Regular Session - March 15, 2011

                                                            1305



         1                 NEW YORK STATE SENATE

         2

         3

         4                THE STENOGRAPHIC RECORD

         5

         6

         7

         8

         9                   ALBANY, NEW YORK

        10                    March 15, 2011

        11                       2:03 p.m.

        12

        13

        14                    REGULAR SESSION

        15

        16

        17

        18  SENATOR JOHN J. FLANAGAN, Acting President

        19  FRANCIS W. PATIENCE, Secretary

        20

        21

        22

        23

        24

        25



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         1                 P R O C E E D I N G S

         2                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

         3       Senate will come to order.

         4                  I ask everyone present to please

         5       rise and repeat the Pledge of Allegiance.

         6                  (Whereupon, the assemblage recited

         7       the Pledge of Allegiance to the Flag.)

         8                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    In

         9       the absence of clergy, I would respectfully

        10       ask that we bow our heads for a moment of

        11       silence.

        12                  (Whereupon, the assemblage

        13       respected a moment of silence.)

        14                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

        15       Reading of the Journal.

        16                  THE SECRETARY:    In Senate,

        17       Monday, March 14th, the Senate met pursuant to

        18       adjournment.  The Journal of Sunday,

        19       March 13th, was read and approved.  On motion,

        20       Senate adjourned.

        21                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

        22       Without objection, the Journal stands approved

        23       as read.

        24                  Presentation of petitions.

        25                  Messages from the Assembly.



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         1                  Messages from the Governor.

         2                  Reports of standing committees.

         3                  Reports of select committees.

         4                  Communications and reports from

         5       state officers.

         6                  Motions and resolutions.

         7                  Senator Libous.

         8                  SENATOR LIBOUS:    Thank you,

         9       Mr. President.  At this time can we adopt the

        10       Resolution Calendar, with the exception of

        11       Resolution Numbers 830, 838, 845, 873 and 801.

        12                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    All

        13       those in favor of adopting the Resolution

        14       Calendar, with the exception of Resolutions

        15       830, 838, 845, 873 and 801, signify by saying

        16       aye.

        17                  (Response of "Aye.")

        18                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

        19       Opposed, nay.

        20                  (No response.)

        21                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

        22       Resolution Calendar is adopted.

        23                  Senator Libous.

        24                  SENATOR LIBOUS:    Thank you,

        25       Mr. President.



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         1                  Could we please call up Resolution

         2       Number 801, by Senator Kennedy, and ask that

         3       its title be read and move for its immediate

         4       adoption.

         5                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

         6       Secretary will read.

         7                  THE SECRETARY:    By Senator

         8       Kennedy, Legislative Resolution 801,

         9       commemorating the 200th Anniversary of the

        10       Town of Hamburg, New York, in 2012.

        11                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

        12       Senator Kennedy on the resolution.

        13                  SENATOR KENNEDY:    Thank you,

        14       Mr. President.

        15                  It is my distinct honor and

        16       privilege to stand here today to commemorate

        17       the 200th anniversary of the Town of Hamburg,

        18       New York, wholly contained within the 58th

        19       Senate District that I represent.  Next year,

        20       2012, represents the 200th commemorative

        21       anniversary.  The Town of Hamburg is located

        22       on the shores of Lake Erie.  It accounts for

        23       9 miles of shoreline along Lake Erie, with a

        24       population of roughly 56,000 people.  It is a

        25       manufacturing hub, with the Ford stamping



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         1       plant that is the manufacturer of the Ford

         2       Edge, a car that many of us are familiar with

         3       and even drive.  It boasts over 9 miles of

         4       shoreline, as I mentioned, and it is

         5       internationally famous for the Devonian

         6       fossils and outcroppings along the bank of

         7       shale along Eighteen Mile Creek.

         8                  The town holds various community

         9       events throughout the year, including the

        10       famed Hamburg Burger Festival.  It accounts

        11       for one of the largest county fairs in the

        12       United States that was established back in

        13       1868.

        14                  And on March 20, 1812, the Town of

        15       Hamburg was officially created, by an act of

        16       this body and the New York State Legislature.

        17       And during the next 50 years, the town became

        18       a thriving agricultural community.  By 1850,

        19       the present borders of the Town of Hamburg

        20       were created from its original boundaries.

        21       The Village of Hamburg was incorporated in

        22       1874; the Village of Blasdell, contained

        23       within the town, in 1898.

        24                  In recognition of the rich history

        25       and the enduring contribution the Town of



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         1       Hamburg has made to the heritage of the State

         2       of New York, it's the intent of this honorable

         3       legislative body to join in the commemorating

         4       of the 200th anniversary of the Town of

         5       Hamburg in 2012, so that the present and

         6       future generations may come to appreciate the

         7       unique significance which its history plays in

         8       the progression of our state and nation's

         9       evolution.

        10                  This honorable body today, I

        11       appreciate you pausing in commemoration of the

        12       200th anniversary of the Town of Hamburg.

        13       Thank you very much.

        14                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    Thank

        15       you, Senator Kennedy.

        16                  The question is on the resolution.

        17       All those in favor signify by saying aye.

        18                  (Response of "Aye.")

        19                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

        20       Opposed, nay.

        21                  (No response.)

        22                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

        23       resolution is adopted.

        24                  Senator Libous.

        25                  SENATOR LIBOUS:    Mr. President,



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         1       at this time I have a resolution at the desk,

         2       Number 830.  I would ask that we read its

         3       title and then just go ahead and move for its

         4       immediate adoption.

         5                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

         6       Secretary will read.

         7                  THE SECRETARY:    By Senator

         8       Libous, Legislative Resolution 830,

         9       memorializing Governor Andrew M. Cuomo to

        10       proclaim Tuesday, March 15, 2011, as

        11       Agriculture Day in the State of New York.

        12                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

        13       question is on the resolution.  All those in

        14       favor signify by saying aye.

        15                  (Response of "Aye.")

        16                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

        17       Opposed, nay.

        18                  (No response.)

        19                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

        20       resolution is adopted.

        21                  Senator Libous.

        22                  SENATOR LIBOUS:    Mr. President,

        23       obviously I would like to open that up for

        24       full sponsorship.  So if anyone does not want

        25       to be on the resolution, they should let the



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         1       desk know.

         2                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

         3       Senator Libous has opened his resolution for

         4       cosponsorship.  Anyone wishing not to be on

         5       the resolution should notify the desk.

         6                  Senator Libous.

         7                  SENATOR LIBOUS:    There's another

         8       resolution at the desk, 838, by Senator

         9       Griffo.  Please have its title read and move

        10       for its immediate adoption.

        11                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

        12       Secretary will read.

        13                  THE SECRETARY:    Legislative

        14       Resolution 838, by Senator Griffo,

        15       memorializing Governor Andrew M. Cuomo to

        16       declare April 2011 as Financial Literacy Month

        17       in the State of New York.

        18                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

        19       question is on the resolution.  All those in

        20       favor signify by saying aye.

        21                  (Response of "Aye.")

        22                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

        23       Opposed, nay.

        24                  (No response.)

        25                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The



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         1       resolution is adopted.

         2                  Senator Libous.

         3                  SENATOR LIBOUS:    Mr. President,

         4       Resolution Number 845 is at the desk by

         5       Senator McDonald.  Please have its title read

         6       and ask for its immediate adoption.

         7                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

         8       Secretary will read.

         9                  THE SECRETARY:    Legislative

        10       Resolution 845, by Senator McDonald,

        11       commemorating the 40th Anniversary of SUNY

        12       Empire State College.

        13                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

        14       Senator McDonald on the resolution.

        15                  SENATOR McDONALD:    Thank you,

        16       Mr. President.  This is also sponsored by my

        17       colleague Senator Hugh Farley.

        18                  This is to celebrate 40 years of

        19       Empire State College.  And with us we have

        20       Dr. Alan Davis, who is the president, John

        21       D'Agati, and David Henahan, who are here as

        22       guests.  Please stand.

        23                  This college was started in 1971.

        24       It's a very unique concept.  It's a College

        25       Without Walls concept.  You're able to turn



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         1       around and get a degree, an associate's, a

         2       bachelor's, or a master's degree --

         3       electronically, through computers or

         4       telecommunications, or even one-on-one with

         5       the faculty or a combination thereof.  It's an

         6       open system, and it's especially relevant to

         7       our working-class community that we have.

         8                  We have over 20,000 students in the

         9       system, and 75 percent or more are actually

        10       employed, going back to improve themselves to

        11       make them more valuable to us as producers in

        12       our great New York State.

        13                  And I'm honored to have the

        14       headquarters for this facility in Saratoga

        15       Springs.  They have 35 other site locations

        16       throughout the state.  The most recent one is

        17       in the city of Troy, also in my district.

        18                  They've made a major impact to many

        19       people throughout our district -- many people

        20       in this building, in fact.  I want to commend

        21       them for their 40 years of service.  They're a

        22       tremendous neighbor in the city of Saratoga

        23       Springs and every community that they're at.

        24                  So thank you, Empire State College.

        25                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    Thank



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         1       you, Senator McDonald.

         2                  Senator Farley on the resolution.

         3                  SENATOR FARLEY:    Thank you,

         4       Mr. President.

         5                  I rise in support of this to say

         6       that we have an asset in this state called the

         7       Empire State College, which is really an

         8       incredible opportunity for people to extend

         9       their education and get a degree.

        10                  As a professor, as a law professor

        11       at the School of Business in SUNY Albany, I

        12       was a contract author for this university and

        13       also taught several correspondence classes for

        14       people taking business law, wrote two

        15       textbooks that were used very successfully.

        16                  And this is a great opportunity,

        17       particularly for a lot of students who are

        18       working and pursuing an education.  And this

        19       is their 40th anniversary.  This is really one

        20       of the hidden treasures of our state

        21       educational system.  And I rise in support and

        22       call the attention of this body to this

        23       magnificent institution which does so much for

        24       our citizens.

        25                  Thank you, Mr. President.



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         1                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    Thank

         2       you, Senator Farley.

         3                  Senator LaValle on the resolution.

         4                  SENATOR LaVALLE:    Thank you,

         5       Mr. President.

         6                  I rise to join my two colleagues

         7       Senator McDonald and Senator Farley in

         8       congratulating and commemorating the 40 years

         9       of the Empire State College.  It is one of the

        10       secret gems, secret gems within the SUNY

        11       system.  It provides opportunities

        12       particularly for individuals who in their life

        13       missed the opportunity to attend a community

        14       college or a four-year school.  And be able

        15       to, at a later point in life, be able to use

        16       their life experience and be able to join in

        17       the programs that the Empire State program has

        18       and allowing people to fulfill what was a

        19       dream and a hope that they'd be able to

        20       receive a baccalaureate degree and even a

        21       master's degree.

        22                  So it is again one of the true gems

        23       within the SUNY system.  And I wish the Empire

        24       State College and all of those people

        25       associated, all the mentors and faculty and



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         1       administrators, another 40 years of success.

         2                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    Thank

         3       you, Senator LaValle.

         4                  Senator Stavisky on the resolution.

         5                  SENATOR STAVISKY:    On the

         6       resolution, Mr. President.

         7                  I too want to commend the Empire

         8       State College for its 40 years of service to

         9       the students of New York State.  In fact,

        10       there's a member of my staff attending Empire

        11       State College.  And it's there for people

        12       throughout the state to take advantage of the

        13       benefits of a SUNY education and at the same

        14       time adapt it to their own individual needs.

        15                  And I must say that as we debate

        16       the bills today, or the resolutions today

        17       dealing with the budget, let's remember the

        18       importance and the contribution of SUNY and of

        19       Empire State College so that Empire State

        20       College can remain the affordable institution

        21       providing a quality education to those people

        22       in New York State.

        23                  I congratulate Empire State College

        24       on 40 years, and it's just a wonderful part of

        25       the wonderful SUNY 64-college system.



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         1                  Thank you, Mr. President.

         2                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    Thank

         3       you, Senator Stavisky.

         4                  Is there any other Senator wishing

         5       to be heard?

         6                  Hearing none, the question is on

         7       the resolution.  All those in favor signify by

         8       saying aye.

         9                  (Response of "Aye.")

        10                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

        11       Opposed, nay.

        12                  (No response.)

        13                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

        14       resolution is adopted.

        15                  Gentlemen, thank you.

        16                  Senator Libous.

        17                  SENATOR LIBOUS:    Mr. President,

        18       there's a resolution at the desk, 655.  It was

        19       previously adopted by the house, a resolution

        20       by Senator Farley.  May we please have its

        21       title read and call on Senator Farley.

        22                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

        23       Secretary will read.

        24                  THE SECRETARY:    Legislative

        25       Resolution 655, by Senator Farley, recognizing



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         1       March of 2011 as Women's History Month.

         2                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

         3       Senator Farley on the resolution.

         4                  SENATOR FARLEY:    Thank you,

         5       Mr. President.

         6                  March 2011 is Women's History

         7       Month.  Throughout American history, women

         8       have been instrumental in the success of many

         9       important movements such as abolition,

        10       emancipation and civil rights.  Countless

        11       charities, cultural institutions and

        12       philosophic organizations were started by

        13       women, and they owe their longevity to women.

        14       Incidentally, my mother was a suffragette.

        15                  The Schenectady Business and

        16       Professional Women's Club will celebrate

        17       Women's History Month throughout March,

        18       including a panel presentation on March 22nd

        19       based on this year's theme, "Our History is

        20       Our Strength."

        21                  Today in the chambers with us we

        22       have the Business and Professional Women's

        23       president, Jane Osterhout, right over here.

        24       Jane, if you'd stand up.  And also with us is

        25       a BPW, or Business and Professional Women's



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         1       member, Cindy Powell, who's a dear friend of

         2       mine.

         3                  Mr. President, I would ask that you

         4       welcome these outstanding women in my

         5       community and give them the privileges of this

         6       chamber.

         7                  (Applause.)

         8                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    Thank

         9       you, Senator Farley.  Of course, given the

        10       fact that they are your friends, we will

        11       certainly welcome them to the Senate chamber.

        12                  Enjoy your day, ladies.

        13                  This resolution was previously

        14       adopted.

        15                  Senator Libous.

        16                  SENATOR LIBOUS:    Thank you,

        17       Mr. President.

        18                  At this time there's a privileged

        19       resolution at the desk by Senator Ritchie.

        20       May we please have the title read and move for

        21       its immediate adoption.

        22                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

        23       Secretary will read.

        24                  THE SECRETARY:    Legislative

        25       resolution by Senator Ritchie, commending the



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         1       New York Farm Bureau on the occasion of

         2       celebrating its 100th Anniversary, and

         3       saluting the outstanding service of its

         4       members and staff on behalf of the

         5       agricultural community and the people of

         6       New York.

         7                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

         8       Senator Libous.

         9                  SENATOR LIBOUS:    I just want to

        10       make note, Mr. President -- Senator Ritchie

        11       has that resolution before the house, the

        12       100th anniversary of the Farm Bureau -- and I

        13       just want to make it noted that the Farm

        14       Bureau started in Broome County.  And I know

        15       some of you are shocked to hear that, but it's

        16       a fact.  And we're very proud.

        17                  And earlier I had a resolution on

        18       the floor and I didn't want to get up twice; I

        19       thought it would be appropriate to speak on

        20       one of the resolutions about Agriculture

        21       Month.

        22                  We are very blessed in this state

        23       to have the great farmers that we have and the

        24       agriculture economy that we have in this

        25       state.  And I know sometimes this house gets



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         1       involved in a number of different debates.

         2       And as Senator Smith likes to say that we are

         3       one New York, and we indeed, sir, are.  And

         4       certainly Manhattan is different from upstate

         5       New York and Long Island is different from

         6       Western New York.

         7                  But we are very blessed to have the

         8       Farm Bureau and the members that are dedicated

         9       to the Farm Bureau celebrating its 100th

        10       anniversary.  And I'm very proud to stand on

        11       the floor and say that it started off in a

        12       place called Broome County that I represent.

        13                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    Thank

        14       you, Senator Libous.

        15                  Senator Liz Krueger on the

        16       resolution.

        17                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you.

        18       I also am proud to stand up in support of

        19       Senator Libous's resolution in honor of the

        20       Farm Bureau.

        21                  I did not know it started in Broome

        22       County.  But since he referenced that

        23       Manhattan and Broome County are somewhat

        24       different, I wanted to note for the record my

        25       home that I live in in Manhattan was an



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         1       original farmhouse from 1765, when the area of

         2       Manhattan I represent was filled with pig

         3       farms, and mine was the house of the original

         4       pig farmer in the East 70s and 80s.

         5                  So Manhattan also has a proud

         6       history of farming, although to be honest it's

         7       been a while since we had any working farms in

         8       Manhattan.

         9                  So thank you very much,

        10       Mr. President.

        11                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    Thank

        12       you, Senator Krueger.

        13                  Is there any other Senator wishing

        14       to be heard?

        15                  Hearing none, the question is on

        16       the resolution.  All those in favor signify by

        17       saying aye.

        18                  (Response of "Aye.")

        19                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

        20       Opposed, nay.

        21                  (No response.)

        22                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

        23       resolution is adopted.

        24                  Senator Libous.

        25                  SENATOR LIBOUS:    Mr. President,



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         1       Senator Ritchie has asked that if members want

         2       to cosponsor the resolution, as we always do;

         3       and that if someone does not want to cosponsor

         4       the resolution, please let the desk know.

         5                  Mr. President, as we move along

         6       with resolutions today, we have a resolution,

         7       a privileged resolution at the desk by Senator

         8       Klein.  May we have its title read and move

         9       for its immediate adoption.

        10                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

        11       Secretary will read.

        12                  THE SECRETARY:    By Senator Klein,

        13       legislative resolution memorializing Governor

        14       Andrew M. Cuomo to proclaim March 6 through

        15       12, 2011, as Problem Gambling Awareness Week

        16       in the State of New York.

        17                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

        18       question is on the resolution.  All those in

        19       favor signify by saying aye.

        20                  (Response of "Aye.")

        21                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

        22       Opposed, nay.

        23                  (No response.)

        24                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

        25       resolution is adopted.



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         1                  Senator Libous.

         2                  SENATOR LIBOUS:    Mr. President,

         3       there is another privileged resolution at the

         4       desk, by Senator Squadron.  May we please have

         5       its title read and move for its immediate

         6       adoption.

         7                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

         8       Secretary will read.

         9                  THE SECRETARY:    By Senator

        10       Squadron, legislative resolution memorializing

        11       Governor Andrew M. Cuomo to proclaim March 24,

        12       2011, as PKD Day in the State of New York.

        13                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

        14       question is on the resolution.  All those in

        15       favor signify by saying aye.

        16                  (Response of "Aye.")

        17                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

        18       Opposed, nay.

        19                  (No response.)

        20                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

        21       resolution is adopted.

        22                  Senator Libous.

        23                  SENATOR LIBOUS:    Thank you,

        24       Mr. President.

        25                  There is another resolution at the



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         1       desk, Mr. President, by Senator Parker.  May

         2       we please have its title read and ask for its

         3       immediate adoption.

         4                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

         5       Secretary will read.

         6                  THE SECRETARY:    By Senator

         7       Parker, legislative resolution mourning the

         8       death of Carolyn Donnett McCulloch,

         9       distinguished citizen and devoted member of

        10       her community.

        11                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

        12       question is on the resolution.  All those in

        13       favor please signify by saying aye.

        14                  (Response of "Aye.")

        15                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

        16       Opposed, nay.

        17                  (No response.)

        18                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

        19       resolution is adopted.

        20                  Senator Libous.

        21                  SENATOR LIBOUS:    Thank you,

        22       Mr. President.

        23                  We have another privileged

        24       resolution at the desk, by Senator Rivera.

        25       May we have its title read and move for its



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         1       immediate adoption.

         2                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

         3       Secretary will read.

         4                  THE SECRETARY:    By Senator

         5       Rivera, legislative resolution memorializing

         6       Governor Andrew M. Cuomo to proclaim Tuesday,

         7       March 15, 2011, as Single Mothers Day in the

         8       State of New York.

         9                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

        10       question is on the resolution.  All those in

        11       favor signify by saying aye.

        12                  (Response of "Aye.")

        13                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

        14       Opposed, nay.

        15                  (No response.)

        16                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

        17       resolution is adopted.

        18                  Senator Libous.

        19                  SENATOR LIBOUS:    Thank you,

        20       Mr. President.

        21                  I believe Senator Rivera would like

        22       to open up his resolution for cosponsorship.

        23       And at this time, if there's anyone who wishes

        24       not to cosponsor the resolution, please notify

        25       the desk.



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         1                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

         2       Senator Libous.

         3                  SENATOR LIBOUS:    Thank you,

         4       Mr. President.

         5                  There's a privileged resolution at

         6       the desk.  May we please have its title read

         7       and move for its immediate adoption.

         8                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

         9       Secretary will read.

        10                  THE SECRETARY:    By Senator

        11       Skelos, Senate resolution adopting proposed

        12       amendments to the 2011-2012 Executive Budget

        13       submission (Legislative Senate Bills 2800C,

        14       2803C, 2804B, 2807B, 2808B, 2809C, 2810B,

        15       2811B, 2812B, 3164, and 4007) as amended with

        16       the legislative intent appended hereto as the

        17       "Report on the Amended State Fiscal Year

        18       2011-2012 Executive Budget."

        19                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:    The

        20       question is on the resolution.  All those in

        21       favor signify by saying aye.

        22                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:

        23       Explanation, please, Mr. President.

        24                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

        25       Senator Krueger has requested an explanation,



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         1       Senator DeFrancisco.

         2                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Thank you.

         3                  This year we are in a process that

         4       I think is worth noting.  Back in 2007, a

         5       Budget Reform Act was passed where everyone

         6       was proud of themselves for having passed such

         7       a far-reaching reform of the budget process.

         8       And in 2008, we followed the procedure under

         9       that law and came up with an on-time budget.

        10       We haven't done that for the last couple of

        11       years.  And we're back to following the law

        12       this year, I'm happy to say.

        13                  That law has been followed all the

        14       way through the process up to today's date.

        15       All the deadlines have been met.  And today's

        16       the date for each house to pass a version of

        17       the budget that they believe is the budget

        18       that should pass overall in this state.  The

        19       Assembly is involved in the same exercise as

        20       we are today as well.

        21                  And ultimately, once the budgets

        22       are passed in each house, we're going to open

        23       conference committees so that it can be

        24       discussed, both can be discussed in the open

        25       where Assembly members and Senators can give



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         1       their opinions on both budgets and try to

         2       reconcile the differences so that we have a

         3       process that's correct and a good budget and

         4       the world knows what's in the budget well,

         5       well before the last three days.

         6                  As far as the substance of the

         7       budget, you should know that this budget, the

         8       All Funds -- whether it's federal or state

         9       funds -- budget is $3.5 billion, with a B,

        10       less than last year's budget.  Which is

        11       significant, because we're in a situation now

        12       where the budget has gotten out of control and

        13       we have to cut.  But it's $3.5 billion less

        14       than the budget was last year.

        15                  In addition, the budget that we're

        16       proposing here is a document that is a

        17       resolution adopting the report showing changes

        18       to a budget, a 1500-page Senate budget that is

        19       also on everyone's desk.  And that's been on

        20       everyone's desk for at least four days now,

        21       for four days.  So everyone should have had

        22       adequate time to go through that budget, as I

        23       did when it was first printed and first made

        24       public.

        25                  This 50-page resolution has some



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         1       modifications to this budget that are very

         2       clearly spelled out for everyone to read.  And

         3       this budget that the Senate is proposing is

         4       approximately $50 billion -- excuse me,

         5       $50 million -- I get my B's and my M's

         6       confused -- $50 million less than the

         7       Governor's budget.  So as a practical matter,

         8       we're very close with the Governor on his

         9       spending goals.

        10                  It does change several things, and

        11       I'll go through a couple of the highlights and

        12       then answer any questions that -- specific

        13       questions that anyone might have.

        14                  The first thing that it did is

        15       we've been saying for a long time that there

        16       should not be unfunded mandates to localities.

        17       And we found in the Governor's budget there

        18       was some spending that was lined out by the

        19       Governor's budget that was left to the

        20       counties and the localities to take care of

        21       which was previously a state obligation.  And

        22       we felt that passing on some of these problems

        23       to the local governments would just exacerbate

        24       their problems and was not the right thing to

        25       do.



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         1                  And the total amount of cost shifts

         2       that we have corrected here in this budget are

         3       $296 million that otherwise would have gone

         4       for additional expenses to the counties --

         5       that were state expenses -- back to the state

         6       where it truly belongs.

         7                  In addition, when the Governor's

         8       school aid runs came out, there was a

         9       substantial disparity or at least a disparity

        10       enough to deal with in a more fair manner for

        11       upstate rural school districts.  And so there

        12       is approximately $280 million of additional

        13       school aid in this budget than was in the

        14       Governor's budget.  And it's primarily to deal

        15       with high-needs rural districts.  Because when

        16       the runs came out, many of the upstate rural

        17       districts had cuts in the high teens or low

        18       20 percent, which was totally unsustainable by

        19       those districts.

        20                  It's not a lot of money, but at

        21       least it provides for some more fairness for

        22       those districts that got hit unintentionally

        23       by the Governor's budget to certain rural

        24       school districts.

        25                  There are also many changes along



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         1       the lines of Governor's recommendations or

         2       Governor's budget that provided for lump sums

         3       that previously were separate lined-out items

         4       for various programs, whether it's the rural

         5       preservation districts or whether it's

         6       agriculture or whatever it might be.  And

         7       those grants were sandwiched together and

         8       subject to competitive grants.

         9                  We felt that that was very

        10       difficult for local organizations to really

        11       plan from year to year whether they're even

        12       going to have an appropriation, not knowing

        13       whether they will win the competition.  And we

        14       felt that it would be better to line out those

        15       items.

        16                  There was a mention earlier about

        17       this is the hundredth anniversary of the Farm

        18       Bureau that was born in Broome County.  And

        19       many if not all of the agricultural funding

        20       for various programs that were taken out by

        21       the Governor's budget are restored in this

        22       budget.  Agriculture is our number-one

        23       business.

        24                  So there's restorations such as

        25       that.  How do we pay for it, you might ask.



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         1       Before you ask, I'll tell you.  There was two

         2       discretionary funds that the Governor had that

         3       were going to be competitive grants for

         4       education.  And we thought -- generally, we

         5       like competitive grants on this side the

         6       aisle.  We think competition is generally good

         7       and we think that the best programs should be

         8       funded.  But in a situation when you had to

         9       choose between some districts getting high

        10       teens and low 20 percent reductions in school

        11       aid, that this wasn't the year really to start

        12       this until we could get in a better economic

        13       climate.  So we decided to use $300 million of

        14       that to offset the educational restorations.

        15                  In addition, human services,

        16       $240 million in restorations, $232 million in

        17       reprogramming and other cuts.  The MRT, we

        18       restored $158 million, financed with

        19       $395 million of cuts and reestimation of

        20       revenues.  And then there are additional cuts

        21       made to the tune of $260 million, the

        22       specifics of which I can address if there's

        23       any questions about that.

        24                  So each of the restorations were

        25       supported by a balance by other cuts in other



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         1       areas.

         2                  And that generally is what this

         3       budget resolution provides for.  And I'd be

         4       happy to respond to any questions that there

         5       might be.

         6                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

         7       Senator Krueger, why do you rise?

         8                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you,

         9       Mr. President.  If the sponsor would please

        10       yield.

        11                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

        12       Senator DeFrancisco, will you yield to a

        13       question?

        14                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes, I

        15       would.

        16                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you.

        17       I appreciated very much the sponsor's

        18       explanation of the bills.

        19                  And yes, it's true those bills have

        20       been sitting on the desks for four days.

        21       They're pretty big.  The 50-page explanation I

        22       believe we got a few hours ago, or an earlier

        23       version.  So just for the record, some of us

        24       haven't had that much time to really look at

        25       the changes.



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         1                  But to start, if the sponsor would

         2       please tell me if the Senate Majority plan

         3       being put before us today is a balanced plan.

         4       Does the income and revenue and the

         5       expenditures match?

         6                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.  I

         7       think I just mentioned that when I answered my

         8       own question "how do we pay for it, you might

         9       ask."  And there are other cuts in other areas

        10       to offset the restoration.

        11                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Mr.

        12       President, if the sponsor would please

        13       continue to yield.

        14                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

        15       Senator DeFrancisco, will you continue to

        16       yield?

        17                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        18                  SENATOR KRUEGER:    Thank you.  You

        19       stated in your explanation that this plan is

        20       $3.5 billion less in General Fund money than

        21       last year's budget, I believe.  How does that

        22       compare with the Governor's proposed budget?

        23                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    All Funds

        24       budget.  And it's approximately $47 million to

        25       $50 million less than the Governor's budget,



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         1       which I explained earlier.

         2                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you.

         3       Mr. President, if the sponsor would continue

         4       to yield.

         5                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

         6       Senator DeFrancisco, will you continue to

         7       yield?

         8                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

         9                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you.

        10                  Would you reiterate for me, because

        11       you mentioned a number of different sections,

        12       how much in total you're restoring to the

        13       budget that the Governor's proposed budget

        14       actually had bracketed?

        15                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.  Let

        16       me go through the list.  There was

        17       $280 million in school aid.  We took over

        18       $296 million of previous cost shifts to local

        19       governments.  We restored $158 million in the

        20       health area.  And we made certain restorations

        21       to SUNY hospitals and community colleges to

        22       the tune of $131 million.  And there are other

        23       smaller ones that are out there.

        24                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you.

        25                  Mr. President, if through you the



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         1       sponsor would continue to yield.

         2                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

         3                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you.

         4                  And what were the changes in

         5       revenues proposed in your budget?  What

         6       revenues were reduced, if any?

         7                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    I'm not

         8       sure I understand that.  What revenues were

         9       reduced?  The revenue projections were made by

        10       the agreement of the Senate, the Assembly, and

        11       the Governor as far as what revenues were

        12       available for this budget.  That's what we

        13       were working off of.  And the spending was

        14       reduced by about $47 million.

        15                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    I don't --

        16       I'm sorry.  Through you, Mr. President, if the

        17       sponsor would continue to yield.

        18                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

        19       Senator DeFrancisco, will you continue to

        20       yield?

        21                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        22                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you.

        23                  I think perhaps the sponsor didn't

        24       understand my question.  I was trying to

        25       understand does this budget resolution have



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         1       any decreases in revenue for the state

         2       compared to the Governor's proposed budget.

         3                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    There was

         4       one that I can think of.  There may be others.

         5       But there was a proposal by the Governor to

         6       close a tax break that cooperative insurance

         7       companies have had since 1896 or thereabouts,

         8       about the time Senator Johnson came to the

         9       Senate.

        10                  (Laughter.)

        11                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Just

        12       kidding, Owen.

        13                  But in any event, in order to

        14       charge these cooperative insurance companies

        15       with an additional 2 percent that other

        16       insurance companies are required to pay.  That

        17       was rejected by the Senate, so it meant

        18       $20 million of less revenue than would have

        19       been in the Governor's proposal.  That's the

        20       only one I can think of.

        21                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    But to

        22       stay -- excuse me, Mr. President.  If through

        23       you the sponsor would continue to yield.

        24                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

        25       Senator DeFrancisco, will you continue to



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         1       yield?

         2                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

         3                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    So staying

         4       on the discussion of revenues reduced, I

         5       believe that I show that there's a

         6       $265 million reduction expected from the 18-a

         7       assessment change for fiscal year 2011-2012.

         8       Could you clarify that we're not reducing

         9       revenue from the 18-a assessment as it's seen

        10       on page 46 of 50?

        11                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes, I can

        12       answer that.  That assessment reduction comes

        13       in the next fiscal year.

        14                  And there was one other reduction

        15       that I forgot about that I was just reminded

        16       about, is that there's about $70 million that

        17       the school districts in the MTA region were

        18       previously paying for the commuter tax or

        19       whatever it's called, the MTA tax, that we are

        20       exempting in our budget both the public and

        21       parochial schools or the private schools from

        22       paying.  So that would be additional funding

        23       that isn't in our budget because we're

        24       exempting school districts from the MTA tax.

        25                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you.



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         1                  If through you, Mr. President, the

         2       sponsor would continue to yield.

         3                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

         4       Senator DeFrancisco, will you continue to

         5       yield?

         6                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes, I

         7       would.

         8                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you.

         9                  And have you made any revenue

        10       increases in this budget compared to the

        11       Governor's budget?

        12                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Well,

        13       there's one.  And by the way, before I

        14       respond, on page 46 of the 50-page booklet,

        15       with respect to 18-a assessments, the last

        16       line of that paragraph says "These provisions

        17       are not intended to have any impact in the

        18       2011-2012 state fiscal year."  So that was

        19       specified that it wasn't in this year's

        20       budget.

        21                  Secondly, there is a provision that

        22       some may like, some may not like -- because

        23       there was a vote on this bill last year for --

        24       I don't know if you called it mixed martial

        25       arts or you call it ultimate fighting or you



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         1       call it whatever you'd like to call it.  But

         2       we're assuming if that happens there will be

         3       some additional revenue in the budget as a

         4       result of normal taxes that have to be paid by

         5       any type of event, and including this new

         6       authorized event if the budget passes in this

         7       fashion.

         8                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Mr.

         9       President, if through you the sponsor would

        10       continue to yield.

        11                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        12                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you.

        13                  Are there any sweeps of accounts in

        14       this budget proposal as opposed to the

        15       Governor's proposal?

        16                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    I had to

        17       get some help on that one.  There is

        18       approximately -- well, less than a

        19       $100 million in miscellaneous accounts that

        20       had not been spent.

        21                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you.

        22                  Mr. President, if through you the

        23       sponsor would continue to yield.

        24                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

        25       Senator DeFrancisco?



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         1                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

         2                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you.

         3                  Is the state's debt load going to

         4       increase?  And what is the Republicans' plan,

         5       as submitted to us today, to reduce the costs

         6       of debt for the state?

         7                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Well, has

         8       the debt been increased?  We don't add any

         9       more debt.  And the debt will be decreased as

        10       we pay our debt off in the ordinary course of

        11       business, as the state pays its debt as it has

        12       to every year.  So there's no additional debt.

        13       But there will be reduction as we pay our

        14       normal expenses.

        15                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Mr.

        16       President, if through you the sponsor would

        17       continue to yield.

        18                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

        19       Senator DeFrancisco, will you continue to

        20       yield?

        21                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        22                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you.

        23                  The reason for my prior question is

        24       by doing an adding up of the new costs in the

        25       proposal before us today, minus the new



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         1       revenue, adding back the additional expenses

         2       minus not a lot of new revenue, and accepting

         3       that the 265 Article 18-a number was

         4       incorrect -- and that's the one of the changes

         5       that was made in the new version I got today,

         6       so thank you -- it seems that this budget

         7       resolution adds an additional billion dollars

         8       in costs to the proposal that the Governor had

         9       made but doesn't have a billion dollars in new

        10       revenue.

        11                  So I assume that means we're going

        12       to have to take on additional debt.  And we

        13       already have -- between 1997 and 2008, the

        14       state's debt grew from $31 billion to

        15       $54 billion, causing the debt load

        16       attributable to each man, woman and child, it

        17       grew from $1,774 to $2,676.

        18                  So I'm concerned that if this

        19       proposal we're being asked to vote on today

        20       adds an additional billion dollars in costs

        21       without a billion dollars in new revenue, that

        22       we in fact will take on a billion dollars in

        23       new debt.  So again, I'll ask the sponsor to

        24       clarify:  We don't have a billion dollars in

        25       new debt from this proposal?



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         1                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    That is

         2       correct.  But it's good to see this year that

         3       you don't want to borrow money.  Because over

         4       the last two years there was a big push to

         5       borrow money so we could pay for more things

         6       that the majority wanted to pay for.  So it's

         7       good to see that you're very interested in the

         8       amount of debt that the state has.

         9                  However, you're factually

        10       incorrect.  I indicated what was added, the

        11       restorations.  I indicated at the outset what

        12       the cuts were in other programs that were in

        13       the Governor's budget.  So it is balanced.

        14                  And unlike the last two years, we

        15       do have a financial plan.  And we will be more

        16       than happy to give you the specifics in a

        17       financial plan so that you can work through

        18       the numbers as we have had the opportunity to

        19       do.  It does balance, and there's no new debt.

        20                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Mr.

        21       President, if through you the sponsor would

        22       continue to yield.

        23                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

        24       Senator DeFrancisco, will you continue to

        25       yield?



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         1                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

         2                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Yes, I

         3       would like to accept your offer of seeing a

         4       financial plan, which unfortunately we as of

         5       now have not seen.

         6                  And again, our numbers attempting

         7       to add and subtract up, without seeing a

         8       financial plan, leads us to believe that

         9       actually there is a billion dollars more in

        10       expenses than revenue from this new proposal.

        11       So thank you for the offer.  I guess we we'll

        12       get it after the vote is taken today.

        13                  Is there any -- Mr. President, if I

        14       can continue with my question, is there any

        15       property tax relief proposal in this

        16       resolution of any sort?

        17                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Well, only

        18       indirectly, insofar as we did in fact prevent

        19       200 and I think it was $90 million in cost

        20       shifts to local governments.  That's in there.

        21       And in addition, it's pointed out the current

        22       STAR program is still being funded, which is

        23       also relief to the local taxpayers.

        24                  But unfortunately, we're in a

        25       situation now, having overspent, spent



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         1       $14 billion more in the last two years and

         2       taxed $14 billion more in the last two years,

         3       that we're in trouble right now and we can't

         4       give the tax relief we would like.  And

         5       hopefully some of the unfunded mandates that

         6       might come out of this budget that would be

         7       taken care of can give further relief to the

         8       counties.

         9                  And one other thing.  You had

        10       mentioned earlier that there was a billion

        11       dollars of extra spending.  The only real

        12       restorations are $350 million in school aid,

        13       $150 million in health, $150 million in higher

        14       ed, which comes to $650 million.  So even the

        15       adds don't add up to a billion dollars even if

        16       you don't take into account the other cuts in

        17       other areas of the budget.

        18                  So I think the numbers are wrong,

        19       and hopefully the financial plan will help you

        20       see that.

        21                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Mr.

        22       President, if the sponsor would continue to

        23       yield.

        24                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        25                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you.



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         1                  Well, to date -- the financial plan

         2       I was just handed across the aisle looks like

         3       this and has basically three lines explaining

         4       the numbers in the budget.  So I actually

         5       don't think this is a legitimate financial

         6       plan.

         7                  We have attempted to add up as much

         8       as we could through the budget that we were

         9       given by our colleagues on the other side of

        10       the aisle, and we see $429 million for

        11       education, $141 million for higher education,

        12       $10 million with pluses and minuses for local

        13       government.  Reductions -- excuse me.

        14       $32 million for Ag and Markets, $70 million

        15       for OCFS, $30 million for OTDA, $44 million

        16       for health.

        17                  We have at least four pages of

        18       attempted breakdown of numbers that, again, we

        19       believe do actually add up to a billion

        20       dollars when you take the reductions and the

        21       increases, the revenue decreases and the

        22       revenue -- the revenue decreases.

        23                  Just for the record, can we --

        24       excuse me, Mr. President.  If through you I

        25       may ask the sponsor an additional question.



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         1                  ACTING PRESIDENT FLANAGAN:

         2       Senator DeFrancisco?

         3                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

         4                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you.

         5                  You talked about changing the

         6       education formula.  You specifically talked

         7       about wanting to make some changes to the

         8       Governor's proposal by shifting some funding

         9       to, as I believe you described it, high-needs

        10       upstate areas.

        11                  Now, several years ago -- actually,

        12       when my Republican colleagues also were in the

        13       majority, we changed the education formula of

        14       base aid to education to reflect challenges in

        15       the courts of the fact that we were

        16       disproportionately underfunding some

        17       high-needs school districts throughout the

        18       State of New York.  And those included urban

        19       poor areas as well as rural poor areas.

        20                  Today's proposal shifts money to a

        21       specific subset and actually violates the

        22       concept of the fair-education-base formulas.

        23       So somebody is gaining.  Who's losing in this

        24       proposal?

        25                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Senator,



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         1       first of all, we're not shifting anything.

         2       It's the Governor's proposal.  We're adding an

         3       additional $280 million to education.  And

         4       we're adding it by looking at those districts

         5       that got disproportionate cuts.

         6                  This is a big state.  So anything

         7       the Governor provided for for any district in

         8       this state is going to get what the Governor

         9       provided.  We refocused the competitive grant

        10       portion of the budget to hit those districts

        11       so the districts that were getting the

        12       disproportionate cuts percentagewise were

        13       provided a little more money.  Which, believe

        14       me, is not going to excite them very much when

        15       you're splitting $280 million throughout the

        16       whole state but 60 percent is up in upstate

        17       and other areas also receive it -- I guess

        18       Long Island gets about 13 percent, and

        19       New York City gets the rest.

        20                  But it tries to equalize the

        21       percentage losses as -- not equalize, but make

        22       it at least a little bit fairer.  So it's not

        23       a shifting.  Everyone gets what the Governor

        24       proposed, but we're redirecting other funds to

        25       those hit the hardest by his proposal.



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         1                  Secondly, you're denigrating this

         2       sheet of paper.  All this sheet of paper is,

         3       the financial plan, is adding the numbers that

         4       in this book, a detailed summary of our

         5       budget.  And it shows you what the numbers

         6       are.  And you can certainly do the same thing.

         7       And if your numbers are different, we'd be

         8       happy to talk to you about the differences and

         9       show you that these numbers are correct.

        10                  And this is a stark contrast with

        11       our first budget debate and our second and our

        12       third and our 25th budget debate last year,

        13       where I was told that the budget was not ready

        14       yet, it was being percolated and we were

        15       meeting and we were -- nothing was provided,

        16       not even a financial plan when the final

        17       budget was being voted on.

        18                  So we have been open, we have been

        19       transparent, and these numbers are correct.

        20       And there's nothing to denigrate.  You should

        21       be thanking us so that you on that side of the

        22       aisle now have information that I did not have

        23       when I was asking the questions that you're

        24       asking now.

        25                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank



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         1       you -- oh, Mr. President, you've changed.

         2                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         3       Krueger.

         4                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    You took me

         5       by surprise.

         6                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    All for

         7       the good.

         8                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Mr.

         9       President, if the sponsor would continue to

        10       yield.

        11                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        12       DeFrancisco, do you continue to yield?

        13                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.  Yes.

        14                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        15       Krueger.

        16                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you.

        17       And I certainly appreciate the sponsor's

        18       responses and his willingness to have an open

        19       debate before the public.  And yes indeed, we

        20       can all do better.  This is my second day as

        21       the ranker in Finance.  And I am hoping that I

        22       will do better.  And I look forward to

        23       continuing my work with Senator DeFrancisco

        24       and the Finance Committee through this budget

        25       process and beyond.



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         1                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         2       Krueger, do you have a question?

         3                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    I do.

         4       Thank you so much, Mr. President.

         5                  Senator DeFrancisco just referenced

         6       that there was $300 million for competitive

         7       grants for the school districts in this budget

         8       plan.  Is there actually cash behind that

         9       $300 million, or is that a dry appropriation?

        10                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.  We

        11       were informed that there was at least 300 --

        12       and that's what we used -- by the

        13       administration.

        14                  And also at the budget hearings,

        15       when we discussed the education budget, we

        16       were fortunate enough to have the Lieutenant

        17       Governor appear before our committee, the

        18       joint committee of the Senate Finance and the

        19       Assembly Ways and Means, and that very

        20       question was asked the Lieutenant Governor.

        21       And he said yes, there is money behind that

        22       budget.  And in private discussions, that has

        23       been reconfirmed.

        24                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you.

        25                  If through you, Mr. President, the



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         1       sponsor could continue to yield.

         2                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

         3                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         4       DeFrancisco continues to yield.

         5                  Senator Krueger.

         6                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you.

         7                  I'm not sure I agree that there's

         8       cash behind that $300 million.  But again, I

         9       just want to understand his answer on the

        10       education funding formula changes.

        11                  Again, somebody is gaining money in

        12       the budget proposal offered by the Republican

        13       Majority today, and so I'm assuming somebody

        14       is also losing.  So could he clarify?  Because

        15       I think he tried to explain but I did not

        16       understand what -- if high-need upstate rural

        17       areas are gaining in changing the formula, who

        18       is actually losing?  Or is anywhere else

        19       besides the upstate rural areas gaining?

        20                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    First of

        21       all, no one is losing.  Everything that the

        22       Governor put in the budget, his budget, to go

        23       to each district throughout the state is not

        24       being reduced.

        25                  However, the additional



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         1       $280 million was directed towards those

         2       districts that had the highest percentage

         3       decrease in funding under the Governor's

         4       funding just to, with this small amount of

         5       money in terms of education funding, to try to

         6       in some way reduce the harm to those

         7       districts.  In fact, under the additional

         8       $280 million, though most of the money is

         9       going upstate to these rural districts, every

        10       region, including New York City, is getting

        11       additional funds out of this $280 million.

        12                  So there happens to be a State of

        13       New York that has different regions.  And

        14       there are Senators in each one of those

        15       regions that represent those regions.  And

        16       when one region is not being -- is getting a

        17       greater percentage of the cut, I think it's

        18       the obligation of all Senators to make sure

        19       that that doesn't happen so some areas are not

        20       treated unfairly.

        21                  And that was the purpose of finding

        22       the additional money and giving additional

        23       money to all districts; however, the most of

        24       which went to those districts that are hurt

        25       the most under the Governor's budget with the



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         1       greatest decrease.

         2                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Mr.

         3       President, if the sponsor could please yield.

         4                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

         5                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         6       DeFrancisco continues to yield.

         7                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you.

         8                  Just, again, this is where I wish

         9       we had actual runs for each school district of

        10       the change proposal.  Are there runs that have

        11       been done on your proposal for education aid

        12       as opposed to what we have already been able

        13       to see in the Governor's proposal?

        14                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    There have

        15       been no runs.  And I have not seen any.  And I

        16       don't believe any member of the Senate has

        17       seen any.  But there was a change in the

        18       formula, and I'd like to, if I could, yield to

        19       Senator Flanagan to explain the details of

        20       that portion, since this is his area and he

        21       was intimately involved in making sure that

        22       this attempt at more fairness in the

        23       distribution of State Ed money actually became

        24       a reality.

        25                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator



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         1       Krueger, the chair will recognize Senator

         2       Flanagan without objection.

         3                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Certainly.

         4                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         5       Flanagan.

         6                  SENATOR FLANAGAN:    Thank you,

         7       Mr. President.

         8                  Senator Krueger, you had raised a

         9       couple of different questions, and I'll try

        10       and address them in broad strokes and then in

        11       more detail.

        12                  Basically we took what the Governor

        13       did and frankly made it better in a lot of

        14       different ways.  And some of these things are

        15       not going to be as apparent in areas -- and

        16       I'm going to give you a perfect example.  In

        17       the restorations that we made, Senator

        18       DeFrancisco spoke to cost shifts.  One of them

        19       is the 4201 schools.  That was a $98 million

        20       cost shift right back to the local property

        21       taxpayer.

        22                  Now, it's not going to be apparent

        23       here, but New York City is the greatest

        24       beneficiary of that.  Seventy million of the

        25       $98 million of that fund goes right to the



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         1       City of New York.  Now, is that going on the

         2       school run with the $280 million?  No.  But it

         3       is an indication that we tried to provide

         4       whatever balance we could, and that's money --

         5       and I don't know the exact numbers on the

         6       summer-school piece and the cost shift from

         7       the Office of Children and Family Services.

         8       But I would daresay, given how these programs

         9       are funded and the role that the City of

        10       New York plays, that they are the largest

        11       beneficiary of us rejecting those cost shifts

        12       by the Governor.

        13                  Having said that, what we did was

        14       look at regional balance.  And frankly, the

        15       Governor's proposal did not create regional

        16       balance.  When you look -- and he puts

        17       together a plan and looks at urban centers,

        18       not just the City of New York, but Buffalo,

        19       Syracuse, Rochester, Yonkers and he basically

        20       says you're going to get cut, but at some

        21       point we're going to cap that cut.

        22                  Well, frankly, he didn't do that

        23       for the rural districts in upstate New York.

        24       So we have districts where they were losing as

        25       much as 23 percent in their state aid.  And



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         1       some of these poorer districts are the ones

         2       that are already heavily reliant on state aid.

         3                  So did we drive more money into

         4       upstate New York in our restorations?  Yes.

         5       Does everybody get more money?  Yes.  And I

         6       will tell you this.  This budget drives more

         7       money on a percentage basis to high-needs

         8       districts than the budget you passed last

         9       year.  It's almost 69 percent of the money in

        10       this budget goes to high-needs districts.

        11                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        12       Krueger.

        13                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you,

        14       Mr. President.  If Senator Flanagan would

        15       please yield.

        16                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        17       Flanagan, do you yield?

        18                  SENATOR FLANAGAN:    Yes.

        19                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        20       Flanagan yields.

        21                  Senator Krueger.

        22                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you

        23       very much.  And thank you for bringing up the

        24       examples.  And of course the special-ed funds

        25       are a different line item in the budget and so



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         1       you're right, that wouldn't be reflected in

         2       runs.  But lots of things would be reflected

         3       in runs.

         4                  So as I understand it, the

         5       Republican proposal before us puts back

         6       9 percent of the education dollars lost from

         7       the Governor's gap elimination program.  And

         8       again, we don't have the runs so we don't know

         9       exactly where that 9 percent goes.  But I

        10       heard Senator DeFrancisco before say that the

        11       monies that were moved were moved to districts

        12       with the highest percent dollar decrease in

        13       funds under the Governor's plan.  Is that your

        14       understanding?

        15                  SENATOR FLANAGAN:    I don't think

        16       I heard Senator DeFrancisco say that at all.

        17                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        18       Krueger.

        19                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you.

        20       Mr. President, if Senator DeFrancisco would

        21       please yield.

        22                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        23       DeFrancisco, do you yield?

        24                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        25                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator



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         1       DeFrancisco yields.

         2                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you.

         3                  Do you recall saying -- because I

         4       was taking a note when you were speaking --

         5       that the shift in the formula being offered

         6       here today by the Republicans, compared to the

         7       Governor's plan, shifts more of the 9 percent

         8       education restoration through the gap

         9       elimination plan to those districts that had

        10       the highest percent reduction in the

        11       Governor's plan?

        12                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    First of

        13       all, I said at least three times that this is

        14       not a shift of the money that the Governor

        15       proposed in his budget.  This is an addition

        16       to what the Governor proposed, and everyone

        17       gets additional money under this particular

        18       proposal.

        19                  And what I said is that the areas

        20       that had the greatest percentage of loss which

        21       we believe -- which we show from the

        22       Governor's runs are the rural districts

        23       upstate -- got 68 percent, actually,

        24       68 percent of the additional $280 million.

        25                  But I had forgotten, as Senator



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         1       Flanagan mentioned, that there are other areas

         2       where the City of New York fared substantially

         3       better than upstate, in that the cost shifts

         4       of the $90 million primarily benefited

         5       New York City by taking that over.

         6                  So the rural upstate districts got

         7       hit the hardest, that's why they got the most.

         8       That's what I said, and I hope I didn't

         9       misspeak.

        10                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you.

        11                  Mr. President, the reason I keep

        12       asking for clarification of that question,

        13       just for the record, is that without runs none

        14       of us know how this dollar plan plays out for

        15       each school district compared to the

        16       Governor's plan.  And if in fact its highest

        17       percent cut in the Governor's plan getting

        18       these new monies, that would technically be

        19       the wealthiest districts, not the poorest

        20       districts.

        21                  But also in the Governor's plan

        22       there was a cap put on how much could actually

        23       be reduced from the high-needs low-income

        24       districts.  So my reason for continuing to ask

        25       and try to clarify the question is that



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         1       whether I agree or don't agree with the

         2       Republican proposal for returning an

         3       additional 9 percent in school aid compared to

         4       the Governor's cuts -- because I think I do

         5       want to see restorations to school aid.  I

         6       feel quite comfortable saying that for myself

         7       on the record.

         8                  I am very concerned about the

         9       details of where that money would actually go

        10       and what violation of court orders and other

        11       historical precedents we would be making with

        12       these changes.

        13                  But I've taken up quite a bit of

        14       time, and I know that many of my other

        15       colleagues have additional questions.  So I'd

        16       like to thank the chair for his cooperation

        17       and sit down.

        18                  Thank you, Mr. President.

        19                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Thank

        20       you, Senator Krueger.

        21                  Senator Rivera.

        22                  SENATOR RIVERA:    Thank you,

        23       Mr. President.

        24                  I want to know if the sponsor would

        25       yield for a question.



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         1                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

         2                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         3       DeFrancisco yields.

         4                  SENATOR RIVERA:    Thank you,

         5       Mr. President.  Through you.

         6                  I wanted to ask you a few questions

         7       about the revenue in this budget proposal, in

         8       this resolution.

         9                  In particular, does it include the

        10       personal income tax surcharge for wealthier

        11       New Yorkers?

        12                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    The

        13       surcharge -- it includes the surcharge because

        14       it's in effect until the end of this year.  It

        15       doesn't include a surcharge beyond the end of

        16       this year because the surcharge expires at the

        17       end of the year.

        18                  SENATOR RIVERA:    Through you,

        19       Mr. President, if the sponsor would continue

        20       to yield.

        21                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        22       DeFrancisco, do you yield?

        23                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        24                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        25       Rivera.



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         1                  SENATOR RIVERA:    Thank you,

         2       Mr. President.

         3                  Thank you for correcting me.  So to

         4       be clear, this budget proposal does not

         5       include an extension of the personal income

         6       tax surcharge for wealthier New Yorkers?

         7                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    That is

         8       correct.

         9                  SENATOR RIVERA:    Thank you.

        10                  Through you, Mr. President, if the

        11       sponsor would continue to yield.

        12                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        13                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        14       DeFrancisco yields.

        15                  SENATOR RIVERA:    Thank you,

        16       Mr. President.

        17                  So if the personal income tax

        18       surcharge was extended, how much would it

        19       generate in the half of the fiscal year that

        20       it would not extend and how much would it

        21       generate further in the next fiscal year?

        22                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    I don't

        23       know because it's irrelevant to our

        24       deliberations, to at least the majority's

        25       deliberations, insofar as we pledged no new



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         1       taxes and we don't have the tax in here.  So

         2       whether it's a billion dollars, $6 billion or

         3       whatever, the fact of the matter is we're

         4       cutting to balance the budget, because I think

         5       that's the Governor's intent, and we want to

         6       stay close to the Governor on that, since he

         7       also is against counting on new revenues based

         8       on the millionaire's tax.

         9                  SENATOR RIVERA:    Through you,

        10       Mr. President, if the response would continue

        11       to yield.

        12                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        13       DeFrancisco, do you yield?

        14                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        15                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        16       Rivera.

        17                  SENATOR RIVERA:    Thank you,

        18       Mr. President.

        19                  So the fact that it will sunset --

        20       as opposed to an extension, you're saying it

        21       will be a new tax.  But is it correct to say

        22       that wealthier New Yorkers at this point, and

        23       until the 31st of December of this year, will

        24       continue to pay at a tax rate that is set for

        25       this personal income tax surcharge; is that



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         1       correct?

         2                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    That is

         3       correct.  That's the millionaire's tax that

         4       applies to people including husbands and wives

         5       that make over $200,000.  So $200,000 is a

         6       millionaire's tax.  It obviously was

         7       ill-conceived from the outset, because the

         8       idea of what a millionaire is is a little bit

         9       reduced, to put it mildly.

        10                  SENATOR RIVERA:    If through you,

        11       Mr. President, the sponsor would continue to

        12       yield.

        13                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        14       DeFrancisco, do you continue to yield?

        15                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        16                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    He

        17       does, Senator Rivera.

        18                  SENATOR RIVERA:    Well, we

        19       certainly are in agreement that it is

        20       currently spoken of as a millionaire's tax and

        21       it is not.  That is why I continue to refer to

        22       it as a personal income-tax surcharge for

        23       higher-income New Yorkers.  I feel that you

        24       would agree, at least, that that's correct.

        25                  I actually would like to ask a



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         1       question that refers to one of the districts

         2       in the Republican conference, and it's the

         3       district that is represented by Senator

         4       Grisanti.  And I figure probably it would be

         5       best to ask him, but I could ask you and maybe

         6       you would refer to him if necessary.

         7                  Do you know the amount of

         8       New Yorkers, of individuals that actually make

         9       more than $200,000, at least as it refers to

        10       tax returns from the previous year in the 60th

        11       Senatorial District?

        12                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    You know, I

        13       don't know that.  I don't know the answer to

        14       that question.

        15                  SENATOR RIVERA:    Okay.  Through

        16       you, Mr. President, if the sponsor would

        17       continue to yield.

        18                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        19                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        20       DeFrancisco continues to yield.

        21                  SENATOR RIVERA:    Thank you,

        22       Mr. President.

        23                  According to some numbers that I

        24       have, that of 91,000 people that filed a tax

        25       return, only 578 individuals in a district



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         1       that has roughly 300,000 individuals, actually

         2       make more than $200,000 a year.  And the

         3       question has to do with actually the type of

         4       services that would be impacted by the lack of

         5       revenue.

         6                  So currently the budget that you

         7       propose does have cuts -- even though it has

         8       restorations in different places, it does have

         9       cuts across in different sectors, whether it's

        10       education, whether it's healthcare, whether

        11       it's public safety; is that correct?

        12                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes, there

        13       are cuts.

        14                  SENATOR RIVERA:    Through you,

        15       Mr. President, if the sponsor would continue

        16       to yield.

        17                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        18                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        19       DeFrancisco yields.

        20                  Senator Rivera.

        21                  SENATOR RIVERA:    And these cuts

        22       would most impact the government services --

        23       people that receive government services; is

        24       that not correct?

        25                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    That's



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         1       correct.  But, you know, there's a bigger

         2       impact.  As we have been spending out of

         3       control, we have been losing residents, we

         4       have been losing companies, we have been

         5       losing employees, and we have been losing our

         6       tax base.

         7                  So the fact is that the way we've

         8       been doing in the past hasn't really worked.

         9       The bigger the tax base, the more money there

        10       is to pay for services.

        11                  You mentioned the number of people

        12       that are over -- paying the millionaire's tax

        13       and as a small amount of people, but many of

        14       those people run the small businesses, run the

        15       businesses that decide that enough is enough.

        16       We had one person in our community, or

        17       actually in upstate New York, Golisano, who

        18       was a gubernatorial candidate at one time.  He

        19       made a lot of money.  And you know what he did

        20       when the millionaire's tax went in?  He moved

        21       to Florida.  So whatever income tax we were

        22       receiving from him is gone.  Whatever income

        23       tax we receive from the people in Buffalo will

        24       be gone if they move across the border to some

        25       other state that's a lot cheaper.



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         1                  And the other part of it is

         2       Golisano donated $5 million to a children's

         3       hospital in Syracuse, the Golisano Children's

         4       Hospital.  Well, now he's donating money in

         5       Florida.

         6                  So there's a far-ranging impact.

         7       If you want more tax money for more services,

         8       you need to create jobs, and to create jobs

         9       you have to be competitive.

        10                  And the last point in that regard

        11       is last year when Governor Paterson -- perfect

        12       example -- Governor Paterson wanted to put a

        13       tax on the bonuses of Wall Street people

        14       because they're bad people, they caused the

        15       problem -- I understand the logic behind that.

        16       The fact of the matter, the Connecticut

        17       governor the next day was pushing to try to

        18       get these brokerage companies to come over to

        19       Connecticut.

        20                  So there is an impact.  And we've

        21       got to stop and try something different.  The

        22       Governor is absolutely right.  We agree.

        23       Actually, we agreed with him before he agreed

        24       with us.  We don't think it's a good idea.

        25                  SENATOR RIVERA:    Through you,



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         1       Mr. President, if the sponsor would continue

         2       to yield.

         3                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

         4                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         5       DeFrancisco yields.

         6                  Senator Rivera.

         7                  SENATOR RIVERA:    Thank you,

         8       Mr. President.

         9                  During the period of time from 2003

        10       to 2005 when there was actually another -- in

        11       another fiscally difficult situation, there

        12       was a similar surcharge that was imposed.  Are

        13       you aware of the increase that occurred during

        14       that period of time in high-income tax returns

        15       during that period of time?

        16                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    What years

        17       are those?

        18                  SENATOR RIVERA:    From 2003 to

        19       2005.

        20                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    I don't

        21       know the exact amount.  But I can also tell

        22       that you during that period of time it was

        23       right after the last recession, and the

        24       economy started kicking in and people starting

        25       making more money.  And that's why people paid



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         1       more taxes.  So I'm sure that's the reason

         2       why.

         3                  And one other point.  As far as

         4       this progressive tax that people are so

         5       concerned about, 5 percent of the people in

         6       State of New York, 5 percent pay 50 percent of

         7       the taxes.  That's pretty progressive.  And if

         8       they have to pay 60 percent or 70 percent,

         9       maybe they won't want to do that anymore.

        10                  SENATOR RIVERA:    Through you,

        11       Mr. President, if the sponsor would continue

        12       to yield.

        13                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        14       DeFrancisco, do you yield?

        15                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        16                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    He

        17       does.

        18                  Senator Rivera.

        19                  SENATOR RIVERA:    The percentage

        20       was 30 percent.  From 2003 to 2005, there was

        21       a 30 percent increase in high-income tax

        22       returns.

        23                  How about in the last year, 2009,

        24       are you aware of what the percentage was of

        25       growth of higher-income households in that



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         1       period of time?

         2                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    I do not

         3       know.  But I know that that tax was stopped,

         4       just like we're trying to stop it now, it was

         5       stopped after 9/11.  So that had a short

         6       history.  This one should hopefully have a

         7       shorter history.  That's why we don't want to

         8       renew it.

         9                  SENATOR RIVERA:    Through you,

        10       Mr. President, if the sponsor would continue

        11       to yield.

        12                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        13                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        14       DeFrancisco yields.

        15                  Senator Rivera.

        16                  SENATOR RIVERA:    The percentage,

        17       Senator DeFrancisco, was 10 percent.  In 2009

        18       when the tax was in existence, there was

        19       actually a 10 percent growth of high-income

        20       households during that period of time.

        21                  And I also -- are you aware of a

        22       Wall Street Journal Wealth Report that came

        23       out in the year 2009 that refers to

        24       high-income households nationally and what

        25       they -- what the people in those households



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         1       base their decisions on about where they live?

         2                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    I'm not so

         3       sure.  But I know we've lost about five major

         4       employers in the Syracuse area over the last

         5       10 years.  And I also know we lost two

         6       Congressional seats over the last 10 years.

         7                  If people are so happy with the

         8       economy in the State of New York and the

         9       manner in which the State of New York taxes

        10       their citizens, it's kind of surprising that

        11       they would be leaving in droves.  We want them

        12       to come back.

        13                  SENATOR RIVERA:    Through you,

        14       Mr. President, if the sponsor would continue

        15       to yield.

        16                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        17                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        18       DeFrancisco yields.

        19                  Senator Rivera.

        20                  SENATOR RIVERA:    Thank you,

        21       Mr. President.

        22                  The Wall Street Journal Wealth

        23       Report in 2009 that did a study of what

        24       wealthy families make their decisions on as

        25       far as where they live actually made a point



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         1       to say that it was not based on tax rates but

         2       upon quality of life, access to good

         3       education, infrastructure and culture, among

         4       other issues.

         5                  So I would actually question -- I

         6       do not question that there are certainly

         7       New Yorkers that have left the state, and we

         8       certainly want them to come back all over the

         9       state.  I would question whether this would be

        10       the best strategy to go about doing that,

        11       particularly when we have -- if we're talking

        12       about shared responsibility and shared

        13       sacrifice, when we're saying that the cuts to

        14       education and to healthcare and to public

        15       safety that you have referred to that still

        16       exist -- because these need to happen in tough

        17       fiscal times -- that it should be a little

        18       easier on what amounts to over 90 percent of

        19       the people.

        20                  And you are correct, 5 percent of

        21       the people pay 50 percent of the taxes.  That

        22       is because they have all the wealth.  So

        23       that's probably why they pay all of the taxes.

        24                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        25       Rivera, are you on the bill now, on the



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         1       resolution, or are you asking a question?

         2                  SENATOR RIVERA:    Oh, I'm asking a

         3       question.  Apologies, Mr. President.

         4                  So a question about Senate District

         5       22, which is represented by Senator Golden,

         6       about the amount of -- the percentage of

         7       people in that district that make more than

         8       $200,000 a year, are you aware of the number?

         9                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    No.  You

        10       can ask me each city in the state, I will not

        11       know the answer to any of them.

        12                  SENATOR RIVERA:    Through you,

        13       Mr. President, if the sponsor would continue

        14       to yield.

        15                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        16                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        17       DeFrancisco yields.

        18                  Senator Rivera.

        19                  SENATOR RIVERA:    Thank you.

        20       Thank you, Mr. President.

        21                  The percentage is 1.3 percent, less

        22       than 1400 individuals in a district that has

        23       over 310,000 individuals, if I'm not mistaken.

        24                  The question really refers to what

        25       the impact -- the impact of the cuts that



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         1       we're talking about, where they're going to be

         2       focused and who is going to eventually be more

         3       impacted by this.  Is it going to be wealthier

         4       individuals or is it going to be the

         5       communities that actually receive these

         6       services, whether it be healthcare or

         7       education or public safety?  That is the

         8       overall question.

         9                  The reason I referred to the

        10       percentages, Senator DeFrancisco, is that it

        11       seems that we should be trying to have the

        12       biggest impact or do something for the greater

        13       good, and that would mean for the majority of

        14       individuals.  And maybe -- so we should maybe

        15       be talking about how to continue a tax that

        16       exists today that there is no hard evidence

        17       that I have seen that these folks are leaving.

        18                  So my question, Mr. President,

        19       would be don't you think that we should be

        20       perhaps focusing our efforts on maintaining

        21       the service levels the best that we can in

        22       very tough times while maintaining a tax rate

        23       for individuals that are wealthier to begin

        24       with that are not -- there is no hard evidence

        25       that I've seen that those are the folks that



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         1       are leaving -- to continue it, to extend it

         2       for a short period of time.

         3                  And even if it's a millionaire's

         4       tax, true millionaire's tax, as Senator

         5       Bonacic suggested, which would give us

         6       $780 million in the next half fiscal year and

         7       maybe almost $3 billion in the next year,

         8       wouldn't that make it easier to -- wouldn't it

         9       make it easier on the communities that we

        10       represent all across the state, whether it's

        11       in the city or in Long Island or in Western

        12       New York or in upstate New York?  Would it not

        13       make it easier?

        14                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    No.  The

        15       millionaire's tax as it exists right now hits

        16       incomes, including husband and wife incomes of

        17       $200,000 or more.  Virtually every small

        18       business is either paying individual taxes or

        19       they're paying through a sub-Chapter S

        20       corporation, which is individual tax rates.

        21       And those small businesses are the ones that

        22       are creating jobs lately in the State of

        23       New York.  The more we can do -- there was a

        24       question asked about property tax relief.

        25       Income tax relief to the small business is



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         1       also important to create jobs.

         2                  So for the -- and this has been --

         3       if this millionaire's tax was so wonderful, it

         4       wouldn't have expired after 9/11.  We would

         5       have continued it on forever.  It was supposed

         6       to be a temporary fix.  And it's obviously our

         7       position and the position of the Governor that

         8       it's not a good idea economically.  We

         9       respectfully disagree with you, and the

        10       Governor respectfully disagrees with you, and

        11       I presume he would have the same answers to

        12       your questions that I would have here on the

        13       Senate floor.

        14                  SENATOR RIVERA:    Thank you,

        15       Senator DeFrancisco.

        16                  Mr. President, on the resolution.

        17                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        18       Rivera on the resolution.

        19                  SENATOR RIVERA:    Thank you,

        20       Mr. President.  And I thank Senator

        21       DeFrancisco for answering some of these

        22       questions.

        23                  And the point that we were trying

        24       to make, that I'm trying to make here -- and I

        25       certainly know that many of my colleagues on



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         1       my side of the aisle who joined me in writing

         2       a letter to the Governor asking for extension

         3       of this, and certainly have been in

         4       communication with some of our colleagues in

         5       the Assembly about extension of this -- is

         6       pretty simple.  We are speaking about how

         7       these very tough economic and fiscal times

         8       that we find ourselves in are forcing us to

         9       make extremely tough decisions that will

        10       impact our children, that will impact our

        11       families, that will impact our seniors, that

        12       would impact schools, hospitals all across

        13       this great state, all across this great state.

        14       And all that we are saying is that if we had a

        15       bit more of revenue, we would be able to deal

        16       with it in an easier way.

        17                  Now, I have -- the reason I cited

        18       some of these studies and some of these

        19       numbers is that I believe that in this chamber

        20       we should be looking, yes, to create the best

        21       situation for the entire state to become

        22       better and to grow.  But our concern needs to

        23       be with the greater good.

        24                  And the greater good in this case,

        25       if I am asking seniors back at home to



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         1       sacrifice further, if I am asking families

         2       with children back home to sacrifice further,

         3       if I am asking hospitals in my district to

         4       sacrifice further, it would be easier for

         5       those sacrifices if they were truly shared.

         6       And this budget, the budget resolution that my

         7       colleagues across the aisle present, does not

         8       do that.

         9                  And when you have a district that

        10       has more than 300,000 individuals that live in

        11       it, with almost 100,000 people that have filed

        12       taxes, and of those taxes that are filed less

        13       than 1400 individuals are impacted by this,

        14       when I do not see any type of hard evidence --

        15       now, it is a talking point that is repeated

        16       often.  But I have not seen any hard evidence

        17       that tells me that people are flying away.

        18                  Yes, Golisano left.  And, personal

        19       opinion, I think we're the better for it.  And

        20       there may be some other folks, some other

        21       millionaires that have also done that.  But

        22       the bulk of these individuals that are paying

        23       this tax right now -- this is not a new tax,

        24       ladies and gentlemen.  This is something that

        25       exists right now.  It would be an extension



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         1       that would give us more revenue to be able to

         2       better deal with the difficulties that we have

         3       going down the road.  That is all that I am

         4       asking today.

         5                  So again, I would ask my colleagues

         6       across the aisle to consider this as they go

         7       forward with this resolution.  Because what it

         8       is doing, it is putting the onus and it is

         9       putting the bulk of the pain on the folks that

        10       you represent -- on the bulk of them, on

        11       98 percent of the people that you represent

        12       and certainly the 90-some percent or the

        13       people that we represent.  I would just ask

        14       you to consider that.

        15                  Thank you for your time.  Thank

        16       you, Mr. President.

        17                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Thank

        18       you, Senator Rivera.

        19                  Senator Espaillat.

        20                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    Thank you,

        21       Mr. President.

        22                  Would Senator DeFrancisco yield for

        23       some questions?

        24                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        25                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator



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         1       DeFrancisco, do you yield to a question?

         2                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

         3                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         4       Espaillat.

         5                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    Thank you,

         6       Mr. President.

         7                  Once again, we are here today

         8       debating this very important budget

         9       resolution.  And I've heard, so far, many

        10       legitimate concerns from its sponsors.  Many

        11       of those concerns strike right at the center

        12       of the well-being of our state.  I heard the

        13       concern that there should be no new taxes.  I

        14       heard the concern that people across the State

        15       of New York are leaving in droves.  I also

        16       heard the concern on behalf of the viability

        17       and the strength of small businesses.

        18                  Yet there is one important concern

        19       that's not included in this list and that is

        20       not included in this budget resolution that I

        21       think will have a devastating effect in this

        22       state, and that's the exclusion of rent

        23       regulations from this budget resolution.

        24                  There is no question that if the

        25       rent regulations expire on June 15, this would



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         1       amount to a back-door tax on over a million

         2       households, over a million households across

         3       the State of New York.  There is no question

         4       that if rent regulations expire and disappear

         5       on June 15 that we are exposing millions of

         6       New Yorkers to leave their homes.

         7       Furthermore, there is no doubt that if rent

         8       regulations expire on June 15 and people leave

         9       their homes to go to other states or people

        10       are forced to pay more rent -- a back-door

        11       tax -- that our small-business community will

        12       be dramatically impacted by this action.

        13                  So I want to ask you, Senator

        14       DeFrancisco, why is it that if you are so

        15       concerned about no new taxes and the impact

        16       that taxes may have on New York State, if you

        17       are so concerned about people leaving in

        18       droves and there being a strong agenda for

        19       small businesses, you are not concerned for

        20       over a million New Yorkers, that you don't

        21       address perhaps the most important legislation

        22       that we may discuss this year here, rent

        23       regulation, the livelihood of them having a

        24       roof over their head for seniors, single moms,

        25       working families, working parents, young



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         1       couples looking to move up the ladder that

         2       have to pay sometimes very excessive rents,

         3       that may find themselves either leaving the

         4       state or doubling up with a neighbor or

         5       relative because they cannot make ends meet?

         6       Why don't we have rent regulations in this

         7       budget resolution?

         8                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         9       DeFrancisco.

        10                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    This budget

        11       resolution reacts to the Governor's budget.

        12       There was no rent-regulation legislation in

        13       the Governor's budget.  And from my

        14       understanding, your former house is passing a

        15       one-house budget today; there is no

        16       rent-regulation language in that bill either.

        17       And as a result, it's -- and plus rent

        18       regulation doesn't expire, as you say, till

        19       June 15th.  It's a separate policy issue and

        20       it's not a budget issue, necessarily,

        21       especially when neither house nor the Governor

        22       has put it in any of their budgets.  So it's

        23       not only this house, it's your former house as

        24       well.

        25                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    Mr.



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         1       President, will Senator DeFrancisco yield for

         2       another question?

         3                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

         4                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         5       DeFrancisco yields.

         6                  Senator Espaillat.

         7                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    Senator

         8       DeFrancisco, we are an independent branch of

         9       government.  We are not guided strictly by the

        10       wishes of the Governor's office or the

        11       Assembly.  We are an autonomous, duly elected

        12       independent branch of government.  We don't

        13       have the exact budget resolution that the

        14       Assembly has.  You just said that we don't

        15       have the so-called millionaire's tax.  They

        16       have it.

        17                  You know, so we're an independent

        18       body.  And we should draft the best budget

        19       resolution that we feel on both sides of the

        20       aisle is the best budget resolution for all

        21       New Yorkers.  I want to ask why is it that we

        22       have not included measures such as vacancy

        23       destabilization, which regulates tons of

        24       apartments.  Some of the experts feel that

        25       over 300,000 units of housing have been lost.



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         1                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         2       Espaillat, do you have a question that you're

         3       posing?

         4                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    Yes, I do.

         5       Why don't we have -- and if I may, through

         6       you, Mr. President -- why don't we have in

         7       this budget resolution the provision to repeal

         8       vacancy destabilization and to regulate most

         9       of the apartments that have been lost through

        10       this loophole in the past two decades,

        11       approximately 300,000 units of housing across

        12       the State of New York?

        13                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        14       DeFrancisco.

        15                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    I don't

        16       think any apartments have been lost.  I think

        17       they may have been deregulated, but that's not

        18       the loss of apartments, number one.

        19                  Number two is because it is a

        20       separate issue, separate and apart from the

        21       budget.  And we're not the only ones.  I'm not

        22       suggesting that we couldn't put it in here.

        23       There's a lot of things, a lot of policy

        24       decisions that I would love to have in the

        25       budget.  I'd love to see the property tax cap



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         1       in the budget that this house has passed

         2       repeatedly and that the Governor, by the way,

         3       sent in a separate bill.  It was his position

         4       that that should be separate and apart from

         5       the budget.

         6                  So there's many, many important

         7       policy issues to every single Senator here.

         8       But if every single one of them was in a

         9       budget bill of each house, we would have a

        10       budget about January 10th of next year --

        11       maybe.

        12                  So there are certain constraints.

        13       And we follow what the Governor's proposed

        14       budget was in addressing those issues, as did

        15       the Assembly.

        16                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    Mr.

        17       President, if the Senator may yield for some

        18       questions through you again, please.

        19                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        20                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        21       DeFrancisco yields to a question, Senator

        22       Espaillat.

        23                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    Senator,

        24       thank you for your explanation.  But I feel

        25       that perhaps in your original explanation you



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         1       may have stumbled into some very basic and

         2       deep contradictions.

         3                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    I doubt it.

         4                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    One, for

         5       example, the millionaire's tax does not expire

         6       till the end of this year.  So why not include

         7       it in the budget?

         8                  The other matter is that we all

         9       know --

        10                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    We did

        11       include it by not including it.  We said we're

        12       not going to pass it.

        13                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    Crafty words,

        14       Senator.  But it wasn't included and it

        15       doesn't end until the end of the year.

        16                  If I may, Mr. President --

        17                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Do you

        18       ask Senator DeFrancisco to continue to yield?

        19                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    Yes.

        20                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        21                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        22       DeFrancisco yields.

        23                  Senator Espaillat, if you can just

        24       continue to stay to the questions.  And if you

        25       want to speak on the resolution, then we can



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         1       allow that.

         2                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    Well, I am

         3       speaking to the resolution, Mr. President.

         4                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    But

         5       you're asking to pose a question.

         6                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    And I'm

         7       addressing some of the contradictions that I

         8       feel have arisen in this debate.

         9                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        10       DeFrancisco yields to your question.

        11                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    In addition

        12       to that, LIFO language has been included.

        13       But, Senator DeFrancisco, you have said that

        14       rent should not be included.  I find that to

        15       be also a contradiction.

        16                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    LIFO was

        17       included -- we already passed a separate bill,

        18       but LIFO was included as amended by the

        19       Governor's proposal because it directly

        20       affects decisions that have to be made by

        21       New York City in determining who they're going

        22       to lay off, how many people are going to be

        23       laid off and what the effects of the layoffs

        24       would be based upon the money that would be

        25       saved by the various layoffs.



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         1                  So it's relevant from a financial

         2       standpoint for the City of New York School

         3       District and the mayor in determining their

         4       budget.

         5                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    If Senator

         6       DeFrancisco will yield, through you,

         7       Mr. President.

         8                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         9       DeFrancisco, do you continue to yield?

        10                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        11                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    But to be

        12       consistent, Senator, the Governor has clearly

        13       stated that he is not fully in support of LIFO

        14       and that in fact he will await for regulations

        15       to come from the State Department of Education

        16       to give us some guidance before we do those.

        17                  So in fact LIFO is not supported by

        18       the Governor, but we have included it in the

        19       budget resolution.  In fact, the surcharge

        20       doesn't expire until the end of the year, but

        21       we have not included it in the resolution.

        22       And in fact we have not included rent

        23       regulation, which will impact the lives of

        24       over a million units of the housing.

        25                  I want to ask you, how come this



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         1       resolution doesn't have a provision of that

         2       legislation that reduces the statutory vacancy

         3       bonus for landlords from 20 percent to

         4       10 percent?  Right now a landlord will get a

         5       20 percent increase on housing every time

         6       there is a vacancy.  A bill that I proposed

         7       before this house reduces that to 10 percent

         8       so we don't have this back-door tax on

         9       tenants.  How come this budget resolution has

        10       not included that provision?

        11                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    I'm not

        12       sure what you mean by this, because there's no

        13       cost to the City of New York by regulation or

        14       deregulation of apartments.  The costs are the

        15       landlord's costs, or the tenant's costs,

        16       depending upon whether the units are regulated

        17       or not.

        18                  What I'm suggesting is that it was

        19       our position that LIFO really is part of the

        20       decision-making process of who you're going to

        21       lay off and how many people you're going lay

        22       off, because there's a cut to the budgets of

        23       all school districts as well as including

        24       New York City.

        25                  Now, if the Assembly and the



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         1       Governor -- and it's a fiscal issue that's

         2       relevant in a budget, in my judgment, whereas

         3       the rent regulation is not.

         4                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    If Senator

         5       DeFrancisco will yield through you,

         6       Mr. President.

         7                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         8       DeFrancisco, do you continue to yield?

         9                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        10                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        11       Espaillat.

        12                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    Please,

        13       Senator, allow me to go back to the crucial

        14       and original question.  And I want to ask you

        15       a very sort of like straight question.  If

        16       1.2 million families saw their rent hiked on

        17       June 16 after rent regulations expires --

        18       because the crux of this debate is that the

        19       elimination of rent regulation to bring rents

        20       to market value.  So if they saw a hike in

        21       their rent on June 15, do you think that that

        22       will have a fiscal impact in the State of

        23       New York?

        24                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    But it will

        25       not have a fiscal impact on the people that we



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         1       are providing funding for, whether it's the

         2       cities, the school districts and the like.

         3                  And we have to have a budget, by

         4       the way, by April 1.  At least that's what

         5       everyone is hoping for.  It's March 15th.  If

         6       we included items such as that in this budget,

         7       it would make it much more difficult to reach.

         8       That's why I'm sure the Governor didn't put it

         9       in his budget, nor did either house.

        10                  Secondly, the dire consequences

        11       that you suggest, if they happen, they will

        12       happen on June 15th.  We have much time

        13       between now and then.  And in prior years when

        14       rent regulation was reestablished, it got

        15       reestablished in some shape, manner or form in

        16       time so the dire consequences wouldn't happen.

        17                  I'm concerned right now, being

        18       chairman of Finance, with getting a budget on

        19       April 1.

        20                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    Mr.

        21       President, if Senator DeFrancisco will

        22       yield -- through you again -- once again.

        23                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        24       DeFrancisco, do you continue to yield?

        25                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.



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         1                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         2       Espaillat.

         3                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    Well, I am

         4       concerned that a critical crisis that may

         5       occur on June 16 is not addressed right away.

         6                  In fact, we are taking measures in

         7       these resolutions to avoid reaching a crisis.

         8       So I am deeply concerned that we will once

         9       again kick the can down the road and find

        10       ourselves at the edge of the cliff on June 15

        11       at 11:30 p.m. with the livelihood of thousands

        12       and thousands of New Yorkers in jeopardy and

        13       danger, and they may see an increase in their

        14       rent that will drive them out of their house.

        15                  I want to know why doesn't this

        16       budget resolution include the reform of major

        17       capital improvements.  And Senator

        18       DeFrancisco, that's a provision that allows

        19       landlords to increase rent when they do a

        20       major capital improvement.  Let's say when

        21       they fix the roof, install new windows or

        22       repair the boiler, they're allowed to pass on

        23       these increases for life, way beyond the time

        24       that they have recovered the original

        25       investment.  And we're asking that yes, they



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         1       should have some ability to recover that

         2       investment, but it should not be for life,

         3       that it should be until the time that they

         4       have recovered the full investment of that

         5       improvement and not beyond that.

         6                  Why does this bill not provide this

         7       provision of the rent regulations law that I

         8       think is a -- will in turn become a back-door

         9       tax to working New Yorkers?

        10                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    My answer

        11       is the same.

        12                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    Mr.

        13       President, if the Senator may wish to answer

        14       my questions?

        15                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        16       DeFrancisco, do you continue to yield?

        17                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        18                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        19       Espaillat.

        20                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    Senator,

        21       English is my second language, so I have sort

        22       of like a short ability to remember.  Do you

        23       mind repeating that?

        24                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    I'd be

        25       happy to repeat it as many times as you want



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         1       to repeat it.  There's a limited time for the

         2       debate.  If you want me to repeat things, I'd

         3       be more than happy to.  But we have an

         4       April 1st deadline.  It's March 15th.  It's an

         5       issue that could slow down the budget process.

         6       More importantly, it's not germane to the

         7       issues of providing monies to the cities, the

         8       school districts and the like.  And there's

         9       plenty of time to deal with it after the

        10       budget.  And each house and the Governor

        11       agrees, because it's in none of the houses.

        12                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    Mr.

        13       President, if the Senator may yield for just

        14       two more questions.

        15                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.  Yes.

        16                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    The

        17       Senator yields.

        18                  Senator Espaillat.

        19                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    Yes.  Senator

        20       DeFrancisco, this budget resolution bill also

        21       does not include a reform of the individual

        22       apartment improvement program.  This program,

        23       instead of reducing rent, what it does is that

        24       it increases rent by 1/60th of the cost of an

        25       internal improvement on the apartment.



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         1                  We are proposing a modest reduction

         2       on that increase from 1/60th to 1/40th of the

         3       cost of the improvement.  Why is this

         4       provision not included in the budget

         5       resolution?

         6                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         7       DeFrancisco.

         8                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    You know,

         9       my answer is the same.  There is probably a

        10       thousand bills in print right now, none of

        11       which being in the budget.  The budget has, I

        12       think -- deals with fiscal issues.  And I

        13       think we're -- my answer would be the same no

        14       matter what one of those bills you pick out.

        15                  And just so I'm clear, are you in

        16       favor of rent control?  I just want to be

        17       sure.

        18                  (Laughter.)

        19                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    Yes, I'm in

        20       favor of rent regulation.

        21                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Thank you.

        22                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    [Inaudible]

        23       Again, English is my second language.

        24                  To finalize, Mr. President, would

        25       the Senator yield for some questions?



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         1                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

         2                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         3       DeFrancisco, do you yield to a final question?

         4                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

         5                  SENATOR ESPAILLAT:    Yes.  Senator

         6       DeFrancisco, thank you for your explanations

         7       and your candidness.

         8                  We are deeply concerned that this

         9       budget resolution does not include rent

        10       regulation and that thousands of New Yorkers

        11       are at the precipice of being evicted from

        12       their homes by increased rents that will be

        13       generated through the deregulation of our rent

        14       laws across the State of New York.

        15                  We are deeply concerned.  We feel

        16       very strongly that this provision should be in

        17       the budget.  And in the words of that great

        18       contemporary philosopher in New York City, the

        19       rent is too damn high.

        20                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Thank

        21       you, Senator Rivera, for quoting Jimmy

        22       McMillan.

        23                  Senator Stavisky.

        24                  SENATOR STAVISKY:    Thank you,

        25       Mr. President.  If the Senator would yield for



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         1       a --

         2                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         3       DeFrancisco, do you yield a question from

         4       Senator Stavisky?

         5                  SENATOR STAVISKY:    A number of

         6       very brief questions.

         7                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    A

         8       number of very brief questions, but we'll

         9       entertain them all through the chair, please,

        10       Senator Stavisky.

        11                  SENATOR STAVISKY:    Yes, sir.

        12                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        13       Stavisky.

        14                  SENATOR STAVISKY:    The Governor

        15       in his budget allocated $40 million for the

        16       City University of New York midyear tuition

        17       increase.  Perhaps -- if Senator LaValle is

        18       rising, perhaps is he going to respond to

        19       those questions?  It doesn't matter to me.

        20                  Mr. President, will Senator LaValle

        21       yield?

        22                  SENATOR LaVALLE:    Yes.

        23                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        24       Stavisky, under Rule 9.4(B), only the members

        25       who have spoken on the resolution are allowed



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         1       to be asked questions.

         2                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    I would

         3       yield to Senator LaValle to answer the

         4       question in his area of expertise.

         5                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         6       DeFrancisco yields to Senator LaValle.

         7       Without objection, Senator Stavisky?

         8                  SENATOR STAVISKY:    That's why I

         9       addressed it to Senator LaValle.

        10                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    No

        11       objection.  Senator LaValle, you may be heard.

        12                  SENATOR STAVISKY:    Well, let me

        13       ask the question.

        14                  There was an allocation of CUNY,

        15       $40 million, and yet it's my understanding

        16       that in the Senate Majority budget resolution,

        17       that $40 million has been swept away.  Can you

        18       give me an explanation for that?

        19                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        20       LaValle.

        21                  SENATOR LaVALLE:    Yes.  Senator

        22       Stavisky, as you know, on the issue of tuition

        23       the board can establish tuition policy,

        24       whether that be the State University or the

        25       City University.  However, they then come to



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         1       the Legislature for appropriation authority.

         2                  In this case, what happened with

         3       City University is they forgot something.

         4       They established tuition, assessed tuition to

         5       the students, and they never sought

         6       appropriation authority until after the fact.

         7                  So there are certain rules of the

         8       road that need to be followed.  And I think we

         9       need to have both systems, whether it be SUNY

        10       or CUNY, establish policies that are

        11       consistent with not only law but with

        12       tradition and custom that has been followed.

        13       You will recall that last year the State

        14       University, SUNY, went through great lengths

        15       to try and get freedom from the Legislature in

        16       establishing their own policy.  So this is

        17       something that is very serious, and we need to

        18       have a dialogue on how we deal with this.

        19                  SENATOR STAVISKY:    Mr. President,

        20       if Senator LaValle would continue to yield on

        21       that particular issue.

        22                  SENATOR LaVALLE:    Yes.

        23                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        24       LaValle yields.

        25                  Senator Stavisky.



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         1                  SENATOR STAVISKY:    I only found

         2       out when you released your budget resolution

         3       sometime Sunday that the $40 million that had

         4       been in the Governor's proposal, the budget

         5       that he released, had been swept away under

         6       your budget resolution.  And that just

         7       increases the cut to CUNY.  This was obviously

         8       not done to the State University of New York,

         9       but to the City University, and subjected them

        10       to an overall reduction of $123.2 million.

        11                  I'm very familiar with the concepts

        12       of differential tuition and the rational

        13       tuition policy.  And at the same time, though,

        14       it would have applied, first of all, to CUNY

        15       as well as SUNY last year.  And the SUNY

        16       trustees have authorized an increase in

        17       tuition, as have the CUNY trustees.  However,

        18       your resolution sweeps away that $40 million.

        19       It's still missing.

        20                  SENATOR LaVALLE:    Well, Senator,

        21       you will recall that the State University, two

        22       years ago, they increased tuition $620 and the

        23       system never saw a dime, not a dime of that

        24       money.  It was swept.  The cut was taken away

        25       from them.  And I didn't hear -- and I



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         1       remember when I sat over there, talked and

         2       railed about that.  SUNY has not had, other

         3       than that, in the last two years -- unlike

         4       CUNY -- an increase in tuition.  The first

         5       tuition increase was done according to the

         6       rules.

         7                  Now, we either have rules or we

         8       don't have rules.  And so I think we need to

         9       have a discussion, a dialogue on this.  I

        10       understand the repercussions.  But you just

        11       can't do things, make it up as you go along,

        12       say we're going to set tuition and assess the

        13       students the tuition and then get

        14       appropriation authority.  It doesn't work that

        15       way.

        16                  SENATOR STAVISKY:    Mr. President,

        17       if the Senator would continue to yield.

        18                  SENATOR LaVALLE:    Yes.  Yes.

        19                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        20       LaValle yields.

        21                  SENATOR STAVISKY:    Isn't it true

        22       that last year, since you brought it up, we

        23       didn't rail, what we tried to do with the SUNY

        24       budget was take it off-budget so that the

        25       entire amount was returned to the campus.



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         1       And, Senator, you know that you voted against

         2       that, as did a lot of other people.

         3                  So, you know, let's -- I want to be

         4       very brief, because -- if the Senator would

         5       yield for another question.

         6                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    The

         7       Senator has yielded, Senator Stavisky.  You

         8       may pose your question.

         9                  SENATOR LaVALLE:    Yes.

        10                  SENATOR STAVISKY:    Yes, let me be

        11       very brief.

        12                  Several years ago the out-of-state

        13       tuition for SUNY students was -- the

        14       authorization was raised, the permission was

        15       granted to raise it by I think it was

        16       5 percent.  Your resolution raises the

        17       out-of-state tuition by 5 percent, and I think

        18       that -- I don't have a problem with that.  But

        19       what happened to the previous years, in 2005

        20       and 2006, when the authorization was granted

        21       to raise tuition for out-of-state students?

        22                  And remember, our tuition is -- the

        23       SUNY tuition for in-state students is below

        24       $5,000 a year and out-of-state it's somewhere

        25       around $13,000.  Extremely low amount when you



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         1       compare other campuses throughout the nation.

         2       What happened to that money that was

         3       authorized back in '05 and '06?

         4                  SENATOR LaVALLE:    I assume that

         5       it was -- I don't know the exact answer,

         6       Senator.  But I assume that they had the

         7       appropriation that it -- that that tuition was

         8       increased.  I believe it was.  I believe the

         9       out-of-state tuition was -- there was a

        10       debate, there was a discussion of the range of

        11       the tuition.

        12                  But no, this year this resolution

        13       does have, as you have indicated, 5 percent

        14       increase for out-of-state students.

        15                  SENATOR STAVISKY:    My question --

        16       if the Senator would continue to yield.

        17                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        18       LaValle, do you yield?

        19                  SENATOR LaVALLE:    Yes.

        20                  SENATOR STAVISKY:    What happened

        21       to the money, though, that was authorized in

        22       2005 and 2006?  Did it go into the budget?

        23       Was it never collected?  Did they ignore it?

        24       What happened to it?

        25                  SENATOR LaVALLE:    The only answer



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         1       I can give you, as part of the sweeps, that

         2       that money, that appropriation was taken down,

         3       a part of it was taken down.

         4                  Here, as you know, in our budget

         5       resolution we have, to the best that we can,

         6       built a firewall around that the State

         7       University will receive those monies and not

         8       have the kinds of sweeps that we've had in the

         9       last two years.  We're trying to prevent that.

        10                  SENATOR STAVISKY:    Thank you,

        11       Senator.

        12                  Very briefly on the bill.

        13                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        14       Stavisky on the resolution.

        15                  SENATOR STAVISKY:    I believe it

        16       is terribly unfair to subject CUNY to special

        17       assessments, to special cuts.  They are

        18       struggling, as all of the public colleges --

        19       and, in fact, the private colleges and

        20       universities are struggling.  But particularly

        21       I think we have an obligation to maintain

        22       support for both the State University of

        23       New York and the City University of New York.

        24                  Twenty years ago, about 65 percent

        25       of their aid came from the State of New York.



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         1       Today it's going to be below 45 percent.  That

         2       is a trend I think that we really ought to

         3       reverse.  And we're going to work together

         4       hopefully to resolve some of those issues,

         5       because I know that the Senate Majority would

         6       agree that we've got to maintain our

         7       university system to continue the

         8       affordability and the excellence that they

         9       provide.

        10                  Thank you, Mr. President.

        11                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        12       Stewart-Cousins.

        13                  SENATOR STEWART-COUSINS:    Thank

        14       you, Mr. President.  Would the resolution

        15       sponsor yield for some questions?

        16                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        17       DeFrancisco, do you yield?

        18                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        19                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    He

        20       does, Senator Stewart-Cousins.

        21                  SENATOR STEWART-COUSINS:    Yes,

        22       Senator DeFrancisco.  You know, we've been

        23       talking about many of the global issues in the

        24       budget.  And I think obviously we all

        25       represent districts, and so therefore we can



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         1       become parochial.  I try not to do that too

         2       often.  But in this case, because of the

         3       ramifications of what is happening in this

         4       budget, I must.

         5                  So my questions to you are with

         6       regard to the school district of the City of

         7       Yonkers.  One of the things that you said in

         8       your opening statement is that you took a look

         9       at the high-needs districts, you added

        10       $200 million, and you found a way to help the

        11       rural high-needs districts.  I'm wondering if

        12       there was any consideration to the plight of

        13       the Big Five.  Because Yonkers, being the

        14       fourth largest city, is one of the Big Five

        15       school districts.  Was there any look at that,

        16       Senator DeFrancisco?

        17                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        18       DeFrancisco.

        19                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Under our

        20       budget, the City of Yonkers gets $17.5 million

        21       in funding beyond the state education formula.

        22       Other large cities get certain grants.  But I

        23       know Syracuse, where I come from, which isn't

        24       much different in population than Yonkers, I

        25       don't think, it's a grant of about $3 million.



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         1       So I think Yonkers did extremely well under

         2       this budget proposal.

         3                  SENATOR STEWART-COUSINS:    Thank

         4       you.  Would the sponsor continue to yield?

         5                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         6       DeFrancisco, do you yield?

         7                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

         8                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    He

         9       does.

        10                  SENATOR STEWART-COUSINS:    Thank

        11       you.  I do appreciate that.  And that has been

        12       the case, certainly, so it's not new in this

        13       budget.  It has been the case because Yonkers

        14       is one of those cities that is located in

        15       Westchester County.  The formula has always

        16       been based on wealth of the area, and the City

        17       of Yonkers is in the category of a wealthy

        18       county, yet the school district itself is the

        19       place where about 75 percent of the school

        20       children have free or reduced lunches.

        21                  So Yonkers is in a unique position.

        22       It is an urban school district in a very

        23       wealthy county, yet the formula that either

        24       looks at this or that doesn't look at the high

        25       needs of the school district itself.  And



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         1       because that happens, we as a state have wound

         2       up doing a number of things.

         3                  In 2002, we spent $300 million to

         4       settle a suit that said that the state could

         5       have been funding Yonkers better.  That went

         6       on for five years.  And after that, the video

         7       lottery terminal money, in order to help,

         8       again, repair the inequities, was targeted to

         9       the Yonkers School District.

        10                  So the additional $17.5 million

        11       grant that you talk about -- which you're

        12       right, has been there every year -- is because

        13       we have not since I've been here, 2007, and

        14       certainly prior to that, not been able to find

        15       a formula that actually works for the City of

        16       Yonkers, which is, again, an urban school

        17       district in a relatively wealthy county with a

        18       high-needs student population and a growing

        19       student population.  Which brings me to my

        20       next point.

        21                  But I guess my question was -- and

        22       I guess you feel that, you know, you answered

        23       it when you said that it gets $17.5 million.

        24       The question that I wanted to know is when you

        25       look at what the proposed cut in the



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         1       Governor's budget was in terms of the Big

         2       Four, were you able to take a look at what

         3       Yonkers was getting relative to what the other

         4       Big Four cities got?

         5                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Well, I'm

         6       being told now, because I did not have the

         7       specific information on Yonkers, but I've been

         8       told that including the grant that has been a

         9       traditional grant, and the monies provided by

        10       the State of New York through the state aid

        11       formula in the Governor's budget, Yonkers

        12       decrease would have been around 8 or

        13       9 percent.

        14                  SENATOR STEWART-COUSINS:    You're

        15       absolutely right.

        16                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Okay.

        17       Well, I'm not right; I was told that.

        18                  SENATOR STEWART-COUSINS:    Your

        19       advice is correct.

        20                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    I had no

        21       clue.

        22                  But where we were directing the

        23       additional funds that I spoke to earlier were

        24       those districts that had the high teens and

        25       low 20 percent, the rural districts upstate,



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         1       which got about 68.01 percent of the

         2       additional funds, I'm sure they would be

         3       ecstatic if their cut was only 8 or 9 percent

         4       as opposed to 17, 18, 21, 22 percent.

         5                  SENATOR STEWART-COUSINS:    Thank

         6       you.  Will the sponsor continue to yield?

         7                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         8       DeFrancisco, do you yield?

         9                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        10                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        11       Stewart-Cousins.

        12                  SENATOR STEWART-COUSINS:    Thank

        13       you.  I asked you that because again, as you

        14       spoke about regions, I wanted for you in this

        15       regional concept to look at Yonkers as part of

        16       the region of the Big Five.  And your response

        17       in terms of it being 9 percent, approximately

        18       8 percent cut, puts it in a higher cut range

        19       than every other city -- with the exception of

        20       New York -- in the Big Five.

        21                  So in the region where my big city,

        22       Yonkers, is, it has been disproportionately

        23       cut to begin with.  That is my point.

        24                  Will the sponsor continue to yield?

        25                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.



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         1                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         2       DeFrancisco yields.

         3                  Senator Stewart-Cousins.

         4                  SENATOR STEWART-COUSINS:    Yes.

         5       Senator DeFrancisco -- and again, I want to --

         6       I appreciate the frankness and talking about

         7       looking at high-needs rural districts.  I just

         8       want to bring your attention to this region of

         9       big cities, of which Yonkers has been

        10       disproportionately negatively impacted with

        11       the cut.

        12                  Are you aware that the video

        13       lottery terminal money that the cities

        14       receive, and specifically the City of Yonkers

        15       receives, is again as a result of the

        16       settlement that happened in 2002 that gave

        17       $300 million over a five-year period to the

        18       City of Yonkers, and then the VLT money kicked

        19       in, it was for the school district?  Were you

        20       aware?

        21                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    I'll take

        22       your word for it.  I don't know that.

        23                  SENATOR STEWART-COUSINS:    It is.

        24       The city, again, as the grant -- the video

        25       lottery terminal money has consistently been



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         1       part of an effort to make some sort of sense

         2       so that the school district and its children

         3       can thrive.  Are you --

         4                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         5       Stewart-Cousins, are you --

         6                  SENATOR STEWART-COUSINS:    Yes,

         7       Through you, Mr. President, will the sponsor

         8       continue to yield?

         9                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        10                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        11       DeFrancisco yields.

        12                  Senator Stewart-Cousins.

        13                  SENATOR STEWART-COUSINS:    Senator

        14       DeFrancisco, are you aware that in the I guess

        15       attempt to help other municipalities, the

        16       grant which goes to the school district of

        17       Yonkers -- not the grant, the VLT money that

        18       goes to the school district of Yonkers --

        19       which, by the way, we have legislation that

        20       that's been sponsored to try and get more,

        21       because again, we're always trying not to lose

        22       the personnel and the services -- which I will

        23       go into later but I won't bore you with right

        24       now as to how much we've had to cut.

        25                  Are you aware that in this



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         1       redistribution $15 million of targeted school

         2       aid is now out of the City of Yonkers video

         3       lottery terminal resources, that it is now out

         4       and apparently redistributed so that the cut

         5       that was originally 8 percent, which we were

         6       trying to mitigate, is now almost 14 percent?

         7       Are you aware of that?

         8                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    I was not

         9       aware of that.

        10                  SENATOR STEWART-COUSINS:    Okay.

        11       I'm glad that I can enlighten you.  Obviously,

        12       this is a problem.  It is a problem because

        13       this is the fourth largest school district in

        14       the state.  And at this point -- and I know

        15       from what you said you care about

        16       disproportionality -- what is happening in

        17       this city will give not only a city that was

        18       sort of trying to come back a real kick

        19       backwards, but it will fail the students of

        20       one of the largest cities in this state.

        21                  So thank you.

        22                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Thank

        23       you, Senator Stewart-Cousins.

        24                  Senator Diaz.

        25                  SENATOR DIAZ:    Thank you,



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         1       Mr. President.  Mr. President, on the

         2       resolution.

         3                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         4       Diaz on the resolution.

         5                  SENATOR DIAZ:    I am going to

         6       speak on the resolution.  And I will not ask

         7       Senator DeFrancisco questions, because I know

         8       what is an exercise in futility.  That means

         9       that we could be here all night, tomorrow,

        10       asking Senator DeFrancisco questions, there's

        11       nothing going to happen.

        12                  The fact of the matter is that you,

        13       the Senators on the Republican side, and five

        14       Democrats that join with you, will vote for

        15       it.  Because no matter what we say, no matter

        16       what we do, you got five Democrats with you

        17       and it's going to be approved.  So that's what

        18       I call an exercise in futility.  So, ladies

        19       and gentlemen, that's why I'm not going to ask

        20       Senator DeFrancisco questions.

        21                  But I'm going to say, I'm going to

        22       speak about a little history.  In 2009 we, the

        23       Democratic side, was in control of this

        24       chamber.  And in 2009 we saw the need to avoid

        25       what I saw today.  I saw today paraplegics in



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         1       beds, in wheelchairs, and they were trying to

         2       breathe.  All over this house and all over

         3       this building, paraplegics, paraplegics asking

         4       us, Please don't cut my services, please help

         5       us.  They couldn't even breathe.

         6                  Do you people think that it is

         7       fair, it is just for us to put them through

         8       this agony?  I saw senior citizens that can't

         9       even walk, all over the place:  "Please help

        10       us."  Do you really think that it is fair for

        11       us, that it is -- humanly speaking, that it

        12       is -- that it makes any sense for us to put

        13       paraplegics, handicaps, blind people, senior

        14       citizens that can't even walk through this

        15       agony?  It doesn't make sense to me.

        16                  But in 2009, we saw this.  And to

        17       avoid this, under the leadership of Senator

        18       Sampson, we decided to put something called, I

        19       believe, millionaire tax, to find some money

        20       to avoid this crisis and this agony to these

        21       people.  And that created 4 -- one, two,

        22       three, $4 billion to help with the crisis.

        23                  What I don't like and what I feel

        24       ashamed today, what I feel ashamed today here,

        25       is that my colleague Senator Espaillat asked a



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         1       question to Senator DeFrancisco and Senator

         2       DeFrancisco said, Hey, hey, we only supported

         3       what the Governor is doing, a Democratic

         4       Governor doing.  Hey, the other house,

         5       controlled by Democrats, they are not doing

         6       it.  What are you criticizing me for?

         7                  That is shameful.  That is

         8       shameful.  I would love for Senator Skelos and

         9       the Republicans to put this money back and to

        10       avoid this crisis.  But a Democratic Governor,

        11       before putting this through, he should sit

        12       down and look at those paraplegics and look at

        13       those senior citizens and look at those people

        14       that's going to be hurt and say, I can't do

        15       this, I am going to have to extend this

        16       millionaire tax, $4 billion that I could

        17       prevent these paraplegics to come around here

        18       crying, leaving their houses from all over the

        19       state -- from all of your districts, all of

        20       your districts.

        21                  And by the way, and by the way, the

        22       majority of them -- no, not the majority.  I

        23       didn't even see one Hispanic or one black.

        24       Paraplegics crying in wheelchairs, in beds,

        25       crying for their services, crying for help.



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         1       That could have been solved, that could have

         2       been solved if we put this -- if we extend, if

         3       we extend this millionaire tax, that could

         4       help.  But the Democratic Governor say no, I

         5       don't care, pull it out, don't put it.  And

         6       also the other house, controlled by Democrats,

         7       should also put it in and should also include

         8       the rent and should also do what we Democrats

         9       supposed to be fighting for.

        10                  It is a shame that we have to come

        11       here to fight with the Republicans when a

        12       Democratic Governor is the one doing this.  It

        13       is a shame for me to hear Senator DeFrancisco

        14       saying that the other house didn't put the

        15       rent and didn't put the housing and didn't put

        16       this thing that we're fighting for.

        17                  So that's why I'm saying this is an

        18       exercise in futility.  They're telling me to

        19       shut up.

        20                  (Laughter.)

        21                  SENATOR DIAZ:    Senator, shut up.

        22       The story of my life.

        23                  (Laughter.)

        24                  SENATOR DIAZ:    I'm not insulted.

        25       I'm not going to shut up.  That is the story



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         1       of my life.  People never want to hear what I

         2       have to say.

         3                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Does

         4       that include your wife?

         5                  SENATOR DIAZ:    That's okay, my

         6       wife is here today.

         7                  (Laughter.)

         8                  SENATOR DIAZ:    People don't want

         9       to hear what I have to say.  So yes, I'm going

        10       to shut up.

        11                  Senator Skelos, you could be a

        12       hero.  Senator Skelos, you could be the hero.

        13       You could be the hero of the Republican Party

        14       saying, We are going to undo what the

        15       Democrats are doing, we're going to help the

        16       paraplegics, we're going to put that money

        17       back.  You could be the hero.  You don't have

        18       to support the Democratic Governor.  You don't

        19       have to support what the other house of

        20       Democrats is doing.  Show them that you really

        21       care, that you really care for the

        22       paraplegics, for the senior citizens, for the

        23       people.

        24                  And what with that, I comply with

        25       your request, Madam.  I am shutting my mouth



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         1       up.  Thank you.

         2                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Thank

         3       you, Senator Diaz.

         4                  Senator Breslin.

         5                  SENATOR BRESLIN:    Thank you,

         6       Mr. President.  Would Senator DeFrancisco

         7       yield for a question?

         8                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Absolutely.

         9                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        10       DeFrancisco will yield.

        11                  Senator Breslin.

        12                  SENATOR BRESLIN:    Through you,

        13       Mr. President.  The Governor's Medicaid Design

        14       Task Force had a number of proposals --

        15                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Excuse

        16       me, Senator Breslin.

        17                  Can we have some order in the

        18       house, please?  Thank you.

        19                  Senator Breslin.

        20                  SENATOR BRESLIN:    The Medicaid

        21       Redesign Task Force had a number of proposals.

        22       One of them was to provide a level of

        23       payment -- a wage floor for home health care

        24       workers.  And that doesn't have any expense to

        25       us as a state.  But it seems as though it may



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         1       not be in your budget.  Can you tell us if it

         2       is, and if it isn't, why?

         3                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    It is not.

         4       And the reason why is that in this difficult

         5       budget time we have to be consistent with

         6       people.  Teachers are being laid off, state

         7       employees are being laid off.  And in

         8       addition, people who work with the most

         9       seriously developmentally handicapped people

        10       had a scheduled COLA increase this year that

        11       was held up because of the budget crisis.

        12                  We thought it was unfair to provide

        13       a pay increase to one segment of individuals

        14       who were at the table at the MRT, it would be

        15       unfair to all the other employees who are

        16       suffering dire consequences.  So that was the

        17       reason.  And, you know, that's something that

        18       we don't believe should be in there.  My guess

        19       is the other house probably will, and that's

        20       something that will have to be negotiated.

        21                  SENATOR BRESLIN:    Through you,

        22       Mr. President, if the sponsor will continue to

        23       yield.

        24                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

        25                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator



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         1       DeFrancisco yields.

         2                  Senator Breslin.

         3                  SENATOR BRESLIN:    Would it have

         4       been possible to put the COLA in which would

         5       have made them more equal, given the fact, as

         6       you said, they really service the most

         7       vulnerable in our population?

         8                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Sure, it's

         9       possible to add whatever you want to add, and

        10       then -- but where do you stop at that point

        11       when we're giving -- then we're giving

        12       increases to some, laying off state employees,

        13       making school districts lay off other

        14       individuals.

        15                  I think it's got to be consistent

        16       that if everyone is not getting raises or some

        17       are getting laid off, the workforce of the

        18       state is in many instances being cut by

        19       10 percent, I think that's the way to be

        20       consistent, because you can't restore for

        21       everybody.

        22                  SENATOR BRESLIN:    Through you,

        23       Mr. President, will the sponsor continue to

        24       yield.

        25                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator



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         1       DeFrancisco, do you yield?

         2                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    Yes.

         3                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         4       Breslin.

         5                  SENATOR BRESLIN:    Thank you,

         6       Mr. President.

         7                  More now on regional.  As a Senator

         8       from upstate, I was very pleased when economic

         9       councils were set up to be administered by the

        10       Lieutenant Governor.  And it's my

        11       understanding that there was an appropriation

        12       put forth by the Governor of approximately

        13       $130 million for the Lieutenant Governor to

        14       run those councils.  Can you tell us what's

        15       happened to that financing?

        16                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    There

        17       was -- it was simply a $130 million, or

        18       whatever the number was, amount that was in

        19       the budget with no language attached to it.  I

        20       think it was our feeling that it would have

        21       been irresponsible to simply create a program

        22       without knowing what the program was.

        23                  So this is something that we're

        24       interested in pursuing and working with the

        25       Governor on, whether it's this or another



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         1       economic development program.  But to agree to

         2       something we don't know the details of, we --

         3       at least I did, and many of us did -- felt it

         4       was irresponsible.

         5                  SENATOR BRESLIN:    Thank you.

         6                  On the bill.

         7                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         8       Breslin on the resolution.

         9                  SENATOR BRESLIN:    Hopefully I'll

        10       confine my remarks generally to the upstate

        11       area.  But we in upstate really look forward

        12       to those economic councils.  The first time we

        13       have a Lieutenant Governor from upstate --

        14       first stripped of his authority, some of his

        15       authority as a Lieutenant Governor -- and now

        16       $130 million which we thought would have been

        17       used for upstate economic development is gone

        18       from the picture.  Hopefully we can move to

        19       restore that later.

        20                  And when I look around, I see in

        21       the budget the addition of New York City OTB,

        22       something that the majority voted against this

        23       past summer when that was a major issue --

        24       excuse me, last summer.  And that OTB bill for

        25       New York City that's been placed back in the



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         1       budget to me affects upstate again, in a

         2       negative way.  It affects Saratoga, it affects

         3       NYRA, it affects the harness track at

         4       Saratoga.  And not very good for us in

         5       upstate.

         6                  I look forward in this budget to

         7       really being responsible.  I sat here in the

         8       minority for 12 years arguing we should do

         9       more for upstate economic development.  I

        10       don't see it in this budget resolution put

        11       forward by the majority.  And again, upstate

        12       languishes and suffers.

        13                  I don't see anything in this budget

        14       on UB 2020.  Again, major, major part of

        15       upstate.  Also I would have been delighted to

        16       see University of Albany be included in that

        17       as well.

        18                  And there's minor parts of this

        19       budget that trouble me.  I look at -- you

        20       know, when we're all one New York, as Senator

        21       Smith said -- we're not upstate, we're not

        22       downstate, we're not Democrat or Republican.

        23       And I look at the Environmental Protection

        24       Fund, and it lists open space programs.  The

        25       Governor put forth certain sums of money and



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         1       really kept them at the levels they were in

         2       the past, and I applaud the Governor for doing

         3       that.  And I go down, and program after

         4       program after program in the open space

         5       program the Senate Majority leaves intact,

         6       with one exception, that being an open space

         7       program that happens to be located in my

         8       district -- probably a coincidence -- the

         9       Albany Pine Bush.  Hopefully at a later point

        10       that will be restored.

        11                  But again, it's the lack of

        12       emphasis on upstate, the lack of recognizing

        13       the fact that we in upstate have suffered for

        14       so many years, we've been cast aside.  And we

        15       need that economic development.  It's not

        16       present here.  And I hope before April 1st,

        17       with the help of my Democratic Minority, that

        18       we will be able to do more for upstate and do

        19       more for economic development, to do more to

        20       resurrect an area that has been languishing

        21       for many, many years.

        22                  Thank you, Mr. President.

        23                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Thank

        24       you, Senator Breslin.

        25                  Senator Liz Krueger to close for



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         1       the minority.

         2                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you.

         3       Thank you, Mr. President.

         4                  Well, you've heard from many of us

         5       today with our questions and our concerns

         6       about this budget resolution.  I suppose I

         7       want to reemphasize, reemphasize one of the

         8       greatest concerns we face today is that we

         9       believe this proposal, as an alternative to

        10       the Governor's budget resolution, will put us

        11       a billion dollars more in debt.  One billion

        12       dollars of revenue is not explained in this

        13       budget.

        14                  And I know there was a great deal

        15       of back and forth before, and I appreciate

        16       Senator DeFrancisco's comments to me.  But I

        17       was also reading some blogs since then where

        18       other Republican Senators are saying "On a

        19       wing and a prayer, maybe this will all add

        20       up."

        21                  I don't think it will add up.  I

        22       think at the end of the day, if this became

        23       law, $1 billion more in debt.  And yet in so

        24       many ways we didn't address the critical

        25       issues for middle-class families.  My



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         1       colleague Senator Breslin just highlighted

         2       some of the issues and the impact specifically

         3       for upstate New York.

         4                  This bill has lots of detail that

         5       was not discussed today.  Because again, we

         6       got the summarized version of the resolution

         7       at 10:30 this morning.  And then we learned

         8       there were some changes after that -- and

         9       that's okay, we're allowed to make mistakes

        10       and we're allowed to fix the mistakes.  But

        11       again, a $130 billion budget, a resolution

        12       that makes significant changes to every part

        13       of that budget, a billion dollars more

        14       expenditures than revenue as the proposal.

        15                  This wasn't enough time.  This

        16       wasn't enough thought put into it.  We learned

        17       it doesn't address UB 2020.  And many of my

        18       Republican colleagues have said they're not

        19       doing a budget that doesn't address UB 2020.

        20       It doesn't address property tax relief or

        21       mandate relief for the localities that so many

        22       of my colleagues on both sides of the aisle

        23       have been so eloquent about.  We're not

        24       dealing with the STAR program or the rebate

        25       check issues or property tax relief.  Even



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         1       though I'm not a big fan of caps, we're not

         2       even dealing with the tax cap.

         3                  Mr. President --

         4                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Excuse

         5       me, Senator Krueger.

         6                  May I have order in the chamber,

         7       please, so we may hear the Senator.

         8                  Senator Krueger, you may continue.

         9                  SENATOR LIZ KRUEGER:    Thank you

        10       so much.

        11                  Obviously we're all good people who

        12       want to do the right thing for the people of

        13       the State of New York.  But I'm afraid that

        14       that document is filled with empty promises

        15       and in fact broken promises.

        16                  Now, we did have plenty of time,

        17       apparently, in this document to undo some

        18       major policy concerns.  My colleague Senator

        19       Espaillat was very eloquent when he talked

        20       about that nothing to do with rent regulation

        21       was in this bill, despite the fact that it has

        22       an almost immediate impact on whether

        23       2.5 million New Yorkers can continue to afford

        24       their homes.  But we did have time in this

        25       bill to revisit LIFO issues for the teachers



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         1       of New York City and apparently violate

         2       collective bargaining agreements in the

         3       context of a budget resolution.  I'm very

         4       confused why we're revisiting that today.

         5                  It did have room to delay

         6       low-sulfur diesel laws that we passed, which

         7       is the number-one cause of air pollution in

         8       urban areas -- in my own district, in fact.

         9       It did have language to attempt to deconstruct

        10       the authority of DEC in ensuring that the

        11       Bottle Bill we passed in this state is

        12       implemented correctly, and in fact may put in

        13       a further hole in the state budget if we don't

        14       have the authority to track and collect the

        15       nickels from the bottles that are supposed to

        16       be reimbursed to us in the state.  But this

        17       language, Part DD in this bill, would actually

        18       gut the authority of the Office of Tax and

        19       Finance to do the job they need to to get us

        20       this money.

        21                  It guts an additional amount of

        22       money from the Department of Environmental

        23       Conservation.  It guts, as Senator Diaz

        24       described so eloquently, some of the most

        25       critical human and social service programs for



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         1       people with special needs who live throughout

         2       the State of New York.

         3                  This is not what we believe to be

         4       should be the budget of the State of New York.

         5       We still have a few weeks left to negotiate a

         6       more serious budget for the state.  I'm

         7       assuming we will have conference committees

         8       announced soon.  And I'm assuming we'll get

         9       another chance to reevaluate what's in here

        10       and what's not in here before we complete the

        11       budget for the State of New York.

        12                  But in closing, we want a fair

        13       budget.  We want a budget where we share the

        14       pain.  We want a budget where those in the

        15       least need provide assistance to those in most

        16       need.  We want a responsible government who

        17       recognizes our responsibility to all

        18       New Yorkers by region, by district, by

        19       recognition of the role of government to

        20       provide assistance and services efficiently

        21       and fairly to all 19 million New Yorkers.

        22                  So there's too much missing.

        23       There's too much unexplained.  There's too

        24       many broken promises.  I'm recommending a no

        25       vote for my colleagues today.  I will be



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         1       voting no.

         2                  Thank you, Mr. President.

         3                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Thank

         4       you, Senator Krueger.

         5                  Again, I ask for order in the

         6       chamber, please.

         7                  I recognize Senator Skelos to close

         8       the debate.

         9                  SENATOR SKELOS:    Thank you,

        10       Mr. President.

        11                  Before I start my actual closing, I

        12       forgot earlier today to thank Senator Diaz for

        13       his kind comments when he said "For Immediate

        14       Release:  Senator Diaz announced today that

        15       the New York State Senate has completely

        16       restored Title 20 money programs in its

        17       one-house budget bill.  I'm pleased that

        18       Senator Skelos and the Senate Republicans, as

        19       well as my conference chairman John Sampson

        20       and the Senate Democrats, worked to ensure

        21       that this very important funding was

        22       continued."

        23                  So I say, you know, thank you for

        24       those kind comments, Reverend Diaz.  And

        25       certainly that should be enough reason for you



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         1       to vote for this budget resolution.

         2                  What Senator Espaillat -- and he's

         3       not here right now.  I was just curious, when

         4       he was demonstrating in front of the

         5       Governor's mansion a week or so ago, whether

         6       he had the opportunity to ask the Governor why

         7       he was not supportive of the so-called

         8       millionaire's tax and if it disproportionately

         9       hit certain people.  But I don't know if he

        10       ever had the opportunity to ask him that when

        11       he was demonstrating.

        12                  What I do know is that the Senate

        13       budget is largely in sync with Governor

        14       Cuomo's priorities.  And working together as

        15       we now move to, hopefully, the general

        16       conference committee this evening -- and I

        17       know that the Assembly is taking up their

        18       budget resolution -- that we can have an

        19       on-time budget.  That is the goal of our

        20       Republican conference.

        21                  Our budget closes the $10 billion

        22       budget deficit without raising taxes, and the

        23       PIT surcharge will be sunsetted.  I should

        24       point out that with $14 billion in taxes and

        25       $14 billion in spending and billions of



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         1       dollars of money from the federal government,

         2       I'd like to know what was accomplished in the

         3       last two years that the Democrats were in the

         4       majority, other than tax and spend and put us

         5       into the deficit situation that we're in right

         6       now.

         7                  I'm also extremely happy that our

         8       budget -- and I want to thank Senator

         9       DeFrancisco as our chair and all of the

        10       members who participated in the budget

        11       process.  And in particular, I want to thank

        12       Senator Hannon with health and Senator

        13       Flanagan with education, because they devoted

        14       an awful lot of time to come up with the

        15       recommendations that are within this budget

        16       resolution.

        17                  Now, school aid restorations have

        18       been made, approximately $280 million, which

        19       are going to help.  And it's targeted towards

        20       the upstate rural districts that are most

        21       reliant on state aid and were

        22       disproportionately impacted in the Governor's

        23       budget.

        24                  I should also point out, you know,

        25       Senator Breslin mentioned that upstate has



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         1       been neglected over the years.  And certainly

         2       there is a lot more that needs to be done to

         3       help upstate New York and all the regions of

         4       the state.  But boy, when I drive down

         5       Washington Avenue to go to my condo, I see a

         6       beautiful nanotech facility that the State of

         7       New York put a billion dollars into, Senator

         8       Breslin.  And when you go up to Luther Forest

         9       in Senator McDonald's district, I see a Global

        10       Foundries facility being developed that's

        11       probably another billion dollars, and

        12       thousands of high-paying jobs being created

        13       right here in the Capital Region, upstate.

        14                  So we're very happy that those

        15       initiatives came from right here, our

        16       Republican conference.

        17                  So I'm not going to go through all

        18       the different aspects of this resolution other

        19       than to say we're proud of this resolution,

        20       we've made appropriate restorations, we've

        21       eliminated cost shifts, we are allowing the

        22       PIT to sunset.  Speaker Silver and the

        23       Assembly Democrats keep the PIT, so-called

        24       millionaire's tax, in place.  We raise

        25       education aid by $280 million, they raise it



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         1       by $200 million.

         2                  So we're very proud of what we've

         3       done in this resolution, and we look forward

         4       to working with you, our friends on the other

         5       side of the aisle, as we go through the

         6       conference committee process, something that

         7       for some reason was not used when you were in

         8       the majority and the Budget Reform Act of 2007

         9       was violated, the law was violated, because

        10       you felt that no Republicans had to be in the

        11       room because everything was Democrat-

        12       controlled.

        13                  That's not the way it's going to be

        14       this year.  We want Democrat Senators

        15       negotiating in public with us.  We want

        16       Assembly Democrats and Republicans negotiating

        17       the finality of this budget with us.  And we

        18       want the Governor to participate, obviously as

        19       he will, in this process.

        20                  So I'm hopeful with bipartisan

        21       cooperation -- because that's what people

        22       want -- that we will be able to put a budget

        23       together that is going to be a challenge.

        24       There are difficult choices to be made right

        25       now, but the reality is we're dealing with a



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         1       $10 billion deficit.  The people of the State

         2       of New York are saying cut government spending

         3       the way their families are doing, don't raise

         4       my taxes, and focus in on private-sector job

         5       creation.  And that's where this conference

         6       will be.

         7                  So, Mr. President, I urge that all

         8       of us support this resolution as the first

         9       really legislative step in concluding the

        10       budget process for this fiscal year.

        11                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Thank

        12       you, Senator Skelos.

        13                  The question is on the resolution.

        14       All in favor signify by saying aye.

        15                  (Response of "Aye.")

        16                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:

        17       Opposed, nay.

        18                  (Response of "Nay.")

        19                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        20       Peralta to explain his vote.

        21                  SENATOR PERALTA:    Mr. President,

        22       to explain my vote.

        23                  Shared sacrifices.  These are words

        24       that we've heard throughout this entire

        25       property.  But when we look at this budget



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         1       process, is it really shared sacrifices?  Now,

         2       we all understand that spending cuts are

         3       necessary.  We all understand that we must

         4       tighten our belts during this fiscal year.

         5       But depending entirely on deep spending cuts

         6       to balance the budget will make our most

         7       vulnerable even more vulnerable.

         8                  Schoolchildren, especially New York

         9       City minority children, seniors, the poor, all

        10       need us here today to preserve essential

        11       services and programs.  Yet we're being asked

        12       here today to forego an existing revenue

        13       stream.  Yet we're being asked here today to

        14       cut taxes for the wealthiest and cut services

        15       for the most vulnerable.

        16                  Simply put, this is not fair.

        17       Simply put, this is not right.  Cutting taxes

        18       for the wealthiest while cutting services for

        19       the most vulnerable is, as Senator Diaz put

        20       it, shameful.  And two out of three

        21       New Yorkers seem to agree with this point.  A

        22       recent Marist poll found that 64 percent of

        23       state voters support extending this surcharge,

        24       compared to only 33 percent who oppose it.

        25                  And the same poll found that the



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         1       higher the person's income, the more likely

         2       the person was to support extending the

         3       surcharge.  So much for the surcharge making

         4       the millionaire's leaving with the state --

         5       with the exception, of course, of Golisano.

         6       In fact, in 2010, with the surcharge in place,

         7       the number of millionaires increased by 35,000

         8       from the year before, according to the

         9       Wall Street Journal.

        10                  Another myth that has made the

        11       rounds is that the surcharge is a jobs killer.

        12       There's not a shred of evidence to support

        13       this claim.  Unless, of course, you're using

        14       the metric of choice, which is the OFT-quoted

        15       ranking that puts New York last for business

        16       and has economic powerhouses such as South

        17       Dakota, Alaska, and Wyoming at the top of

        18       their list.  And no doubt Sarah Palin would

        19       argue Alaska's lofty standing is entirely

        20       warranted.

        21                  But I'm not buying this argument,

        22       I'm really not.  The real jobs killer here is

        23       layoffs, thousands of them, which will in turn

        24       increase the unemployment roll.  The way to

        25       attract and retain businesses is by developing



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         1       an educated, skilled workforce.  Everyone in

         2       this chamber knows that.  And everyone in this

         3       chamber also knows that you don't develop an

         4       educated, skilled workforce by laying off

         5       thousands of people.

         6                  So let's set aside the sham

         7       arguments.  What we're really being asked to

         8       consider here today is to pile new tax cuts on

         9       top of other tax cuts for the wealthiest, and

        10       to pile more service cuts on top of other

        11       service cuts for our seniors and

        12       schoolchildren and the poor.

        13                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Thank

        14       you, Senator Peralta.

        15                  SENATOR PERALTA:    It's that

        16       simple.  Because of the federal tax cuts that

        17       were extended in December, those with incomes

        18       of over $1 million will pay an average of

        19       $34,000 less in federal taxes, according to

        20       the Fiscal Policy Institute.  We're talking

        21       about a temporary --

        22                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        23       Peralta -- Senator Peralta.

        24                  SENATOR PERALTA:    If I could --

        25                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    I've



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         1       been very generous in extending time today.

         2       We're under a two-minute limit here.  We have

         3       a number of speakers.

         4                  SENATOR PERALTA:    If I could just

         5       finish my --

         6                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    I'd

         7       appreciate it if you can just complete your

         8       thought right now, please.

         9                  SENATOR PERALTA:    Yes.  We're

        10       talking about temporarily extending an

        11       existing surcharge.  We're talking about

        12       temporarily extending an existing surcharge in

        13       the face of a $10 billion budget gap --

        14                  SENATOR LIBOUS:    Mr. President, I

        15       believe Senator Peralta is out of order.  I

        16       believe, under Senate rules, he has two

        17       minutes to explain his vote.  How long has he

        18       taken to explain his vote?  Point of order.

        19                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        20       Peralta has exceeded that.  Thank you, Senator

        21       Libous.  Your point of order is well-taken.

        22                  SENATOR LIBOUS:    Thank you,

        23       Mr. President.

        24                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        25       Peralta, I'm going to recognize Senator



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         1       Kennedy.  Thank you, Senator Peralta.

         2                  Senator Kennedy.

         3                  SENATOR PERALTA:    Well, thank you

         4       for allowing me to explain my vote.  And thank

         5       you for -- I will recommend that everyone in

         6       this chamber vote nay on this budget

         7       resolution.

         8                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Thank

         9       you.

        10                  Senator Kennedy, please confine

        11       yourself to two minutes, please.

        12                  SENATOR KENNEDY:    Thank you,

        13       Mr. President.

        14                  I rise today in opposition to this

        15       budget resolution because I don't believe this

        16       is what the constituents I represent in

        17       Western New York want to see as New York

        18       State's next budget.

        19                  We understand, in Western New York

        20       and across New York State, the fiscal

        21       condition of our state.  We know that there's

        22       tough decisions that need to be made.  And

        23       while there are pieces of this budget that I

        24       do appreciate -- specifically, there's no

        25       direct tax increases on hardworking



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         1       middle-class families or small businesses --

         2       there are a few things missing from this

         3       budget that are absolutely essential to the

         4       health and well-being of the people of Western

         5       New York.

         6                  It starts with UB 2020.  In

         7       January, the Western New York delegation and I

         8       drafted a letter to the Governor asking that

         9       he include UB 2020 policy reforms in his

        10       budget proposal.  The Governor included

        11       important components of UB 2020, but absent

        12       were the critical rational tuition provisions.

        13                  We proudly stood together in this

        14       chamber, Democrat and Republican, just two

        15       weeks ago to pass UB 2020 legislation.  We

        16       passed it with overwhelming bipartisan

        17       support, a demonstration of our understanding

        18       of how important UB 2020 is to the people of

        19       Western New York.  We handed the plan off to

        20       the Assembly, and I urge our colleagues in the

        21       Assembly to act on this important legislation

        22       in their chamber.

        23                  But this budget resolution today,

        24       as a Senate chamber, provides us the

        25       opportunity to indicate our budget priorities.



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         1       It is a priority of Western New York to have

         2       UB 2020 legislation fully implemented in the

         3       budget.  This budget resolution proposed today

         4       does not do that.

         5                  So then we should indicate that in

         6       these priorities the revitalization of Western

         7       New York and our economic economy is one of

         8       our priorities.  UB 2020 must be put in as a

         9       policy reform in its entirety.  And I urge

        10       opposition to this budget to anyone who is

        11       supportive of UB 2020 in the implementation.

        12                  Thank you.

        13                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Thank

        14       you, Senator Kennedy.

        15                  Senator Montgomery.

        16                  Again, I remind the members please

        17       confine your comments to two minutes.  Thank

        18       you.

        19                  SENATOR MONTGOMERY:    Yes, thank

        20       you, Mr. President.  To explain my vote.

        21                  I'm very, very sorrowfully going to

        22       be voting no on this bill.  There's one group

        23       of people in our state who are the highest

        24       unemployment, the highest drop-out rate

        25       people, high school drop-out rate, the most



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         1       gang-involved, supposedly, involved with

         2       selling drugs, the highest number of persons

         3       in need of supervision, PINS, young people,

         4       cost involving the courts, the police

         5       departments, $200,000 to $210,000 to $220,000

         6       per young person for detention or placement.

         7                  So the Governor has heard from

         8       every single citizen in the state, including

         9       the counties, that we need to do something

        10       about the high cost of having so many of a

        11       particular group of young people end up in the

        12       highest-cost system that is the least

        13       effective in helping them turn their lives

        14       around.  Most of the young people that I'm

        15       talking about are black and brown, mostly

        16       young males, in our state.

        17                  And unlike some of my colleagues

        18       who demagogue them as well as the commissioner

        19       of the Office of General Services by calling

        20       them criminals and by blaming her, it is on

        21       all of us -- yet, yet neither the Republicans

        22       in our house nor the Democrats, I'm sorry to

        23       say, have seen fit to protect the centerpiece

        24       of the Governor's attempt to address the

        25       problem of these young people.  And that is



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         1       the $31 million that the Governor has proposed

         2       that we take and spend to reverse this

         3       horrible system.

         4                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Thank

         5       you, Senator Montgomery.

         6                  SENATOR MONTGOMERY:    And

         7       therefore, I'm ashamed of the fact that we've

         8       decided to steal the money from the kids and

         9       do otherwise with it.  Now, tell me that you

        10       didn't do it.

        11                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:

        12       Senator Mont -- thank you.

        13                  SENATOR MONTGOMERY:    And I'm

        14       voting no on this budget.

        15                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Thank

        16       you.

        17                  Senator Oppenheimer.

        18                  SENATOR OPPENHEIMER:    I'll be

        19       voting no, but I would like to say that much

        20       of what's been done around education I'm

        21       pleased with.

        22                  I'm voting no most specifically

        23       because the problems that we experience where

        24       I live are basically around the property tax.

        25       And I see that there is a $125 million cut out



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         1       of STAR, which is a reduction in the property

         2       tax relief that we have been giving.  This is

         3       the opposite of what is needed in my county.

         4       We don't need to have property tax reductions

         5       taken away, we need to have them expanded.

         6                  And there isn't anything in the

         7       resolution before us that restores any part of

         8       STAR, either the STAR rebate check for the

         9       middle class or for the seniors.  Not even a

        10       mention of a prior thought that we might

        11       perhaps at a prior day start small and grow

        12       larger.  And of course there's nothing in here

        13       that talks about relief from the MTA

        14       surcharge.

        15                  These are the main issues of my

        16       community.  And as I have said to you so many

        17       times, there is no county in our state that is

        18       more beleaguered than Westchester with our

        19       property taxes.  So for that reason, even

        20       though I support many parts of this budget

        21       resolution, I will be voting against it.

        22                  Thank you, Mr. President.

        23                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Thank

        24       you, Senator Oppenheimer, for your explanation

        25       within the time period.



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         1                  Senator Parker.

         2                  SENATOR PARKER:    Mr. President,

         3       to explain my vote.

         4                  I'm voting no because I really want

         5       people to understand that we come from a

         6       history of Republican fiscal irresponsibility

         7       that includes late budgets.  From 1995 to

         8       2006, 10 out of 12 late years, for 819 days

         9       late, nearly three full years, and 97

        10       extenders totaling $73 billion.

        11                  We're talking about a history of

        12       Republican budget overspending.  Under

        13       Republican rule during the Pataki-Bruno-

        14       Skelos years from 1996 to 2008, the state

        15       budget grew nearly a hundred percent, from

        16       $62 billion to $121 billion.  Despite talking

        17       about controls, the Republicans regularly

        18       violated their own plan of a state spending

        19       cap 24 of the last 28 times they were in

        20       control.

        21                  Creating debt.  The Republicans

        22       have a history of creating debt.  And between

        23       1997 and 2008, the state debt grew from 31 to

        24       $54 billion, causing the debt load

        25       attributable to each man, woman and child in



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         1       New York State to soar from $1774.56 in 1997

         2       to now a whopping $2,675.70.  The Republicans

         3       have doubled the debt service in the state.

         4       And not only did the Republicans turn a blind

         5       eye to accruing debt, but they also committed

         6       the state to poor loan agreements resulting in

         7       a doubling of the state's annual debt service

         8       from $3 billion annually in 1997 to $5.8

         9       billion in 2009.

        10                  And lastly, nearly $25 billion in

        11       one-shots and sweeps.  Besides overspending

        12       and debt, they voted to enact approximately

        13       $24.678 billion in one-shots and sweeps, money

        14       many education and healthcare programs could

        15       rely on now had they not been wasted during a

        16       good economy to cover for their indulgence.

        17                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Thank

        18       you, Senator Parker.

        19                  SENATOR PARKER:    This budget

        20       resolution -- I'm wrapping up right this

        21       second, President Griffo -- this doesn't

        22       address the structural reforms.  This is more

        23       of the same.  I urge everybody to vote no

        24       because this state can and must do better.

        25                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator



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         1       Grisanti.

         2                  SENATOR GRISANTI:    I rise for a

         3       couple of reasons.  There is a concern, it's

         4       basically the UB 2020.  UB 2020 is not dead.

         5       In fact, there are messages in this bill that

         6       affect UB 2020.

         7                  What we need to do is focus on the

         8       Assembly.  This Senate, my colleagues and

         9       friends, passed it here.  The Western New York

        10       delegation in the Assembly need to step up to

        11       the plate and get it done.  We also need, as

        12       Senators, we need to rise in the Western

        13       New York district and go after the

        14       $138 million that is sitting there for UB to

        15       build their capital projects.  Procurement is

        16       already in there, as well as other issues.

        17                  UB 2020 is not dead.  It's just

        18       beginning, it's alive.  We've addressed the

        19       issues; it's up to the Assembly and my

        20       colleagues there.

        21                  As Senator DeFrancisco stated, I am

        22       pleased in the resolution additional funding

        23       has been allocated for education to upstate,

        24       especially the high-needs districts.  This is

        25       also important.  I'm not just a one-issue



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         1       person with UB 2020, I have educational

         2       concerns in my district as well.  The

         3       restoration of $260 million plus will go far

         4       in the high-needs districts that I represent.

         5                  I'm happy about a restoration that

         6       everybody forgot here, to the 4201 schools

         7       that were knocked out.  Tell that to the deaf,

         8       the blind and the disabled, to go to a regular

         9       school.  Tell them that to their face.  And

        10       I'm happy with the restoration of funds to

        11       Roswell, another key component of my area.

        12                  I vote yes on this resolution for

        13       the issues that I've just stated.  Thank you

        14       very much.

        15                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

        16       Ruth Hassell-Thompson.

        17                  SENATOR HASSELL-THOMPSON:    Thank

        18       you, Mr. Chairman -- Mr. President.  My mike

        19       seems to be very short for a tall woman.

        20                  I will be voting no on this

        21       resolution today, sadly.  There have been some

        22       restorations of programs, particularly like

        23       our Title 20 and some other things.  But there

        24       seems to be an unfairness in the way in which

        25       the restorations to education were made.



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         1       Rather than to restore and take the

         2       recommendations that this conference has made

         3       about how we could extend the millionaire's

         4       tax so that we could restore at least

         5       35 percent of the Governor's intent to ensure

         6       that, number one, we keep faith with the

         7       commitment made to CFE, which is not in this

         8       budget, and to have deprived the Yonkers

         9       School District -- with all of the

        10       difficulties and problems that it has -- of

        11       its funding shows a selfish lack of

        12       consideration for all of the Big Fives.

        13                  Yonkers has struggled in this

        14       conference, and I have sat here 10 years when

        15       there was other representation for Yonkers and

        16       seen infusions of dollars continue to pour

        17       into Yonkers.  And suddenly Yonkers gets not

        18       only ignored but gets deliberately violated

        19       and passed over.

        20                  This budget does not show fairness

        21       to education for all of the children of the

        22       State of New York.  And until we begin to

        23       understand that all children deserve to be

        24       educated fairly and appropriately and

        25       adequately, I will be voting no on every



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         1       resolution that creates an unfair barrier to

         2       education for all children and who would put

         3       prisons over education as the institution of

         4       choice for children of color.

         5                  Thank you.

         6                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         7       Perkins.

         8                  SENATOR PERKINS:    Thank you very

         9       much.  I want to just briefly associate myself

        10       with a lot of the arguments made by my

        11       colleagues on this side, especially those who

        12       articulated so well the concern that the

        13       millionaire's tax is available to us to offset

        14       a lot of the needs that would otherwise have

        15       to be cut out of the budget and that does not

        16       have to be delayed or -- and that we can take

        17       some initiative to make happen.

        18                  Real rent reform is a very

        19       important concern in terms of those of us that

        20       live in this city as well as others who live

        21       throughout the state.  Millions of our

        22       constituents are subject to losing their

        23       homes, and we can make a difference in this

        24       budget if we pass the bill that my colleague

        25       Senator Espaillat so wonderfully articulated



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         1       while we're doing the budget.

         2                  And so I want to associate myself

         3       with that and to therefore respectfully vote

         4       against this resolution.  Thank you.

         5                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Thank

         6       you, Senator Perkins.

         7                  Senator Duane.

         8                  SENATOR DUANE:    Thank you,

         9       Mr. President.

        10                  I wanted to add my voice to the

        11       voice of many others that you've heard on this

        12       side of the aisle in voting no on this

        13       resolution, but hoping that we'll all move

        14       forward in a bipartisan manner -- I'm more

        15       concerned with this house than the other

        16       house, since we're actually in this house --

        17       that we can all come together and pass an

        18       on-time budget which does not negatively

        19       impact those New Yorkers who most need the

        20       assistance and help of government and a budget

        21       which protects working people and which will

        22       add jobs and economic development to our

        23       state.

        24                  With that, I'm voting no.  But I'm

        25       an eternal optimist, Mr. President.  Thank



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         1       you.

         2                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Senator

         3       Squadron.

         4                  SENATOR SQUADRON:    Mr. President,

         5       to explain my vote.  I will be joining many of

         6       my colleagues who have raised such concerns

         7       about this resolution.

         8                  Look, there are some things in the

         9       resolution that are promising.  The problem is

        10       they're not real.  And the last thing the

        11       people of the State of New York need is more

        12       broken promises, more being told that one

        13       thing is going to happen but in practice it

        14       not be impossible.  And this resolution, as my

        15       colleagues Senator Krueger and others talked

        16       about, has that.  It leaves out -- even while

        17       doing that, it leaves out much of what we need

        18       to do.

        19                  It doesn't sufficiently take care

        20       of the promise of increased education funding

        21       that children across the state are and have

        22       been due for years now.  It doesn't

        23       sufficiently restore the human services that

        24       protect those who especially in this time need

        25       the most among us.  And it does nothing to



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         1       prevent the largest tax increase in effect on

         2       tenants that we've ever seen in this state

         3       because we have rent regulations, as Senator

         4       Espaillat so eloquently talked about, expiring

         5       and we have tenants, millions of tenants in

         6       New York City and the surrounding counties who

         7       are at risk of having the state impose the

         8       largest cost or tax increase they've ever

         9       seen.

        10                  So for those reasons, this

        11       resolution simply isn't good enough.  The

        12       restorations are welcome.  Unfortunately,

        13       they're not real, they don't go far enough,

        14       and it leaves out too many other key policy

        15       proposals.  I'll be voting no, Mr. President.

        16                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Seeing

        17       no other Senator who wishes to explain their

        18       vote, I call upon Senator DeFrancisco to

        19       complete explanations of votes.

        20                  SENATOR DeFRANCISCO:    I'm going

        21       to vote yes.  And the only point I wanted to

        22       make is that, you know, there's been various

        23       points made about things people don't like in

        24       this one-house budget.  I don't like

        25       everything either.  And I'll bet if you go to



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         1       each one of the Senators on either side of the

         2       aisle they could find many items that they're

         3       not quite happy with.

         4                  This is a starting point.  This is

         5       a fair starting point to bring the state's

         6       fiscal house back in order and to provide some

         7       restorations, as much as we can, for some

         8       vital services.  We're now going to go into

         9       the joint conference committees, and everyone

        10       on both sides of the aisle will have a say at

        11       those public meetings, and hopefully we all

        12       together can come up with a budget in a

        13       responsible way, on time, that the State of

        14       New York and all of us can be proud of.

        15                  Thank you, Mr. President.

        16                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    Thank

        17       you, Senator DeFrancisco.

        18                  The resolution is adopted.

        19                  Senator Libous, there's another

        20       motion before the desk.

        21                  SENATOR LIBOUS:    Can we go to

        22       motions and resolutions.

        23                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    On

        24       motions and resolutions.

        25                  SENATOR LIBOUS:    Thank you,



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         1       Mr. President.

         2                  On behalf of Senator Fuschillo, I

         3       would move that the following bill, Senate

         4       Print 3624, be discharged from its respective

         5       committee and be recommitted with instructions

         6       to strike the enacting clause.

         7                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    So

         8       ordered.

         9                  SENATOR LIBOUS:    Mr. President, I

        10       have an announcement that the Energy Committee

        11       meeting scheduled for tomorrow at 9:00 a.m.

        12       has been postponed till next week.  So members

        13       of the Energy Committee, there will be no

        14       Energy Committee tomorrow morning, it's

        15       postponed until next week.

        16                  Mr. President, is there any further

        17       business at the desk?

        18                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    There

        19       is no further business before the desk,

        20       Senator Libous.

        21                  SENATOR LIBOUS:    The Senate will

        22       stand adjourned until March 16th at 11:00 a.m.

        23                  ACTING PRESIDENT GRIFFO:    On

        24       motion, the Senate stands adjourned until

        25       Wednesday, March 16th, at 11:00 a.m.



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         1                  (Whereupon, at 4:53 p.m., the

         2       Senate adjourned.)

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