrong.  I think everybody was right.

         3                  I think you were right in that we

         4       have to do more, and we will.

         5                  I think you were right in that

         6       actions speak louder than words, and we acted

         7       today, louder than the words we heard for the

         8       last 20 years.

         9                  I think you were right when you

        10       said as we go forward, please make sure we

        11       make some changes.  And we will do that by

        12       getting that report back from the committee in

        13       90 days.

        14                  We rightfully agreed that there is

        15       more to be done.  However, today is Monday.

        16       We took charge on Wednesday.  We went home,

        17       some of us, on Thursday.  And, God willing,

        18       you had a wonderful weekend with your families

        19       and enjoyed the ascension to something that

        20       has not happened in over 43 years.  And on

        21       Sunday night, they came here.

        22                  Now, I know that my colleagues

        23       present themselves as superwomen and supermen.

        24       But while I ask them to get no sleep, I do ask



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         1       them to spend time with their families and

         2       enjoy that.

         3                  And I think tomorrow, when

         4       Senator Bonacic calls Senator Valesky and

         5       Senator Winner and Senator DeFrancisco gives

         6       him all the advice that he needs to bring

         7       forth the rules that you now put forth today,

         8       we will be more than happy to entertain those,

         9       and we probably will adopt them on short

        10       order.

        11                  I don't think 90 days is a long

        12       period of time, given that we had the rules

        13       that we were governed by for almost 43 years.

        14       So I don't think another three months is going

        15       to hurt.  If we waited that long, ladies and

        16       gentlemen, we can wait another three months

        17       and do it right.  What we are trying to make

        18       sure is we don't go back and make mistakes and

        19       have to come back and correct it.

        20                  So what we did today is send the

        21       message to the public, the message which is we

        22       heard you, we're making the changes.

        23                  What I don't want to do, though, is

        24       miss one of the most historic things that are



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         1       happening in these rules.  And I think while

         2       we are talking about committee members and

         3       committee sponsorships of bills and motions to

         4       discharge, there is one thing that is in these

         5       rules that we have not talked about today, and

         6       that's the historic change that we made in

         7       creating a vice president of the Senate for

         8       urban planning and policy by the name of Pedro

         9       Espada, the first person to chair that on this

        10       floor in the Senate.

        11                  And I salute you, Pedro Espada,

        12       along with my colleagues here.

        13                  (Applause.)

        14                  SENATOR SMITH:    And so,

        15       Mr. President, while we are thankful for the

        16       advice and input of our colleagues, while I

        17       think all of them deserve praise for the

        18       effort they put into it, we have a lot more to

        19       do.  We do.  We have a lot more to do.

        20                  And I would hope that even those

        21       who are not a part of the committee will

        22       provide input in such a way that we will

        23       clearly make a statement to the public within

        24       the next three months.



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         1                  And again, the committee may come

         2       sooner than that.  They may debate for a month

         3       and say, you know what, we're done.  Ninety

         4       days is the out date.  It doesn't mean that

         5       they can't come back sooner.  And should they

         6       do so and the rules are debated and agreed

         7       upon, we'll be happy to make those changes,

         8       because we have a lot more to do.

         9                  Mr. President, I thank you very

        10       much for your presiding, and I look forward to

        11       these new rules.

        12                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    Thank

        13       you very much, Senator Smith.

        14                  The question is on the resolution.

        15       All those in favor say aye.

        16                  (Response of "Aye.")

        17                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    All

        18       those opposed say nay.

        19                  (Response of "Nay.")

        20                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    I

        21       believe the ayes have it.  The resolution is

        22       adopted.

        23                  Senator Smith.

        24                  SENATOR SMITH:    Mr. President, I



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         1       hand up the following leadership notice and

         2       ask that they be filed in the Journal.

         3                  And at the same time, I also hand

         4       up the following Finance Committee members'

         5       notice and ask that they be filed in the

         6       Journal as well.

         7                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    To be

         8       filed in the Journal.

         9                  Senator Smith.

        10                  SENATOR SMITH:    Mr. President,

        11       before we adjourn, I'd just like to announce

        12       that we'll be having an immediate press

        13       conference following this session, and I

        14       invite all my colleagues on both sides of the

        15       aisle to be a part of that, as we discussed

        16       the rules changes.

        17                  And, Mr. President, if there is no

        18       further business at the desk, I ask that we

        19       adjourn and reconvene on Tuesday, January 13,

        20       at 11:00 a.m.

        21                  ACTING PRESIDENT BRESLIN:    The

        22       desk is clear, Senator Smith.  There being no

        23       further business to come before the Senate, on

        24       motion, the Senate stands adjourned until



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         1       tomorrow, Tuesday, January 13th, at 11:00 a.m.

         2                  (Whereupon, at 4:43 p.m., the

         3       Senate adjourned.)

         4

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        10

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        14

        15

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